The Ground Gym

[CREAM_93]

Hey Smogon! I’ve come to the RMT forum this time for my Ground Gym team in regards to my Pokemon Forum’s Gym Challenge (which if you’re interested in, you should check out my sig for the link). The rules are basically choose a type, and make sure EVERY Pokemon on your team has that type in it, NO WILDCARDS. People who suggest wildcards are wasting energy, that could have gone to other things... like...reading the intro paragraph >.>

_____________________________________________________________________​

Mamoswine

Item: Focus Sash
Trait: Snow Cloak
Nature: Adamant
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

~ Earthquake
~ Ice Shard
~ Endeavour
~ Stealth Rock

This ain’t no stall team, so an offensive lead was the aim here. Mamo is the only real offensive ground typed lead but I guess he does his job. Getting Rocks up is 50/50 though, but I really need this fella to revenge some common Dragons and all the other blah that comes with Mamo that I just love. It’s just annoying getting them up later versus Jirachi, Azelf, Aero and such.

_____________________________________________________________________​

Flygon

Item: Choice Scarf
Trait: Sand Veil
Nature: Jolly
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

~ Outrage
~ Earthquake
~ Thunderpunch
~ U-turn

Flygon has served a pretty reliable Choice Scarf user. Thunderpunch works to revenge Gyarados which is the only reason it has the move, but then again what else do you seriously put in that slot, let alone ever use? Outrage and Earthquake are just boring old dual STAB, yada yada. U-turn is really cool for scouting, but only really a solid choice if I’m avoiding something that not only kills Flygon but also, doesn’t slaughter the rest of the team, and late game with a Ground Gym that’s kinda common :/

_____________________________________________________________________​

Torterra

Item: Leftovers
Trait: Overgrow
Nature: Jolly
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Spe

~ Wood Hammer
~ Earthquake
~ Stone Edge
~ Rock Polish

Torterra is like one of those “in theory you’ll rape shit” but yeah in reality it’s alright, not much else I guess. The selling point was resistance to Water considering it’s part Grass, so really it’s only a neutrality but shit it’s better than nothing. What’s really cool is when I bring this out later game and sweep shit when they switch, even then with this weird bulky spread yet fast (after Rock Polish) that’s easy anyway and then he’ll go on a rampage picking up the scraps. The general bulk works nicely with his handy resistances as often he’s hit and run before setting up and sweeping, so this spread goes a long way for the 2 roles he fills.

_____________________________________________________________________​

Camerupt

Item: Leftovers
Trait: Solid Rock
Nature: Modest
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA

~ Lava Plume
~ Earthquake
~ Hidden Power Ice
~ Substitute

Camerupt is mainly just the Scizor cremator, it can’t do jack to him, but he’ll screw the living hell outta Scizor, then again so can most of counters :P Regardless my amazing spread substitutes as they switch and then hits stuff kinda hard, how nice... So funny when people laugh at it and switch to their SUPER LEET COUNTER and then get shitcanned behind a sub. Great stuff. This thing gets general Steels, Dragons, Grass types and other general blah especially behind a sub, but in general not the most amazing thing ever, I just needed a specially bulky Ice resister.

_____________________________________________________________________

​

Gliscor

Item: Leftovers
Trait: Sand Veil
Nature: Jolly
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe

~ Earthquake
~ Ice Fang
~ Taunt
~ Roost

Gliscor is cool. Nuff said, if you’re not a mod then you know what this does and you can skip to Swampy cause every Gliscor does this.

You are a mod, and are therefore reading my “anti-lock-even-though-it’s-obvious-what-this-does” paragraph. Gliscor basically owns up stall with the Taunt + Roost combo. Also it’s a general hit taker, with some nice resistances and a Ground immunity is always welcomed. He kinda misses Sand Veil working reliably, now I only get versus the Rock Gym which I challenge a lot for moral support ownage.

_____________________________________________________________________​

Swampert

Item: Leftovers
Trait: Torrent
Nature: Impish
EVs: 240 HP / 52 Atk / 216 Def

~ Earthquake
~ Avalanche
~ Rest
~ Sleep Talk

This set should be the standard, seriously it’s soooo good it’s uncanny. Swampert without reliable recovery, even without RestTalk is one of the best Physical Walls in the game, so going half way with RestTalk is sick. Swampy covers much that the team can’t handle alone, just the steroid Physical Sweepers and is able to come in and do that again with his recovery method. My most reliable Water counter, unlike Torterra who takes water neutral but then the impending and inevitable Ice Beam 4x super effective. The coverage of Earthquake and Avalanche is pretty flawless too, I think it only misses out on Shedinja from memory, not bad stuff.

_____________________________________________________________________​

Okay so that’s the team. The only troubles I’m having is generally hit taking. Individually, certain Pokemon fair quite nicely like Swampert and Gliscor for example, but then things like my Torterra may take a Surf but are then swamped by an Ice Beam. I’ve tried many combinations but I can’t seem to get a good one down, so any help is really appreciated ^_^ Thanks in advanced to all you raters.

 

[moussrfacekilla]

awesome idea for a team! mechanics seem solid. Probably won't do amazing in OU, but it looks like a fun and interesting team. I did the same with fighting and its fun on wifi

p.s. don't be afraid to add 1-2 "wild cards" aka pokemon that look like ground pokemon, but arn't ground type for example: dunsparce (digs in the ground), aerodactyl (dug up from the ground) or clefable (lives underground). I used electivire on my fighting team ebcause he looks buff, learns cross chop/low kick and has a dojo/fighting feel (and he's resistant to flying)

 

[CREAM_93]

cheers mate, but i'm looking for rates > compliments

p.s. read the intro...

 

[Jebus McAzn]

You seem to have removed the link from your sig... T_T

I find Dugtrio to be superior to Camerupt. The tier difference of UU and NU speaks for itself, but Dugtrio can reliably trap Scizor while Camerupt can only set up, then fail to hurt whatever switches in on it. Your Camerupt set is ruined by Swampert, Suicune, and just bulky Waters in general (while your only answer to them is Torterra, which is in turn hit hard by Ice moves). Dugtrio is a reliable answer to your Scizor problem, but the bulky water problem still stands. Right now, your only counter is a Scarfed Flygon carrying Thunderpunch, and the fact that it's Scarfed makes prediction elementary and switch-ins very easy on their part.

Frankly, I see few answers on a pure Ground team to bulky Waters. Life Orb/Specs Nidoking with Thunderbolt can attempt to remedy this, but you'd have to cut a Pokemon from your current team, none of which are really replaceable. Flygon, for the most part, can take out these Waters, but they can switch out so easily once they see Flygon coming.

I realize that I'm treating this too much like an OU team and not enough like a Gym-specific team, but that's where the fun is, isn't it? xD

 

[iKinkajou]

What would you do if Camerupt died, and you had no ways of demolishing ices?

 

[Jebus McAzn]

Well if Camerupt dies, he doesn't have a way of handling Ices. Dugtrio does learn Stone Edge though. Frankly the team has difficulty with anything that's part Water or part Ice.

 

[Xiahou Dun]

Props for no Wildcards. Wildcards are boring. Why Mono at all if you have like only 3-4 Pokemon of your gyms actual type.

Obviously in a Mono there ARE going to be unavoidable weakness issues but you really shouldn't have THREE pokemon on your team who are 4x to Ice.

I would drop one of them personally for something else. Nidokings large movepool would allow you to add some much needed flexibility.

 

[GtM]

I second Xiahou Dun, use a Nidoking or Nidoqueen, perhaps with a Passho Berry, and give it Thunderbolt or Thunderpunch. Whilst we're on the subject of berries, perhaps a Yache Berry on Torterra would help it deal with bulky waters, since almost all of them will use Ice Beam the first chance they get. Then you can destroy Suicune and Swampert with Wood Hammer.

 

[gaburu]

I think Quagsire would make for a decent substitute for Swampert in one
of these rare cases. It gives you needed water immunity with the same typing and similar movepools. I hope it works out for you.

 

[moussrfacekilla]

for camerupt use earthpower over EQ for a SpA spread imo. Unless it is for attacking defense on a special wall.

 

[Jebus McAzn]

for camerupt use earthpower over EQ for a SpA spread imo. Unless it is for attacking defense on a special wall.

Seconded; a Modest nature and no EVs doesn't help Earthquake any.

I still think that a Nidoking would be better over Camerupt. The Passho Berry suggestion isn't bad either.

 

[CREAM_93]

You seem to have removed the link from your sig... T_T

Well i had to as we can't advertise other sites on this forum so instead i gotta direct people to pm me if they want the info. So feel free to drop us a message :P

I find Dugtrio to be superior to Camerupt. The tier difference of UU and NU speaks for itself, but Dugtrio can reliably trap Scizor while Camerupt can only set up, then fail to hurt whatever switches in on it. Your Camerupt set is ruined by Swampert, Suicune, and just bulky Waters in general (while your only answer to them is Torterra, which is in turn hit hard by Ice moves). Dugtrio is a reliable answer to your Scizor problem, but the bulky water problem still stands. Right now, your only counter is a Scarfed Flygon carrying Thunderpunch, and the fact that it's Scarfed makes prediction elementary and switch-ins very easy on their part.

I see some reasoning behind this tbh, but trapping doesn't stop it killing duggy. Choice Band Scizor probably OHKO's duggy whilst he'd fail to OHKO even with earthquake, and that would even still leave it vulnerable to priority, what's worse is duggy's only priority is weak to scizor. Also tiers don't mean jack shit to be frank.

Life Orb/Specs Nidoking with Thunderbolt can attempt to remedy this, but you'd have to cut a Pokemon from your current team, none of which are really replaceable. Flygon, for the most part, can take out these Waters, but they can switch out so easily once they see Flygon coming.

Yeah i've tested nido's and they work quite well, i tried life orb with nido running a special set and it worked quite well. I ended up testing between passho and yache berry, leaning to yache later on however. This has replaced camerupt.

I think Quagsire would make for a decent substitute for Swampert in one of these rare cases. It gives you needed water immunity with the same typing and similar movepools. I hope it works out for you.

Yeah i ended up switching this in and booted torterra, and it uses toxic, EQ, ice punch, recover. Works really nice as sometimes swampert is needed for two many hits so having "2 swamperts" per se works quite well :P

for camerupt use earthpower over EQ for a SpA spread imo. Unless it is for attacking defense on a special wall.

Nice catch there, but sadly it's only a typo. Thx for pointing that out though...

 

[pokemon]

Your Gliscor EVs aren't that effective. What does 252 Speed EVS accomplish except for speed tying with max speed + nature E-Vire? Which already gets raped by Flygon.

Go for 252 Hp, 40 Def, 216 Speed for most useful. Outspeeds Jolly SD Luke and rapes it with EQ.

Oh yeah whats Ice Fang do again? Mence can OHKO you with DM, with like a bit of residual damage. All the dragons outspeed you. I would recommend Toxic. Toxic, in cooperation with Taunt and Roost completely shuts down Stall. The only thing that could hurt it would be like CroCune or Blissey with Ice Beam+SAtk EVs.

 

[Shizzle]

On your lead, outspeeding Heatran is always nice, so run this spread, 20 HP / 252 Atk / 236 Spe, and a Jolly Nature.

Give Torterra a Life Orb, he needs to be dealing a shit load of damage, you can't be an offensive sweeper without attack EVs and 109 Base Attack, use this spread 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe.

Also you may want to use a CursePert, it will be the one pokemon that is a reliable set up sweeper, and without Curse, the damage you are doing is far too low. Curse with the Careful natured set on the analysis is the set to use, please try that one out.

EDIT:
@pokemon, you kind of contradicted yourself there, you just said in your third para why Gliscor should run max speed, so then it can beat both SD Luke and Salamence, as well as other Gliscor. The 40 Def EVs are just leftovers, and there is nothing better than getting the jump on other Gliscor/Salamence/Non Scarf Jirachi

 

[pokemon]

Um...what? Max Speed gliscor cannot outspeed Max Speed Mence, Max Speed Jirachi, basically anything base 100 and up thats max speed with speed boosting nature. Those Gliscor EVs already outrun Jolly Luke...so I don't know what the hell you're saying. Even if it is the Old-Mix Mence, you won't do too much with Intimidate factored in, and DM OHKOs. Jolly Weavile can't even OHKO mence after intimidate, how can Gliscor? It can do some damage I guess, but mence can just roost it all off. Toxic is more useful in wearing it down.

BTW Gliscor has only base 95 speed. Cannot outrun Max Speed +nature base 100s.

Other gliscors can be beaten down by Avalanche and HP ice from Camerupt so its not a biggy.

 

[Shizzle]

My bad, for some reason thought Gliscor had 100 base Speed, but I would still rather be outspeeding other Gliscor, especially when you pack Ice Fang

 

[pokemon]

:/

Eh good point but packing Toxic completely ruins stall. They must switch out or eventually die to poison. And Taunt screws over Rest. Ice Fang is viable I suppose, but you don't see lot's of Gliscors in the current metagame. Lol I'm thinking about this as if it were an OU team....But thats not the whole point. Toxic ruins over every type except for steel and poison. Those with Rest and Natural Cure are fucked over. Ice Fang does hit dragons flying but Camerupt covers all of them, Swampert covers all of them. Then so does Flygon. Its not needed IMO. Toxic is best for wearing down pokemon.

