Other The Lack of Power Creep in Gen 6

[Sebasti]

I really hope you're joking about MegaZam. It dies twice as fast as normal Alakazam (no Sash), has marginally more power than normal LO Alakazam, which doesn't make a difference thanks to Magic Guard. Since it loses Magic Guard, MegaZam basically is asking for Scizor to come in, and if Scizor continues to be in 20% of teams, that's not a good number of games you are practically down one mon in. Also it takes about 50% from Breloom's Mach Punch, haha. I'd rather use Mega Heracross, for goodness sakes. And we all know how good that thing is...

MegaZam, only having 65 base defence and 60 hp, takes only 50% from technician stab boosted Mach punch from Breloom, a pokemon who likely has good investment in attack IVs? I'll take that for comparable attacking stats to the special side of Deoxy-A.

Especially when you consider it yoinks any ability on its way in and with 175 base special and outspeeding anything barring the literal top 3 fastest pokemon, I feel like MegaZam is in a much better position to sweep a team than MegaGar is since, as both have general use as revenge killers and neither has a stable way of locking in the opponent upon coming into battle, Zam has the advantage of good coverage and (albeit marginally) better stats for what its purpose is.

Scizor is going to do what, its only option is technician bullet punch and if that doesn't score the kill its as cooked as bacon. Once that's out of the way you'll only be able to depend on any other kind of priority you may have. Just imagine MegaZam stealing some of the abilities that might pop up in ubers... Lord forbid he manages to steal your Speed Boost, Multiscale, Sheer Force, or Sturdy. Or even, say... Shadow Tag. That's one pokemon you don't want to have to switch in to.

 

[rainbowumbreon]

i think this meta is going to completly different to anything we have seen before.two of the most used things in b/w,weather and stealth rocks.These has been nerfed so even 5th gen pokemon are going to be shuken up

there is also a lot less pokemon in this gen and im dlighted game freak didnt just throw high stats into them.Some abilitys are a little tend to a little bit of a power creep but there very few stand out pokemon.I think this might also be related to the lack of legendary pokemon i mean we got 3 at the release of gen V we had 8.

 

[Aasgier]

MegaZam, only having 65 base defence and 60 hp, takes only 50% from technician stab boosted Mach punch from Breloom, a pokemon who likely has good investment in attack IVs? I'll take that for comparable attacking stats to the special side of Deoxy-A.

Taking 50% from a resisted 90 BP move, factoring in Technician as well as STAB, is a way to prove your point. Not.

Especially when you consider it yoinks any ability on its way in and with 175 base special and outspeeding anything barring the literal top 3 fastest pokemon, I feel like MegaZam is in a much better position to sweep a team than MegaGar is since, as both have general use as revenge killers and neither has a stable way of locking in the opponent upon coming into battle, Zam has the advantage of good coverage and (albeit marginally) better stats for what its purpose is.

Not harder to wall than Life Orb Gardevoir, to give an example /w similar power. Ofcourse, MegaZam is twice as fast, but not particularly fearsome if you have non-resisted Priority to throw at it, and even Mach Punches have a tendency to do damage that cannot be ignored.

Talking about Gardevoir, that's something else that can tank everything MegaZam can throw at it and OHKO back /w Shadow Ball/Signal Beam, with or without Mega. Garde can't switch in though, but it is a check, and even in NU there are already dozens of checks to MegaZam.
Also Drapion/Skuntank both completely screw MegaZam over.

Scizor is going to do what, its only option is technician bullet punch and if that doesn't score the kill its as cooked as bacon. Once that's out of the way you'll only be able to depend on any other kind of priority you may have. Just imagine MegaZam stealing some of the abilities that might pop up in ubers... Lord forbid he manages to steal your Speed Boost, Multiscale, Sheer Force, or Sturdy. Or even, say... Shadow Tag. That's one pokemon you don't want to have to switch in to.

