Other XY OU Viability Ranking Thread (V2) (Last update on post #5189)

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That said, I wouldn't be opposed to Mence being in D or unranked because there are a number of reasons why I would never use Salamence in OU (outclassed, wrecked by Fairies, etc.).

poor gen 3 pseudo-legends
Two words: Iron Tail

But yeah, Salamence is mostly outclassed by Dragonite as a DD sweeper/CB user (it dreams of having ExtremeSpeed) and by Kyurem-B as a mixed attacker. However, it can OHKO Ferrothorn and Bisharp with Fire Blast and can break through Mega Mawile if it has Intimidate, something Dragonite and Kyurem-B can't reliably do. It can also act as an emergency stop to most physical sweepers. Keep Mence where it is for now.
 

Aragorn the King

Literally a duck
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The problem with doing the whole "would I use it" test is that everyone would use different things. Some people would use things that other people would call simply unviable. There should be some line, but rankings are extremely subjective. When looking at a Pokemon like Salamence, you have to wonder what niche it has. I personally see a tiny tiny tiny one; a Dragon Dancer that gets stronger as time goes on. However, the loss of defensive utility when compared to Dragonite and the loss in power and dual STAB when compared to Mega Charizard-X makes it never really worth using. Should we rank it because it has a tiny niche and can do something, or should we not rank it to make sure we don't advocate using it? Vaporeon isn't ranked, for the same reason, in my opinion, Salamence shouldn't be ranked. I'd compare Blissey to Salamence too; both have a tiny niche but are rarely, if ever, seriously worth using. I know the thread kinda exploded the last time Blissey was mentioned; but come on. Its niche is so small that it really shouldn't be thought of as on the same level as Magnezone, who has no competition for its role. It's a very solid Pokemon with solid stats and a solid level of effectiveness; its problem is that its niche isn't that necessary. It's the perfect C rank, in my opinion.

Perhaps you could argue that Blissey's niche of taking less hazard/weather damage as big as Magnezone's niche of trapping Scizor, Skarmory, and Ferrothorn for different offensive Pokemon, but I'd entirely disagree. I agree with someone's proposal earlier that we should possibly change the definitions, and definitely move some Pokemon around to reflect their actual viability. Every Pokemon is usable, but only those with distinct niches in OU should be ranked, again in my opinion. If something has a distinct niche, but it doesn't perform as consistently as desired, or the niche isn't that important, it should be D rank. Then again, there are some Pokemon no one really knows what to do with, like Meloetta, that are actually really fun to use. SubCM and Assault Vest are interesting sets that are unique in OU, and I won't stop using them if it gets unranked. But I'm not sure if something with no defining niche deserves a rank, unless there's a precedent for that.

If we want to continue the "would I use it" test; here's mine. These are the Pokemon I'd never use: Alakazam (non mega), Blastoise, Espeon, Haxorus, Hydreigon, Sharpedo, Smeargle, Zygarde, Blissey, Escavalier, Goodra, Houndoom, Salamence, Tangrowth, Tornadus, Umbreon, Dugtrio, Hawlucha, Kyurem, Mantine, Roserade, Abomasnow, Cloyster, Cofagrigus, Empoleon, Jirachi, Snorlax, and Toxicroak.

That doesn't mean that those all should be removed, as obviously I cannot speak for everyone. But I can say, like in many viability threads, the lower ranks are still inflated.
 
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Zoroark @ Life Orb
Ability: Illusion
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Knock Off
- Sucker Punch
- Flamethrower/Focus Blast
- U-turn/Focus Blast/Extrasensory
I'm actually going to propose Zoroark for C+ rank. Zoroark sits in a pretty good speed tier at 105 speed and is a great mixed attacker. It posses STAB Knock Off and Sucker Punch coming off of 105 Attack and is easily able to free moveslots to hit the tier's physical walls like Skarmory and Ferrothorn. While it sounds outclassed by Bisharp, they play quite differently, as Zoroark is much faster, has a wider movepool, has Illusion and can scout with U-turn, in exchange for the raw power and Defog/Intimidate discouraging from Bisharp. The closest thing to Zoroark in the tier is probably Mega Absol, who can have similar coverage and is faster and stronger on the physical side, but has to Mega Evolve to get that speed and lacks Illusion and U-turn (and that makes all the difference). Illusion is something no other Pokemon has and, if played right, can be very beneficial. Even with Team Preview, Zoroark can easily disguise itself as a lead or a Pokemon capable of carrying similar moves, such as Landorus-I, Mawile, Tornadus, Bisharp, Mew and more. Zoroark's ability to force switches, wallbreak, revenge kill and scout warrant a C+ rank for it in OU.
 

