Resource SS UU Crown Tundra Viability Ranking Thread

[princessgod]

Can we have Shedninja to at least c? I know it's untiered, and all but dealing with Zygarde is a huge pain since Thousand arrows kills Skarmory, and Latias with no ice beam or dragon pulse makes it really hard to deal with. This is the most solid metagame I ever played where in team building you can build the most solid team in history, and the tier is lacking a lot of set up sweepers compared to other metagames where shedninja with wonder guard plays a huge role, as with will o wisp a lot of threats like Salamence don't want to switch in. He at least should deserve a mention. I find that heavy boots benefit him a lot better than what low ladder players do with their Scyther's.

 

[HydreigonTheChild]

Can we have Shedninja to at least c? I know it's untiered, and all but dealing with Zygarde is a huge pain since Thousand arrows kills Skarmory, and Latias with no ice beam or dragon pulse makes it really hard to deal with. This is the most solid metagame I ever played where in team building you can build the most solid team in history, and the tier is lacking a lot of set up sweepers compared to other metagames where shedninja with wonder guard plays a huge role, as with will o wisp a lot of threats like Salamence don't want to switch in. He at least should deserve a mention. I find that heavy boots benefit him a lot better than what low ladder players do with their Scyther's.

Can you provide reasoning for other stuff than a single mon that can still KO it due to toxic, zygarde is managable via other forms such as tang, phys def mandi, and in general priority. It also has a very tough time coming in and has to force a ko in order to win an exchange as it is so frail and so vulnurable to status that this is a tough. Different pokemon can take advantage of it being locked into one move such as sylveon, togekiss, and primarina taking advantage of it if it uses outrage, tang, zarude, tapu bulu, kommo-o, and chansey and take advantage of it if its locked into t arrows. Replays would be nice to

 

[princessgod]

Can you provide reasoning for other stuff than a single mon that can still KO it due to toxic, zygarde is managable via other forms such as tang, phys def mandi, and in general priority. It also has a very tough time coming in and has to force a ko in order to win an exchange as it is so frail and so vulnurable to status that this is a tough. Different pokemon can take advantage of it being locked into one move such as sylveon, togekiss, and primarina taking advantage of it if it uses outrage, tang, zarude, tapu bulu, kommo-o, and chansey and take advantage of it if its locked into t arrows. Replays would be nice to

Yeah I know, Shedninja can easily be killed (c), but in this metagame I find it to fit in on some teams based on how the metagame lacks a lot of set of sweepers, Shedninja serves a niche being able to switch into a lot of threats in the metagame shown in the thread. Zygarde is not always managable via other forms. You can't easily slap Tang, mandi, and in general priority on a lot of teams hence why c (requires way too much support to be worth it).

A lot of c ranked pokemon like Raikou imo can check a lot of the metagame top threats but is not as good as pokemon like Thunderus-therian with volt absorb, Helioisk has dry absorb (being able to switch in to a lot of mons spamming scald or hydro pump but is easily replaced ( Zygarde is not always managable via other forms. You can't easily slap Tang, mandi, and in general priority on a lot of teams), I even find Haxorus threatening at times but isn't as good as Salamence or Noivern. A lot of these mons in today metagame can easily be replaced by other options but what most teams that have this issue is a lack of a good set up sweeper that can hold most teams, but can't check some of the metagame most important threats, in this case based on my experience Zygarde.

 

[Estarossa]

B+ to B: Another mon that got absolutely cucked by these shifts. Pelipper is gone now so Seismitoad can no longer run rain sweeping sets yes I know we still have Politoed but that mon is straight cheeks lol and in terms of defensive Rockers, we got Swampert, which completely outclasses Seismitoad in that role. Seismitoad just got the short end of the stick with these drops, and I think it should drop to reflect that.

Don't want to start nitpicking a whole post, (there's a few other things I disagree with here such as the concept that Exca is speed control and that Mandibuz is unsplashable or struggles when Fog is kinda bad on it in first place so like those 2 attacks u-turn roost sets are really solid glues, but this point I really disagree with a lot and I feel kinda misconstrues the situation with Toad vs Pert in the current metagame.

So honestly its Seismitoad that outclasses Pert most of the time atm really? Flip Turn is nice and all but Water Absorb is huge vs Rotom-W which can be rather annoying to switch-into rn especially if its twave for the dragons, and can even punish Slowking for trying to click Scald a bit, but it compressing Knock is also solid value that Pert can't do. Pert has value as a pivot with Flip Turn but losing Knock Off and Water Absorb makes it unable to do stuff like pressure Slowking as well without fear of Scald Burns and the mon gets worn down very easily into range of stuff like Rotom-W even if max SpD, (which coincidentally is making you a lot worse versus stuff like Mole).


----------

As a general view on the VR rn, ive discussed it a bit but I see at the top in S rank rn, its value is so key to so many teams and its by far our most splashable glue mon, keeps a lot of stuff in check and its momentum value is amazing, and can help mitigate the danger of hugely scary stuff like Conk and Heracross a lot with good positioning and a Colbur Berry to stop Slowking getting them in at all. In general its that multi-dimensional glue mon that has lots of different purposes and usefulness, be it Fsight + fighting-type breaker (esp scary with Hera tbh), twave support to just shut down shit like Hydreigon completely, or Psychic + colbur to put more generic pressure on switch-ins like amoong and your threats like conk/hera. CM sets are also underrated af on fat builds like semi/full stall and give you a really potent win con, and way of handling some very hard to deal with stuff like cm glowbro (if you aren't quaggers).

should definitely be #2, but whether it sits in S with Slowking or like S-/top of A+ is debateable, and I feel like its not really at the same level as slowking and would maybe s-? Latias definitely has an enormous effect on teambuilding etc but it definitely feels like something that typically underperforms in practice a lot of the time, and there are honestly a lot of ways of handling it, eg. slowking + offensive check, umbreon, diancie, spdeff aegi/steela, chansey, hatt etc, with most off the non umbreon options actually fitting on a wide variety of playstyles too, and can be a bit prediction reliant to make progress at times. It's overall effect and potency-late game is defnitely noticeable with the ability to get through a lot of the non umb/diancie/chansey checks over time easily with the right buttons clicked eg. 2HKO'ing slowking with LO tbolt if boots are down or if they are more mixed defensiv and its a hugely versatile Pokemon with so many sets to keep wary, and offers huge amounts of value to a lot of teams as generic speed control and offensive check to a range of threats and potent breaker that it definitely still feels like the #2 mon in the tier for me. CM Boltbeam sets are honestly rather underrated in my eyes especially and can be really terrifying on fatter teams that can give it tbolt support, fact that slowking is typicallynot running twave now is especially useful for it too and it can be really terrifying into more BO'y teams with it abusing slowking / 2hkoing mole at +1 etc.

is kind of a hard one to place for me, spin value + its ability to offensively check potent shit like hatterene, jirachi, rotoms etc is huge but I do find it a bit offensively disappointing, as a spinner it definitely can't do a thing to stop skarm spikes, typically resulting in needing something like hatterene if you want to keep spikes off or just building in speciic ways to mitigate this, (even roserade spikes is typically going leaf storm now for slowking + mole so you struggle to switch in and can't even have the hatt keep them off either), and I don't rly find SD sets to typically be able to actually make progress easily in a tier full of solid checks to it everywhere, (skarm/steela/tang/umb/mandi/molt etc to name a few). Toxic sets definitely have potency to discourage/punish some typical checks like SLowking/Mandi and offer solid all round supportive value that shouldn't be underrated. Its support value is definitely high though and the lead sets are very cool on HO when compressing spin + rocks support. Would probably put it around A atm, but more for the supportive value and its overall effect on teambuilding than what it can actually offensively accomplish.

