Metagame SS OU Metagame Discussion v4 (check out posts #483 and 484 for DLC1 info!)

[Pabloaram]

View attachment 250925 (sets up alongside CM)
View attachment 250928 (breaks sub)
View attachment 250930 (if it doesn't sub for whatever reason)

Primarina is not a problem here

I mean you would run 3 moves only for primarina when gastro give Clef pass free wish, Ferro do wathever he want, what gastro do to not give a free switch when either nothing like to switch in knock off?? and what gastro do if they gain a free switch? Nothing... Toad set sr and spam knock off for free...

 

[McCoolDude]

I mean you would run 3 moves only for primarina when gastro give Clef pass free wish, Ferro do wathever he want, what gastro do to not give a free switch when either nothing like to switch in knock off?? and what gastro do if they gain a free switch? Nothing... Toad set sr and spam knock off for free...

Each of those options, alone, stops Primarina pretty well. I don't believe he's suggesting someone runs all three.

 

[Pabloaram]

Each of those options, alone, stops Primarina pretty well. I don't believe he's suggesting someone runs all three.

Yes, you stop Primarina. and what more?? The thing is the lack of Knock Off/Stealth Rock make Gastrodon too pasive, when Toad check the same mons and give more ulitility, nothing in the tier swich free on Toad...

 

[Spoontech]

While this mon will drop usage (20% is insane) I feel Toadster will still be a balance staple due to its ability to set rocks, spread burn/toxic and knock off. I expect that as Toad drops in usage, Keldeo/Specs Pelipper might rise in usage again (will depend on how Pex is gonna use its EV's) causing small bounces every now n then.

While these 2 can get more mix, I'm not 100% sure if it will fully happen. I expect Ferrothorn to remain fully PDef due to Excadrill and Zeraora, where Pex will go more SpDef for NP breakers to try and get a haze out. If Pex goes SpDef it'll open up a lot though for the likes of Exca, SD Aegi, but will be harder to get broken through by the likes of NP users and SpecsHex.


Now that one of Pexothorn is gonna run SpDef I feel like the odds of seeing a return of LO Clef as minimal, which is a shame as LO Clef is really fun.

 

[Martin]

I mean you would run 3 moves only for primarina when gastro give Clef pass free wish, Ferro do wathever he want, what gastro do to not give a free switch when either nothing like to switch in knock off?? and what gastro do if they gain a free switch? Nothing... Toad set sr and spam knock off for free...

Obviously u wouldn't run all three; the sets r basically one of amnesia or clear smog (neither of which are run expressly for Prim btw, granted if you're running Clear Smog u only beat it behind sub if you run EQ) but the point was more it's not setup bait for Prim with broadly very minor adjustments to set structure. The types of teams that gastro is generally run on have solid defensive cores to account for things switching in on it, and even then it can still pressure them with Scald and can actually just sit in front of stuff and stall with Recover, which is imo broadly more important in this metagame than a Pokemon that technically checks mons A, B, and C but falls flat the moment it has to check more than one of them.

To directly compare their ability to check stuff, Gastro has almost the same physical bulk (assuming identical investment), noticably better special bulk/lower weight (notably letting it check Zeraora better), reliable recovery, and options to let it deal with stuff like CM Clefable, CM Primarina, CM Reuniclus, CM+Taunt Keldeo, etc. Generally speaking, if you have another Stealth Rock user (e.g. Rhyperior, Kommo-O, Hippowdon etc.) you should be running Gastrodon instead of Seismitoad. And if you are comparing against, IDK, EP+Clear Smog Gastro, Seismitoad is also bait for Primarina, which can Sub on it if it isn't carrying EQ, as well as having the option to run either Seis or Gastro alongside something like Power Whip Ferro which can deal with Primarina itself.

 

[BolTingBlazie]

Shuckle is back, why such a big rise? It went from pu to ou? How and why did it shoot up in viabillity so fast?

