NP: UU - Bye Bye Bye

[shrang]

But if Moltres gets forced out, it doesn't have the speed boost anymore. Not to mention that instead of wasting a moveslot on Agility, you can run Flamethrower for late-game cleaning.

That happens with every Pokemon, my friend. Just make sure you can keep SR off the field, and replace Roost with Agility and bring him out late game. I'm going to do a bit more testing on this =D.

 

[SJCrew]

Moltres doesn't need the extra speed, honestly. What it needs is a CM pass so it can smack all its counters harder, since they're all slower and count on surviving its attacks rather than outspeeding and OHKOing.

 

[Heysup]

Milotic is annoyingly difficult to kill though. It can survive fucking Wood Hammers from Torterra and shit and, unlike Tangrowth (a Tangrowth lived through my CB Arcanine's FlareBlitz today, I still can't get over that...) it has excellent mixed defenses and reliable instant recovery with a great defensive typing and ability. I mentioned sometime back that defensive suspects don't get much attention (unless they're ridiculous, like Cressy) because the offensive ones overshadow them, so it's possible that in a metagame without any obvious offensive suspects more attention will be paid to Registeel/Milotic. Not that I'm suggesting either one is broken or worthy of being banned, mind.

If LO Venusaur wasn't absolutely wrecking the metagame I would probably consider nominating Milotic. I mean, I still am considering it because it fits the "crobat precedent" of broken because it checks too much shit (namely offensive shit).

 

[shrang]

Yeh, I hate Milotic. And Registeel. Every time you want to try and build a team around a sweeper, you go "What are Pokemon X's counters and how do I get rid of them". Almost every time, I would go "Milotic does." If I don't, you'd be sure "Registeel does".

 

[YaM]

Wouldn't Moltres complement MiloSteel? Takes on Venusaur and Toxicroak..

Magmortar seems like a good answer to MiloSteel =P

 

[Ekanselttar]

Magmortar seems like a good answer to MiloSteel =P

Milotic used Surf!

 

[Thund91]

I've 6-0'd some teams with Milo. The Restalk set is really beast. If things keep going the way they are I might even consider nominating it, but I believe it to be a necessary evil. Without Milo all the special Fire-types just shit on the metagame.

 

[shrang]

You still have Slowking, Blastoise and Azumarill to check them, although it would be a lot harder.

Talking about Azumarill, RestTalk Azu is really cool. I know Thund has been running it from time to time as well, but Waterfall/Double Edge/RestTalk @ Life Orb is just plain tank. A bit like the Machamp of the UU metagame, although with a bit more bulk and no annoying ass Dynamicpunch.

 

[Thund91]

It's true Slowking does decently against Moltres, but you'd still be hard pressed against Houndoom. Slowking is KO'd after a NP boost as is Blastoise. I guess Azumarill does ok but after being force to switch Houndoom can just wait for Azu to be weak enough so it can Sucker Punch it and sweep from there.

Also I always run strange Restalkers, ranging from Azu to Arcanine to Moltres to Nidoqueen. xD

 

[Banedon]

Yeh, I hate Milotic. And Registeel. Every time you want to try and build a team around a sweeper, you go "What are Pokemon X's counters and how do I get rid of them". Almost every time, I would go "Milotic does." If I don't, you'd be sure "Registeel does".

Curiously enough earlier today I was thinking about what counters Mismagius. So long as it has Substitute, it's impervious to Chansey. Thunderbolt scares Milotic after a NP boost (2HKOes even 252/252+ Milotic easily) while HP Fightning scares Registeel. So there's a Pokemon that isn't walled by Milotic + Registeel and Chansey besides.

On the other hand, Sub / NP / Thunderbolt / HP Fightning is conspicuously short on Shadow Ball. Can Mismagius be viable without Shadow Ball? I've not used the set, so I honestly don't know. But if you're only worried about dealing with Milotic and Registeel, you could try Shadow Ball / NP / Thunderbolt / HP Fighting.

@Above - an Azumarill without Aqua Jet to deal with Houndoom? That's ... surprising ...

