Serious US Election Thread (read post #2014)

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beating a hispanic man is terrible. You shouldn't physically attack anyone unless they're physically attacking you first. If that man bragged to me about how he beat a hispanic man, as a trump supporter myself, I'd tell him to get the fuck out and that he wasn't welcome.

was that hard? no shifting blame, no saying "you do it too," no victim blaming. violence is bad and anyone who uses violence as a political tool is not welcome in my movement. i don't have the power to do anything about a man 1000 miles away but if someone told me they committed violence in the name of trump i would tell them off and stop associating with them. violence is not acceptable.

Good. I'm glad to hear that from you. That makes me happy. The candidate himself is still spewing bigotry and encouraging racism to a substantial degree, though.

And don't get me wrong - Clinton's foreign policy is pretty abhorrent. But it's an easy choice here.

EDIT: The behavior of anti-Trump supporters is, however, a common tactic when Trump's racism is pointed out. As seen in this exact thread.
 
beating a hispanic man is terrible. You shouldn't physically attack anyone unless they're physically attacking you first. If that man bragged to me about how he beat a hispanic man, as a trump supporter myself, I'd tell him to get the fuck out and that he wasn't welcome.

was that hard? no shifting blame, no saying "you do it too," no victim blaming. violence is bad and anyone who uses violence as a political tool is not welcome in my movement. i don't have the power to do anything about a man 1000 miles away but if someone told me they committed violence in the name of trump i would tell them off and stop associating with them. violence is not acceptable.

Basically.

I sure wish more Bernie/Hilldawg people here would take the same stance as this instead of blaming Trump for it.

EDIT: And hey! Thanks for calling me a racist despite not saying anything racist.
 
von the don my man pls remove the "srs" tag from this thread

outlaw, u do notice the ppl in the videos u link tend to be minorities right? so it's not hard to assume given that you a) support an openly racist candidate and b) "defend" him by showing minorities doing bad things. it's almost like ur first and only defense to "trump is racist" is to say "well he's right given all these mexicans and black ppl doing violent things". ur going to try to remove race from the equation entirely; you would be equally outraged if a fukin lily-white old guy punched someone in the face, right? oh wait, trump supporters do that, as SE and I have shown to u multiple times. somehow u dont care though - the left candidates supporters do it "more" according to ur corner of the echo chamber, a totally fair and reasoned quantitative analysis that conveniently ignores the fact Trump is endorsed by the actual ku klux klan, who have done more than hit their enemies with lunch boxes. Trump, after careful thought and political manouvering, disavowed the kkk though, so it's cool, just as Bernie and Hillary arent out there fucking organizing hits on trump supporters (read: they've condemned violent attacks). Trump, however, has encouraged - and received - violent responses from his supporters towards protesters. Imma break it down for you in chart form

"Left" candidates:
- Have violent supporters they disavow who have committed violent acts against the other candidate's supporters
- have violent supporters who tend to be black / latino.

Trump:
- Has violent extremist groups he disavows who have supported him
- has violent supporters who he encourages to send protesters "out of here on stretchers" because he will "pay their legal bills", and who listen and oblige
- has violent supporters who tend to be white
- Has an openly racist message as the central thesis of his campaign for U.S president

if ur main focus has shifted from video games to fringe-supporter campaign violence, ur looking to be on the wrong side. Bernie and Hillary nearly unequivocally disavow such acts (sometimes defending the motivation behind them) while trump openly encourages them. the main difference, of course, is one of race. but u have black friends and a black smogon avi and didnt say (BAN ME PLEASE), so im wrong, ay dude? i hope u have one thumb up ur ass and one on ur controller come election day, honestly
 
i think trump supporters are uninformed people or people who only connect to trump in an extremely superficial manner without understanding or accepting any of the myriad of potential problems he would create if elected to office

edit: Or people who willfully ignore these problems in favor of issues that I personally think are shitty and minor in comparison (oh no pc culture buzzword <- pc culture should not even be a term. fucking hate when ppl say pc culture.)
 
Wait.

