Other 6th Gen Pokemon UU Candidate Speculation Thread

[KOTR]

How about looking at things from the lower tiers that might be moving up?

Drapion

This good news. Hope it pans out. I've always been a big Drapion fan because it looks like a boss from Sonic the Hedgehog.

Another plus: Pursuit trapping Trevenant, Gardevoir, Gourgeist, Delphox, Meowstic, and et al. And on top of Poison Jabbing all the Fairies, to boot.

 

[repulsion]

I'm interested to see what happens to Staraptor. Would it be BL'd again? Perhaps it will finally have an actual tier to play in rather than being banned to BL and terrible in OU. It would have very good synergy with UU Rapid Spinners (Blastoise, Hitmontop and probably Donphan) and provide significant competition against other spam-and-win physical attackers like Darmanitan and Victini. The again, it may still be too good...

 

[Kietharr]

I'm interested to see what happens to Staraptor. Would it be BL'd again? Perhaps it will finally have an actual tier to play in rather than being banned to BL and terrible in OU. It would have very good synergy with UU Rapid Spinners (Blastoise, Hitmontop and probably Donphan) and provide significant competition against other spam-and-win physical attackers like Darmanitan and Victini. The again, it may still be too good...

I wouldn't depend on Blastoise remaining UU, mega launcher aura pulse and dark pulse are just way too good off 135 SpA.

 

[repulsion]

I wouldn't depend on Blastoise remaining UU, mega launcher aura pulse and dark pulse are just way too good off 135 SpA.

Are they going to consider a Pokemon and its mega the same thing or split them up with something like Soul Dew Clause for mega stones?

 

[Kietharr]

Are they going to consider a Pokemon and its mega the same thing or split them up with something like Soul Dew Clause for mega stones?

I would assume that mega stones will be banned on a case by case basis (for example, gengarite will almost certainly be banned from OU) but usage stats are determined from the pokemon itself, not the mega. So if Blastoise hits high enough usage, he'll be OU rather than UU even if he might be balanced for use in UU.

 

[Ckarasu]

I've been using spikes+sleep powder Roserade and it is nice but I don't think it will be enough to push it to OU. Looks like Bl for Roserade:S

If it does go to OU, I think that Amonguss would be the replacement because it has the same typing plus bulkier defenses.

I don't know about Roserade being UU(I mean that seriously). It gets to abuse Hidden Power due to the Technician boost and has Dazzling Gleam as coverage against dragons. Spikes+Sleep Powder just seems so inferior to that in every regard(in terms of usefulness). With a pure offensive set consisting of HP Fire/Shadow Ball/Sludge Bomb/Dazzling Gleam, it gets perfect neutral coverage to hit with that good 125 special attack.

 

[Kriptini]

I mentioned it another thread, but I figure I'll bring it here.

Zygarde is going to be BL, and maybe even UU. The only way he can possibly function is if he Dragon Dances; he NEEDS that +1 Speed to function offensively as any half-decent attacker with a super-effective move will 2HKO a totally defensive Zygarde, and he has no hope of OHKOing them back without the +1 Attack. He relies heavily on Outrage and Earthquake, both of which can be nullified by a Fairy-type or Flying-type respectively. Mamoswine will easily force him out, as will Weavile and Togekiss, unless he's running Stone Edge. Does this set look familiar at all?

 

[xSilentDeviL]

I mentioned it another thread, but I figure I'll bring it here.

Zygarde is going to be BL, and maybe even UU. The only way he can possibly function is if he Dragon Dances; he NEEDS that +1 Speed to function offensively as any half-decent attacker with a super-effective move will 2HKO a totally defensive Zygarde, and he has no hope of OHKOing them back without the +1 Attack. He relies heavily on Outrage and Earthquake, both of which can be nullified by a Fairy-type or Flying-type respectively. Mamoswine will easily force him out, as will Weavile and Togekiss, unless he's running Stone Edge. Does this set look familiar at all?

