Stall... new for me, not you

[Lightsabre]

I have been working on a stall team for quite some time. I have always wanted to try it, but HO has been the way I've gone for quite a while, since I'm not always the most patient guy, but I've decided to finally give it a go.

SIDE NOTE: This is a WIFI team, so Rotom forms and Wish Bliss are not happening


Team at a Glance version 1.0

Version 2.0

I will bold things I'm not sure of, and italize things I've changed



Stealth Rocker

Hippowdon

Impish
Leftovers
252 HP / 168 Def / 88 SpD

EarthQuake
Stealth Rock
Slack Off
Roar/Ice Fang

Hippowdon suplies me with a well needed electric imunity, as well as stealth rock and a solid Ttar counter. This is my usual way of dealing with the rock monster, since the rest of the team can do little but force it out. The difference between roar and ice fang is pretty big to me. I could always use more shuffling, but being able to deal with DD mence is always valuable. I need some advise here. Otherwise this is a fairly easy set. with recovery, rocks, and stab.

Hippowdon is taking some testing. I'm thinking of switching for Gliscor to take out Lucario much easier. will still have SR and recovery. thoughts?

Synergy

Go To
Vaporeon for Water
Blissey/Vaporeon for ice
Blissey/Foretress for grass special
Foretress for grass phisical

Takes
Electic attacks aimed at Vappy
TTars


Toxic Spiker
Foretress

Relaxed
Shed Shell
252 HP / 112 Atk / 144 Def

Rapid Spin
Toxic Spikes
spikes
Payback

Now, I don't have gyro ball since mine happens to have a max speed IV, but Payback willingly fills that gap, and for good reason. Quite often Ghosts will come in on forry to stop his spinning, but now they'll get hit with a 200 power(if you count SE and special effect) move that will give them a shock. If I know that there's a ghost on the opposing team, then I will almost always use payback first. Otherwise TS is the third part of my hazard team, and an essential one. If I know that the opponent is using HO teams, then I'll usualy only use TS once, so I can knock off more HP faster. Rapid Spin is a necessity, since none of my team likes the damage recieved from spikes and rocks(or TS if Blissey is unavailable).

I changed pain split to spikes to replace Skarmory's spiking.

Synergy

Go To
Vappy/Blissey for fire

Takes
grass from hippowdon/vappy
other random stuff he resists


The Wish Passer

Vaporeon

Bold
Leftovers
188 HP / 252 Def / 68 Spe

Surf
Wish
Protect
Hidden Power[electric]/Ice Beam


Although all of my team has some form of self recovery, two of them relly on the dubious pain split, so wish passing is always a good thing. This is the standard Wish Support, and it's standard because it's good at what it does. The only question I have here is for the filler move. I have a somewhat weak to gyarados, so HP[electric] is good, but Roar is always handy and Ice beam is helpful for the Salamences that are running rampant. I'm really not sure what to use there, so I'm open to advise. I have all three moves available, so I can do any combonation.

Ice Beam was decided on orriginaly, but HP[electric] helps mitigate a DD Gyarados weakness, so I need much more imput on this. going with Hidden Power for now

Synergy

Go To
Hippowdon/Blissey for Electric
Blissey for grass special
Foretress for grass phisical

Takes
Water/ice from Hippowdon


The Cleric

Blissey

Calm
Leftovers
252 Def / 40 SpA / 216 SpD

Aeromatherapy
Softboiled
Toxic
Ice Beam

This is a standard for all stall teams, except those who refuse to use her. Speaking of which, please don't make worthless posts telling me I'm a loser because I use Blissey. Blissey is here to take the random special stuff that the rest of the guys can't bear, along with curing statuses from others. Toxic for those pesky flyers and livitaters that avoid the TS

Synergy

Go To
Spiritomb for explosion/fight/trick

Takes
Any special attack that the rest don’t resist.

THE SPIN BLOCKER
Spiritomb

calm
Leftovers
252 HP / 140 Def / 116 SpD
Shadow Ball
Hidden Power fighting/Will-O-wisp
rest
Sleep Talk

Here is a different form of Spiritomb. I used to use the lead set with trick>Will-O-Wisp, but I've changed it to this to help a Lucario weakness. This Spiritomb now helps as a status absorber, and Blissey with Aeromatherapy will get rid of the sleeping if I don't have time to sleep talk. Spiritomb is mainly my spin blocker now, but I've lost my answer to trick, so for trick scarfers I have to let Latias eat it, and then I won't be able to calm mind. I need some more advice on this set, but for now this is what I'll use

Synergy

Go To
Since there are no weaknesses on this guy, I’ll go to whoever is appropriate whenever it’s appropriate

Takes
Fight, Psycic, Normal for the whole team.


