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NOC Smallstreet Mafia v2 Won by the Mafia (Clouds, Ehmcee, Dead By Daylight, Duskfall98)

Trying to actually do a live catch up to save time so I'll just do my reads this way. Probably next I do Ehmcee.

ElectricityCat: EC is honestly probably just town here TBH. They have a ridiculously pure tone that comes from newbie town most of the time. They are also borderline derptelling off the public vanilla stuff honestly. I would put EC at or slightly below where AP is on my readslist.

M2H
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AP
EC
 
Ehmcee: Honestly, Ehmcee doesn't look that that great to me at the moment. Most of his focus has been on rolespec which is like fine (I started off with rolespec) but he seems to be focused solely on that, which may just be an Ehmcee thing (?) if he doesn't believe in d1 reads. Looking back on the thread, I did notice that Lechen actually DOES come off very pure and Ehmcee was kind of paired with Lechen by Clouds in his readslist iirc. I was actually going to push a Clouds / Ehmcee team with this post, but then noted that Clouds is putting AP / Lechen over Ehmcee which I actually agree with so that is something worth noting perhaps (?). I will be focusing on Lechen in particular next but Clouds will come much later.

M2H
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AP
EC
---
---
---
Ehmcee
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Ok, I already know what scum is :tymp: . I've been reading the new messages and seeing what you all say.

I will re-clarify my position, I want to try to be useful in the game. But it seems that almost all the conjectures are based on behaviors you observed in past Mafia games.

I don't know how any of you play, and I can't really believe or verify what you say.

Today, I am not going to vote for anyone because I don't have a sufficient basis. I would be voting just for the sake of voting and it would be a lottery. I will leave it up to you.

I will wait to see what actions happen at night and then take a stance.

Reminder that if anyone is a Fruit Vendor, please sell me a watermelon.
 
Lechen: I think Lechen is pretty obvtown off their posting so far TBH, probably going above AP/EC in my mind by a bit. Obviously I am taking my impression of Lechen's skill level into account when I say this (sorry Lechen).

Lechen said:
Although I do feel kinda bad about this, I genuinely believe lynching dbd is the play here, because all three outcomes don't hurt us much
if dbd flips scum, we can be pretty sure mafia recruited and know their lineup to some extent
If dbd flips town and nobody got a bpv, then mafia is 3 person
If dbd flips town and someone got a bpv, we know the mafia lineup
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Example of a pretty good attempt to solve with rolespec.

Lechen said:
Hey everyone (can people react to my posts for my reaction score not to tank ty)
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Very comfortable open IMO.

Lechen said:
Oh i thought that was pre game, mb
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Example of an actual good derpclear imo.

Lechen said:
if they recruit a healer and a 4th member they would be 10 in debt unless they they give a townie a bpv
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Lechen was actually engaging with my analysis live which is a good look.

That puts me at

M2H
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Lechen
AP
EC
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---
---
Ehmcee
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Dead by Daylight: Hmm. This one is tough because the public vanilla is a decent pickup in the 4 mafia members world which is more likely imo and DbD has shown based on his negotiations with me in the OC that he is a higher level player at core skills required to play as scum, BUT also the insistence on a neon policy lynch is a pretty bold play day 1 along with stating he has no reads at all? I am probably the most conflicted on him overall but I'd put him at a very light TL / very high null ATM.

Clouds: Not too much to say really. We have more or less agreed on our reads at this stage outside of him voting me and him probably being a little more on the TR side on DbD and Ehmcee than me. I do think if Clouds is mafia he probably is with one of those two but likely not both. Clouds + DbD would make sense in the 4 mafia world with Clouds as a good pickup. I put Clouds as a mid/high TL with potential to drop quite a lot depending on how he solves moving forward. With that said, Clouds, can you help me understand the Ehmcee read in particular?

M2H
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Lechen
AngryPidgeon
ElectricityCat
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Clouds
---
DbD
---
Ehmcee
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Eh

I'm getting tired of the long drawn out analyses.

Time for the vibes list

M2H
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Lechen
AngryPidgeon
ElectricityCat
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Tommy
Clouds
Skipper
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DbD
Alice
Pulsar
ImaginaryNeon (solve through mech later)
Apricity
HH
NE (on the verge of dropping to a SL actually)
---
Ehmcee
StupidFlandrs48
Saberslasher11

HH, Alice, Pulsar, and Skipper placements were very high level tbh, i kind of just placed them somewhere that felt vaguely right.
 
