No, it's for Meowscarada, the council got tired of seeing her ugly ass
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Metagame SV OU Metagame Discussion
- Thread starter TPP
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Same as always
50+ games, gxe of 70+ or was it 80+...?
What happened toanyways? It had a big popularity spike and it seemed like it might become OU, but then it just plummeted and was never seen of again. It seems like a half decent ww counter as well.
Ever since he lost some of his tools, he became kind of underwhelming and he has too many checks or counters in OU in the likes of Meows, Gren, Gholdy, Roaring, Gambit, Pult, etc. At least he's doing decently in UU rn, he got better luck than his Bro.
80 GXE min. scaled from 30-50+ games
I’m on phone rn, but you can find it in other suspect OPs
I’m on phone rn, but you can find it in other suspect OPs
Ah, thanks Finch. As per usual, an extremely high ceiling but plausibly doable.
Lot of newer players getting reqs inflated our numbers so far, especially during the first test. As always, feel free to shoot me a PM if you need any help or have any questions. Happy to help people with reqs strategies when I have spare time.
The only help I got was "if you drop a game pre 20 wins, just reset" which makes me feel bad due to flood PS with dead accounts.
That's wild advice, a better measurement to follow is ideally not try to drop any games before 10 wins, and if you reach 20 wins try not to stack up more than 3 losses, and just go from there.
The best advice I can give you is, know when to give up, unironically many people have been banned or warned due to the absurd levels of salt, farming a dead account just to get a bad matchup or a bad day is unlucky, trying to get reqs on a mon that you didn't even wanted its also annoying, just take it easy
Many people will be in their position as you, so if you see something like "OUWW 1LDK" and he has 5 garganacls and 1 chesnaught, and you lose, then at least know it wasn't personal
Nah, I wasn't like that when I was getting reqs for last vote. I won't be like that this time either. I know I'm a... Well, I hesitate to say bad player, but I'd say below average. Between my main and alt, I average around 1400 rating, 57.85 GXE, and a registered lifetime WL of 184/139 (56.97%).
In the team builder, I'm pretty good. In play, I am not good at all.
Hey. Its important to remember there's not a cheat code to get reqs. Not a particular team, a particular hour to play, early on the suspect or late. Even advice like "you gotta go 20-0" may come from a place of privilege. Here are some things you can try
- Try looking up what others are doing! Whle there is not a team that will get you reqs for free, a fair bit of people post the teams they used in the suspect thread, the identification thread, or other places such as the RMT subforum. I myself got reqs for the first time with a team I found in the Zamazenta suspect thread.
- Don't overdo yourself! This doesn't mean "give up if you dont get it on your first 3 runs", but rather know that Pokemon, just like any other activity, isn't healthy on super heavy amounts. So please don't play 100 games in one sitting. Tons of people get reqs playing just a few games per day until they reach it.
- Have someone you can trust/vent to. Sometimes reqs can be frustrating and we need someone to tell us we can still do it or that yes we lost cause we got unlucky. I know Fusien got me through one of my runs so s/o to him. I would really recommend a close friend instead of posting your frustrations in forums or ou chat (still ask for advice in those places though!)
It might seem controvertial suspecting revival blessing at this moment but I respect the council decision on finally addressing something a part of the community has been asking for a while.
Now talking seriously besides the obvious need of sun to exploit all of its potential, Wake's main issue in my opinion is that it wants to get both, speed and sp. attack boost from proto to be what everyone was fearing it could be the day it got revealed, unlike Chi-Yu who could get away with just running a choice scarf.
Proto speed might limit the options to revenge kill it but even it struggles a lot to break fat cores if played well and can be taken down with priority and hazards, while proto sp. attack sometimes is even a dead weight in some match ups vs offense because either gets outspeeded and gets OHKO or can't get into the field easily (this particularly hurts a lot because of the sun turns being a huge factor on Wake's momentum).
That lack of consistency is what makes me think that the council did the right call not quick banning it since a suspect test will give more time to see how the meta develops with wake on it because in practice Wake doesn't feel like the bane of OU like we thought it would be.
Ironically, I see a lot more people now turning pro-ban. Initially many serious players thought Wake was overrated. But over time I see more and more people finding it unhealthy for the meta.
I didn't know how it'd be until I played with it.
Then I played with it.
And it's a total monster, in and out of Sun. Sun just exacerbates it. As much fun of a toy as it is for me, I know it isn't good for the overall health of the game, so I'm fine with being in the pro-ban boat.
That is why I agree with the suspect, Wake is a mon that is good, but in my experience playing with it and against it, feels kinda inconsistent and feel like I still need to see more optimized teams with it and counterplay against it.
To add something more, taunt Hydreigon is an amazing partner for Wake's since it eats the common defensive answers to it, Cloud and Pex in particular can't do anything to the Hydra.
On the topic of Reqs:
The Chien-Pao suspect was my first attempt at Reqs, and I was able to push myself up from a 68 GXE ceiling on my first attempt to a 76 GXE ceiling on my third attempt. I didn't get them in the end, but I saw enough improvement in my ratings that I think it's worth sharing what helped me.