The glue for it all

Latias

Timid
Leftovers
252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spd
Calm Mind
Dragon Pulse
Surf
Recover


Latias is here to help keep away some of my weeknesses. outspeeding an severely damgaging(haven't done calcs, but probably okos) mixSalamence/and none DD or scarf mence. Latias also helps by checking multiple threats such as Infernape and scarftran. Latias can come in late game and let me shift mindests from stalling to sweeping. after a few calm minds, I'll be able to finnish off everything that the rest of my team has weakened. 252speed is necissary to outrun any base 100s before a speed boosts. after that I dump the rest into HP, since her SPATK will be boosted with Calm Mind.

Synergy

Go to
Vappy for ice
Foretress/reliable checks for dark
Blissey for ghost

takes
Fire/Water/Ground/grass/electric depending on who's using it
choice items

There’s my team. The next two posts will be the threat list and team construction, so please wait to post until I’ve got those up.

Noteable dangers:
Opposing Stall. I have a big problem with other stall teams, mostly because I can't deal with their rapid spinners


Old team Members
THE SPIKER

Skarmory

Impish
Shed Shell
252 HP / 60 Atk / 176 Def / 20 Spe

Drill Peck
Whirlwind
Roost
Spikes

The first of my entry hazard team. This one sets up my spikes. I chose spikes over stealth rock for this skarm, because Hippowdon can set up rocks, and I don't want foretress to have to set up two different hazards. Drill Peck>Brave Bird because the only thing you'll ever find me attacking with this is also taking 25%+ damage from switching in, unless it's a fellow lead. That is the only problem with Scarm. Many of the present leads have a convenient way of dealing with him; however, I have a switchin for almost all of them, so he works just fine. 20 speed evs is to outspeed other whirlwinding skarmory

 

[Lightsabre]

Threat list

OFFENSIVE THREAT LIST


Azelf: I go straight to Spiritomb for this guy.

Breloom: Haven’t seen one of these in a while, but Skarmory can drill peck it and spiritomb can take the sleep. Both resisting/being immune to one or more of its stabs

Celebi: foretress and Spiritomb can take it down eventuly. Toxic stalling and shuffling around can also help here.

Dugtrio: There’s nothing on this team that it’ll really want to trap, bar blissey, and its frail defenses mean I really don’t need to worry about it.

Electivire: Hippowdon can come in on thunder punch, but only if he has high enough HP to take on ice punch.

Empoleon: empoleon will only cause trouble if it has grass knot. Otherwise vapporeon comes out and stalls it away

Flygon: Flygon doesn’t like vaporeon, and if I choose to use ice fang on hippowdon it will become a solid counter.

Gengar: Blissey and Spiritomb combined will destroy it.

Gliscor: Scarmory comes in and walls it all day. Once things get uncomfortable with its boosts I’ll just WW it away.

Gyarados: Gyarados can cause me some grief. HP[electric] on Vapporeon can stop that, and he won’t like switching into stealth rock repeatedly.

Heatran: Vapporeon can take anything except perhaps a specs HP[grass]. Blissey can also wall it, but will have no effective means of destroying it.

Heracross: Spiritomb can make stop it, but guts will make me cry in the process.

Infernape: Latias

Jirachi: Latias and Blissey can stop the special version, and I am aided with Jirachi being exceedingly rare on wifi.

Kingdra: Kingdra simply cannot get past Vapporeon, unless it gets a few DDs in. Latias can also come in and threaten to OKO

Latias: Latias can be a hastle. I don’t know whether it’s specsed and will draco meteor, or if it will trick. If it proves to be a cm variant, then Vapporeon can survive long enough to roar away

Lucario: Latias will threaten it with surf, though crunch/ice punch will hurt

Machamp: Latias can check it, but it can still annoy the heck out of me with confusion

Magnezone: Zone can’t trap any of my pokemon, since my two steels have shed shell. He also won’t like me switching in hippowdon to take thunderbolt, but then it depends on which hidden power he has to whether I can finnish him or not.

Mamoswine: Swine can be scary. He has the ability to come in and threaten quite a bit of my team, but Vapporeon can usually bring him down first. The problem with that is that I need to switch Vappy in first.

Metagross: Metagross usually won’t cause much of a broblem. Especially the CB variant. Once he’s locked into a move he can’t do anything, meanwhile. I can go to Vapporeon and wish pass away.

Ninjask: Roar from Hippowdon. The next time it’ll come in I’ll have stealth rock up, and it won’t want to do that again


Rhyperior: Vaporeon

Roserade: Roserade can do some damage to me, but Spiritomb can out play it. Also, Blissey can come in and take anything, including sleep powder, with it’s natural cure ability.

