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Theorymon Discussion and Viability Ranking

Yeah, Latias with the ability to escape Tyranitar's pursuit is definitely a great benefit. I believed we touched on this back on my post about Recovery Fade. Of course Baton Pass has the huge advantage of being able to pass the calm minds it collects, so that's definitely a reason to use Baton Pass over Recovery Fade, but for the most part Recovery Fade would suit Latias better on non-CM variants.
 
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Scizor can still screw you up with U-turn and a team capable of checking your pass targets-- but overall, Baton Pass Latias would leave its opponents with few viable answers. Maybe we would see Roar Tyranitar used? Lol. Roar Heatran would be a good answer.
 
EJ190 said:
Would baton pass latias be broken though? It now gets past pursuit, passes stat boosts and wishpasses. The scary thing is that it can do it all on the same set.
Latias w/leftovers
dragon pulse
cm
wish
baton pass
what do u think? Also,
what if mew had an ability that changed its type to match the type of its 1st attack?
So if mews 1st attack was ghost type, then mew would become a ghost pokemon, and so on. Would this mew be ou viable or would it be outclassed at every type.
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Wow this is a cool idea. Although I'm not sure if this would cause Mew to become an OU Pokemon, it would sure give it MUCH more of a niche in the metagame then it ever had before. The biggest thing about that ability is that Mew can become pretty much any type in the game thanks to its stellar movepool, and this alone makes Mew extremely unpredictable and dangerous. With Shadow Ball, Mew could become one of the better spin blockers in OU, thanks to its access to reliable recovery, Will-O-Wisp, and a ton of support moves. Although Jellicent and even Sableye would give Mew competition, Mew is only weak to Dark and Ghost, while the former is weak common attacks such as Grass and Electric and the latter isn't nearly as bulky. Mew could also become a very bulky Dragon-type with a ton of useful resistances if it were to use Dragon Pulse as its first move. With Iron Head or Flash Cannon, Mew becomes a formidable physical walls with amazing mixed bulk and lacks a weakness to Electric-type moves like Skarmory. Although other Steel-types would still give Steel Mew competition, Mew's incredible movepool would give it different niches on teams that some of the other Steel-types couldn't fulfill.

Then of course, Mew can now run a myriad of sweeper sets thanks to its endless movepool, making it a great and unpredictable late game cleaner, but the only problem is most of its offensive sets would be outclassed by something else in some way. Thundurus-T mostly outclasses it NP set thanks to its humongous SpA stat and somewhat higher speed. Celebi would be an all around better special Grass-type sweeper thanks to its plethora of resistances and STAB Psychic. Volcarona is a better sun sweeper because of Quiver Dance, and Keldeo heavily outclasses Water Mew.

So all in all, I feel like this would make Mew more defensively viable because it can function as an amazing supporter for a lot of teams, patching up common weaknesses with just a simple change of a move. It's offensive sets would be great due to their unpredictability, however, most of its offensive sets would still face stiff competition from other things in the tier. Mew would most definitely prefer this ability of Synchronize, I think.
 
I think you guys are missing the thing about Mew becoming able to be a Life Orb Nasty Plot Rain Water Type sweeper, that and a ghost type defensive terrakion check etc. mew could do so much shit that it would probably be S rank in OU if this were to happen, especially since mew could do so much stuff with it's new typings
 
What if instead of the first move, the type changed based on the plate it was holding (added normal plate)... And it got judgement?

How would a mini-arceus fare in ou?

Mew's typing certainly leaves something to be desired, and now it doesn't have to be! The ability to take on any type seems incredible... Mew could be the ultimate "glue" for a team, albeit one that doesn't excell in any role aside from filling in whatever hole is needed
 
MikeDawg said:
What if instead of the first move, the type changed based on the plate it was holding (added normal plate)... And it got judgement?

How would a mini-arceus fare in ou?

Mew's typing certainly leaves something to be desired, and now it doesn't have to be! The ability to take on any type seems incredible... Mew could be the ultimate "glue" for a team, albeit one that doesn't excell in any role aside from filling in whatever hole is needed
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This honestly takes out the creativity of being it a completely different way than how arceus changes, and just in general doesn't push too much of a change than the last theorymon rather than losing an item slot, which is complete ass to deal with
 
OiawesomeDG said:
This honestly takes out the creativity of being it a completely different way than how arceus changes, and just in general doesn't push too much of a change than the last theorymon rather than losing an item slot, which is complete ass to deal with
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I don't think we're going for that kind of creativity here... Adding x move to y pokemon is about as wild as most of the posts are intended to be

Making the change a legit move/ability at least gives it more realistic grounds than changing based upon the first move.
 
