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Pokémon Talonflame

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This thing is the bane of my team. Often I end up sacrificing Ferrothorn, switching in on Brave Bird and then eating Flare Blitz so that they'll bite it on Iron Barbs and the Rocky Helmet I have equipped, + recoil and potential Life Orb damage. Stealth Rock helps a bit, but they usually just Roost off the damage from that. If they can survive a Brave Bird, my Tentacruel or the surprise factor of my Clefable can check it to some degree. If Talonflame gets a boost, the match is pretty much over for me. Eventually the Talonflame will faint under recoil, but by then half my team is usually gone.

If I could get a Rock Blast off from either Cloyster or Heracross, it would be a lot easier, but Gale Wings makes finding an opening difficult and Heracross has that glaring 4x Flying weakness.
 
greybob said:
This thing is the bane of my team. Often I end up sacrificing Ferrothorn, switching in on Brave Bird and then eating Flare Blitz so that they'll bite it on Iron Barbs and the Rocky Helmet I have equipped, + recoil and potential Life Orb damage. Stealth Rock helps a bit, but they usually just Roost off the damage from that. If they can survive a Brave Bird, my Tentacruel or the surprise factor of my Clefable can check it to some degree. If Talonflame gets a boost, the match is pretty much over for me. Eventually the Talonflame will faint under recoil, but by then half my team is usually gone.

If I could get a Rock Blast off from either Cloyster or Heracross, it would be a lot easier, but Gale Wings makes finding an opening difficult and Heracross has that glaring 4x Flying weakness.
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You're probably aware of this and you're likely just venting, but the problem is with your team design, not with Talonflame itself. There are plenty of viable checks and counters (cf. M-Kangaskhan) to Talonflame and if you're not running any of them, you quite frankly deserve to be wrecked by it. Try incorporating Rotom-W/H, Tyranitar, Landorus-T, Heatran, Almost any rock type etc, heck even mons like Mega-Mawile put Talonflame in a bit of a pickle, threatening to KO with Sucker Punch while being unable to be KO'd by Bravebird.
 
JustLetMePlay said:
You're probably aware of this and you're likely just venting, but the problem is with your team design, not with Talonflame itself. There are plenty of viable checks and counters (cf. M-Kangaskhan) to Talonflame and if you're not running any of them, you quite frankly deserve to be wrecked by it. Try incorporating Rotom-W/H, Tyranitar, Landorus-T, Heatran, Almost any rock type etc, heck even mons like Mega-Mawile put Talonflame in a bit of a pickle, threatening to KO with Sucker Punch while being unable to be KO'd by Bravebird.
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The only problem with using sucker punch with mawile to hit talonflame is that its priority brave bird overrides it. Play rough is a 2HKO so if you catch it on the switch lots of mind games can occur.

252+ Atk Huge Power Mega Mawile Play Rough vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Talonflame: 183-216 (61.4 - 72.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Of course you can always switch out to your talonflame counter but who's to say your opponent isn't thinking the same thing?
 
BSMEforme said:
The only problem with using sucker punch with mawile to hit talonflame is that its priority brave bird overrides it. Play rough is a 2HKO so if you catch it on the switch lots of mind games can occur.

252+ Atk Huge Power Mega Mawile Play Rough vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Talonflame: 183-216 (61.4 - 72.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Of course you can always switch out to your talonflame counter but who's to say your opponent isn't thinking the same thing?
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Yes, I wasn't trying to tout M-Mawile as an answer to Talonflame, but rather it's a mon that you might think fairs badly when in reality it does... okay.
 
mizore_s said:
People needs to stop thinking in OU Pokemons to counter Talonflame. Most of his counters are in UU or below.
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I think Rotom-W is a pretty decent counter. The other one with the same typing being Lanturn, even though I love it and has amazing HP, it fall short in the def and s.atk department.
 
mizore_s said:
People needs to stop thinking in OU Pokemons to counter Talonflame. Most of his counters are in UU or below.
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Rotom- W, tyranitar, defensive gyarados, and hippowdon are pretty solid OU counters. Lots of things can revenge kill or check him too like garchomp, extreme speed lucario and Dragonite
 
I find Stealth Rocks to be the main counter to Talonflame, as it is forced to Roost on switch or risk and perform an almost suicide Brave Bird. One thing is for sure, it completely destroys Choice Band Talonflame, rending its usefulness to just KO or badly hurt one pokemon that doesn't resist flying (scenerio without a Wish support on the team).

I think a Rapid Spinner or Defog...er (?) must be always on mind when using Talonflame on a team.
 
kizux said:
I think Rotom-W is a pretty decent counter. The other one with the same typing being Lanturn, even though I love it and has amazing HP, it fall short in the def and s.atk department.
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Physically defensive rotom W is fantastic counter, especially if you're rocking rest. Rotom can eat up literally anything Talonflame decides to go for.
 