(Rotom forms removed due to not being used on WIFI)

Salamence: Latias gives me a psuedo check, but Mence is still a beast

Scizor: 2 steels and vapporeon mean that this thing won’t go far.

Snorlax: Skarmory can whirlwind away it’s attempts to curse, and vapporeon can come in and roar it if fire punch is coming. Then it’s just a matter of wearing it down

Starmie: I’ve never met a bulky version of Starmie for whatever reason, but I could see it screwing me over unless Blissey could just PP stall it. The HO versions are usually choiced, and will lock onto hydro pump or trick right off(in my experience) I have my counters to each of those separate, but not combined.

Suicune: hey look. It’s vaporeon’s brother! Vapporeon doesn’t like it. ROOAARR!! But seriously, if it’s the opponents last pokemon, I might be having some troubles with this thing. Crocune can't beat Latias in a calm mind war.

Togekiss: Blissey can take versions that aren’t going mixed, and spiritomb can beat it via sucker punch (bypassing the flinch abusers)

Tyranitar: Hippowdon and toxic are literally the ONLY things on this team that can take him out. He could provide some real problems if I lose hippowdon

Weavile: Another huge threat to this team. The best thing I can say that he won’t like losing 50% of his health every switch in. Scarmory can WW him out and make him die to hazards, but that’s the best I got.

Yanmega: Yanmega can’t do too much to me, while spiritomb and blissey stop it cold with sucker punch and pure stall respectively. It also hates stealth rock, which is vital to my team and will consequently be up 99% of the time.

Zapdos: Blissey is my short answer to this problem. The sub roost toxic versions, however, might give even her some problems.




DEFENSIVE THREAT LIST

Blissey: I’m gonna have to outstall it, but it has nothing to do against this team.

Bronzong: I can’t really do anything to it, but it can’t do anything back

Celebi- Spiritomb can take anything it throws at it, and then bounce back a pursuit. Scarkmory can also deal with versions that only know grass knot as attacking moves, but Spiritomb is my go to guy to avoid any tricky business.

Cradily– Skarmory can stop pretty much everything that this guy wants to do, but can’t do anything in return

Cresselia- Spiritomb can stop it pretty well. Blissey can toxic stall it once I’m sure it has leftovers and not some trick set

Crobat- Crobat almost always runs the evil taunt, which is pretty much the bane of stall teams. Spiritomb can take a lot of what he brings, and if he Brave Birds(haven’t done calcs yet) I think I survive and can pain split away that damage, and then sucker punch him to finnish him.

Donphan– Donphan is slower and hates Vapporeon.

Drapion- The only thing this guy can do is get rid of my toxic spikes. hippowdon can kill it

Dusknoir- Spiritomb laughs at pretty much everything, though burn will lower my damage output for a short time.

Empoleon- (see offensive threat list)

Forretress- forretress is a problem on paper, since I have no fire attacks to abuse its weakness, but I’ve never really had trouble with it. The biggest problem is that it doesn’t always die before I get rid of the TS, so it can get in and respike the place.

Gliscor – Vaporreon can do some damage here, but since the leftovers will be busy recovering SS damage, I’ll have to wish/protect more often.

Gyarados- Bulky Gyarados offers the same problem as offensive Gyarados, but with the added effect that a lot more bulky ones carry taunt. Latias can pseudo stop him, but can't do enormous amounts of damage

Hariyama - I really don’t know how I would mess this thing up. If Spiritomb has already absorbed a trick, then I can trick the item back onto Hariyama, but otherwise I have very little way of beating it. Latias helps here as well

Heatran- depends on what his hidden power is. If he lacks grass, then Vappy can take him on. Otherwise Blissey will be the switch in.

Hippowdon- probably just gonna go to vappy

Jirachi- see offensive Jirachi

Latias- no different then the offensive latias.

Ludicolo- I have to outstall it, since there’s nothing on this team that can beat it one on one

Machamp Latias can stop it

Magnezone- Blissey, or if it lacks hidden power grass/ice then Hippowdon can take it.

Mesprit – Spiritomb can take all but a calm mind set.

Metagross- depends on if it has ice punch or not. If not then hippowdon can take it. Otherwise, vapporeon can usually deal with it

Milotic- I have a problem with Milotic, mostly because I’m giving it a 50% boost right when it switches in. I can take the offensive threat, and the defensive can’t do much, but leftovers+recover makes even toxic stalling take forever. It’s better to just roar him out and take care of him when he’s the only thing left.

Miltank- Miltank can annoy me, but Hippowdon can take most of what she throws at it, and can roar it away.

Porygon2- P2 can’t really do anything outside of counter Gyarados and salamence. Blissey can take anything but trick with laughing ease.

