BH Balanced Hackmons Central Resources

ho oh should be c i think

i've already talked about the unaware set in the creative and underrated sets thread but that set requires magic bounce. recently i've been using prankster ho oh which does all right without bounce because it checks things anyway which is kind of nice. mons like pixilate pdon/diancie, psychic surge setup mmy, mmx, mega gengar and even some kyogre sets are taken down by this thing. flying/fire is actually so good as a defensive typing and its spdef is so high man

Ho-Oh @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Haze
- Glare
- Lava Plume
- Shore Up

Ho-Oh @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Careful Nature
- Heal Order
- Spectral Thief
- Entrainment
- Magic Coat / filler

additionally, offensive ho oh is an extremely underexplored concept that needs some looking into, like it could run some crazy sets. aerilate and turboblaze stand out to me but other options sound good as well.

Ho-Oh @ Stone Plate
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- V-Create
- Fleur Cannon
- Overheat
- Judgment

Ho-Oh @ Choice Specs
Ability: Aerilate
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Boomburst
- Blue Flare
- Trick
- Secret Sword / Sleep Talk

Ho-Oh @ Choice Band
Ability: Turboblaze
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Ascent
- V-create
- Ice Hammer
- filler
 
Ho-oh without Magic Guard has one big problem: Stealth Rock. An Unaware mon which loses 50% of its health on the switchin cannot be viable, as the opponent doesn't need boosts to 2HKO it afterwards.
 
it's called anything under B-
That's not true at all. C-Rank Pokemon are good Pokemon that are typically used for more specific purposes, but are able to sub into other roles in a pinch if a team composition requires it. For example, Palkia usually does Stakeout stuff, but can abuse rain or act as a decent Fur Coat check if the need arises. Or Cresselia, who can run pretty much any defensive/support ability just fine and really only struggles because of the prevalence of Gengar/Yveltal/Moongeist/Spectral Thief.

D-Rank Pokemon are the more niche tier that you have to build around to make work, but they work quite well if their weaknesses are compensated for. Most teams won't use D-Rank, but a significant enough portion will employ them and they can easily wreck your stuff if you're not prepared (Imposter Pikachu with Paralysis support comes to mind.)

Below that you have what I'd call Extreme Niche Pokemon. Which... work as an E-Rank, so to speak. This is the stuff that you either pick first and plan your whole team around ("I really wanna use Mega-Houndoom since it has a cool typing. How should I build around it?") or you struggle to find a sixth member that synergizes well with your team and go through the whole pokedex looking for something until you stumble upon it. ("Huh... Earth Plate Pixilate Heatran walls and checks all of the threats to the rest of my team. Well, okay then, let's try it.") This is the stuff you'll pretty much see on one stray team here and there, like Wildbeast's Krookodile. It works great for him, but what other team composition is actually going to find a use for it? If you want, you could also call this the "VGC Champion Pachirisu tier." Yeah, that guy made a team that made great use of it but, considering it doesn't even have a doubles or VGC analysis, it's safe to say it didn't work for anyone else.


Or, in short: C-rank can fit on a lot of teams with a little bit of work. D-rank can fit on some teams with a fair bit of work. "E-Rank" only fit on very, very specific teams.
 
Gengar is still in the role compendium under Stallbreakers and Shadow Tag so this needs fixing.
Something I forgot to mention last post: maybe sandstream for ttar as a possible ability (although obviously we can't have every viable ability listed as it would be HUGE but I thought it was worth mentioning even if it doesn't get listed)

I was going to edit my ho-oh comments into the last post but I left it a couple of days so I thought I'd just post again:
Ho-oh - the majestic bird Pokemon who enjoys nothing better than supporting LGBT rights with its rainbow attire.
I know this Pokemon is often considered PDon's older, less successful brother who dropped out of highschool and got locked up for petty crime but it has some key virtues that mean it does have a niche.
First and foremost is it's bulk. With 106/90/154 on the physical side it's nothing to write home about but it's special bulk is definitely notable being similar to Giratina's and better than Registeel's. The other factor that distinguishes it is it's typing Fire/Flying which gives a load of useful resists: Fire, Fairy, Fighting, Steel and a Ground immunity while it only has 3 weaknesses: water, electric and rock.
What roles does it carry out? It can be a very reliable Pixilate Diancie check even without an ability due to resisting Fairy as well as all the usual coverage types as well as having the special bulk to take resisted boombursts like a champ (harder than it sounds). Resisting Fighting, Fairy and Steel also helps it to check certain MMX sets, especially stakeout, which often runs these types and can do so better with an ability such as fur coat.
It's 4× Rock weakness has to be careful taken into account due to good hazard control being needed. However, if teams can run shedinja which instantly dies to stealth rocks as well as spikes and dies a little less instantly to toxic spikes, it's definitely possible to keep on top of hazards if you build with that in mind and it's this team support which obviously means Ho-oh is going to be fairly low ranked.
Thousand arrows makes Ho-oh sad :[

TL;dr Ho-oh to C- or something

Esteemed user Silver_Lucario42 has already posted a couple of sets so I'll try not to repeat them but here's some anyway
Ho-Oh @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Desolate Land
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Careful Nature
- Spectral Thief
- V-create
- U-turn
- Slack Off

This desolate land set can act as a check to most POgre sets, especially bulky boost PH ones that commonly run Water/Fairy or Water/Ice coverage with spore and I suppose other water types but who uses those? The weather also boosts V-create's power so that this set isn't too passive; even with a neutral nature at can OHKO Pokémon such as mmy and obviously threatens steel types.

+1 252 SpA Kyogre-Primal Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Ho-Oh: 100-118 (24 - 28.3%) -- 96.2% chance to 4HKO

Ho-Oh @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Fur Coat
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Careful Nature
- Spectral Thief
- V-create
- U-turn
- Slack Off

Yeah ok it's the same set but with Fur Coat. This can take most things a mmx is likely to throw at it (it can switch into any move above 5% in http://www.smogon.com/stats/2017-07/moveset/gen7balancedhackmons-1760.txt from a no item Stakeout mmx, although it dies to contrary psycho boost).


Couldn't make a post about Ho-oh without mentioning a set I've shamelessly stolen from a RMT and used to great effect (with a small amendment):

Khonsu (Ho-Oh) @ Saftey Goggles
Ability: Turboblaze
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Pursuit
- Spore
- Stealth Rock
- V-create

I'm not sure why this set is good but it seems to be.
 
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Gengar is still in the role compendium under Stallbreakers and Shadow Tag so this needs fixing.
Something I forgot to mention last post: maybe sandstream for ttar as a possible ability (although obviously we can't have every viable ability listed as it would be HUGE but I thought it was worth mentioning even if it doesn't get listed)

I was going to edit my ho-oh comments into the last post but I left it a couple of days so I thought I'd just post again:
Ho-oh - the majestic bird Pokemon who enjoys nothing better than supporting LGBT rights with its rainbow attire.
I know this Pokemon is often considered PDon's older, less successful brother who dropped out of highschool and got locked up for petty crime but it has some key virtues that mean it does have a niche.
First and foremost is it's bulk. With 106/90/154 on the physical side it's nothing to write home about but it's special bulk is definitely notable being similar to Giratina's and better than Registeel's. The other factor that distinguishes it is it's typing Fire/Flying which gives a load of useful resists: Fire, Fairy, Fighting, Steel and a Ground immunity while it only has 3 weaknesses: water, electric and rock.
What roles does it carry out? It can be a very reliable Pixilate Diancie check even without an ability due to resisting Fairy as well as all the usual coverage types as well as having the special bulk to take resisted boombursts like a champ (harder than it sounds). Resisting Fighting, Fairy and Steel also helps it to check certain MMX sets, especially stakeout, which often runs these types and can do so better with an ability such as fur coat.
It's 4× Rock weakness has to be careful taken into account due to good hazard control being needed. However, if teams can run shedinja which instantly dies to stealth rocks as well as spikes and dies a little less instantly to toxic spikes, it's definitely possible to keep on top of hazards if you build with that in mind and it's this team support which obviously means Ho-oh is going to be fairly low ranked.
Thousand arrows makes Ho-oh sad :[

TL;dr Ho-oh to C- or something

Esteemed user Silver_Lucario42 has already posted a couple of sets so I'll try not to repeat them but here's some anyway
Ho-Oh @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Desolate Land
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Careful Nature
- Spectral Thief
- V-create
- U-turn
- Slack Off

This desolate land set can act as a check to most POgre sets, especially bulky boost PH ones that commonly run Water/Fairy or Water/Ice coverage with spore and I suppose other water types but who uses those? The weather also boosts V-create's power so that this set isn't too passive; even with a neutral nature at can OHKO Pokémon such as mmy and obviously threatens steel types.

+1 252 SpA Kyogre-Primal Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Ho-Oh: 100-118 (24 - 28.3%) -- 96.2% chance to 4HKO

Ho-Oh @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Fur Coat
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Careful Nature
- Spectral Thief
- V-create
- U-turn
- Slack Off

Yeah ok it's the same set but with Fur Coat. This can take most things a mmx is likely to throw at it (it can switch into any move above 5% in http://www.smogon.com/stats/2017-07/moveset/gen7balancedhackmons-1760.txt from a no item Stakeout mmx, although it dies to contrary psycho boost).


Couldn't make a post about Ho-oh without mentioning a set I've shamelessly stolen from a RMT and used to great effect (with a small amendment):

Khonsu (Ho-Oh) @ Saftey Goggles
Ability: Turboblaze
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Pursuit
- Spore
- Stealth Rock
- V-create

I'm not sure why this set is good but it seems to be.
Its bulk is like a sightly better reverse Pdon, but many of the special attackers can hit Ho-Oh hard in one way or another. MMY can 2HKO with almost any set due to Psystrike.
252 SpA Mewtwo-Mega-Y Psystrike vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Ho-Oh: 187-222 (44.9 - 53.3%) -- 33.2% chance to 2HKO
Add surge, specs, whatever. Mray can totally go mixed since it has 180/180 and it 2HKOes with Dragon Ascent.
252 Atk Rayquaza-Mega Dragon Ascent vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Ho-Oh: 211-250 (50.7 - 60%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Gengar goes with Normalize. Yes it can be spored and it won't be 2HKOing Ho-Oh but getting Spored doesn't depend on Ho-Oh. (You can splash spore on anything).
Kyogre goes for STAB SE moves.
252 SpA Kyogre-Primal Scald vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Ho-Oh: 194-230 (46.6 - 55.2%) -- 71.1% chance to 2HKO
Any -ate bar pixi brute forces it. Most need a little of chip damage or specs but if Ho-Oh is intended to be a wall then I don't see how it is going to be at full hp all the times.
So its walls pixiliate and Sceptile when Unaware + Safety Googles. Except that when SR are up it doesn't work. You need an entire team to avoid SR and then it is matchup reliant because if your defogger is Maudino and it has to Defog in the face of specs surge MMY or band Pdon then you are going to have a bad time. Same for rapid spin except now you are giving free turns on tina and gengar. And tina can 2HKO with spectral thief after SR.
An immunity to ground is debatable since Thousand Arrows still targets flying stuff and in the case of Ho-Oh it starts receiving SE hits. Even pixi Diancie may run TArrows since Celesteela sometimes is used. Diancie 3HKOes Ho-Oh only because in the first turn it deals half damage, then if Ho-Oh wants to live it has to run Strenght Sap or spam whatever recovery it is running because otherwise it only gets a turn. And don't forget that Diancie is able to run Steam Eruption that while it generally targets just Pdon (OHKO at that) it is good enough to threaten Ho-Oh.
On the other hand, running it immune to passive damage prevents Ho-Oh from dealing with setup.
252 SpA Diancie Steam Eruption vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Ho-Oh: 164-194 (39.4 - 46.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
And Ho-Oh dies to rock coverage anyway, and while I recognize that it is very underutilized, it has nice neutral coverage as only Steel (that tanks half the meta anyway), Fighting (AKA MMX) and Ground(AKA pdon, but it ends up taking neutral hits from Rock anyway) resist it. Very little is weak to that, but flying behaves similarly and -ate is still usable.
 
