Metagame SS OU Metagame Discussion Thread v7 (Usage Stats in post #3539)

Why would you not just run choice specs? It has the exact same benefit as throat spray without having to waste a turn screeching. I understand you saying you want to switch moves, but offensive regieleki just wants to spam electric moves and switch out on a ground type, plus you'll only keep your boosts for one sitting.

While yes, rillaboom will generally be able to deal with ground types, you always give your opponent a free turn when you use an electric move against a ground type, and the most common ground type Lando-T has plenty of ways to neuter Rillaboom, through knock off, toxic, u-turn or just simply setting up rocks.
Yeah, but if the team only has Regieleki, Rillaboom, and Tapu Koko I'm sure you can throw Lando-T counters on the team...
 

ausma

imperfection is beautiful
is a Site Content Manageris an official Team Rateris a Top Social Media Contributoris a Top Artistis a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Live Chat Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
OU Forum Leader
Hey; I'm glad we have a new discussion point, but please try not to use calcs against a Pokemon that's not even accessible in the tier or even the generation outright, as it doesn't prove or support any kind of point given it is a purely irrelevant hypothetical that does not explore the execution of Regieleki in the tier. Please minimize the one-liners, too, and keep posts constructive and substantial.

Have a good Friday, all!
 
did you even read my post? you need terrain down from Tapu Koko, and also rising voltage is an option
that is terrain down
unless im missing something thats also a + spatk nature. I mean unless you have the calc I'm just saying eleki is weak sauce. Plus at +1 it struggles to KO a lot more especially the more bullky resists. No amount of boosts is gonna let it hit ground types.

+6 252+ SpA Regieleki Swift vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Swampert: 185-218 (45.7 - 53.9%) -- 3.1% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

eleki is bad. tedtalk over
 
Guess I put this in the wrong spot... Here goes

When we first saw base 200 speed on a pokemon, one that is related to Regigigas for Arceus’ sake we knew it would be worth looking at. In this article, I’m going to highlight the reasons why I think Regieleki should be banned. Please keep in mind that I am no professional, I don’t even have a good ladder ranking. Just hear me out.



What people have been doing



Most people have been using Regieleki as either a setup mon, for easy screens. There has been some usage as a special sweeper, taking advantage of its awesome ability and speed.



What NOBODY has tried



Regieleki is OP, here’s why. THROAT SPRAY. I was looking at ways to improve on its Special Attack stat enough to OHKO all of the pokemon in the metagame. I tried using choice specs which allowed an OHKO on most pokemon. However, this limited it to a single attack forcing it to switch out on any threat (such as any scarf user). I wanted to be able to use Volt Switch to get Regieleki out quickly if necessary. Being able to use Extreme Speed is also helpful for any Pokemon that have priority moves that threaten Regieleki’s speed control. The answer to this predicament was Screech. At first, you may say that it literally does nothing for Regieleki and that’s s where you’re right, It doesn’t. When you couple Screech with Throat Spray however you get a Special Attack boost on a pokemon that shouldn’t be able to get a Special Attack boost. Now mix that with U-Turn Tapu Koko, to get electric terrain down and you can OHKO almost everything in the metagame except for Ground Types. The answer to that? Throw Rillaboom on the team and you’re set. There are a few pokemon that can’t Be OHKOed by Regieleki, but they aren’t too much of a threat to worry about. Just for reference, it 2HKOs 255 SpDef Blissey.

It OHKOs Mega Rayquaza. It OHKOs Regice. This is crazy, neuter or ban. The only real counter is ground types (which can easily be countered with Rillaboom), scarf users, and Rotom Mow.