Don't want to write too much now and will probably write a more detailed post once we have more info about action taken on the top stuff eg. lati. Some general stuff i think should rise/drop below though (by no means a complete list):

Rises -

Drops - + most of C

 

[HydreigonTheChild]

Yeah I know, Shedninja can easily be killed (c), but in this metagame I find it to fit in on some teams based on how the metagame lacks a lot of set of sweepers, Shedninja serves a niche being able to switch into a lot of threats in the metagame shown in the thread. Zygarde is not always managable via other forms. You can't easily slap Tang, mandi, and in general priority on a lot of teams hence why c (requires way too much support to be worth it).

A lot of c ranked pokemon like Raikou imo can check a lot of the metagame top threats but is not as good as pokemon like Thunderus-therian with volt absorb, Helioisk has dry absorb (being able to switch in to a lot of mons spamming scald or hydro pump but is easily replaced ( Zygarde is not always managable via other forms. You can't easily slap Tang, mandi, and in general priority on a lot of teams), I even find Haxorus threatening at times but isn't as good as Salamence or Noivern. A lot of these mons in today metagame can easily be replaced by other options but what most teams that have this issue is a lack of a good set up sweeper that can hold most teams, but can't check some of the metagame most important threats, in this case based on my experience Zygarde.

Why would you use shedinja on any team, when tang is way better overall at checking the metagame, and shedinja needs boots and just one misprediction can lead to its death like switching into toxic or on a burn. It just seems like not something I am very desperate for to run shedinja of all things, this is not OU where lele, koko, and kyurem are big threats and have nothing to hit shed. This tier is filled with plenty of pokemon that can take advantage of it

 

[Adaam]

Hey guys, please keep on topic with the thread and avoid back and forths. If you want to have a conversation about a specific Pokemon, you are welcome to in the Underused Discord. And for the future, if you want to nominate an unranked Pokemon, it's recommended to support the nomination with replays of it in action.

Further Shedinja talks will be deleted

 

[mushamu]

Should’ve added this to my original post about golis but I also think weezing g should be ranked at least C+. Its main niche is being the only mon in the entire tier that can switch into and shut down conkeldurr. Facade under neutralizing gas does 40%ish and that alone should get it ranked again considering how big of a threat conk is as seen by bushtush vs gxe in scl. Aside from conkeldurr, neutralizing gas shutting down the many regenerator mons in the slowtwins, meinshao, and the fat grasses is super valuable as well, especially considering the dominance of Slowking. Slowbro g in particular is so much less threatening when you erase its ability to outlast through switching. I don’t have many replays with it but I have a good one that shows how much erasing regenerator matters.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen8uu-582533 - tangrowth is rendered useless here as I can just go to gweezing every time it tries to switch and it eventually gets overwhelmed. Galarian Slowbro can’t recover anymore through regenerator after taking seismitoads eq on turn 22 and is put in a position where all of my Pokémon besides gweezing itself can ohko it in the HP range it is in. The game becomes an uphill battle for my opponent as he doesn’t have a reliable wincon anymore with Slowbro g at such a low hp %.

 

[afuyeas]

New to A+: The other one of the incredibly strong Dragons we got, Hydriegon is a complete monster, running over every mon not named Chansey or Primarina like a freight train. Nasty Plot sets in particular are incredibly dangerous, being able to inflict substantial damage on the aforementioned mons if it gets enough boosts. The only things keeping it from the S rank IMO are its poor speed and relative fraility, especially when compared to Latias. Still, it's definitely one of the biggest threats in the tier right now and deserves an A+ rank.

This is mostly an affair of phrasing and semantics but last time i checked 92 / 90 was better physical bulk than 80 / 90 and in general calling a pokemon naturally bulkier than Keldeo "frail" strikes me as a little disingenuous. There are arguments for keeping Hydreigon out of S (awkward speed, fairy and fighting weaknesses being some of them) but frailty is not one of them.

A to A+: Mienshao really loves the changes in the meta that occurred as a result of these tier shifts. Having a Speed tier that lets it outrun the three best drops in Lati, Drei, and Exca except if Exca is in sand but who runs Sand teams anyways rolfamo is just incredible. It can also cripple mons that are supposed to counter it, like Slowking, with Knock Off, allowing it to make incredible progress. Definitely one of the best mons in the tier right now.

And so I can't be accused of just being nitpicky I'm going to elaborate on why I disagree with this. First of all when you look at the current A+ mons you will notice they all have discernable defensive utility even for the offensive ones. Aegislash has steel typing, fighting immunity and enormous bulk when in the shield form and potential priority on some sets, Keldeo is naturally bulky and has a water typing, Kommo-o is naturally really bulky and has the choice of being immune to either powder moves or moves like Shadow Ball and Sludge Bomb letting it blank many Tangrowth sets as well as check threats like Chandelure and Primarina has a fantastic typing with an invaluable dragon immunity. Mienshao does not possess any defensive utility because of its low bulk which restricts the number of teams you can build with it since you will always have to compensate for the defensively dead slot on your team, usually with bulky pivots like Slowking or a Rotom form and the defensive deficiency teams with Mienshao face is especially problematic in the current metagame where teams struggle to account for the variety of threats in the tier. Additionally running any offensive set that isn't scarf (which has its own issues) is a luxury since you now have to account for the Latias, Keldeo, Lycanrock, Zydog and Azelf you are now outrun by which results in teams with unreliable speed control at best. This is another trait Mienshao currently doesn't share with the pokemon in A+: it doesn't have versatility in sets, scarf is perfectly decent but it's not worth an A+ rank on its own and life orb leaves you with noticeable holes in your team right out of the gate. I think it's definitely a notable threat in the current metagame with its combination of traits being valuable but A+ is pushing it.

 

[5camp]

UR -> B-

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8uu-1434822199-4uahp0xqhj8dh0oy58g097vg3u2rbt5pw - It's just passable bulk means that it can tank one hit and then go in for another kill, as shown when it took out Azelf. Aside from that Drill was also gonna be chipped badly even if it was still alive because Pory's speed tier gets the jump on it.

Quick mom get the camera, it's me getting destroyed by Porygon Z!

(In my defence, some bad luck with sleep powder accuracy and good luck on my opponent's end with sleep talk rolling scald meant my SpDf Excadrill got obliterated very early on, but that PZ would have torn my team a new one even with a somewhat healthy Exca so I still support this nomination).

Oh hey fuckit since I'm here and have been playing this tier a lot recently, want to give some takes on the new mons and tiers.

New to S - Best mon in the tier, probably ban-worthy. That speed + defensive utility matters a lot, allowing it to come in repeatedly even without pivot support.

New to A+: That lower speed matters a lot when compared to Latias, meaning its easier to revenge, especially versus fighting types and anything that packs a random fairy move. Otherwise it's excellent, quite similar to Latias, and a mon you are forced to play aggressively around due to nasty plot punishing passive play hard.

New to A+: Genuinely excellent blanket check to so many mons. Can't afford to futureport since it simply isn't afforded that amount of time with mons like Hydreigon and Aegislash hovering around, but each move still works individually. Has a bit 4MSS and you struggle sometimes to choose whether to run more physdef to check mons its typing should theoretically allow it to check without getting hurt too much by u-turn, like the fighting types, and whether to invest more in SpDf to actually do its job in checking mons like Latias. That said, that works in your favour too, since you know its spread and moves so can build your team accordingly, making it very customisable.

New to A: Struggles fair bit offensively due to it relying on a pretty shitty sand setter in Gigalith for the sand rush set, and the fact every team packs easily splashable counters like Skarm or Tangrowth. It's support set though? Phwoar! Rapid spin boosting speed really puts the fear in many offensive mons that might have wanted to scare it out, and the sheer number of levitate mons in the meta means no Rotoms are gonna be defogging on your watch, and the two new dragons are pretty scared of you after a speed boost. No higher than A though due to its purely offensive sets lacking imo.