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Ho-oh without Magic Guard has one big problem: Stealth Rock. An Unaware mon which loses 50% of its health on the switchin cannot be viable, as the opponent doesn't need boosts to 2HKO it afterwards.
I can see where you're coming from but I think calling it completely unviable is a bit far. However, it is difficult to maintain throughout a battle which is why I don't run it and neither do many other players. That being said, it has an excellent time making sure the Pokémon that it is meant to check have as bad a time as possible dealing with it when the criteria is met (That being rocks not existing on your side of the field).
 
Ho-Oh definitely has its problems, but it is really flexible beyond those issues. Fur Coat, Regenvest, defensive Unaware, offensive Unaware, Physical Aerilate, Mixed Aerilate, Poison Heal, Magic Guard, Desolate Land, Mold Breaker... all of them are viable. I've not experimented enough with it to figure out the most optimal options of those, but I think its versatility really does warrant a passage out of D-rank. I mean, when you see Ho-Oh at team preview, you really can't be 100% sure what it'll be doing. Its drawbacks plus competing with Primal Groudon and Mega-Rayquaza though should keep it from ascending too much, however.
 
I wanted to see if we could possibly consider for role compendum non-Psychic Terrain setters. One reason is because Prankster Nature Power is blocked by Psychic Terrain, so it is counter productive, and because Psychic Terrain is already its own established role, on things like Deoxys-A, Mega Mewtwo-Y, etc.

I know Electric Terrain is likely the second best Terrain because it can combine with Galvanize, prevent Sleep (removing the necessity for Safety Googles, even if you Spore a Flying type with Magic Bounce), pairs well when you change abilities through form changes, and overall boosts Electric moves which hits A and S ranked Water types like Kyogre-Primal hard. It also gives the equivalent of STAB coverage to Pokémon like Groudon so they can hit things hard that resist their attacks, without fear from Imposters (think Primordial Sea or Flash Fire Scizor being hit by Electric Terrain boosted Bolt Strike; base 195 Damage), or even Mega-Gyarados. Electric Terrain also pairs well with Thunder on Rain abilities, think of Electric Surge Kyogre with Blue Orb).

It also allows Flying types whom are immune to Electric Terrain to be hit with Sleep and according to Bulbapedia: It boosts the power of Electric-type moves used by affected Pokémon by 50% (regardless of whether the target of the move is affected by Electric Terrain). So Bolt Strike Zekrom/Groudon's Attacks on Primordial Sea Celesteelia are still Boosted.

Lastly, it can boost Speed with Surge Surfer if you don't mind Speed tieing with an Imposter, and want to not lose the speed boost after switching out (like you would from Unburden).

As for other Terrains:

Keep in mind, Misty Terrain also prevents Sleep, as well as even self-induced status like Toxic/Flame Orb (preventing Poison Heal), turns into Moon Blast upon Nature Power (useful for Prankster sets), and reduces Dragon damage which can be useful for Dragons that skip stab moves like Giratina which oftentimes prefers Circle Throw over Dragon Tail to be Imposter-proof. Misty Terrain is like a Safeguard for both teams, which in some ways gives you justification for packing less status moves (since it protects the foe as well), and gives your more reason to focus on healing, boosts, hazards and attacking moves, and removes some of the need for Magic Bounce, Poison Heal, etc. on your team and allows for more balanced play. Misty Surge can also pair well with Giratina to reduce Dragon damage. Think of Misty Surge being played on a team with an Unburden Pokémon with Misty Seed. Not only can it be used to double Speed, but it can boost Special Defense on switch-in, all the while the user is immune to Status effects. It's like Agility+Safeguard+Assault Vest in 1 turn on Solgaleo, having the option to now use status moves, not fearing burn, Sleep, or paralysis and being faster than even Imposter.

Grassy Terrain- Nature Power Becomes Energy Ball, and it heals both sides of the field 6.25%, but the point is to boost already powerful Grass types like Kartana with Power Whip, or Mega-Sceptile with Contrary Leaf Storm or Adaptability Seed Flare to new levels. Not as useful, unless you pick the best STAB types out their, it's the least effective in general, but can at least be used to clear opposing Psychic Terrains and can come in handy if you build your team around it. Grassy Terrain also pairs well with Solar Sword on Sunny Day abilities (think of Grassy Surge Groudon with Red Orb).

Keep in mind, when combined with a corresponding Seed item, Unburden sets can capitalize on getting +1 Def or SpD while doubling Speed (something Imposters's cannot do). Unlike most consumable items, they are immediate upon switch-in (provided a Terrain is up and the user isn't a flying type), so you can use a Surger to set up a Terrain, pass to an Unburden user, and they get double speed and a 50% boost to either defense, all while not fearing Knock Off impacting their strategy. (Grassy and Misty Seeds can replace Assault Vest for immediate boosts without hindering Move choices, can be Baton passed and can be stacked with Simple, Unburden, and isn't impacted by Knock-off/Trick).

Lastly, consuming the Seed also boosts Acrobatics, so if your Mega-Tyranitar needs to hit a Bug/Grass/Fighting type with a 110 (220 when Super Effective) Flying Move look no further.

Here is an example of half of a synergy team.

I call these sets: Automatic
Kyogre @ Blue Orb
Ability: Electric Surge
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Thunder
- Steam Eruption
- Frost Breath
- Shell Smash

Kyogre adds an immunity to Sleep, gains STAB on Thunder through the terrain, gains a second STAB on Steam Eruption through Primordial Sea, always critical hits to break past SpD boosts on foes and -SpA nerfs from Prankster Topsy Turvey with Frost Breath, and sweeps with Shell Smash.

I view it as giving Kyogre a Choice Specs for Thunder and Steam Eruption.

Oftentimes, Electric Surge catches people off guard when they try and Spore, and they don't see the effect because of the color and animation of Primordial Sea.

Kyogre can counter Mega-Gyarados, opposing Kyogre, better handles Flying types like Yvetal, and Thunder is at perfect accuracy or 30% when foes use Protect. Thunder also has a 30% chance to Paralyze, which pairs nicely with Steam Eruption.

Any Kyogre Imposter user has to face this:

Groudon @ Red Orb
Ability: Electric Surge
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 0 SpA
- Thousand Waves/Arrows
- Sacred Fire
- Shift Gear
- Bolt Strike

Perfectly counters Imposter Kyogre and most opposing Kyogre regardless, thanks to Bolt Strike.

Sacred Fire and Bolt Strike gain a secondary STAB, and STAB bonus, respectively, as well as a great set of coverage where Bolt Strike lets you use Thousand Waves over Thousand Arrows as you can hit Flying-types Super Effectively, and handle opposing Yvetal, Mega-Gyarados, Lugia, etc.

Electric Terrain negates the need for Safety Goggles, adds power and prevents other Sleep tactics like Rest and Yawn.

Further, Sacred Fire packs a 50% burn rate, and Bolt Strike packs a 20% Paralysis rate, similar to the secondary effects listed on Kyogre.

The benefits of Electric Surge also allow my Prankster teammate to thrive:

Ampharos-Mega @ Red Card / Life Orb
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
-Spe Nature, +SpA
IVs: 0 Spe
- Core Enforcer
- Nature Power
- Copycat
- Tail Glow

Ampharos can go first with Nature Power turning into Thunderbolt, thanks to Electric Surge, and gets both a STAB and a terrain boost. Core Enforcer, with its low Speed, allows it to go second to deactivate abilities, followed by Copycat or Nature Power to go first, thanks to Prankster, on the next turn to hit twice (2x) in a row. Backed by Tail Glow, Ampharos will surprise foes with how strong it's hits land and if Electric Surge runs out, Tri Attack, backed by Tail Glow will still hurt, allowing it to dent Ground and Grass types that expect more Electric Attacks (like Groudon-Primal), oftentimes resulting in 2HKOs:

+3 252+ SpA Mold Breaker Ampharos-Mega Tri Attack vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Groudon-Primal: 242-285 (59.9 - 70.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
--
+3 252+ SpA Life Orb Ampharos-Mega Tri Attack vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Zygarde-Complete: 303-357 (47.6 - 56.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

+3 252+ SpA Life Orb Ampharos-Mega Tri Attack vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Groudon-Primal: 315-370 (77.9 - 91.5%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

Red Card is to be used up the turn you survive the hit when you used Tail Glow, allowing you to force a switch and leave your foe unprepared. Life Orb is an option as well.

Ampharos also has good synergy with the prior 2: Water/Grass/Electric resists, while Kyogre resists Ice, and Groudon resists Fairy. (I included Water in the event that a foe Core Enforces Groudon and it loses its Water Immunity, or if the foe has Primordial Sea, Delta Stream, Cloud Nine, Entrainment, etc.) Ampharos also makes use of its Flying Resistance for Aerilate Rayquaza (Core Enforcer for the KO), etc.

Alternative:
Code:
 Sometimes I replace Ampharos-Mega with Drampa for STAB, Spectral Thief Immunity, and slower Speed.

+3 252+ SpA Silk Scarf Drampa Tri Attack vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Groudon-Primal: 373-441 (92.3 - 109.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

+3 252+ SpA Silk Scarf Drampa Tri Attack vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Zygarde-Complete: 361-426 (56.7 - 66.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

+3 252+ SpA Silk Scarf Drampa Tri Attack vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Kyogre-Primal: 249-294 (61.6 - 72.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Both Ampharos-Mega and Drumpa also resists Fire, Water, and Electric moves listed in the above Kyogre and Groudon sets that Imposters use.
 
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Those pre-primal terrain-setting abilites have one problem: they can activate only once per game, just before primal reversion happens - so that you only get 5 turns of electric terrain and can't re-set it after it runs out. 5 turns is a pretty short time considering how long BH matches usually last - and often you will not be able to benefit from all 5 terrain turns, as you can easily get forced out. I would rather use a pokemon which can set the terrain multiple times throughout the match, just like Psychic Surge MMY does it to block priority against its teammates - this also frees up the item slot on the primals for better items like boosting items, plates or Z-crystals.

Also, you should better improof Kyogre, because your PDon fails to do it:
+2 252 SpA Kyogre-Primal Frost Breath vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Groudon-Primal on a critical hit: 212-250 (52.4 - 61.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Groudon-Primal Bolt Strike vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Kyogre-Primal in Electric Terrain: 506-596 (71.8 - 84.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (250 HP base for Imposter Chansey)
As the Imposter outspeeds you because of the copied Shell Smash boosts, you can't kill it, even when it predicts wrong and uses Thunder or Steam Eruption on the switch.

Ampharos is more like a big gimmick which works against low ladder - just like shuckle and cosmoem :D - but it gets pretty much shut down by the common thicc steels, fairis and invites psychic surge MMY to switch into a copycatted Core Eenforcer. Considering this calc: 252 SpA Zygarde-Complete Core Enforcer vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Ampharos-Mega: 188-224 (48.9 - 58.3%) -- 98% chance to 2HKO it can't even switch into the weakest of the defensive dragons.
 
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Misty Surge is cool and really under-utilized. Status is very common and Core Enforcer is rampant and Misty not only provides defense against both, but also solidly disrupts Psychic Terrain. For example, Misty Terrain Giratina with Spectral Thief and not running min-speed can easily check Surge Smash MMX/Y, Sash or not, and can also pretty much freely directly switch into non-Specs Psycho Boost at the cost of needing to Recover next turn.

However, I don't think there are currently any standard users to add to the role compendium.