EDIT* I chose Screech over Round because Round can be blocked by ghost types.
On my opinion it seems interesting and fun. However it's walled by Ground types and frail as fuck
As I love heat and creative sets, this set in particular is not viable. Since you not only need a turn to use with Screech but overall you're probably gonna die while using it meaning that's difficult to get the boost on the first place, and Regieleki has a lot of issues, lack of coverage in particular the worst, but the frailty, it's nice on the paper, but really bad in practice.
But I think there's hope for Regieleki in the sinnoh remakes. I don't want to theorycraft, however if Hidden Power comes back and Regieleki learns it. Ground-types will see a OHKO or 2HKO on their face. But again for now Eleki is not that good because frailty and lack of coverage (aka this is what balance Eleki from being overwhelming to check. Imagine it with Ice Beam or Grass Knot) so Eleki is pretty bad now but there's hope for him on the sinnoh remakes
 
Yeah, but if the team only has Regieleki, Rillaboom, and Tapu Koko I'm sure you can throw Lando-T counters on the team...
Even if you have counters, landorus-t (or most ground types in the meta) has ways to either threaten or cripple anything that's coming in, easily setup in it's face or just simply u-turn out and gain momentum. Yes Regieleki is strong, but that prevalence of ground types on pretty much every single team which completely nullify it makes it very hard to dedicate a team slot for.
 

Finchinator

Harry's House
is a Tournament Directoris a Top Social Media Contributoris a Community Leaderis a Community Contributoris a Live Chat Contributoris a Top Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Top Smogon Media Contributoris a Super Moderator Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnusis a Past WCoP Championis a former Tournament Circuit Champion
OU & NU Leader
Also, Regieleki is fringe at best. Screens is cool, but Tapu Koko is arguably more consistent and versatile. Offensive sets are hardly ever worth using — no defensive niche outside of being a one time Tornadus-T check and you cannot bypass Grounds, which see usage on every non-Zeraora team. It is a cool Pokemon with some fun concepts, but it does not strike me as an OU mainstay or anything above a C tier threat.
 
You all my be right, but I think this could have the same potential as Gen 5 drag mag teams. All I have to do is find the right mag..
Guess I put this in the wrong spot... Here goes

When we first saw base 200 speed on a pokemon, one that is related to Regigigas for Arceus’ sake we knew it would be worth looking at. In this article, I’m going to highlight the reasons why I think Regieleki should be banned. Please keep in mind that I am no professional, I don’t even have a good ladder ranking. Just hear me out.



What people have been doing



Most people have been using Regieleki as either a setup mon, for easy screens. There has been some usage as a special sweeper, taking advantage of its awesome ability and speed.



What NOBODY has tried



Regieleki is OP, here’s why. THROAT SPRAY. I was looking at ways to improve on its Special Attack stat enough to OHKO all of the pokemon in the metagame. I tried using choice specs which allowed an OHKO on most pokemon. However, this limited it to a single attack forcing it to switch out on any threat (such as any scarf user). I wanted to be able to use Volt Switch to get Regieleki out quickly if necessary. Being able to use Extreme Speed is also helpful for any Pokemon that have priority moves that threaten Regieleki’s speed control. The answer to this predicament was Screech. At first, you may say that it literally does nothing for Regieleki and that’s s where you’re right, It doesn’t. When you couple Screech with Throat Spray however you get a Special Attack boost on a pokemon that shouldn’t be able to get a Special Attack boost. Now mix that with U-Turn Tapu Koko, to get electric terrain down and you can OHKO almost everything in the metagame except for Ground Types. The answer to that? Throw Rillaboom on the team and you’re set. There are a few pokemon that can’t Be OHKOed by Regieleki, but they aren’t too much of a threat to worry about. Just for reference, it 2HKOs 255 SpDef Blissey.

It OHKOs Mega Rayquaza. It OHKOs Regice. This is crazy, neuter or ban. The only real counter is ground types (which can easily be countered with Rillaboom), scarf users, and Rotom Mow.

EDIT* I chose Screech over Round because Round can be blocked by ghost types.
You all my be right, but I think this could have the same potential as Gen 5 drag mag teams. All I have to do is find the right mag..
 

TailGlowVM

Now 100% more demonic
is a Pre-Contributor
And it's not exactly Dracovish where there was only one widely viable Water immunity, and it was a Pokemon you wouldn't usually use otherwise, with about two other options. Let's look at the list of viable Ground types:

OU by usage:
:landorus_therian: The best Pokemon in the tier with a wide variety of sets.
:garchomp: One of the likely top 5 Pokemon of the tier thanks to the broken Scale Shot.
:nidoking: Strong wallbreaker capable of devastating defensive staples like Clefable and Toxapex.
:swampert: Stealth Rock pivot that also has one of the best defensive typings in the game.
:hippowdon: Skarmory-topping physical bulk with reliable recovery and sets Sand for Excadrill and Dracozolt.
:excadrill: Powerful sweeper with blistering speed under sand.