 

[kd24]

I'm sure it's been said or at least implied or told to you in some forum BUT, I would suggest Nidoqueen with Toxic Spikes/Ice Beam/Fire Blast/Protect over Camerupt. Toxic Spikes can eliminate the biggest threat to a ground-type theme team: Bulky-Waters and this nidoqueen can still be a solid scizor counter, scouting with protect, absorbing hits, and koing with fire blast. Ice Beam will help you with dragon problems just in case, as you obviously try not to let them set up.

camerupts cool for the fire-typing and fun moves, but at the end of the day, toxic spikes just supports your team better and if it still counters scizor, i would use it.

good luck gym leader!

 

[CREAM_93]

Your Gliscor EVs aren't that effective. What does 252 Speed EVS accomplish except for speed tying with max speed + nature E-Vire? Which already gets raped by Flygon.

Go for 252 Hp, 40 Def, 216 Speed for most useful. Outspeeds Jolly SD Luke and rapes it with EQ.

Ever heard of non-standards being viable? Look at this Gliscor, it's a taunt user, you know what makes it shit? being taunted, why should i risk loosing to other gliscor, imo opinion the most common non-lead taunter. Besides because gliscor is quite potent many things aim to outspeed it to 1 point. And what's stopping me switching out of electivire? Gliscor is part of a TEAM, so i couldn't give a rat's ass what can kill it or not, that's what the allies cover up, and what they do so quite well *cough mamo*

On your lead, outspeeding Heatran is always nice, so run this spread, 20 HP / 252 Atk / 236 Spe, and a Jolly Nature.

Indeed, I've lost to heatran leads before, but i knew i'd live with focus sash and OHKO with earthquake. However some are really bulky and i swear one lived an EQ once (shuca berry, lol), meaning i couldn't get up the rocks after, so having the speed to get in twice will come in very handy. Cheers for that, but i think the 20 EV's will go better in defence, his HP's already massive :P

Give Torterra a Life Orb, he needs to be dealing a shit load of damage, you can't be an offensive sweeper without attack EVs and 109 Base Attack, use this spread 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe.

I needed torterra to take hits, if you read his description then you'd see that >.> Plus the fact he's got big attack means it'll cope without a pumping, and rather his defensive prowess to certain types (hence the reason i picked him in the first) needed to be maximised over attacks. Besides rock polish is there just cause the filler of a pure defensive set wont get used, so it found it's way into my filler spot. lol :P

And i dropped torterra anyway, another good reason to read stuff... reading good :P

Eh good point but packing Toxic completely ruins stall. They must switch out or eventually die to poison. And Taunt screws over Rest. Ice Fang is viable I suppose, but you don't see lot's of Gliscors in the current metagame. Lol I'm thinking about this as if it were an OU team....But thats not the whole point. Toxic ruins over every type except for steel and poison. Those with Rest and Natural Cure are fucked over. Ice Fang does hit dragons flying but Camerupt covers all of them, Swampert covers all of them. Then so does Flygon. Its not needed IMO. Toxic is best for wearing down pokemon.

I tried toxic > different moves (taunt and ice fang, mainly ice fang) but really gliscor IS the solid ice user that faces up to what ice moves slaughter. Toxic works nicely over Ice Fang, i agree completely; as that's what it originally had but sometimes i got screwed over because of not having it on me at the time. Good catch though...

I'm sure it's been said or at least implied or told to you in some forum BUT, I would suggest Nidoqueen with Toxic Spikes/Ice Beam/Fire Blast/Protect over Camerupt. Toxic Spikes can eliminate the biggest threat to a ground-type theme team: Bulky-Waters and this nidoqueen can still be a solid scizor counter, scouting with protect, absorbing hits, and koing with fire blast. Ice Beam will help you with dragon problems just in case, as you obviously try not to let them set up.

ohhh, i never thought of using a nido defensively. Well yeah i ended up replacing it with Nidoking which is working nicely as having room for thunderbolt to pwn bulky waters helps a lot. I might not need IB on Nidoqueen so i might try TB if IB isn't fairing that well and the bulky water issue is too much. Nice suggestion, i'll definately give this a try :P

 

[moe1216]

Did you ever think about using a Hippowdon with Earthquake/Stealth Rock/ Toxic/ Protect with Leftovers? It has excellent defense stats and if used just right can wear down opponents with patience while setting up Sandstorm and Stealth Rock for future support. Just an opinion from a fellow ground user. Also, I like how you use Mamoswine. It looks awesome!

Also, how do you find the pictures of pokemon that you add to your posts?

 

[Jebus McAzn]

Mamoswine's analysis says "This ain't no stall team", so I suspect that he'll want to shy away from Hippowdon. It's a great Pokemon in its own respect, but mono-Ground gives him raging weaknesses to Ice, Water, and Grass; weaknesses that he doesn't need to aggravate more.