M2H said:
vote NightEmerald
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Interesting. TBH I dont hate this vote.

Alice Kazumi said:
I don't like skippergamez reads on m2h and duskfall town and pulsar scum so far. He did say that he will give us his thoughts today so I will be waiting for it!
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Ya Skippers reads have been pretty eyebrow-raising to me. Calling m2h town early on when I had specific concerns about m2h's content: "lets massclaim, Id pick a healer, game is solvable!" Then m2h was gone for a while. Skipper calling m2h out as his first townread and scumming pulsar just made me think Im going to be out of sync with Skipper all game.

Does anyone have a meta opinion on Skipper? Skipper does seem to be comfortably interacting with the thread which is the basis for me not wanting to vote them. But I put them with Flandrs in my reads because there is something about both Flandrs/Skipper that gives me a slight pause.

ImaginaryNeon said:
Pulsar's always whatever alignment inconveniences town more
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Funny post


Duskfall98 said:
i didnt at rand believe that hal was likely to be mafia though, wont pretend i didnt
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Eh? i think you typo'd. You did, right?

Duskfall98 said:
whats town about your posting, in regards to what would you have done different as mafia?
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Well for one I wouldnt have tried to steer so actively. Id probably engage people with questions primarily but not be so active or do things like harangue flandrs over his pulsar vote. I think I also probably fluff more in general then. I think everything Ive said has been about the game, not much/any filler.

Duskfall98 said:
hes going to start playing eventually and is doing a weird gimmick to not get n1ed is my soul read
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Will he? Every hour that passes makes me more willing to D1 him.

Duskfall98 said:
may we get some reasons sir?
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Ive talked about most of these at some point. I can point to specific posts in a bit. Ehmcee asking twice about the recruit mechanic was either cheeky scum or hapless town and I think it was the latter. Pulsar yelling at him in all caps was funny and made read to me as a townie genuinely frustrated that someone is asking an answered question. Alice is a gut read I guess, but she gave me bad vibes in ToS mafia and I just don't see it here. With Alice in particular I think she has a harder time interacting more peacefully/naturally with the thread as mafia. HH probably deserves to be higher up, but I read him as a competent player who could emulate his townself as scum. His reads mirror my thoughts very well so I actually do feel good about him. Lechen I think has just been very earnest with moving the discussion. Scumreading dbd for setup spec is not exactly what Id expect from scum and I do think it was a brilliant observation from Lechen since most people assumed there will be a recruit and that mafia is likely to elect riskless roles lke Vanilla. I realize now that Vanilla isnt exactly riskless for mafia because it does make strategic sense for town to vote off a role early which is a) confirmed no power and b) indicative of mafia choices
 
AngryPidgeon said:
Interesting. TBH I dont hate this vote.


Ya Skippers reads have been pretty eyebrow-raising to me. Calling m2h town early on when I had specific concerns about m2h's content: "lets massclaim, Id pick a healer, game is solvable!" Then m2h was gone for a while. Skipper calling m2h out as his first townread and scumming pulsar just made me think Im going to be out of sync with Skipper all game.

Does anyone have a meta opinion on Skipper? Skipper does seem to be comfortably interacting with the thread which is the basis for me not wanting to vote them. But I put them with Flandrs in my reads because there is something about both Flandrs/Skipper that gives me a slight pause.


Funny post



Eh? i think you typo'd. You did, right?


Well for one I wouldnt have tried to steer so actively. Id probably engage people with questions primarily but not be so active or do things like harangue flandrs over his pulsar vote. I think I also probably fluff more in general then. I think everything Ive said has been about the game, not much/any filler.


Will he? Every hour that passes makes me more willing to D1 him.


Ive talked about most of these at some point. I can point to specific posts in a bit. Ehmcee asking twice about the recruit mechanic was either cheeky scum or hapless town and I think it was the latter. Pulsar yelling at him in all caps was funny and made read to me as a townie genuinely frustrated that someone is asking an answered question. Alice is a gut read I guess, but she gave me bad vibes in ToS mafia and I just don't see it here. With Alice in particular I think she has a harder time interacting more peacefully/naturally with the thread as mafia. HH probably deserves to be higher up, but I read him as a competent player who could emulate his townself as scum. His reads mirror my thoughts very well so I actually do feel good about him. Lechen I think has just been very earnest with moving the discussion. Scumreading dbd for setup spec is not exactly what Id expect from scum and I do think it was a brilliant observation from Lechen since most people assumed there will be a recruit and that mafia is likely to elect riskless roles lke Vanilla. I realize now that Vanilla isnt exactly riskless for mafia because it does make strategic sense for town to vote off a role early which is a) confirmed no power and b) indicative of mafia choices
Click to expand...