Regirock- Vapporeon will have her work cut out for her, should be able to manage.

Registeel – Hippowdon can just sit there and fire off EQs until he dies

Rhyperior- solid trait or not, he still falls to one maybe two surfs

(removed rotom forms)

Salamence (see offensive threats)

Scizor – not necessarily a threat, but I can’t do much to it; which is a problem since it’s the most used OU pokemon out there

Shaymin- Blissey can out stall it, assuming I don’t get many SPDEF drops.

Shuckle- I have nothing to stop it, and enchore can do some serious ill to my team, but otherwise I don’t worry about it

Skarmory- Vapporeon can stop it.

Slaking – Vapporeon+protect=lifesaver. The only problem is if he enchores me.

Slowbro – Spritomb can take most of what he throws out, and absorb trick in the mean time.

Snorlax lacking a fight type move is seriously hurting my team right now. If this guy ends up being the last pokemon on my opponent’s team, then I’m screwed. Spiritomb is the best thing to take it on, but can do nothing to it.

Spiritomb- I have little to no way of dealing with this guy, since he outstalls Blissey without even trying.

Starmie Spiritomb can take all but a choice specs hydro pump, and will make my opponent rue tricking me. if they aren’t running trick then Blissey deals handily with them.

Suicune- see offensive threats

Swampert – I don’t think he’ll cause me much grief, but only vappy can cause him some.

Tentacruel- Tentacruel can annoy me, and the toxic spikes will need to go, but it can’t do anything to Blissey bar the goofy SD set

Togekiss – Spiritomb and Blissey can usually stop it.

Tyranitar – Hippowdon can switch into Stone Edge and threaten with EQ

Umbreon- I have absolutely no way to truly deal with this thing, except hope that it mean looks my psudohazers.

Vaporeon I have little to do to this beast, but it can’t do to much to Blissey.

Walrein- Walrein is a joke if I’ve gotten rid of Hail, and toxic/ toxic spikes will ruin its day

Weezing- Vappy can come in and block most of his attacks, bar thunderbolt.

Zapdos- Latias can help stop this guy cold, and even with HP[ice], a couple of calm minds will stop it; however, toxic subroost sets will cause a stop to that.

 

[Lightsabre]

Team Building

OK. I started this team with the basic idea of stalling. to most effectively do this, you want the three hazards on the field, and since I wanted SS going, Hippowdon was necissary

I then decided that I wanted Skarmory for the spikes, and it is extremely good for stall teams.

I then was faced with the dilema of which Toxic Spiker I wanted. Did I want Tentacruel, or Foretress. I left this decision out for a bit, since I wasn't sure either way.

So I now go on to look at a wish passer. I knew that no matter what toxic spiker I chose, self recovery would be shaky at most. I had to decide between Latias and Vapporeon. I went with Vappy, but still think about going to Latias. None-the-less, Vapporeon joined the team

With Vappy there, I didn't want a triple electric weak, so I decided on Forretress for my spiner/toxic spikes

Then Blissey was added for her special tanking abilities, along with aeromatherapy

Then I puzzled for the longest time. I didn't know what to put last. a spin blocker I knew would be useful, but I also saw a weakness to trick. eventualy I came up with that Spiritomb set, and put him in the last slot.

EDIT #1

After playing a little bit, Scarm+forry created a lot of fire weakness, and pokemon like Infernape can really get through to me. after getting a helpful rate, I've decided to remove Scarmory for Latias, and place Hippowdon in the lead position

 

[Aura Guardian]

I have used your team on the ladder. Not once have I found myself wishing for a different moveset. Roar is better on Hippowdon because Hippowdon should not be put against grass types, and the others deal with grass and dragon types well enough.
Roar on Hippowdon. It is good for phazing

Vaporeon's Surf is sufficient for battle. Ice beam completes the set, dealing with the dragons. Roar is a bad idea because Hippowdon already uses it. HP Electric is just uneeded. If Vaporeon had 5 slots, sure! However, the team does not need the electric attack
Ice Beam on Vaporeon.

On Spiritomb, I used Sucker Punch. It was excellent. Never was I in a position where Pursuit would have been better. Sucker Punch is excellent STAB priority.
Sucker Punch on Spiritomb.