New to A: Spikes good, walling physical attackers good. Main problem is most physical attackers carry u-turn, can run various mixed sets, or run taunt, so it's not as good as I thought it might be. Helmet doesn't mean shit versus Mienshao and Conk can just barrel through you anyway.

New to A-: Having a utility mon with overcoat and reliable recovery is really nice, and it can check a lot of things...but it doesn't check any of them perfectly, which makes it a weird mon to fit on a team. It works best as a defensive pivot on an offensive team where it is only intended as a temporary measure and bonus hazard support. Not a glamourous role, but it's an ugly mon so that fits.

New to B-: This mon is worse in UU than it is on OU. At least there it is the best answer to one of the best mons in the tier in Heatran. At least there it can slap Ice Beam and do bonkers damage to quad ice weak mons, rather than bounce off UUs litany of dragons. At least in OU it does more damage than the resident regenerator wall can deal with versus Toxapex rather than being laughed at by Slowking, Amoongus and Tangrowth. It's a pivot that scares nothing.

Other noms I agree with:

B- to A-: Its mach punch got a lot scarier recently.

A to A-: Boy does this poor thing hate Excadrill.

A to A-: Probably lower, it's hard to beat Skarm as a spiker.

UR to B-: Yup that was me in that replay having a new arsehole ripped open by this bloody thing.


Other things that should drop:

- grrr Slowking grrrr Latias

- Two new powerful special attacking dragons running around, fighting types getting popular, more mons running fairy coverage

- Excadrill dropping means more people are running reliable counters to this thing, especially Skarm

- Can't wait to bring back my Politoad rain team!!!

And rises:

- Yeah fuck your fast dragons. This thing is incredible right now with no Buzzswole around.

- See that game where I got destroyed by PZ? It showcased what a chad mon Thundurus can be, running the same kind of stuff its banned cousin did with taunt, knock, superpower and volt switch. Great at walloping Excadrill on the switch since it still has 105 attack.

- A physical attacker not walled by Skarm? A dragon faster than the two new dragons?

 

[romanji]

Lets get some more noms in rn

to a+/s
Excadrill's utility and breaking potential make it excellent in UU. Rapid Spin makes Excadrill into probably the best hazard control we’ve ever had. Swords Dance turns Excadrill into a killing machine. Boosted Iron Head being able to break through even physically defensive Tangrowth with a flinch allows it to be an even more devastating threat. It also does have a few flaws; Its speed can often be annoying against offensive teams, since 88 isn’t that good, Skarmory and Celesteela existing when it can’t break them for the life of it hurts as well. But with the proper team support it can still be a top tier threat.

to a/a+
Hydreigon's set versatility allow it to be a dangerous threat, as there are certain checks to Nasty Plot sets are susceptible to LO + Roost, Choice Specs, or even Choice Scarf. But it also has SEVERE 4MSS as it kinda wants everything on the same team. No coverage for Primarina sucks (Roseli Berry + Belch is a waste of a Pokemon don’t use) I hope it can truly show off its potential after some meta shifts.

to s
Latias is able to just find a way against many teams. Its Lycanroc-D tying speed and solid power. LO + Roost has great power and longevity due to its defensive typing. Other utility moves such as Healing Wish and Trick on Choiced sets allow it to be annoying. Calm Mind + BoltBeam is also able to break through normal checks such as Primarina and Mandibuzz also allows it to break through teams even better. Though there has been a resurgence of many other checks to it such as Sylveon, Diancie, Umbreon, and Choice Scarf users such as Krookodile and Zarude, it is still absolutely at the top of the meta once again.

to a-
Mandibuzz has found its niche in UU as an effective stop gap to many threats such as Excadrill, Latias, Zarude, and Krookodile, but it also falls short some times. Overcoat is really nice for avoiding Spore and Sleep Powder from Amoonguss and Tangrowth lets them waste a turn and then freely U-turn on the switch. Though it also has pretty bad 4MSS, since it can’t run Knock Off and Foul Play on the same set. It also wants Brave Bird to deal big damage to Conkeldurr.

to a-
The real best Spikes setter has returned. It being able to set up hazards freely against Excadrill is great and Defoggers aren't that good right now. There really isn’t much to talk about with Skarmory, because we already know what it does, but this will just be a solid part of the meta.

to a+
After a brief hiatus in OU, Slowking come back doing what it has been doing since Isle of Armor. It checks many special attackers such as Latias, Keldeo, and Primarina. Future Sight + Teleport is fantastic for offensive teammates such as it gets free pivots into strong breakers like it has been. Colbur Berry sets are also good at punishing Knock Off attempts from Mienshao and Conkeldurr by firing back with Psychic, while still being a good pivot and special wall. Fantastic Pokemon right now.

to b
Swampert is just... here? It often feels like a momentum drain while still having a momentum pivoting move. Vulnerability to Toxic and Rocky Helmet and no reliable recovery make its longevity very poor. Seismitoad also outclasses it most of the time since while still having Knock Off. I GUESS you can run Ice Beam to potentially do damage to Grass- and Dragon-types, but it can’t do much to them anyway and is better off running Toxic.

Now it’s time for some other noms:

to much higher
Big Conk has been a HUGE benefactor of Buzzwole's rise to OU. In a tier with a shit ton of Dark-types, Fighting-types would also be excellent. Its main draw over Mienshao is its much greater power and Mach Punch, which is huge for targeting down faster threats such as Hydreigon, Excadrill, and Lycanroc-D. Facade and Knock Off has perfect coverage, with it being able to nuke Fighting resists such as Slowking and Moltres. pokemonisfun made a great post in the NP thread about how good it is right now, but I don't see this being banworthy just yet due to its extremely low speed.

to a+
Mienshao’s offensive sets have also appreciated Buzzwole’s departure, but we have even seen the revival of the old Assault Vest set from SM come back to be a fantastic offensive/defensive check to Pokemon such as Hydreigon. Its other coverage helps it out a lot; Poison Jab breaks through Tangrowth, Primarina, and Azumarill (just ask IP), while Stone Edge nails Salamance trying to Intimidate and Moltres trying to fish for a burn. Its insane Speed tier allows it to be a fantastic cleaner against offensive teams. Regenerator makes this somehow impossible to chip down, allowing it to have fantastic longevity even with how frail it is.

to s-
Primarina's defensive utility has been put on full display as of late, as both RestTalk have been fantastic checks to the new Dragons Hydreigon and Latias. SubCM sets are also fantastic at breaking through teams that only rely on Amoonguss, Assault Vest Tangrowth, and Slowking for their checks to Primarina. I think this is probably the 2nd best Pokemon after Latias.

to a
Thundurus is a great pivot at the moment. Nihilego and Keldeo falling off dramatically helps its Speed tier not be as crowded as it was previously. Knock Off is Knock Off, as removing Boots and Eviolite from Chansey (which is huge). Volt Switch is great since it is already able to deal big damage to the Ground-types with Focus Blast such as Krookodile and Excadrill. The 4th moveslot is also up for variations such as Defog for emergency hazard removal, Grass Knot to nuke Rhyperior harder, and Psychic for Kommo-o (but you can just pivot on it)

Other stuff i agree with

rise

drop

 

[death dreigon]

Hydreigon's set versatility allow it to be a dangerous threat, as there are certain checks to Nasty Plot sets are susceptible to LO + Roost, Choice Specs, or even Choice Scarf. But it also has SEVERE 4MSS as it kinda wants everything on the same team. No coverage for Primarina sucks (Roseli Berry + Belch is a waste of a Pokemon don’t use) I hope it can truly show off its potential after some meta shifts.