Anty

let's drop
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BLACKLISTED POKEMON
  • Florges
  • Donphan
  • Heliolisk
  • Darmanitan
The problem with this imo, is that the meta changes, so does pokes niches. A while ago Arcanine was on the list and now it is somewhere in C-rank - unless its totally (TOTALLY) outclassed (sylveon>florges) then it shouldnt be back listed (that is the same with victini/entei>darm and raikou/mega mane>helio). I just think Donphan was there to discourage newer players from using it (it doesnt sound bad with rocks + spin and decent physical bulk).

Or you can use any of the Defoggers that exist for.Stall lime Skarmory, who also has Roost and Phazing.
Not every team wants a defoger. In non-stall, it isnt easy constantly getting your hazards up especcially if you are using rocks + spikes or sticky web (im not just talking about suicide leads) and even in these occaisions, exca might not be what you want if your team is bulkier.

Currently all the con-donphan posts have been one liners - if you want to disagree then post goddam evidence or actually try to convince me that it shouldnt be D.
 
This really is just the issue of every viability thread, The C Rank might as well as "a couple of neat pokes, rest are niece or trash".

most of the C-rank are quite frankly not good, and D-rank is so poor, that stuff like darmanitan and heliolisk will be discussed, because it makes it seem like the smallest of niece's can earn a pokemon a ranking (mantine, Toxicroak).

I really feel like the entire idea or C/D rank needs to be revamped.
 
Agent Gibbs , as much effort as you put in your post, it is ultimately just theorymoning. It would be a lot better to show replays of Donphan in action carrying out the niche you described against good opponents to convince people that it should be ranked. If there is a good team with Donphan out there, then sure it should be ranked, but I have yet to see a good team with Donphan on it.
Sure, it's theorymon, but that's how a lot of these lower rank Pokemon are ranked in the first place. For instance, could you find me any real success at upper level play from Meloetta? Empoleon? Escavalier? Toxicroak? Snorlax? Mega Abomasnow? Any of the other super niche Pokemon among these ranks? But that's beside the point.

I'll go ahead and be straightforward. My Donphan post was less of a legitimate nomination and more of a commentary on the state of some of these lower ranks. It's not so much that I want to see Donphan ranked as it is that I've looked at some of the Pokemon in these ranks and thought, "Well, if this thing is ranked there, then you might as well throw Donphan back in D Rank." The way I see it, if you don't want Donphan ranked, then we have two choices: either we analyze the other Pokemon in these ranks and demonstrate how they are viable and successful enough in higher level play to warrant their rank and how that differs from Donphan, or we can clean up some of these ranks and remove or drop certain Pokemon where appropriate. I prefer the latter. I was going to make a more detailed post later regarding some of the changes I personally would like to see, but they've generally been covered well enough by the post TCR made a couple of weeks ago and the one Jukain made earlier today. If we are going to crack down on these ranks and get a bit more strict about what actually makes the list, then I personally have no problem with leaving Donphan unranked.
 
http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/teh-new-meta-fgts.3509165/ Meloetta upper level play success

I come here to look into some less viable Pokemon that are still usable in OU and can be effective, and in between these informative posts, I read "this Pokemon is absolute shit don't use it or you're a noob" posts and I don't want to be influenced to hold such a douche attitude. Before Baton Pass teams were nerfed I was using Crobat that was suddenly deemed unviable without an informative reason. Before BP was nerfed to one Pokemon Vaporeon was deemed unviable even though it was still on BP teams. And then I notice Whimiscott is unranked despite being used by Denissss and that Pokemon on it's own I find to be far from useless. So then, the C and D ranks ought to be revamped because I don't see a clear line between what is viable and unviable.
 
http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/teh-new-meta-fgts.3509165/ Meloetta upper level play success

I come here to look into some less viable Pokemon that are still usable in OU and can be effective, and in between these informative posts, I read "this Pokemon is absolute shit don't use it or you're a noob" posts and I don't want to be influenced to hold such a douche attitude. Before Baton Pass teams were nerfed I was using Crobat that was suddenly deemed unviable without an informative reason. Before BP was nerfed to one Pokemon Vaporeon was deemed unviable even though it was still on BP teams. And then I notice Whimiscott is unranked despite being used by Denissss and that Pokemon on it's own I find to be far from useless. So then, the C and D ranks ought to be revamped because I don't see a clear line between what is viable and unviable.
People think BP is an illegitimate strategy or is too match-up based/gimmicky to be viable. Since all of the mons in your post have to do with BP, they all get thrown out the window.
 