 

[theotherguytm]

Not being funny, everyone saying "rain is ded now":
1. Vish's presence was arguably a net negative for Rain due to the overuse of Water immunities and very sturdy resists.
2. It kinda has been ded ever since the Metronome nerf was discovered, which made Metronome Mantine unviable.
3. Did you forget this boy?
Crawdaunt @ Choice Band
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Aqua Jet
- Crabhammer
- Knock Off
- Close Combat

It hits things

252+ Atk Choice Band Crawdaunt Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Ferrothorn: 242-286 (68.7 - 81.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Choice Band Adaptability Crawdaunt Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Toxapex: 176-208 (57.8 - 68.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Choice Band Adaptability Crawdaunt Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Toxapex: 228-270 (75 - 88.8%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Choice Band Adaptability Crawdaunt Crabhammer vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Corviknight in Rain: 356-420 (89 - 105%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Choice Band Adaptability Crawdaunt Aqua Jet vs. 0 HP / 0- Def Zeraora in Rain: 290-342 (91.4 - 107.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Choice Band Adaptability Crawdaunt Aqua Jet vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Zeraora in Rain: 260-306 (82 - 96.5%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

If you feel the need to really go overboard, this thing gets Dragon Dance and Swords Dance too. Yeah, it has the same speed as Arctovish, but let's work with what we have here. However, as you can see in the spolier, it does also have a scary Aqua Jet. So, knock yourself out I guess. I mean, wait, dang, not litera- never mind..

Anyway, I thought I'd post a few breakers from UUBL who might now have a larger niche for those wondering what their Clef is supposed to WishPort into play, and who don't want to immediately resort to Conk.

Obstagoon

Obstagoon @ Choice Band
Ability: Reckless/Defiant
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant/Jolly Nature
- Double-Edge
- Knock Off
- Close Combat
- Switcheroo/Gunk Shot
Obstagoon @ Flame Orb
Ability: Guts
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant/Jolly Nature
- Facade
- Knock Off
- Close Combat
- Switcheroo/Parting Shot/Bulk Up
Pros:
Base 95 speed, decent offensive typing, reasonable bulk, deep movepool with lots of underexplored options.
Cons:
Shocking defensive typing aside from the redundant Ghost immunity, base 90 Attack is bad unboosted, most options are inferior to Flame Orb.

Dracozolt

Dracozolt @ Leftovers
Ability: Hustle
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Substitute
- Bolt Beak
- Dragon Claw/Outrage
- Aerial Ace/Stone Edge/Earthquake/Fire Fang
Dracovish (Dracozolt) @ Choice Band/Scarf
Ability: Hustle
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Bolt Beak
- Earthquake/Fire Fang
- Stone Edge/Aerial Ace
- Outrage
Pros:
Hustle Bolt Beak hits HARDER than Vish's Strong Jaw Rend, it's otherwise just Dracovish with 20% chance to miss, just you wait until Sand Rush drops lol.
Cons:
Missing, Electric immunities are much easier to come by than Water ones, lacks Dracovish's defensive typing and bulk.
252+ Atk Hustle Dracozolt Dragon Claw vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Hippowdon: 115-136 (27.3 - 32.3%) -- 61.2% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Hustle Dracozolt Outrage vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Hippowdon: 157-186 (37.3 - 44.2%) -- 100% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Choice Band Hustle Dracozolt Outrage vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Hippowdon: 237-279 (56.4 - 66.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Crawdaunt

Crawdaunt @ Life Orb
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant/Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance/Swords Dance
- Crabhammer
- Knock Off
- Aqua Jet/Close Combat
(See above for Band set)
Pros:
New Rain wallbreaker of choice, godly STABs including priority, did you know it gets Close Combat now?
Cons:
Lacking when not clicking STABs, terrible speed (always outsped by max speed Swords at +1).

Durant

Durant @ Life Orb
Ability: Hustle
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Hone Claws
- Stomping Tantrum
- Stone Edge
- Superpower/Iron Head
Durant @ Choice Band
Ability: Hustle
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- First Impression/Crunch
- Iron Head
- Stone Edge
- Stomping Tantrum
Pros:
109 base speed=No getting forced out by Terrakion if Jolly and tying base 95 if Adamant, First Impression is godly, can patch up Hustle accuracy with Hone Claws or respond to a miss with 150 BP Stomping Tantrum, great PhysDef and defensive typing.
Cons:
First Impression is hard to fit on a set (being locked into it is terrible, but fitting it on a sweeping/boosting set is impossible), terrible STABs make you want to just use non-STAB sets, shallow movepool.