^That.

Regarding your claim that giving Mew Multitype and Judgment wouldn't be too much of a change from your idea, that's incorrect. Judgment would get a power boost from the Plate as well as the STAB boost, which would allow Mew to hit much harder than it ordinarily could with its STAB, even with your type-change scenario. This would give defensive sets the ability to do some solid damage and make a Nasty Plot sweeper VERY threatening.
 
MikeDawg said:
What if instead of the first move, the type changed based on the plate it was holding (added normal plate)... And it got judgement?

How would a mini-arceus fare in ou?

Mew's typing certainly leaves something to be desired, and now it doesn't have to be! The ability to take on any type seems incredible... Mew could be the ultimate "glue" for a team, albeit one that doesn't excell in any role aside from filling in whatever hole is needed
Click to expand...
The lack of recovery with leftys or the power from life orb hurts mew more than arceus though.
That said if it got espeed as well.....
 
If it got E- Speed it would still be outclassed by Lucario in that regard ;)

But Multitype Mew would surely be interesting even without Judgment especially with Mews extremely versatile Movepool allowing it to fill almost every possible role. Nasty Plot Water type is something that comes to mind first, but it would also be a superb spin blocker as a ghost especially for balanced/offensive teams as an alternative to Gengar. Fighting could be interesting as a special fighting type sweeper, but Lucario also kinda fills this role and isn't too great. Steel would definitelly be one of the most interesting types especially with the Stall breaker set, that now boasts more resistances and immunity to toxic. Dragon would propably be outclassed in alsmost every role i can imagine out side of Double Dancing sets with Dragon Pulse and Fireblast/Aurasphere although i doubt that this would be very effective. Electric and Grass seem also pretty outclassed by already existing Pokemon like Thundurus, Raikou, Celebie and Shaymin.
All other Typings are pretty mediocre due to SR weakness and existing pokemon giving it serious competition. Top sets would propably be:

Mew@Splash Plate
EVs: 4HP/252 SpA/252 Spe
Nature:Timid/Modest
-Nasty Plot
-Surf
-Ice Beam/Thunder
-Rock Polish/Thunder

Mew@Spooky Plate
252 Spe/252 HP/4SpA
Nature: Timid
-Taunt
-WoW
-Shadow Ball
-Softboiled

Mew@Spooky Plate
252 Spe/252 SpA/4HP
Nature: Timid
-Shadow Ball
-Aura Sphere
-Nasty Plot
-Taunt/WoW/Softboiled

Mew@Steel Plate
252 Spe/252 HP/4SpA
Nature: Timid
-Taunt
-WoW
-Ice Beam
-Softboiled

Mew@Ground Plate
252 SpA/252 Spe/4 HP
-Nasty Plot
-Earth Power
-Ice Beam
-Flamethrower/Rock Polish
 
Yuttt said:
What if Togekiss got Hurricane and Thunder?

With decent bulk and a base 120 SpA, a STAB Hurricane could be very annoying. Due to Serene Grace it would also have a 60% chance to confuse the opponent, leading to a 30% chance of the opponent attacking themselves if they are slower. The move Thunder would also have a 60% chance to paralyze, making a terrifying Parafusion combo. An option is also using Air Slash to flinch, and if all three effects are in play, the opponent will have a mere 23% to move. A moveset of Hurricane, Thunder, Nasty Plot and Roost would be scary to deal with. It could also potentially be used alongside Jirachi, as they have decent synergy and corresponding goals. However, it could be checked by pokemon such as Mamoswine, who are immune to thunder and have a power SE STAB move.
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Well, i really love Togekiss but i think Hurricane and Thunder is so broken. With his coverage(Fighting+Flying+Fire) is also great but with a 60 % of confuse or paralize... i think what rain with togekiss+jirachi became mainstream and togekiss became OU.
 
