Serious Teacher loses appeal to return to teaching because of history in pornography

Truthfully once a whore, always a whore. A woman who has been with many men will never be loved / accepted by someone their equal. A woman could be near perfect for you but if they have been with too many men, she is far less valuble and most men would prefer to claim their parter / love someone that not everyone has already had.
@Logan-- wow what the fuck? Are you serious? Please tell me you are just trolling

Unfortunately, sometimes you have to commit yourself to the unpopular opinion/course of action if you're ever going to make things like "a culture more supportive of porn and open sexuality" a modern reality. Change isn't born in day dreams and silent prayers.

Oh please, as if there weren't countless other ways to introduce change through means other than blowing up this case, or forcing these kids to "be good" despite culture they've already been indoctrinated in. If I wanted to see sexuality more open in society, and in the education system, there are baby steps, starting with attitudes towards sexuality in raising elementary school kids--we build into the system, that would be better for the kids.



I think a lot of you fail to see that the teacher is not the only "victim" or innocent party who has been hurt by this incident.

All the kids who don't act up, still have to deal with all the drama going on in and out of class. You can't say it won't have a negative impact on their studies, and that simply isn't fair.

Even for those students who are acting up, they are not adults. They are prepubescents in their most awkward adjustment/development period (especially towards sexuality). There's only so much (especially towards this topic) that you can expect them to handle properly and maturely-- anything beyond that expectation, and really, you are the one responsible, not the kids.

I think this is a pretty easy to understand concept-- children cannot be held to the same degree of accountability and responsibility as adults.
 
So she can't teach because 12 year old boys are immature. They use the term "inability to command authority" as a way to place the blame on her, rather than on the kids for being retarded, or the parents for doing a poor job raising them. So she engaged in a "morally questionable" occupation for 9 months to pay bills because it made her a hell of a lot more money than working at McDonalds. It in absolutely no way, shape or form affects her knowledge or teaching ability. Cases like these frustrate the hell out of me because people are being punished for small reasons whereas the much larger cause of the problem is being completely overlooked. Parents these days increasingly use the "kids will be kids" mentality as an excuse to be lazy and not put work into raising their children. I was a 12 year old boy at one point in my life, and I went through the same hormonal explosions that everyone else does, but my parents actually put in the damn work to teach me discipline, self-control and respect. To make matters worse, parents these days are not working together and cooperating with their children's teachers. Rather, they are adopting this "my child can do no wrong" approach and fight with the teachers every step of the way. The whole system grows more f'ed up by the year, and people like Ms Halas are just casualties of it. Until we get back to a place where Parents and Teachers are on the same team, things will continue this way.
 
@Ala: I want to reiterate my point of "Should perfection be our standard?" You mentioned how she chose to do porn, whereas teachers with impeding disabilities did not choose that. My only response to that is (rhetorically) asking "Have you ever made a mistake?" The point here is that yes, she chose to do porn, but even if she regretted that decision 1000 fold, and repented as much as she could, we still would forbid her from teaching simply because "Well you made a choice we dislike once, should've been more perfect."


And why do people act as if porn stars aren't well-rounded human beings? I mean I know the point of the industry is to turn them into objects for your entertainment, but that doesn't actually mean they BECOME objects. This woman is not a shell of a human being, whose majority of thoughts are about sex and deviancy. Just a normal person. To underline this I'll give you this study, that showed Porn Stars as having "higher self-esteem, more positive feelings and greater levels of spirituality than other women".


Basically, even if we still insist on holding people to our standards of perfection, being a porn star isn't even that blemishing on a person's true character in the first-place.
 
So she can't teach because 12 year old boys are immature. They use the term "inability to command authority" as a way to place the blame on her, rather than on the kids for being retarded, or the parents for doing a poor job raising them. So she engaged in a "morally questionable" occupation for 9 months to pay bills because it made her a hell of a lot more money than working at McDonalds. It in absolutely no way, shape or form affects her knowledge or teaching ability. Cases like these frustrate the hell out of me because people are being punished for small reasons whereas the much larger cause of the problem is being completely overlooked. Parents these days increasingly use the "kids will be kids" mentality as an excuse to be lazy and not put work into raising their children. I was a 12 year old boy at one point in my life, and I went through the same hormonal explosions that everyone else does, but my parents actually put in the damn work to teach me discipline, self-control and respect. To make matters worse, parents these days are not working together and cooperating with their children's teachers. Rather, they are adopting this "my child can do no wrong" approach and fight with the teachers every step of the way. The whole system grows more f'ed up by the year, and people like Ms Halas are just casualties of it. Until we get back to a place where Parents and Teachers are on the same team, things will continue this way.

