Metagame SS OU Metagame Discussion Thread v5 (usage in post #547)

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TR is ABSOLUTE FUCKING GARBAGE in this metagame. I already ranted on it before, and I'm gonna rant on it again because people keep saying TR is good when it's actually not.
I'm not super experienced with TR in gen 8 but based off your post I don't think you are either. I agree that it's not exactly top tier but I disagree with your logic.

And even then it's hard to make use of those 3 turns because while the abusers (Alolan Marowak, Hatterene) have insane attacking power, bringing them in is near impossible because they aren't that bulky at all.
They switch in for free via Teleport. Slowbro and P2 are both able to set up multiple Trick Room passes per game. Alternatively Explosion or Healing Wish. But even if you somehow do have to hard switch these things are bulked out max HP. They can usually take at least one hit

In the case of Hatterene, it's extremely easy to hard counter it (Chansey says hello once more).
252+ SpA Life Orb Hatterene Psyshock vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 257-304 (40 - 47.3%) -- 47.7% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock

Also Chansey is a super free switch to Marowak.

Lastly, it's overly reliant on keeping its setters alive,
So you run enough of them that it isn't an issue. Again I'm not saying Trick Room is going to take the meta by storm but it was playable in 7th gen and it's much stronger now in a meta with a lower power level.

Tournament play is a different story. I don't expect to see Trick Room in SPL or anything. But surely there is a decent team composition that would work on the ladder.
 
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TR is ABSOLUTE FUCKING GARBAGE in this metagame. I already ranted on it before, and I'm gonna rant on it again because people keep saying TR is good when it's actually not.

TR has always suffered from the fact that you only have 3 turns to do anything - 1 turn to set up TR and 1 turn to switch out to bring the abusers in. And even then it's hard to make use of those 3 turns because while the abusers (Alolan Marowak, Hatterene) have insane attacking power, bringing them in is near impossible because they aren't that bulky at all. And it's not like we have a lot of pokemon that can take them out in one hit. In the case of Hatterene, it's extremely easy to hard counter it (Chansey says hello once more). Lastly, it's overly reliant on keeping its setters alive, and although the same can be said about weather, at least weather has much more viable abusers. However, the thing about TR's setters is that they're simply too vulnerable to Knock Off, whereas the weather setters are not as vulnerable.

In short, TR has been and will always be trash.
TR on individual setters is fine like Hatterene, but there are still a lot of problems for Trick Room in full trick room teams.
These problems can be solved in the future but discussing buffs to trick room would be better suited for Showdown or Discord.
 
Teleport certainly helps, especially against the U-Turn/Volt Switch into something that can handle your sweeper, which makes you waste a TR turn. And you certainly would rather have your TR setter get Tricked into holding a Choice Scarf than your sweeper.

But full TR teams still open themselves up to weaknesses they cant cover. It only takes one pokemon that you cant setup TR on(due to either powerful attacks or Taunt) and the team can fall behind and fall apart. TR setters are generally bad against stall too, even the ones with offensive presence are all special attackers, and they give up a moveslot for TR(Teleport helps at least). So it puts alot of pressure on your dedicated sweepers to break it. I honestly don't really like full TR teams; 2 setters-2 sweepers at most is all you really need.
 
Hello!, I am a fan eeveelutions and I think that although now only 4 eeveelutions that I am going to mention are niche, I still think it is an interesting topic (I hope), feel free to correct me and if I give my opinion on something, no worry, they can keep correcting me
i leave a Sylveon replay:
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8ou-1139849214
flareon.gif
Flareon
A little underrated in my opinion, it is an exceptional counter of Volcarona, Clefable Offensive, Corviknight and Magearna in the same slot and can also use Wishpass, which distinguishes Flareon from other fire types such as Cinderace or Incineroar, it is quite nice on certain teams And I think it deserves some consideration in certain teams.
I leave my set below:
Flarito (Flareon) (M) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Flash Fire
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Wish
- Protect
- Yawn
Ignore the nicknames, I always give them gender and nicknames, but apart from that I must mention that this set is used to count the aforementioned pokemon, Flare Blitz is their stab, Wish + Protect is to basically recover and Yawn is to force mons like Volcarona or Dragapult sometimes, which can be quite good.

Before starting I want to clarify that I am aware that all the eeveelutions that I am going to mention have a lot of competition with other mons, but I think they have a sufficient niche to be considered in serious teams (maybe I could try to make them ranked in the future)
sylveon (1).gif
Sylveon
Sylveon has a couple of pretty decent niches that differentiates it from its big competitors (Clefable, Primarina, Magearna and Chansey), on the one hand it has Yawn and Yawn very well press the pokemon that threaten Sylveon like Volcarona and Magearna (as seen In that replay, Sylveon with Yawn was an obstacle), which is great because it forces changes and if they decide to attack, they will only fall asleep later and Sylveon can give way to another setup sweeper or some offensive mon that simply destroys the team and by other hand The Hyper Voice side is quite nice because it pierces through sub users like Dragapult and some Urshifu and with its increased special defense and special attack, it can better counter the offensive Clefable and does not eat any attacks, unlike Primarina.
Sylvita (Sylveon) (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Pixilate
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hyper Voice
- Calm Mind
- Wish
- Protect / Mystical Fire (at your choice)
CM Sylveon differs from CM Magearna and CM Clefable by these decals that I will leave below
+3 252 SpA Volcarona Fire Blast vs. +3 252 HP / 4 SpD Sylveon: 147-174 (37.3 - 44.1%) - 100% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
+3 252 SpA Volcarona Fire Blast vs. +3 252 HP / 4 SpD Clefable: 202-238 (51.2 - 60.4%) - guaranteed 2HKO (it needs to spam Soft Boiled and although it can pp stall, Volcarona can continue using Quiver Dance and then finish Clefable, however Sylveon does not you eat so much damage and you don't need to always recover, so you can use Calm Mind more freely)
+3 252 SpA Volcarona Fire Blast vs. +3 248 HP / 0 SpD Magearna: 330-390 (90.9 - 107.4%) - 43.8% chance to OHKO (It's obvious)
Which means Sylveon has a better match up against Volcarona than all her competitors and although Primarina can also do this, Sylveon has a more reliable way of recovering which is Wish, so her Volcarona MU + Wish is a nice thing and also I mentioned that Sylveon beats many Sub Users.
Sylvita (Sylveon) (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Pixilate
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Wish
- Hyper Voice
- Yawn / Heal Bell / Mystical Fire (pretty versatile slot)
- Protect
This set is the main one for Sylveon in my opinion because it has no competition, since Yawn forces several offensive mons and setup sweepers as is the case with Volcarona and Magearna, Hyper Voice is nice and I think I already mentioned why, sub users can be dangerous, wishtect is for recovery, but unlike his brother Flareon, Sylveon can pass wish in addition to recovery.

vaporeon.gif
Vaporeon
I honestly believe that Vaporeon has a solid niche (like all the other eeveelutions already mentioned), it is basically any water resist but it has something very important and it is Wish Support + Flip Turn, which makes Vaporeon stand out from other bulky waters and water resists, as previously mentioned I want to mention Vaporeon SpDef specifically.
This set of Vaporeon is to check Volcarona better and withstands better the special blows especially, in exchange for not being so good against Cinderace and the physical attackers, this depends on your team in general and what you need, I think it would sound repetitive, but I'm really excited to try the eeveelutions.
Ariel (Vaporeon) (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Flip Turn / Scald
- Wish
- Protect
- Heal Bell / Scald
and his special defensive spread ev
Ariel (Vaporeon) (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Flip Turn / Scald
- Wish
- Protect
- Haze / Scald (Haze is better here for Vaporeon)

bye
 
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End Game Clan Analysis #1

Hey, its me, EG Jhonx, as Sub-Leader of EG Clan we going to write some analysis about current metagame and Pokemon that been working lately, explaining here what these Pokemon does, dropping some EV Spreads we been using, forgive me for my poor english, let's move on.