Diggersby

Diggersby @ Choice Band
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Superpower/Spikes/Knock Off
- Earthquake
- Take Down/Quick Attack
- Stone Edge
Diggersby @ Life Orb
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Bulk Up/Spikes
- Earthquake
- Knock Off
- Stone Edge
Pros:
Huge Power, Knock Off, STAB EQ and priority, access to the rare Spikes.
Cons:
Reliant on Huge Power, terrible defensive typing, 78 speed, you're using a Diggersby.

Weavile

Weavile @ Choice Band
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Ice Shard
- Icicle Crash
- Knock Off
- Brick Break/Psycho Cut/Poison Jab
Weavile @ Life Orb
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Icicle Crash
- Knock Off
- Brick Break/Ice Shard/Psycho Cut
Someone play stall so I can break it (Weavile) @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 248 HP / 204 Atk / 56 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Taunt
- Substitute
- Icicle Spear
- Knock Off/Toxic
Pros:
Literally only outsped by Dragapult and Zeraora, Adamant is faster than base 109, access to Swords Dance and a deep movepool including priority, have you tried looking for Ice resists lately? (Why else is Cloyster OU lol).
Cons:
Defensive typing still sucks, stallbreaking is basically worthless in the current metagame.

Enjoy I guess.

 

[Jordy]

Shuckle is back, why such a big rise? It went from pu to ou? How and why did it shoot up in viabillity so fast?
View attachment 250958

The main reason for Shuckle's gigantic rise in usage is the popularity of this team on the ladder. Typically, Ribombee and Araquanid were considered better Sticky Web setters, but Shuckle is very convenient for these types of teams as it can compress Sticky Web and Stealth Rock into one slot, giving you more freedom with other slots.

 

[TheArchangle]

As everyone said, seems to me that sand is really great right now with Vish gone and Toad dropping in USG as a result. While Ferrothorn for example is still a great mon, people well feel less compelled to have it on teams which helps sand too, and I think gradually people will run more mixed spreads and less MaxD. Hippo+Corv just got that much better, it's easier for Drill to sweep, etc.

I think Terrakion may benefit a bit as well. Toad dropping is huge for it, again less physical investment in spreads will help, and sand being better means it can use that SpDef boost from time-to-time making it able to soak up overheats from Rotom-H and either setup a SD or punch huge wholes in teams

 

[UnoriginalNinja2003]

I am One Hundred percent agree with Dracovish because it's too broken for OU but some Pokémon like Seismitoad will drop to the lower tiers because their only use is to used to Counter Vish Also I actually don't know if it will be banned after both DLC will come back because some Pokémon like Slowbro could check it.

 

[theotherguytm]

Also I actually don't know if it will be banned after both DLC will come back because some Pokémon like Slowbro could check it.

I'll repost a couple of calcs from the Nat Dex thread:
252+ Atk Choice Band Strong Jaw Dracovish Fishious Rend (170 BP) vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro: 179-211 (45.5 - 53.6%) -- 94.1% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Choice Band Strong Jaw Dracovish Crunch vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro: 226-268 (57.5 - 68.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
Basically, it's another Toxapex, but without Baneful Bunker.

 

[Steorra]

I am One Hundred percent agree with Dracovish because it's too broken for OU but some Pokémon like Seismitoad will drop to the lower tiers because their only use is to used to Counter Vish Also I actually don't know if it will be banned after both DLC will come back because some Pokémon like Slowbro could check it.

ok seismitoad has other uses in rocking, passing out scalds, being a defensive mon all around, even in gen 7 ou it had some usage in ou, not much though, but still has a niche in being a defensive water who can rock

 

[UnoriginalNinja2003]

ok seismitoad has other uses in rocking, passing out scalds, being a defensive mon all around, even in gen 7 ou it had some usage in ou, not much though, but still has a niche in being a defensive water who can rock

Makes sense but Seismitoad will likely drop to UU but will still have a niche in OU like Incineroar.

 

[Steorra]

yea I could see it going to uu and maybe ru, note that it was nu last gen, and I think with dracovish gone, it does the same thing as last gen

 

[Ema Skye]

Gastro feels really good right now, even without Vish.

Being able to beat Prima (Quake breaks subs), Heat-Tom (only fears Toxic) and Zeraora (Knot 3HKOs) in one slot is so valuable as these are three of the strongest Mons in the meta right now. While it doesn't have rocks, it's also a solid partner for Rocks users like Hippo and Kommo-o.