Also, I was going to wait until after the OMFL so I could do some good comparison tests by directly switching it for a standard Pokemon and vice versa on my teams, but Real Life™ suddenly has me on indefinite hiatus from battling. I have time to sit down and finish writing this post I started a while back, but not enough time to sit down and do a few hours of testing. Since I dunno if I'll be able to get to that testing in a week from now or months from now, I'll play it safe and go ahead and post now.


But nominating Mega Manectric for at least C-rank, but actually targeting B-rank. Holy crap, why so high though? Simple: Xurkitree. Running some numbers, they're almost the same Pokemon with a couple of tweaks, particularly Specs Manectric and Scarf Xurkitree (which I know is a thing.) Timid Manectric sits at 405 speed. Modest Scarf Xurkitree sits at 397.5 speed (so, 397 if I'm correct that decimals are simply dropped in calculations.) Timid Scarf Xurk sits at 436.5 speed. The difference between unboosted Manectric and Scarf Timid Xurkitree's speed is same nature normal Hoopa, Mega-Sceptile, and, this one is, yes, a biggie, Mewtwo-Y.

The damage between Scarf Xurk and Specs Mega-Mane? Well...

252 SpA Galvanize Xurkitree Boomburst vs. 248 HP / 252 SpD Arceus: 237-280 (53.4 - 63.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

252+ SpA Galvanize Xurkitree Boomburst vs. 248 HP / 252 SpD Arceus: 261-307 (58.9 - 69.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

252 SpA Choice Specs Galvanize Manectric-Mega Boomburst vs. 248 HP / 252 SpD Arceus: 295-348 (66.5 - 78.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Assuming both Timid for fairness, that's a ~13-15% damage difference in, surprisingly, Manectric's favor on this particular calculation. That might not seem like much, but that's the difference between U-Turn chip + Boomburst 2HKO potental. Or 3 layers of Spikes potential OHKO, but not many teams use Spikes. Modest Xurk narrows the gap to less than 10%, but that's still on Timid Manectric. Modest though?

252+ SpA Choice Specs Galvanize Manectric-Mega Boomburst vs. 248 HP / 252 SpD Arceus: 322-381 (72.6 - 86%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

~20-23% advantage over Timid Xurk and ~14-17% over Modest. Which means, Timid Scarf Xurk is better at popping almost the whole meta with a high powered Boomburst while either nature Specs Manectric is better at being quite fast and hitting quite hard at the same time. This isn't the whole crux of my argument, but I think it makes a strong opening case. I mean, Specs Xurk will wall break better than Manectric could without set-up while Scarf Manectric can run circles around the entire unboosted meta and significant portions of the boosted meta, allowing it to pose a significant threat to other fast and frail Pokemon.

Beyond Scarf and Specs stuff, Manectric differentiates itself from Xurk in trading power for speed. Both have really similar bulk (about a .01% difference in damage from Arceus' Boomburst) so there's no advantage to gain or lose there. As such, in non Scarf/Specs sets, where Xurkitree is used as a sledgehammer to break down stubborn walls, Manectric is a bit more finesse, coming in to hit really fast, scare off other fast Pokemon, and then bail out before the incoming counter-attack. As such, I've found a few sets that work well for this.

Manectric-Mega @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Galvanize
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Boomburst
- Ice Beam / Steam Eruption
- Encore
- Spore

The original set I've showcased. Acts as fast, offensive support/disruption with solid unboosted damage that can threaten most neutral Pokemon and is capable of beating stuff like Soundproof Perish Trap, Imprison Transform Eviolite Chansey, Sub-Spore set-up, and other stuff by stopping them from even getting their strategy moving. It can also put most offensive threats to sleep and then blow them up before they wake up. However, the set is quite flexible, such as swapping Spore for Glare to focus on crippling offensive teams harder. Or do other things, such as...


Manectric-Mega @ Icium Z
Ability: Galvanize
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Boomburst
- Ice Beam
- Encore
- Stealth Rock

Here's a variation. Most of Manectric's switch-ins are not Magic Bounce, so it can set-up rocks quite easily. Most bouncers are hit pretty hard by Boomburst, so bouncing rocks is pretty risky for them since Manectric outspeeds all common Bouncers and can 2HKO a significant chunk of them, such as Mega-Audino. Encore still does dickish Encore things and Icium allows Manectric to outright OHKO non-Assault Vest Zygarde-Cs. Or reliably 2HKO Giratinas who think they can just tank the Ice Beams, which is important since Giratina likes to Bounce too. Just, Ice Beam first and then finish with Z-Ice Beam.


Manectric-Mega @ Icium Z
Ability: Galvanize
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Boomburst
- Steam Eruption
- Ice Beam
- Volt Switch

Or here you can go full-on lure to nuke Manectric's expected checks. Steam Eruption OHKO's non-immune non-Vest Primaldon. And, more importantly, outspeeds it too, something Xurk would have to rely on prediction to get right since Primaldon would otherwise just shrug and nuke it with a Ground move first. Manectric also outspeeds speed-invested Zygarde, which is important so it can avoid damage when OHKOing it with Z-Ice Beam. Volt Switch, meanwhile, chips stuff while letting Mane escape and grabs momentum off of normal switches, which Mane can often force on something that doesn't want to eat a Boomburst.



The shown sets are things Xurkitree could theoretically do, but does worse without the speed since it becomes very prediction reliant. Manectric... doesn't need to predict like that. Its faster than almost everything it'll face so it knows at the start of the turn if it can take on the opponent or needs to bail, rather than "please swap Primaldon into my Steam Eruption". Xurk still directly wall breaks better, and probably Shell Smashes better too since at +2 it outspeeds all unboosted Pokemon anyway. But Mega-Mane definitely fills a few of the pairs of shoes Xurk is already wearing and exchanges the pairs it can't wear well for ones Xurk can't either.

So, if you've tried and like Xurk, seriously give Manectric a spin.


As for other possible sets? Well, Galvanize is what enables Manectric. Without it, it's fairly gimmicky. It can imitate Xurk's Sheer Force and Surge Surfer sets, run a Refrigerate lure set, and if you wanna get really niche, I've run a successful Dry Skin + LO + Thunder set on a rain team. But, I'd only consider the Galvanize set to be the only thing worth noting on any viability rating.
 
Those pre-primal terrain-setting abilites have one problem: they can activate only once per game, just before primal reversion happens - so that you only get 5 turns of electric terrain and can't re-set it after it runs out. 5 turns is a pretty short time considering how long BH matches usually last - and often you will not be able to benefit from all 5 terrain turns, as you can easily get forced out. I would rather use a pokemon which can set the terrain multiple times throughout the match, just like Psychic Surge MMY does it to block priority against its teammates - this also frees up the item slot on the primals for better items like boosting items, plates or Z-crystals.

Also, you should better improof Kyogre, because your PDon fails to do it:
+2 252 SpA Kyogre-Primal Frost Breath vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Groudon-Primal on a critical hit: 212-250 (52.4 - 61.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Groudon-Primal Bolt Strike vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Kyogre-Primal in Electric Terrain: 506-596 (71.8 - 84.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (250 HP base for Imposter Chansey)
As the Imposter outspeeds you because of the copied Shell Smash boosts, you can't kill it, even when it predicts wrong and uses Thunder or Steam Eruption on the switch.

Ampharos is more like a big gimmick which works against low ladder - just like shuckle and cosmoem :D - but it gets pretty much shut down by the common thicc steels, fairis and invites psychic surge MMY to switch into a copycatted Core Eenforcer. Considering this calc: 252 SpA Zygarde-Complete Core Enforcer vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Ampharos-Mega: 188-224 (48.9 - 58.3%) -- 98% chance to 2HKO it can't even switch into the weakest of the defensive dragons.
The rest of my team is fast, I use Deoxys-S to pile on hazards for the switch in, and Nuzzle to paralyze so my Primals outspeed, I then use my primals mid-game and Ampharos for clean up.
Remember with my Calculations, for Ampharos, Tail Glow does just fine with Tri a Attack, you don't really need Electric moves, and Electric terrain clears Psychic terrain. Mega-Mewtwo often stay in on Kyogre expecting a switch if they think I fear Psystrike, while Kyogre Shell Smashes, if they have Focus Sash when I send in Amphhros I surprise them with Priority Electric Surge boosted Thunderbolt.
Keep in mind that typically the Kyogre Imposters think they can handle whatever Kyogre will do, sometimes they even Shell Smash expecting me to switch while I use Thunder, lowering their SpD. Thunder + Electric Terrain is 165 base power, Galvanize Boomburst is 168, they are comparable in power.

Imposters use Thunder when I switch to Groudon Primal. If we assume the Chansey has accumulated at least some prior hazard damage (12.5%), and that they can both survive a single hit, and Groudon.

I use Misty Terrain on my Prankster Assist team:
Reminder of how Assist works:
Greetings everyone, I created a better than average (at least where Assist-Prankster teams are concerned) team that I want some helpful feedback on. Keep in mind, using Assist restricts the number of moves your team can have, as you want Assist to only be able to call upon 1 move so that you can guarantee that you get V-Create. For a list of moves that are not called upon by Assist (and therefore the only "safe" moves you can use on the rest of your team's moveslots), check this link here: http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Assist_(move)

Remember, moves that seem like they shouldn't be called upon, like Baneful Bunker, are not included on the list and therefore shouldn't be assumed just because they are like "Protect". I have tested and noticed that Baneful Bunker, and any other move not on that list is indeed called upon by Assist.

Introduction:
My goal of this team is to provide effective coverage to counter common threats to anti-priority users, whether through the use of Fairy moves against Dark-types, or through loopholes like Copycat+Shadow Force. Let's see if we can make this team the best possible Gen 7 Prankster Assist team. I know each generation this team archetype is theorymoned, but I have tested this team and it seems to be quite useful in countering some common checks and threats.

My 2 Diancie-Mega are focused on the removal of the following 5 types of Counters:
1. Dark-types (Due to Immunity to Prankster)- Tyranitar-Mega, Greninja-Ash, Yveltal
2. Psychic Surge/users (Commonly Psychic types): Mewtwo-Y, Deoxys-A
3. Dazzling/Queenly Majesty users: Pheromosa, Deoxys-A/S
4. Triage/-Ate users (i.e. Triage Heracross, Triage Rayquaza-Mega, -Ate Fake-out/Extreme Speed Pixelate Diancie-Mega, Aerilate Rayquaza-Mega, Refrigerate Kyurem-Black/White, Galvanize Xurkitree)
5. Tanks: Zygarde, Giratina

With the introduction over, lets get started!

Diancie-Mega @ Choice Specs
Ability: Misty Surge
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Mild Nature
- Nature Power
- V-create
- Trick
- Shadow Force
I knew packing Assist meant limiting my team's move sets severely, and it also meant picking only the absolute best Pokemon/items/abilities to cover multiple roles at once.
[1] Diancie-Mega's Special Attack after Specs hits 690. Nature Power turns into Moonblast under Misty Terrain. Further, Diancie's high Attack allows it to serve as a great Mixed Attacker with V-Create/Shadow Force, which makes for strong coverage versus non-Flash Fire Registeel, and allows it to hit Aegislash super effectively with one move regardless of its ability.
[2] Mega-Diancie's role is far beyond an effective mixed sweeper, as Misty Surge not only prevents Toxic Orb from activating on PH Pokemon, but provides protection from Spore, Nuzzle and other status effects that would otherwise require the use of Safety Googles, or Lum Berry. It most importantly removes Psychic Surge, and helps my team actually use Prankster, not to mention remove the boost for Psychic attacks, and halve the damage of Dragon Moves.
[3] Mega-Diancie's awesome typing lets me to switch it in to prevent common Dragon moves like Core Enforcer, and Dragon Tail from ruining the momentum of my Pranksters, while still having enough resistances to make-up for its lower HP, allowing it to survive Oblivion Wings from Rayquaza-Mega and KO with Moonblast.
[4] Lastly, Diancie-Mega's ability to disarm Normalize Gengar with Trick (removing their Spooky Plate) before I switch to a Ghost-type is priceless!