Why the fuck does anyone CARE about faceless 'supporters'? The hell knows Trump or Clinton or any candidate isn't planting their own people to insight violence against themselves to gain media attention? It isn't like they wouldn't get the concept and tbh there's way more violence than you should really expect in short spans of time this election. ESPECIALLY when the RNC and DNC haven't even started yet, which is when things generally get ugly.

In my opinion, there is a lot of protests that are incited into riots probably purposefully by the candidate they're rioting against. Specifically because it would be sooo easy to incite violence in a mass like that and it's easy publicity to slander other candidates with. Who the fuck cares, this isn't anyone's spoken policy. If anything, Trump has encouraged this sort of action with his words already. Does that justify the violence? No. But what the hell does he think the result of telling his supporters to sock someone who tries to protest a rally?
 
Hi can we please not argue about whose supporters are bigger dingdongs/asshats/cuntflaps/etc?

There are immense idiots both on the far left and the far right.

Meanwhile, if you support a candidate because of who else supports a candidate (or supports their opponent), you have pathetically low conviction in your own beliefs.

The argument of "I won't support Trump because white supremacists also support him" or "I won't support Hillary because radical feminists also support her" is just so unbelievably stupid. Make up your own goddamn mind for yourself.
 
von the don my man pls remove the "srs" tag from this thread

outlaw, u do notice the ppl in the videos u link tend to be minorities right? so it's not hard to assume given that you a) support an openly racist candidate and b) "defend" him by showing minorities doing bad things. it's almost like ur first and only defense to "trump is racist" is to say "well he's right given all these mexicans and black ppl doing violent things". ur going to try to remove race from the equation entirely;

You're the one looking at the complexion of their skin, pal. Not me. All I see are people assaulting another for who they support. I don't care if they're white, black, latino or asian. Ya don't do it.

Go ahead and keep putting words in my mouth though.

you would be equally outraged if a fukin lily-white old guy punched someone in the face, right? oh wait, trump supporters do that, as SE and I have shown to u multiple times.

I already said as much. They shouldn't of done that. The level of violence displayed by the protesters is far beyond that of one guy decking another however. The dude doing the decking is wrong, but the group harassing and sucker punching is more wrong in my eyes. You could say its badong.

somehow u dont care though - the left candidates supporters do it "more" according to ur corner of the echo chamber, a totally fair and reasoned quantitative analysis that conveniently ignores the fact Trump is endorsed by the actual ku klux klan, who have done more than hit their enemies with lunch boxes.

The argument of "I won't support Trump because white supremacists also support him" or "I won't support Hillary because radical feminists also support her" is just so unbelievably stupid. Make up your own goddamn mind for yourself.

Pretty much sums up my thoughts. So what? Would you keep supporting Hillary/Bernie if ISIS threw their support their way? (Hint: You would.)

i hope u have one thumb up ur ass and one on ur controller come election day, honestly

My state is unfortunately not your brand of red. So until election reforms happen, my vote doesn't matter one bit. And I don't know about things up asses, but I think you might have a little sand in your vagina if all you can come up with is "YOU'RE A FUCKING WHITE MALE! YOU'RE DEFINITELY RACIST!" when someone disagrees with you. You want me so desperately to be racist it must really hurt you when I am not one.
 
I'm gonna highlight some types of posts that are not acceptable

if ur main focus has shifted from video games to fringe-supporter campaign violence, ur looking to be on the wrong side. Bernie and Hillary nearly unequivocally disavow such acts (sometimes defending the motivation behind them) while trump openly encourages them. the main difference, of course, is one of race. but u have black friends and a black smogon avi and didnt say (BAN ME PLEASE), so im wrong, ay dude? i hope u have one thumb up ur ass and one on ur controller come election day, honestly

shrug youve started from the conclusion that trump supporters are terrible people and worked backwards. i might respond when i get off of work, but i feel like it may be a waste of breath

hey, outlaw, you're raising all the internet racist red flags

And I don't know about things up asses, but I think you might have a little sand in your vagina if all you can come up with is "YOU'RE A FUCKING WHITE MALE! YOU'RE DEFINITELY RACIST!" when someone disagrees with you.