 

[Empress Mobile]

I honestly think rain will be better now. It's true that it lost a great abuser in Dracovish, but now it's unlikely that every team will have a dedicated water immunity. Seismitoad can be replaced by another Rocker, most of which are destroyed by rain quite easily. Both Seismitoad and Gastrodon previously served as decent rain answers, but as options have opened up a bit, rain teams can easily run Ludicolo or Ferrothorn to easily dispatch both Water/Ground threats. Vaporeon is now an unmon in OU. It is outclassed in Wish passing by Clefable and even more niche choices (of questionable viability as Wish passers) such as Jirachi and Sylveon due to Vaporeon's complete incapacity to accomplish anything meaningful for a team. The two main rain counters - Toxapex and Ferrothorn - will probably start being spec'd more to specifically counter rain team. The good thing for rain teams? The 3 most vicious breakers in the tier - Conkeldurr, Kyurem, and Zeraora - all have options to put both of them on the backburner, especially with good prediction/favorable spec matchup. I look forward to seeing how this develops for rain teams. Crawdaunt, Keldeo, Ludicolo and Primarina are looking all like decent options.

 

[ScottyAdams]

All this talk about CM Prima, and I'm just like "Uhh, Specs is a monster" as well as having a more immdiate threat. It takes prediction, but you have Scald (or hydro)/Moonblast/Energy Ball/Psychic at your disposal.

 

[Finchinator]

Specs should run Scald + Hydro + Moonblast + Psychic, for what it's worth (especially in a post-Dracovish tier, which mandates less Seismitoad and less desire for Energy Ball). Specs Primarina is an ok option for sure, but Sub+CM is so much better at forcing progress in the long haul that sticks and far less prediction reliant. If you are not prepped for it, then it is far less forgiving than Specs, which can be "played around" a lot of the time, especially by more offensive teams.

 

[kstiemsma]

I've been playing around with Primarina quite a bit today and I think PerishTrap can be a great lure. It beats both Ferro and Pex 1v1 and still is able to slam offensively with Moonblasts as the defensive investment for Dracovish is no longer needed. Very easy to heal up as well with WishClef as a teammate. Only downside is the opportunity cost of using CM Primarina but on certain builds it works great.

 

[Perish Song]

I don't understand why people speculate Seismitoad to fall UU or have a major negative usage spike. As far as I'm concerned, it still serves as a Water / Electric-type immunity, has access to Rocks, can spread Toxic / Burn, and has access to Knock Off. It also has a respectable bulk, it still forms solid defensive cores with Corviknight and Clefable and does well against certain Pokemon such as Toxapex, Cinderace, Hippowdon, and Excadrill. It's still a solid Pokemon with so much to offer.



I currently love this thing so much. It sits on a pretty solid speed tier that grants him a solid advantage over lots of offensive Pokemon such as Kyurem, Conkeldurr, and Hydreigon. Not limited to that, it's typing alone lets it take advantage of Clefable and coverage options such as Focus Blast and Thunderbolt allow it to break defensive staples such as Corviknight, Ferrothorn, and Toxapex. However it struggles quite a lot from Zeraora and Dragapult being all around, it still gives satisfactory results when paired up with pivots like Clefable.

 

[Jordy]

Before this thread starts flooding with theorymon, please wait until everything is actually released. I'll delete any posts that talk about the announcement from today until it is released, as it will otherwise derail the thread.

 

[TPP]