Mild Nature improves Special Attack and lowers Defense, as I wont be out speeding Rayquaza, and once it realizes I don't use Pixelate it will likely hit with Oblivion Wing or if it has Aerilate it will just Boomburst rather than Extreme Speed.

Counter/Checks Section Diancie-Mega Damage Calculations:
1. Dark-types: +1 252+ SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Tyranitar-Mega: 416-492 (102.9 - 121.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+1 252+ SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Tyranitar-Mega: 380-450 (94 - 111.3%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO
+1 252+ SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Yveltal: 476-564 (104.3 - 123.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+1 252+ SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Yveltal: 434-512 (95.1 - 112.2%) -- 75% chance to OHKO
+1 252+ SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Greninja-Ash: 584-690 (167.8 - 198.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO

2. Psychic Surgers: +1 252+ SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Mewtwo-Mega-Y: 208-246 (50 - 59.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+1 252+ SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Deoxys-Attack: 507-597 (166.7 - 196.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO

3. Dazzling/Queenly Majesty:
+1 252+ SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Pheromosa: 816-960 (235.8 - 277.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Diancie-Mega Shadow Force vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Deoxys-Speed: 260-306 (85.5 - 100.6%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO
+1 252+ SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Deoxys-Speed: 253-298 (83.2 - 98%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

4. Triage/-Ate Users: +1 252 SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Heracross-Mega: 416-492 (114.2 - 135.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+1 252+ SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Rayquaza-Mega: 474-558 (114.4 - 134.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+1 252+ SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Kyurem-White: 474-558 (104.4 - 122.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+1 252+ SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Kyurem-Black: 506-596 (111.4 - 131.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+1 252+ SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Xurkitree: 292-345 (78.9 - 93.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

5. Tanks: +1 252+ SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Zygarde-Complete: 444-524 (69.8 - 82.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+1 252+ SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Zygarde-Complete: 488-576 (76.7 - 90.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+1 252 SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Giratina: 344-408 (68.2 - 80.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+1 252 SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Giratina: 378-446 (75 - 88.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO


Diancie-Mega @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Misty Surge
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Lonely Nature
- Nature Power
- V-create
- Shadow Force
- Trick
Notes are hidden to keep the overall post shorter
I decided to use a Scarf Diancie-Mega because I needed a Fairy type Revenge Killer for my team. [1] Being able to switch into stuff like Dazzling Pheromosa and block Spore and KO with Moonblast, not to mention handle fast Dark types like Greninja-Ash that block Prankster helps tremendously.
[2] Scarf paired with Shadow Force also allows Diancie-Mega to threaten Normalize Mega-Gengar, which can pose a threat to my other Diancie-Mega, not to mention, it has general use for the fact it can bypass all forms of Protect including King's Shield when the foe expects a V-Create.
[3] V-create provides awesome neutral coverage, and deals with common switch-ins like Magic Bounce Registeel, especially when paired with Shadow Force to handle Flash Fire Aegislash. Trick can be replaced by Destiny Bond, but I find Trick to be more helpful, especially in the start of the match if I see that only 1 or two of the foe's Pokemon are going to be fast while the rest are slower or bulky.
[4] Scarf is obviously necessary to outspeed Deoxys-S, as well as M-Rayquaza, as Triage outpaces my Prankster V-creates, which is a problem due to the Defense and Special Defense drops. I also use 2 Diancie-Mega because it confuses the foe as the match drags on, and in the beginning they think at least 1 of them may have Pixelate, and they switch out their Dragon or Dark type (like Rayquaza-Mega fearing a Fake-out + Extreme Speed combo).

Diancie reaches 478 Speed with Scarf, and used a Lonely Nature to Maximize Attack, while lowering Special Defense because Rayquaza will see that I am faster than it, and if it is Aerilate, it will opt for Extreme Speed, rather than Boomburst, which allows me to handle the hits better as I Moonblast.
Additional Info:
I can also abuse Trick to weaken Chansey with the removal of Eviolite, before switching to a Fire/Fairy resist like Groudon-Primal to resist V-Create and Moonblast (or a Ghost-type if Misty Surge has worn-off). If they opt for Shadow Force, I can switch to a Chansey of my own and since Imposter wont activate on their Imposter Chansey, I can let my Normal Chansey switch in safely, which prevents it from being completely Imposter bait. (Yes Chansey can always Trick it back, but at least it's Defenses are weakened, and if the Speed tie puts my Diancie-Mega before Chansey, then Chansey is locked in to whatever move it chooses and cannot switch moves next turn).


Diancie-Mega Calculations:
1. Dark-types: 252 SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Tyranitar-Mega: 254-300 (62.8 - 74.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Yveltal: 290-344 (63.5 - 75.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Greninja-Ash: 356-420 (102.2 - 120.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO

2. Psychic Surger: 252+ Atk Diancie-Mega Shadow Force vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Mewtwo-Mega-Y: 332-392 (79.8 - 94.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Diancie-Mega Shadow Force vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Deoxys-Attack: 568-670 (186.8 - 220.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
3. Dazzling/Queenly Majesty:
252+ Atk Diancie-Mega V-create vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Pheromosa: 686-808 (198.2 - 233.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO252 SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Pheromosa: 494-584 (142.7 - 168.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO252+ Atk Diancie-Mega Shadow Force vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Deoxys-Speed: 284-336 (93.4 - 110.5%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO

4. Triage/-Ate:

252+ Atk Diancie-Mega V-create vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Heracross-Mega: 362-426 (99.4 - 117%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Heracross-Mega: 278-330 (76.3 - 90.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Rayquaza-Mega: 288-338 (69.5 - 81.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Kyurem-Black: 306-362 (67.4 - 79.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Kyurem-White: 288-338 (63.4 - 74.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Diancie-Mega V-create vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Xurkitree: 333-392 (90 - 105.9%) -- 37.5% chance to OHKO

5. Tanks:
252 SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Zygarde-Complete: 296-350 (46.5 - 55%) -- 66.4% chance to 2HKO
252 SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Zygarde-Complete: 270-320 (42.4 - 50.3%) -- 0.4% chance to 2HKO
252 SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Giratina: 254-300 (50.3 - 59.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Giratina: 230-272 (45.6 - 53.9%) -- 46.9% chance to 2HKO
252+ Atk Diancie-Mega Shadow Force vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Giratina: 234-276 (46.4 - 54.7%) -- 62.1% chance to 2HKO
252+ Atk Diancie-Mega Shadow Force vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Giratina: 214-252 (42.4 - 50%) -- 0.4% chance to 2H
KO


Banette @ Banettite
Ability: Drought
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Assist
- V-create
- Shadow Force
- Copycat

I knew that the only way to bypass the Ability Clause was through Mega Evolution or Primal Reversion, and after checking out what Banette's Drought could accomplish for the entire team, I knew I had myself a powerful support Pokemon.
[1] Drought is really invaluable, and depending on the foe's team, I sometimes lead with it before switching to Diancie-Mega. After all, if I lead with Diancie-Mega, the foe will know it isn't a Pixelate Pokemon, and they will not waste their turn going for Spore when they see Misty Terrain. But If I set the Sun and switch to Diancie on say a Deoxys-S' Spore, I accomplished 2 field effects at once, all while making the foe waste their turn.
[2] I really try to be strategic with Bannette, as I don't always Mega-Evolve it right away, as it can power up the V-Create for the rest of my team, and at least weaken Water-moves used against them. When I do Mega-Evolve, it is oftentimes a surprise that Bannette-Mega has Prankster. Further, it becomes a bigger surprise how powerful Bannette's 471 Attack V-Creates hurts when under the Sun.
[3] One thing many Dark-types and Psychic Surge Pokemon are not immune to are Shadow Force under Copycat. The reason for it is due to the fact they only block priority moves that target the user, while Copycat doesn't target anyone during the first turn of Shadow Force. Further, Shadow Force allows me to Stall out the foes and hit for massive damage with near impunity, while still posing a threat to Giratina, Flash Fire Aegislash, and others that think they can handle V-Create. Of course, I still use V-Create in my set over, say Destiny Bond, because it's always great to use V-Create on a predicted switch to a Dark-type like Yveltal, which would block my Prankster.


Chansey @ Eviolite
Ability: Imposter
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Bold Nature
- Destiny Bond
- Whirlwind
- King's Shield
- Copycat

I used to have 2 Imposters before I decided it was best to have 2 Diancie-Mega.
[1] I found that 1 Chansey was really all I needed due to so many Imposterproof sets running around. Of course, the best part about Imposter, is that fact that it is Imposterproof itself, plus it can use moves that don't count against Assist.
[2] Being able to clear and set-up hazards is extremely helpful on a team like this, which not only forces switches, but requires you to switch out. Sometimes, the only way is through Imposter, and this requires me to have at least 1 per team.

Marowak-Alola @ Thick Club
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Assist
- Copycat
- Shadow Force
- V-create

I know many people may wonder what Marowak-Alola brings to the team that a second Groudon-Primal doesn't.
[1] Being immune to being Trapped is extremely useful, as is having the ability to switch into Facade from PH Slaking, Regigas due to the Immunity, as well as the key resistances to Bug, and Grass allow it to perfectly counter Triage Heracross and avoid damage from High Jump Kick Phermosa. Further, unlike Groudon it is able to come in on Pixelate Diancie-Mega's Fake Out and survive the Boomburst next turn in order to start abusing Shadow Force and Copycat.
[2] Marowak serves as the in-between of Bannette and Groudon, while also being slower than Bannette, which allows its Shadow Force to go slower on the second turn, and stay invulnerable. Yes, Groudon can use any hold item, but Marowak-Alola can take better advantage of the STAB moves that don't impact Assist.

Groudon-Primal @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Brave Nature
- Assist
- V-create
- Nature Power
- Copycat

Groudon is obviously necessary, as it can KO Shedinja with a single Rocky Helmet contact move, while being able to Copycat a STAB Thousand Arrows or Precipice Blades back at the foe first due to Prankster.
[1] One of the unique characteristics about Groudon-Primal is Nature Power. Whether Moon Blast or Tri-Attack is called, Nature Power allows Groudon-Primal to serve as a mixed Priority sweeper, hitting off of 399 Special Attack. In fact, Mega-Rayquaza/Zygarde is harder by Moon Blast than it would through V-create (if sun is absent), and without the cost of lowering Defense and Special Defense.
[2] Rocky Helmet is mandatory, not just for Shedinja, but to prevent Rapid Spin and Knock Off from working. During battle, I discovered that if Rocky Helmet's passive damage KOs the foe (say a Shedinja uses Knock-off, killing itself), then it prevents both these moves from working. Further, if Groudon switches into Endeavor from Shedinja, which kills it due to Rocky Helmet, then you can use a Prankster Copycat Endeavor next turn to severely weaken the next opponent. Yes, your Groudon is likely dead, but you took out almost 2 Pokemon in the process, especially if the foe lands a contact move on the turn you use Copycat Endeavor, where their 1 HP left is turned to 0 due to Rocky Helmet.
_______
Notes about the use of Ghosts:
*Special Notes: Shadow Force also prevents Rapid Spin, Defog, Parting Shot, U-turn, Volt Switch, Spectral Thief, and attacks on a Contrarian user from benefiting your foe's team. If your Imposter Chansey can set up some hazards, or even Baton Pass boosts to Marowak or Bannette, then you can create an endless loop that forces out your foe's Pokemon, leaving them unable to clear it off the field.
In case you don't know, I lowered the Speed EVs and IVs to 0, while using a -Speed Nature because it means my Shadow Force will more often than not go after the foe. Being last means I hit last so my invulnerability protects me for 2 turns, and allows me to almost guarantee that using Copycat next turn will trigger Shadow Force. The only moves that can stop this are +1 or greater priority moves on a fast Pokemon on the first turn, or -1 priority moves (or a slower Pokemon) going last on the second turn when you use Copycat.