Mantine.

I think there lot of people who dont have discovered this Pokemon yet, while others do, this Pokemon at the moment have a big usage in Smogon World Cup, but ¿why? after DLC got released we got plenty of new Pokemon, Mantine having a good typing of Water / Flying type make it useful as a Ground Inmunity, and thanks to Water Absorb as Ability it have some important roles in the actual metagame, Mantine have good Special Defense and a good amount of HP, It have decent Physical Defense which makes it a good tank.

¿What Does Mantine?

Mantine actually works as a Tank to some threats, mostly Volcarona sets, Sand cores like Hippowdon + Excadrill (Rock Slideless), Rain Matchups, and it can Haze some threats like Azumarill or Non Electric Move Magearna (Shift Gear, Iron Defense, CM sets) since they run Draining Kiss and Stored Power to sweep and its a check to Urshifu Water Type while people don't run Thunder Punch on it, can be a check to Cinderace too, all of this is possible thanks to Heavy Boots Item which prevents Mantine from taking Stealth Rocks damage, helping it to stay healthy and a consistent Defoger.

EV Spreading.

As we mentioned before, Mantine is a good Special Defensive tank, it have decent physical defense but its not enough for the current metagame, after trying this Pokemon and doing some calcs, we found Mantine without Special Bulk but 248 HP EV's can counter Volcarona, Volcarona after a Quiver Dance boost Psychic does 36% (Max Roll), it can tank Magearna that dont carry Electric Moves, Stored Power after Calm Mind Modest boost does 26% max and 50% damage after Shift Gear + CM boost, Since its speed base its not poor it can run EV's into speed, this helps to outspeed Adamant Max Speed Azumarill to do fast Haze into Belly Drum sets, making it 96 EV's in speed is enough to hit 200 Spe, some people run a bit more speed EV's to outspeed Alolan-Marowak at the cost of some physical bulk, the remaining EV's may go in Physical Defense since Mantine defense isnt enough, but you can toy with EV's there, being able to tank Urshifu Rapid Strike that dont carry Thunder Punch or Stone Edge (Most people run Zen Headbutt to hit Toxapex and flinch %), Close Combat banded does 45% Max roll, also this Mantine can switch in agaisnt Non Choice Banded Cinderace, as it fails to 2HKO Mantine with Zen Headbut doing 49.5% if Cinderace carrying Life Orb, most Cinderace run Heavy Boots which do 38% max damage, Barraskewda Choice Band Psychic Fang does 46% Max Damage and Kingdra Choice Specs Draco Meteor does 67% Max damage, Hurricane Kingdra do 37%, Mantine can roost into Draco Meteor and its perfectly walled.

Good Cores and Team Partners in General.

Mantine dislikes Electric types, hard walls like Ferrothorn, Toxapex, fat stuff in general.


I like this core personally because Mantine can switch in into Water Types in order to protect Hippowdon, while Hippowdon can handle Electric Types, Physical Attackers like Bisharp or threats that can 2HKO Mantine, also Mantine provides Stealth rock support and you can add good Pokemon to support this core, examples of this are:

/
/
/
/


Excadrill here with Mantine and Hippowdon can totally handle Zeraora, and its a nice speed control because Sand Rush, giving offensive presence to these two, can annoy Fairy types that lack of Flamethrower or Fighting Type Moves like Clefable and Magearna, another good partner is Magnezone being able to remove Ferrothorn which walls Hippowdon and Mantine and helps to trap other solid steel types like Corviknight, Skarmory, etc. Clefable here can work to handle Urshifu Dark Type, Toxapex with Electric Coverage, Ferrothorn with Fire Coverage, can work as Wish Pass too, Clefable have a lot of utility here since it can pair well with offensive sets like Life Orb with speed for some threats or Defensive Bulk for threats like Urshifu as I mentioned before. Ferrothorn can wall Zeraora and other physical threats, also it can give Spikes Support to team if needed, while Hydreigon can work as offensive partner to Mantine being able to wall Rotom-Heat with Roost sets, taking advantage of Nasty Plot sets too so it dont become a passive core.

Import of sets.
Mantine @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 248 HP / 164 Def / 96 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Defog
- Haze
- Roost

This one for Azumarill Speedcrep.

Mantine @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 248 HP / 128 Def / 132 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Defog
- Haze
- Roost

faster version to outspeed Alolan-Marowak


Team Example



Shoutouts
Shoutouts to NG Guys who suggested to add some stuff to the analysis, big thanks to Finchinator for allow End Game Clan start this proyect in this thread, thanks for read, hopefully we'll be writing and testing new stuff to make 2 solid analysis per week, to help comunity and to help metagame evolution.
 
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Flarito (Flareon) (M) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Flash Fire
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Wish
- Protect
- Yawn
When messing around with calcs, this thing actually performed better than expected:
+1 252 SpA Volcarona Psychic vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Flareon: 102-121 (30.5 - 36.2%) -- 53.1% chance to 3HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Magearna Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Flareon: 132-156 (39.5 - 46.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
The issue is that Flareon is forced to Wish+ Protect, which is a huge momentum sap and gives your opponent free turns while you're forced to recover your Volc/Mag answer. It has some niche, but it's pretty heavily overclassed in my opinion. If you are going to use it, I'd recommend Toxic over Yawn to cripple stuff like Volc and potential switchins.

Sylvita (Sylveon) (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Pixilate
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hyper Voice
- Calm Mind
- Wish
- Protect / Mystical Fire (at your choice)
Sylveon is something I used a bit before DLC and have seen a few times since. Its niche comes from being a special wall capable of spreading fat wishes and removing status with heal bell. I don't think CM is the best set right now- the prevalence of physical attackers such as Urshifu and Marowak-A, as well as Sp.Def Pex, means that Sylv is hard-pressed to find an opportunity to set up freely. Due to this, I think the utility set is still the most viable option:
Sylveon @ Leftovers
Ability: Pixilate
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Wish
- Protect
- Hyper Voice
- Heal Bell / Mystical Fire


Ariel (Vaporeon) (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Flip Turn / Scald
- Wish
- Protect
- Heal Bell / Scald
Vaporeon functions in a similar role to Sylveon, but I do think it's much less viable. It can't really switch in to things like Marowak, Urshifu, and even Excadrill (which forces it to wish), all things which a Physically defensive pivot in this meta should be able to at least partially deal with. Wish + Flip Turn is a nice niche, but Vaporeon struggles in practice and faces heavy competition from other bulky waters such as Pex and Slowbro.

