Gen VII: Pokemon Sun and Moon Discussion MKII

[IcyMan28]

How would they even be able to make these games more challenging without turning the AI hax on full tilt or just overleveling NPCs and turn these games into one long grindfest?
Can we realistically expect GF to make the AI smart enough to be challenging for anyone who has played one of these games before and knows how not to lose?

As a player you get...

- an opportunity to switch in your best Pokémon for the matchup every time an opposing Pokémon faints. (Unless you turn it off.)
- to use healing items during battles which most NPCs do not get to do and even if they do, only in a very limited and predictable amount.
- to use Revives. Really. Imagine the Champ or another "boss" using Revives during a battle. How is the AI supposed to compete with that shit?
- a full team of six, which has never been as easy to train as in Gen VI and I don't see them nerfing the Exp. Share. How many NPCs actually get a full team of six?
- to give your Pokémon items to hold. Again... how many NPCs get this benefit? A few "bosses" probably will have Z-Crystals. Some random trainers might have Pokémon with berries.
You'll probably have a team full of nuke moves in no time. Just think about how many Megas you had access to in XY by the third badge. Z-Crystals are the new big thing. They'll probably be shoving them down our throats.

I do wish that these games were more challenging and force me to actually think during battles and not just spam my most poweful move until I get a textbox from the NPC I'm facing and some cash, but I have literally zero hope that this will be the case.

The thing is, GF could easily implement most of these things. For example:

-Pokemon switching. Though the AI rarely switches, they can. I first noticed this in HGSS in the trainer house where teams are based off poke walker sync. One of the trainers, who had a full team of legendaries, switched to an advantage pretty regularly. Anecdotal, I know, but possible.

-Item use: I'm not saying every battle would need this but it could be implemented every now and then, excluding the revives. The gym leaders and E4 already do this.

-Fuller teams: This is a pet peeve of mine since like Gen 5. It was particularly egregious in XY where the 8th leader had a mere 3 Pokemon and the E4 had 4 each. By this point, a team of 6 is expected. Hoenn at least did this right.

-Trainer items: This actually used to be a thing back in Emerald, where certain trainers had the type-boosting items on one of their Pokemon. I don't see why random trainers could have berries or other items on their Pokemon, it's just GF being too lazy to apply this.

 

[Deck Knight]

So I'm way late to the party on all of this news. Not that my commentary is important, but lets go:

Silvadi:

Based on the description this will function as 18 different, extremely strong additions to the metagame. I love everything about this concept, and what it will mean for competitive battling. I wonder what other touches they will add to it, such as what Type:Null and its Base Stats will be and if there will be parallels. If it's basically Arceus but with a physical-based Judgement, I wonder if Arceus will also have a way to learn Multi-Attack.

In any case, the wait was worth it. This is one of the coolest concepts yet.

Jarango / Jararanga:

These designs have a great badass factor to them. Jarango reminds me of what Machoke would be if it were Draconic instead of Human-esque. Dragon/Fighting is a great type, and if this has halfway decent Speed (85+) it will be great in hackmons just for Contrary Close Combat / Draco Meteor. The coolest thing about it is that it starts off as something like an ankylosaurus and as it evolves it mixes in more Raptor-like features.

General Trends:

A lot of Dark types have proliferated this Generation, especially with Alolan Formes. I wonder if that is intentional given the generally darker direction of the series. It seems like Dark will go from being one of the rarer types to being one of the more common ones. Dark has 51 Pokemon currently, including Megas. Contrast Psychic which has 90 and Bug which has 72. Steel has fewer at 49, and Ice the fewest at 39.

I am so hyped for this, and will be getting the demo on the 18th with everyone else. So hyped!

 

[Siggu]

By the way, I totally fail to see the whole supposed samurai motif Jangmo-o's evos many say they have. All I see is feathers on the side. Fine, they look like plating, but...

 

[Oddish.]

Lots of cool new stuff. Shoutout to Count Bleck for gathering all the information they could.

Silvadi looks amazing. Was kinda on the fence about what Type: Null's evolution would be, wasn't sure what to expect. This thing looks awesome though. I might actually use it in game. And I think its status as mini Arceus could possibly hint at what is creators *cough*Aether Foundation*cough* were trying to do with it.