Anyway, those are my suggestions

 

[ARandomDude]

I sense a serious stall-weakness here, since Spiritomb doesn't exactly scare Forretress, the most common spin-blocker. He will just sit and Payback all day until you run and he gets to blow away your hazards. To remedy this, I would recommend a switch to Dusknoir as your spinblocker:

252HP/228Def/28SpD Impish
-Fire Punch
-Ice Punch/Thunderpunch
-Earthquake
-Pain Split

 

[Lightsabre]

Aura Guardian- thanks for the imput. I added most of your changes. the only thing I didn't get is your imput on spiritomb. I know I'm using sucker punch. the thing I'm trying to figure out is whether I want to use Pursuit or Shadow Sneak

ARandom Dude. Yeah, I've got a serious problem with stall. The only problem with your suggestion is that I need to keep trick, and Duskinoir can't really switch into the people using trick mindlessly. I do see the problem, I just don't know if that's the solution. One thing I was thinking about was swaping Vappy for Latias and Forretress for Tentacruel, but I don't really want to, since Tentacruel has no way of healing itself

 

[Little Green Yoda]

I run a very similar stall team with the same Forry/Vappy/Blissey core. I prefer HP Elec on Vappy if only because Taunt Gyara will curbstomp your team if it gets a DD in, especially the bulky variety. While DDmence is scary in its own right, you can possibly Roar it out with Hippo in some cases. Plus you have 2 Steels to absorb +1 Outrages.

Not sure how I feel about running Trick Spiritomb to counter Trick - seems really situational. Between WoW and Resttalk, there's a lot options that I'd personally prefer. IPL had a really cool Spiritomb set on his stall team. It's possible (albeit tricky lol) to play around Trick. Another idea: you can always give Scarf-Rotom (regular form) a try. Weaker defenses but it gives you a revenge killer as a failsafe against DDGyara.

But if you do swap out Forry/Vappy for Latias/Tenta, you could always run Rest on the squid since you're running Aroma on Bliss anyway.

 

[Noimus]

What I don't get is how do you win against stall teams? Like their are no attacks. Do the people just flee out? Like If i would face your team right now I would kill myself its soo boring. So how does it work?

Btw your team is amazing! I dont understand why you can't have Rotom forms it works fine for me on Wi-Fi. One thing why not get Toxic on Vaporeon? It can be very helpful!

 

[Jukain-Arashi]

What I don't get is how do you win against stall teams? Like their are no attacks. Do the people just flee out? Like If i would face your team right now I would kill myself its soo boring. So how does it work?

Btw your team is amazing! I dont understand why you can't have Rotom forms it works fine for me on Wi-Fi. One thing why not get Toxic on Vaporeon? It can be very helpful!

Wish on Vappy lets him pass wish onto his other Pokemon. It can be very helpful in stall teams.

 

[giggity69]

So long as your foretress is in good health, you have zero problems with weavile, although I would recommend gyro-ball for that purpose. I would also suggest a choice band on spiritomb both to punish trick users, and to beef up sucker punch or shadow sneak when you need the extra power. Also, because you have a cleric blissey on your team, rest is advisable on foretress and possibly spiritomb as opposed to pain split.

 

[OMGBURRITO]

I really like how you posted the synergies your guys have with the other pokemon on your team. Your team looks really solid, and I'm too inexperienced to be able to make any constructive comments about the team. But this is probably one of the best RMT's I've read in a while for that reason.

 

[Zach]

Edit: oh wi-fi team bleh sorry

First, place Hippowdon in the lead position. It is simply a better lead than Skarmory.

This team is very Gyarados and Lucario weak. The only Pokemon who really stands a chance against Taunt Gyarados is Vaporeon, who is inevitably beaten before her weak Ice Beams KO. Meanwhile, the only Pokemon that has little fear of Lucario after a Swords Dance on this team is Spiritomb, who is left to attack Lucario with 4x resisted Dark-type moves. There are several fixes:

Fix 1:

Replace Spiritomb with:

Rotom-a @ Leftovers
252 HP / 40 Def / 216 Spe
Timid nature (+Spe, -Atk)
-Thunderbolt
-Will-o-Wisp
-Rest
-Sleep Talk

Resttalk Rotom with a tweaked EV spread for this team's needs. Thunderbolt takes out Gyarados. The Speed EVs and Timid nature allow Rotom to outrun Adamant Lucario, so it can Will-o-Wisp it before being Crunched.

Fix 2:

Replace Spiritomb with:

Rotom-h @ Choice Scarf
148 HP / 220 Spe / 140 SpA
Timid nature (+SpA, -Atk)
-Thunderbolt
-Overheat
-Will-o-Wisp
-Trick

This outspeeds all Lucario and Gyarados and can OHKO either. This also absorbs Tricks. The Speed EVs outrun Max Speed Jolly Gyarados after a DD, as well as Empoleon after Agility.