I think there lot of people who dont have discovered this Pokemon yet, while others do, this Pokemon at the moment have a big usage in Smogon World Cup, but ¿why? after DLC got released we got plenty of new Pokemon, Mantine is one of them, having a good typing of Water / Flying type make it useful as a Ground Inmunity, and thanks to Water Absorb as Ability it have some important roles in the actual metagame, Mantine have good Special Defense and a good amount of HP, It have decent Physical Defense which makes it a good tank.
WIth the Greeks slapping it on a few teams this past week, Mantine has shown to be an option in the current meta. While Mantine isn't one of the new pokemon, it definitely gets an increase in viability through the returning of Volc (which is its main niche). Its Defense is pretty bad. It can barely take hits from Urshifu and Marowak, which makes its niche pretty clear; it is a Volc answer and defogger that also provides some specially defensive backbone and a defogger, as well as being a ground immunity (which can help vs sand) and an answer to rain. However, it gets overwhelmed pretty quickly by lots of other common mons in the tier, not even being able to switch into Mag until the set is comfortably known. It definitely has more of a niche than the Eeveelutions, but it probably won't change much in viability as the meta settles.
 
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There's a fascinating gimmick that I saw mentioned elsewhere and I wonder if it could work.
My guess is it could be somewhat unreliable but surprising when it goes according to plan.
(I don't play much anymore so I'm not in a great position to judge myself.)

So Dracozolt has Bolt Beak; a drawback-free Electric move which doubles in power to 170 whenever it goes before its foe.
In addition, Dracozolt gets STAB and has Hustle which boosts its attack (in exchange for a reduction in accuracy) making the move devastating.
However Dracozolt has middling speed and no reliable way to boost it which limits its opportunities to fire off full strength Bolt Beaks.

Gen VIII introduced a peculiar consumable hold-item called "Blunder Policy" which raises speed by two stages when its holder misses a move.
(It will not be consumed if the move fails because the target is immune. It only triggers on a miss due to accuracy/evasion.)
One could deliberately run an inaccurate move on Dracozolt in order to activate Blunder Policy and gain a +2 speed boost.
With a neutral nature Dracozolt hits 249 speed which is fast enough to outrun max speed Dragapult when boosted.

Something like:
Adamant Hustle Dracozolt @ Blunder Policy
~Bolt Beak
~Dragon Claw
~Fire Fang/Earthquake
~Dragon Rush

Dragon Rush is only 60% accurate (with Hustle) so it has a good chance to miss and activate the Blunder Policy for +2 speed.
If it does connect it will hurt quite a bit with 100 base power and STAB (+20% flinch for a chance to "get away" with not missing a slower foe).
If you're using Dragon Rush instead of Dragon Claw you probably want it to miss so the damage would only be a consolation prize.
Still, it's a dual threat with the outcome being up to RNGesus.

One obvious issue I can see is that the set will attract ground types and it doesn't have coverage specifically for them (Excadrill excepted).
Furthermore, the first three moves are at most 80% accurate under Hustle and could trigger Blunder Policy prematurely before a sweep is possible.
I could see this either saving the player in a pinch or disappointing them terribly, depending on the match.
Anyway, just thought I would throw it out there.
 
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TR on individual setters is fine like Hatterene, but there are still a lot of problems for Trick Room in full trick room teams.
These problems can be solved in the future but discussing buffs to trick room would be better suited for Showdown or Discord.
I've actually been wondering about this and this comment makes me think its a fair one to ask, how good is a single TR Pokemon like Hatterene? Like on paper it makes sense since it basically acts as a type of Agility for it, but TR has always had a connotation of being a "team thing" so not gearing the team around it seemed off whenever I thought about it.
 
I have personally tested TR quite a bit and I think that hard TR is as usual, very niche, especially because Uxie and Cresselia are missing. The way to go in my opinion is some sort of Semi-TR, because stuff like Hatterene and Magearna are pretty good even outside of TR. Now I think you could go with smt like these two setters, 1 abuser and then some backbone and speed control for when TR isn't up, which would make your team much more flexible. What are your thoughts on this?
 
I posted about Trick Room a couple months ago after Dracovish was banned. At the time, Trick Room was really good on the ladder with that devil-fish gone. It was easier to set up and few offensive teams had good answers to Life Orb Necrozma, Hatterene, or Reuniclus. (My TR-users of choice, though you could swap one out pretty easily).

How has the metagame changed since then? Chansey, Chansey, and Chansey. The strong special sweepers that set up Trick Room now have a blanket counter, though as a previous user mentioned, Hatterene’s Psyshock can still 2HKO (this requires SR and LO not being Knocked Off). But Chansey will still stall you out with Protect and the rise in Mandibuzz hasn’t helped either.

What about Magearna? The premier setter from last gen, Mag isn’t as spectacular without Twinkle Tackle, now suffering severely from 4-moveslot syndrome and still unable to break Chansey with a TR set.

What about Marowak? Marowak is actually a blessing and a curse in disguse for Trick Room. It is a great user of Trick Room but opposing Marowak’s with Spe investment have the potential to wreck any TR team. Crawdaunt can only switch in once. (It wasn’t very common in OU last gen outside of TR).

Conclusion: It is usable but has some serious flaws that keep it from being more than a gimmick imo. Could be possible there is some hidden threat lurking in UU or RU that changes that though. Additionally, semi-TR may be more viable as well - using LO TR and a slow breaker that cruises through offensive mons and the rest of your mons working on bulkier stuff.

I won’t comment on TR last gen - I did that last gen.
 
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Looking at the tier shifts posted earlier today, I saw that clef is finally no longer #1 in usage. It’s like #6 with around 20% usage. Kinda shows that clefable isn’t as overbearing anymore like it was pre-DLC
 
Looking at the tier shifts posted earlier today, I saw that clef is finally no longer #1 in usage. It’s like #6 with around 20% usage. Kinda shows that clefable isn’t as overbearing anymore like it was pre-DLC
Also pre-DLC monster like Kyurem Aegislash Conkeldurr drop to UU..
Aegislash go to Uber Gen 6 and 7 to UU Gen 8
 


I don't think I'd call six mons (including G-Bro), five of which have radically different defensive typings and all of which have incredibly good synergy with one-another, to be "poor distribution" when Regenerator cores in their current state can stall out a huge amount of threats just by switching between one-another.
“Radically different typings”
3 Water Types
3 Psychic Types
3 Poison Types
2 Grass types

Yup...
 

TPP

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RMT Leader
June usage stats are here!