I disagree that hydreigon has a severe 4MSS or even minor 4MSS. it only really needs draco,dark pulse and flamethrower/fireblast for it's as it's coverage as it's stab combo covers most of the tier while fire coverage wrecks bulky steels and grasses. It doesn't need flash as togekiss is the only fairy flash is actually relevant against which is pretty rare while hatterene hardly fares good against dark pulse anyway(Sylveon doesn't cares about even plus 2 flash due to its superb bulk.And fire coverage is only really required on specs and scarf while the fourth could be your move of choice. Meanwhile np doesn't even needs fire coverage as much because plus 2 dark pulse and draco are enough to take care of most bulky steels and grasses as they simply don't do much to hydra in return once it has setup safely so the fourth moveslot is open to roost. That's why I disagree a rank lower than A+ on hydra and I personally see it fit for A+ only. I honestly don't see why would you even want covarge for prima,sylv and Chansey when it covers everything else (and the former doesn't even gets a reliable recovery).

 

[haunted paper]

Swampert for B+

There's a lot of hate for Swampert and people seem to think Seismitoad is better. I guess people forgot about this set:

Swampert @ Rindo Berry
Ability: Damp
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Mirror Coat
- Scald
- Earthquake
- Toxic / Stealth Rock

Good-bye specs Latias and grass types that are hitting with giga drain. Looks like Seismitoad has some competition. Swampert having counter and mirror coat + a lot of bulk are really good for surprise one shots. Have fun messing with people in tours and ladder. Team Player is back.

Latias for S rank - A lot has been said about this mon and I really have nothing to add. It's the perfect mon and it will always put in work in every game.

Skarmory for A+ or A rank - This mon can be splashed on so many teams and it teams up so well with special walls. Skarm is such a great physical wall and a fantastic pivot against Amoonguss. Great spiker, rocker, and defogger too. The only problem with Skarmory is that it tends to have difficulty dishing out damage, unless it's iron defense + body press.

Noms I agree with:

for higher

for A- ;(

An unranked nom

for C+ please? :D

I've talked about Whimsicott and this time I am ready to nom it. After laddering with it for a while, I've seen that it's STABs are really good in this metagame because, there are so many mons that are 4x weak to them. Choice Specs is it's best set that provides great power and good momentum with U-Turn. The specs set can run psychic for poison types or shadow ball for aegislash. It's a great pivot for draco and powder spam and it's typing can help it live a lot of other strong attacks like Drei's dark pulse, Conk's CC, Zydog's Thousand Arrows, and Keldeo's STABs. The speed tier is invaluable and being able to come in repeatedly on knocks is good for HO teams.
(I found out from a help room mod that I don't need permission from the other player to post replays.)
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8uu-1435905457-4adpeuk5eyhwbcvejviaaarbnkufw94pw
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8uu-1435897801-oxdt42gjoc0ie2vacs8fdtobwrj7f3opw

 

[death dreigon]

> B+:
We need it now more than ever since dragons like hydra and Latias are running rampant who are two of the most scariest pokemon in the tier. It checks all 4 dragons in one slot while also soft checking keldeo and zarude. Yawn is also a nice tool to force out sub cm prima or shutting down overconfident nihilegos and exca who think they just got a delicacy to eat. You could alternatively also run heal bell if you hate status and adds to a nice support move. It can also use dragons in order to wish pass weakened mons. Mixed defense is my recommendation to check physical sets of those dragons and psyshock in latias's case.

 

[HydreigonTheChild]

-> C+

Due to pelliper rising, I see no reason for politoad to not take the same ranking it had before, and drop kingdra there to, as kingdra is reliant on rain to do anything to not be outclassed by latias. Politoad is still a momentum sink, has litterally no utility, and is worn down by everything, so it deserves the C+ tier because I think it deserves its place back.

-> A-

If losing one of your biggest counters to t-arrows does not sound good enough it can bully more pokemon with it such as skarmory, latias, and hydreigon, while having a great speed tier to outspeed the new threats. Especially with skarmory and slowking who can set up spikes and pivot it in via teleport and set up future sight to nail foes like tangrowth, tapu bulu, swampert, and kommo-o. Slowking being able to fit on more offensive teams so that they do not require chansey is nice for zygarde-10% to be able to be built around more easily.

 

[scorbunnys]

So I'd like to bring up some points to this:
Rises:
A+ to S-
I fully agree with what avg wrote, it's just so useful rn, it can check the new dragons (lowkey counters Hydrei, even tho it has some issues vs LO Latias TBolt, as it has to Rest) while also being a useful mon vs the offensive threats such as Keldeo and Mienshao. Not to mention it also has some neat offensive sets, I like SubCM personally because it can abuse many defensive staples such as Umbreon and it also abuses Swampert too, but Specs sets might be underrated, as they appreciate Rain leaving so it has more leeway to run an offensive set, but yeah rise it to S-, it's at least top 3 mon imo.

A to A+
So I've saw some discussion on this and ngl I'm leaning towards rising this, as while it's true that building around this mon is kinda awkward (though ngl I find it very splashable in Double Regen structures), it's still a really threatening mon due to being so good at crippling it's checks with Knock Off + U-turn combo and Regenerator allows it to have a really good longevity. Meta shifts also helped it quite a lot as it received two new threats (Hydreigon and non Sand Rush Exca) and OU just stoled Buzzwole and Rain (I mean...technically you can do stuff with Politoed, Kingdra and Omastar but that's it), one of which was the best Shao counter (and well, Rain was a good offensive answer to it as Barra outsped and KOed it). Anyways, now let's go through its sets, Life Orb is probably the most awkward to build around, but it's still a very strong wallbreaker if you can fit it on a team and Scarf sets lock it into an attack, making it more abusable, but those sets gives teams an Speed Control while also giving momentum to the team. Overall a really strong Speed Control and Wallbreaker worth to rise to A+ (though I can see the counter-arguments and I fully respect them).

A to A+
I understand if you guys disagree with this one as it's just a very hot take, but I feel like it has gotten benefited by the shifts as now it has a new victim (Excadrill) and with Buzzwole leaving we need a way to check Zyg-10%, so that's when Tangrowth comes in hand! It's just a hella good Zyg-10% hard-check (kind of dies to Toxic + chip + Outrage though!) and it also checks many other Physical Attackers such as Excadrill (already mentioned above), Zarude, Krookodile and it's able to pivot in Conkeldurr in order to chip it with Rocky Helmet. Also you guys should run Power Whip more in order to hit Prim harder, but yeah I'd rise it to A+ rn.

A- to A
Do you want a pinkblob in a meta were you need a Chansey and Hydreigon check? Yeah I want it rfn. In all seriousness, this mon just offers so much right now, it's a pivot, it's a Hydreigon and Latias check (in fact counter in the Hydra's case, as Latias can cripple it in Specs sets) and it also checks some stuff such as Azelf NP and Thundurus-Therian because it's Chansey and it's FAT. I also feel like people should explore this mon more, as it has many utility moves such as Heal Bell, Healing Wish, Wish and Confide, moves which are worth exploring especially in fat teams, won't elaborate further because we all know what it does, but it simply loves the meta shifts as it has gotten two victims and it got Skarmory, a really good partner in fat teams due to the pink blob's ability to check most SpA attackers and Skarm checks stuff such as Excadrill, but yeah I just feel like this mon should rise a subrank rn.

B+ to A-
One of the best CM wincons thanks to it's bulk and it's capacity to be a solid Mienshao (Knock Off hurts and Poison Jab wear it downs rly quickly though!) and Latias check (Mystical Fire into Thunderbolt Life Orb hurts though!) while also fully abusing defensive threats such as Umbreon, Skarmory, Sylveon and Slowking in one slot. Magic Bounce is also nice due to it's ability to be a solid secondary hazard control while also being pretty bulky and it has a solid Psychic-Fairy-Fire coverage, so I feel like it's better than most B+ mons and can rise a subrank.