These are not OU by usage but are ranked if you somehow can't fit one of those:
:gastrodon: See Swampert, but with reliable recovery and a Water immunity instead of Rocks and a pivoting move.
:nidoqueen: A slower but bulkier Nidoking.
:seismitoad: Stealth Rock setter and special attacker for rain.
:quagsire: Only viable on stall but has an invaluable ability for it.
:krookodile: Niche Scarfer with Intimidate and Knock Off for role compression.
:mamoswine: Niche but powerful wallbreaker with priority and an amazing offensive typing.
:diggersby: Niche Swords Dance wallbreaker with one of the highest attack stats available to OU thanks to Huge Power.
:rhyperior: Probably the game's best switchin to Zapdos, with attack higher than Garchomp and practically impossible to OHKO without a 4x supereffective hit on the physical side.

There's also Zeraora and the occasional Thundurus-T if you absolutely cannot run a ground type. Against any of these Pokemon, Regieleki has to blow up or click (lol) Swift, and not a single one of them are used solely to beat Regieleki.
 
Last edited:
You all my be right, but I think this could have the same potential as Gen 5 drag mag teams. All I have to do is find the right mag..

You all my be right, but I think this could have the same potential as Gen 5 drag mag teams. All I have to do is find the right mag..
You are never going to find it because there are zero trapping abilities in OU (And no Magma Storm Heatran isn"t a solution)
 
I've been searching.. will update with a team eventually. Thanks for the list.
Part of what makes dragmag work is that Magnezone traps steel types guaranteeing you can kill skarmory and ferrothorn; it has a consistent way of eliminating its issues. There is no trapper for ground types meaning that there is no true regieleki core like dragmag.
Edit: oops someone else already mentioned this, but yeah Regieleki is not banworthy...
 
Last edited:
Sorry, I'm new to smogon but yes Dragmag was good because magnezone was pretty much guaranteed to kill the steel types it trapped, but with ground types there really isn't a way to trap ground types and reliably kill them. Additionally Regieleki is so far from banworthy that I don't even think it even should be conversed about. Yeah those are my thoughts
 
Regileki with spa boosting nature and +1 spa does like 30% to Chomp and 35% Lando if they have 0 hp/sdef evs. Also non stab extreme speed from uninvested 100atk is so weak.

If your opponent switches to any ground type the turn you screech, you have to switch out or you lose leki. So you're playing 5v6 until your opponents volt absorber or ground type dies, and even then stuff like with priority, or scarf kartnana can revenge kill you easily with how weak exspeed is.

With specs you can at least swift on the turn the ground switches in and get some chip. Being forced out isn't as big a deal, you keep the specs/+1. All you do after killing grounds is click rising thunder anyway so being able to switch moves will barely ever help. Rising thunder with terrain does more to zolt, a 4x resist, than swift does lol.

Before the ban you could run Mag+Leki so the opponent would have to respect the screens+double dance possibility, which leaves them weak to specs mag+leki. There's no (at least I haven't found a) threatening enough wall-breaker-disguised-as-setup-sweeper that appreciates leki forcing the opponent to keep their grounds healthy the way mag did.
 
Interesting, Zamazenta doesn't even learn Swords Dance.
Kyurem-B was a piece of shit that brought nothing positive to the table, outside of spamming its choiced dragon stab, be it physical or special, and awkward sub sets, a comparision between Giratina (bw, of course, you never saw Gira OU, but the functionality would be similiar to it.) and Zam seems to be more fitting, powerful 'mons that are unbanned to blanket check several stuff, and ease teambuilding when dealing with 9,999+ threats With your 6 slots.
How would it work, though? Unbanning Zamazenta-Crowned? You're forced to have the shield when teambuilding, otherwise the team is banned to ubers? Bit strange, but it wouldn't be the first time, with Megachomp being regarded as weaker than regular 'Chomp, though those megas were "Tier X by technicality", you could argue though, that you weren't forced to mega evolve ASAP with Garchomp, so that changes the matter at hand, and as such the approach to have.
If you do the suspect test now and have people vote during the April Fish, only to have the final result to actually be real, you could topple Haunter's April Fish on gen 6.
In exactly which world is either Zamazenta form similar to Kyurem-Black or even Giratina considering how you compare KyuB and Giratina later on?