Code:
Combined usage for OU (1695 stats)
+ ---- + ------------------ + ------- +
| Rank | Pokemon            | Percent |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ------- +
| 1    | Magearna           | 40.446% |
| 2    | Urshifu            | 25.411% |
| 3    | Mandibuzz          | 23.237% |
| 4    | Cinderace          | 22.444% |
| 5    | Dragapult          | 22.165% |
| 6    | Clefable           | 20.920% |
| 7    | Excadrill          | 19.181% |
| 8    | Rillaboom          | 19.113% |
| 9    | Volcarona          | 18.842% |
| 10   | Toxapex            | 18.663% |
| 11   | Azumarill          | 16.986% |
| 12   | Marowak-Alola      | 15.272% |
| 13   | Ferrothorn         | 13.144% |
| 14   | Chansey            | 12.496% |
| 15   | Slowbro            | 12.328% |
| 16   | Magnezone          | 11.910% |
| 17   | Hippowdon          | 11.869% |
| 18   | Tangrowth          | 11.686% |
| 19   | Alakazam           | 10.991% |
| 20   | Hawlucha           | 10.856% |
| 21   | Corviknight        | 10.045% |
| 22   | Urshifu-Rapid-Strike |  9.571% |
| 23   | Kommo-o            |  8.399% |
| 24   | Zeraora            |  8.355% |
| 25   | Rotom-Heat         |  8.191% |
| 26   | Hydreigon          |  7.684% |
| 27   | Pelipper           |  7.411% |
| 28   | Togekiss           |  7.280% |
| 29   | Mew                |  5.424% |
| 30   | Kingdra            |  5.254% |
| 31   | Bisharp            |  5.218% |
| 32   | Amoonguss          |  5.160% |
| 33   | Scizor             |  4.778% |
| 34   | Skarmory           |  4.442% |
| 35   | Quagsire           |  4.401% |
| 36   | Hatterene          |  4.390% |
| 37   | Barraskewda        |  4.098% |
| 38   | Crawdaunt          |  4.064% |
| 39   | Seismitoad         |  4.056% |
| 40   | Aegislash          |  3.773% |
| 41   | Terrakion          |  3.767% |
| 42   | Lycanroc-Dusk      |  3.626% |
| 43   | Conkeldurr         |  3.537% |
| 44   | Gengar             |  3.224% |
| 45   | Talonflame         |  3.200% |
| 46   | Kyurem             |  3.114% |
| 47   | Heracross          |  3.085% |
| 48   | Krookodile         |  2.995% |
| 49   | Weezing-Galar      |  2.963% |
| 50   | Slowbro-Galar      |  2.927% |
| 51   | Jirachi            |  2.876% |
| 52   | Grimmsnarl         |  2.815% |
| 53   | Venusaur           |  2.685% |
| 54   | Ninetales-Alola    |  2.641% |
| 55   | Rotom-Wash         |  2.552% |
| 56   | Indeedee           |  2.488% |
| 57   | Primarina          |  2.424% |
| 58   | Torkoal            |  2.177% |
| 59   | Tyranitar          |  1.942% |
| 60   | Ditto              |  1.862% |
| 61   | Starmie            |  1.828% |
| 62   | Mantine            |  1.823% |
| 63   | Weavile            |  1.704% |
| 64   | Cloyster           |  1.685% |
| 65   | Pincurchin         |  1.560% |
| 66   | Keldeo             |  1.550% |
| 67   | Mimikyu            |  1.525% |
| 68   | Druddigon          |  1.512% |
| 69   | Shuckle            |  1.346% |
| 70   | Raichu-Alola       |  1.336% |
| 71   | Tentacruel         |  1.308% |
| 72   | Klefki             |  1.292% |
| 73   | Haxorus            |  1.287% |
| 74   | Blissey            |  1.270% |
| 75   | Gyarados           |  1.262% |
| 76   | Porygon2           |  1.254% |
| 77   | Reuniclus          |  1.243% |
| 78   | Diggersby          |  1.161% |
| 79   | Scyther            |  1.086% |
| 80   | Necrozma           |  1.039% |
| 81   | Toxtricity         |  1.029% |
| 82   | Accelgor           |  0.973% |
| 83   | Scolipede          |  0.962% |
| 84   | Dragalge           |  0.898% |
| 85   | Mamoswine          |  0.812% |
| 86   | Rhyperior          |  0.793% |
| 87   | Mienshao           |  0.785% |
| 88   | Darmanitan         |  0.775% |
| 89   | Comfey             |  0.765% |
| 90   | Ninetales          |  0.746% |
| 91   | Dracozolt          |  0.742% |
| 92   | Porygon-Z          |  0.690% |
| 93   | Gastrodon          |  0.656% |
| 94   | Chandelure         |  0.647% |
| 95   | Bronzong           |  0.619% |
| 96   | Shiftry            |  0.610% |
| 97   | Ribombee           |  0.585% |
| 98   | Sharpedo           |  0.580% |
| 99   | Xatu               |  0.575% |
| 100  | Charizard          |  0.559% |
| 101  | Exploud            |  0.523% |
| 102  | Heliolisk          |  0.511% |
| 103  | Vaporeon           |  0.507% |
| 104  | Palossand          |  0.497% |
| 105  | Zoroark            |  0.488% |
| 106  | Lycanroc           |  0.477% |
| 107  | Centiskorch        |  0.446% |
| 108  | Clawitzer          |  0.436% |
| 109  | Runerigus          |  0.435% |
| 110  | Snorlax            |  0.432% |
| 111  | Incineroar         |  0.386% |
| 112  | Golurk             |  0.384% |
| 113  | Arcanine           |  0.371% |
| 114  | Flygon             |  0.358% |
| 115  | Milotic            |  0.337% |
| 116  | Toxicroak          |  0.329% |
| 117  | Poliwrath          |  0.328% |
| 118  | Salazzle           |  0.318% |
| 119  | Slowking           |  0.304% |
| 120  | Froslass           |  0.303% |
| 121  | Shedinja           |  0.302% |
| 122  | Obstagoon          |  0.299% |
| 123  | Whimsicott         |  0.274% |
| 124  | Exeggutor-Alola    |  0.257% |
| 125  | Araquanid          |  0.257% |
| 126  | Sylveon            |  0.250% |
| 127  | Celebi             |  0.247% |
| 128  | Politoed           |  0.238% |
| 129  | Claydol            |  0.237% |
| 130  | Pyukumuku          |  0.236% |
| 131  | Luxray             |  0.226% |
| 132  | Stunfisk-Galar     |  0.226% |
| 133  | Galvantula         |  0.218% |
| 134  | Noivern            |  0.217% |
| 135  | Gardevoir          |  0.212% |
| 136  | Bouffalant         |  0.209% |
| 137  | Sandslash-Alola    |  0.203% |
| 138  | Inteleon           |  0.202% |
| 139  | Vikavolt           |  0.199% |
| 140  | Indeedee-F         |  0.198% |
| 141  | Lurantis           |  0.197% |
| 142  | Lucario            |  0.193% |
| 143  | Eiscue             |  0.187% |
| 144  | Dhelmise           |  0.185% |
| 145  | Umbreon            |  0.181% |
| 146  | Blastoise          |  0.180% |
| 147  | Sirfetch’d         |  0.172% |
| 148  | Goodra             |  0.170% |
| 149  | Slurpuff           |  0.169% |
| 150  | Espeon             |  0.168% |
| 151  | Corsola-Galar      |  0.165% |
| 152  | Silvally-Ground    |  0.158% |
| 153  | Frosmoth           |  0.154% |
| 154  | Jellicent          |  0.146% |
| 155  | Miltank            |  0.146% |
| 156  | Polteageist        |  0.135% |
| 157  | Rotom-Mow          |  0.131% |
| 158  | Golisopod          |  0.128% |
| 159  | Bewear             |  0.105% |
| 160  | Drifblim           |  0.103% |
| 161  | Coalossal          |  0.103% |
| 162  | Shelmet            |  0.101% |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ------- +
Our first usage stats in the DLC meta is here and it proves that the metagame has definetely changed a lot. Magearna and Urshifu have taken the metagame by storm, and some of our previous top mons like Corviknight have taken a fall from grace. There's a lot to cover, so I'll just keep it brief and leave some questions at the end.