In general, pictures come from Google Images, although Bulbapedia has the most reliable, same-size sprites of Pokemon. Get to the page with just the image on it, copy the URL in, and click the "picture" tab right above the text box that you type in. Paste the URL there and you'll get a picture.

 

[Wanderer]

There aren't any huge changes I can suggest, but Ice Beam over Avalanche on Swampert with a Relaxed nature does more damage to Dragons on the switch, even with no SpA EVs. Plus, it makes it so that a bulky DDmence or something can't set up on you (unboosted Avalanche only does 32-38% to bulky Mence, while regular Mence takes 47-55% and can still sweep if SR wasn't set up). I know you have Mamoswine, but if it took a hit down to sash in the lead position and SR is up, then it's goodbye to the rest of your team.

Also, what is Ice Fang on Gliscor for? It's not really all that strong of an Ice move especially on something with no attack investment (doesn't even guarantee an OHKO on Flygon), so I'm not sure what you use it for. Toxic to me seems like a good replacement overall to help hit bulky waters on the switch if you haven't set up tspikes yet.

Reading this reminds me that I need to make another mono-team, heh. Good luck with the team!

 

[Enygma]

Ever heard of non-standards being viable? Look at this Gliscor, it's a taunt user, you know what makes it shit? being taunted, why should i risk loosing to other gliscor, imo opinion the most common non-lead taunter. Besides because gliscor is quite potent many things aim to outspeed it to 1 point. And what's stopping me switching out of electivire? Gliscor is part of a TEAM, so i couldn't give a rat's ass what can kill it or not, that's what the allies cover up, and what they do so quite well *cough mamo*

What can other Gliscor do to you that makes you so afraid of them? Opposing Gliscor can't do jackshit to your own Gliscor unless they are max speed w/ Ice Fang, which I hardly doubt they will run. Secondly, why would opposing Gliscor switch in on your Gliscor? Toxic? Pfft. Why use 252 Spe EVs to outrun things that you don't need to outrun? At the end of the day, the slower Gliscor usually gets the advantage (note that I didn't say WIN) because the slower one will take the Taunt so the switch-in can come in Tauntless; you'd be better off running 252 HP l 40 Atk l 216 Spe, Jolly.

I tried toxic > different moves (taunt and ice fang, mainly ice fang) but really gliscor IS the solid ice user that faces up to what ice moves slaughter. Toxic works nicely over Ice Fang, i agree completely; as that's what it originally had but sometimes i got screwed over because of not having it on me at the time.

The majority of the time, Toxic will be better, since Ice Fang doesn't hit anything hard that EQ can't other than Mence/Dragonite and shit like that. You definitely need Toxic to be able to combat bulky waters that would like to switch in and run on your team. You already have ScarfGon and Swine for Mence, unless you get shitfucked and decide to sack Swine early on. My advice to you would be to use Swampert as a lead, since Swine is the only thing in the way of a boosted Mence sweep. With Pert as lead, you would free up a slot for Swine.

ohhh, i never thought of using a nido defensively. Well yeah i ended up replacing it with Nidoking which is working nicely as having room for thunderbolt to pwn bulky waters helps a lot. I might not need IB on Nidoqueen so i might try TB if IB isn't fairing that well and the bulky water issue is too much. Nice suggestion, i'll definately give this a try :P

Personally, I would consider Nidoqueen > Nidoking because of her bulk, and because Queens > Kings. Just saying. But test both out and see what floats your boat and makes you hard.

One thing that I noticed is that this team is screaming for Quagsire somewhere, or at least Hippowdon to summon SS. SS would definitely help break down Mence, as well as other shit so your team can handle them better. Quagsire would be very beneficial to, literally, absorb water attacks that your team is prone to. You already have grass assaults handled pretty well with Nido and Gliscor. If you decide to keep Swine as your lead, then I would suggest using Sire > Pert, but if you move Pert to the lead position, then I suppose it's your call. Or you can just move Gliscor as a lead, since you already have a second answer to Lucario.

Being a retired Ground GL on another forum back in the day, I can tell you that Swine would probably be the best Pokemon since you need it to counter Mence (and Chomp back in the day, aha!), which is why you shouldn't run Swine as a lead. Nidoqueen also acts as your Lucario counter should you find Gliscor in a tough spot to switch in on a boosted Lucario.

I hope I helped!

 

[moe1216]

Whoops! My bad. hmmmm....I'm going with Enygma. Swine is definitely strong but using it as a lead may put you in a bind when you need it down the road, but those like Swampert can shine since they only have one weakness (CURSE YOU GRASS!) in the lead spot.