Multitype Mew would have an extremely good niche as a Normal Gem Explosion lead:
252+ Atk Normal Gem Mew Explosion vs. 252 HP / 48+ Def Ferrothorn: 193-228 (54.82 - 64.77%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
 
vyomov said:
Multitype Mew would have an extremely good niche as a Normal Gem Explosion lead:
252+ Atk Normal Gem Mew Explosion vs. 252 HP / 48+ Def Ferrothorn: 193-228 (54.82 - 64.77%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
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Think u forget the part where multitype mew needs a normal plate(which technically doesn't exist) to become a normal type
 
I worded it badly, my main point was that either way we get much of the same resault, but alas, the discussion itself is more important, and I apologize for that remark, but right now lets look at some mew sets that can be effective!
I'll be using the original version of the theorymon and will put *s around where the multitype version comments go

Set: NP Water Sweeper
151.gif

Mew @ Life Orb *Splash Plate*
Type: Water
Trait: Type Change *Synchronize*
EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Timid Nature
- Surf *Judgement*
- Nasty Plot
- Thunder
- Roost / Ice Beam / Baton Pass

This set lets mew be insane under the rain, with 1 boost and great resistances and a favoring weather to work with, this lets Mew really destroy lives, with NP, Life orb *Splash Plate* and a rain boosted STAB surf *judgement* it will 2HKO and OHKO some crazy stuff that you thought could switch into stuff like keldeo and starmie.
for instance, ferrothorn is demolished by this set, celebi is smashed by surf as well, and ice beam guerentees the OHKO vs 70 HP latias and 2HKO after CM on CM latias, while surf can 2HKO offensive anyway, also this is the only *good* water type in OU with nasty plot and thunder letting it get past stuff like jellicent and other bulky waters with pure ease, also it's probably one of the most well rounded offensive waters, with 100 across bulk, 100 SpA, and 100 speed tier. Here are some calcs to show the power of mew after an NP:
Standard Sets:
Special Wall Jellicent
+2 252 SpA Life Orb Mew Thunder vs. 252 HP / 220+ SpD Jellicent: 406-478 (100.49 - 118.31%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Standard Ferrothorn
+2 252 SpA Life Orb Mew Surf vs. 252 HP / 208 SpD Ferrothorn in rain: 187-220 (53.12 - 62.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Specially Defensive Celebi
+2 252 SpA Life Orb Mew Surf vs. 252 HP / 236+ SpD Celebi in rain: 183-217 (45.29 - 53.71%) -- 1.95% chance to 2HKO
+2 252 SpA Life Orb Mew Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 236+ SpD Celebi: 328-387 (81.18 - 95.79%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Offensive Latias (70 HP spread)
+2 252 SpA Life Orb Mew Surf vs. 74 HP / 0 SpD Latias in rain: 201-238 (63 - 74.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+2 252 SpA Life Orb Mew Ice Beam vs. 74 HP / 0 SpD Latias: 359-424 (112.53 - 132.91%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Calm Mind Latias
+2 252 SpA Life Orb Mew Surf vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Latias in rain: 201-238 (55.21 - 65.38%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+2 252 SpA Life Orb Mew Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Latias: 359-424 (98.62 - 116.48%) -- 93.75% chance to OHKO
Specially Defensive Jirachi
+2 252 SpA Life Orb Mew Surf vs. 252 HP / 236+ SpD Jirachi in rain: 368-434 (91.08 - 107.42%) -- 43.75% chance to OHKO
Wall Amoongus
+2 252 SpA Life Orb Mew Surf vs. 252 HP / 228+ SpD Amoonguss in rain: 214-252 (49.53 - 58.33%) -- 64.45% chance to 2HKO
+2 252 SpA Life Orb Mew Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 228+ SpD Amoonguss: 382-450 (88.42 - 104.16%) -- 31.25% chance to OHKO

I'll edit this post with more sets when I come around to writing them
 
@OiawesomeDG: Mew can't run both splash plate AND life orb so those calcs are pretty useless on the outset/
What if Pokemon could have two abilities simultaneously?
This is something I've been thinking about for some time.
Salamence would become a beast with both Intimidate AND Moxie at the same time.
Likewise Breloom can now run Poison Heal + Technician making it very difficult to handle

Politoed now gets BOTH Water Absorb AND Drizzle(which might be OP) so good luck in rain vs rain
Lanturn becomes interesting with Volt Absorb AND Water Absorb.
 
vyomov said:
@OiawesomeDG: Mew can't run both splash plate AND life orb so those calcs are pretty useless on the outset/
What if Pokemon could have two abilities simultaneously?
This is something I've been thinking about for some time.
Salamence would become a beast with both Intimidate AND Moxie at the same time.
Likewise Breloom can now run Poison Heal + Technician making it very difficult to handle

Politoed now gets BOTH Water Absorb AND Drizzle(which might be OP) so good luck in rain vs rain
Lanturn becomes interesting with Volt Absorb AND Water Absorb.
Click to expand...