1. Make sure your team is rock-solid. To get from 1000 to the 1700ish you'll need for Reqs, you're going to see every different type of team. You really can't afford to lose on team preview to anything common if you want a realistic chance. If you're already getting caught out low ladder by certain archetypes or individual pokemon, make appropriate changes to your team or strategy. There's no shame in using Meta pokemon or those top of the usage list. This is a tough Meta and you really can't afford to be carrying any passengers. If you're struggling to build a team, there's nothing wrong with using someone else's team.
2. Appreciate that you likely won't win every game and try not to get tilted. Sometimes you get frozen by Ice Beam and stay frozen 5 turns in a row. It happens. Sometimes you miss a Draco Meteor and it costs you the game. It is what it is. Being able to differentiate between losing due to hax (which happens!) and losing because of a team-building issue or because of a misplay is a crucial skill. Don't throw your entire team away because of a loss. However, if you lose 3/4 in a row the same way, that might be a team-building issue that you can fix.
3. Going back and watching your own replays of wins and losses is going to help you to see things you've done well or poorly and will allow you to improve your game. The more of your own replays you watch, you'll start to pick up on the things that you do subconsciously. This will help if you've got any bad habits that you might not be consciously aware of.
4. Play slowly, and take care of your GXE. It's going to go up more quickly the more games you win in a row. If you lose, don't rush straight back into a new game. Watch the replay, see where things went wrong, and try to determine if you lost due to misplays, team-building, or something else. If you notice that you keep losing because of the same thing, this will help you identify the issue, and there's a wealth of knowledge on this forum, youtube, etc. relating to how to fix that issue.
5. Try to make achievable progress. By that I mean, if you're a consistent 50 GXE player, the harsh truth is you're probably not going to get Reqs. BUT, that doesn't mean you can't try, and it doesn't mean you can't improve. If you're at 50, try to set yourself a target of 60 GXE, and use the tips in this thread to achieve that. If you're at 60, aim for 65, and so on and so forth. 80 GXE is objectively hard to reach and there's a reason the majority of the playerbase won't hit it.
The Chien-Pao suspect was my first attempt at Reqs, and I was able to push myself up from a 68 GXE ceiling on my first attempt to a 76 GXE ceiling on my third attempt. I didn't get them in the end, but I saw enough improvement in my ratings that I think it's worth sharing what helped me.
1. Make sure your team is rock-solid. To get from 1000 to the 1700ish you'll need for Reqs, you're going to see every different type of team. You really can't afford to lose on team preview to anything common if you want a realistic chance. If you're already getting caught out low ladder by certain archetypes or individual pokemon, make appropriate changes to your team or strategy. There's no shame in using Meta pokemon or those top of the usage list. This is a tough Meta and you really can't afford to be carrying any passengers. If you're struggling to build a team, there's nothing wrong with using someone else's team.
2. Appreciate that you likely won't win every game and try not to get tilted. Sometimes you get frozen by Ice Beam and stay frozen 5 turns in a row. It happens. Sometimes you miss a Draco Meteor and it costs you the game. It is what it is. Being able to differentiate between losing due to hax (which happens!) and losing because of a team-building issue or because of a misplay is a crucial skill. Don't throw your entire team away because of a loss. However, if you lose 3/4 in a row the same way, that might be a team-building issue that you can fix.
3. Going back and watching your own replays of wins and losses is going to help you to see things you've done well or poorly and will allow you to improve your game. The more of your own replays you watch, you'll start to pick up on the things that you do subconsciously. This will help if you've got any bad habits that you might not be consciously aware of.
4. Play slowly, and take care of your GXE. It's going to go up more quickly the more games you win in a row. If you lose, don't rush straight back into a new game. Watch the replay, see where things went wrong, and try to determine if you lost due to misplays, team-building, or something else. If you notice that you keep losing because of the same thing, this will help you identify the issue, and there's a wealth of knowledge on this forum, youtube, etc. relating to how to fix that issue.
5. Try to make achievable progress. By that I mean, if you're a consistent 50 GXE player, the harsh truth is you're probably not going to get Reqs. BUT, that doesn't mean you can't try, and it doesn't mean you can't improve. If you're at 50, try to set yourself a target of 60 GXE, and use the tips in this thread to achieve that. If you're at 60, aim for 65, and so on and so forth. 80 GXE is objectively hard to reach and there's a reason the majority of the playerbase won't hit it.
Meanwhile, residential memelord Joey "PokeAimMD" Whateverhislastnameis, out here getting Ws on the daily with random crap.
But in all seriousness, I'm actually sitting here trying to build a different Sun team style with Wake for the reqs grinding, but it's being wonky. I still have the old team, but I wanted something different. Such a shame that having Wake and Moon on the same team just opens you up for a whole can of whoop-ass when it comes to opposing Dragons and Fairies.
Meanwhile, residential memelord Joey "PokeAimMD" Whateverhislastnameis, out here getting Ws on the daily with random crap.