When I was 12 we were just learning sex ed and giggling at the word "penis" everytime the teacher mentioned it, so I don't see why you're saying the children are being retarded, they're just being kids. If this happened to me when I was 12, I'd find it hilarious. I'm more weirded out by her fellow teachers looking for the goods.

@Ala: I want to reiterate my point of "Should perfection be our standard?" You mentioned how she chose to do porn, whereas teachers with impeding disabilities did not choose that. My only response to that is (rhetorically) asking "Have you ever made a mistake?" The point here is that yes, she chose to do porn, but even if she regretted that decision 1000 fold, and repented as much as she could, we still would forbid her from teaching simply because "Well you made a choice we dislike once, should've been more perfect."

She made a mistake, obviously, but just because she did does not absolve her of any consequences. If I made the mistake of drinking too much, getting behind the wheel of a car and getting arrested, should I be let go because it was just a mistake? No, of course not. There's not much else I can say other than "tough shit" for her, I hope other girls in a similar situation realize that by doing porn they are potentially jeopardizing their future careers.

Just note that I am not agreeing with the decision that she was fired for this, but that she should have known in a society where sexuality is considered taboo that this would be frowned upon.
 
I'm more weirded out by her fellow teachers looking for the goods.

I noticed that part too, when they all looked it up on their smartphones, haha. Regardless, just because kids are immature by nature does not mean you can't combat it with good parenting. They aren't going to be perfect little angels all the time no matter what you do, but you can at least raise them well enough so they aren't "unable" to learn because their teacher used to be a pornstar.
 
Yeah, that part where they are unable to learn was more the parent's view of the situation I think, it just doesn't sound like something a kid would say.
 
Truthfully once a whore, always a whore. A woman who has been with many men will never be loved / accepted by someone their equal. A woman could be near perfect for you but if they have been with too many men, she is far less valuble and most men would prefer to claim their parter / love someone that not everyone has already had.

What in the sweet mother of fuck? Your thinking is very backwards. Go back to the 1930's.
 
I think she should be allowed to teach; she has her certificate, she just happens to have a past profession in pornography (look at that alliteration!). Whether she'd be an effective teacher, I don't know; students will watch her videos (some, at least), bother her about it, disrupt the lessons, etc. But I still think she should be allowed to teach.
 
i think it's a really unfortunate situation for the teacher, especially teaching classes of younger children, who we really can't expect to behave sensibly and maturely. even if, like some of you have suggested, the parents and teachers did a better job raising the children and making them more sensitive to issues like this, there will always be some kids who carry on causing trouble. that's assuming that all of the parents are even prepared to look past things like this, some people are stuck in their ways and will not change, and so the indoctrinated kids often grow up the same. (hey religion, how ya' doing?)

i have no doubt that she's a changed woman and genuinely regrets the decisions she has made in the past, like most people do, and in an ideal world she wouldn't have to lose her job over this. taking just the issue out of this context, i wouldn't judge her on what she has done in the past, i'd rather base my opinions on her around how she behaves from then on (in the simplest terms and obviously generalising to keep things relatively succinct). and so from an employment standpoint, they obviously hired her because she was qualified and presumably kept her for as long as they did because she was good at her job.

unfortunately that's all sort of irrelevant in this particular case; i mean yes, we can talk about this as an actual issue and debate the 'correct' moral and ethical way to proceed, but we're mature, forward thinking adults (well, at least most of us are). the reality of the situation is that children aren't mature, they're not going to think of how this impacts on the teacher's life and they definitely aren't going to be thinking anything along the lines we're discussing now- and that's the problem, she has lost the respect of the children she teaches, so how can she carry on being an effective teacher? you can mask this however you like, it's not an issue of sexism or anything else; i'd expect the exact same reaction if the teacher was a man. you can't teach effectively if the children don't respect you, teacher's with no such history can still have trouble controlling certain classrooms of kids because children are just like that, we'd be fooling ourselves to think otherwise and expect any more from them on issues like this. if the children don't respect the teacher's authority and aren't prepared to listen/learn, then the whole point of the lesson is compromised. and this won't just be a one off, as long as the videos are available online it'll keep happening as long as she's at the school. and so you can understand, from the view of the school's board and the judges who ruled against her, she can no longer work effectively in her position.