He does have extremespeed however, so i would agree BL. simply too strong for UU

 

[Chou Toshio]

OMG guys, didn't take long to make this thread go to shit huh?

I have deleted every post about Talonflame in this "potential UU" thread. Talonflame is more centralizing, and more dominant than every former Uber included in the meta now, including Genesect. There is ZERO reason why you guys should be taking almost half the posts in this thread to talk about it-- in terms of UU!!

I told the OP that you should be as conservative as possible in guessing potential UU mons-- there is no reason to turn this thread into a circle jerk about a poke that's currently more dominant than Genesect, Torn-T, Lando-I, etc. combined. That's unacceptable-- and if you guys continue on making this thread go like that, I'm gonna shut it down.

A discussion of a UU metagame when we have no idea what OU will look like is half-brain dead at best as a starting point, so do please do your best to make this an exercise that's somewhat intelligent.

Needless to say-- don't anyone talk about Talonflame being UU in this thread again. If you want to make an argument for Talonflame being UU, please do it in the Talonflame thread (not hijacking this one)-- where I guarantee that your argument will soon be laughed at.

 

[Oddish is the best]

I don't know about Roserade being UU(I mean that seriously). It gets to abuse Hidden Power due to the Technician boost and has Dazzling Gleam as coverage against dragons. Spikes+Sleep Powder just seems so inferior to that in every regard(in terms of usefulness). With a pure offensive set consisting of HP Fire/Shadow Ball/Sludge Bomb/Dazzling Gleam, it gets perfect neutral coverage to hit with that good 125 special attack.

Oh that sounds good I didn't actually think about technician with HP!

 

[CoolStoryBrobat]

Know what? Can we also have Jolteon in UU? A ton of people have been thinking it would have fallen sooner especially when compared to Raikou, who's got more bulk, power, and move options at the cost of a slightly lower Speed and no (released) immunity to Electric. I mean Jolteon's got competition from Thundurus-I, Thundurus-T, Raikou itself, and Mega Manectric as far an electric-type goes. As someone else said, Rain's nerf means there's gonna be a narrower threshold for Thunder spamming, on top of Hidden Power being nerfed to 60 BP, meaning Jolteon's primary attacking role got reduced a bit. So (hopefully) most people won't go for it when compared to the other Electric-types who have notably wider movepools and options for the roles that need fulfilled on a team.

In UU I can see this guy running a pretty decent Choice Specs set, probably the only plausible option for it aside from LO (Though a Scarfer with that high of a Speed stat would be unable to get outsped...still not worth it for the tier it's in imo), and it would be fun to use Jolteon on a Volt-Turn team just because of that blazing-fast Volt Switch. If Raikou somehow does stay in UU for whatever reason, this guy will probably be a somewhat-decent check to Zapdos and Raikou (Though I'm not totally sure how it'll beat SubCM Raikou...a choice set, maybe though). And needless to say it still has funky options it can use to mess around with in UU, having access to moves like Yawn, Toxic, Baton Pass (No boosting moves outside of Work Up, Agility and Charge Beam tho), and Thunder Wave. Not saying those are gonna be (or should be) used, but ya never know, right? And it kinda feels weird to be thinking in terms of Gen V's UU, which may be pretty altered compared to this Gen's, but I have little else to go off of.

Oh yeah it gets Signal Beam too. RIP Umbreon

 

[lmitchell0012]

If Ninjask doesn't make it to OU I can definitly see this thing making UU. While it doesn't have many attacking options, he's still one of the best baton passers in the game if you need speed and attack.

 

[Thorhammer]

If Ninjask doesn't make it to OU I can definitly see this thing making UU. While it doesn't have many attacking options, he's still one of the best baton passers in the game if you need speed and attack.

He's NU now and didn't get any better than he was before. Meanwhile, other Baton Passers did, particularly Scolipede, who can do Ninjask's job better.