- KyuB was broken (in Gen 8 specifically) because it gained DD alongside its long-awaited physical Ice STAB, and the setup is what really pushed it over the edge (also it hasn't consistently or very viably run Choice items or Dragon moves since like ORAS so idk who you've been playing). Zamazenta can at best get +1 Attack per turn with Howl, which allows it to still be outsped by some Scarfers and a handful of faster Mons. Additionally, it's a supremely astute observation that they didn't give the shield mon the sword move. Well done.

- Zamazenta isn't being possibly unbanned to blanket check threats and do nothing else. It'd be suspected to see if it would be a healthy addition to the meta, which a variety of factors would decide (matchups against playstyles, movepool, stats, etc.). It's far from a done deal once unbanned on ladder for the suspect.

- Mega Garchomp being OU by technicality was due to how Mega forms work - the Megas require the base form to be used before Mega Evolution is triggered, meaning it's literally impossible for them to be independent of the base forms, which is why MChomp couldn't drop down to UU without base Chomp also dropping - otherwise, you could just run Garchomp without Mega Evolving it or something, which entirely defeats the purpose. The Zamazenta forms are independent of each other in battle and can be used separately - one is just locked to having a specific item, so this doesn't line up to mean the same thing.

Genuinely unsure what the rest of that means, although you're free to explain and elaborate.
 
So I wanted to post this before there's a chance they legalize Zamazenta since their release will only spell doom for this Mon. The Mon I wanna talk about is Scizor since I feel it has a bunch of untapped potential in the current meta. Its stats, typing and moveset give it so much versatility.

It's great typing lets it run pretty much anything from offensive to physically or even specially defensive.

scizor.png


Scizor @ Metronome
Ability: Technician
- Swords Dance
- Bullet Punch
- Knock Off
- Roost

This is a set I've been running with much success. Not posting a specific EV spread since I feel it can be run with almost any decent spread and is very versatile when it comes to team building.

This set basically works the same way as most standard Scizor sets. Knock Off is never gonna be a bad support move and Roost is to ensure it's not worn out in long battles and aids in set up sweeping. What makes this set really threatening though is Metronome. When it comes to late game sweeping, you're gonna be pretty much spamming Bullet Punch after you set up so you might as well run an item that rewards you for spamming the same move. After using your third BP, you start doing more damage than you would if you were holding Metal coat and it also helps Scizor a bit harder with Knock Off.

When played correctly, this set lets it beat many threats that other standard sets might have trouble with such as Counter Skarm, Malmetal, and Double Dance Reuniclus.
 
I've been using this demon Kyurem set that I have no idea why no one has thought of yet:
1616247387654.png


Kyurem @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 32 Atk / 224 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Earth Power
- Icicle Spear
- Freeze-Dry

This set mashes all of Kyurem's qualities into one big set:
1. Its poor defensive typing
2. Its amazing 125/90/90 bulk
3. Its great mixed attacking stats (people forget Kyu has 130 base attack)
4. Its great offensive movepool
5. Its "almost enough" 95 base speed

Common scenario with this set: You send out Kyurem, opponent got Rillaboom/Landorus/anything thats outsped and OHKOed by Specs Kyurem on the field (which is half the metagame). Your opponent decides to switch to Heatran on the Ice move, Blissey if he has it, or make the SpDef Corvknight or Clefable midground. In any case, you DD up. If its a Clef or Corv you let it hit you, then youre at +4/+2/+2 (basically a shell smash and a swords dance) and its good game. Otherwise even at +1/+1, many teams are basically lose cuz their Ice resists (water,fire and steel) get bopped by Freeze Dry or Earth Power, and their fat SpDef walls get bopped by Icicle Spear.

You need to ensure that pesky Volcaronas,Ferrothorns,Unburden Hawluchas or fast Scarfers like Kart and Chomp are removed first

I've lost count of the number of teams I've swept with this. Kyurem's offensive prowess is just so good that just from team preview you basically won the match already when you get to +1. Teams often count on the fact that Kyurem is choiced, or is too slow to handle revenge killers, and this set rectifies both of that.