 

[shrang]

I'm not running that Azu to deal with Houndoom, just an attacker. If you want to deal with Houndoom, then yes, you'd better hope you have Aqua Jet. About the Mismagius set, Registeel would still Thunder Wave you and then either Iron Head you to death or switch in something that can take a +2 attack and OHKO you back (Like Drapion).

 

[IronBullet]

I've tried out Resttalk Azumarill and SubPunch Azumarill in tandem today and I have to say, Resttalk has been amazing. I still run Leftovers though. Aqua Jet is missed, but Double Edge hits hard as fuck, and not even Milotic can do much to this guy.

 

[M BLADE]

That's where Slowbro comes in. Best counter for Azumarill. And for a ton of pokes.
How forgotten Slowbro is?

I love CM Slowbro. It fits so well on Slowbro... as does his STAB moves.

 

[shrang]

The only problem with Slowbro is when people are running it as their bulky Water, they get completely curbstomped by Moltres, who is probably the biggest damn threat in UU at the moment. Not to mention that Venusaur wrecks it too. CM Slowbro is pretty cool though.

 

[M BLADE]

Indeed. Slowking has more fitting stats for a bulky water.
I see Slowbro more like a physical wall rather than a bulky water.


But Venusaur shouldn't ever switch in against Slowbro, because Thunder Wave can really mess with it (if it carries it... since everytime i use Slowbro, it is the CM one).

 

[Erazor]

Curiously enough earlier today I was thinking about what counters Mismagius. So long as it has Substitute, it's impervious to Chansey. Thunderbolt scares Milotic after a NP boost (2HKOes even 252/252+ Milotic easily) while HP Fightning scares Registeel. So there's a Pokemon that isn't walled by Milotic + Registeel and Chansey besides.

On the other hand, Sub / NP / Thunderbolt / HP Fightning is conspicuously short on Shadow Ball. Can Mismagius be viable without Shadow Ball? I've not used the set, so I honestly don't know. But if you're only worried about dealing with Milotic and Registeel, you could try Shadow Ball / NP / Thunderbolt / HP Fighting.

@Above - an Azumarill without Aqua Jet to deal with Houndoom? That's ... surprising ...

HP Fight may dent Registeel, but one on one, Registeel will still win. And Mismagius is too weak without Shadow Ball - for god's sake, it loses to Rotom, and loses the ability to really hurt Spiritomb, for starters - and loses its most reliable and powerful attack. All this just to beat Milotc and Registeel, who doesn't even lose to that set.

Hell, I just run NP Missy without HP Fight. I've never really missed it, and Thunderbolt works better to deter Milotic and Blastoise, amongst others. Oh, and having more speed than the common HP fighting Mismagius helps too.

 

[YaM]

Bye smogon I'm retiring thnks fr th mmrs

P.S. Use RAINRAINRAIN destroys everything but watch out for
Venusaur Registeel Milotic Uxie Toxicroak Poliwrath Azumarill Slowbro Slowking Absol Hitmontop Gardevoir Porygon2 Snover Hippopotas Trick Roomers Sun Teams Jolly Kabutops and ScarfMissy ScarfZam or even freaking GOLDUCK or if you don't like Rain then run Sun or Trick Room or All-Choiced or Hail Cleffa! Themed teams FTW.

haha reach/jabba don't infract me and ask me to lurk more ^ competitive discussion above ^ :naughty:

 

[Banedon]

HP Fight may dent Registeel, but one on one, Registeel will still win. And Mismagius is too weak without Shadow Ball - for god's sake, it loses to Rotom, and loses the ability to really hurt Spiritomb, for starters - and loses its most reliable and powerful attack. All this just to beat Milotc and Registeel, who doesn't even lose to that set.

Hell, I just run NP Missy without HP Fight. I've never really missed it, and Thunderbolt works better to deter Milotic and Blastoise, amongst others. Oh, and having more speed than the common HP fighting Mismagius helps too.