B+ to A-
Busted dog. Buzzwole leaving means less checks for it and now it's main check, Tangrowth, can still lose to Toxic + Hazards + Outrage, which is just super good for this dog. It also has Extreme Speed in order to clean teams vs Scarf Shao, Mamoswine if chipped and Hydrei Scarf, the rest is just Thousand Arrows being busted af and it just has many ways to beat it's counterplay (Skitter Smack over Toxic is an option too), yeah it definitely should rise. Also, just wanna mention that this mon ain't that hard to slap onto teams as it only needs some pivoting support, then you're okay as this mon hits hard and has some utility in form to be a (p shaky) Electric-type check.

B to B+
pokemonisfun This mon is finally good yea! So basically it's just a rly good SD wincon thanks to its sick coverage and with Buzzwole lefting you're not longer forced to run Zen Headbutt (still good for the Sussy Baka mushroom though) and now you can run Horn Leech / SD / Close Combat / Darkest Larkat, able to hit everything bar Amoonguss while also being a good check to Primarina, Zygarde-10%, Krookodile, Zarude and Keldeo while also abusing non Thunder Wave Slowking too. Defensive sets are still good due to its neat defensive attributes and being a check to all the mons mentioned above but with the capability to run Synthesis. Oh yeah and before I forget, I want to say that Grassy Surge is mega valuable now, as it gives recovery to mons such as Diancie, Aegislash and Tentacruel while also reducting the damage taken from EQ, Earth Power and Thousand Arrows (p sure I missed a move), so yeah I love this mon rn due to its defensive and offensive attributes, we should explore it more as there's room for exploration def (Bulk Up and even Choice Scarf looks interesting atm), idk if pif is going to add something but this is my Bulu nom :).

B to B+
Estarossa Umbreon gang! Anyways, this mon is just pretty good atm, as now it checks many stuff such as Excadrill, Latias, Hydreigon, Mamoswine, Gyarados, Jirachi and Azelf while also having access to Wish utility in one slot, yeah it's definitely a good pick for balance- but that's not all! It also has Foul Play, which can combo extremely well with Toxic as they both can cripple many mons and prevent lots of things from switching into it, I can say that I love this mon and I think it should rise definitely thanks to its attributes in fat teams (and it can fit on some BOs too, though I personally prefer Sylveon for them)

B- to A-
This mon rose a lot since the Buzzwole's departure, as now it has one less wall and it doesn't have too much competition for the fighting slot. It has lots of tools such as Mach Punch in order to revenge kill the mole & Hydreigon and it can just eat Skarmory alive while also having Knock Off in order to remove items and wear down it's checks. While I don't believe it's broken as it's still slow asf and has competition from Mienshao, I still feel like it should rise a lot as the meta shifts heavily benefit it. Oh yeah and not to mention that Facade goes super brrrr rn, heat mon for sure!

B- to B
Kinda clunky but it checks Latias, Gmoltres, Salamence, Thundurus-Therian and Entei in one slot while it's also a neat Rocker able to beat some hazard removals such as Mandibuzz and Salamence. Body Press + Moonblast + Diamond Storm also chunks lowkey everything bar Tentacruel as Lily said in a metagame discussion post, so yeah thanks to its decent offensive prescence and access to Rocks it might be worth to B. It's also a rly rly good Bulu partner as it benefits from Grassy Surge due to its lack of recovery (sorry if this one was lazy af, I just think it's kinda self-explanatory).

C+ to B-
I've heard (and talked) about this mon in the discord server and ngl I feel like it's a decent Defogger thanks to it's capacity to Defog in the two best Spikers (Roserade and Skarmory) while also having access to Heal Bell and Haze, which are pretty useful if your team has something like Toxic Umbreon or Mystical Fire Sylveon and you need a solid defogger. It also checks Salamence and it can hit the Mole (Freeze-Dry does like 21-24 but if you Knock Off it's lefties, you can wear down it with Hazards and just chip it until death). Yeah it's pretty decent in fat teams and might deserve a little rise.

C+ to B+
This mon is a reliable check for LO 3a Latias, Hydreigon (run 68 SpD on this mon to tank a +2 Flash Cannon from LO Hydreigon), Mienshao, Kommo-O, Krookodile, Zarude, Salamence and Thundurus-Therian in one slot while also offering Fire-Fairy coverage, which is sick as it can chunk the best steels rn (Mole and Aegi) and it also offers Wish support (Bell support is nice but if u drop mfire u let 100 mons in anyways, though might be nice in fat teams). Also, some people says ''Primarina is better'', and while is true, Sylveon has lots of niches over it, read this post in order to see a little more about it's niche and enjoy :3!

C to C+
I've also heard and talked about it on the discord server and I've saw it on some battles and not gonna lie it looks very promising, as it offers momentum, a speed tier able to outspeed foes such as Mence, Zarude and Krookodile and being a defogger which beats Roserade is always nice (though I prefer Taunt on it). It's sorta weak to Knock Off because it hates losing it's boots, but it's still an ok pivot able to beat a unique amount of mons and with some neat perks in form to Taunt and even Defog by itself, so yeah might warrant a little rise.

C to C+
So I recommend you guys to look at this Aqua Ring's post in order to see some calcs, but yeah, this mon's pretty neat rn, as it has gained a host of new threats and it just lost Buzzwole, which just makes this mon better than it used to be, though this is not all, as it offers a lowkey unwallable STAB combo (Triple Axel is still good here btw) while also having priority, which is super nice to pick up threats such as ZyDog (though dont let it get chipped in order to revenge kill it) and Scarf Shao after chip. I personally would like to try it in Spikes teams, as it can chip stuff with Spikes up and sometimes it's raw power is lacking, so you can compensate with Spikes support, yeah it should rise a little imo.

Drops:
A+ to A-
This little pony is just not as good as before, since Latias got freed, Slowking dropped and Rain rose, Keldeo is just kinda awkward, as it gets walled p easily by them and you can't outspeed threats such as Lycan-Dusk, which is mega awkward for a mon like this. ProTox is neat as it can wear down it's checks and Specs is still okay as it still can hit hard and Toxic + Icy Wind is annoying for it's checks, I don't think that it's as good as before, as its not the nuclear bomb that it used to be and it's speed is just not as good due to being easily outsped by busted dog and Latias, it's still valuable though as it can revenge kill Hydreigon, but yeah it should drop.

A+ to A
This mon has been kind of outclassed by mole, as it Spins and has a better MU vs BoltBeam Latias while also simultaneously hitting Rotoms unlike this mon, making the mole the better ground overall. It also doesn't appreciate the rise of another Ground-Types such as Seismitoad and the Swampert's arrival, making this mon harder to fit onto a team, not to mention that Nihilego has been disappearing quite a bit due to the meta trends being super unkind to it (I'll mention it below). I still think it has a significant niche as a Knock Off user and a Ground-Type able to beat Exca and it has a better MU vs Skarmory, as it at least can Knock Off it, but overall deserves a drop IMO.

A to A-
The same problem than Krookodile but even worse, as Nihilego hardly makes progress right now as this mon has such of a flawed MU vs Slowking, Latias, Swampert and Excadrill, making this mon...kinda awkward. Not to mention that now the clear preference to Washtom is just super bad for it, as now Heattom, it's main victim tbh, it's just disappearing a lot and Roserade has been dropping due to Buzzwole leaving, which was kind of a Nihi victim, not to mention that Nihi teams have massive flaws vs Excadrill and Krookodile even tho it can Knock Off them, but yeah just drop it to A-.

A to B+
It was one of the biggest haters of the meta-shifts, as not only it has gotten Skarmory, a better Spikes user able to check mole and most Ground-Types while also having Whirlwind for Gyarados, but it lost Buzzwole, it's partner in crime which was able to cover it from Ground-Types, now with it gone, using this mon on a team is hella hard as then the team has big holes vs Ground-Types and even Fighting-Types. Not to mention it hates Mole existence too, as now it can't pull Defensive sets as effectively as before, and now it just feels kind of forced to run Leaf Storm and SpA investment in order to chunk Excadrill, which means that now the teams which use it struggle more vs Primarina too, so yeah I just don't like the big gaps which it leaves to teams and definitely should drop.