May usage stats are here

Visual

Usage

Combined usage for OU (1695 stats)
+ ---- + ------------------ + ------- +
| Rank | Pokemon            | Percent |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ------- +
| 1    | Clefable           | 42.154% |
| 2    | Zeraora            | 30.449% |
| 3    | Dragapult          | 27.361% |
| 4    | Corviknight        | 26.011% |
| 5    | Excadrill          | 23.600% |
| 6    | Ferrothorn         | 22.474% |
| 7    | Aegislash          | 21.739% |
| 8    | Seismitoad         | 19.743% |
| 9    | Bisharp            | 19.513% |
| 10   | Dracovish          | 19.192% |
| 11   | Toxapex            | 18.354% |
| 12   | Hydreigon          | 16.513% |
| 13   | Rotom-Heat         | 15.719% |
| 14   | Hippowdon          | 15.369% |
| 15   | Kommo-o            | 15.342% |
| 16   | Togekiss           | 13.140% |
| 17   | Conkeldurr         | 13.039% |
| 18   | Cloyster           | 12.087% |
| 19   | Mew                | 11.845% |
| 20   | Mandibuzz          | 11.148% |
| 21   | Cinderace          | 10.305% |
| 22   | Kyurem             |  9.687% |
| 23   | Gengar             |  9.040% |
| 24   | Terrakion          |  7.346% |
| 25   | Tyranitar          |  7.117% |
| 26   | Mimikyu            |  6.482% |
| 27   | Primarina          |  6.470% |
| 28   | Grimmsnarl         |  6.264% |
| 29   | Jirachi            |  6.201% |
| 30   | Hawlucha           |  6.062% |
| 31   | Hatterene          |  5.858% |
| 32   | Shuckle            |  5.369% |
| 33   | Ninetales-Alola    |  5.205% |
| 34   | Pelipper           |  4.455% |
| 35   | Keldeo             |  4.221% |
| 36   | Crawdaunt          |  4.026% |
| 37   | Salazzle           |  3.958% |
| 38   | Diggersby          |  3.750% |
| 39   | Necrozma           |  3.486% |
| 40   | Gyarados           |  3.328% |
| 41   | Venusaur           |  2.741% |
| 42   | Reuniclus          |  2.679% |
| 43   | Mamoswine          |  2.621% |
| 44   | Torkoal            |  2.542% |
| 45   | Chandelure         |  2.426% |
| 46   | Snorlax            |  2.416% |
| 47   | Toxtricity         |  2.363% |
| 48   | Accelgor           |  2.352% |
| 49   | Obstagoon          |  2.154% |
| 50   | Ditto              |  2.109% |
| 51   | Incineroar         |  2.083% |
| 52   | Celebi             |  2.025% |
| 53   | Weezing-Galar      |  1.887% |
| 54   | Darmanitan         |  1.847% |
| 55   | Vaporeon           |  1.735% |
| 56   | Rotom-Wash         |  1.723% |
| 57   | Ribombee           |  1.685% |
| 58   | Polteageist        |  1.680% |
| 59   | Gastrodon          |  1.548% |
| 60   | Rhyperior          |  1.393% |
| 61   | Charizard          |  1.352% |
| 62   | Umbreon            |  1.297% |
| 63   | Slurpuff           |  1.287% |
| 64   | Quagsire           |  1.278% |
| 65   | Weavile            |  1.276% |
| 66   | Vikavolt           |  1.137% |
| 67   | Sirfetch'd         |  1.104% |
| 68   | Mantine            |  1.075% |
| 69   | Dracozolt          |  1.061% |
| 70   | Haxorus            |  0.970% |
| 71   | Sylveon            |  0.943% |
| 72   | Whimsicott         |  0.931% |
| 73   | Barraskewda        |  0.888% |
| 74   | Meowstic           |  0.882% |
| 75   | Cobalion           |  0.865% |
| 76   | Lucario            |  0.850% |
| 77   | Rotom-Mow          |  0.822% |
| 78   | Xatu               |  0.821% |
| 79   | Bewear             |  0.777% |
| 80   | Barbaracle         |  0.748% |
| 81   | Gardevoir          |  0.715% |
| 82   | Arcanine           |  0.659% |
| 83   | Heliolisk          |  0.654% |
| 84   | Blastoise          |  0.631% |
| 85   | Jellicent          |  0.608% |
| 86   | Corsola-Galar      |  0.587% |
| 87   | Araquanid          |  0.584% |
| 88   | Galvantula         |  0.566% |
| 89   | Gigalith           |  0.545% |
| 90   | Toxicroak          |  0.532% |
| 91   | Sigilyph           |  0.510% |
| 92   | Durant             |  0.504% |
| 93   | Golisopod          |  0.486% |
| 94   | Runerigus          |  0.477% |
| 95   | Vileplume          |  0.475% |
| 96   | Ninetales          |  0.439% |
| 97   | Froslass           |  0.408% |
| 98   | Silvally-Ghost     |  0.408% |
| 99   | Flygon             |  0.398% |
| 100  | Decidueye          |  0.391% |
| 101  | Sableye            |  0.379% |
| 102  | Espeon             |  0.378% |
| 103  | Milotic            |  0.365% |
| 104  | Hitmonlee          |  0.365% |
| 105  | Frosmoth           |  0.355% |
| 106  | Coalossal          |  0.344% |
| 107  | Centiskorch        |  0.339% |
| 108  | Sandaconda         |  0.305% |
| 109  | Roserade           |  0.296% |
| 110  | Pincurchin         |  0.290% |
| 111  | Pangoro            |  0.288% |
| 112  | Tsareena           |  0.285% |
| 113  | Bronzong           |  0.277% |
| 114  | Abomasnow          |  0.270% |
| 115  | Copperajah         |  0.264% |
| 116  | Type: Null         |  0.253% |
| 117  | Indeedee           |  0.252% |
| 118  | Duraludon          |  0.248% |
| 119  | Goodra             |  0.248% |
| 120  | Clefairy           |  0.223% |
| 121  | Malamar            |  0.215% |
| 122  | Flapple            |  0.209% |
| 123  | Ludicolo           |  0.208% |
| 124  | Inteleon           |  0.200% |
| 125  | Steelix            |  0.200% |
| 126  | Rillaboom          |  0.181% |
| 127  | Braviary           |  0.170% |
| 128  | Eldegoss           |  0.167% |
| 129  | Drednaw            |  0.160% |
| 130  | Shiftry            |  0.156% |
| 131  | Lanturn            |  0.151% |
| 132  | Morpeko            |  0.142% |
| 133  | Drapion            |  0.136% |
| 134  | Lapras             |  0.133% |
| 135  | Pyukumuku          |  0.132% |
| 136  | Gallade            |  0.132% |
| 137  | Noivern            |  0.130% |
| 138  | Claydol            |  0.124% |
| 139  | Appletun           |  0.118% |
| 140  | Raichu-Alola       |  0.118% |
| 141  | Mudsdale           |  0.117% |
| 142  | Pikachu            |  0.107% |
| 143  | Machamp            |  0.107% |
| 144  | Togedemaru         |  0.106% |
| 145  | Vanilluxe          |  0.105% |
| 146  | Orbeetle           |  0.103% |
| 147  | Shedinja           |  0.101% |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ------- +

