Smogon University PO Statistics — April 2011

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Parasol_Kirby said:
Code: 
 | 50   | Blastoise       |   548 |  2.4607 | 
 | 62   | Smeargle        |   425 |  1.9084 | 
 | 246  | Octillery       |    30 |  0.1347 | 
 | 286  | Glalie          |    16 |  0.0718 | 
 | 407  | Bibarel         |     2 |  0.0090 |
Yeah, I'm pretty sure this proves that moody is the farthest thing from broken in the uber tier right now.
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Just because they're not used doesn't mean they're not broken. Remember Deoxys-N in OU?
 
I'm sorry, but don't bother bringing up Deoxys-N as evidence. Nobody used him in suspect. Deoxys-N was NEVER tested. He was simply banned alongside deoxys-A because the people who used Deoxys-A found him broken. That is all.
 
alphatron said:
I'm sorry, but don't bother bringing up Deoxys-N as evidence. Nobody used him in suspect. Deoxys-N was NEVER tested. He was simply banned alongside deoxys-A because the people who used Deoxys-A found him broken. That is all.
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Comparing the stats of the two, Deoxys-N's attacking stats are 87% of those of Deoxys-A, and its defensive stats are 179% of those of Deoxys-A. In other words, Deoxys-N could wreak about as much destruction as Deoxys-A, while being almost twice as durable, meaning it could potentially actually take the weak hit you might be able to toss at it by means of a priority move or something. There's no question that if Deoxys-A was broken, Deoxys-N was broken, and Deoxys-A was broken.
 
Thorhammer said:
Comparing the stats of the two, Deoxys-N's attacking stats are 87% of those of Deoxys-A, and its defensive stats are 179% of those of Deoxys-A.
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True. I don't think Conkeldurr's non-boosted, or even with one Bulk Up, Mach Punch always OHKOes Deoxys-N, despite its paper defenses, while Deoxys-N's Psycho Boost easily kills it (maybe unless an insane SpD investment).
 
While I see what you're saying Thorn, that doesn't change the fact that Deoxys-N wasn't given a fair test. Arguements were brought up showing his attacking stats were actually on par with some other pokemon whom we currently have in OU (since Deo-N is running a speed boosting nature and usually has to seperate his EV spread). In some cases, he was doing less damage than other sweepers, as he was generally relying on Non STAB moves to do so and in some rare cases, hidden power fire. The few people who used him and argued this point said he was dissapointing because he couldn't kill what he needed to and was always ohko'd in return. But they weren't in the majority, and DEo-N was merely banned without a test.

And I don't think Conkeldurr +1 mach punch even kills Deoxys-A. Hitmontop needed LO Technician Fake out AND mach punch to check him. Even with the higher attack, conk's probably not going to kill him.
 
Still can't believe Zapdos will be UU. I mean I know thunderus outclasses offensively but you'd think he'd still be pretty well used. O well now it's down to gengar and starmie.
 
for fuck's sake you guys, deo-n is exactly the same thing as deo-A except with minor differences.

When somebody is able to show me 5 important koes that deo-a gets and deo-n misses, it could be possible to think of. For now, though, they're literally the same pokemon, almost.
 
Toxicroak is OU. Hell yes.

Also cool that Cloyster and Venusaur have moved up to the big leagues.

Sigilyph and Slowbro should be higher, while Hydreigon, Chandelure, and Gengar should be lower. What are people doing with Chandelure anyway, scarf?

I can't believe Zapdos has fallen at last. It's a shame Lightningrod didn't get released for it in time for this, I'm sure Zapdos would still have it's veteran status in that case. Once it does come out I would be suprised if Zapdos didn't move up and stay OU for a long time.

Thanks for the stats, RD. I've been looking forward to this for a very long time.
 
Frost Nocturne said:
Toxicroak is OU. Hell yes.

Also cool that Cloyster and Venusaur have moved up to the big leagues.

Sigilyph and Slowbro should be higher, while Hydreigon, Chandelure, and Gengar should be lower. What are people doing with Chandelure anyway, scarf?

I can't believe Zapdos has fallen at last. It's a shame Lightningrod didn't get released for it in time for this, I'm sure Zapdos would still have it's veteran status in that case. Once it does come out I would be suprised if Zapdos didn't move up and stay OU for a long time.

Thanks for the stats, RD. I've been looking forward to this for a very long time.
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Sigilyph sucks IMO, its Speed tier is trolled by Base 98's, Genosect and Base 100's and gets killed easily by everything faster than it as well as T-Tar, and from what I've seen, either Flame Charge or Scarf are the most popular sets for Chandelure.

@ Balla
Don't you have anything better to do than stalk my posts? Also, there is a DW Tier if you hadn't noticed.
 
Thorhammer said:
Comparing the stats of the two, Deoxys-N's attacking stats are 87% of those of Deoxys-A, and its defensive stats are 179% of those of Deoxys-A. In other words, Deoxys-N could wreak about as much destruction as Deoxys-A, while being almost twice as durable, meaning it could potentially actually take the weak hit you might be able to toss at it by means of a priority move or something. There's no question that if Deoxys-A was broken, Deoxys-N was broken, and Deoxys-A was broken.
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While stats are objective in of themselves, misinterpreting them is easy.