DudeBro420 said:
I cannot fathom why people are honestly considering a defensive set and are excited about priority Roost. Talonflame has arguably one of the worst defensive typings in the game, terrible defensive stats, and loses half of his HP on entry.
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And by worst defensive typing in the game, you mean one that can switch-in on Bug, Fighting, Ground, Steel, Grass, Fairy, and Fire moves? Those are some of the most common attacking types in OU. Heatran, Scizor, Breloom, and Fairies in general are completely walled. I realize this is an old post, but you seriously can't think that Fire/Flying is the worst defensive typing. 78/70/70 isn't anything to sneeze at, it's only a few points weaker than Politoed on the physical side (with priority instant-recovery). A weakness to SR doesn't = unusable, especially with how little SR users there are, and how amazing defog is.

Worst Typing Candidates:
Rock/Ice? Yes.
Fire/Flying? No.
 
Not sure if this has been mentioned but Natures Gift with a Liechi Berry(sp?) (80pow grass) on adamant talonflame +2 near almost 1hit kos Rotom washer and a number of other talonflame counters with rocks. Most teams will switch in rotom the moment talonflame appears giving the SD chance. Plus talonflame likes to self own itself activating clutch berries a fair amount for an atp boost and Acrobatic sets enjoy loss of item.
 
Coddy:) said:
Not sure if this has been mentioned but Natures Gift with a Liechi Berry(sp?) (80pow grass) on adamant talonflame +2 near almost 1hit kos Rotom washer and a number of other talonflame counters with rocks. Most teams will switch in rotom the moment talonflame appears giving the SD chance. Plus talonflame likes to self own itself activating clutch berries a fair amount for an atp boost and Acrobatic sets enjoy loss of item.
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I prefer the salac berry, if you're going the way of natural gift, as it ohko's tyranitar.
 
Coddy:) said:
snip Natures Giftsnip
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Actually I read in the research thread that salac/liechi berry now give 100bp natural gift. So i guess its somewhat more appealing. It just would have been so much more amazing if natural gift used the same mechanics as belch.
 
Physically defensive Mandibuzz, physically defensive Slowbro, and Heatran can all check Talonflame as well and either force it out, or make it faint itself from recoil.
 
SnoopysWorld said:
Physically defensive Mandibuzz, physically defensive Slowbro, and Heatran can all check Talonflame as well and either force it out, or make it faint itself from recoil.
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Actually Heatran would need Ancientpower to fully check Talonflame, otherwise boosting variants with Roost could potentially overcome it. Bulk Up Talonflames can also boost up enough to overwhelm Mandibuzz while taking Foul Plays and keeping Mandi from doing much else by using Taunt.
 
Aegislash and excadrill aside, I'm starting to wonder if flare blitz is worth it over fire blast. You don't need any investment to nab the 2hkos and ohkos on steel types like skarmory, ferrothorn, scizor, and forretress with an adamant nature. And you don't needlessly whittle your hp either. I get why banded sets run flare blitz, but I don't really think it's worth it on anything else. You end up suiciding into something when you could have just kept talonflame alive and threatened more of your opponent's team.
 
Punchshroom said:
Actually Heatran would need Ancientpower to fully check Talonflame, otherwise boosting variants with Roost could potentially overcome it. Bulk Up Talonflames can also boost up enough to overwhelm Mandibuzz while taking Foul Plays and keeping Mandi from doing much else by using Taunt.
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He doesn't need Ancientpower, just Toxic.
 
SmashBrosBrawl said:
Notice how he mentioned taunt. Case in point, you need ancientpower if you want to have any chance against bulk up talonflame.
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So your set is Taunt/Bulk Up/Brave Bird/Flare Blitz? Heatran can beat that with just fire moves.

Inb4 you come up with some totally unreasonable set that beats Heatran but is sub-par against everything else.
 
Now that Kangaskhan is banned should we fall back on CB Talonflame's speed EV's to 132 (formerly 164).

Or are their other switch-ins to outspeed to burn with Will-O-Wisp / priority to outspeed with Brave Bird?
 
TKGriffiths said:
So your set is Taunt/Bulk Up/Brave Bird/Flare Blitz? Heatran can beat that with just fire moves.

Inb4 you come up with some totally unreasonable set that beats Heatran but is sub-par against everything else.
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The set has roost instead of flare blitz and please tell me how is toxic heatran beating that set when it can just taunt it and setup in its face.
 
thelandlordsmm said:
208 speed EVs allow you to outspeed Jolly Mega Pinsir's Quick Attack
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Thanks. Sounds good.

Time to test some 50 HP / 252 Atk / 208 Spe CB Talonflame goodness.

SmashBrosBrawl said:
The set has roost instead of flare blitz and please tell me how is toxic heatran beating that set when it can just taunt it and setup in its face.
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If they are running Ancient Power.
 
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