Calcs:

+2 252 SpA Timid Mismagius vs. 252/156 Careful Registeel (the one in the analysis) using HP Fighting: 41.8% - 49.5%
+2 252 SpA Timid Mismagius with Life Orb vs. 252/156 Careful Registeel using HP Fighting: 54.4% - 64.3%
100 Attack Registeel vs. 0/0 Mismagius using Iron Head: 44.8% - 52.9%

So HP Fighting does give Mismagius a chance to dent Registeel. If Mismagius NP's on the switch and is holding Leftovers, then Registeel dies first. It'll take two Iron Heads and be reduced to near-death, but Registeel dies first. If Mismagius NP's on the switch and is holding Life Orb, then it takes only one Iron Head and again Registeel dies first. Thunderbolt doesn't deal nearly as much damage to Registeel and is less effective against other Pokemon like Clefable and Steelix, although it does also hit super effective on Moltres.

Now that you argue it Mismagius without Shadow Ball looks pretty ridiculous bar the surprise factor (although you can be sure Rotom switching into Mismagius will be Scarfed, and Spiritomb isn't going to die to Mismagius anyway). It's like a sweeper Alakazam without Psychic. But NP + 3 attacks should still be viable without being walled by Milotic or Registeel.

Otherwise looking at the stats another thing that would break through Milotic and Registeel is powerful physical Fighting attacks. Hitmonlee is an obvious choice here. Absol might work as well, especially if it manages to Swords Dance. Mixed Magmortar with Cross Chop / Thunderbolt would win, too (just throwing out ideas).

 

[Bad Ass]

If you really want something that destroys chansey, milotic, and registeel then just use rotom. Sub / Pain Split / Will O Wisp / Thunderbolt with max hp and speed. I've been experimenting with special attack evs, but i can't really find a good number. It needs a ridiculous amount to ohko moltres, which makes it soooooo much less bulky. it also takes 252 evs to be able to ohko 252/56 calm milotic 91% of the time. I recommend just using 4 evs. Rotom burns the shit out of a lot of stuff with it's great typing, makes a sub they can't break, and then pain splits when they inevitably switch / die. Try it out!

also max attack jolly murkrow will always 2hko 252/200 calm milotic with brave bird.

 

[FlareBlitz]

Missy doesn't need Thunderbolt on a Nasty Plot set; I only use Thunderbolt on a CM set. After an NP Shadow ball hits Milo and Moltres hard enough anyway, and you need HP Ground (not Fighting...) in order to beat Registeel, Drapion, Skunktank, Houndoom, etc.

 

[Delko]

Rest Talk Drapion makes a fine Mismagius counter in my opinion. As the best Mismagius can do is it with a Hidden Power (ground) which just does 66.9% - 79.1% after a NP (against the specially defensive versions anyway), while it get's OHKO'd in return.
Most Mismagius aren't even running Hidden Power (ground) anyway.

 

[IronBullet]

If you really want something that destroys chansey, milotic, and registeel then just use rotom. Sub / Pain Split / Will O Wisp / Thunderbolt with max hp and speed. I've been experimenting with special attack evs, but i can't really find a good number. It needs a ridiculous amount to ohko moltres, which makes it soooooo much less bulky. it also takes 252 evs to be able to ohko 252/56 calm milotic 91% of the time. I recommend just using 4 evs. Rotom burns the shit out of a lot of stuff with it's great typing, makes a sub they can't break, and then pain splits when they inevitably switch / die. Try it out!

That set is devilish. Thund used it against me and it was an absolute pain the ass to take out. Shadow Ball can go over Pain Split, as it's better to get some solid damage against Ground types rather than just stalling them out. Also, not much can break that fucking Sub after you get burned....that typing is so sexy.

 

[FlareBlitz]

I actually ran that same Rotom last metagame, but with max SATK instead of HP. It was setup bait for Raikou so I stopped using it, but I can see it being really amazing now.

 

[Flamewheeler]

Yeah I remember facing rolfkip when he used it. That set is so annoying. It's very hard to take down, so I may use it. =) I just haven't felt like changing teams since I finally found a consistent one. xD

 

[capefeather]

This is probably nothing, but why is Raikou listed as UU again?