http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/teh-new-meta-fgts.3509165/ Meloetta upper level play success

I come here to look into some less viable Pokemon that are still usable in OU and can be effective, and in between these informative posts, I read "this Pokemon is absolute shit don't use it or you're a noob" posts and I don't want to be influenced to hold such a douche attitude. Before Baton Pass teams were nerfed I was using Crobat that was suddenly deemed unviable without an informative reason. Before BP was nerfed to one Pokemon Vaporeon was deemed unviable even though it was still on BP teams. And then I notice Whimiscott is unranked despite being used by Denissss and that Pokemon on it's own I find to be far from useless. So then, the C and D ranks ought to be revamped because I don't see a clear line between what is viable and unviable.
:o das my team (and also Psychological, Cinco Diablo, and MegaScizor 's but w/e)

Yeah Melo isnt all that bad, kinda underrated imo, but its not a huge threat. Really, when we were building that the sole purpose for it was that it was a fantastic Aegis check, as it beats Crumbler and SubToxic, the latter given a free switch to avoid Toxic. Keep in mind that for that team we were building around Melo. Now, it does have other uses that can be good in battles, like checking things like Mega Venu well, but its dead weight a lot. Its a very niche Aegis check and I think D Rank is fair for it, as someone who has made a decently successful team around it. Furthermore, it only has like one viable set in OU, and thats Sub CM, so its really predictable too. That said, a lot of D Rank doesn't even deserve that imo. Like idek what Snorlax does in OU. Cofagrigus too...

also, w/e they say, building around melo was my idea :]
 
ye I'm gonna revamp lower rankings and make a huge ass post later on. People will be mad, sad, happy, etc. Tough shit tbh, gotta make this neat and obviously I can't speak for the other people who run this, but I am looking for a better system than simply x has a niche, thus it gets D / C.
 
I pretty much agree with what agent Gibbs said earlier in this page. At the lower ranks, the rankings are just so inconsistent and I like how he used Donphan as an example to illustrate that. Donphan is a worse Hippowdon not unlike how Mantine is a worse Gyarados. (Before anyone get at me and say Gyarados and Mantine run different roles, Gyarados outbulks Mantine on both sides simultaneously as long as Mantine runs more than 252/136+ special bulk, which Gyarados still outbulks massively physically).

For a simple comparison,
Gyarados vs Mantine:
Mantine is a better defogger(obviously)
Gyarados is better for literally everything else

Hippowdon vs Donphan
Donphan is the better spinner (obviously), and has Knock Off
Hippowdon is better for everything else

Both are pokemons being horribly outclassed, and yet there are established players singing praises of Mantine, while at the same time calling Donphan shit. It feels completely inconsistent. Donphan and Mantine equally good (or equally shit) and the rankings should reflect that.

mantine and donphan are just examples to illustrate. There are obviously other stuff like blissey and salamence etc
 
Also, the sub ranks in the C department seem a little superfluous tbh. Can we really make enough of a distinction between what's apparently C- and C? We don't have sub ranks in D, so are they of much use for C either? Sub ranks make sense in the A and B sections because they contain pokes that are actually used on a frequent enough basis to realistically compare their performance with others around them and they can subtly fluctuate based on gradual shifts in the meta.

As for how the lower tiers can be refurbished, I'll give an example of a pokemon who I don't think should be ranked at all and is casting a negative light on the C section and the lower rankings as a whole: Mantine. It lacks reliable recovery which is suicide for a defensive defogger, especially a SR weak one since it means you might only be able to get a defog off once before it can't do it again, it's a massive momentum burner due to a quad weakness to Volt Switch and having virtually no offensive presence, it's completely outclassed by the Lati's as a Keldeo counter and as a defogger, to the point where I'd honestly never consider using it on any serious team (hell, even non-serious ones as well). I think that last part is the most important; if it has no realistic high-level use, it just shouldn't be ranked. And by the way, just because somebody has used it in a Tour match doesn't automatically mean it's viable either; players experiment with things and experiments sometimes fail. I would classify Mantine as a failed experiment, it was a cute idea and had some ok properties on paper, but at the end of the day, it sucked and isn't worth using again. I cannot fathom why you would ever want to use this as your defogger when there are so many others out there that are infinitely better.

