Terrakion

[tehy]

I don't think anyone in their right mind would switch a scarfed latios into a dragonite or salamence... It's called revenge-killing. If you KNOW i am Np'ing, or HP firing, then obviously you're going to have to risk coming in. As for how i know;i may not. But there are situations in which it would be revealed.Also, if it becomes standard, i can mostly start assuming such.

 

[alphatron]

I already use slowbro on my sun team. I don't bother with defensive tangrowth because it is 2hko'd by cb terrakion after rocks and doesn't resist a single one of its attacks, allowing the opponent to spam attacks as you switch in in hopes for the high damage roll. Tangrowth is great against landorus, but he sucks vs. banded terrakion when you don't want to lose a Pokemon.

Hippowdon is in the same boat when it comes to stealth rock and close combat's high damage rolls screwing him over. On top of this, he doesn't have regenerator.

 

[tehy]

Not sure if anyone's mentioned this;but what about;say; bulky resttalk golurk?

Okay; you had. Balls.

Still; if you have something like defensive tangrowth and someone to take the other attacks(Donphan can take stone edges AND spin rocks), then defensive tangrowth helps.

Also;what about torterra? Can it tank 2 cc;s?

 

[andysensei]

Terrakion's only true counter besides Golurk, is stone edge's miss rate tbh.

 

[tehy]

What about a defensive chlorophyll synthesis tangrowth in the sun? Enough speed to outspeed timid band/adamant band;enough defense to recover, and of course power whip for the ohko. I assume most of your problems with him come out of sun; but if not try it out.

 

[Vein]

I'm using RestTalking Milotic as my only counter to Terrakion in my team. When I see Terrakion, I usually Rest to activate Marvel Scale (huge increase in Def) to tank CC and Stone Edge. Then I Sleep Talk to either Scald (super-effective + burn) or phaze with Dragon Tail. But, this gets screwed when Sleep Talk select Rest over Scald/Dragon Tail.

 

[alphatron]

What about a defensive chlorophyll synthesis tangrowth in the sun? Enough speed to outspeed timid band/adamant band;enough defense to recover, and of course power whip for the ohko. I assume most of your problems with him come out of sun; but if not try it out.

I don't have many issues with terrakion on sun tea,s thanks to cresselia being awesome, volcorona killing the banded variants, and my opponent using x-scissor against heatran because they're scared that cresselia will switch in. It's other teams that I have trouble with him on. I haven't tried a speedy defensive tangrowth due to him being so crippingly slow even with chlorophyll, but this is worth a try if I'm able to outspend him.

Torterra isn't bulky enough to stand up to two banded close combats. He's quite the unfortunate Pokemon, since I'd use a growth Torterra if he actually got chlorophyll.

 

[NoUserName]

Physically defensive Nidoqueen is also a counter, taking the fact that Terrakion never carries EQ, since it does not need it for coverage.

But if Terrakion is holding Air Baloon, it could SD in the face of Nidoqueen. At least Nidoqueen can Roar it away.

 

[Shurtugal]

The best way to hit Sub Terrakion is to get 2 layers of TS before it comes in. A little rapid spin support, and Sub Terrakion is deadly.

It is walled by a few things however, but usually a team carries the standard threats to Terrakion; "Scizor", "Gliscor", "T-Waver's", "Rotom-W whom is scarf", "Garyados"

Lets see....

Scizor<Sub
Gliscor<Sub + SD
T-Wave<Sub
Scarf Pokemon<Sub
Garyados<Sub [Stone Edge?]

Sure, you might say Garados is a bad counter, but with Intimidate, bounce, and substitute, its really annoying for the standard Terrakion.

There are a few, but these are usually what is ran to check/counter Terrakion, and this set just can do so much shit to them.

Psychic types do become a problem, which is why Scizor is an ideal partner [BP on Lati@s], as when you make sets, as I often see on Smogon Analysis, there are reccommended support.

Scizor + Hazards + Wish are like god support for Sub Terrakion, thought I would mention it :)

 

[New World Order]

I do think that Tyranitar is probably the most helpful teammate for SubSD Terrakion. Not only is it the bane of Psychic-types, it also sets up Sandstorm to up Terrakion's Special Defense, making Substitute even deadlier.

 

[Pocket]

I've been using Stealth Rock + Spikes support with SubSD Terrakion. Terrakion forces so many switches that it can easily wear down its would-be counters with hazards damage, and just whale away at the opponent's teams. Many offensive teams rely on checking Terrakion rather than countering it, so a well-timed Substitute can easily mean taking out 2 mons or even a clean sweep.