I realize that given the issues its hard for you to treat each other with respect, because you don't respect each other, but it's that or infractions from here on out.

Shrug, as far we can tell you started all this shit, so knock it off. Outlaw is allowed to have an opinion. It's not going to be the difference between whether Trump gets elected or not.
 
Shrug, as far we can tell you started all this shit, so knock it off. Outlaw is allowed to have an opinion. It's not going to be the difference between whether Trump gets elected or not.

are u absolutely sure
 
This is what I hate. 100%. The normalization of a candidate like Donald Trump.

It's as if people want to believe he's like normal people. Normal people are not racist, bigoted, ignorant liars. Now, I can see WHY people support trump for what he will do, and being republican, yadda yadda yadda. Democrats will be democrats and republicans will be republicans. Go figure.

He's not normal. At all. He caters to the view of an old America, where you didn't need an acceptable SAT, GPA. etc. to succeed. And instead of calmly pointing out that this is an issue, (because inequality, which this inevitably leads to, is an issue), he firmly believes going on bantering about what can only described as cringeworthy bullshit like trade will lead to something productive happening in the world. This is my issue with Donald Trump.

"Oh, but he speaks his mind!"

Sure, he speaks his mind. This is necessarily good how? Today's society is increasingly offended by the smallest things, but Trump goes above and beyond that by saying things like "a temporary ban on Muslims is logical", continually defending this point, and providing little to no evidence this would work. He barely skimps by on evidence, getting by on the public's hopes that he's not what he's portrayed as.

My point is, do you agree with his policies? Go ahead. You do you. PLEASE, FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, DO NOT TREAT HIM LIKE A NORMAL CANDIDATE. Normal candidates don't mock people with disabilities, order people asking questions out of rallies when they can't answer said questions, and make 10 racist comments a day.
 
Good post, but what?

I mean, I don't want to make assumptions here, but I feel like the America he wants is simply not achievable. To be honest, he gives me a vibe of white supremacy, although i know he isn't one, and I feel that's what people take away from his speeches, especially his supporters. He kind of supports a time when anyone could go up to some factory somewhere, ask for a job, and be accepted, kind of like Detroit during the car boom, but everywhere. And that is just not achievable in this day and age.
 
Trump, and Sanders to an extent, are protective isolationists. They both have different ways of showing this, but both candidates have used a major group as a focal point to why this is necessary. Trump does it with foreigners, claiming they take too many jobs/are threatening to our peace. Sanders does it with the rich and large corporations, stating that they drive unfair deals not only for our workers but for workers of other countries. Currently only Clinton is downright open to trade/immigration (as far as we can tell...).

I don't get the vibe of racism from Trump. I think that a lot of his supporters are missing the fine line he walks but he's very "Pro-American". He basically shows love to an 'older tradition of America' in everything he does (Make America Great Again being only one of the slogans that kind of gives you this idea that he's building on). How far back is he going? Well... I think we're talking Eisenhower with Trump for where I think Trump wants America's state of mind. This area of time would basically be where America had some serious single-minded morale and stupid amounts of faith in 'The American Dream'. It also happened to be a period of incredible white dominance, but I'm pretty sure this is irrelevant to his proceeding. The point is, I think this is his goal: A unified American mind, which really relies on trust in the government and a common enemy. He's doing both: He's open and seen as honest, and he's propping up an obvious enemy in ISIS (if not also with Mexico). Remember that Eisenhower was also a really trusted American President: He was a former general, seen as a good religious man and his address to Congress on the Military-Industrial complex is still seen as a fantastic speech that should be heeded. Hell, when Nixon ran for President vs JFK, Eisenhower's few words of support were multiple points at the polls.

Socially, I think he's more towards Lyndon B Johnson as I believe he secretly is interested in Single Payer or Public Option. He's been vocal for single payer before, too. He's one of the few republican candidates openly (or somewhat openly) in support of gay marriage. He was, of course, considered liberal for multiple years and I think that still stands for the most part.