Now let me compare it to Arcanine to help illustrate my idea of how we might be able to clear these lower ranks up and prevent a possible slippery slope where half of entire pokedex ends up ranked. Arc actually is a pokemon who has merit and one who I would consider using on a serious team if I had a glaring weakness to Mawile, which is a current S rank threat and one which every team needs to be prepared for and which has extremely few counters. Basically, it wouldn't be an early pick for a team member, but one which can supplement a team during the end stages of production. Arc's main job is to do just that, but what makes it worth being ranked is that it isn't completely dead weight if they don't have a Mawile, it can still act as a relatively decent general purpose physical wall thanks to intimidate, can spread burns with Wisp, has E-Speed to pick off things if shit hits the fan, can counter a number of other specific things like Mega Scizor, Conk and so on, and has options like Roar to prevent it from being set-up bait for other top tier threats like Charizard-X.

As you can see, there is a clear difference between the two of these pokemon despite the fact that they have been given the same rank. One is hopelessly outclassed, underpowered and isn't worth giving up a slot for in the slightest, while the other has an actual legitimate niche in being one of the extremely few pokes that can perform a certain useful task while being relatively ok outside of it as well. One has competitive merit, the other does not.

So with that said, we definitely need to get some better terminology going in the OP as what classifies mons into their respective ranks, ideally with a focus on more objectivity and rigor, because frankly, basically relying solely on words like "amazing", "fantastic" and "great" doesn't really help much.
 
Can we move Rotom-H to B-? I know it's outclassed but he has some things over the washing machine:
It's one of the few mons that resist BoltBeam(the others being Magnezone and Thick Fat Mamoswine)
It can stay in on M-venu and burn it effectively crippling it
It threatens M-Mawile more, resists both STAB and can OHKO with Overheat, if you predict sucker punch you can WoW and cripple it too
Resists both U-Turn and Volt Switch, while having Volt Switch of his own to abuse
Obviously he has cons like having weakness to SR, but he carries his own weight.
 
Can we move Rotom-H to B-? I know it's outclassed but he has some things over the washing machine:
It's one of the few mons that resist BoltBeam(the others being Magnezone and Thick Fat Mamoswine)
It can stay in on M-venu and burn it effectively crippling it
It threatens M-Mawile more, resists both STAB and can OHKO with Overheat, if you predict sucker punch you can WoW and cripple it too
Resists both U-Turn and Volt Switch, while having Volt Switch of his own to abuse
Obviously he has cons like having weakness to SR, but he carries his own weight.
The bolded statement itself answers your question. To quote the current C rank definition, "Pokemon from this rank tend to face a lot of competition with the more commonly used Pokemon." The fact that it is mostly outclassed means that it fits this perfectly. This may change if the rank definitions get updated, but right now, it belongs in the C ranks.
 
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Rotom-H isn't outclassed by Rotom-W at all. Rotom-H is better against threats like Ferrothorn, Mega Scizor, Talonflame, Mega Manectric, and Mega Mawile thanks to the useful resistances provided by its Fire type. Rotom-H can also take on many of the threats which Rotom-W can. Really, the only reason why Rotom-W sees much more use than Rotom-H is the SR weakness for Rotom-H. Other than that, they are pretty much equal. So I think B- would be good for Rotom-H.
 
Really, the only reason why Rotom-W sees much more use than Rotom-H is the SR weakness for Rotom-H. Other than that, they are pretty much equal.
This isn't true. Rotom-H suffers from having a far more inconsistent STAB move then Rotom-W (Overheat) that forces it out everytime after its use, leaving it prone to becoming setup bait. Its typing also gives it a greater number of weaknesses than Rotom-W and Fire / Electric coverage has overall worse coverage than Electric / Water. I think its position in C+ Rank is fine.
 