A- to B+/B
Mole dropping just affected it a lot, as it folds to Mold Breaker EQ and the worse part is that it also folds to SD + Rock Slide unlike Washtom, making it even worse as a check, as at least Washtom checks Sand Rush (kinda rare but still worth mentioning here). It also dislikes Roserade dropping and stuff such as Primarina raising quite a lot. It also dislikes meta shifts, as it had a victim in Buzzwole and now it has new threats such as Latias and Hydreigon while also Tangrowth becoming the (imo) best Grass-Type isn't the best thing for it, as it can Knock Off it unlike the other grasses and Rotom-Heat without Boots just folds to Rocks, making this mon overall really vulnerable to meta threats and it's clearly not as dominant as most A- mons.

B+ to B
So I just find this mon kinda mediocre rn, as now it's walled by Slowking and Latias despite that Sacred Fire can burn them, but Slowking on one hand resists Sacred Fire and Latias on other hand outspeeds it and tanks a hit while also killing it to Draco Meteor Life Orb, making it just...easier to deal than before? Like you die to the best mons of the tier (imo). Not to mention that it also gets walled by a handful of mons such as Primarina, Seismitoad, Swampert (new mon but w/e), Umbreon and Diancie while also being revenge killed by Zygarde-10% (mon which is getting way better than before), Azumarill and Conkeldurr after some chip. It also doesn't appreciate Buzzwole lefting and Roserade dropping, as it was pretty good at killing those structures. I still find it very powerful, especially under sun, but I feel like it should drop a subrank rn.

B+ to B
This mon just got a big hit for the meta shifts, as now we've got Slowking, Mole, Hydrei and Latias which is like, super bad for it, as it has gotten a new wall (Slowking), three revenge killers (Mole, Hydrei and Latias) and lowkey a competition for the Ground-Type slot aka Mole, which at least offers some sort of defensive utility, but this mon is just kinda mediocre atm and it's not like only for the shifts, it's because it also has been getting hurt by the meta trends already, especially with Rotom-Wash rising quite a lot and with stuff such as Mamoswine, Sneasel and AV Reuniclus seeing some usage, big threats to Nidoking without a doubt and just...leaves Nidoking as a really unreliable breaker.
Also, yeah ik it's weird to see someone nominating this mon lower considering that it's also B+ on the OU VR, but OU and UU are completely different metas, I just wanted to clarify it in order to avoid some sort of confusion and/or counterargument related to it, as having mons lower in a lower tier than in a higher tier is okay and from what I know is accepted.

C+ to C
While it has been always a niche pick, now is just even nicher, as now we've got Excadrill, mon which hard walls it and it's still an Electric-type which can't break grounds without Toxic Spikes support. Sub sets might still be viable but they might drop in order to reflect how worse did they got. Oh and not to mention that Latias ignores Toxic Spikes too and I can threaten it.

C to UR
Would you mind explaining me what are their niches rn?

New mons:
S
I agree with Esta on this one, this mon is so flexible and splashable, its lowkey a check for many mons of the tier such as Latias, Kommo-O, Salamence, Keldeo and it can also have a better MU vs Conkeldurr, Heracross & Shao if runs Psyshock/Psychic + Colburr Berry, which is really aprecciated as find a check to them isn't easy rn. I also find Thunder Wave very nice to dissuade Hydrei from switching and I also don't know why people underrates FuturePort so much? It still can fit into the right team as it's still lowkey busted paired with the fighting-type mons such as Shao or Hera and like Esta mentioned, CM sets might be dangerous vs fat teams. Also, I've saw some arguments such as "Dark-types being very common", but I don't think those are good at all, as it's very easy to slap onto teams and you can easily fit a Dark-type check alongside it, so I don't see it as a problem. But yeah is IMO the best mon of the tier.

S-
I definitely believe that this mon is super good, as it's offensive sets are just very dangerous due to their coverage and access to Roost, but I think that 3a Roost has been already mentioned and I think it's just it's best set, so won't go further on it. I've found Choice Specs to be really nukey though, as they can break through it's common resists such as Sylveon and Umbreon and like I've mentioned in my Best Thing post, after getting rid of the fairy you can start Draco Meteor spam until death, as even resists such as Aegislash get heavily wear down, it's not it's best set but it's fun definitely, I also think we can start testing Scarf and Grassy Seed more too, as they have interesting niches on their own. With that being said, though, I still think that straight S might push it, as the metagame in it's two weeks of existence has adapted well to it with mons such as Sylveon, Diancie and Umbreon, which are very good rn and it still finds itself on a kinda uncomfortable position when switching into status such as Toxic or Thunder Wave, but overall I believe that S- might be appropriate for it.

A+
I find this mon very neat, as it's utility sets can just bring a very good check to many mons such as Galarbro, Nihilego and Aegislash while also offering Spin utility, rocks (it's a rocker that doesn't fold to Hatterene) and a Volt Absorber in one slot, which is very valuable for most balance teams, as it's also a neat semi-check to Latias, not to mention it hits Washtom too, the best hazzard control rn. Now I personally think that SD sets are kinda underrated, as if the oppo team doesn't have Skarm/Celesteela or they have one of them but it's weakened, it can sweep, as most checks are one flinch away to die (Mandibuzz, Tangrowth and Latias under Sand or with a Spin boost). My only problem with it is that it can't deal with hazard setters such as Skarmory or even Swampert, making it kinda bad at keeping hazzards off, however, I believe that a good way to patch up this is pairing it with Hatterene, but yeah really good mon overall.

A
Oh yeah boi, a new Chansey/Sylveon partner here! I just love this mon as it's without a doubt the best Spikes user to the tier due to its ability to beat Excadrill while also chunking Rotoms with Body Press and/or Toxic'ing them, it also checks stuff such as Bulu, Zarude, Krookodile, DD Gyarados if running whirlwind and DD Mence in one slot and due to this, it can fit on many teams. I also think that Defog might be nice on teams which needs the role compression of PhsyDef wall + Defog user and Custap Berry sets might need some exploration in HOs too, as it's also kinda threatening with Body Press and stuff and while it's kinda shaky as a Psychic-type check, I still think that it should be ranked highly.

A-
I find it as a very nice glue mon thanks to its ability to check Latias, Hydreigon, Azelf and Excadrill while also offering Knock Off support and pivoting abilities respectively and it can do all of this reliably as it has good recovery and Overcoat is a nice ability as it helps to be inmune to Spore, allowing it to either Knock Off it or just nail it with Brave Bird (risking play though). I also think that Foul Play is a neat option on this thing too as it beats Gyara DD, SD Exca and Mence DD, which is very good as it can stomach a hit from them. Not everything is good for it though, as it can get crippled rather easily by Knock Off and Toxic due to its weird typing, it also has a small 4mss because it wants Brave Bird, Toxic (this one helps to cripple CM Latias and NP Hydrei) and Foul Play + Knock Off U-turn Roost but it's still very effective as a glue and should be in the A ranks imo.

A-
While it's true that it faces competition from Seismitoad in defensive sets, I still think that we are underestimating a little this mon, as while it's true that defensive sets have some issues (though I find them to be cool in Sylveon or Umbreon balances and Volt-Turns), I think we should consider Offensive sets as an option, as Swamp has many options such as Ice Punch to hit Latias and Hydrei while also having stuff such as Flip Turn and EQ in order to just hit very hard overall, making it effective in offensive teams due to its pivoting capabilities and unique combination of typing and moves, so yeah I just don't find it that comparable with Toad in non-Defensive sets and it should be considered more, as they are still rather effective in some Volt-Turns.

I also agree with the following noms (though some of them have been only briefly mentioned):
rise
rise
rise
rise
rise
rise
drop
drop
rise
rise
rise

Au revoir!