Here are the usual questions, with a few extra ones at the end to discuss the new metagame after Dracovish's ban:

1. How do you guys feel about the usage stats?
2. Are there any rises/drops that you expected or think are noteworthy?
3. Which mons do you think will continue rising and which mons will continue dropping?
4. Are there any non-OU mons that may rise up to OU next month? If so, what are they?
5. Are there any underrated/low usage mons that you can see getting more usage next month?
6. What was the biggest surprise to you this month?

New Metagame:

Before I go into the questions, there's some good news. Hidden Abilities for the starters are now available, which means Grassy Terrain Rillaboom, Libero Cinderace, and Sniper Inteleon are now legal. Do keep in mind it may take a few hours before they are available on PS.

List of decent moves Rillaboom has:

Moves

Wood Hammer
Superpower
Earthquake
Hammer Arm
High Horsepower
Darkest Lariat
Drum Beating
Drain Punch
Stomping Tantrum
U-turn
Knock Off

Non-damaging moves:

Bulk Up
Leech Seed
Swords Dance
Taunt

List of moves Cinderace could make use of:

Moves

Pyro Ball
High Jump Kick
Double Edge
Gunk Shot
Bounce
Iron Head
Zen Headbutt
Sucker Punch
U-turn

Non-damaging moves:

Court Change
Taunt
Bulk Up

List of decent moves Inteleon has:

Moves

Hydro Pump
Ice Beam
Dark Pulse
Scald
Snipe Shot
Air Slash
U-turn
Weather Ball

Non-damaging moves:

Focus Energy
Haze

1. How do you think people will structure/adjust their teams after Dracovish's ban?
2. Will they continue to run Seismitoad/Ferro/Pex/Kommo on every team, or will something new take over that slot?
3. If it's something new, will it be another defensive oriented mon, or could we see a more offensive utility mon there?
4. How do you feel about the new hidden abilities for the starters? Will Rillaboom and Inteleon have any potential in OU at all? How will Cinderace perform? Try to avoid saying Cinderace is broken or deserves Ubers since we'll have to see how it plays out first.
5. What items/sets do you think the starters will run? Will Cinderace continue to use boots, or will it move on to another item like Choice Band or Choice Scarf?