 

[UltiMario]

Decided to bump this thread to say that SubSD Terrakion is a force of nature. I would go as far as saying its the best physical sweeper in the metagame, ahead of Dragonite, Haxorus, Landorus, and all the other competitors for the title. First and foremost, Substitute protects Terrakion from random status moves, and gives it a much easier time setting up. It also eases prediction should you anticipate your opponent switching out. Finally, it provides a buffer against potential revenge killers such as Scizor, Scarf Terrakion, and the like. As they waste a turn breaking the Sub, Terrakion breaks them with a Close Combat or Stone Edge.

Man I look away from the Metagame for like 2 weeks and this pops up.

The only time I've ever used Terrakion, since even day 1, was SubSD with Sandstorm support.

SubSD is as scary as all fuck, especially back when the set was basically non-existant and a complete surprise to those trying to status it. I'd argue it's the easiest Terrakion set to run, it's generally the safest to set up with, and the hardest to take down when its sweeping. I think I ran Jolly, Leftovers SubSD to get the most life I could out of it. Even that hits just so absolutely hard.

 

[Agent Gibbs]

I've tried the SubSD set on a Sandstorm team a little while back, and I really like it. Having the chance to OHKO standard Gliscor at +2 and with the Rock Gem (guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock, provided Scor's Toxic Orb has not activated yet) is pretty awesome. Personally, though, I like the Choice Scarf set the best. I've used it on several teams due to the fact that it checks so many threats with its excellent speed, coverage, and raw power. It's also been a bit easier to use since Excadrill's ban since I don't have to worry about the mole coming in and laughing at Terrakion's speed like he used to.

 

[Razza]

Rock Gem > lefties on sub sd terrakion, nothing screams sub sd like leftovers,and rock gem lets you ohko slowbro, gliscor skarm and stuff, you might wanna go adamant for the guaranteed ohko's

also gliscor is a nice counter to cb terrakion, it needs 2 stone edges to hit get 2 high damage rolls and sr to 2hko you and the adition of the move protect makes youa pretty solid counter.

 

[True]

Ive seen a few SUB-SD terrakions when laddering, subdisable gengar runs over it like nothing.. ( wich in my luck i was carrying at that time) and he is actually really common. Also , people intend to switch in skarmory a lot against any terrakion so skarm comes in when terra uses sub ( -25% hp) , if terrakion sword dances up or attacks the next turn , skarm shrugs it off ( 33.2% - 39.5% with either cc or se) and whirlwinds him out , at worst doing no damage at all to skarm if he used sword dance. If you take these scenarios into account , leftovers is definitely the best item on subsdterra.
Also it deserves a mention that if terrakion uses sub on a poke, the current pokemon will likely to be able to break your sub and make terrakion easily revenged by scarfers or other pokemon. ( i checked smogons OU list and every pokemon in there can break his sub , hell even chansey can use seismic toss). Just pointing out a few flaws.

I think the surprise factor is a big one, people expect terra to be banded or scarfed and are not ready for dealing with him after a sub. Tough when this set gets common and people know its there... its easier to handle it.

 

[alphatron]

The point of using substitute is to use it when you're sure you will force a switch. That's why substitute chandelure is actually effective. You're not supposed to use it under the guise that the enemy pokemon will simply break it...and if chansey and ferrothorn are simply using power whip/seismic toss against you, then you can simply kill them with close combat instead of wasting more hp.

I could easily say that blaziken's biggest flaw is the same thing. He didn't even use
Substitute(though it was good to have over protect at times), so chansey, ferrothorn, Jirachi, and celebi, could use thunder wave. Forretress could simply earthquake him on the turn that he uses sword's dance, etc. Those aren't exactly flaws.

 

[Razza]

Ive seen a few SUB-SD terrakions when laddering, subdisable gengar runs over it like nothing.. ( wich in my luck i was carrying at that time) and he is actually really common. Also , people intend to switch in skarmory a lot against any terrakion so skarm comes in when terra uses sub ( -25% hp) , if terrakion sword dances up or attacks the next turn , skarm shrugs it off ( 33.2% - 39.5% with either cc or se) and whirlwinds him out , at worst doing no damage at all to skarm if he used sword dance. If you take these scenarios into account , leftovers is definitely the best item on subsdterra.
Also it deserves a mention that if terrakion uses sub on a poke, the current pokemon will likely to be able to break your sub and make terrakion easily revenged by scarfers or other pokemon. ( i checked smogons OU list and every pokemon in there can break his sub , hell even chansey can use seismic toss). Just pointing out a few flaws.

I think the surprise factor is a big one, people expect terra to be banded or scarfed and are not ready for dealing with him after a sub. Tough when this set gets common and people know its there... its easier to handle it.

