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Thanks for your input :). If anyone can cba it would be great to see some damage calcs to see if modest is worth running power wise that would be awesome....lol

also that speed tier thread is great; you should put it in your sig to bump it :).
 
Think of Modest not as a nature, but as a 10% power boost on all of your attacks. If you're 'just missing' OHKOs or 2HKOs, Modest will turn those into actual OHKOs and 2HKOs. Generally speaking, if you're under base 100 speed, no matter how much you boost you won't outspeed everything base 100 speed and above (mostly because everything 100+ runs max+ speed to outspeed everything else 100 and above), so the extra speed isn't all that useful. However, the power boost applies to every attack you hit with.

Also, thanks, and the thought of putting it in my sig never crossed my mind lol
 
I've got 2 hasty Maractus, both w/ chlorophyll that I'm planning a mixed set w/ growth / sucker punch / giga drain / Filler.

These are the IV's:

Maractus #1 - 20 / 28 / 2 / 30 / 30 / 31

Maractus #2 - 28 / 14 / 30 / 26 / 24 / 31

The first looks tempting but its Def IV's are horrible. The second one has pretty solid defensive IV's but only half atk IV's.

I know these pokes have pretty bad defenses from the get go but should I go ahead w/ #2 and give up some Atk IV's to have a Maractus w/ better bulk?
 
I know that most of the time it is a special wall, but would physically defensive mandibuzz be viable?
 
Why is it that garchomp is banned , while all these legends , latios , landorus , thundurus , tornadus , latias , celebi , mew , jirachi ,victini and so on , all arent banned?
They all can kill a garchomp with ease , a garchomp isnt a problem AT ALL .
Sure he has sand veil , what does it matter ? Use never hitting moves , can counter that. But some people in the metagame use 3+ legends in 1 team , making it near to impossible to kill them all. They all have extraordinary stats , where garchomp still has normal stats ( garchomps total stat is 600 i believe , almost all legends are above that) . Celebi has 100 too but it has NO weakness , has 100 in every stat , same for shaymin , jirachi ...

I really cant understand this , are you all such crybaby's about garchomp's sand veil but you never noticed how legends are really ruining the metagame ?

Pls some1 explain it to me...
 
Soulfly said:
Why is it that garchomp is banned , while all these legends , latios , landorus , thundurus , tornadus , latias , celebi , mew , jirachi ,victini and so on , all arent banned?
They all can kill a garchomp with ease , a garchomp isnt a problem AT ALL .
Sure he has sand veil , what does it matter ? Use never hitting moves , can counter that. But some people in the metagame use 3+ legends in 1 team , making it near to impossible to kill them all. They all have extraordinary stats , where garchomp still has normal stats ( garchomps total stat is 600 i believe , almost all legends are above that) . Celebi has 100 too but it has NO weakness , has 100 in every stat , same for shaymin , jirachi ...

I really cant understand this , are you all such crybaby's about garchomp's sand veil but you never noticed how legends are really ruining the metagame ?

Pls some1 explain it to me...
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Not all legends are unbanned. For example, Mewtwo, Rayquaze etc. If these pokes are unbanned, then they would definitely spoil the metagame. However, some other legends such as Celebi are on the level of other OU pokemon. They do not have godly stats(most have 600 base stats), and all have weaknesses that can be exploited. To put it simply, placing pokes in tiers do not defend simply on legend or non-legend, it depends on the poke as a whole and how well it fairs in the metagame
 
kmuffinman said:
Not all legends are unbanned. For example, Mewtwo, Rayquaze etc. If these pokes are unbanned, then they would definitely spoil the metagame. However, some other legends such as Celebi are on the level of other OU pokemon. They do not have godly stats(most have 600 base stats), and all have weaknesses that can be exploited. To put it simply, placing pokes in tiers do not defend simply on legend or non-legend, it depends on the poke as a whole and how well it fairs in the metagame
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That still doesnt change the fact that the legends i named were spoiling the meta game ,every single one of them can sweep a team with not too much effort . Garchomp was banned because 'it ruined the metagame' , but really ... thelegends i listed are ruining it alot more , DEFENATLY when there are SO many of them in 1 team. Everytime i lost a battle it was because they used 3 or more legends against me , its just gay , make a legend clause...
 
Soulfly said:
That still doesnt change the fact that the legends i named were spoiling the meta game ,every single one of them can sweep a team with not too much effort . Garchomp was banned because 'it ruined the metagame' , but really ... thelegends i listed are ruining it alot more , DEFENATLY when there are SO many of them in 1 team. Everytime i lost a battle it was because they used 3 or more legends against me , its just gay , make a legend clause...
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Never missing move?

wrong argument.

Anything with 60 BP--Too weak unless you have Technician to back it up, only user of Tech in OU is Scizor, no slot for Aerial Ace(BP/SP/U-Turn/Bug Bite is what most people run)

Vital Throw--hi. I'm a negative priority attack. As such, Garchomp can deal massive damage to whoever uses me before I kill him. Oh, and Garchomp has decent bulk. umad? :nerd:

Aura Sphere--I can count the number of Pokemon who get this move and are not in Uber(for the record, 4)

Clear Smog-- what a joke
 
when you get reqs you can vote to ban those guys and bring down garchomp, soulfly.

that is, if you ever get reqs, seeing how you must be a pretty horrible battler to be unable to handle those pokemon. stop whining
 
Pwnemon said:
when you get reqs you can vote to ban those guys and bring down garchomp, soulfly.

that is, if you ever get reqs, seeing how you must be a pretty horrible battler to be unable to handle those pokemon. stop whining
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If that is the case , how horrible was the world before that they couldnt handle a garchomp ?
Just saying , i dont need this kind of replies.

20%more evasion in the sandstorm , ok , then most moves still have 80 accuracy , wich is ok.
Gliscor has the same ability , a ton of ice pokemon have the ability ...
It really doesnt matter if u ask me.

And when would i get 'reqs' ?
 
Soulfly said:
Celebi has 100 too but it has NO weakness
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I lol'd. FYI, Celebi has the most number of weaknesses out of all Pokemon, and will always be even if you consider unreleased typing combinations.

Garchomp's evasion really comes in when it spams substitute until you miss a move, and it can SD up and sweep.. and that's even assuming that the Pokemon Garchomp is facing can OHKO it. Garchomp has swampert's bulk, so it's not exactly easy to OHKO. Weaker Ice moves can't OHKO and I'm not counting Yache berry variants.

Oh, and did I mention nothing resists Garchomp's STABs other than Bronzong and Skarmory?

And just wondering, what Legendaries do you have trouble with? Surely you aren't having troubles with... Articuno, right? tsk tsk
 
Soulfly said:
If that is the case , how horrible was the world before that they couldnt handle a garchomp ?
Just saying , i dont need this kind of replies.

20%more evasion in the sandstorm , ok , then most moves still have 80 accuracy , wich is ok.
Gliscor has the same ability , a ton of ice pokemon have the ability ...
It really doesnt matter if u ask me.

And when would i get 'reqs' ?
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Well combine that with Substitute, bulk more impressive than Swampert and the ability to Swords Dance in your face, and you've got something very difficult to take down...

And 80% is good? Stone Edge has 80% and misses all the time...

Gliscor is different as it's mostly used as a wall rather than a physical sweeper, and ice pokemon aren't common in the metagame compared to dragons...

You'd get reqs from laddering until getting over 1450 (don't quote me on that) rating and then you'd get voting reqs in order to vote whether something is broken or not :)

EDIT: Ninja'd :)
 
Soulfly said:
If that is the case , how horrible was the world before that they couldnt handle a garchomp ?
Just saying , i dont need this kind of replies.

20%more evasion in the sandstorm , ok , then most moves still have 80 accuracy , wich is ok.
Gliscor has the same ability , a ton of ice pokemon have the ability ...
It really doesnt matter if u ask me.

And when would i get 'reqs' ?
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Well, lurk more. If you want to know the reactions of battlers pre-chomp ban, look at the threads for the previous rounds.

80 accuracy is already unreliable enough(*cough*Stone Miss*cough*), slap on BrightPowder and then you have 70(*cough*Fail Blast*cough*)
 
Well brightpowder is banned , so it doesnt get worse then 80%.
Focus blast etc should miss alot but when they use it against me it missed only 1 time out of 50+ trys allready ...

As for legends causing me troubles : not one in particular.
Thats why i say , they should add a legends clause like : not more then 2 legends in a team.
Some people come at me with celebi , heatran , latios , landorus or any of his brothers i guess, and so on .
That is plain gay , its not hard to be the best when using almost only legends.
Thats what i'm trying to say , i'm not saying they should bring garchomp back , i'm just saying how they can tollerate 3 or more legends in one team , and not tollerate 1 garchomp .
 
Hope this link will answer your question: Smogon's Philosophy. They will never make such a Legendary Clause. You may use them with your friends, but no, there's no way Smogon's going to do that.

Smogon said:
Another misplaced argument is the opposite—the banishment of lesser legendaries. This is not disputed in the case of monsters like Mewtwo, but for strong yet available choices like Azelf, or even lesser Pokémon like Entei, which aren't even considered standard! The important thought to keep in mind is that all Pokémon are unique, and there is actually a world of difference between, say, Jirachi and Entei—while the former is high-tier and enjoys consistent use, the latter is a forgotten rarity due to a poor stat distribution and movepool. Smogon attempts to avoid bans as much as possible—only when it becomes very apparent that a Pokémon is far too powerful to be in line with a balanced metagame is it banished permanently from the standard arena. Many legendary Pokémon are very balanced within the realm of standards and open up new options for players, who value any option to avoid staleness.

The above arguments sometimes drive people to search for their own metagames, unique ideas outside the realm of Smogon's standards. This is not a bad idea...
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This essentially says no to the Legendary Clause.

EDIT: Master Win, their performance in Uber tier has nothing to do with their Uber-ness, so to speak. If they're broken in OU, then they go to Ubers, simple as that. Those legendaries that aren't Uber are because they aren't broken in OU, not because they don't do well in Ubers.
 
Hey guys, (Soulfly included) this belongs more in the suspect testing forums. If you have an arguement about certain pokemon being in a certain tier, then go complain there. But I'll think I'll wrap up this arguement like this:

These legendaries aren't in ubers because they don't have the fire power to BE in ubers. Landorus would get swamped by kyogre, and I doubt victini could do much to groudon with V-create. Garchomp was banned simply because of the sets he could run. It doesn't matter what the base stat total is. A lv 1 rattata can beat a lv 100 rayquaza with the right moveset. Case closed. If you still want to keep on arguing, do it in the suspect testing thread.
 
Amarillo said:
Hope this link will answer your question: Smogon's Philosophy. They will never make such a Legendary Clause. You may use them with your friends, but no, there's no way Smogon's going to do that.



This essentially says no to the Legendary Clause,
Click to expand...

Well i didnt mean any of the uber legends , they are to be banned from ou completely.
But the other legends , that can be used , should be limited per team.
I mean , if they come at you with landorus , wich is fast and bulky enough to survive unboosted priority's (as it is a legends wich are never really frail...).
So of all the legends , that arent banned, there should be a limit of amount u can have in a team.
Personally i would say maximum 2 of those non-uber legends per team.
Because usually u counter a pokemon with 1 pokemon , but if there is 2 of the same kind of pokemon , your planned counter will eventually die.

If you planned a counted for a sweeping legend like thundurus , and they come with a thundurus + landorus , or thundurus + latios etc etc , you're plain fcked ... unless you have a full defensive team to say it like that...

Anyways , i think you know what i mean , and i think every1 that battle's on smogon has felt what i'm feeling before , unless they never had 5 battles in a row with people using almost full legend OU teams ...
 
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