 

[TheEvergreenChameleon]

Yes, and apples are better than oranges. Breloom is currently OU, Chesnaught will probably be UU. Breloom is a priority attacker, Chesnaught is a bulky attacker. Neither are going to like Talonflame's priority acrobatics/brave bird hanging around in OU, so Breloom might end up in UU after all.

Apparently Chesnaught gets Synthesis according to a post in the research thread though, something I hadn't considered in my initial evaluation. It still won't be OU, but this makes it a much more potent tank in UU. He gets basically everything you'd ever want on him except for maybe Mach/Bullet Punch, Stealth Rock and Shell Smash.

With the buff to rock tomb, which makes it stronger on Technician Breloom than Stone Edge was, no Talonflame is going to dare switch in on Breloom. Chesnaught fears it much more, since, whilst it can also run RT or SE, those moves lack the utility on it that they have on Breloom (as well as the power) and will only really be considered for Talonflame. RT is likely to be a standard on Breloom, by comparison, since it compensates for the loss of technician low sweep whilst also providing coverage for a lot of common switch ins.

To be blunt, almost nothing in OU is currently liking Talonflame.

 

[Chaos714]

If Ninjask doesn't make it to OU I can definitly see this thing making UU. While it doesn't have many attacking options, he's still one of the best baton passers in the game if you need speed and attack.

It is NU back in Gen V and I don't think it will have enough usage to climb tiers at this moment... unlike Smeargle with King's Shield & Sticky Web. Now it can surely go UU at least with those new goodies (unless people overlook Smeargle's potential in X/Y :| ).

 

[rainbowumbreon]

i was thinking about what dragons could fall i mean haxorous is a prime canidate to fall down to uu from last gens ou.And its attack is massive and a double dance set could work in uu and be very prevelant if the most of the good fairys are ou especailly at the beginning when everyone plays with the new stuff

on this point of "new stuff" The beginning of this meta could be a bit of a cluster like last gen (remember uu deoxys d guys) so we could end up with some mad pokes down here

We could get Staraptor back in the tier (and unfortually chansey as well ) which are very good pokemon

Also we will have MEGA pokemon such as houndoom heracross and medichan in the tier and i think they will be meta defining pokemon and our meta will shape around them

we could also get drizzle if the nerf really hurts politoad (personally i dont think it will ) but that would be madness at the beginning

 

[Zé Capáu]

Why it probably won't be OU: A good ability with great coverage help Clawitzer's viability, but it's pretty much outclassed by Mega-Blastoise who has access to most of Clawitzer's movepool, it's new ability as well as Rapid Spin and more bulk. ...

Actually Clawitzer Outclasses Mega-Blastoise, Blastoise is wasting its item slot with Blastoisite, while Clawitzer can equip a Life Orb, Choice Specs (both more power) or Assault Vest (more special bulk). Also Clawitzer has U-Turn while Blastoise/Mega-Blastoise may waste a turn+moveslot with Rapid Spin (also Defog may outclass it).

 

[noknuckles]

Gen V UU was land of the insane fire types. What do you think is gonna happen to fire types in Gen 6?

Defog allows you to remove SR easily, clearing the way for fire types. Perhaps this will pave a way for one of the insane UU Fires to rise to OU. The nerf to rain may also help them out a bit (though sun has also been nerfed). Out of Victini, Darm, and Chandelure, who has a shot at rising to OU? Maybe Rotom-H (it's what, the 6th? most used fire in UU?) will leapfrog all of these with its resistances to Talonflame's stabs.

If none of those rise, how crazy fiery would UU be? We may get Mega Houndoom and Delphox on top of what we already have. Maybe we'll also get Mega Charizard.

 

[thatguyfromsparta]

Any thoughts on Zoroark? I've been using one lately (using Illusion to become Aegislash), sort of dependent on the other team though.

 

[noknuckles]

It might still be early, but as time passes and we slowly get acquainted with how OU is playing out, it starts to make a bit more sense to speculate what will rise and what will fall.

Which former UU mon will rise to OU?

