The Everything NFL Thread - 2013-2014 Edition

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JackTheGordie said:
Only one week until Peyton shows why he only has one ring and Tom Brady has 3. Can't Wait.
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Why'd that be I wonder? I'm sure it must have something to do with the Patriots being vastly outmatched in some of the worst areas to be outmatched in this upcoming game. The Patriots are going to have to use some Belichickian Dark Voodoo Magic to pull this win out of their ass. It is a long as fuck shot.
 
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JackTheGordie said:
Only one week until Peyton shows why he only has one ring and Tom Brady has 3. Can't Wait.
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Lol, a good example of what to look forward to this week.

People will bring up Brady's record vs Manning in the playoffs when the Patriots elite defense was the main reason for the wins in 2003 and 2004. Brady was very mediocre in all 3 playoff games vs the Colts.

Of course most people who follow football are too ignorant to remember this and will choose to believe in their false narratives.

Also I think Colston's forward pass this weekend was more hilarious than the Butt Fumble.
 
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some hero said:
What the hell. Pete Carroll is probably the most underrated coach in the NFL. In 2011, with one of the worst QBs in the league he went 7-9, 1 more loss than the Cowboys who have a top 5 qb. He also won a playoff game in his first season. The guy has been fantastic his entire seahawk career. As good as Harbaugh at least.
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If I liked coaches based on their abilities as a coach then I would love all of the remaining coaches, especially belichick... I don't like them because of their attitudes and the way they behave. Ex Pete Carroll: pompous, arrogant, selfish. Left USC knowing they would be punished for his callous disregard for the rules (don't believe any of the bullpucky he says about not knowing). He is a spineless snake, but he is obviously a good coach.
 
Mercy said:
Lol, a good example of what to look forward to this week.

People will bring up Brady's record vs Manning in the playoffs when the Patriots elite defense was the main reason for the wins in 2003 and 2004. Brady was very mediocre in all 3 playoff games vs the Colts.

Of course most people who follow football are too ignorant to remember this and will choose to believe in their false narratives.

Also I think Colston's forward pass this weekend was more hilarious than the Butt Fumble.
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Poor Peyton never stood a chance against those great Patriots teams what with being surrounded by absolute nobodies all over the field.

False narratives certainly are already abounding.
 
It's funny to see people acting towards Manning the same way they did towards Elway.
But what's funnier is that the same people love Lombardiless Marino.
 
True Tom brady had a better supporting cast, but it's not like Manning had no offenseive weapons. Wayne and Harrison? Pretty solid 1-2 punch. Granted the pats had a great secondary, with Harrison, Asante Samuel, and Ty Law just to name a few. And the pats have beaten the Broncos past 2 times(45-10 last year, and 34-31 this year), so don't start counting them out yet.
 
Marino started his career with a bounty of good playoff games. He started 27/14 in the playoffs (historically extremely great, would have wrecked every single player as far as TD/INT besides Joe Montana until Kurt Warner showed up and went ham on the world), anyway in his 30s crumbled to 32/24 by the end which paints a drastically different, very confusing light on his career.

I did make one huge, glaring mistake when I tried to make my all time QB rating in that last argument, one that I was reminded of the last couple days. I left out fucking Kurt Warner!!!! With a look to quantity of good results as opposed to the "perfect qb rating", the best QBs in playoff history are like

S tier Montana>Bradshaw>Brady>Warner>Brees>Rodgers
A tier Favre>P. Manning>Young [Better Manning can change that this season, of course]
B tier Elway+Marino>Aikman>Staubach [Marino edge if you prefer best statistical results or completion %, Elway should get the nod if you care about him earning the 1 SB win he really earned and Y/A]

And still, I might be forgetting some 70s or 80s dudes, I am not 100% perfectly studied on the stuff that came before I lived, I threw out anyone I knew sucked though e.g. super suck Joe Namath. Picking the best out of Montana, Bradshaw, Brady, or Warner comes down to what you believe about eras and what you believe is important about playstyle, or even what you believe about their teammates. To put Brees or Rodgers #1, you have to go with the most on paper perfect statistics. & If you want to hype someone from A or B tier over Warner, Brees, or Rodgers then you basically have to care more about outcomes (which are team based) than what statistics really say has happened, which is a whole OTHER argument. It just all piles up, it is a really hard subject to perfectly argue.