Saying Deoxys-N is twice as durable really isn't saying much. If I made the comparison that X Pokemon had double the Special Attack of Shuckle, no one would bat an eyelash. Why is this really any different?

Show some actual damage calculations where it is relevant and I'll actually pay attention to what you're saying.
 
Frost Nocturne said:
Toxicroak is OU. Hell yes.

Also cool that Cloyster and Venusaur have moved up to the big leagues.

Sigilyph and Slowbro should be higher, while Hydreigon, Chandelure, and Gengar should be lower. What are people doing with Chandelure anyway, scarf?

I can't believe Zapdos has fallen at last. It's a shame Lightningrod didn't get released for it in time for this, I'm sure Zapdos would still have it's veteran status in that case. Once it does come out I would be suprised if Zapdos didn't move up and stay OU for a long time.

Thanks for the stats, RD. I've been looking forward to this for a very long time.
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Why should Hyderigon be lower? It works amazingly well, and deserves the usage it gets.
 
Glen ^^ said:
Switching into Ferros, subbing up, destroying stuff. This little guy punishes Ferro users so badly it isn't even funny.


Vizirion and Chandelure are the TOP anti-metagame Pokes.
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And ttar, the second most used poke, punishes chandelure so badly it's not even funny. It not only can't really do anything, it dies if it tries to run.

If it gets raped by the #2 poke, it isn't an anti metagame poke.
 
Arc Tech said:
And ttar, the second most used poke, punishes chandelure so badly it's not even funny. It not only can't really do anything, it dies if it tries to run.

If it gets raped by the #2 poke, it isn't an anti metagame poke.
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252/216 Careful TTar takes ~40.6% - 48.5% damage from Timid Chandelure's HP Fighting. Chandelure isn't exactly safe from Tyranitar, but Stealth Rock support and hitting it on the switch-in (or giving up on Flame Charge to have Substitute) means Tyranitar is going to suffer a *bit* trying to kill Chandy.
 
Mario With Lasers said:
252/216 Careful TTar takes ~40.6% - 48.5% damage from Timid Chandelure's HP Fighting. Chandelure isn't exactly safe from Tyranitar, but Stealth Rock support and hitting it on the switch-in (or giving up on Flame Charge to have Substitute) means Tyranitar is going to suffer a *bit* trying to kill Chandy.
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an eye for 7/8 of an eye is a wasted teamslot in exchange for free death fodder.

Chandelure is not good.
 
Breludicolo said:
an eye for 7/8 of an eye is a wasted teamslot in exchange for free death fodder.

Chandelure is not good.
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Tyranitar's bulkiest set (unless people really use 252/252?) taking 80-96% and having a pretty good chance of dying with hazard support (SR is more than enough) at full health doesn't seem to me as "bad punishment".
 
252/80 Sassy Tar is the standard I believe. There's also a certain type of team that benefits very much from Tyranitar taking 80-96%.
 
Ulevo said:
While stats are objective in of themselves, misinterpreting them is easy.

Saying Deoxys-N is twice as durable really isn't saying much. If I made the comparison that X Pokemon had double the Special Attack of Shuckle, no one would bat an eyelash. Why is this really any different?

Show some actual damage calculations where it is relevant and I'll actually pay attention to what you're saying.
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Deoxys-N has a lead set in Gen 4 that uses some Defense investment to survive two Extremespeeds from max Attack Jolly Deoxys-S. Deoxys-A would require far more investment in both Defense and HP to manage the same, if it can at all.

For more examples, Deoxys-N with no defensive investment always survives max Attack Adamant LO Lucario's Extremespeed, and with 12 HP EVs, it always survives max Attack Adamant CB Azumarill's Aqua Jet. Deoxys-A is always OHKOed by both unless it uses huge amounts of defensive EVs.

There's enough of a difference to matter.
 
Virizion said:
Sigilyph sucks IMO, its Speed tier is trolled by Base 98's, Genosect and Base 100's and gets killed easily by everything faster than it as well as T-Tar, and from what I've seen, either Flame Charge or Scarf are the most popular sets for Chandelure.

@ Balla
Don't you have anything better to do than stalk my posts? Also, there is a DW Tier if you hadn't noticed.
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Since Smogon's tiers are formed from standard ladder statistics, the dangers to Sigilyph of which Genesect and Shadow Tag Chandelure possess are totally irrelevant.

Sigilyph can easily ruin Tyranitar as well, by burning it with Psycho Shift / Flame Orb.
 
Ciele said:
Since Smogon's tiers are formed from standard ladder statistics, the dangers to Sigilyph of which Genesect and Shadow Tag Chandelure possess are totally irrelevant.

Sigilyph can easily ruin Tyranitar as well, by burning it with Psycho Shift / Flame Orb.
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While it OHKO's your Sigilyph with Stone Edge.
 
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