Despite losing Z moves, Magearna is back and is actually even stronger than before. Magearna has a ton of sets, including Shift Gear + 3 attacks, Shift Gear + Calm Mind, Iron Defense + Calm Mind, Choice Scarf, Choice Specs, and Calm Mind + Pain Split. Magearna having gained Stored Power has helped double dance sets sweep, and the addition of Trick has made Choice Scarf and Choice Specs sets even more threatening, as not even something like Toxapex or Chansey is truly safe. Choice Specs in particular has seen some usage in the first few world cup games, and for good reasons too. Thanks to its typing and natural bulk, Magearna is able to come in frequently, and when it does, Magearna is able to deal massive damage, even dealing over 50% to resisted mons with Specs Fleur Cannon. It's definetely not an easy one to switch into, that's for sure.


Urshifu (Single-Strike) on the other hand is brand new and so far Choice Band sets have been working really well. Wicked Blow alongside Close Combat is very tough to safely switch into, as the coverage and power alone lets Urshifu nearly 2HKO the entier tier outside of Fairy-types like physically defensive Clefable. While Fairy-types do resist Close Combat + Wicked Blow, Urshifu has access to Poison Jab and Iron Head, both of which can deal a ton of damage and 2HKO Fairy-types like Clefable and Togekiss. It sits at a pretty respectable speed tier as well of 97 base speed, allowing it to outspeed mons like Rotom-Heat and Excadrill. Finally, Sucker Punch gives Urshifu the means to threaten faster offensive mons like Cinderace and Volcarona, making it a little difficult to revenge kill.


Mandibuzz has essentially replaced Corviknight as the best Defogger in the tier. Mandibuzz is able to soft check a ton of new threats, including Urshifu, Alolan Marowak, Alakazam, as well as some previous threats like Rillaboom and Dragapult. The typing and natural bulk really goes a long way, and access to Foul Play helps it deal with other threats like Belly Drum Azumarill as well. Overall, it looks like Mandibuzz will remain as one of the best support mons in the DLC metagame, especially when it comes to Defog users.


Cinderace was really good before dlc hit, and that hasn't changed. Despite Slowbro being in the tier, Cinderace is able to put in good work against most teams thanks to Libero and its physical move pool consisting of Pyro Ball, High Jump Kick, Zen Headbutt, U-turn and Sucker Punch. U-turn in particular lets Cinderace hit Slowbro for 40% while grabbing momentum and this can make it a good facilitator for offense. Defensively, Cinderace has some new utility in that it can be used to revenge kill Magearna and Volcarona, both of which are new strong mons with high usage.


Dragapult was expected to take a hit with Magearna and Chansey returning, but it's surprisingly still great. Dragapult's speed tier lets it outspeed nearly everything, including Alakazam and Scarf Magearna. Despite Mandibuzz having its highest usage ever, Dragapult has been able to put in decent work thanks to U-turn and Wisp as well as some new options like a mixed or physical set using Dragon Darts. Dragapult is a pretty nice revenge killer for mons like Alazakam, and is also one of the few mons that can resist and tank Azumarill's +6 Aqua Jet and threaten it back. It has also benefited from Zeraora seeing less usage due to the new additions of Tangrowth and Amoonguss.

There's a lot of mons that saw a big dip in usage and some that even fell to UU. Those mons include the following:

Significantly lower usage than pre-dlc:

Dropped to UU:


Here are my questions for everyone:

1. How do you feel about the new mons that made it to OU (
)?
2. How do you feel about the pre-dlc mons that saw dips in usage?
3. For both returning mons and new-dlc mons, whose usage surprised you the most?
4. What mons do you believe will continue to see high usage?
5. What mons do you believe will continue to see low/lower usage?
6. What mons do you think are underrated and may see higher usage in the future?
7. What mons do you think are overrated and may see less usage in the future?
8. This one isn't entirely related to usage, but among the world cup games played so far, what has caught your attention so far?
9. How do you feel about team building? Does it feel like there are too many things to cover, or are there certain mons that restrict building?
10. Was this post helpful for you? I hope so :)

Have a great day :psyglad:

Edit: The thread to discuss the world cup of pokemon 2020 is here: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/the-world-cup-of-pokemon-2020-ou-discussion.3666729/
 
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How do you feel about the new mons that made it to OU (
)?
Chansey: The Pink Blob is back again, ready to instill fear into the many special attackers in the tier such as Alakazam, Rotom-H, and Hydreigon, the latter two even seeing significant wane in usage. Chansey is probably going to be a huge threat and a good staple on stall teams by virtue of its monstrous HP stat and an awesome Special Defense.

Alakazam: A good speed tier and nice Special Attack, what else can I say? Unfortunately, it is one of the many Pokémon hard walled by Chansey, and its poor Defense stat leaves it prone to Knock Off users like Tangrowth and Azumarill, as well as U-turn from Cinderace and Mandibuzz. However overall, Alakazam can be an offensive powerhouse.

Magnezone: Although it lost Hidden Power this generation, Magnezone could prove itself that it is worthy since it is able to trap old threats like Corviknight and Bisharp, as well as returning faces like Magearna. Magnezone still has to watch out for Aura Sphere from Magearna though.

Urshifu Base - This is the reason why Aegislash dropped in the first place. Unseen Fist being able to ignore protection leaves King’s Shield useless, while Wicked Blow can just straight out OHKO it. Urshifu is going to prove itself as a menace in OU, and is only stopped by Magearna (if I’m correct).

Magearna: The new queen of OU, succeeding Clefable is ANOTHER FAIRY. Magearna is an absolute OU goddess right now. Gaining Trick this generation allowed it to cripple walls such as Tangrowth, Mandibuzz, Toxapex, and Chansey. Magearna’s ability to utilize plenty of sets can make it hard in a battle to guess which set your opponent’s Magearna is running.

Azumarill and Kingdra: AKA the Make Rain Great Again duo. These two have been the reason why Pelipper rose up to OU once again after the Dracovish ban. I believe with these two, rain in OU is going to start a sort of “Weather Cold War” between sand and rain teams.