Also, the Tom Brady part of this shit is easy as hell to get. He has the 2nd best TD/INT of all time to only Montana. His Y/A is worse than almost everybody else on any of these tiers. He is truly the best master we have seen of not fucking up games, and of continually doing the same good things drive in drive out. The Patriots have made 8 AFC championships in 13 years, mind boggling shit. His drive in drive out consistency is a huge part of things no matter where his talent was when they won Super Bowls (really not matching the hype until the 3rd Super Bowl), they win whatever defense they trot out or whatever offensive style they pick. Of course you have to ask what about the defenses, what about the no wins after the first 3, and how much does BB matter (Madden or BB is the greatest coach of all time, accept no other answer :))
 
Or Tom Coughlin... who has taken some of the worst teams ever to not only championship games(jags) but won 2 sbs(giants). His teams year in and out are some of the least talented in the league yet managed to win it all. 2011 giants: worst OL, worst running game, horrible defensse etc
 
some hero said:
Or Tom Coughlin... who has taken some of the worst teams ever to not only championship games(jags) but won 2 sbs(giants). His teams year in and out are some of the least talented in the league yet managed to win it all. 2011 giants: worst OL, worst running game, horrible defensse etc
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Prof. Almeida said:
You can't be seriously putting Brees ahead of Manning.
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he's going by td/int ratio only and brees' is way better, like 24/6 versus 34/22 for manning. brees has also only played in 11 playoff games versus 21 for manning, and brees would project to smash manning in total playoff yards if brees played those ten more games (brees has 3539 yards, manning has 5909).

So basically Brees statistically crushes most quarterbacks in terms of playoff performance.
 
No problem if anyone's opinion is Walsh>BB, I think Lombardi is insanely overhyped though. What Madden, Walsh, BB have done against modern amount of teams versus what Lombardi did against 15, just not comparable. Landry is nowhere close to Madden/BB level. And I do not even get why you would pick Noll, just for being there when his team lucked into one of the most loaded rosters of all time? Guys like Shula eat him for breakfast.

Almeida, go look up what Brees did in his Super Bowl run versus Manning (there has literally not been a postseason Manning specifically has not choked away), and then maybe learn to never try to speak so ridiculously definitively over something you have absolutely no fucking knowledge about again.

Byrne, I include Y/A (period) & if comparable era completion % too, Brees beats Manning in BOTH. What is important is taking a full look at absolutely every part of every QB's resume. Everyone in the S tier is actually really hard to contextualize, besides Montana who you can only detract teammates and "west coast offense being ahead of its time", everyone else has a serious flaw even in the S tier (Warner & Rodgers & Brees "only" 1 win/"not enough playoffs", Bradshaw TD/INT, Brady ridiculously poor Y/A, and in Warner's case easily the weirdest regular season career out of any of these guys, but if Rams win 2/2 Super Bowls no one would ever shut up about how great he is).

Also I think Rodgers will outpace Brees, with so much more of his career left to finish. Brees is just ahead for now, and if Rodgers does not win another Super Bowl, without injury being the reason, I will be fucking astonished.
 
Most of the important players on that "loaded roster" were drafted after Noll arrived, and he was very involved in the drafting process. Is drafting well now considered luck? I do realize that drafting is an inexact science, but there is still a great deal of strategy involved. You also have to actually be able to coach the players after they are drafted, which isn't always easy. Noll managed to keep his team relevant even through the 80s when they were saddled with mediocre talent like Mark Malone and Bubby Brister. You don't win 4 Super Bowls and have many more playoff appearances with pure luck, that's for sure. Shula is a great coach, but I wouldn't say he "eats him for breakfast". I do agree on Lombardi though, I was just interested in seeing your take on it.
 
Chuck Noll was 193-148-1, Don Shula was 328-156-6. 130 extra wins for 8 extra losses, idgi where you see the disconnect. Super Bowl wins are great, with best of all time arguments you always have to contextualize deeper. If Chuck Noll were so great at drafting and not just largely lucky, then his record would be like Shula's, not like what it actually is.
 
Looks like Whisenhunt has a new job as the Titans HC. I dunno...I like the guy, but his situation isn't much improved from when he was the Cardinals HC towards the end; unsettled at QB (unless you really think Locker is the answer, though to be fair Locker still better than the rotating cycle the Cardinals have had since Warner retired), no real running game to lean on since CJ2K hasn't been great since, well, that 2k year, a defense that's trending downwards. And Fitzpatrick isn't going to turn out to be the old QB with a few years of glory left like Warner either. He's gonna have a pretty rough job at any rate.
 
Slightly off topic but I came across this:
http://first-pick.com/

It's a draft simulator game. It kept me up all night last night. Some of the trade proposals are a little ridiculous and you can make some... questionable trades but for the most part it's kind of realistic. Where they have people ranked in the draft is also slightly questionable, but its fun to try and see the best draft class you can get for your favorite team.
If you really are hardcore into it the best way I've found to earn more points is by accepting any trade offer you get that offers you a 1st round pick in another year.
 