 

[HydreigonTheChild]

A -> A-

Slowking just does the special set but better, it has pivot, a spammable move in scald, recovery, and can take on the new and old threats better such as latias, celesteela, keldeo, excadrill, and more. Slowbro-g just feels like it has fallen off, and its CM set is the one that will now be carrying its weight as slowking just has a much better special sponge set.

 

[sims796]

I'm sti confused as to the reasoning that Politoes should return, why exactly is that?

 

[TailGlowVM]

I'm sti confused as to the reasoning that Politoes should return, why exactly is that?

Pelipper, which completely outclassed Politoed, rose to OU, leaving Politoed the best option for a rain setter.

 

[sims796]

Pelipper, which completely outclassed Politoed, rose to OU, leaving Politoed the best option for a rain setter.

Of course, silly me, thanks.

 

[Celebiii]

Time for a giant round of nominations to go with a new meta:

from UR to S: To nobody's surprise, Latias instantly warped the meta around it as soon as it rejoined the tier. It has a fantastic defensive typing, great bulk, amazing speed, and most importantly, the ability to run many viable sets. The Life Orb + Roost + 3 Attacks variant seems to once again be the most prominent, but Latias can easily run Calm Mind, Specs, Grassy Seed, Scarf, and SubCM variants, as well as variations of each of these. It absolutely must be accounted for in the builder, and has been a big factor in teams becoming slower and bulkier. I'm not convinced it needs to be banned or suspected yet, but my opinion might change with time.

from UR to S-: In my mind, Hydreigon is just a little worse than Latias, but is still incredible. Hydreigon is able to click Dark Pulse more freely than Latias can use its STABs, but is hampered by its lower speed and weakness to Conkeldurr's Mach Punch. Like Latias, however, Hydreigon can run several viable sets in Nasty Plot, Defog, Taunt, Scarf, and Specs, and every team requires a plan to deal with it.

from UR to A: Excadrill has also proven itself amazing in UU, though I wouldn't say to the same extent as the Dragons. It compresses a lot of roles in hazard removal, hazard setting, boosting sweeper, Electric immunity, and can perform several roles just like the Dragons. In Excadrill's case, it's found value as a suicide lead for hyper offense, hazard control, sweeper, and Dragon check. Sand offense options are also being explored. One of the biggest perks of Excadrill is that the Rotoms cannot Defog safely in front of it, limiting what were previously very consistent hazard removers. Excadrill is a bit easier to check naturally than the Dragons due to its relatively low speed, weakness to common offensive types in Fire, Water, Fighting, and Ground, and being hard checked by the incredible physically defensive Tangrowth, which finds itself on many teams. The mole is not to be underestimated by any means though.

from UR to A: Sorry Roserade, but Skarmory has returned to lay spikes like nobody's business once again, and this time with no firey rabbit to make it sweat or thundercat to zap it out of the sky. Skarm has the physical bulk to take on just about any physical attaker it isn't weak to, while shuffling opponents around the hazards it lays with Whirlwind. It can very viably run Safety Goggles just as it did before to safely pivot into Amoonguss, and it isn't passive due to having great offensive tools in Body Press or Brave Bird at its disposal as well.

from UR to B: Swampert is a really weird pick right now and usually feels like you are sacrificing something to put it on your team. It's a Ground type that isn't comfortable against Thundurus-Therian, and a Water type that doesn't resist Water itself. It also tends to be very passive and a bit of a momentum sink in my experience. I wouldn't call it bad, and I will be interested to see offensive sets like Choice Band be explored, but right now it feels like there are better choices.

from UR to B+: Mandibuzz I feel is most solid right now as a specially defensive sponge to help check the Dragons. It has a bevy of useful utility moves, and having Overcoat to switch into Amoonguss and ignore sandstorm/hail damage is great too. It can struggle to remove hazards unfortunately, and even to do its job of checking the special threats if they are running boosting moves/items, but I think Mandibuzz is a decent choice for some teams.

from UR to A-: In all honesty, I really haven't used much of Slowking yet, but it has performed its role well when I've gone up against it. Thunder Wave is annoying to switch into as always, and Slowking tends to live for quite a while, allowing it to act as a valuable defensive pivot. I'm in agreement with what has been said on the Discord that it should be running Psychic or Psyshock rather than Future Sight right now for immediate damage.

from UR to C+, from C to C+, from UR to C+, from UR to C+: Grouping all the hail baddies together. While it's a specific style, it's been shown to be successful, and takes advantage of the slower structures and plentiful Dragons running around right now. See my hail team post above for more info on the team I've been using, as well as Freezai's recent video!

from A+ to A-: Quite simply, Keldeo really does not love Latias, Primarina, and Slowking being super prominent in the tier at the moment.

from A+ to A: Excadrill's rise to prominence hurts Washtom a bit, but it's still a great choice for an offensive/defensive pivot. It also has somewhat of a more open moveset these days since UU now has more viable hazard removers.

from A to A-: I've seen very little Lycanroc-Dusk lately. I attribute this to the skyrocketing popularity of Conkeldurr, the high usage of physically defensive Tangrowth, and the fact that with the bulkier structures common in the tier, Lycan tends to get worn down quickly by chip + hazards + LO recoil while not actually taking things out. Perhaps Swords Dance sets will see a resurgence in the future to help remedy this?

from A to A+: Mienshao has been utterly fantastic post-shifts. Fighting types in general love the current metagame, and Mienshao is able to threaten heavy damage on most things in front of it no matter what set it is using. The Life Orb set acts as a fantastic wallbreaker/offensive pivot that sticks around for most of the game, while the Choice Scarf set provides the same offensive pivot potential while also being able to clean up late-game. I will be curious to see if AV Shao starts to pop up more in the future as well.

from A to A-: Mence really has been something I've seen almost none of lately, similar to Lycan. It feels like a huge opportunity cost to use it when you could be using either of the new two fantastic Dragons or the excellent Kommo-o or Zygarde-10%. Mence is never something to count out, however, and it won't surprise me if after more experimentation it regains its former prominence.

from A- to A: One of the best answers to the two new Dragons in the tier while also providing amazing utility potential to its team? Yeah, Chansey is good right now. While it does need to beware Trick and Psyshock from Latias, making it less of a sturdy check to the returning queen of UU, it's still a fantastic blanket check to special attackers that can set up rocks, provide status and/or cleric support, and act as a safe pivot into dangerous offensive threats with Teleport.

from B+ to A: Probably the best answer to Conk right now while also being able to hold off the Dragons. Togekiss, similar to Chansey, has a variety of utility/support options to help its team out as well. I recommend the fully physically bulky variant with Draining Kiss.

from B+ to A-: This dog clicks Thousand Arrows on anything not named Tangrowth and damages them heavily while outspeeding just about everything. It can also clean up late game with Outrage or Extremespeed, and loves Skarmory and Excadrill being very popular.

from B- to A+: BIG CONK. This man is such a terror right now. Facade + Fighting STAB (I prefer Drain Punch) + Knock Off means that it is nigh impossible to switch into safely. Conk, perhaps better than anything else right now, abuses the slow, bulky structures common in the tier, and hits so hard with Mach Punch you would think it has Tinted Lens. Right up there with the Dragons in that you MUST account for Conk in the builder.

from C+ to B+: A fantastic check to the prominent Dragons in the tier while also providing cleric support to its team, and not being passive against its switch-ins (Mystical Fire and Hyper Voice still hit quite hard even on the cleric set).

from C to B-: Crobat takes on the prominent Fighting types in Conk and Mienshao very reliably right now while also having the speed to act as a fantastic offensive pivot. It can also provide the team with Defog support, but does not love Excadrill being a popular hazard setter. Give the bat a try though - I promise it will put in work!