Is it achievable? Actually, yes. Isolationism is ridiculously easy for a president to pull off because one of the few places they're strong is in foreign policy. And for honesty, I think Trump can have his own stupid moments, but I'd probably believe him as fast as I'd believe GWB: I might suspect him to be wrong, but not because he's lying. It isn't Jimmy Carter level of honesty, but I believe he's honest enough in what he believes that people wouldn't question that. And the common enemy isn't something that can be used, it HAS to be solved. This is universal, even outside the USA. ISIS is a big deal and needs to be taken care of. Who knows what he might achieve in policy, but he certainly can achieve this mentality shift.

Now this is where I worry. Trump knows this line between racism and American nationalism. He's toeing it, but he knows how not to overstep. The mentality WILL LEAD to increased racism in America. And unfortunately unless you draw closer to a police state [which requires officers who aren't going to be racist], you're going to have hate crimes. At least until Trump gets to the White House in this case. Probably after, though less so as most people fall off in caring for politics after elections end. I think Obama's presidency has shown a great light on the fact that we haven't solved this issue, especially when we have people who hate him calling him anything from a monkey to a Muslim. I think it gets worse if Trump is there because people will somewhat mirror Trump's personality or use him as justification for their actions.

As an aside: people could use to be offended, to be honest. An entire culture that has been raised to not have their sheltered feelings hurt is just embarrassing. When "safe space" goes from being an area where people can look for help about domestic abuse, rape and suicidal thoughts to some fucking embarrassment of a word that tumblr uses, it is absolutely refreshing to see someone like Trump go out of his way to offend those who need to get some thicker skin. I'd love to rant on how pissed I am about the current state of advocacy. I actually served as an advocate for my college, but focused almost entirely on advocating for the poor and those involved in abusive relationships. You'd go to the advocacy meetings every other week and listen to people bitch about how no one is listening to them or how they're offended by how someone could be homophobic/xenophobic. And then you see programs that do nothing more than yell at you for not conforming to their beliefs and they wonder why people avoid them. Advocacy isn't easy but so many people have done it wrong that it's no wonder words like 'feminists' or even 'transgender', 'Muslim' and 'poor' have gotten negative connotations.
 
Trump, and Sanders to an extent, are protective isolationists. They both have different ways of showing this, but both candidates have used a major group as a focal point to why this is necessary. Trump does it with foreigners, claiming they take too many jobs/are threatening to our peace. Sanders does it with the rich and large corporations, stating that they drive unfair deals not only for our workers but for workers of other countries. Currently only Clinton is downright open to trade/immigration (as far as we can tell...).

I don't get the vibe of racism from Trump. I think that a lot of his supporters are missing the fine line he walks but he's very "Pro-American". He basically shows love to an 'older tradition of America' in everything he does (Make America Great Again being only one of the slogans that kind of gives you this idea that he's building on). How far back is he going? Well... I think we're talking Eisenhower with Trump for where I think Trump wants America's state of mind. This area of time would basically be where America had some serious single-minded morale and stupid amounts of faith in 'The American Dream'. It also happened to be a period of incredible white dominance, but I'm pretty sure this is irrelevant to his proceeding. The point is, I think this is his goal: A unified American mind, which really relies on trust in the government and a common enemy. He's doing both: He's open and seen as honest, and he's propping up an obvious enemy in ISIS (if not also with Mexico). Remember that Eisenhower was also a really trusted American President: He was a former general, seen as a good religious man and his address to Congress on the Military-Industrial complex is still seen as a fantastic speech that should be heeded. Hell, when Nixon ran for President vs JFK, Eisenhower's few words of support were multiple points at the polls.

Socially, I think he's more towards Lyndon B Johnson as I believe he secretly is interested in Single Payer or Public Option. He's been vocal for single payer before, too. He's one of the few republican candidates openly (or somewhat openly) in support of gay marriage. He was, of course, considered liberal for multiple years and I think that still stands for the most part.

Is it achievable? Actually, yes. Isolationism is ridiculously easy for a president to pull off because one of the few places they're strong is in foreign policy. And for honesty, I think Trump can have his own stupid moments, but I'd probably believe him as fast as I'd believe GWB: I might suspect him to be wrong, but not because he's lying. It isn't Jimmy Carter level of honesty, but I believe he's honest enough in what he believes that people wouldn't question that. And the common enemy isn't something that can be used, it HAS to be solved. This is universal, even outside the USA. ISIS is a big deal and needs to be taken care of. Who knows what he might achieve in policy, but he certainly can achieve this mentality shift.