Volcarona: This thing got WAY WAY better from last generation. Heavy-Duty Boots allows Volcarona to continuously switch in without fear of losing 50% of its health unlike Gen 7. Even though it lost Z-moves, Volcarona is still better than before.

For both returning mons and new-dlc mons, whose usage surprised you the most?
The Rillaboomer. I thought it was going to be UU at first because of Cinderace’s presence in the tier. However, I was shocked that it reached OU, even more the Top 10 most used. Now I will no longer underestimate it.

Was this post helpful for you? I hope so :)
Yes TPP GOAT. Have a nice day :psyglad:
 
Today in the misaventures of the low ladder noob, I wanted to express my opinion with the questions TPP made, but before that, lets make a moment of silence and huge respect for Ttar, rest in pepperoni my semi legendary friend.............................................

so with that out of the way, lets get right into it :3

I think that these mons make OU a bit more "interesting", Mag and Urshifu are by far the 2 new faces of this new OU that was dominated by Clefable and Corviknight not so long ago, I even can hear some people calling ban on Mag, but lets just wait a little more, the 2 week tier shift are not over and maybe something crazy will happen again

On one hand, im sad that Hydreigon took a huge blow (although I think it will still be OU and even going up in usage soon), on the other hand, Im kinda happy Zeraora can be put undercontrol now, also, having a new fire type that is not Rotom Heat or Cinderace is nice :,3

Magearna and its mighty 9 sets are sure making Clefable look like a relic from the past, 40% usage should be more than enough to activate some brain alarms. Urshifu Rapid Strike didn't fall to UU contrary to what I though and I think im not the only one in being surprised. and the best of all, Quagsire almost making it into OU and even having more usage than Aegislash, damm the legends are true, Quagsire literaly bends reality

The top 4 mons, Volcarona, Rillaboom, and Hippowdown will shape OU at this point and I think its not going to change anytime soon

Clefable is not omniprescent anymore and now this will go lower untill Urshifu and Mag gets banned, Togekiss to be honest doesn't really care about all these new mons, it will stay low, but I dont think it will fall to UU, Scizor made it just barely into OU, it has its niches (you guys should try choice band with stabs + Wingbeat and Sand Tomb) but in two weeks this thing falls into UU guaranteed

Guys, Im aware that everybody ignored me with this one, but listen, Dragon Tail Kommo-o is the way to heaven I promise.. Okay but real talk here, since Toad is no more, Kommo-o has seen more and more usage as proably the best rocker, and even tho many treats had appeared, I belive that people will experiment more with this mon instead of using the same Body Press set

To be honest, I cant put my finger on a mon that is "overrated" right now so lets just move on, sorry for the short answer :c

I wont answer 8 because i havent seen world cup....... yeah.........

im gonna be completly honest here, I dont even know what im doing when I try to build a team, but at least I know that a Volcarona answer, Urshifu answer and a Mag check (because Mag has no true counters, with Volcarona being the best check by far) are pretty much a must at this point, also Lucha HO cause sadly, I cant spam Dragon tail Kommo-o forever on the ladder without its fare share of consequences

Yes, cause I wanted to post my opinions but didnt know how, thanks :,3 <3

so thats about it, I hope I didnt make any mistakes when writing this, I cant wait to see other opinions, so yeah, bye c:
 
Guys, Im aware that everybody ignored me with this one, but listen, Dragon Tail Kommo-o is the way to heaven I promise
I would not use Kommo-o as a phazer if there’s a better option such as Hippowdon with Whirlwind. First of all, Whirlwind would always hit, while Dragon Tail only has 90% accuracy, which means Whirlwind is more reliable. Second of all, Whirlwind (I think) can ignore Substitutes, while Dragon Tail just straight out fails if the target has a Substitute.
 
Here are my answers for TPP questions.

1) I welcome most of the new faces that came to OU. Exceptions beign Urshifu since I feel like it lacks general defensive counterplay that is not Mandibuzz (only if it comes on wicked blow) or Clefable. Magerna may be somewhat problematic, but it feels like it is a pokemon that is not good because it has that one or two dominant sets, but because it can run multiply sets that can compliment multitude of teams. Now, this may be overbearing to some, but for now, I am personally fine with her. I am actually suprised by how good Magnezone is. Sure, it can not kill Ferrathorn without making some serious moveset changes, but it is still good special attacker that can trap and eliminate weakened steels and threaten bulky fairy, flying and water types.

2)I think that this is mostly new toy syndrome in a lot of cases. I do not feel that a lot of pokemon that fell to UU will stay there. And no I am not saying that because most of them will probably be banned. Stuff like Aegislash and Kyurum can still cause havoc even with Chansey around. I feel like most of the pokemon that fell are still better then some "new" alternatives, especially better then mons such as Scizor, Urushima Rapid Strike and Kingdra. But for mons that I am glad that fell are Tyranitar, Toad and Hatterna. They are probably three pokemon that could possibly stay in that tire.

3) Alolan Marowak. That mon is just good, healthier version of urushima in my opinion. Oh it hurts, and when it gets on the field your heart beat drops. But since it is slow and not all that bulky, it can be easily revenge killed. And it can not switch into most of pokemon for fear of knock off.

4)Magearna, Urshifu and Mandibuzz will probably climb more and more. But most certainly Cindarace. It has great speed tire, can check or revenge kill 9 out of 10 pokemon (that includes itself) in usage above. And considering that it is one of the more reliable answers to Magearna, it will rise more and more.

5) RIllaboom. Man, I love this mon but with realise of Urshifu, one of its sets, choice band, kind of become less then ideal. It is still good sword dance and physical choice scarf user (choice scarf is still good since wood hamer still hits like a track). At same time, I expect HO to slow down in next couple of days, and with it Rillaboom climb. I am still not sure what Scizor is doing in this tire. It is basically worse Rilaboom when it comes to offense, and it is not all that good on defensive spectrum either.

6) I feel like a lot of usage here is going to stay for a while. Maybe Amoongus, since it has nice typing that compliments a lot of our defensive pokemon. It especially pairs well with Mandibuz in collective effort against Urshifu.

7) I already said Rillaboom, Scizor, Urshifu RS and Kingdra. The one I think will also fall the most will probably be Hidragon. It just has so many natural checks and things that can revenge kill it that it is getting harder and harder to use. And its choice scarf set just does not have reliable way to damage anything without its dragon stab. I could have just said that Chansey exists but it would be to easy to just leave it at that.

8)Have not watched it.

9) Urshifu is for now the biggest problem. It feels like it only has few checks and those being Mandibuzz, Hippowdon and Clefable. It is basically slower Galarian Darmatian in my opinion that is not week to stealth rock.

10) It was helpfull.
 