tbh yeah apricity will probably try at some point soon if he's town

And also I still stand by a d1 massclaim. Lynching a faith healer d1 is almost a 50/50 shot at scum, and lynching both faith healers almost guarantees one hit one misslynch. That's not a terrible bet TBH.
 
and also -- if both faith healers claim we could just have them protect each other until we have solid reads on them. that might be a good compromise option TBH. If one faith healer is nullish/sr and the other is towny, we just lynch the sr one. If both faith healers are towny or nullish then have them protect each other and if something goes wrong we know to lynch the other one.
 
i have another idea as well.

we should public coordinate faith healer targets TBH if nothing else.

like create two piles of players, players A and players B

if you are a faith healer in player A column, you only BG players in player A. If you are in player B column, you only BG players in player B column.

This would minimize the risk that faith healers don't stop each other from working by accident while keeping things uncertain.
 
eh that actually isn't a very solid idea but I do think we could come up with an idea to make faith healers more effective without straight up leashing them. its important to make sure that the faith healers don't stop each other without completely removing their flexibility.
 
AngryPidgeon said:
Ya Skippers reads have been pretty eyebrow-raising to me. Calling m2h town early on when I had specific concerns about m2h's content: "lets massclaim, Id pick a healer, game is solvable!" Then m2h was gone for a while. Skipper calling m2h out as his first townread and scumming pulsar just made me think Im going to be out of sync with Skipper all game.

Does anyone have a meta opinion on Skipper? Skipper does seem to be comfortably interacting with the thread which is the basis for me not wanting to vote them. But I put them with Flandrs in my reads because there is something about both Flandrs/Skipper that gives me a slight pause.
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Honestly I only played a single game with skip and it was my first one. I didn't know what I was doing so I can't help with that :totodiLUL:

M2H said:
tbh yeah apricity will probably try at some point soon if he's town

And also I still stand by a d1 massclaim. Lynching a faith healer d1 is almost a 50/50 shot at scum, and lynching both faith healers almost guarantees one hit one misslynch. That's not a terrible bet TBH.
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It's not a terrible idea but I like more massclaim in d3. I feel like trackers can give info on the setup by learning mafia night actions and d3 massclaim gives time to both trackers to do their night action and we could get info on roles that way. You like mechanical solving, wouldn't this option suit you more? In case we massclaim d1 I think we would lose that chance.

M2H said:
i have another idea as well.

we should public coordinate faith healer targets TBH if nothing else.

like create two piles of players, players A and players B

if you are a faith healer in player A column, you only BG players in player A. If you are in player B column, you only BG players in player B column.

This would minimize the risk that faith healers don't stop each other from working by accident while keeping things uncertain.
Click to expand...

I think that would be terrible in case one of the faith healers is mafia. If we townread both of them it would be really good though.
 
Alice Kazumi said:
Honestly I only played a single game with skip and it was my first one. I didn't know what I was doing so I can't help with that :totodiLUL:


It's not a terrible idea but I like more massclaim in d3. I feel like trackers can give info on the setup by learning mafia night actions and d3 massclaim gives time to both trackers to do their night action and we could get info on roles that way. You like mechanical solving, wouldn't this option suit you more? In case we massclaim d1 I think we would lose that chance.



I think that would be terrible in case one of the faith healers is mafia. If we townread both of them it would be really good though.
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ngl tracker is uh

kinda bad ngl

i don't foresee us losing out on much if mafia decide to shoot the tracker LOL

a town mayor is like the only role of much value we could lose IMO, and commuter and vengeful being outed obviously is a loss of value if they are town but tbh these roles are above rand mafia roles anyways.
 
Clouds said:
yes on the first line re: recruit, but i'm not sure we learn a ton about the lineup other than that maybe the outer edge high credit role(s) are less likely to be mafia unless mafia recruited and also chose one of those roles & assumed
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I think multiple people indicated that vanilla is a likely mafia pick in the case where there are 4 mafia. If we ever learn there are 4, the slot becomes sus. Its not necessarily true that mafia picks it. TBH I think going 3 5-cost roles is an idea as mafia in hindsight. Nonetheless, I think vanilla is a more likely pick compared to priest, FV. Im not going to say mafia DEFO picked vanilla but like you were saying earlier: would mafia pick governor? I misspoke btw: DS picked universal backup and inherited the governor.
 
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