Now this is where I worry. Trump knows this line between racism and American nationalism. He's toeing it, but he knows how not to overstep. The mentality WILL LEAD to increased racism in America. And unfortunately unless you draw closer to a police state [which requires officers who aren't going to be racist], you're going to have hate crimes. At least until Trump gets to the White House in this case. Probably after, though less so as most people fall off in caring for politics after elections end. I think Obama's presidency has shown a great light on the fact that we haven't solved this issue, especially when we have people who hate him calling him anything from a monkey to a Muslim. I think it gets worse if Trump is there because people will somewhat mirror Trump's personality or use him as justification for their actions.

As an aside: people could use to be offended, to be honest. An entire culture that has been raised to not have their sheltered feelings hurt is just embarrassing. When "safe space" goes from being an area where people can look for help about domestic abuse, rape and suicidal thoughts to some fucking embarrassment of a word that tumblr uses, it is absolutely refreshing to see someone like Trump go out of his way to offend those who need to get some thicker skin. I'd love to rant on how pissed I am about the current state of advocacy. I actually served as an advocate for my college, but focused almost entirely on advocating for the poor and those involved in abusive relationships. You'd go to the advocacy meetings every other week and listen to people bitch about how no one is listening to them or how they're offended by how someone could be homophobic/xenophobic. And then you see programs that do nothing more than yell at you for not conforming to their beliefs and they wonder why people avoid them. Advocacy isn't easy but so many people have done it wrong that it's no wonder words like 'feminists' or even 'transgender', 'Muslim' and 'poor' have gotten negative connotations.

The fact that he will change the American mentality, and not in a good way, is not a good thing at all. take the next president. How about them? How are they going to change the American people "back"? Trump might not be exceedingly racist, but he inspires it, and that, in the end, is what really matters.
 
Actually, I don't think a Trump presidency would be half as bad as a Clinton one.

Major two reasons:
  • Corporate media needs a huge reset. Currently, the only way we get stories from Washington is through big news organizations. This is unacceptable because it invites bribery from parties to MSM (CNN) sources or parties actually creating MSM (Fox). I think Trump has the personality to at least neutralize this a bit. Basically, you need a ringmaster in office to reel back the loose animals.
  • I want it absolutely certain Citizens United dies. Clinton won't do it, at least not in her first four years (especially first two) when a President can expect the most support. She needs them for her second run if she gets elected. A decision like that needs a strong, unified house to continue getting anything done afterwards and election laws to be rewritten after the Supreme court overrules the decision. It takes TIME beyond just overturning it.
I think the mentality of racism is something that could even die out with age, too. Less and less people alive lived in a segregated world that MLK jr fought against. As we move further and further away from this, like it or not equality will slowly start to be achieved in mind. Yeah it can be achieved faster but let's not forget that Clinton was willing to be downright racist to try and beat Obama in 08. And ol' Super Predator. Ain't no Saint Rosa Parks running on the democratic ticket.
 
Actually, I don't think a Trump presidency would be half as bad as a Clinton one.

Major two reasons:
  • Corporate media needs a huge reset. Currently, the only way we get stories from Washington is through big news organizations. This is unacceptable because it invites bribery from parties to MSM (CNN) sources or parties actually creating MSM (Fox). I think Trump has the personality to at least neutralize this a bit. Basically, you need a ringmaster in office to reel back the loose animals.
  • I want it absolutely certain Citizens United dies. Clinton won't do it, at least not in her first four years (especially first two) when a President can expect the most support. She needs them for her second run if she gets elected. A decision like that needs a strong, unified house to continue getting anything done afterwards and election laws to be rewritten after the Supreme court overrules the decision. It takes TIME beyond just overturning it.
I think the mentality of racism is something that could even die out with age, too. Less and less people alive lived in a segregated world that MLK jr fought against. As we move further and further away from this, like it or not equality will slowly start to be achieved in mind. Yeah it can be achieved faster but let's not forget that Clinton was willing to be downright racist to try and beat Obama in 08. And ol' Super Predator. Ain't no Saint Rosa Parks running on the democratic ticket.