I'm gonna second jbtc10's move from A to A+ from page 166 based on the Will-o-Wisp set and the standard wallbreaking set. I've been using this set, which has more speed creep to get Landorus-T, Excadrill, Kyurem-B, Dragonite, Lucario, Breloom and others:
Charizard @ Charizardite Y
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 248 HP / 40 Def / 220 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Will-O-Wisp
- Flamethrower/Fire Blast
- Solar Beam
- Roost
This Will-o-Wisp set can easily bluff a bulky Mega Charizard X set and surprise checks and counters to that set with a powerful Flamethrower/Fire Blast/Solarbeam. Mega Charizard Y does a surprisingly good job at crippling physical attackers while maintaining enough power thanks to 159 Sp. Attack and Drought. Focus Blast doesn't seem too useful on the set just to get Heatran since Earthquake isn't a hard move to come by for its teammates and Mega Charizard Y usually isn't going to be staying in for very long since it wants to keep its sun.
Standard Roost + 3 Attacks Charizard Y is still a great wallbreaker, outclassed only by Landorus-I in this role thanks to Landorus' ability to carry Knock Off mostly and the fact that it doesn't have to rely on weather for 5 turns. Still, the majority of the tier is 2HKOed by Fire Blast and the fear of getting swept by Charizard X makes it easy to force switches. With both sets in mind, Mega Charizard Y is worthy of A+ rank.
 
This isn't true. Rotom-H suffers from having a far more inconsistent STAB move then Rotom-W (Overheat) that forces it out everytime after its use, leaving it prone to becoming setup bait. Its typing also gives it a greater number of weaknesses than Rotom-W and Fire / Electric coverage has overall worse coverage than Electric / Water. I think its position in C+ Rank is fine.
Inconsistent is in the eye the beholder. Yes, the special attack drop from Overheat sucks, but WoW is still usable and Volt Switch at least keeps the momentum. It can be argued that "Hydro Miss" is more inconsistent than Overheat. Rotom H has more weaknesses, but it also has more resistances than Rotom-W. Fire / Electric coverage is not significantly worse than Water / Electric coverage; they hit different targets. Both Rotom forms have their strengths and weaknesses in comparison to each other. The SR weakness is the main thing which makes Rotom-W "better" than Rotom-H, but that alone is not enough difference to put Rotom-W in A and Rotom-H all the way back in C+ rank.
 
Inconsistent is in the eye the beholder. Yes, the special attack drop from Overheat sucks, but WoW is still usable and Volt Switch at least keeps the momentum. It can be argued that "Hydro Miss" is more inconsistent than Overheat. Rotom H has more weaknesses, but it also has more resistances than Rotom-W. Fire / Electric coverage is not significantly worse than Water / Electric coverage; they hit different targets. Both Rotom forms have their strengths and weaknesses in comparison to each other. The SR weakness is the main thing which makes Rotom-W "better" than Rotom-H, but that alone is not enough difference to put Rotom-W in A and Rotom-H all the way back in C+ rank.
That Stealth Rock weakness is what makes it so easy to wear. Rotom-W is already rather easy to wear down and you are adding more residual damage to the mix with another fact that it switches frequently? Then, you have the fact that Rotom-H has a -2 SpA move which can't threaten the things that can Rotom-W can use nicely against like Heatran, Gliscor, Landorus-I, Mega Charizard X, etc. What common targets does Rotom-H OHKO that Wash forme can't 2HKO with Hydro Pump / cripple with WoW? Then it's set up bait after the Overheat too which may lead to a sweep and with Mega Charizard X being such a dominant force which Rotom-H can't do crap too, this can lead to an open sweep. More weakness with that awful typing as well. It is perfectly fine in C+
 
Rotom-H has a better matchup against some pretty significant threats

Aegislash: Overheat is a lot more powerful than Hydro Pump. Otherwise pretty equal. Rotom-W can break subtoxic without getting weaker or switching which is nice.
Mawile: Resisting Play Rough is a huge gain over Rotom-W
Thundurus: Electric resist comes handy here.
Mega Pinsir: Able to OHKO it from full. But status and Volt Switching out from either Rotom is crippling anyway.
Mega Scizor: Does actual damage, but Rotom-W still scares it off well with Wisp.
Mega Venusaur: Will-O-Wisp really annoys it, and Rotom-H isn't weak to any of Venu's moves so it can come in and fire this off.
Zard Y: Solar Beam resist. Volt Switch is actually pretty weak, so this matchup isn't particularly relevant unless you run T-Wave or are specially defensive.
Ferrothorn: Obvious advantage

Not having an attack that it can fire off multiple times is not as bad as it sounds. Rotom isn't a full tank/wall, it's supposed to come in, throw out one or two attacks or a status move, Volt switch out. The biggest problem I run into is vs sub mawile, but even then Overheat has a chance to KO a 75% Mawile at -2, and Wisp is still as crippling as it always is.
 