Homeslice said:
Slightly off topic but I came across this:
http://first-pick.com/

It's a draft simulator game. It kept me up all night last night. Some of the trade proposals are a little ridiculous and you can make some... questionable trades but for the most part it's kind of realistic. Where they have people ranked in the draft is also slightly questionable, but its fun to try and see the best draft class you can get for your favorite team.
If you really are hardcore into it the best way I've found to earn more points is by accepting any trade offer you get that offers you a 1st round pick in another year.
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you know you could just buy Madden and actually be able to play with the people you draft or you could simulate and see how good your team actually becomes and whatnot right? stuff like this is what makes sports video games actually engrossing to me
 
idk, Locker depends entirely on what you think about his durability...the amount of games played each year is pretty weak, the uptick in performance seems really consistent & solid so far though
 
Oh my god the Lions couldn't even get Ken F*king Whisenhunt to coach these assclowns. Now Detroit's going to be stuck with Jim "I can't coach offense" Caldwell.

Fuck Ken Whisenhunt.
 
I'm still angry that Coughlin gets no respect. He is an all time great coach(better than belicheat at least who had brady and could never win against mediocre coughlin led teams). This year was one of his finest ever. After starting 0-6, with Eli having an al time bad season he still only had 1 more loss than the cowboys who had a top 3qb.
 
DetroitLolcat said:
Oh my god the Lions couldn't even get Ken F*king Whisenhunt to coach these assclowns. Now Detroit's going to be stuck with Jim "I can't coach offense" Caldwell.

Fuck Ken Whisenhunt.
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What do you mean, don't you remember they were 14-2 and almost won the Super Bowl with Caldwell?

...yes that is a joke, in case anyone forgot the subsequent drop to 10-6 when Ryan's Jets beat them and then 2-14 year which clearly showed how Manning pretty much ran everything with the Colts. He's probably better than that Cam Cameron fellow that was the Raven's OC before him though.
 
Homeslice said:
Slightly off topic but I came across this:
http://first-pick.com/

It's a draft simulator game. It kept me up all night last night. Some of the trade proposals are a little ridiculous and you can make some... questionable trades but for the most part it's kind of realistic. Where they have people ranked in the draft is also slightly questionable, but its fun to try and see the best draft class you can get for your favorite team.
If you really are hardcore into it the best way I've found to earn more points is by accepting any trade offer you get that offers you a 1st round pick in another year.
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game's bs

made a ton of unrealistic but super favorable trades that let me stockpile 3 2nd round picks, 2 3rd round picks, and 5 4th round picks while literally filling every hole the Falcons have by drafting a shitload of great prospects... and I get 16th out of 32 with 3645 points. wtf

Byrne said:
you know you could just buy Madden and actually be able to play with the people you draft or you could simulate and see how good your team actually becomes and whatnot right? stuff like this is what makes sports video games actually engrossing to me
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oh but that also requires you to buy NCAA xx to move your prospects up... every year. I just cheat by saving before the draft, seeing what the overall values of the players are after the draft, then checking where they were drafted and drafting only the best guys though :^)
 
CaptKirby said:
Chuck Noll was 193-148-1, Don Shula was 328-156-6. 130 extra wins for 8 extra losses, idgi where you see the disconnect. Super Bowl wins are great, with best of all time arguments you always have to contextualize deeper. If Chuck Noll were so great at drafting and not just largely lucky, then his record would be like Shula's, not like what it actually is.
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I will absolutely agree that Shula is a better coach, but he also had the great fortune of beginning his head coaching career with an already successful team led by a little known QB named Johnny Unitas. When he went to Miami, they also already had a future HoF quarterback in Bob Griese. He really only had to deal with a couple years of mediocrity after Griese left, as they got Dan Marino in the '83 draft, which was really the first time he had been involved in picking his team's franchise QB. Noll, on the other hand, came into a team with almost no talent that he had to build almost from scratch. This means he wasn't able to get as many wins early on as Shula did. Additionally, once Bradshaw's career ended with injury he was stuck with Mark Malone, whose career was impacted by several severe injuries. Noll was still able to get them to the playoffs a few of those years, but he wasn't going to pile on more wins like Shula was with Marino.

I'm not diminishing Shula's accomplishments at all, but I also don't think it's fair to discount Noll so much when you take into consideration what he had to work with for over half his tenure in Pittsburgh.

Interestingly enough, I just learned that Noll was actually a defensive coach under Shula in Baltimore before they both came over to their new teams.
 
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