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1. How do you feel about the new mons that made it to OU (
)?
2. How do you feel about the pre-dlc mons that saw dips in usage?
3. For both returning mons and new-dlc mons, whose usage surprised you the most?
4. What mons do you believe will continue to see high usage?
5. What mons do you believe will continue to see low/lower usage?
6. What mons do you think are underrated and may see higher usage in the future?
7. What mons do you think are overrated and may see less usage in the future?
8. This one isn't entirely related to usage, but among the world cup games played so far, what has caught your attention so far?
9. How do you feel about team building? Does it feel like there are too many things to cover, or are there certain mons that restrict building?
10. Was this post helpful for you? I hope so :)
1. The only Pokemon in that list I feel like aren't going to stay in OU are :magearna: and :scizor:. Scizor because there aren't a lot of things it necessarily beats anymore (and it's margin of surviving was more or less a miracle), and Magearna because ban plz.

2. A lot of the victims were probably victims due to New Toy Syndrome. Can guarantee that the next tier shift will look a lot more like previous ones.

3. :azumarill: Thought this would be used wayyyyyy less. What is this, Gen 6 OU?

4. :magearna: will continue to dominate for as long as it's allowed in the tier. :clefable: is also seeing a drop in usage because of NTS, once people realize how stupid WishPort is again it'll be right back.

5. If there was no reason use :tyranitar: before, there's even less now.

6. :haxorus: maybe someday

7. :magnezone: I mean, it's okay. It really doesn't do too much anymore though outside of beating Skarmory 2.

8. I haven't been keeping up oops

9. I like building teams a lot more now that Vish is gone. Teambuilding and crafting sets will always and forever be my favorite part of the game. Even if I absolutely suck at using them. Currently I don't feel like anything is massively impacting what you can run, my only issue is Magearna is dumb. It has always been dumb and now it is slightly less dumb but dumb nonetheless. The problem is that it runs multiple different sets and all of them are good. This is of course a step back from last gen where Every Copy of Magearna is Personalized, but it's still very hard to find the right check to at least a couple sets at a time.

10. Ur doing great keep it up :)
 

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1. How do you feel about the new mons that made it to OU (
)?
I guess I'm not really surprised by any of these Pokemon except for maybe Kingdra. They all have left a huge effect on the tier in some way or another due to their unique/potent offensive and defensive characteristics alike, and explaining what makes these Pokemon so good would just be repetitive, because it's been explained in great detail already. My feelings as a whole, though, is that they're all pretty solid, and I'm curious to see how the meta continues to adapt to these threats.

I guess Scizor and the aforementioned Kingdra come as a surprise to me the most, though. The former barely made the cut, and only really has one good set (so I expect it to fall off some when new toy syndrome subsides), and the latter is heavily influencing the second coming of Rain Offense, so that's pretty cool.

2. How do you feel about the pre-dlc mons that saw dips in usage?


Oh how the mighty have fallen. Kyurem didn't even make the cut, and the former three took a drastic hit from their once top 10 usage rates, as a lot of the newcomers give these 4 specifically a great wealth of trouble. I find it greatly ironic that Zeraora and Kyurem were once considered banworthy and seeing them become much less viable as a result of the threats that have arrived on the scene. Of these, I believe Rotom-Heat is definitely going to see a resurgence in use once people get acclimated to the tier, as its Fire/Electric typing and Nasty Plot set are really valuable in the current metagame due to Volcarona, Magearna, Tangrowth, Amoonguss, and Scizor running around.

Corviknight I can also see coming back to light if Urshifu ends up getting banned. Urshifu alone has already made Mandibuzz the superior Defog user since it resists Wicked Blow and is physically bulkier, but being an Electric-weak Steel-type right now is pretty problematic as well, as shown by Skarmory and Corviknight's great falls. Though, while it definitely still has a place in the tier, Mandibuzz gives it a ton of competition at the moment, so only time will tell.

Zeraora makes me sad. Its main niche now as an Electric attacker is its speed tier and coverage, but Tangrowth and Amoonguss have proven to be great in the tier, and put a huge dent in its offensive prowess due to resisting Plasma Fists and barely being threatened by Fire Punch. Zeraora certainly is still good, but it's not the Pokemon that once spearheaded offense anymore.

3. For both returning mons and new-dlc mons, whose usage surprised you the most?


This thing being as good as it is is a gigantic surprise to me. It definitely was good at the start of SM OU too, but its shortcomings became pretty quickly apparent due to Stealth Rock and Pursuit. Though, Fire/Ghost has ended up showing itself to be a pretty good typing both offensively and defensively now, and the loss of Pursuit in Gen 8 has given Ghost-types--and consequentially, Alolawak--a lot more room to breathe and pull off their roles. And, to add the cherry to the top, it even has a base 110 physical Ghost Move now to bat, as if Ghost-types needed any more firepower. Honestly, Ghost now currently is one of the best types in the game next to Steel and Fairy, and Alolawak's success is a testament as to why that is. Even though the why makes sense to me, I guess I'm just surprised it ended up being so good to begin with. Proof's in the pudding; don't underestimate the spooky specters.

Though, the thing is about Alolawak, is that I have a weird hunch that it might experience a fall similar to SM OU. It was appealing on the surface, but its proneness to being worn down due to it needing Thick Club and its trash speed tier really sent it down in the long term. I'm admittedly unsure if the same will happen here, as it has a much more definable niche than in Gen 7 OU, but I guess time will tell.

4. What mons do you believe will continue to see high usage?


Magearna is easily the best Pokemon in the tier right now. It has ungodly set versatility, an amazing defensive typing, and is even more splashable than it was in Gen 7. The loss of Z-moves hurt it considerably, but it has several new toys to make up for it, bringing viability to even more sets and even more cores. I still hold by my opinion that it is harder to use, though, and I believe that while it definitely is better than it was, that it makes up for it by being harder to use in a vacuum. I love Gen 8 Magearna, and it's clear that with how consistently it's been performing in tournaments that it's going to keep staying at the top.



Slowbro is a giant poggers moment. Regenerator + Teleport is unbelievably good, and it has proven to be the best defensive pivot in the tier by a longshot with its surprisingly solid defensive typing, great stats, and nifty movepool. There's not really much else to say about it, other than: poggersbro.


Chansey does Chansey things. It's a Stall staple, an amazing support Pokemon, and a phenomenal wall for reasons I do not need to explain. Though, it's easily the best it's been as a result of getting Teleport, which lets it perform on Balance and even Offense teams as another amazing pivot and Rocks setter. I wouldn't say it's as good of a pivot as the Bro since it relies on Eviolite, is relatively passive, needs Soft-Boiled/Wish to heal, and gets smashed by Fighting spam, but it's definitely amazing and will remain at the top rungs of the metagame for sure.

5. What mons do you believe will continue to see low/lower usage?

This thing used to be a top OU mon, but now it's dropped to UU, and is only sinking deeper and deeper. It's still got some use with its great defensive typing, Stealth Rock, and a Water immunity, but it dropping really is a testament to how huge Dracovish was toward its usage. I can certainly still see some fringe use for the aforementioned reasons, but it's just not as good as a Rocker as it used to be.