Scizor still resists everything Alakazam can throw at it bar Focus Miss (even MegaZam cannot OHKO Scizor unless it runs Hidden Power Fire, which leaves it open to Drapion/Skuntank), and then KO Alakazam with Pursuit or U-Turn. Besides, CB Scizor does OHKO MegaZam /w Bullet Punch.

 

[KOTR]

Black/White had many Attack-focused Pokemon and few Specially defensive ones and it seems to be the opposite this gen.

I know, right?

I was just thinking this when I was playing X recently: between Pancham, Honedge, Inkay, and Tyrunt I have way too many physical tanks and way too few specially (just Jim Sterling, my Careful Snorlax).

They're all also tanks as opposed to walls. So the pendulam appears to not have swung wildly in the other direction either.

 

[Mr. Degradation]

OT- I didn't feel like GenV had any sort of power creep outside of Excadrill. GenIII is probably the single biggest power hike I can remember in Pokemon, because GenIII mons were designed with far less rounded stats and more focus on their "strong suit" (I remember Blissey and Skarmory were oddly extreme in Gen II). Gen IV was also the same kind of explosive hike with mons like Garchomp and Infernape who completely outclassed large swaths of mons- and ofcourse the attack-type change which outright destroyed some mons. Gen V felt more even handed, even with Ferrothorn and Volcarona around- because their existence was largely to create counterplay, and to give tools to mons that had completely fallen apart. Gen VI feels like more of the same, with some level of healing sprinkled on with improved tools and movepools, to make rounded stats not a bad thing.

 

[Non-Guest 31415]

So, is all of this discussion happening with the knowledge that Shadow Tag does not block switching on the turn Gengar Mega Evolves?

 

[Luigifan]

Bulbapedia is being awfully slow to upload stat data on the new Pokémon, which disappoints me greatly. I'm also disappointed by just how few new Pokémon there are.

 

[Thorhammer]

So, is all of this discussion happening with the knowledge that Shadow Tag does not block switching on the turn Gengar Mega Evolves?

Yes, we've been over this several times.

It offers considerable convenience on Gengar's first switch-in and really nothing beyond that.

 

[Luigifan]

Yes, we've been over this several times.

It offers considerable convenience on Gengar's first switch-in and really nothing beyond that.

You say that as though Gengar will be able to switch in more than once. It's a friggin' Glass Cannon, its job is to do as much damage as it possibly can before it's inevitably destroyed.

 

[JayHankEdLyon]

You say that as though Gengar will be able to switch in more than once. It's a friggin' Glass Cannon, its job is to do as much damage as it possibly can before it's inevitably destroyed.

It's an avenger, not a switch-in.

It's pretty simple, really. Gengar can Mega up while another pokemon is brought in to "counter him". Then he switches out if it's a bad match and uh-oh, you've got a pokemon with Shadow Tag in the wings whenever one of its teammates faints.

The issue then becomes Pursuit. Gengar needs to run moves that beat Ttar and Scizor if it wants to thrive (read: survive long enough to avenge), but given Gar essentially gets a free hit as the Pursuiter switches in it doesn't seem too impossible, even with Focus Miss doing its job, ESPECIALLY considering Scizor is now neutral to Shadow Ball).

This is a long, not-succinct way of saying that yeah, we know Gengar needs a turn to get Shadow Tag, but that doesn't suddenly make him not amazing.

(Pokemon with Sucker Punch and Pursuit, like Houndoom, are the only thing he really has to watch out for, but still, free hit on the switch if it switches in.)

 

[TinyNinja]

The stat increase for all mega evo's is exactly 100 in their BST

 

[Toljik]

This thread title seems a bit silly, now that we know what we know about Mega Gengar/Kangaskhan/Pinsir/Lucario as well as Xerneas.

 

[Chou Toshio]

Why did you guys bump this thread...?

Anyway, I think this thread is ready to be retired-- after all, we all know now that Gen 6 represents a MONSTROUS power creep, with things like Terrakion and Keldeo falling to UU usage lol.