But in all seriousness, I'm actually sitting here trying to build a different Sun team style with Wake for the reqs grinding, but it's being wonky. I still have the old team, but I wanted something different. Such a shame that having Wake and Moon on the same team just opens you up for a whole can of whoop-ass when it comes to opposing Dragons and Fairies.
lol this reminds me of a good 6th point to add:
6. Don't compare yourself to content creators. Just because somebody else can win with meme pokemon, it doesn't make you any worse for not being able to do it too. That being said, I do think he's a good resource. From the videos that I've seen, he talks through his thought processes really well and his teams are usually solid.
Yeah, I know. It's just an interesting thing that he can meme about and then there's me who actually tries with building and then can't win.
Edit: Tonight is really not my night. Watching myself lose game after game is just making me depressed. Maybe I won't go for reqs after all.
Double edit: Yeah, I'm done with this. Even with my ol' reliable Gren team, I can't win for shit tonight. I'm going to give up on going after reqs before it even starts. I'm not good enough for it, and never will be. Good luck to those who want to go for it.
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The "just adapt bro" argument is almost always followed by a lack of suggestions as you demonstrate, but also what adaptations there have been are either teams hurrying to fit fat Regen spdef walls+second resist, or overly specific mons like Azu (who frankly isn't all that great anyways) of spdef RotomW (which wasn't really common at all prior to WW entering the meta).
It's not necessarily quick ban worthy, but its appearance has flipped the meta on its head in a matter of days and has very much impacted building quite significantly. At the least, it is suspect worthy.
Also calling proto spam "cheap" is really goofy. There's nothing cheap about sun teams, and they were at least more balanced prior to WW.
Hisui Zoroark gets Trick. This mon is better and better the more I use it. Think of All the wake Diskussion, do you people realize how quickly Teams crumble if Blissey or Clodsire get tricked?
Also Scarf H-Zoroark has a nice speedtier aswell. You can catch Meowscarada aswell.
I just need to think of the best tera type for it as Normal or Ghost are bad. Has anybody tried Tera Fairy?
Also Scarf H-Zoroark has a nice speedtier aswell. You can catch Meowscarada aswell.
I just need to think of the best tera type for it as Normal or Ghost are bad. Has anybody tried Tera Fairy?
Hyper Offense/Heavy Offense - You don't really need much for walking wake, you can easily out offense and HO usually has 1 fairy and 1 water resistant mon.
Ex.: Iron Valiant + Meow, Iron Valiant + Dnite, Grimmsnarl + Roaring Moon, Meowscarada + Fairy Iron Moth, Gholdengo + Roaring moon
Bulky Offense - Harder to fit and is the playstyle Walking Wake destroys most, but i find just a spdef water + a fairy type mon or tera works, or just a fat steel.
Ex.: Toxapex + Fairy Garg, Corviknight + Rotom Wash, Iron Valiant + Rotom Wash, Slowking
Balance - You usually have 4 fats 2 generalist, so u have a lot of options for anti wake techs.
Ex.: toxapex + corviknight, Clodsire + Iron valiant, gastrodon + steel.
Stall - well... blissey clod hatt and so much more, walking wake is not gonna break stall, you can prob ask Highv0ltag3 for specific anti wake techs since he is 2100 with stall rn.
Hypothetical iron leaves choice band set in electric terrain sounds scary asf, seeing as you basically don’t need prediction, assuming the opponents dark types are all KOd
check out this calc:
252 Atk Choice Band Quark Drive Tera Psychic Iron Leaves Psyblade (120 BP) vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Corviknight in Electric Terrain: 178-210 (44.6 - 52.6%) -- 82.4% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
After SR, it’s 2HKOing one of the most sturdy resists in OU.
defensive gholdengo is 2hko‘d whilst scarf variants need to be over 90% to have a chance of switching in.
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got the idea from seeing the potency of Tera psychic iron moth threading the needle through teams if one significant check is KOd. Basically common slower switch ins like toxapex, clodsire, rotom can’t reliably force it out anymore once they switched in. Faster ones like dragapult get 1 switchin, max.
check out this calc:
252 Atk Choice Band Quark Drive Tera Psychic Iron Leaves Psyblade (120 BP) vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Corviknight in Electric Terrain: 178-210 (44.6 - 52.6%) -- 82.4% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
After SR, it’s 2HKOing one of the most sturdy resists in OU.
defensive gholdengo is 2hko‘d whilst scarf variants need to be over 90% to have a chance of switching in.
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got the idea from seeing the potency of Tera psychic iron moth threading the needle through teams if one significant check is KOd. Basically common slower switch ins like toxapex, clodsire, rotom can’t reliably force it out anymore once they switched in. Faster ones like dragapult get 1 switchin, max.
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I've been using Tera Electric in E-Terrain and the issue is that most teams have either a Dark-Type like Meow, Ting-Lu, Kingambit, etc. in the back, forcing you to go for hard reads to KO them + some tertiary mons like Scarf Gholdengo or Dragapult that will force it out and lead to Electric-Terrain turns being wasted. So far, I've found Iron Valiant and even Iron Jugulis to be the much stronger Pokemon in E-Terrain. Tera Psychc Psyblade might be the way though. The move is strong af already, 2HKOing Gholdengo in E-Terrain w/o Tera and the fact that it 2HKOes Corv means you don't really need to predict or even run Wild Charge, which is pretty fire.
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