DLC will be released on the night of Wednesday, June 17th, so we have the next 2 weeks to enjoy this short metagame before DLC changes everything. Let's have some fun and enjoy it while we can. Also, I'll use this post to say that this is not the thread to discuss/speculate DLC content, as it is not available at this point in time.

 

[Ema Skye]

Rillaboom is going to be fantastic. Statwise, it's basically Bulu from last gen (marginally weaker due to having 5 less Atk, but 10 more speed is good). Terrain boosts are weaker this Gen so it won't hit as hard.

A few set ideas:

• Band is obviously a great idea. Wood Hammer is nuclear with Band, STAB and the terrain boosts and just mows through anything that doesn't resist it. It even 2HKOs Rotom-Heat so that's not even a safe switch.
• Scarf also seems viable here. Unlike Bulu, Scarf Rilla outspeeds both Dragapult and Zeraora and has coverage to scare them out (Knock Off and High Horsepower, respectively). Wood Hammer is still potent, with a possible 2HKO on Pex with Rocks.
• Substitute sets also seem viable. SubSeed, SubSD and SubBU all seem reliable, and Grassy Terrain allows it to sub more.

 

[theotherguytm]

Rillaboom is going to be fantastic. Statwise, it's basically Bulu from last gen (marginally weaker due to having 5 less Atk, but 10 more speed is good). Terrain boosts are weaker this Gen so it won't hit as hard.

A few set ideas:

• Band is obviously a great idea. Wood Hammer is nuclear with Band, STAB and the terrain boosts and just mows through anything that doesn't resist it. It even 2HKOs Rotom-Heat so that's not even a safe switch.
• Scarf also seems viable here. Unlike Bulu, Scarf Rilla outspeeds both Dragapult and Zeraora and has coverage to scare them out (Knock Off and High Horsepower, respectively). Wood Hammer is still potent, with a possible 2HKO on Pex with Rocks.
• Substitute sets also seem viable. SubSeed, SubSD and SubBU all seem reliable, and Grassy Terrain allows it to sub more.

I personally think not having a secondary STAB type, healing from Horn Leech, or a partner like Kartana to complement it will make Rilla much less impactful in the long run, even if it is threatening in the short term. SubSeed sounds very annoying though.
As for Cinderace:
252 Atk Libero Cinderace Zen Headbutt vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Toxapex: 132-156 (43.4 - 51.3%) -- 45.3% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Black Sludge recovery
252 Atk Libero Cinderace Zen Headbutt vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Toxapex: 168-200 (55.2 - 65.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Choice Band Libero Cinderace Zen Headbutt vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Toxapex: 194-230 (63.8 - 75.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Black Sludge recovery
252 Atk Choice Band Libero Cinderace Zen Headbutt vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Toxapex: 252-296 (82.8 - 97.3%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
You will no longer be laughed at for running Banded Cinderace.

 

[Martin]

Libero Cinderace is gonna be obnoxious as fuck but at least I can say that its Hippowdon problems aren't solved. Most of what Libero seems to do is fix a few coverage moves that were kinda shit before. It also means its Sucker Punch is just a little less pathetic now.

252 Atk Libero Cinderace Sucker Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Dragapult: 270-318 (85.1 - 100.3%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Libero Cinderace Sucker Punch vs. 0 HP / 0- Def Zeraora: 150-177 (47.3 - 55.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

Setting aside Zen Headbutt above, it also makes Gunk Shot chunk Clef harder:
252 Atk Cinderace Gunk Shot vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Clefable: 312-368 (79.1 - 93.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Libero Cinderace Gunk Shot vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Clefable: 468-552 (118.7 - 140.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Cinderace Gunk Shot vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Clefable: 214-252 (54.3 - 63.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Libero Cinderace Gunk Shot vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Clefable: 320-378 (81.2 - 95.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

This is especially notable vs physdef clef, bc before the only (good) cinder set couldn't do anything more than this without the boost from Blaze:
252 Atk Cinderace Pyro Ball vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Clefable: 160-189 (40.6 - 47.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO