Pokémon Tyrantrum

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Bravadorado said:
Not quite, as he doesn't get the Strong Jaw boost with Stone Edge. It'll be about the same just like crunch. So yeah his attacks are slightly more powerful but he doesn't have the huge special bulk. Plus that is Mega TTar, and Mega TTar is a bit weaker than normal TTar (Life orb) except with more bulk. Normal TTar definitely outclasses the strong jaw set imo. Rock head is another story entirely, but for now I think people would be better off running TTar.
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Mah I think when it comes to running dragon dance, tyrantrum outclasses tyranitar if even by a tiny margin. True, tyranitar is far more bulky, but tyrantrum deals more damage.


I don't want to start a hype train. But tyrantrum has the ability to become one of the top dragon dancers, but only after rock head.
 
mertyville said:
Is this thing even viable right now? I mean it doesn't even have access to its Hidden Ability yet.
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Rather good physical bulk, coupled with DDance and a semi-decent/mediocre speed makes him good with support. Take out any special attackers that may threaten him and he can do work. Or, even open with him as a lead and try to force a powerful offensive presence early on. I have seen him do work, although that was earlier on; sometime around November. Haven't seen many otherwise sadly.
 
LoDart210 said:
Well the most common tyrantrum is dragon dance and I have to compare that to mega tyranitar a dragon dance set (the only one you see) so the only thing I can say is

+1 252+ Atk Mega Tyranitar Crunch vs. 252 HP / 232+ Def Skarmory: 147-174 (44 - 52%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Strong Jaw Tyrantrum Crunch vs. 252 HP / 232+ Def Skarmory: 153-181 (45.8 - 54.1%) -- 5.1% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Very slightly out damages a stab coming off a base 164 attack.

That means his stone edge out damages even more noticeably as tyrantrum gets stab on it.

And better coverage.

Yeah honestly if it weren't for his garbage special defense, he would probably give mega friggin tyranitar a run for his money as a bulky dragon dancer and thats just as strong jaw. Rock head would easily blow it out of the water.
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Bravadorado said:
Not quite, as he doesn't get the Strong Jaw boost with Stone Edge. It'll be about the same just like crunch. So yeah his attacks are slightly more powerful but he doesn't have the huge special bulk. Plus that is Mega TTar, and Mega TTar is a bit weaker than normal TTar (Life orb) except with more bulk. Normal TTar definitely outclasses the strong jaw set imo. Rock head is another story entirely, but for now I think people would be better off running TTar.
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I think what was meant here is that Tyrant matches a +1 STAB Crunch from MegaGodzilla so it could be assumed a SE is naturally stronger from Tyrant as well But you are also right there is very little difference other than do you want MegaGodzilla for your mega slot or not. If you want Mega T-Tar then use it but you don't have a big power gap between the two.

Now whenever Rock Head is released it'll be great of course and the Strong Jaw loss to Crunch and Elemental Fangs may not make a huge difference to some people but it'll be a difference. Granted, tyrantrum will now join the club of outrageously powerful stab-hitting mons like Darmanitan, Mega-Skywalker, etc but you'll now to change things to accomadate the change. One thing is for sure.....SJ Tyrantrum is a UU sweeper, RH Tyrantrum is an OU sweeper.
 
El Coqui said:
I think what was meant here is that Tyrant matches a +1 STAB Crunch from MegaGodzilla so it could be assumed a SE is naturally stronger from Tyrant as well But you are also right there is very little difference other than do you want MegaGodzilla for your mega slot or not. If you want Mega T-Tar then use it but you don't have a big power gap between the two.

Now whenever Rock Head is released it'll be great of course and the Strong Jaw loss to Crunch and Elemental Fangs may not make a huge difference to some people but it'll be a difference. Granted, tyrantrum will now join the club of outrageously powerful stab-hitting mons like Darmanitan, Mega-Skywalker, etc but you'll now to change things to accomadate the change. One thing is for sure.....SJ Tyrantrum is a UU sweeper, RH Tyrantrum is an OU sweeper.
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I was referring to this line in particular:
LoDart210 said:
That means his stone edge out damages even more noticeably as tyrantrum gets stab on it.
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Which is why I quoted it. This line isn't true because while Tyrantrum gets Strong jaw boost on Crunch, he only gets STAB on Stone edge. Strong Jaw is a 50% boost, so the damage of Mega TTar's Stone edge will be about the same as Tyrantrums, except you also have AMAZING bulky, the ability to pursuit trap, set up sand for your team, and you take no LO recoil.

The fact that Mega TTar is a mega is a moot point. If you want Mega TTar then you will take him. If you don't want him, and you take another mega, then you STILL aren't going to take Tyrantrum. The reason is simply because normal TTar also outclasses Strong Jaw Tyrantrum. It's stronger, bulkier, can pursuit trap, set up sand, etc. All of the things that Mega TTar can do, except with an item and less bulky (But still bulkier than Tyrantrum).

So if you don't want to use Mega TTar, then you'd just take normal TTar to fill this slot on your team.

Mark my words though, RH Tyrantrum will destroy this metagame lol, after a DD he outspeeds so many things, and doesn't give a crap about Talonflame or Mega Pinsir, he can OHKO Conkeldurr on the switch with Outrage and can survive a mach punch:
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Tyrantrum Outrage vs. 120 HP / 0 Def Conkeldurr: 378-446 (99.21 - 117.06%) -- 93.75% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Conkeldurr Mach Punch vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Tyrantrum: 132-156 (43.27 - 51.14%) -- 2.73% chance to 2HKO

Neither Keldeo nor Greninja (Both outsped after a DD) is safe:
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Tyrantrum Outrage vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Keldeo: 398-468 (123.21 - 144.89%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Tyrantrum Head Smash vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Greninja: 625-737 (219.29 - 258.59%) -- guaranteed OHKO (He OHKO's with every attack)

Not Azumaril either:
252+ Atk Choice Band Huge Power Azumarill Aqua Jet vs. 0 HP / 4 Def (custom): 102-121 (33.44 - 39.67%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Tyrantrum Head Smash vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Azumarill: 546-643 (135.14 - 159.15%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Not even freaking Lucario (Only barely with full special investment Vacuum Wave):
252+ Atk Life Orb Lucario Bullet Punch vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Tyrantrum: 143-172 (46.88 - 56.39%) -- 73.44% chance to 2HKO
252+ SpA Life Orb Lucario Vacuum Wave vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Tyrantrum: 265-312 (86.88 - 102.29%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Tyrantrum Earthquake vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Lucario: 541-637 (191.84 - 225.88%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Mamoswine has no chance unless he has an unbroken sash and doesn't get hit on the switch:
252 Atk Life Orb Mamoswine Ice Shard vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Tyrantrum: 148-174 (48.52 - 57.04%) -- 89.06% chance to 2HKO
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Tyrantrum Head Smash vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mamoswine: 542-640 (150.13 - 177.28%) -- guaranteed OHKO (Also OHKO's with Outrage)

Mother fucking CB Scizor only has a 50% chance to OHKO while being obliterated by Head Smash:
252+ Atk Choice Band Technician Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 0 HP / 4 Def (custom): 278-330 (91.14 - 108.19%) -- 50% chance to OHKO
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Tyrantrum Head Smash vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Scizor: 452-534 (131.77 - 155.68%) -- guaranteed OHKO
What else is there? I don't even know. Physical walls?

0 Atk Hippowdon Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Tyrantrum: 204-242 (66.88 - 79.34%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Tyrantrum Outrage vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Hippowdon: 231-274 (55 - 65.23%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

0 Atk Gliscor Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Tyranitar: 180-212 (59.01 - 69.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Tyrantrum Head Smash vs. 244 HP / 248+ Def Gliscor: 281-331 (79.82 - 94.03%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

76 Atk Landorus-T Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Tyrantrum: 270-320 (88.52 - 104.91%) -- 31.25% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Life Orb Tyrantrum Head Smash vs. 252 HP / 180+ Def Landorus-T: 250-294 (65.44 - 76.96%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Landorus and Scizor are the only ones who can kill him and that's only if they don't get hit on the switch! That said, he's going to fear powerful neutral Choice Scarf special revenge killers, or weak SE choice scarf special hits, or strong SE Choice scarf hits. If it's faster than him and can land a strong special attack, he's probably going down. However, most of the things that can do that are frail, and are going to be hit for tons if not OHKO'd on the switch.

He's a goddamn dangerous motherfucker.
 
While I will admit that Rock Head Tyrantrum is powerful, it still doesn't change the fact that little can be done to fix ol' Rex's terrible Special Defense, low Speed and six easily exploitable weaknesses. Yes, it has access to Dragon Dance, but it has to actually SURVIVE long enough to get one off. I'm happy GameFreak finally gave us a T-rex Pokemon, but I simply feel it'll do better in UU.
 
RandysRage said:
While I will admit that Rock Head Tyrantrum is powerful, it still doesn't change the fact that little can be done to fix ol' Rex's terrible Special Defense, low Speed and six easily exploitable weaknesses. Yes, it has access to Dragon Dance, but it has to actually SURVIVE long enough to get one off. I'm happy GameFreak finally gave us a T-rex Pokemon, but I simply feel it'll do better in UU.
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Wat. Did you not read those calcs? How are those "Easily Exploitable" weaknesses? He's a late game sweeper, and like all other sweepers you wait to give him a free switch in on something like Talonflame, Mega Pinsir, Zapdos, etc. and then you DD and then you kill everything.

He doesn't fear priority or many physical walls. Except Landorus, maybe Scizor, maybe Ferrothorn (I can see Ferro doing very well maybe) Things generally aren't fast enough to outspeed him after a DD, as he is 10 points faster than Choice Scarfed TTar (Known for being one of the better Revenge killers) and he isn't OHKO'd by Earthquake either due to his high Defense. All of his weaknesses besides Ice and Fairy are generally Physical attacks, and he can survive basically any physical attack below a 120BP SE attack. He also has NO 4X WEAKNESS unlike Tyranitar and Garchomp.

Of the points you made, the only valid one is his low Special defense, which is his main weakness. He has many other benefits though, he can freaking OHKO Physically Defensive Skarmory with a neutral attack for christ's sake. He's certainly not unvaluable based on the fact that he can't take a special hit lol. Charizard Y gets killed by a small child throwing a pebble at him, and yet he's still one of the most powerful Mega Evolutions. People still use Garchomp even though if walks within 30 feet of a bag of frozen peas he keels over. People still use Tyranitar even though a slap from an angry toddler makes him explode.

Like I said, the main thing he fears is very fast special attackers, of which there are not many that can survive a switch in, let alone do enough damage to get rid of him. I'd say the biggest danger to RH Tyrantrum is his own LO recoil, honestly. In most scenarios, he can at least take out the opposing pokemon before succumbing to death via recoil. In the situations that he can't, well you have 5 other team members and he's a late game sweeper. You're supposed to clear out the threats so that your sweeper can sweep, that's the whole strategy.
 
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LoDart210 said:
All aboard the hype train>:D

Cannot wait for rock head to be released.
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Seriously, I didn't even realize how good his bulk was until I did those calcs, he literally does not fear a single priority move outside of fully invested Vacuum wave unless it's +1, Choice Banded, SE, STAB, and coming off something with decent attack. And even then (In Scizor's case) it's only a 50% chance to OHKO! He doesn't fear any physical revenge killers that I can think of. And Special revenge killers are semi-rare and probably going to die on the switch.

Pair him with Tyranitar/Hippowdon and his Special defense weakness is patched up pretty well too.
 
I love X-Drake ediction fossil (One Piece tribute) but just a note on the Conkeldurr calculations: Tyrantrum doesn't learn Outrage. Not for now, if anything. If Rock Head is released and Outrage will be a Z move tutor move, well, this dude will be utterly insane.
 
Does he not? I thought for sure he did...

Oh, he learns Draco Meteor? WHY?! xD Oh well, if they are giving him Draco Meteor then I'm almost positive he'll get Outrage from a tutor. If not, he still has Dragon Claw which will do respectable damage without the threat of confusion. Headsmash+Dragon Claw is still a more fearsome than the STABs that a lot of sweepers have, but I really hope he does get Outrage anyway.
 
Bravadorado said:
I was referring to this line in particular:

Which is why I quoted it. This line isn't true because while Tyrantrum gets Strong jaw boost on Crunch, he only gets STAB on Stone edge. Strong Jaw is a 50% boost, so the damage of Mega TTar's Stone edge will be about the same as Tyrantrums, except you also have AMAZING bulky, the ability to pursuit trap, set up sand for your team, and you take no LO recoil.

The fact that Mega TTar is a mega is a moot point. If you want Mega TTar then you will take him. If you don't want him, and you take another mega, then you STILL aren't going to take Tyrantrum. The reason is simply because normal TTar also outclasses Strong Jaw Tyrantrum. It's stronger, bulkier, can pursuit trap, set up sand, etc. All of the things that Mega TTar can do, except with an item and less bulky (But still bulkier than Tyrantrum).

So if you don't want to use Mega TTar, then you'd just take normal TTar to fill this slot on your team.

Mark my words though, RH Tyrantrum will destroy this metagame lol, after a DD he outspeeds so many things, and doesn't give a crap about Talonflame or Mega Pinsir, he can OHKO Conkeldurr on the switch with Outrage and can survive a mach punch:
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Tyrantrum Outrage vs. 120 HP / 0 Def Conkeldurr: 378-446 (99.21 - 117.06%) -- 93.75% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Conkeldurr Mach Punch vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Tyrantrum: 132-156 (43.27 - 51.14%) -- 2.73% chance to 2HKO

Neither Keldeo nor Greninja (Both outsped after a DD) is safe:
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Tyrantrum Outrage vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Keldeo: 398-468 (123.21 - 144.89%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Tyrantrum Head Smash vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Greninja: 625-737 (219.29 - 258.59%) -- guaranteed OHKO (He OHKO's with every attack)

Not Azumaril either:
252+ Atk Choice Band Huge Power Azumarill Aqua Jet vs. 0 HP / 4 Def (custom): 102-121 (33.44 - 39.67%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Tyrantrum Head Smash vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Azumarill: 546-643 (135.14 - 159.15%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Not even freaking Lucario (Only barely with full special investment Vacuum Wave):
252+ Atk Life Orb Lucario Bullet Punch vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Tyrantrum: 143-172 (46.88 - 56.39%) -- 73.44% chance to 2HKO
252+ SpA Life Orb Lucario Vacuum Wave vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Tyrantrum: 265-312 (86.88 - 102.29%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Tyrantrum Earthquake vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Lucario: 541-637 (191.84 - 225.88%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Mamoswine has no chance unless he has an unbroken sash and doesn't get hit on the switch:
252 Atk Life Orb Mamoswine Ice Shard vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Tyrantrum: 148-174 (48.52 - 57.04%) -- 89.06% chance to 2HKO
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Tyrantrum Head Smash vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mamoswine: 542-640 (150.13 - 177.28%) -- guaranteed OHKO (Also OHKO's with Outrage)

Mother fucking CB Scizor only has a 50% chance to OHKO while being obliterated by Head Smash:
252+ Atk Choice Band Technician Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 0 HP / 4 Def (custom): 278-330 (91.14 - 108.19%) -- 50% chance to OHKO
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Tyrantrum Head Smash vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Scizor: 452-534 (131.77 - 155.68%) -- guaranteed OHKO
What else is there? I don't even know. Physical walls?

0 Atk Hippowdon Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Tyrantrum: 204-242 (66.88 - 79.34%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Tyrantrum Outrage vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Hippowdon: 231-274 (55 - 65.23%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

0 Atk Gliscor Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Tyranitar: 180-212 (59.01 - 69.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+1 252+ Atk Life Orb Tyrantrum Head Smash vs. 244 HP / 248+ Def Gliscor: 281-331 (79.82 - 94.03%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

76 Atk Landorus-T Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Tyrantrum: 270-320 (88.52 - 104.91%) -- 31.25% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Life Orb Tyrantrum Head Smash vs. 252 HP / 180+ Def Landorus-T: 250-294 (65.44 - 76.96%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Landorus and Scizor are the only ones who can kill him and that's only if they don't get hit on the switch! That said, he's going to fear powerful neutral Choice Scarf special revenge killers, or weak SE choice scarf special hits, or strong SE Choice scarf hits. If it's faster than him and can land a strong special attack, he's probably going down. However, most of the things that can do that are frail, and are going to be hit for tons if not OHKO'd on the switch.

He's a goddamn dangerous motherfucker.
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Earlier in the thread I also made calcs for CB Head Smash and Dragon Dance Tyrantrum (for details check page 11, it includes some calcs which are not mentioned here). I assure you that you won't find anything in OU avoiding 2HKO unless it's heavy rock resist and even sturdiest of them take around 35-47% on switch (like Max HP/Max Def Swampert) ! If you give this thing Sticky Web/VoltTurn support, it should shine. People forget that Head Smash has whooping 150 base power, which is the same as... full powered Water Spout. Right now unfortunately recoil is really heavy, so it's not really that viable, but once Rock Head is released it should dominate with proper team support. Lack of Outrage is still a bit of a problem (although CB Dragon Claw is enough to secure 2HKO on SpD Hippowdon with one set of Spikes), but if he gets move tutor for it (or Aqua Tail for Hippowdon) it may end up as dominating force. And Tyrantrum with Rock Head should be brilliant for HO teams, as there is no wall which won't end up crippled for the rest of the game so breaking through stall should be an easy task. But even without those, the number of things which counter him is... technically only Hippowdon, as many hard rock resists lack good recovery, so you may wear them down anyway even in 2 hits if they take small residual damage (hint: strong U-Turn/Volt Switch should do the trick :D).
 
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Bravadorado said:
Wat. Did you not read those calcs? How are those "Easily Exploitable" weaknesses? He's a late game sweeper, and like all other sweepers you wait to give him a free switch in on something like Talonflame, Mega Pinsir, Zapdos, etc. and then you DD and then you kill everything.

First off, I don't deal in calculations, I deal in FACTS. Calcs are, for all intents and purposes, assumptions, and I don't make any assumptions until I use a Pokemon itself in battle. Having tried Tyrantrum myself shortly after Pokebank was released to compare it to other Dragons, I feel a bit underwhelmed with it. Don't take that the wrong way, as I still firmly believe having Rock Head will give him a niche in OU, but thats it: a niche.

He doesn't fear priority or many physical walls. Except Landorus, maybe Scizor, maybe Ferrothorn (I can see Ferro doing very well maybe) Things generally aren't fast enough to outspeed him after a DD, as he is 10 points faster than Choice Scarfed TTar (Known for being one of the better Revenge killers) and he isn't OHKO'd by Earthquake either due to his high Defense. All of his weaknesses besides Ice and Fairy are generally Physical attacks, and he can survive basically any physical attack below a 120BP SE attack. He also has NO 4X WEAKNESS unlike Tyranitar and Garchomp.

Anything with STAB Ice Beam and Moonblast/Pixilate Hyper Voice say otherwise, which generally OHKO the poor thing. And while they do have 4x weaknesses, Tyranitar and Garchomp usually use Chople/Yache Berries to give themselves a turn to strike back, plus Ttar has Dragon Dance as well, and ol' Chompy has Swords Dance.

Of the points you made, the only valid one is his low Special defense, which is his main weakness. He has many other benefits though, he can freaking OHKO Physically Defensive Skarmory with a neutral attack for christ's sake. He's certainly not unvaluable based on the fact that he can't take a special hit lol. Charizard Y gets killed by a small child throwing a pebble at him, and yet he's still one of the most powerful Mega Evolutions. People still use Garchomp even though if walks within 30 feet of a bag of frozen peas he keels over. People still use Tyranitar even though a slap from an angry toddler makes him explode.

I agree with you here, although MegaZardY is usually paired with the likes of Excadrill, Garchomp and other Rock resistors, Excadrill especially as it can spin away it biggest enemy Stealth Rock.

Like I said, the main thing he fears is very fast special attackers, of which there are not many that can survive a switch in, let alone do enough damage to get rid of him. I'd say the biggest danger to RH Tyrantrum is his own LO recoil, honestly. In most scenarios, he can at least take out the opposing pokemon before succumbing to death via recoil. In the situations that he can't, well you have 5 other team members and he's a late game sweeper. You're supposed to clear out the threats so that your sweeper can sweep, that's the whole strategy.

Which is my main point: Tyrantrum needs an entire team built around him to be useful, whereas Tyranitar, Garchomp, and the 'Zards are, for the most part, self-sufficient. Tyrantrum simply has too much competition as a Dragon Dance sweeper thanks mostly to MegaZardX, Tyranitar and Multiscale Dragonite. Tyrantrum will feel more at home in UU, and with alot of support, Rock Head has a solid nice in OU.
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RandysRage said:
First off, I don't deal in calculations, I deal in FACTS. Calcs are, for all intents and purposes, assumptions, and I don't make any assumptions until I use a Pokemon itself in battle. Having tried Tyrantrum myself shortly after Pokebank was released to compare it to other Dragons, I feel a bit underwhelmed with it. Don't take that the wrong way, as I still firmly believe having Rock Head will give him a niche in OU, but thats it: a niche.

Anything with STAB Ice Beam and Moonblast/Pixilate Hyper Voice say otherwise, which generally OHKO the poor thing. And while they do have 4x weaknesses, Tyranitar and Garchomp usually use Chople/Yache Berries to give themselves a turn to strike back, plus Ttar has Dragon Dance as well, and ol' Chompy has Swords Dance.

I agree with you here, although MegaZardY is usually paired with the likes of Excadrill, Garchomp and other Rock resistors, Excadrill especially as it can spin away it biggest enemy Stealth Rock.

Which is my main point: Tyrantrum needs an entire team built around him to be useful, whereas Tyranitar, Garchomp, and the 'Zards are, for the most part, self-sufficient. Tyrantrum simply has too much competition as a Dragon Dance sweeper thanks mostly to MegaZardX, Tyranitar and Multiscale Dragonite. Tyrantrum will feel more at home in UU, and with alot of support, Rock Head has a solid nice in OU.
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The calculations are facts that his weaknesses are not easily exploited, though? Calcs aren't assumptions, they are facts. If I use X move it does Y damage, if the enemy uses B move it does A damage, these are facts. He's a set up sweeper, the way to deal with a set up sweeper is to survive the hit and phase it, or to take it out with SE priority. Based on the calcs, most walls can't avoid the 2HKO, and most SE priority doesn't put him in much danger.

Did you not read what I said? I said that "All of his weaknesses BESIDES Ice and Fairy were generally physical". Icebeam and Moonblast/Hyper voice don't "say otherwise" they say exactly what I said. Ground, Dragon, Fighting, Steel, are all generally physical attacks, which he can survive. things like Icebeam and moonblast are what he has to watch out for, his weakness. Chople/Yache reduce their potential as sweepers pretty greatly. And the same can be said about Tyrantrum, use the Yache berry and bam no more ice weakness, which is the most dangerous weakness for him.

This isn't an argument. If you get to have Excadrill with your Yzard then how about I take Tyranitar/Hippowdon and completely negate Tyrantrum's special weakness. Or maybe I'll put an Assault Vest on him and have Scolipede pass +2 attack and +2 speed to him while giving him Ice Fang/Fire Fang to get past even more threats? Teammates are there to help your other teammates and cover your weaknesses. Saying that Excadrill or whatever cover's Yzard's weakness isn't an argument at all, as there are many things to cover Tyrantrum's weak points as well.

In what universe is a Scolipede or a tyranitar/hippowdon "an entire team"? Oh yeah no you're right man. Tyranitar, Garchomp and Yzard don't need anyone. The first two can totally handle priority users such as Conkeldurr and Mamoswine with their 4x weaknesses. And yeah Yzard doesn't need an entire team built around him, I mean it's not like there is an entire RMT based around building a team around Yzard. Your arguments are way way way flawed man. With Rock Head, Tyrantrum firmly outclasses Tyranitar (Slightly less attack, but better defense/speed, way better STABs and better resistances/weaknesses) unless you need the sand (Which you would rather take Hippowdon because synergy, etc). I'm not sure about Dragonite because I don't use him, but of course Mega Xzard will outclass him, because he's a mega. I'll be giving my mega slot to Yzard who greatly enjoys Tyrantrum's ability to remove Electric/rock threats (And a ton of other things) while removing the Ground/steel/ice/fighting threats for Tyrantrum. You can give your mega slot to Xzard with someone else as your wallbreaker, and that's fine.

Pokemon teams aren't made with 1 pokemon bro, and a pokemon doesn't need to be absolutely perfect to fit on a team.
 
That's how I was running tyrantrum initially, because he has great synergy with char y, plus he's a great talonflame counter, and can put the hurt on aegislash, two top Pokemon.


With rock head, tyrantrum will be able to take on the likes of S-class threats like mega pinsir, char y, possibly char x, and thundurus

The only reason tyrantrum is not good enough now is because he can't use head smash.
 
RandysRage said:
Which is my main point: Tyrantrum needs an entire team built around him to be useful, whereas Tyranitar, Garchomp, and the 'Zards are, for the most part, self-sufficient. Tyrantrum simply has too much competition as a Dragon Dance sweeper thanks mostly to MegaZardX, Tyranitar and Multiscale Dragonite. Tyrantrum will feel more at home in UU, and with alot of support, Rock Head has a solid nice in OU.
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Honestly I don't get this argument. Many sweepers needs teammates support to make sure they do their job. Some more, some less, but all of them need those. Mentioned MegaZard Y without Defog (or Rapid Spin) support would be much, much weaker choice for any team and sometimes Defog or Rapid Spin may be hard to use if you deal with really offensive team which puts high pressure on you all of time. In other words this kind of support may be hard to use. But does this make him bad option to consider ? Not really. Or Talonflame (especially CB) which should always run Defog or Rapid Spin support. And no one will say that it's not viable because of this ;).