If the opponent has a skarmoury you use swords dance, then ko with a boosted rock gem stone edge. The set functions just like the double dancer does, use swords dance if its a defensive team or they have slowbro or gliscor or mew or such wall, rock gem helps out here, if you are facing an offensive team use substitute then wreck face as most teams rely on scizor to check terrakion which is pretty hard when he is behind a sub,

And no chansey is gonna stay in on terrakion unless the opponent wants to sack it because other key memebers cant switch in on terrakion.

 

[Challenger]

If the opponent has a skarmoury you use swords dance, then ko with a boosted rock gem stone edge. The set functions just like the double dancer does, use swords dance if its a defensive team or they have slowbro or gliscor or mew or such wall, rock gem helps out here, if you are facing an offensive team use substitute then wreck face as most teams rely on scizor to check terrakion which is pretty hard when he is behind a sub,

And no chansey is gonna stay in on terrakion unless the opponent wants to sack it because other key memebers cant switch in on terrakion.

That doesn't really work. Skarmory will Whirlwind Terrakion out on turn one; that's the only smart move, unless you think it's scarfed. Stone Edge's shaky accuracy is the only thing holding Terrakion down, assuming good prediction.

 

[New World Order]

That doesn't really work. Skarmory will Whirlwind Terrakion out on turn one; that's the only smart move, unless you think it's scarfed. Stone Edge's shaky accuracy is the only thing holding Terrakion down, assuming good prediction.

Normally, Terrakion should Swords Dance on turn 1 unless the opponent has no Pokemon that can deal with a Terrakion behind a Substitute. Skarmory can definitely deal with Terrakion without Substitute, so you Swords Dance on turn 1, Close Combat as Skarmory whirlwinds you out/ Brave Birds you or whatever, then finish off Skarmory with whoever came in (+2 Close Combat should put Skarmory into KO range for pretty much anything, Sturdy taken into account). You really don't want to reveal Substitute unless you think the opponent will use Thunder Wave or something, since its a great way to finish off teams that rely on Scizor to deal with +2 Terrakion.

 

[Princess Bubblegum]

I hate to be the guy that bumps an old thread, but this has seriously been bothering me. Why in the world is earthquake the preferred move on this thing for the last slot on a choice set? Exactly what are you hitting, Nidoqueen? I only used Terrakion for a short time, but it seemed that rock slide, while situational, is the better option to hit dragons and Volcanora when you need too, without worrying about missing.

It seems to be the popular option though, so I am most likely missing something big.

 

[NoUserName]

In my case, I prefer Toxic in the Scarf set and Quick Attack in CB set.

If Terrakion could learn SR, I could consider it, since its movepool of choice sets is shadow, really does not need anything bar its STAB and maybe X-Scissor for more PP than Stone Edge and reliability.

 

[doughboy]

I hate to be the guy that bumps an old thread, but this has seriously been bothering me. Why in the world is earthquake the preferred move on this thing for the last slot on a choice set? Exactly what are you hitting, Nidoqueen? I only used Terrakion for a short time, but it seemed that rock slide, while situational, is the better option to hit dragons and Volcanora when you need too, without worrying about missing.

It seems to be the popular option though, so I am most likely missing something big.

I think the reason is for Tentacruel who could potentially live a Stone Edge and do some Protect Shenanigans. Really though Terrakion only needs 2 slots on his Choiced sets AKA his STABS. It's really an indication of how powerful he is and how hard he is to cover.

 

[Shurtugal]

Earthquake hits Jirachi better for starters. It also hits fire mons like ninetails in sun that, even though stone edge also hits, might be more reliable for the KO if you do not want a CC Def drops. If your team can deal with fire, and Jirachi/Metagross, then EQ should not be used. It really depends on what your team struggles with for the last move in that slot.

 

[Agent Gibbs]

I've found that I don't use Earthquake on ScarfTerra too terrible often, but it is nice to have for every once in a while. Sometimes you might just need a move with good coverage/power and more reliability, something that doesn't run a risk of missing like Stone Edge and doesn't drop your defenses like Close Combat, and Earthquake can be that reliable move in a tight spot. Besides, it's not like Terrakion has many other options. I used to run HP Ice on ScarfTerra with a Naive nature to 2HKO Gliscor switchins, but it stopped being worth it after Gliscor dropped in usage last fall. I'll agree that Rock Slide is useful for a better-safe-than-sorry answer to a boosted Volcarona or Salamence, but that 90% accuracy still isn't perfect.

On a side note, I suppose it's kinda nice that Earthquake does pound Nidoqueen into pieces, who otherwise would be a very solid answer to Terrakion in general.

 

[alexwolf]

Everyone here forgot EQ's main target: Toxicroak. Without it you cannot revenge kill the quite threatening SD Toxicroak. If you have a band you can even do crazy things like come in against a bulky Bulk Up Toxicroak as he uses Bulk Up and ohko in the next turn with EQ!