**Please note: Queen's Majesty and Dazzling both stop even Copycat Shadow Force because they more heavily impact the use of priority beyond just preventing one from being targeted. Psychic Surge and Dark types cannot stop the Copycat + Shadow Force combo because Copycat targets a move (they can stop Copycat V-Create because it targets the foe).
*Please keep criticisms about the use of Assist/Prankster to a minimum. My post is to maximize the use of an Assist team, not to simply stop using it altogether. Most people wouldn't have even thought to use Misty Surge as a way to not only provide excellent coverage on common Dark and Dragon threats, but for status condition prevention for both your team and your opponent's team. I also want influential feedback that will improve the team as a whole, as I think I have tried to make it function without hurting Assist's likelihood of calling the right move.

Keep in mind, if you suggest I remove V-create from Bannette, Groudon, or Marowak-Alola (because it is already on both Diancie-Mega), keep in mind the risk of a Dark type or an anti-priority user switching in and preventing both Assist and Copycat. Also, before you suggest replacing V-create on a Pokemon, remember this team must have either 2 V-Create users if on a Prankster (so that a Prankster user with V-Create can call on another Pokemon's V-Create), or 1 V-Create on a Non-Prankster user (such as Diancie-Mega).

I hope to hear some useful feedback. So please get started! I took so much time explaining the concept (of how Assist/Prankster/Copycat uniquely work), and gathering calculations, so please know this wasn't just some quick run of the mill team.
Edit: I typed up a bunch of info here but it got removed when my page crashed and refreshed... I hate iPhones.

Think of it this way: Misty Terrain let's Shedinja hold a move other than a Lum Berry, Psychic Terrain + Seed let's Solgaleo hold an item besides Assault Vest, Electric Terrain + Galvanize makes Extreme Speed 148, Electric Surge Thunder is 165 Damage | Galvanize Boomburst is 168
Combined Boomburst with both effects and its power is 252 Base before STAB, which would make it 378 Base power. Electric Terrain then Volt Switch to a Galvanize user and boom!
 
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Deoxys-Speed isn't good in the current meta - we already had this discussoon here - and your hazards may get removed. You need better improofing (or remove frost breath from POgre), otherwise your team loses to Imposter.

Also you don't seem to realize that BH battles usually take way more than 100 turns - at least high-ladder ones - so that one-time items like Psychic Seeed over AV on Solgaleo, one-time hazard setters like Deoxys-Speed and one-time abilities like Electric Surge pre-primal are almost useless.

Shedinja doesn't really need the Lum Berry as status is pretty rare, Protective Pads are usually preferred to be able to spam Endeavor without having to worry about Rocky Helmet, Baneful Bunker or Spiny Shield.
 
Misty Surge is cool and really under-utilized. Status is very common and Core Enforcer is rampant and Misty not only provides defense against both, but also solidly disrupts Psychic Terrain. For example, Misty Terrain Giratina with Spectral Thief and not running min-speed can easily check Surge Smash MMX/Y, Sash or not, and can also pretty much freely directly switch into non-Specs Psycho Boost at the cost of needing to Recover next turn.

However, I don't think there are currently any standard users to add to the role compendium.


Also, I was going to wait until after the OMFL so I could do some good comparison tests by directly switching it for a standard Pokemon and vice versa on my teams, but Real Life™ suddenly has me on indefinite hiatus from battling. I have time to sit down and finish writing this post I started a while back, but not enough time to sit down and do a few hours of testing. Since I dunno if I'll be able to get to that testing in a week from now or months from now, I'll play it safe and go ahead and post now.


But nominating Mega Manectric for at least C-rank, but actually targeting B-rank. Holy crap, why so high though? Simple: Xurkitree. Running some numbers, they're almost the same Pokemon with a couple of tweaks, particularly Specs Manectric and Scarf Xurkitree (which I know is a thing.) Timid Manectric sits at 405 speed. Modest Scarf Xurkitree sits at 397.5 speed (so, 397 if I'm correct that decimals are simply dropped in calculations.) Timid Scarf Xurk sits at 436.5 speed. The difference between unboosted Manectric and Scarf Timid Xurkitree's speed is same nature normal Hoopa, Mega-Sceptile, and, this one is, yes, a biggie, Mewtwo-Y.

The damage between Scarf Xurk and Specs Mega-Mane? Well...

252 SpA Galvanize Xurkitree Boomburst vs. 248 HP / 252 SpD Arceus: 237-280 (53.4 - 63.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

252+ SpA Galvanize Xurkitree Boomburst vs. 248 HP / 252 SpD Arceus: 261-307 (58.9 - 69.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

252 SpA Choice Specs Galvanize Manectric-Mega Boomburst vs. 248 HP / 252 SpD Arceus: 295-348 (66.5 - 78.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Assuming both Timid for fairness, that's a ~13-15% damage difference in, surprisingly, Manectric's favor on this particular calculation. That might not seem like much, but that's the difference between U-Turn chip + Boomburst 2HKO potental. Or 3 layers of Spikes potential OHKO, but not many teams use Spikes. Modest Xurk narrows the gap to less than 10%, but that's still on Timid Manectric. Modest though?

252+ SpA Choice Specs Galvanize Manectric-Mega Boomburst vs. 248 HP / 252 SpD Arceus: 322-381 (72.6 - 86%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

~20-23% advantage over Timid Xurk and ~14-17% over Modest. Which means, Timid Scarf Xurk is better at popping almost the whole meta with a high powered Boomburst while either nature Specs Manectric is better at being quite fast and hitting quite hard at the same time. This isn't the whole crux of my argument, but I think it makes a strong opening case. I mean, Specs Xurk will wall break better than Manectric could without set-up while Scarf Manectric can run circles around the entire unboosted meta and significant portions of the boosted meta, allowing it to pose a significant threat to other fast and frail Pokemon.

Beyond Scarf and Specs stuff, Manectric differentiates itself from Xurk in trading power for speed. Both have really similar bulk (about a .01% difference in damage from Arceus' Boomburst) so there's no advantage to gain or lose there. As such, in non Scarf/Specs sets, where Xurkitree is used as a sledgehammer to break down stubborn walls, Manectric is a bit more finesse, coming in to hit really fast, scare off other fast Pokemon, and then bail out before the incoming counter-attack. As such, I've found a few sets that work well for this.

Manectric-Mega @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Galvanize
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Boomburst
- Ice Beam / Steam Eruption
- Encore
- Spore

The original set I've showcased. Acts as fast, offensive support/disruption with solid unboosted damage that can threaten most neutral Pokemon and is capable of beating stuff like Soundproof Perish Trap, Imprison Transform Eviolite Chansey, Sub-Spore set-up, and other stuff by stopping them from even getting their strategy moving. It can also put most offensive threats to sleep and then blow them up before they wake up. However, the set is quite flexible, such as swapping Spore for Glare to focus on crippling offensive teams harder. Or do other things, such as...


Manectric-Mega @ Icium Z
Ability: Galvanize
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Boomburst
- Ice Beam
- Encore
- Stealth Rock

Here's a variation. Most of Manectric's switch-ins are not Magic Bounce, so it can set-up rocks quite easily. Most bouncers are hit pretty hard by Boomburst, so bouncing rocks is pretty risky for them since Manectric outspeeds all common Bouncers and can 2HKO a significant chunk of them, such as Mega-Audino. Encore still does dickish Encore things and Icium allows Manectric to outright OHKO non-Assault Vest Zygarde-Cs. Or reliably 2HKO Giratinas who think they can just tank the Ice Beams, which is important since Giratina likes to Bounce too. Just, Ice Beam first and then finish with Z-Ice Beam.


Manectric-Mega @ Icium Z
Ability: Galvanize
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Boomburst
- Steam Eruption
- Ice Beam
- Volt Switch

Or here you can go full-on lure to nuke Manectric's expected checks. Steam Eruption OHKO's non-immune non-Vest Primaldon. And, more importantly, outspeeds it too, something Xurk would have to rely on prediction to get right since Primaldon would otherwise just shrug and nuke it with a Ground move first. Manectric also outspeeds speed-invested Zygarde, which is important so it can avoid damage when OHKOing it with Z-Ice Beam. Volt Switch, meanwhile, chips stuff while letting Mane escape and grabs momentum off of normal switches, which Mane can often force on something that doesn't want to eat a Boomburst.



The shown sets are things Xurkitree could theoretically do, but does worse without the speed since it becomes very prediction reliant. Manectric... doesn't need to predict like that. Its faster than almost everything it'll face so it knows at the start of the turn if it can take on the opponent or needs to bail, rather than "please swap Primaldon into my Steam Eruption". Xurk still directly wall breaks better, and probably Shell Smashes better too since at +2 it outspeeds all unboosted Pokemon anyway. But Mega-Mane definitely fills a few of the pairs of shoes Xurk is already wearing and exchanges the pairs it can't wear well for ones Xurk can't either.

So, if you've tried and like Xurk, seriously give Manectric a spin.


As for other possible sets? Well, Galvanize is what enables Manectric. Without it, it's fairly gimmicky. It can imitate Xurk's Sheer Force and Surge Surfer sets, run a Refrigerate lure set, and if you wanna get really niche, I've run a successful Dry Skin + LO + Thunder set on a rain team. But, I'd only consider the Galvanize set to be the only thing worth noting on any viability rating.
Not got much to add except Manectric can also function as the Terrain setter and a quick pivot. Here's a set I made for an example, probably not optimal:
Manectric-Mega @ Terrain Extender / Choice Specs / Darkinium Z
Ability: Electric Surge
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Volt Switch / Parting Shot
- Ice Beam
- Steam Eruption
- Destiny Bond / Thunderbolt

Functions similarly to Volt Switch Psychic Surge mmy as a fast pivot and terrain setter but probably only worth it on dedicated ETerrain teams.

The rest of my team is fast, I use Deoxys-S to pile on hazards for the switch in, and Nuzzle to paralyze so my Primals outspeed, I then use my primals mid-game and Ampharos for clean up.
Remember with my Calculations, for Ampharos, Tail Glow does just fine with Tri a Attack, you don't really need Electric moves, and Electric terrain clears Psychic terrain. Mega-Mewtwo often stay in on Kyogre expecting a switch if they think I fear Psystrike, while Kyogre Shell Smashes, if they have Focus Sash when I send in Amphhros I surprise them with Priority Electric Surge boosted Thunderbolt.
Keep in mind that typically the Kyogre Imposters think they can handle whatever Kyogre will do, sometimes they even Shell Smash expecting me to switch while I use Thunder, lowering their SpD. Thunder + Electric Terrain is 165 base power, Galvanize Boomburst is 168, they are comparable in power.

Imposters use Thunder when I switch to Groudon Primal. If we assume the Chansey has accumulated at least some prior hazard damage (12.5%), and that they can both survive a single hit, and Groudon.

I use Misty Terrain on my Prankster Assist team:

Edit: I typed up a bunch of info here but it got removed when my page crashed and refreshed... I hate iPhones.

Think of it this way: Misty Terrain let's Shedinja hold a move other than a Lum Berry, Psychic Terrain + Seed let's Solgaleo hold an item besides Assault Vest, Electric Terrain + Galvanize makes Extreme Speed 148, Electric Surge Thunder is 165 Damage | Galvanize Boomburst is 168
Combined Boomburst with both effects and its power is 252 Base before STAB, which would make it 378 Base power. Electric Terrain then Volt Switch to a Galvanize user and boom!
I just like to mention at these moments that all these insanely powerful Terrain boosted Thunders etc are still weaker than V-create. (Don't read anything into that, just an observation.)

Deoxys-Speed isn't good in the current meta - we already had this discussion [just noticed a typo, you're welcome xP] here - and your hazards may get removed. You need better improofing (or remove frost breath from POgre), otherwise your team loses to Imposter.