Fix 3:

Replace Spiritomb with:

Rotom-a @ Leftovers
252 HP / 120 Def / 136 SpD
Bold nature (+Def, -Atk)
-Thunderbolt
-Will-o-Wisp
-Rest
-Sleep Talk

Replace Hippowdon with Gliscor:

Gliscor @ Leftovers
252 HP / 36 Def / 220 Spe
Jolly nature (+Spe, -SpA)
-Stealth Rock
-Taunt
-Earthquake
-Roost

Gliscor is the surefire Lucario counter, and still handles Tyranitar pretty well. This also frees Rotom to use a more defensive EV spread, giving it more breathing room against Life Orb variants of Gyarados. Jolly and 220 Spe allows Gliscor to outrun all Lucario, as well as those trying to do the same (aka other Gliscor. which means you can Taunt them first).

I recommend the last fix. Good luck!

 

[Lightsabre]

little green yoda- Thanks for the advice. I think I will try hp[electric] I definately have a problem with taunt Gyarados. I might give rotom regular a go. I'd still have trick, but the fact that no normal spiritomb runs trick with leftovers has been to my advantage. what set do you think I should use?
If I do switch Vappy/Forry for Lati/Tenta then I'll take your advice there.

noimus- I basically have to out play them, with a combonation of entry hazards and pp stalling
thanks =)

giggity69- Thanks for the rate. I've been thinking about switching to gyro ball, and will give it a go. I don't really want to be running rest, since I then become dead wieght until I can get Blissey in.

crunchatize me- I'm gonna guess by your edit that you know that 3 of your suggestions cannot be done. I might go for the Gliscor though. It'll give me another ground immunity and help againt Luke.

I've added what I thought was good into the thread.

Thanks for the rates everyone!!! please keep rating

 

[Delta 2777]

Have you ever tried using a stall team on wifi? Seriously, I would quit after 50 turns when the battle isn't even halfway finished >.>

First matter of business: Will-O-Wisp > Trick on spiritomb. While I realize getting tricked a choice item on a full stall team sucks, WoW helps counter sooo many huge threats, such as Gyarados, Tyranitar, etc. who you would be otherwise helpless against.

Next: I think I have a way to solve several of your team's weaknesses and give you a revenge killer should things get out of hand.

Jirachi@Choice Scarf
Nature: Naive/Jolly
252 Atk/252 Spe/6 SpAtk
-Iron Head
-Thunderbolt/Fire Punch
-Ice Punch/Fire Punch
-Trick/U-Turn
Use this in place of Skarmory. You'll gain a revenge killer that can stop DDMence, DDGyara, and SDLuke (although only 2 of those 3 at the same time). Thunderbolt hits hard against not only Gyarados, but skarmory as well, making it usually the superior option to Thinderpunch. Trick helps break down opposing stall, and just cripple stuff that doesn't like it. U-Turn hits Celebi and is used to gather momentum.

Now, I suggest you place Spikes over Toxic Spikes on Forretress. You may think "But that means I don't have all 3 entry hazards!!1!". This is true, however, I don't think they are necessary for your team. With Toxic on Blissey, and WoW on Spiritomb, you should be inflicting plenty of status. Besides, many of the biggest threats in this metagame (Gyarados, Salamence, Latias, Scizor...) are immune to toxic spikes anyway.

 

[Lightsabre]

there are two problems with using Jirachi. One, and the most forceful, is I don't hack and I have no Jolly/naive Jirachi. There isn't one out there as far as I know, and I've been looking for one. Aside from that, using Jirachi saps me of a VERY useful phisical wall. Without Skarmory I have too few psudohazers(only hippowdon) and this team appreciates all of the entry hazards. with all of the entry hazards completely up, TTar coming in will take at least 40% damage. That knocks enough off for Hippowdon to come in on the next attack(barring aqua tail) and deal a KO. Don't doubt Hippo's staying power when TTar is locked into Stone Edge, and I have someone for every hit he deals out. Crunch and EQ go to Skarm, Stone Edge Hippo stays put. Aqua Tail goes to Vappy(Hippo takes 53.8% - 63.8% from it). All of these can handle and PP stall him. if he switches out, then my purpose is finnished. The DD version is handled quite the same way, except I won't bother with switching Hippo out and just go for the KO

 

[Lightsabre]

Bump. please comment. I've been in one battle with this thing so far. and the most important peice of log was this(sharpedo is choiced)

Light switched in Vapporeon
Sharpedo used ice fang
ice fang did --- damage


Sharpedo used ice fang
Vapporeon froze
Vapporeon thawed out
Vapporeon flinched

Sharpedo used ice fang
Vapporeon froze!
Vapporeon is frozen


so yeah, and after Vappy was gone I had a hard time getting rid of his scarf flygon, but it couldn't really hit back hard enough to do much damage

 

[Zach]

well if x is gone then you're weak to y

this holds true for any team

although if you use bold bliss (148 HP / 252 Def / 108 SpD) you could take on his flygon better and Ice Beam it.