I mean that Trump changing the American midset could potentially hamper attempts made by following presidents to do something to help the US due to the change in thought.
 
So did GWB crashing the stock market.

So did Bill Clinton lying to the public about his relations. (Explan: Media trust loss of the presidency. If we wanted other examples from Clinton, I'd use NAFTA)

So did Reagan's refusal to talk about aids.

So did LBJ's willingness to go to war in Vietnam.

So did Obama's troop evacuation plan before stabilizing the countries in the middle east.

So did about Carter's controlled price ceiling and sanctioning of gasoline

A great deal of presidents gave issues to their predecessors. Some easier to solve than others.
 
IMO Trump is a clown running for prez. Sanders is way too socialist and Clinton has a bunch of scandals following her. So if i can vote im not going for anyone. Maybe Obama again for third term( but of course two is maximum)
 
IMO Trump is a clown running for prez. Sanders is way too socialist and Clinton has a bunch of scandals following her. So if i can vote im not going for anyone. Maybe Obama again for third term( but of course two is maximum)

Heres-Why-Gary-Johnson-Polling-At-11-Nationally-Is-A-Big-Deal.png


Gary Johnson's been polling nationally on average around 10-11%, & 5% when the Green Party's Jill Stein is included whom was at 3%. In order to be allowed in the televised presidential debates a candidate must be poling in at 15% in five national polls. Gary's recently had three big donations to his campaign in the past few days, one of them by former Nirvana bassist Krist Novoselic. Gary Johnson's also been getting some TV time as of late on CNN, NBC, Fox, CBS.

While he also may not be your guy, it doesn't hurt to look into him, especially with his recent surge of steam that has been picked up.

https://garyjohnson2016.com/issues/
 
beating a hispanic man is terrible. You shouldn't physically attack anyone unless they're physically attacking you first. If that man bragged to me about how he beat a hispanic man, as a trump supporter myself, I'd tell him to get the fuck out and that he wasn't welcome.

was that hard? no shifting blame, no saying "you do it too," no victim blaming. violence is bad and anyone who uses violence as a political tool is not welcome in my movement. i don't have the power to do anything about a man 1000 miles away but if someone told me they committed violence in the name of trump i would tell them off and stop associating with them. violence is not acceptable.

Agreed. And it can get even worse between those who support different candidates. I admit that I've even picked up very strong feelings against Hillary supporters, even coming to think of them as politically uninformed.
I'm not happy that in order to stop Trump from becoming president (which would be a disaster), I'll have to vote for their candidate of choice, so I feel that even though I don't like her, and intensely distrust her, I have little choice but to either vote for her, or say "fuck you" to the establishment, and as my father explains it, vote for Trump, for all intents in purposes.

But all that said, I think the problem with this country is that we are too polarized, rather than uniting, and trying to compromise by solving the issues everyone cares about. I've seen Republicans call Democrats "libtards", and I'm sure that Democrats have also called Republicans names that are just as scathing. And I can't help but wonder if the two parties are probably not only keeping us that way, but also using it to their advantage. I'm worried at times that if this keeps up, emotions are gonna reach a fever pitch, and it's going to turn into fire fights (especially if Trump gets elected).

We should always treat each other with respect, educate one another, and try to reach common ground, even if that means both sides doing what the other doesn't want (addressing climate change for Republicans, and outlawing abortion for example, is a stupid hoax too conservatives, and I strongly believe that abortion shouldn't be outlawed to the point where it infringes on a woman's right and dignity as an individual. Actually, other than doing something about the debt, I can't think of any Republican issue that has any real value). If we start resorting to violence to assert our beliefs, no matter how strongly we hate the other's ideas and candidates they back, then just remember the American Civil War. All it takes is the right series of events. And I don't believe anyone wants that to ever happen again.

Of course, that can be difficult, when there seems to always be some fucktard who throws the first punch. And then people retaliate, and all hell breaks loose.
 
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