Also you don't seem to realize that BH battles usually take way more than 100 turns - at least high-ladder ones - so that one-time items like Psychic Seeed over AV on Solgaleo, one-time hazard setters like Deoxys-Speed and one-time abilities like Electric Surge pre-primal are almost useless.

Shedinja doesn't really need the Lum Berry as status is pretty rare, Protective Pads are usually preferred to be able to spam Endeavor without having to worry about Rocky Helmet, Baneful Bunker or Spiny Shield.
I wouldn't go as far as to say most battles last way more than 100 turns but it's definitely not unusual for battles to be long and even in a fairly short 40 turn battle the 5 turns of terrain can soon disappear - especially when the opposition is deliberately stalling them out to remove your advantage.

While I agree Lum Berry probably isn't the best choice of item for shedinja in most cases nowadays, you can't deny that it's nice to have the same saftey blanket without the need for the item. This means if you're sash or goggles or something you don't need to worry about Baneful Bunker and you can rest at ease as you switch into Scalds and onto Toxic Spikes.

I think Terrain setting is definitely a notable role but maybe not so commonly needed that we should include it in resources.
 
Willdbeast I forgot about terrain sets, although I'm not sure they're noteworthy enough for the VR since, in my experiments, Galvanize is by far the most consistent performer. But if that's an incorrect assumption, then I'd love to be proved wrong!
 
Misty Surge is cool and really under-utilized. Status is very common and Core Enforcer is rampant and Misty not only provides defense against both, but also solidly disrupts Psychic Terrain. For example, Misty Terrain Giratina with Spectral Thief and not running min-speed can easily check Surge Smash MMX/Y, Sash or not, and can also pretty much freely directly switch into non-Specs Psycho Boost at the cost of needing to Recover next turn.

However, I don't think there are currently any standard users to add to the role compendium.


Also, I was going to wait until after the OMFL so I could do some good comparison tests by directly switching it for a standard Pokemon and vice versa on my teams, but Real Life™ suddenly has me on indefinite hiatus from battling. I have time to sit down and finish writing this post I started a while back, but not enough time to sit down and do a few hours of testing. Since I dunno if I'll be able to get to that testing in a week from now or months from now, I'll play it safe and go ahead and post now.


But nominating Mega Manectric for at least C-rank, but actually targeting B-rank. Holy crap, why so high though? Simple: Xurkitree. Running some numbers, they're almost the same Pokemon with a couple of tweaks, particularly Specs Manectric and Scarf Xurkitree (which I know is a thing.) Timid Manectric sits at 405 speed. Modest Scarf Xurkitree sits at 397.5 speed (so, 397 if I'm correct that decimals are simply dropped in calculations.) Timid Scarf Xurk sits at 436.5 speed. The difference between unboosted Manectric and Scarf Timid Xurkitree's speed is same nature normal Hoopa, Mega-Sceptile, and, this one is, yes, a biggie, Mewtwo-Y.

The damage between Scarf Xurk and Specs Mega-Mane? Well...

252 SpA Galvanize Xurkitree Boomburst vs. 248 HP / 252 SpD Arceus: 237-280 (53.4 - 63.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

252+ SpA Galvanize Xurkitree Boomburst vs. 248 HP / 252 SpD Arceus: 261-307 (58.9 - 69.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

252 SpA Choice Specs Galvanize Manectric-Mega Boomburst vs. 248 HP / 252 SpD Arceus: 295-348 (66.5 - 78.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Assuming both Timid for fairness, that's a ~13-15% damage difference in, surprisingly, Manectric's favor on this particular calculation. That might not seem like much, but that's the difference between U-Turn chip + Boomburst 2HKO potental. Or 3 layers of Spikes potential OHKO, but not many teams use Spikes. Modest Xurk narrows the gap to less than 10%, but that's still on Timid Manectric. Modest though?

252+ SpA Choice Specs Galvanize Manectric-Mega Boomburst vs. 248 HP / 252 SpD Arceus: 322-381 (72.6 - 86%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

~20-23% advantage over Timid Xurk and ~14-17% over Modest. Which means, Timid Scarf Xurk is better at popping almost the whole meta with a high powered Boomburst while either nature Specs Manectric is better at being quite fast and hitting quite hard at the same time. This isn't the whole crux of my argument, but I think it makes a strong opening case. I mean, Specs Xurk will wall break better than Manectric could without set-up while Scarf Manectric can run circles around the entire unboosted meta and significant portions of the boosted meta, allowing it to pose a significant threat to other fast and frail Pokemon.

Beyond Scarf and Specs stuff, Manectric differentiates itself from Xurk in trading power for speed. Both have really similar bulk (about a .01% difference in damage from Arceus' Boomburst) so there's no advantage to gain or lose there. As such, in non Scarf/Specs sets, where Xurkitree is used as a sledgehammer to break down stubborn walls, Manectric is a bit more finesse, coming in to hit really fast, scare off other fast Pokemon, and then bail out before the incoming counter-attack. As such, I've found a few sets that work well for this.

Manectric-Mega @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Galvanize
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Boomburst
- Ice Beam / Steam Eruption
- Encore
- Spore

The original set I've showcased. Acts as fast, offensive support/disruption with solid unboosted damage that can threaten most neutral Pokemon and is capable of beating stuff like Soundproof Perish Trap, Imprison Transform Eviolite Chansey, Sub-Spore set-up, and other stuff by stopping them from even getting their strategy moving. It can also put most offensive threats to sleep and then blow them up before they wake up. However, the set is quite flexible, such as swapping Spore for Glare to focus on crippling offensive teams harder. Or do other things, such as...


Manectric-Mega @ Icium Z
Ability: Galvanize
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Boomburst
- Ice Beam
- Encore
- Stealth Rock

Here's a variation. Most of Manectric's switch-ins are not Magic Bounce, so it can set-up rocks quite easily. Most bouncers are hit pretty hard by Boomburst, so bouncing rocks is pretty risky for them since Manectric outspeeds all common Bouncers and can 2HKO a significant chunk of them, such as Mega-Audino. Encore still does dickish Encore things and Icium allows Manectric to outright OHKO non-Assault Vest Zygarde-Cs. Or reliably 2HKO Giratinas who think they can just tank the Ice Beams, which is important since Giratina likes to Bounce too. Just, Ice Beam first and then finish with Z-Ice Beam.


Manectric-Mega @ Icium Z
Ability: Galvanize
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Boomburst
- Steam Eruption
- Ice Beam
- Volt Switch

Or here you can go full-on lure to nuke Manectric's expected checks. Steam Eruption OHKO's non-immune non-Vest Primaldon. And, more importantly, outspeeds it too, something Xurk would have to rely on prediction to get right since Primaldon would otherwise just shrug and nuke it with a Ground move first. Manectric also outspeeds speed-invested Zygarde, which is important so it can avoid damage when OHKOing it with Z-Ice Beam. Volt Switch, meanwhile, chips stuff while letting Mane escape and grabs momentum off of normal switches, which Mane can often force on something that doesn't want to eat a Boomburst.



The shown sets are things Xurkitree could theoretically do, but does worse without the speed since it becomes very prediction reliant. Manectric... doesn't need to predict like that. Its faster than almost everything it'll face so it knows at the start of the turn if it can take on the opponent or needs to bail, rather than "please swap Primaldon into my Steam Eruption". Xurk still directly wall breaks better, and probably Shell Smashes better too since at +2 it outspeeds all unboosted Pokemon anyway. But Mega-Mane definitely fills a few of the pairs of shoes Xurk is already wearing and exchanges the pairs it can't wear well for ones Xurk can't either.

So, if you've tried and like Xurk, seriously give Manectric a spin.


As for other possible sets? Well, Galvanize is what enables Manectric. Without it, it's fairly gimmicky. It can imitate Xurk's Sheer Force and Surge Surfer sets, run a Refrigerate lure set, and if you wanna get really niche, I've run a successful Dry Skin + LO + Thunder set on a rain team. But, I'd only consider the Galvanize set to be the only thing worth noting on any viability rating.
scarf xurk is no set, specs xurk is the only thing you want to use trust me.

anyway i haven't tried out mmane for myself so don't quote me on this, but i don't see why you'd use it over mmy. like sure you can hit steels harder with galvanize boomburst, but i'm pretty sure they avoid the 2hko unless specs. also, stuff like ogre is hit just as hard by psychic surge psystrike.
 
Not got much to add except Manectric can also function as the Terrain setter and a quick pivot. Here's a set I made for an example, probably not optimal:
Manectric-Mega @ Terrain Extender / Choice Specs / Darkinium Z
Ability: Electric Surge
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Volt Switch / Parting Shot
- Ice Beam
- Steam Eruption
- Destiny Bond / Thunderbolt

Functions similarly to Volt Switch Psychic Surge mmy as a fast pivot and terrain setter but probably only worth it on dedicated ETerrain teams.



I just like to mention at these moments that all these insanely powerful Terrain boosted Thunders etc are still weaker than V-create. (Don't read anything into that, just an observation.)



I wouldn't go as far as to say most battles last way more than 100 turns but it's definitely not unusual for battles to be long and even in a fairly short 40 turn battle the 5 turns of terrain can soon disappear - especially when the opposition is deliberately stalling them out to remove your advantage.

While I agree Lum Berry probably isn't the best choice of item for shedinja in most cases nowadays, you can't deny that it's nice to have the same saftey blanket without the need for the item. This means if you're sash or goggles or something you don't need to worry about Baneful Bunker and you can rest at ease as you switch into Scalds and onto Toxic Spikes.

I think Terrain setting is definitely a notable role but maybe not so commonly needed that we should include it in resources.
Your point about V-Create applies when it's an Instead of, in both cases Groudon uses Bolt Strike with its STAB moves, so I don't think it matters to bring up V-Create, it's not like Groudon is replacing its Fire Move with Bolt Strike... also Bolt Strike let's it use Thousand Waves and Precipice Blades instead Thousand Arrows, so it frees up moves so it can still hit Flying types with a 195 base power move super effectively.

In your observation with V-Create vs Thunder, Kyogre is using Special Attacks not physical, and Primordial Sea at that, so it is kind of moot to bring it up on a Pokémon not really planning to use the move anyways... unless you think a Contrarian V-Create Primal Kyogre is better than the set I thought of... at least Kyogre gets immunity to Sleep and can threaten Mega-Gyarados.

If a Galvanize set with Primal Groudon off of 180 Base Attack (Extreme Speed) and 150 SpA (Boomburst) is good enough, (Imposter proof sets with Earth Plate Judgement), I think Electric Surge Kyogre off of 180 SpA with Thunder nearing Galvanize's Boomburst in in power is good enough. Plus the point of Terrain is to aid your teammates similar to weather, so you can always switch out to a Galvanize user who can take Electric Terrain + Galvanize Boomburst to 252 Base Power without STAB, and 378 with STAB. Through in Specs on Mega Manectric and you got yourself a powerhouse.
 
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scarf xurk is no set, specs xurk is the only thing you want to use trust me.

anyway i haven't tried out mmane for myself so don't quote me on this, but i don't see why you'd use it over mmy. like sure you can hit steels harder with galvanize boomburst, but i'm pretty sure they avoid the 2hko unless specs. also, stuff like ogre is hit just as hard by psychic surge psystrike.

For your specific examples, Celesteela, particularly Prim Sea/Flash Fire variants, are a particularly good Steel-type target for Mane since Ytwo's typical coverage doesn't touch it (or touch it very well). MMY also doesn't run coverage specific for Kyogre, and doesn't always have Psystrike with the rise of Psycho Boost and Psychic sets, and Psystrike gets stopped pretty hard by Fur Coat sets, which Manectric scoffs at. Boomburst also 2HKO's AV Regen Kyogre if its Bold and pulls it off with some Rocks if its not. As for general Steel-types, Mane falls extremely short on a 2HKO on + SpD Registeel and reliably 2HKOs Solgaleo and Aegilsash without any boosts and running Timid. Stealth Rock ensures a 2HKO on Registeel. Often, this forces the opposing Steel-types out or forces them to Recover-spam to survive (or attempt to D.Bond in Prankster's case, but this is where the disruption moves like Encore come in.) Unboosted Ytwo can do this sort of thing with a coverage move, but that's running a move to hit Steel's specifically whereas MMane can do it with STAB alone.