it's sad because there's sorta nothing she can do about it now; maybe they should have just let her keep her job and see how long she actually stayed before it got out of hand and she ended up quitting anyway? the real problem here is publicising the whole thing so she has no chance of getting a job teaching anywhere else.

i don't expect everyone to agree with me, but i'm just being honest and realistic. it'd be nice if children behaved like adults, but they don't. however well they've been brought up, they're still children- it's not difficult to understand, just try and accept it for what it is.
 
No I agree, but it is her fault because she knew the risks. "Fell on hard times" lol so she was forced to do gangbangs for money? I guess everyone poverty stricken should go into the porn business. She's playing the victim "oh poor me I got caught doing something that is frowned upon while teaching children whose parents are obviously going to be outraged by my actions" when she only has herself to blame for making a stupid fucking decision without thinking things through.

ala, tell me this. Have you ever done anything stupid in a spur of the moment thing? Have you made any decisions in your life that you still regret now?

IMHO one stupid decision made years ago should not disqualify someone from holding a job. Now that this is in the news, everyone will have her name...nobody will hire her, not even McDonalds. She'll have to go hide out in her parent's basement. Does she deserve that for being in a porn movie?

EDIT: @Logan: I feel sorry for your girlfriend with that attitude. Just because someone had sex with more then one person in their lives, they're suddenly less of a person then you?
 
Okay, I'll bite.

Truthfully once a whore, always a whore. A woman who has been with many men will never be loved / accepted by someone their equal.

On what basis is somebody promiscuous no longer "acceptable"?

A woman could be near perfect for you but if they have been with too many men, she is far less valuble...

Why does this fact (per se) make her less "valuable"? (I dislike the word in this context, because it implies objectification, which is unsurprising given the content of your post).

... and most men would prefer to claim their parter / love someone that not everyone has already had. Investing so much time / love in something that will cum to you or any man so easily anyways isn't really logical. Someone lesser than them would still value them in spite of this because the whore that they could never have now would love someone like them.

This spiel smacks of immaturity, misogyny, and a backward opinion of women and relationships.
 
ala, tell me this. Have you ever done anything stupid in a spur of the moment thing? Have you made any decisions in your life that you still regret now?

IMHO one stupid decision made years ago should not disqualify someone from holding a job. Now that this is in the news, everyone will have her name...nobody will hire her, not even McDonalds. She'll have to go hide out in her parent's basement. Does she deserve that for being in a porn movie?

I've said in another post that I don't agree with her being fired, but she should have had the sense to know that being in porn and becoming a kids teacher would not look good if she gets caught. I have made decisions in my life that I regret, sure, but the difference is that I own up to my mistakes, whereas she plays the victim. I take what I learn from my mistake and move on, hopefully not doomed to repeat myself. Nobody gives me a free pass when I fuck up, why should anyone give her one? Tough shit for her, but as I said, hopefully others in a similar position will learn from her mistake. There are other ways to get money you know, jumping into the porn business is a sad excuse for a paycheck. But hey, maybe she can go back into it now, ride her fame (and a bunch of dudes), make some more movies.
 
My opinion on this is mixed, but I will bring up one point that no one has mention: No one at the school knew she did this, so apparently she left it off her resume. Imo, she knew her past history wouldn't go over well which makes me less incline to side with her.

Edit: I also pretty much agree with what ala is saying.
 
These things really got me:

"We even had kids who were referring to her by her stage name in class, from catcalls in the back," DeLapp said.

After rumors of her performance surfaced, profanity was etched on Halas' classroom window, a teacher testified.

Were these kids punished? Because last I checked, none of those things are her making the environment uncomfortable. These kids are actually sexually harassing their teacher, though we just find that so ridiculous to believe because they're just kids! It's her and her sexual job that caused this mess! Except that..