Jangmo-o's evos are pretty cool, too. I still think that with its armor-like body, it should be part steel type, but fighting works, too. At least the Bulletproof/Sounproof abilities still make sense.

 

[Chamlly]

Loved Silvadi. Expected more about Jangmo-o, but it's not the end of the world. Waiting for the trailer to see its ingame model. Btw, i searched but didn't find any answer: when Silvadi uses Memory, does it gains a new type and keeps the Normal (eg: uses "ghost memory", Normal/Ghost), or just change for the other type (in this case only ghost)?
Sorry for the bad english. Also, new here. Hi guys.

 

[MrTharne]

All I see is feathers on the side. Fine, they look like plating, but...

It's not feathers, those are scales.

 

[Project_Mars]

So Type:Null gets a physical form of Judgement?
Depending on the BP of the move (hopefully 85+), that in itself is pretty damn good opening for up the possibility of good physical grass/ice/fairy/poison/rock moves that aren't constrained by low accuracy or PP.

Is it confirmed to be physical? If it is then a lot more types could probably use it at 80 base power compared to Special. It would depend on Movepool of course, but i do agree that a Physical variant of Judgement, even with reduced power, would be more useful than if it were Special with reduced power.

 

[viol and bass]

So Type:Null gets a physical form of Judgement?
Depending on the BP of the move (hopefully 85+), that in itself is pretty damn good opening for up the possibility of good physical grass/ice/fairy/poison/rock moves that aren't constrained by low accuracy or PP.

Also ghost. Tangent: could this be the gen where we finally get a decent physical ghost move with some distribution? Phantom force doesn't count. Having a charge turn for a type with an immunity is just a massive downside, and it's not like the BP is high enough to make up for it. Shadow punch is a joke. Especially because we have some physically-based ghosts that would love to have a decent ghost STAB (Golurk, Dusknoir, etc.)

Edit: also wasn't ghost a physical type in gen 3?

 

[Tyranitar.armaldo]

Sudden thought. Might be the wrong place; but whatevs.

With Alolan-Forms; these pokemon bear some genetic difference to their mainland cousins.

E.g. Rattata whisker shape is totally different and in a different place.

Then; what makes these differences not enough for them to be "new" pokemon? If all pokemon are supposed to be related, a-la Mew, then is a small difference not enough to classify them as new species?

 

[HauntedPumpkin]

Also ghost. Tangent: could this be the gen where we finally get a decent physical ghost move with some distribution? Phantom force doesn't count. Having a charge turn for a type with an immunity is just a massive downside, and it's not like the BP is high enough to make up for it. Shadow punch is a joke. Especially because we have some physically-based ghosts that would love to have a decent ghost STAB (Golurk, Dusknoir, etc.)

Edit: also wasn't ghost a physical type in gen 3?

Can we get actual good Ghost moves period? I don't get why Dark has all the cool stuff like Taunt, Pursuit, Sucker Punch, Knock Off etc while all Ghost gets is a new animation for Shadow Ball every Gen.

 

[blasphemy1]

You all know we already have two Poison/Water lines, right? That's the same number as Poison/Dark. Not seeing the issue with the Grimer line getting it instead of Poison/Water.

Sudden thought. Might be the wrong place; but whatevs.

With Alolan-Forms; these pokemon bear some genetic difference to their mainland cousins.

E.g. Rattata whisker shape is totally different and in a different place.

Then; what makes these differences not enough for them to be "new" pokemon? If all pokemon are supposed to be related, a-la Mew, then is a small difference not enough to classify them as new species?

You're getting into species concepts and that's something which is much debated in biology let alone Pokemon. And like I said before, until you test the hypothesis that a genetic change is the explanation for the phenotypic change (whisker shape, what have you) you can't really say if something is a different species. For Pokemon, we'll never be able to test it, so I just go with the flow and/or pretend it's an extreme example of phenotypic plasticity.

 

[TheMantyke]

Regarding difficulty / some journalists didn't get to the first trial in their two hours, keep in mind we've had large gaps in Pokemon games between badges before. Think XY Badge 1 -> Badge 2 or DP Badge 2 -> Badge 3. We could have something like that right when we start the game. It could also just be a matter of these folks in particular wanting to soak in the world and take it slowly. Most of them seem to be gushing over that, at any rate.