...Steelix is a notable exception but its rare and sets running Steam Eruption for Pdon comfortably 2HKO Steelix anyway.

Aside from that, the direct niches it has over Mewtwo is coverage (Boltbeam hits pretty much everything, Steam Eruption is really only there because Pdon is everywhere), Paralysis immunity (if Ytwo gets paralyzed, its more often than not done, and same often goes for most/all other fast sweepers), STAB Volt Switch, and it functions way better on Electric Surge teams than MMY who wants Psychic Surge (though Mane likes the anti-priority from Psy Surge). Not to mention, its a fantastic offensive partner to P.Don as it threatens a lot of P.Don's checks and counters and can lure Zygarde for a OHKO with Icium or spread status and hazards to faster stuff to ease a P.Don sweep. As such, I think the differences are at least significant enough to warrant a ranking at C-rank at the very least.
 
For your specific examples, Celesteela, particularly Prim Sea/Flash Fire variants, are a particularly good Steel-type target for Mane since Ytwo's typical coverage doesn't touch it (or touch it very well). MMY also doesn't run coverage specific for Kyogre, and doesn't always have Psystrike with the rise of Psycho Boost and Psychic sets, and Psystrike gets stopped pretty hard by Fur Coat sets, which Manectric scoffs at.

Boomburst also 2HKO's AV Regen Kyogre if its Bold and pulls it off with some Rocks if its not. As for general Steel-types, Mane falls extremely short on a 2HKO on + SpD Registeel and reliably 2HKOs Solgaleo and Aegilsash without any boosts and running Timid. Stealth Rock ensures a 2HKO on Registeel. Often, this forces the opposing Steel-types out or forces them to Recover-spam to survive (or attempt to D.Bond in Prankster's case, but this is where the disruption moves like Encore come in.) Unboosted Ytwo can do this sort of thing with a coverage move, but that's running a move to hit Steel's specifically whereas MMane can do it with STAB alone.

...Steelix is a notable exception but its rare and sets running Steam Eruption for Pdon comfortably 2HKO Steelix anyway.

Aside from that, the direct niches it has over Mewtwo is coverage (Boltbeam hits pretty much everything, Steam Eruption is really only there because Pdon is everywhere), Paralysis immunity (if Ytwo gets paralyzed, its more often than not done, and same often goes for most/all other fast sweepers), STAB Volt Switch, and it functions way better on Electric Surge teams than MMY who wants Psychic Surge (though Mane likes the anti-priority from Psy Surge). Not to mention, its a fantastic offensive partner to P.Don as it threatens a lot of P.Don's checks and counters and can lure Zygarde for a OHKO with Icium or spread status and hazards to faster stuff to ease a P.Don sweep. As such, I think the differences are at least significant enough to warrant a ranking at C-rank at the very least.
I don't fault you for finding the use in electric Terrain, galvanize, Mega Manectric, etc., but I did find a few notable flaws in your post-
Against a Mega Steelix-
252 Atk Steelix-Mega Precipice Blades vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Manectric-Mega: 348-410 (101.1 - 119.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO

That was without a nature, without an item, and without any damage boosting ability.

For the other ones which don't use Precipice Blades:
252 Atk Technician Steelix-Mega Bonemerang (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Manectric-Mega: 436-516 (126.7 - 150%) -- guaranteed OHKO

So Manectric can't survive to hit the second turn, and most players would send in Steelix during an electric move to begin with, so it wouldn't likely switch into Steam Eruption. Ironically, Steelix takes the least damage possible from Stealth Rock, so it isn't going to make a difference for Manectric's Steam Eruption like it would Boomburst vs a Kyogre-Primal.

Anything can have Bolt Beam coverage, and No Guard MMY with Zap Cannon / Blizzard / Inferno / Focus Blast or Psystrike can afford to pack Life Orb and make quick work of Zygarde without wasting a item slot for a Z-crystal. Remember, MMY has superior SpA stats, so a Life Orb allows it to rival, in power, a Manectric with Choice Specs.
252 SpA Life Orb Mewtwo-Mega-Y Blizzard vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Zygarde-Complete: 691-816 (108.6 - 128.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Plus, Mega Mewtwo isn't weak to Thousand Arrows, and won't cry if Core Enforcer takes away its Ability.

252 Atk Zygarde-Complete Thousand Arrows vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Mewtwo-Mega-Y: 121-144 (29 - 34.6%) -- 7% chance to 3HKO

252 Atk Zygarde-Complete Thousand Arrows vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Manectric-Mega: 224-266 (65.1 - 77.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Further, it can paralyze and Burn close to anything not electric/ground or fire, so it can still go faster than a foe that paralyzed it now that they both are, can take a physical hit better after a burn, can 1HKO Zygarde without fail, and can 2HKO Registee with Inferno or Focus Blast;
252 SpA Life Orb Mewtwo-Mega-Y Inferno vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Registeel: 229-270 (62.9 - 74.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO +!6.25% burn damage is 69.4%-80.35%

252 SpA Life Orb Mewtwo-Mega-Y Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Registeel: 276-325 (75.8 - 89.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

And that's without Psychic Terrain set up by a teammate.
-----

Manectric functions well with necessary teammates. Perhaps we should decide if it is better as a Galvanizer or an Electric Terrain setter. Afterall, we could give Mega Manectric Electric Surge, Primal-Groudon with Galvanize, Primordial Sea Golisipod Crab Hammer for opposing Primal Groudon (Resist Ground + immunity to V-Create/Sacred Fire) and Bolt Strike for opposing Gyarados/Kyogre, then No Guard MMY with the aforementioned set to boost Zap Cannon, and You pick the last two.

What does Manectric do? Prevents Sleep, so no need for Safety Googles or Spore on your moveslots, allows for a powerful pivot with Volt Turn getting a boost, while boosting coverage moves on Golisipod, MMY, and powering up Imposter proof Groudon-Primal.

Not a complete team, but an example where roles are not repeated, rather, they are complimented by teammates: Mega Mewtwo Y is the generalist Special sweeper, Groudon is the priority Imposter proof physical attacker and can switch into Half of MMY-Imposter's movepool with ease, Golispod serves as check to many of the team's weaknesses such as Contrary Groudon (can switch in on V-Create, Superpower, Ice Hammer), can boost its own water STAB through Primordial Sea, and can take physical resisted stab from Steel, Water, Ice, Fighting, Ground, and maintain an immunity to Fire. Fur Coat could also be used since it has great defense but a low HP stat.

It's up to you, but I think Manectric, and the terrain's best advertisement is listing useful and synergetic teammates.

What else could we add?
 
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this is amazing. whenever someone posts stuff that's more flames than anything i have, i can just call them unsets and no one will complain

i apologize if this sounds mean because there's already enough mean stuff in the bh threads free heliolisk i don't want to be mean to people in what should be a civilized debate so yeah if i say something dumb then you can do whatever just know that i didn't mean it
I don't fault you for finding the use in electric Terrain, galvanize, Mega Manectric, etc., but I did find a few notable flaws in your post-
Against a Mega Steelix-
252 Atk Steelix-Mega Precipice Blades vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Manectric-Mega: 348-410 (101.1 - 119.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO

That was without a nature, without an item, and without any damage boosting ability.

For the other ones which don't use Precipice Blades:
252 Atk Technician Steelix-Mega Bonemerang (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Manectric-Mega: 436-516 (126.7 - 150%) -- guaranteed OHKO

So Manectric can't survive to hit the second turn, and most players would send in Steelix during an electric move to begin with, so it wouldn't likely switch into Steam Eruption. Ironically, Steelix takes the least damage possible from Stealth Rock, so it isn't going to make a difference for Manectric's Steam Eruption like it would Boomburst vs a Kyogre-Primal.

Anything can have Bolt Beam coverage, and No Guard MMY with Zap Cannon / Blizzard / Inferno / Focus Blast or Psystrike can afford to pack Life Orb and make quick work of Zygarde without wasting a item slot for a Z-crystal. Remember, MMY has superior SpA stats, so a Life Orb allows it to rival, in power, a Manectric with Choice Specs.
252 SpA Life Orb Mewtwo-Mega-Y Blizzard vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Zygarde-Complete: 691-816 (108.6 - 128.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Plus, Mega Mewtwo isn't weak to Thousand Arrows, and won't cry if Core Enforcer takes away its Ability.

252 Atk Zygarde-Complete Thousand Arrows vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Mewtwo-Mega-Y: 121-144 (29 - 34.6%) -- 7% chance to 3HKO

252 Atk Zygarde-Complete Thousand Arrows vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Manectric-Mega: 224-266 (65.1 - 77.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Further, it can paralyze and Burn close to anything not electric/ground or fire, so it can still go faster than a foe that paralyzed it now that they both are, can take a physical hit better after a burn, can 1HKO Zygarde without fail, and can 2HKO Registee with Inferno or Focus Blast;
252 SpA Life Orb Mewtwo-Mega-Y Inferno vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Registeel: 229-270 (62.9 - 74.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO +!6.25% burn damage is 69.4%-80.35%

252 SpA Life Orb Mewtwo-Mega-Y Focus Blast vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Registeel: 276-325 (75.8 - 89.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

And that's without Psychic Terrain set up by a teammate.
-----

Manectric functions well with necessary teammates. Perhaps we should decide if it is better as a Galvanizer or an Electric Terrain setter. Afterall, we could give Mega Manectric Electric Surge, Primal-Groudon with Galvanize, Primordial Sea Golisipod Crab Hammer for opposing Primal Groudon (Resist Ground + immunity to V-Create/Sacred Fire) and Bolt Strike for opposing Gyarados/Kyogre, then No Guard MMY with the aforementioned set to boost Zap Cannon, and You pick the last two.

What does Manectric do? Prevents Sleep, so no need for Safety Googles or Spore on your moveslots, allows for a powerful pivot with Volt Turn getting a boost, while boosting coverage moves on Golisipod, MMY, and powering up Imposter proof Groudon-Primal.

Not a complete team, but an example where roles are not repeated, rather, they are complimented by teammates: Mega Mewtwo Y is the generalist Special sweeper, Groudon is the priority Imposter proof physical attacker and can switch into Half of MMY-Imposter's movepool with ease, Golispod serves as check to many of the team's weaknesses such as Contrary Groudon (can switch in on V-Create, Superpower, Ice Hammer), can boost its own water STAB through Primordial Sea, and can take physical resisted stab from Steel, Water, Ice, Fighting, Ground, and maintain an immunity to Fire. Fur Coat could also be used since it has great defense but a low HP stat.

It's up to you, but I think Manectric, and the terrain's best advertisement is listing useful and synergetic teammates.