In Bethel School District No. 403 v. Fraser (1986) the courts ruled that schools have the power to discipline students if they use "obscene, profane language or gestures" which could be viewed as substantially interfering with the educational process, and inconsistent with the "fundamental values of public school education."
Hey, guess what! Students referring to her by her porn name and putting profanity on her classroom window are sexually harassing her. Just because she did something 8 years ago relating to sex doesn't give them a free pass to demonize her. Usually sexual harassment is seen where there's an unequal distribution of power, and obviously she's the adult so she should have "more power" but a group of boys making catcalls and other sexual behavior toward her is still harassment. It's not like she showed her porn videos in class or advertised her history. She didn't do anything to make the environment uncomfortable aside from get a job that paid money so she could survive through college. It's ridiculous that we don't start wondering why something sexual in nature gives kids the right to be assholes to teachers.

District superintendent Jeff Chancer applauded the commission's ruling.

Halas' decision to "engage in pornography was incompatible with her responsibilities as a role model for students and would present an insurmountable, recurring disruption to our schools should she be allowed to remain as a teacher," Chancer said in a statement.
Is Halas really a bad role model? A woman who came through tough times (and had to make tough decisions that she obviously doesn't glamorize) and was able to make something of herself and become a teacher? What a bitch, right?

Not to mention, if the other teachers had just let whatever was going around about Halas being a former porn star die, this wouldn't have gotten to be such an issue. Kids look for anything to make enough noise about so they don't have to learn. If the teachers didn't condone this behavior by LOOKING UP VIDEOS OF HER ON SCHOOL COMPUTERS, it would have lost traction. Once kids had the teachers hooked, they knew it would create buzz. Middle schoolers are manipulative and the teachers got played by them. This whole scenario is so reprehensible on the school's side, it's a wonder that the teaching staff wasn't brought up with charges.
 
@Solace
As middle schoolers, I doubt they understand the severity and emotional impact that their actions would have. They were probably aware it was rude, but not something as serious as sexual harassment. I wouldn't be inclined to believe that a majority of a middle school boys would have developed the maturity and insight to see what they are doing transcends beyond the level of mere teasing and disrespect.

Unfortunately, even if she was allowed to teach, the media attention gathered from the situation already would mean that the information could easily resurface and, therefore, disrupt a middle school classroom. She would have to work at an elementary school or a college level. Too many middle schoolers and probably even high schoolers, in addition to teachers, would make both the classroom environment and her professional workplace unpleasant. It is saddening to see a story like this.
 
@Solace
As middle schoolers, I doubt they understand the severity and emotional impact that their actions would have. They were probably aware it was rude, but not something as serious as sexual harassment. I wouldn't be inclined to believe that a majority of a middle school boys would have developed the maturity and insight to see what they are doing transcends beyond the level of mere teasing and disrespect.

Right, but when do we start to teach that emotional empathy? Should we wait until it's already ingrained into them that they can get away with this kind of thing?
 
oh my god a teacher had sex what do we do i can't focus on schoolwork all i can think about is boning the teacher help me
 
Unfortunately, I have to agree with the school board's decision here. If we lived in a perfect world, her past as a porn star wouldn't affect her ability to teach, but the fact of the matter is that's not true. Having suffered through too many classrooms where the teacher can't control the students I can say it is HELL and even though the teachers did nothing wrong in those scenarios, teaching was sure as hell not the right job for them!
 
What if it was something like a home sex video that was released by an angry ex, should that be just enough to make it too difficult for students to be taught by her as opposed to a naked photo of her? Not to badger you, but how exactly is this line drawn when considering the immaturity of students or where society deems that she has done things that make it too inappropriate for her to teach?

Although honestly it probably would come down to a case by case decision with how much grief the school would be willing to deal with and how well the teacher would still be able to teach, based on their own abilities vs the complications..

idk its really up to the school to determine when keeping a teacher is more problematic than firing a teacher

obviously if there were complaints then the line is "when the complaints become unbearable when put into view of her teaching skills and the necessary effort to hire a new teacher" - im sure they can find teachers that are JUST as good as her that wouldnt have such a compromising past.

if she does a worse job than other teachers because students will not give her respect, then she should be fired. it easy to say "blame the students", but if a teacher's job is to teach students then that is the metric she should be scored on, not some arbitrary metric like "she's a nice person who might be a really good teacher if people could pay attention to if she didnt do porn in the past and besides its not really her fault". even if itd be nice to keep her in a utopian world where we should provide for everybody regardless, the school is simply being pragmatic.

o wow pwnemon ninjaed me
 
btw-- I disagree completely with ala that being a porn actress was a "mistake" as in an ethical mistake--there is nothing wrong with porn.