It's just not a good climate for Zeraora, and it's a pretty honest Pokemon without any weird tricks up its sleeve other than its coverage and speed. Unless someone comes up with some crazy tech for it, I really don't really see a metagame where Zeraora will be at the top rungs again unless Tangrowth and Amoonguss suddenly become niche or banned, both of which are obviously not happening.

6. What mons do you think are underrated and may see higher usage in the future?

Lycanroc-Dusk is unironically a sick mon. SD/Band Variants absolutely dismantle common defensive cores, and on top of that, it has insurmountably good coverage that are Tough Claws boosted as well as Rock priority, which blows away Volcarona and frail set-up sweepers. I made a more in depth post about it here. While Terrakion is more consistent, I think the more varied, unique explosiveness of Lycanroc's coverage and options make it hold a pretty strong niche over Terrakion after using it a fair bit.

7. What mons do you think are overrated and may see less usage in the future?


I know this is a really bold take, but, despite Volcarona being a good Pokemon, I don't think it is as effective in this metagame as it's been made out to be. I want to make clear that it'swithout question that Volcarona is a pretty good set-up sweeper, as HDB are a huge boon for easier set-up. However, no matter how you slice it, Fire/Bug offensively is less powerful here in execution as it seemed on paper, and it lacks good coverage outside of Giga Drain/Psychic. HDB, while great for ease of set-up, really makes it lack that extra oomph that it needs for its offenses. In particular, lacking Z-Crystals really hurts its sweeping game and the ability to more immediately break apart teams like in Gen 7. It only really does one thing in the metagame due to the HDB hype as well, making it pretty easy to telegraph, punish, and switch into, too, on top of being ripe for priority's picking. It's not really that Volcarona sucks--in fact, it is pretty good in the right hands--but more just the fact that teams are more naturally prepared for its main set, especially with Alolawak, Rotom-Heat, and Chansey being so common-place, and Volc lacking Z-Crystals to break through said checks more efficiently. It's unquestionably good against the uprise of defensive Grass-types and definitely is a great set-up sweeper, but it's less effective to use in execution than it's been made out to be, in my opinion.



Alakazam is underwhelming to me for similar reasons that Volcarona is underwhelming. Also similar to Volcarona, it's not a bad Pokemon whatsoever. It's extremely strong, has a great speed tier, and has amazing coverage; its LO Nasty Plot sets are horrifying breakers even with Chansey in the tier for sure. However, it has a hard time setting up against anything besides Stall/passive Pokemon due to its bad defenses and bad defensive typing, and consequentially it is a big risk to switch it in as well. Volcarona can at least find pretty solid, safe switch-in opportunities with its natural bulk, typing, and HDB, but it's a lot more of a gamble with Alakazam. Consequentially, it has to rely on much more passive Pokemon for set-up, limiting its otherwise incredible breaking potential. On top of that, while it is very strong (especially once set-up), its poor defenses leave it to be revenged pretty easily, especially with Alakazam's inability to raise its Speed without a Scarf (unlike Volcarona). As such, priority and opposing Scarfers pick it off without much issue. Though, when in the right hands, this thing wrecks house.

For the record, this is less about me thinking they'll drop off and more just my opinion on how they've fared in the metagame, so I wanted to use this question as an opportunity to dish my impressions of these mons in particular. While they're great, they definitely need team support and good play to really live up to the potential Gen 8 has allotted them.

8. This one isn't entirely related to usage, but among the world cup games played so far, what has caught your attention so far?
This is definitely not my field of expertise so I'll let a more tournament experienced player break this one apart. I will say, though, that I find the current World Cup to be pretty fascinating right now, as I'm seeing a lot of interesting techs being run. That one CM Zera set made waves in its era (ha).

9. How do you feel about team building? Does it feel like there are too many things to cover, or are there certain mons that restrict building?
Team building is in a very weird place right now. I haven't exactly been sure of how to structure my teams around my centerpiece Pokemon, though that could be more a symptom of the completely new tier climate and less the state of the metagame itself. But, from some loose observations I've made, I don't really like how it kind of feels mandatory to run niche spreads/sets in order to check certain threats. I've seen Anger Point Krookodile and Phys Def Brave Bird Mandi, the former of which is cool but niche, and the latter being kind of a slog to run. Though, if I had to put it in a vacuum, I am pretty sure the weird state of teambuilding is less the tier itself and more this uncharted valley we're in metagame-wise.

10. Was this post helpful for you? I hope so :)
very much so, thank you for your work!! :>
 
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Nickos

Quack
is a Smogon Media Contributor
Alakazam: A good speed tier and nice Special Attack, what else can I say? Unfortunately, it is one of the many Pokémon hard walled by Chansey,
+2 252 SpA Life Orb Alakazam Psyshock vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 464-546 (66 - 77.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+2 252 SpA Life Orb Alakazam Focus Blast vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 442-523 (62.8 - 74.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Not sure about that one


Regarding the usage stats, this month sure started out interesting, apart from obvious drops like Seismitoad, it's very noticeable that Urshifu-S pretty much killed the usage of at least half the mons that dropped to UU as well (Aegis/Terrakion/Conk/), this thing is possibly the biggest threat in the meta rn.

I'm surprised at how good Dragapult ended up being despite the additions of many mons that would give it trouble on paper, DD Dragapult is likely my favorite set and I feel that it being so underrated for so long during early SS was a crime, I can see SubDD sets possibly popping up more often due to using a lot of Pokémon that would usually just status Pult if it tried to DD as setup baits, combined with Phantom Force allowing you two rounds of Lefties recovery and it's just an amazing mon.
 

Gomi

cinderace rights
is a Pre-Contributor
7. :magnezone: I mean, it's okay. It really doesn't do too much anymore though outside of beating Skarmory 2.
I've seen this said so often and every time it just confuses me as to whether the person has used it or not. Specs Magnezone is extremely difficult to switch into and forms an incredible volturn core with Libero Cinder, Rillaboom, even CB Scizor if you're into that. Dealing 17-20% to a chansey while grabbing momentum with turn is nutty. The only things that really comfortably switch in and deny its turn antics are Gastrodon and Seismitoad, as Excadrill can come in once or twice on a mispredict ( 252+ SpA Choice Specs Magnezone Flash Cannon vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Excadrill: 153-180 (42.3 - 49.8%) ), and Hippowdown is risking a meaty 67-79% every time it attempts to block a volt, not to mention you can just toxic water grounds. "What about the regen grasses tho" well, Common Amoong spreads take a huge amount ( 252+ SpA Choice Specs Magnezone Flash Cannon vs. 248 HP / 92 SpD Amoonguss: 232-274 (53.8 - 63.5%) ) and AV Tang is both awful and dislikes toxic heavily. This isn't even mentioning that analytic is a very considerable power jump and a legit option since there isn't all that much to trap currently, and that basically limits your switchins down to Exca once, Chansey, and the Water Grounds, if they dont mind getting nailed by a toxic, Though I still tend to prefer magnet pull for deterring choiced Mages from ever claiming a KO with anything but volt switch.
Edit: I completely blanked on ferro's existence but its the same deal as Chansey really, 20-25% a volt turn on top of hazards while being forced out by Zone's volturn partner.
 
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