 

[Aura Guardian]

Aura Guardian- thanks for the imput. I added most of your changes. the only thing I didn't get is your imput on spiritomb. I know I'm using sucker punch. the thing I'm trying to figure out is whether I want to use Pursuit or Shadow Sneak

ARandom Dude. Yeah, I've got a serious problem with stall. The only problem with your suggestion is that I need to keep trick, and Duskinoir can't really switch into the people using trick mindlessly. I do see the problem, I just don't know if that's the solution. One thing I was thinking about was swaping Vappy for Latias and Forretress for Tentacruel, but I don't really want to, since Tentacruel has no way of healing itself

Oops. I misread your team. I meant to say that you should use Shadow Sneak over Pursuit. My bad.

 

[Lightsabre]

Crunchatize Me- How does that Blissey stack up against other threats that the normal Blissey set handles well? I thought that people had migrated away from Bold because the special side was just to strong to be compromising your deffenses

Aura Guardian- I'll test both. So far Shadow sneak has been ok, but most of the psycic types are switching out, so I think I'll go for Pursuit. still testing on that one

 

[Little Green Yoda]

I thought that people had migrated away from Bold because the special side was just to strong to be compromising your deffenses

I believe the Calm/SpD versions are mainly to ensure you beat things like NP PoryZ and NP Togekiss. Bold versions will still handle the vast majority of special threats. On the Shoddy ladder, it's probably okay to overlook them due to their infrequent use (while the extra Defense will help against common, mid-tier physical Pokemon like Scarfgon). The Wifi metagame is fragmented so it'll likely have more NP PoryZ and NP Togekiss - but probably not enough to be a major problem.

And although Hippowdon and Spiritomb can handle SDLuke fairly well, I believe SDScizor will give you trouble, especially if you're only bluffing WoW. Skarmory is your best answer and a +2 LO'd Superpower will do 66.5% - 78.4%. Hippo/Vappy/Tomb all take a crapton of damage from +2 Bug Bite and Forry is setup bait.

I actually have Resttalk/Roar Gyara on my team instead of Skarmory to help check SD Scizor/Luke. If you make that substitution, you'd have to move Spikes to Forry and lose Toxic Spikes or Pain Split or Payback.

If you take out Toxic Spikes, you'll probably have a tougher time with set-up sweepers. CM Celebi/Raikou are kinda rare on Wifi though. DDTar is checked by Hippowdon (if no Aqua Tail) and the rest of the notable OU setup sweepers are immune to Toxic Spikes anyway (Latias, Gyarados, Salamence, etc.)

If you take out Pain Split, Forry can only heal with Wish from Vappy. Remember that without Skarmory, Forry is your only Steel (aka Dragon resist, Dark resist).

If you take out Payback, you'd have to rely on Toxic Spikes against opposing spin blockers. At least on Wifi, you won't be seeing Rotom-A. So if you can Pursuit trap Gengar with Spiritomb, all other Ghosts are susceptible to Toxic Spikes. But if somebody runs a Rest(talk) Ghost, your Forry is shit out of luck.

So basically, pick your poison. <_<

 

[Lightsabre]

OK, so either I lose to stuff like Cro Cune, Ghosts will be able to stop my spinning, or I need to guarantee that Vappy will be able to heal Forry. Not something that I would enjoy, but SD scizor did run me over in a previous battle(right after that battle I read your rate and I'm thinking, "don't I know it."

So an option is to replace my Vapporeon for an impish/jolly(if I can find one) Jirachi with

wish
thunder punch
fire punch
iron head/ice punch/protect/trick

would this work? I lose my immunity to water, but I keep my ice resistance. I don't really know, because on the other hand Gyara can now wreck my team since I can't outspeed it after a DD. Mance also will start causing me a lot of grief, which is a huge problem. is there any other option. I'll switch to Gyara if I need to, but I'll lose something no matter what. also, if I replace Skarm with bulky gyara, who should I lead with? and should I keep Sand Storm with only 2 resistances?

 

[Setsuna]

Responding to your PM.

You have already received a lot of comments, and I don't wanna get confused with the current status of the team, so I'm gonna take the team as: Skarmory - Hippowdon - Blissey - Vaporeon - Spiritomb - Forretress.