Tyrantrum has something over other sweepers - sheer power in one move without ANY immunities (in other words no Ghost to switch on Fighting attacks like Close Combat or Fairy switch on Outrage, etc.) and something even more important - really few x4 rock resists, which make switching into him even harder. STAB Head Smash has ridiculous base power (225 BASE POWER counting STAB which unlike Water Spout isn't based on HP) and rock attack is great offensive STAB to use. You don't even need to predict that much - when you deal even 45-47% to the HEAVIEST of rock resists (depends on damage roll and this is with CB version, +1 Life Orb DD should deal EVEN MORE), you technically have nuke button which you may just spam. Heck, if you are Dragon Dance version, you may just Head Smash at first, weakening target a bit and find a chance again later on to finish it off anyway after DD next time. Also this sheer power means that it should force switches easily - you don't want to leave for example Azumarill on him as CB Head Smash is easy KO (and CB Aqua Jet is only neutral against you), so it means you have free turn for DD. Or Tyranitar which can't handle his EQ. Or Talonflame, which can only U-Turn away. Or if you are desperate, you may try to set-up on Entei Sacred Fire and hope you won't get burned (or his CB Stone Edge). Or Terrakion locked into Stone move. If you can provide him Sandstorm support, you should find even more turns and push your luck against Scald for example on weaker Bulky Waters). In other words you should find those free turns without many problems as many popular OU mons take a huge risk staying in (although I admit you may struggle a bit against really fast teams, but Gen 6 is slower than Gen 5). Although there's always Sticky Web support or paralysis support. And good news is that in overall Scarfers are slower in Gen 6 than 5, making DD more viable (and he can handle even SE priorities) and pure offensive pressure of possible CB should let him get free turns. Although I would still threat DD Tyrantrum more like a wallbreaker than sweeper for some sort of HO team, balanced double dragon dance team or some sort of DragMag team (Magnezone + Dragons) - he has so much power that technically only Hippowdon can switch into him without being crippled for the rest of the game, allowing something like Salamence, Dragonite or MegaCharizard X sweep so much easier after. From what I see in OU so far with MegaLuke gone, I see NOTHING which even comes close in terms of power counting popular STAB attacks.
 
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Does Tyrantrum outrun Greninjaat +1 with Adamant? Also, you list him with Life Orb, so the likes of CB Scizor would OHKO after Life Orb recoil.
 
Hibiki said:
Does Tyrantrum outrun Greninjaat +1 with Adamant? Also, you list him with Life Orb, so the likes of CB Scizor would OHKO after Life Orb recoil.
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Nah it's 241+1 (~364) vs 377, (In the calc I forgot to give Greninja Timid) however Greninja needs a free switch in or he has no chance of coming in as he is OHKO'd by every single move Tyrantrum has (If he learns outrage, but Dragon Claw might do it too, not sure). I listed Scizor as a threat, but not all scizor are CB, and scizor can't switch in to head smash which is an OHKO, and if Tyrantrum survives the Bullet Punch (50% chance with CB, higher chance to survive with LO) he still OHKO's with Head smash. Granted this will likely kill Tyrantrum, but that's still 1 for 1.
 
Would it be viable to sacrifice some Attack EVs and place them into HP for Scizor? Or would you rather fire fang it on the switch or leave Scizor to Magnezone or whoever?
 
TwinklePuff said:
Would it be viable to sacrifice some Attack EVs and place them into HP for Scizor? Or would you rather fire fang it on the switch or leave Scizor to Magnezone or whoever?
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If you're talking about RH Tyrantrum (Which is what we're talking about right now) then why would you firefang? Just Head Smash to OHKO. I'm sure someone will come up with the optimal speed tier and damage amount to free up some EVs for Defense/HP once RH tyrantrum actually comes out.
 
Does Jolly outspeed Greninja?
And does Tyrantrum even need Life orb? Isn't he strong enough anyway? He could run Lum or Lefties.
 
Yes, I was referring to Rock Head Tyrantrum. So, +0 Life Orb Head Smash KOs 252 / 0 Scizor? That's great.

Is it viable to opt for Muscle Band instead of Life Orb? I believe muscle band boosts physical attacks by 10% while LO boosts both kinds of attacks by 30%, but this T Rex wouldn't dare use special attacks. Do you think the drop in power is worth increasing its longevity?
 
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