What else could we add?
maybe we could add actual sets

offensive mega steelix is a beyblade
non stab bolt beam is my favorite way to kill kyogre
offensive mons need to be able to switch into thousand arrows. no such thing with spectral thief
that team sounds like something that would tilt me if i lost to it. it's like a bunch of bad breakers slapped together. take primordial sea golisogod to mnm. where is your imposter proofer? how was my gordon ramsay impression

concerning electric surge mmanec: seems like a decent idea but man even in electric terrain it loses to every other terrain setter. misty giratina doesn't care, mmy picks it off with specs boost. other terrain isn't the most relevant tho but still it seems like for a surge user zekrom or something would be better

OM! a bh team needs certain stuff to be successful. READ THIS
  • reliable counterplay to imposter
  • reliable counterplay to poison heal (regigigas kyogre maybe xern)
  • something for shell smash
  • something for contrary (prankster destiny bond, earth plate imposter, imposter in general, unaware ho oh, ff aegi, sometimes shed)
  • something for specs surge mmy (basically a psycho boost switchin)
  • something for -ate (aps on offense, fat steels/soundproof on fatter teams)
  • something for opposing fat stuff (reliable hazards, a breaker)
  • something for sheddy (reliable hazards, ghosts)
  • something for v create (giratina, sheddy, fc ogre)
if your team doesn't have all this stuff then you might win some games but eventually you'll run into the thing and your opponent will be so bad and misplay the thing horribly but they'll win on matchup anyway and make you tilt (source: regigigas)

looking at this team, the only defensive synergy it has is pdon + golisopod but man that loses to every mmy set with psychic moves as well as earth plate galvanize pdon with setup (common set). you also need to imposter proof all four of the breakers nice. man i really really want to suggest shiftry right now for that sick mmy check and fwg core but i've made enough memes recently already

anyway man which one sounds better? "mmanec should rise because i've used it on x team and here are some high ladder replays of it performing well" or "mmanec should rise because it might go well with x and y"? it doesn't matter if you randomly pick two mons that make mmanec look borderline broken, you need some proof to back it up.

got my own nom
magearna to d
whenever i use this mon it never fails... to let me down. like ferrothorn it's one of those steels that doesn't check specs ate due to its insufficient bulk so you need a soundproofer or something but unlike ferro it doesn't provide any significant benefit in exchange for this sacrifice.

no spore immunity so regigigas puts it to sleep, magic bounce needs core enforcer or else regi just brute forces it and it takes the L

av regen looks nice except yknow 252 SpA Choice Specs Mewtwo-Mega-Y Psystrike vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Magearna: 179-211 (49.1 - 57.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock (in terrain) and yes it does get worse 252 SpA Choice Specs Mewtwo-Mega-Y Blue Flare vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Magearna: 252-298 (69.2 - 81.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

the only real benefit avregen has over better steels is a core immunity (if i wanted the fighting resist i would use solgaleo or aegi) and i get that core enforcer is annoying for other regen users but like is it really that bad for a steel???

the other set, flash fire, also looks ok except again, there are better options. much better options. does ff registeel get blown back by mega sceptile's +2 draco meteor??? flash fire's only use is as a niche imposter proofer for guys like zard x and reshiram that have core enforcer but at that point i'd almost rather use another fairy type with flash fire

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7balancedhackmons-620881673

this mmy wasn't specs or psychic terrain and my ff magearna still failed to wall it. impressive. team was fun to use tho

why is hoopa u c? i've literally never seen it on the ladder so i have no idea what it does. the same applies for mega venusaur
 
Hoopa-U is an APS sweeper with STAB on both Power Trip and Stored Power. It can also use the combination of Focus Sash + Bug move to kill an opposing imposter. However, I've rarely seen one.

The mega venusaurs I've fought on the (lower) ladder were bulky spore-immune hazard/status users, one even with Black Sludge trickeroo. Maybe also usable as a Pogre-check.
 
this is amazing. whenever someone posts stuff that's more flames than anything i have, i can just call them unsets and no one will complain

i apologize if this sounds mean because there's already enough mean stuff in the bh threads free heliolisk i don't want to be mean to people in what should be a civilized debate so yeah if i say something dumb then you can do whatever just know that i didn't mean it

maybe we could add actual sets

offensive mega steelix is a beyblade
non stab bolt beam is my favorite way to kill kyogre
offensive mons need to be able to switch into thousand arrows. no such thing with spectral thief
that team sounds like something that would tilt me if i lost to it. it's like a bunch of bad breakers slapped together. take primordial sea golisogod to mnm. where is your imposter proofer? how was my gordon ramsay impression

concerning electric surge mmanec: seems like a decent idea but man even in electric terrain it loses to every other terrain setter. misty giratina doesn't care, mmy picks it off with specs boost. other terrain isn't the most relevant tho but still it seems like for a surge user zekrom or something would be better

OM! a bh team needs certain stuff to be successful. READ THIS
  • reliable counterplay to imposter
  • reliable counterplay to poison heal (regigigas kyogre maybe xern)
  • something for shell smash
  • something for contrary (prankster destiny bond, earth plate imposter, imposter in general, unaware ho oh, ff aegi, sometimes shed)
  • something for specs surge mmy (basically a psycho boost switchin)
  • something for -ate (aps on offense, fat steels/soundproof on fatter teams)
  • something for opposing fat stuff (reliable hazards, a breaker)
  • something for sheddy (reliable hazards, ghosts)
  • something for v create (giratina, sheddy, fc ogre)
if your team doesn't have all this stuff then you might win some games but eventually you'll run into the thing and your opponent will be so bad and misplay the thing horribly but they'll win on matchup anyway and make you tilt (source: regigigas)

looking at this team, the only defensive synergy it has is pdon + golisopod but man that loses to every mmy set with psychic moves as well as earth plate galvanize pdon with setup (common set). you also need to imposter proof all four of the breakers nice. man i really really want to suggest shiftry right now for that sick mmy check and fwg core but i've made enough memes recently already

anyway man which one sounds better? "mmanec should rise because i've used it on x team and here are some high ladder replays of it performing well" or "mmanec should rise because it might go well with x and y"? it doesn't matter if you randomly pick two mons that make mmanec look borderline broken, you need some proof to back it up.

got my own nom
magearna to d
whenever i use this mon it never fails... to let me down. like ferrothorn it's one of those steels that doesn't check specs ate due to its insufficient bulk so you need a soundproofer or something but unlike ferro it doesn't provide any significant benefit in exchange for this sacrifice.

no spore immunity so regigigas puts it to sleep, magic bounce needs core enforcer or else regi just brute forces it and it takes the L

av regen looks nice except yknow 252 SpA Choice Specs Mewtwo-Mega-Y Psystrike vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Magearna: 179-211 (49.1 - 57.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock (in terrain) and yes it does get worse 252 SpA Choice Specs Mewtwo-Mega-Y Blue Flare vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Magearna: 252-298 (69.2 - 81.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

the only real benefit avregen has over better steels is a core immunity (if i wanted the fighting resist i would use solgaleo or aegi) and i get that core enforcer is annoying for other regen users but like is it really that bad for a steel???
Your points are not completely valid:
I specifically said for Steelix-Mega it doesn't even need an offensive nature, ability, or item, just Precipice Blades. It could have a defensive ability, item, and nature, my point was all it needs is a single move.

Why is it bad to not have STAB Bolt Beam coverage? No Guard MMY is a fairly common set, as it is commonly a status abuser, causing burns, and paralysis, especially as Electric Terrain prevents Sleep.

Also, who needs STAB on Electric moves with Electric Surge from Volt Switch Manectric?

252 SpA Life Orb Mewtwo-Mega-Y Zap Cannon vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Kyogre-Primal in Electric Terrain: 393-463 (97.2 - 114.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

The point is you would switch Mega Mewtwo Y into Thousand Arrows because Zygarde would use a ground move against Mega Manectric, or Groudon due to it being weak to Ground, after all, it wouldn't Core Enforcer or Spectral Thief a Terrain setter since the ability already activated, and they know they will probably switch out due to Zygarde resisting their STAB.

So it is basically a 7% chance at a 3HKO, for MMY switching into a Zygarde 1K Arrows or 1K Waves, especially as some Zygarde are carrying Thousand Waves instead of Thousand Arrows, so they can trap and stall out Imposter sets. Point is, MMY comes in and counters Zygarde.

For Spectral Thief, here:
252 Atk Zygarde-Complete Spectral Thief vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Mewtwo-Mega-Y: 162-192 (38.9 - 46.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

Although, Zygarde wouldn't use it unless it predicts the MMY switch in due to it not surviving a Blizzard to hit MMY back... so is MMY able to survive it even on the switch in and KO Zygarde? yes.

Is it more useful to have a No Guard MMY for this team than Psycho Boost with Psychic Terrain? Yes. Better to save Psycho Boosts for Contrarian users...

252 SpA Life Orb Mewtwo-Mega-Y Psycho Boost vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Zygarde-Complete in Psychic Terrain: 497-585 (78.1 - 91.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

Strong for a neutral hit, but most people would probably switch to a Steel or Dark type if they saw the Terrain come up, such as Solgaleo.

My MMY can 2HKO Solgaleo:
252 SpA Life Orb Mewtwo-Mega-Y Inferno vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Assault Vest Solgaleo: 221-260 (46.2 - 54.3%) -- 100% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock &/or BURN.

If it used U-Turn after a BURN (I subbed in Reflect):
252 Atk Solgaleo U-turn vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Mewtwo-Mega-Y through Reflect: 79-93 (18.9 - 22.3%) -- possible 5HKO

Groudon can counter play Manectric and Groudon Imposters... I hadn't finished the rest of my example as a team. So who is to say I didn't know that bullet point already? For example, I didn't list a Hazard setter, with Taunt to prevent Defog. Doesn't that counter Shedinja too?

To be fair, I did list Golisipod as a counter to V-Create and Contrarian specifically, did mention Galvanize Groudon is Imposterproof and counters Manectric, etc.

You would sound a lot better if this was RMT, but my post was merely trying to piece ideas for Electric Surge and MManectric and literally asking for others to throw in a few more teammates. I don't think your post impressed anyone...
 
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why would you run an inaccurate stab on a defensive mon when better options (tarrows, twaves, even eq) exist? It (pblades) doesn't even show up on the usage stats.

(yes I know Pdon does this sometimes in Ubers/AG but that has 180 base attack in a much frailer metagame)

edited for clarity
 
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I'm not going to wade into all of that about Electric Surge Mega-Mane and stuff since I don't really have the time. Its probably a viable set, but, if I'm correct, the VR focuses on optimal sets (otherwise we need about 30 more P.Don sets on there.) And, as far as I'm aware, Galvanize is Manectric's most optimal set(s) by far, so I'd like to focus on that for VR discussion. Although if you guys want to keep debating Surge Mane, well, I'm not stopping you, I'm just saying I'm not participating since a couple of things in that was directed at me.

Though, I will say, since this is about Galv Mane, yes, Mewtwo can Boltbeam, but that takes two of its non-STAB slots, which it really wants for coverage moves that pair better with its STAB, and Manectric's Bolt is stronger anyway, especially with Galvanize. Boltbeam is a great selling point for Mane and other Electric-types since they get STAB + great coverage in only two moves, something not many non-Primal Groudons can boast.

And, yes, Mane is weaker to Ground-type moves than Mewtwo since, well, it is its weakness. Its not really a fair comparison, as is saying Mane takes Moongeist better than Ytwo isn't really fair either.

And for Core Enforcer... only Surge Ytwo doesn't care about ability loss, the rest do.

------

As for Marg, I kinda support a drop, but I've never used it. In replays and my opponents, I've only seen it accomplish something in one or two battles total, the rest of the times it kinda does nothing except take a hit or two. Though dropping or not probably should be decided by people with more experience with the Pokemon than me.

As for Hoopa, what Semako said. Plus, unless it changed, Hyperspace Fury is Imposter-proof since Imposter can't use it. If it did change and Imposter can use it now, someone bop me. Never mind, I've been bopped on that point.

As for Venusaur, it has a lot of neat qualities thanks for typing. Its particularly good at messing with teams that have a PH user. Trick Black Sludge onto a PHer to shut down their recovery and steal the Orb without worries of being Poisoned. Then come back later and give something else on their team the Orb. Steel-types can do this too, but Venusaur had the niches of Spore/Seed immunity and benefiting from Black Sludge, so could actually wait to use it at the best time rather than tossing it at the first opportunity. It was quite a good Pokemon in X/Y, but the rise of Primaldon and Mega-Ray in ORAS made it a lot less useful. It still makes a decent Pixilate and Galvanize check if they're lacking Fire or Ice coverage though.
 
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