We're losing our two best fairies. I'm seeing Azumarill and Togekiss a lot in OU. Even though I haven't used Azumarill that much in UU, I'm gonna miss it. Togekiss, not so much.

I haven't seen too many Blastoise, but that's a legit OU spinner. In Gen 5, we were all complaining about how spinners lose to blockers, and how Blastoise has to spend 2 turns just to spin (best case scenario for Blastoise is Cofag gets to +2, Shadow Balls and gets roared away). Well now instead of Foresight, Blastoise can use Dark Pulse off Mega Launcher boosted 135 SpAtk. It's OU worthy, I kinda hope that all those other megas push him down to UU. He'll be a force, but hopefully he'll be balanced by all the powerful OU drops

Of the fire types, I see Rotom-H as most likely to rise up. It's a great counter to Talonflame, even resisting U-Turn. Rotom-W is the only thing keeping Rotom-H down, but Heat can absorb WoW and can hit grass types like Ferrothorn. Rotom-W is more useful than -H but Rotom-H does have its perks.

I've heard people talking about Crobat, but I haven't seen it very much.

Roserade is interesting. Its defense buff is probably not a selling point, but it does help it out in UU. The changes to breeding mechanics makes Rose more versatile. Offensive poison is a bit better than before. As OU-worthy as I think this is, ultimately I think it's staying in UU.

Fall of the dragons

The two dragons, Flygon and Kingdra, were major forces in UU. UU struggled to keep up with Flygon's CB Outrages off of 100 Attack and Kingdra's DD or Manual Rain Sp Attacks off of 95 offensive stats. What happens when 147 Attack worth of Haxorus (who was on the verge of falling at the tail end of Gen 5) inevitably falls to UU?

Dragons will inevitably fall down for two reasons. First, fairies are supposed to put dragons in their place. More fairies means less incentive to use dragons, means dragon usage should go down. However, I think a bigger reason is simply oversaturation of dragons in OU. OU was so dragon dominant that a 147 attack dragon dancer was considered bad. Gen 6 gave us some more dragons, and while they all play differently, you're typically not gonna have 3+ dragons on your team. There are just too many dragons to fit on people's team, so SOMETHING is bound to drop.

At the end of last gen, Hydreigon, Haxorus and Kyurem-B (am I seeing this right?!?!) were on the verge of falling. Gen 6 added Dragalge, Zygarde, Noivern, Goodra Tyrantrum and a few megas (Ampharos, as Charizard is probably going to OU. I mean... it's Charizard, who cares if you don't feel it's OU worthy, people are gonna use it). Dragalge will almost certainly drop. I see Hydreigon and Haxorus (and hopefully not Kyurem-B) getting pushed down. In UU, they'll have a reason to run speed nature. The rest of them are all good, though I see Tyrantrum dropping. Zygarde is absolutely OU worthy, though I see it dropping because people will be attracted to DD and will think it's just a bad Dragonite.

Depending on what falls into our lap, Gen 6 UU may be the tier for dragon spam.

Who will stand up to the dragons?

(more to come when I get more energy. I wanted to discuss Metagross, UU fairies, and certain megas. Additionally I'm wondering about how Staraptor and Froslass would do)

 

[TPO3]

I wanted to discuss Metagross, UU fairies, and certain megas. Additionally I'm wondering about how Staraptor and Froslass would do

Metagross in UU is something that I was looking forward to nearly all of last generation but ended up never getting. Now that multiple dragons were added which will probably cause a few to drop, it seems like it's going to have some strong synergy with what will end up landing in the tier. Kingdra, Druddigon, and Flygon are already in the tier, and it's not too unrealistic to believe that quite a few more will drop. Fairies being weak to Steel makes Metagross a great partner for dragon-spamming teams. It resists all three of Dragon's weaknesses and has plenty of bulk to switch in throughout a game. Metagross also has a huge offensive presence with its massive attack stat as well as a STAB that it can spam to scare fairies away pretty easily. Most fairies will also probably be setup bait for Agility Metagross, so Dragons can provide it with some setup opportunities as well. I'm sure there are a few fairy-types that aren't complete setup fodder for AgilityGross, but losing Azumarill and Togekiss helps Metagross out a lot. I wouldn't be surprised at all to see Metagross + Dragon teams floating around, especially not in the early stages of the tier.