Other things I don't know enough about yet but should probably be ranked:

 

[churine]

hey its everyones favorite discord main and bd poster in the uu server, here to talk about pokemon for once, specifically to vouch for magneton somewhere on the ranks. (prob c or c+ lol)

Magneton @ Choice Specs
Ability: Magnet Pull
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Thunderbolt
- Flash Cannon
- Volt Switch
- Toxic

simply put, with skarm dropping and spiking all over uu, it only seems natural to start experimenting with the dedicated skarm remover magneton. removing skarm puts a halt to its hazard setting while also greatly benefiting many pokemon like exca, latias, dd mence, and others to clean the opposing team. magneton can also trap defensive celesteela, but it needs rocks first and has to pivot around carefully to avoid flamethrower/eq. now we all know magneton is very matchup reliant, but i wouldnt call it total deadweight in matchups without skarm. specs magneton still hits insanely hard, volt switch is always annoying to deal with, and while theres a boatload of grounds, many of them dont like taking a specs flash cannon. magneton also can toxic the more annoying grounds like swampert or just to put things on a timer like the newly dropped slowking. steel beam is also an enticing option for a complete nuke that can also sack itself to safely bring in a teammate. now its speed still leaves much to be desired and its bulk is p garbage giving it hard time taking even resisted hits, but being able to simply trap skarm and halt its hazards has got to be worth something. i know its bad etiquette to not post replays my b for that but i think magnet pull is pretty easy to understand how it affects games. thank you bn

 

[mushamu]

And so I can't be accused of just being nitpicky I'm going to elaborate on why I disagree with this. First of all when you look at the current A+ mons you will notice they all have discernable defensive utility even for the offensive ones. Aegislash has steel typing, fighting immunity and enormous bulk when in the shield form and potential priority on some sets, Keldeo is naturally bulky and has a water typing, Kommo-o is naturally really bulky and has the choice of being immune to either powder moves or moves like Shadow Ball and Sludge Bomb letting it blank many Tangrowth sets as well as check threats like Chandelure and Primarina has a fantastic typing with an invaluable dragon immunity. Mienshao does not possess any defensive utility because of its low bulk which restricts the number of teams you can build with it since you will always have to compensate for the defensively dead slot on your team, usually with bulky pivots like Slowking or a Rotom form and the defensive deficiency teams with Mienshao face is especially problematic in the current metagame where teams struggle to account for the variety of threats in the tier. Additionally running any offensive set that isn't scarf (which has its own issues) is a luxury since you now have to account for the Latias, Keldeo, Lycanrock, Zydog and Azelf you are now outrun by which results in teams with unreliable speed control at best. This is another trait Mienshao currently doesn't share with the pokemon in A+: it doesn't have versatility in sets, scarf is perfectly decent but it's not worth an A+ rank on its own and life orb leaves you with noticeable holes in your team right out of the gate. I think it's definitely a notable threat in the current metagame with its combination of traits being valuable but A+ is pushing it.

As someone who uses mienshao a lot i really disagree with when u say the mon has no defensive utility at all compared to the other A+ ranked mons. Aside from being a dangerous offensive threat mienshao is incredible as a midground to random weaker attacks that dont ohko it due to regenerator (and can use assault vest as well to check certain mons like hydreigon). Things like azelfs flamethrower, latias's thunderbolt, random knock off/u turns, krookodile's earthquake and zarudes darkest lariat are examples of things it can take repeatedly within the duration of a game and keep up momentum due to its offensive presence and sometimes choice scarf. As long as it doesnt die, then that gives it more opportunities to click u-turn/whatever and do its job later on. I think thats whats so nice about the mon tbh, you really need to know what buttons to press with the mon to bring it in safely and make progress but its extremely high reward in return. I think mienshao is an incredible scarfer because of this, and while other offensive pokemon might have more objective defensive qualities they can get worn down over time which limits them coming in, while regenerator makes up for mienshao's lack of defensive traits because its durable throughout the duration of a battle which makes it easier to use as a revenge killer in different points in a game. From personal experience scarf mienshao is incredible at grabbing momentum and serving as a midground early/midgame which no other scarfer can really do as well aside from like rotom w i guess. Mienshao also has a decent amount of versatility in its sets, on life orb you can pick between blaze kick for amoonguss, poison jab for fairy types, and stone edge for moltres and salamence as ur fourth move and assault vest is cool as well. Its pretty easy to build with too, as a scarfer its very splashable and it pairs well with spikes users/other offensive pokemon that get enabled as a result of its constant u turn spam which brings them in.

 

[HydreigonTheChild]

-> B+

This pokemon is good, good typing and checks many of the new threats such as excadrill with inner focus + foul play, hydreigon with its monstrous special bulk as well as latias. It also benefits from the shifts as buzzwole easily took advantage of it with its 3 attacks set and latias being walled. While it mandates a cleric, and being taken advantage of skarmory, the new rising conk, and rest talk prim, but that is nothing that cannot be solved by its teammates.

-> B+

It is taken advantage of by skarmory, who has better bulk, a better typing, and more consistent recovery. It also still has to compete over grass slot which is tough for it. It is still good, I am not saying it is bad, its just it has a lot of competition right now as a spiker, tho it has its unique traits of pressuring primarina, keldeo and is generally less passive.

 

[hariyana grande]

hi some of my thoughts just from some games on the uu ladder :

B- to A+

this mon is so broken rn. pairing it with slowking which can just blindly come in on so many things just to teleport and bring in this makes it so strong and super obnoxious to deal with, only leaving you with super niche pokemon like g weezing to reliably check it

S-

seeing slowking paired with any wallbreaker, particularly fighting types like conk/mienshao (to get max effectiveness out of future sight) open one's eyes to see how obnoxious this thing really is lmao. you bring this thing in on like half the tier, close ur eyes, click teleport and go into ur wallbreaker. its so consistent at what it does and its strategy is difficult to deal with

to C+ at least

like i said earlier, the only thing that can comfortably come in on conk rn, and considering how good conk is rn i'd say thats a big reason to use it on teams. just as others have said, its ability (lol) to stop other regenerator mons from healing upon switching out is nice, and it has some nice role compression too with defog


Both to B+
The fact that these two are so easily capable of coming in on lati and hydreigon, arguably the two best mons in the tier (albeit umbreon needs toxic to deal with np hydreigon), makes them more than worthy of being this high up on the tier list. obviously they aren't exactly the same pokemon but they definitely fulfill similar roles, mainly being providing nice wish pass support and dealing with some titans of the tier.

completely disagree on this rising. not only did skarm drop, but tangrowth and amoonguss are everywhere, which put a stop to 99% of this things sets, and if you actually have zen ur allowing it to get walled by aeg/zarude etc (this is the sd 3 attacks set im talking about), everything else is completely walled skarm/tang/amoong

 

[HydreigonTheChild]

completely disagree on this rising. not only did skarm drop, but tangrowth and amoonguss are everywhere, which put a stop to 99% of this things sets, and if you actually have zen ur allowing it to get walled by aeg/zarude etc (this is the sd 3 attacks set im talking about), everything else is completely walled skarm/tang/amoong

While it still has 4MSS with lariet, megahorn, and edge, it can be used on teams that appreciate breaking past certain pokemon or putting huge dents in them such as slowking, swampert, celesteela, krookodile, mandibuzz, umbreon, primarina, and more. It will never be walled by zarude as SD 3 attacks runs horn leech, CC, and a coverage move depending on the situation. If my team needs me to hit moltres-g, mandibuzz, moltres, and thundy-t harder I can run Stone edge, if my team needs me to hit threats such as slowbro-g, jirachi, and aegislash I can run lariet, and if my team needs me for stuff such as a harder hit on tang then I can run megahorn. CC and horn leech hit majority of the tier aside from amoonguss, slowbro-g, moltres, salamence, chandy, and vern. Tapu bulu is pretty god like if you can set it up for it to wreak havoc. This is why its B+ not A- as it still needs a lot of support from teammates and gives up a grass slot but it does what it does well.