That Stealth Rock weakness is what makes it so easy to wear. Rotom-W is already rather easy to wear down and you are adding more residual damage to the mix with another fact that it switches frequently? Then, you have the fact that Rotom-H has a -2 SpA move which can't threaten the things that can Rotom-W can use nicely against like Heatran, Gliscor, Landorus-I, Mega Charizard X, etc. What common targets does Rotom-H OHKO that Wash forme can't 2HKO with Hydro Pump / cripple with WoW? Then it's set up bait after the Overheat too which may lead to a sweep and with Mega Charizard X being such a dominant force which Rotom-H can't do crap too, this can lead to an open sweep. More weakness with that awful typing as well. It is perfectly fine in C+
Zebstrika explained some advantages for Rotom-H, so I won't recap them here. SR is a pain in the ass, but we don't penalize Talonflame and Zard-Y too heavily for their weaknesses. Defog and Rapid Spin do exist. Rotom-W can be Roost stalled by bulky DD Zard-X, so its best option is to Volt Switch out too. Rotom-H is not as good as Rotom-W, but not almost two letters below Rotom-W.

Edit: Rotom-H also resists both U-turn and Volt Switch which is very useful against Volt Turn teams. Rotom-W resists neither move.
 
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One of the biggest advantages Rotom-H has over Rotom-W is the liberty to run Thunder Wave over WoW. While WoW is certain disruptive, the only notable target of WoW that dgaf about Thunder Wave is Garchomp. The fact that Rotom-H can take out Bisharp, Mawile, Scizor, etc with Overheat means it does not have have to actually run WoW. Thunder Wave, with its good sets of resists, actually allows Rotom-H to reliably switch into both Charizard formes safely so long as SR isn't on the field, with a set of 248/32/228 Calm, with Volt Switch|Overheat|TWave|Pain Split/Rest and crippling both for the remainder of the game. The fact that it can switch into based Charizard without having to predict is already an impressive feat on its own. Rotom-H is also possibly the best switch in to Mega Gardevoir, for it doesn't even have to fear a WoW on the switch. Resisting everything that MegaMan has is crazy good for balance teams. Resisting both parts of VoltTurn actually makes it harder to wear down than Rotom-W so long as rocks are not up. All these traits combines makes it worth using over Rotom-W. Rotom-W is still more versatile with roles, which is why it is A. But Rotom-H does have a lot of invaluable qualities to be worth using over Rotom-W.

"If you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid"
 

Karxrida

Death to the Undying Savage
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One of the biggest advantages Rotom-H has over Rotom-W is the liberty to run Thunder Wave over WoW. While WoW is certain disruptive, the only notable target of WoW that dgaf about Thunder Wave is Garchomp. The fact that Rotom-H can take out Bisharp, Mawile, Scizor, etc with Overheat means it does not have have to actually run WoW. Thunder Wave, with its good sets of resists, actually allows Rotom-H to reliably switch into both Charizard formes safely so long as SR isn't on the field, with a set of 248/32/228 Calm, with Volt Switch|Overheat|TWave|Pain Split/Rest and crippling both for the remainder of the game. The fact that it can switch into based Charizard without having to predict is already an impressive feat on its own. Rotom-H is also possibly the best switch in to Mega Gardevoir, for it doesn't even have to fear a WoW on the switch. Resisting everything that MegaMan has is crazy good for balance teams. Resisting both parts of VoltTurn actually makes it harder to wear down than Rotom-W so long as rocks are not up. All these traits combines makes it worth using over Rotom-W. Rotom-W is still more versatile with roles, which is why it is A. But Rotom-H does have a lot of invaluable qualities to be worth using over Rotom-W.

"If you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid"
152+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Dragon Claw vs. 248 HP / 32 Def Rotom-H: 162-192 (53.4 - 63.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
152+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Flare Blitz vs. 248 HP / 32 Def Rotom-H: 123-144 (40.5 - 47.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
152+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Outrage vs. 248 HP / 32 Def Rotom-H: 246-289 (81.1 - 95.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+1 152+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Flare Blitz vs. 248 HP / 32 Def Rotom-H: 183-216 (60.3 - 71.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+1 152+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Dragon Claw vs. 248 HP / 32 Def Rotom-H: 243-286 (80.1 - 94.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+1 152+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Outrage vs. 248 HP / 32 Def Rotom-H: 366-432 (120.7 - 142.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO


Also, what makes it better than Rotom-W at running T-Wave, exactly?
 
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