 

[Ashrynn]

Surprised to see Arcanine not get mentioned, he always seemed to be a solid UU pokemon. This gen hasn't 'gifted' him anything unique, but given that the meta-game seems tilting towards 'Priority' I'd say anything with access to Extremespeed and a base 110 Atk shouldn't be overlooked.

Arcanine @ Choice Band/Life Orb
Nature: Adamant
Ability: Intimidate
~ Flare Blitz
~ Wild Charge/Outrage
~ Extremespeed
~ Close Combat/Morning Sun

Basically his set from 5th Gen. He'd need entry hazard support, but with Intimidate and possibly a specific EV spread he could make a great hit and run pokemon to use. I remember playing against the Toxic set in UU and he's actually not bad when it comes to bulk and Inimidate.

I could totally see Arcanine as a top UU threat and possibly shoot a little chaos up in OU. Too bad he doesn't get a strong boosting move outside of Howl though.

 

[AOPSUser]

I actually think Metagross wouldn't be that dominating in UU once it drops. Gen V UU was filled with Fire-types, Dark-types, and Ghost-types, and unless Chandelure, Victini, Darmanitan, Arcanine, Scrafty, Sharpedo, Houndoom, Mismagius, Weavile, Rotom-H, Zoroark, Umbreon, and Sableye (and lol Dusclops) all leave UU at the same time, life is going to be very hard for Metagross in Gen VI UU. Plus, there are a bunch of new UU threats like Delphox and Pyroar, as well Charizard if it doesn't make OU. Also, there's the fact that a lot of special attackers like Life Orb Kingdra can 2HKO him or better, even with max Special Defense investment. Yes, it will make an impact. Will it be a Staraptor/Chansey-like impact? Probably not.

Also speaking of Staraptor, I don't think the new gen gave UU much to beat him with. We still have to use Rhyperior or Doublade to hard counter him, or look to lower-tiered Pokemon like Regirock. Close Combat is just too beastly with its STABs.

 

[ScraftyIsTheBest]

Yeah Metagross would be pretty awesome in UU, without Azu or Kiss in UU, a lot of Fairies will get wrecked by Metagross's mighty Meteor Mash, and in general Metagross has great all round stats and a slew of resistances, so it would be a real threat in UU. Not sure if it will be broken, but it will definitely be a good Pokemon!

By the way, speaking of possible UU candidates, I'd like to talk about a few of them.

I'd like to talk about Scolipede, who I can see possibly rising out of the lower tiers into possibly UU with the buffs he received. With an improved Attack stat and an awesome ability in Speed Boost, Scolipede could become a much greater threat in UU than ever. In last gen's UU, Scolipede was a pretty solid Pokemon, serving as a fast spiker with good coverage or even a good physical sweeper, although it didn't see that much usage. This gen though, I'm expecting Scolipede to become a greater Pokemon than ever since it hits slightly harder, can do its old jobs just as well, and can also Speed Boost+Baton Pass, throwing Ninjask out of commission. Scolipede also has Poison STAB, which is probably much more useful with the new Fairy type around, and Scolipede's Speed makes it a strong contender in general.

On Megas, I can see Absol and Gardevoir being strong contenders for UU with their new Mega formes, both hit hard as fuck, and Gardy's new Fairy typing really helps it, even moreso if we see all of those Dragons falling from UU. Absol has great offenses, with a great Speed now and high Attack and Special Attack, and with an awesome offensive movepool, it could make a great sweeper and wallbreaker. Gardevoir could handle Dragons and in general do well with an amazing movepool, great Special Attack, and good special bulk to boot. I think they'll be good contenders for viable megas in UU.

Just some thoughts.