After analyzing, the first thing I can say is that that combo Skarm+Forry isn't really working for the team, I mean, they both have similar functions, as they are better physical walls than special, weak to fire type, etc. So I think this is the weakest link of the team, and seeing that it is focused to the heavy stall side, I want you to remove Skarmory, move Hippowdon to the lead position, and add Calm Mind Latias:

Latias @ Leftovers
Timid nature.
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spd
- Calm Mind
- Dragon Pulse
- Surf
- Recover

Vaporeon is doing three things for the team: supporting with Wish, countering DD Gyarados, covering MixApe. Against a semi-stall team using Infernape and Gyarados with entry hazards, or simply an offensive team with both of them, Vaporeon will eventually get reduced because of the hits that it needs to take in order to protect your team of those sweepers. Now, adding Latias means you have a powerful sweeper, that paired with entry hazards becomes even more dangerous, and it also helps Vaporeon to stop Infernape and hit Gyarados for a reasonable damage.
In my opinion, in this stall team a sweeper like Latias, which offers not only the possibility of sweeping the opponents team but also covers some important threats and revenge kill others. Try it out.

And we have Hippowdon in the lead position with the same moveset/spread, and with Skarm gone Forretress needs a small change: Spikes over Pain Split, definitely needed and I think don't need to explain why.

One last thing, you are kind of weak to SD Lucario. The only possibility you have is Hippowdon that after some minor hits it's gonna get KOed by a +2 CC. The only answer I see without twisting the team is Spiritomb, but you need a more efficient spread to stand up in front of Luke. Use this:

Calm | 252 HP / 140 Def / 116 SpD
Shadow Ball | Will-o-Wisp/HP Fighting | Sleep Talk | Rest

This set means a problem for SD Lucario either with WoW or Hidden Power, and that's exactly what you need besides of a status absorber.

Hope to have helped.

 

[hobo bob]

A word of advice: if you havent started making your team, then stop. Have you ever played Stall on Wi-Fi? It is one of the most painful experiences a human can go through. Even on Shoddy a stall team can take a while, God forbid two stall teams against each other. I should know I used to play Hailstall on Wi-fi...most the time people ragequit after 10 turns of trying to get through Walrein. While it may sound fun to piss off your opponent and win most of your matches, it isnt worth it. After a while you just look forward to a normal fight without someone quitting early, or one that will last 30 minutes.
*end rant*

Also I second Sucker Punch on Spiritomb. Unless you are paranoid about Gyra you can run HP electric over Ice beam. Otherwise stick with ice to take down the dragons.

 

[Lightsabre]

Responding to your PM.

You have already received a lot of comments, and I don't wanna get confused with the current status of the team, so I'm gonna take the team as: Skarmory - Hippowdon - Blissey - Vaporeon - Spiritomb - Forretress.

After analyzing, the first thing I can say is that that combo Skarm+Forry isn't really working for the team, I mean, they both have similar functions, as they are better physical walls than special, weak to fire type, etc. So I think this is the weakest link of the team, and seeing that it is focused to the heavy stall side, I want you to remove Skarmory, move Hippowdon to the lead position, and add Calm Mind Latias:

Latias @ Leftovers
Timid nature.
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spd
- Calm Mind
- Dragon Pulse
- Surf
- Recover

Vaporeon is doing three things for the team: supporting with Wish, countering DD Gyarados, covering MixApe. Against a semi-stall team using Infernape and Gyarados with entry hazards, or simply an offensive team with both of them, Vaporeon will eventually get reduced because of the hits that it needs to take in order to protect your team of those sweepers. Now, adding Latias means you have a powerful sweeper, that paired with entry hazards becomes even more dangerous, and it also helps Vaporeon to stop Infernape and hit Gyarados for a reasonable damage.
In my opinion, in this stall team a sweeper like Latias, which offers not only the possibility of sweeping the opponents team but also covers some important threats and revenge kill others. Try it out.

Will do. thanks for the tip

And we have Hippowdon in the lead position with the same moveset/spread, and with Skarm gone Forretress needs a small change: Spikes over Pain Split, definitely needed and I think don't need to explain why.

That could work. I'll give it a shot. at least Vappy can switch into the fire type moves that are coming his was, and then wish pass back to him.

One last thing, you are kind of weak to SD Lucario. The only possibility you have is Hippowdon that after some minor hits it's gonna get KOed by a +2 CC. The only answer I see without twisting the team is Spiritomb, but you need a more efficient spread to stand up in front of Luke. Use this:

Calm | 252 HP / 140 Def / 116 SpD
Shadow Ball | Will-o-Wisp/HP Fighting | Sleep Talk | Rest

This set means a problem for SD Lucario either with WoW or Hidden Power, and that's exactly what you need besides of a status absorber.

I can see what you're talking about. I'll try to grab a calm variant. I'll update the first post with these changes

Hope to have helped.

and Hobo Bobo-I've made it, and I enjoy it. I mostly use it on my little brother, but I have fun with it. and I haven't run into quiters yet

I also need some advice on

A) switching Hippo for Gliscor. YES? NO?
B) taking on trickers. what should I use to help?