Weakness Policy activation is oftentimes not needed, but once activated, it's basically gg to fatter balance or stall without Unaware Clef. With Kyurem's natural bulk, it can live many,many supereffective hits easily.

252 Atk Landorus-Therian Stone Edge vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Kyurem: 260-306 (66.4 - 78.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
0 Atk Tyranitar Stone Edge vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Kyurem: 306-360 (78.2 - 92%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Zeraora Close Combat vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Kyurem: 258-304 (65.9 - 77.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Clefable Moonblast vs. 0 HP / 0- SpD Kyurem: 332-392 (84.9 - 100.2%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO

252+ Def Ferrothorn Body Press vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Kyurem: 212-250 (54.2 - 63.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Def Corviknight Body Press vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Kyurem: 180-214 (46 - 54.7%) -- 58.2% chance to 2HKO
0 SpA Clefable Moonblast vs. 0 HP / 4- SpD Kyurem: 236-282 (60.3 - 72.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

I use this with Aurora Veil support and Magnezone. 224 SpAtt to kill Urshifu-R without a boost. With Aurora Veil, you get to activate Weakness Policy without dying from very strong offensive pokemon like specs Koko, kartana, etc.

Hope yall try this out for yourselves
 
Last edited:
There's been a lot of discussion about Scizor, and I wsa wondering what sets are getting used, and maybe if someone could provide some examples of teams using it.
 

Katy

Banned deucer.
There's been a lot of discussion about Scizor, and I wsa wondering what sets are getting used, and maybe if someone could provide some examples of teams using it.
:scizor:
Scizor @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Technician
EVs: 248 HP / 168 Def / 92 SpD
Impish Nature
- Swords Dance
- Bullet Punch
- Knock Off / U-turn
- Roost

or this

Scizor @ Leftovers / @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Technician
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Bullet Punch
- U-turn
- Roost
- Knock Off​

are currently used, the former is used to tank hits better from choice band kartana and rillaboom, where the latter is better to check special attackers such as kyurem, tapu lele, and clefable with thunder in its arsenal. Both sets have their merits in the current meta, but which set you should use depends on your team entirely.

currently there are plenty of scizor teams which tend to be rather offensive with partners such as weavile, rillaboom, hawlucha, volcarona, garchomp, tornadus-t, and tapu koko, as they can put a lot of pressure on plenty of common pokemon and they easen the teampartner up with great synergy while maintaining the offensive pressure. this is mainly why scizor has risen in popularity recently. also it is one more knock off user with a boosting move in swords dance and knock off users in ou are in general very appreciated to remove annyoing items such as leftovers and heavy-duty boots.
these are the main reasons as to why scizor has found a place in the current metagame and i think it'll see a rise in the viability in the future as well, as this pokemon alongside weavile really left a big impact recently.
 
:scizor:
Scizor @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Technician
EVs: 248 HP / 168 Def / 92 SpD
Impish Nature
- Swords Dance
- Bullet Punch
- Knock Off / U-turn
- Roost

or this

Scizor @ Leftovers / @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Technician
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Bullet Punch
- U-turn
- Roost
- Knock Off​

are currently used, the former is used to tank hits better from choice band kartana and rillaboom, where the latter is better to check special attackers such as kyurem, tapu lele, and clefable with thunder in its arsenal. Both sets have their merits in the current meta, but which set you should use depends on your team entirely.

currently there are plenty of scizor teams which tend to be rather offensive with partners such as weavile, rillaboom, hawlucha, volcarona, garchomp, tornadus-t, and tapu koko, as they can put a lot of pressure on plenty of common pokemon and they easen the teampartner up with great synergy while maintaining the offensive pressure. this is mainly why scizor has risen in popularity recently. also it is one more knock off user with a boosting move in swords dance and knock off users in ou are in general very appreciated to remove annyoing items such as leftovers and heavy-duty boots.
these are the main reasons as to why scizor has found a place in the current metagame and i think it'll see a rise in the viability in the future as well, as this pokemon alongside weavile really left a big impact recently.
Just wondering- why does the spdef set not run SD? (Also, thanks for the info :))
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 1, Guests: 2)

Top