I told you I was using the original version of the theorymon which wasn't using multitype type thing, seriously READ the post man, read
 
My apologies with regards to that:
I think Mew will also become a strong pivot on sand teams because of the rise in SpD as well as the attacking prowess with STAB Stone Edge.
Mew's coverage also ensures it can beat out threats to sand teams(such as Politoed, who is demolished by Thunderbolt on the switch)
 
vyomov said:
@OiawesomeDG:
What if Pokemon could have two abilities simultaneously?
Click to expand...
This would be nifty on pokemon that have more than one useful ability.
Bronzong w/levitate+heatproof would be interesting.
Tremble at the might of guts+ironfist conkeldurr.
Regenerator+reckless meinshau
Swiftswim+raindish ludicolo
Rain is outright broken i think.
Also i would like to try techician+skilllinkcinncinno
 
Natural Cure + Analytic Starmie
Sand Stream + Sand Force Hippo
Intimidate + Moxie Salamence + Gyara
Poison Heal + technician Breloom
Water Absorb + Drizzle Politoed would be pretty funny as would Ninetales
Sap Sipper + Chlorophyll Sawsbuck xO

Yes I would very much like that.
 
speed boost+tinted lens yanmega
Magnet pull+sturdy magnazone
Chlorophyll+regenerator tangrowth
Serene grace+superluck togekiss
Download+adaptability porygonz
Flash fire+flamebody heatran
Sandrush+scrappy stoutland
Unaware+simple swoobat(lolol)
sandrush+sandforce excadrill(yes i know its uber)
Waterabsorb+cursedbody jellicent
Lightingrod+pressure zapdos
I could go all day long.
 
I've had a few thoughts about this kinda idea, and I think these Pokemon would benefit the most.

Chandelure - Flash Fire + Shadow Tag
Yangmega - Speed Boost + Tinted Lens
Quagsire - Unaware + Water Absorb
Feraligatr - Torrent + Sheer Force
Landorus-I - Sheer Force + Sand Force
Reuniclus - Magic Guard + Regenerator
Breloom - Poison Heal + Technician
Conkeldurr - Guts / Iron Fist + Sheer Force
Landorus-T - Sheer Force + Intimidate
Bronzong - Heatproof + Levitate
Heracross - Moxie + Guts

Just a few to think about.
 
Here's some pretty interesting ability combinations:
Sap Sipper + Huge Power Azumarill
No Guard + Guts Machamp
Chlorophyll + Leaf Guard/Own Tempo Lilligant
Magic Guard + Wonder Skin Sigilyph
Thick Fat + Ice Body Walrein
Technician + Skill Link Cinccino (2HKOs Lando-T and Gliscor with boosting item)

If Cinccino got a 25 BP Arm Thrust on top of that it would be really threatening.
 
(I don't think Lando-T gets Sheer Force?)

Now, if you had all of your abilities, how would that change the game?

First of all, some Pokemon (Durant, Haxorus (arguably)) would be completely screwed over since they have a horrible ability. On the other hand, some Pokemon would rise, and some would be the same as they were with two abilities.

Rivalry+Mold Breaker+Unnerve Haxorus: Rivalry hurts it quite a bit, since half the time you get screwed over by PS's random genders. Half the time you beat the shit out of everything though, not sure if I'd really want to use it.

Effect Spore+Poison Heal+Technician Breloom: This is a tough one. Effect Spore means that hax can screw you up 20% of the time, if you switch into a weak or resisted attack (Ferrothorn's Gyro Ball, for example), making it so you can't spore them. Against many opponents, that can cause Breloom to lose to them, but since it has Poison Heal+Technician, I doubt it would be that much worse.

Flash Fire+Flame Body+Shadow Tag Chandelure: OP nerf plz

Guts+Iron Fist+Sheer Force Conkeldurr: Move over SD Lucario, Conkeldurr is more powerful at +0 than Luke at +2.

Klutz+Unaware+Simple Swoobat: With two abilities, this is amazing. With all three, it sucks.

Klutz+Iron Fist+No Guard Golurk: See above.

Guts+No Guard+Steadfast Machamp: Not as great as Conkeldurr would be with all three abilities, but would still leave a mark.

Overcoat+Magic Guard+Regenerator Reuniclus: Move over Latias, Reuniclus is the new defensive Psychic.

Overall, I think that having all three abilities as opposed to only having two is a lot more restricting. Although it can be good for a lot of mons (Conkeldurr!), it can be bad for others (lol Durant). What do you guys think about it?
 
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