Now, if I were her friend and we were speaking about pragmatic career planning decisions-- yeah, that wouldn't have been something I'd have advised. Probably not a wise decision. A bad decision with "bad" as in smart/pragmatic, not bad as in ethical.

edit: Whoops, kay, sorry Ala--PC+++


@Solace-- Of course the harassment was improper and mean spirited-- the kids who did it ought to be disciplined.

However, the disciplining of the students is a different issue from the effectiveness of the teacher.

The decision to remove her from the teaching staff shouldn't be in the spirit of "punishing" her; simply acknowledging that she is not capable of effectively fulfilling her duties. I know that you think she should still be seen as a good role model, and she very well should be. However, the kids do not have the emotional maturity to align the teacher's identity as a former porn star, with her role as an educator who deserves their respect. This is why the chanceler used the word "incompatible."


I brought up a construction worker who becomes unable to lift heavy weight, as a similar example. The worker is not at fault-- however, he can no longer fulfill his duty.
 
And chiming in to say that it should never be forgotten / completely forgiven. Truthfully once a whore, always a whore. A woman who has been with many men will never be loved / accepted by someone their equal. A woman could be near perfect for you but if they have been with too many men, she is far less valuble and most men would prefer to claim their parter / love someone that not everyone has already had. Investing so much time / love in something that will cum to you or any man so easily anyways isn't really logical. Someone lesser than them would still value them in spite of this because the whore that they could never have now would love someone like them.

Damn, you are misogynistic to the core.
 
btw-- I disagree completely with ala that being a porn actress was a "mistake" as in an ethical mistake--there is nothing wrong with porn.

Now, if I were her friend and we were speaking about pragmatic career planning decisions-- yeah, that wouldn't have been something I'd have advised. Probably not a wise decision. A bad decision with "bad" as in smart/pragmatic, not bad as in ethical.

I never said nor do I think it is unethical to do porn, it is a pretty dumb decision if she wants to teach children for her career. When I said its a sad excuse for a paycheck I meant that when she's crying over how she's desperate for money and pretending as if she didn't have a choice, there are plenty of viable options that don't include getting railed by a bunch of dudes. I don't give a fuck ethically, so we are actually in agreement lol.

edit: No worries dude
 
So she can't teach because 12 year old boys are immature. They use the term "inability to command authority" as a way to place the blame on her, rather than on the kids for being retarded, or the parents for doing a poor job raising them. So she engaged in a "morally questionable" occupation for 9 months to pay bills because it made her a hell of a lot more money than working at McDonalds. It in absolutely no way, shape or form affects her knowledge or teaching ability. Cases like these frustrate the hell out of me because people are being punished for small reasons whereas the much larger cause of the problem is being completely overlooked. Parents these days increasingly use the "kids will be kids" mentality as an excuse to be lazy and not put work into raising their children. I was a 12 year old boy at one point in my life, and I went through the same hormonal explosions that everyone else does, but my parents actually put in the damn work to teach me discipline, self-control and respect. To make matters worse, parents these days are not working together and cooperating with their children's teachers. Rather, they are adopting this "my child can do no wrong" approach and fight with the teachers every step of the way. The whole system grows more f'ed up by the year, and people like Ms Halas are just casualties of it. Until we get back to a place where Parents and Teachers are on the same team, things will continue this way.

Amen. I'm a school bus driver and it is ridiculous the things patents expect the schools to teach their kids. I see more of it being on a special ed team but regular ed parents are the same way it just comes up less. I seriously sat there while a parent told my supervisor that we needed to teach her son to sit down and wear his seatbelt on the bus. It was our job to teach him how to behave not hers.
 
i think what a lot of people fail to understand is that it's possible for a person to be as impartial to fucking for money as they would be flipping burgers. one is obviously going to pay out better and quicker than the other, and it's only unfortunate that society respects one better than the other because one involves gratuitous, shameful sexual acts, and the other does not.
 
i can't reconcile your argument with the description of those acts as gratuitous and shameful. were you being facetious, or
 
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