As for the complaints about Pokemon's difficulty. Keep in mind that these games are trying to be as accessible as possible and easy enough that someone around the age of a 1st grader can play through the game. I'm around children who play the games fairly often (Pokemon Leagues are fun as hell! Go find yours!) and none of them thought XY or ORAS were too easy. A handful got hung up at some of the less direct bits of Hoenn. Hell, when I was a kid, I couldn't get past the GSC E4 even with a level 61+ Meganium. Much of this stream lining is pretty welcomed for younger players. If you want to make the game harder for yourself, there are an endless array of self imposed challenges to raise the difficulty for you.

With that said, let me be a pretty huge hypocrite for a second: Very happy myself to see the new EXP Share return even if it got a little crazy towards the end. The ideal solution to the late overleveling problem would be to use Gen 5 EXP mechanics to bring up lower level team mates without making higher leveled ones ridiculous. I suppose we can check if we're using normal or new EXP mechanics by looking at the E3 footage and confirm or deny that outright, but I'm not in an environment where I can check that myself.

 

[Pyritie]

How would they even be able to make these games more challenging without turning the AI hax on full tilt or just overleveling NPCs and turn these games into one long grindfest?
Can we realistically expect GF to make the AI smart enough to be challenging for anyone who has played one of these games before and knows how not to lose?

As a player you get...

- an opportunity to switch in your best Pokémon for the matchup every time an opposing Pokémon faints. (Unless you turn it off.)
- to use healing items during battles which most NPCs do not get to do and even if they do, only in a very limited and predictable amount.
- to use Revives. Really. Imagine the Champ or another "boss" using Revives during a battle. How is the AI supposed to compete with that shit?
- a full team of six, which has never been as easy to train as in Gen VI and I don't see them nerfing the Exp. Share. How many NPCs actually get a full team of six?
- to give your Pokémon items to hold. Again... how many NPCs get this benefit? A few "bosses" probably will have Z-Crystals. Some random trainers might have Pokémon with berries.
You'll probably have a team full of nuke moves in no time. Just think about how many Megas you had access to in XY by the third badge. Z-Crystals are the new big thing. They'll probably be shoving them down our throats.

I do wish that these games were more challenging and force me to actually think during battles and not just spam my most powerful move until I get a textbox from the NPC I'm facing and some cash, but I have literally zero hope that this will be the case.

- bigger teams is an easy one. So many trainers only have teams of 1 or 2. Give more things big teams of 4, 5, or even 6.
- better movepools. Generic trainer-owned pokemon still just keep whatever last 4 moves a pokemon can learn. This should be changed so they always keep at least STAB attacks.
- Hold items! Doesn't have to be anything fancy like choice scarf, just give some things sitrus, lum, or type-resist berries.
- Give ace trainers and gym leaders more of a theme or some tactics. Basic stuff like trick room, weather, or whatever. Not only to make them more difficult, but also to teach players about the sort of combinations you can get, and to better prepare them for battle spot and stuff
- remove shit like this:

 

[Ash Borer]

How would they even be able to make these games more challenging without turning the AI hax on full tilt or just overleveling NPCs and turn these games into one long grindfest?
Can we realistically expect GF to make the AI smart enough to be challenging for anyone who has played one of these games before and knows how not to lose?

As a player you get...

- an opportunity to switch in your best Pokémon for the matchup every time an opposing Pokémon faints. (Unless you turn it off.)
- to use healing items during battles which most NPCs do not get to do and even if they do, only in a very limited and predictable amount.
- to use Revives. Really. Imagine the Champ or another "boss" using Revives during a battle. How is the AI supposed to compete with that shit?
- a full team of six, which has never been as easy to train as in Gen VI and I don't see them nerfing the Exp. Share. How many NPCs actually get a full team of six?
- to give your Pokémon items to hold. Again... how many NPCs get this benefit? A few "bosses" probably will have Z-Crystals. Some random trainers might have Pokémon with berries.
You'll probably have a team full of nuke moves in no time. Just think about how many Megas you had access to in XY by the third badge. Z-Crystals are the new big thing. They'll probably be shoving them down our throats.

I do wish that these games were more challenging and force me to actually think during battles and not just spam my most powerful move until I get a textbox from the NPC I'm facing and some cash, but I have literally zero hope that this will be the case.

One could easily have a hard mode where set battling is forced, mid-battle item usage, AI improvements, NPC team improvement, item distribution is limited, and EXP availability are adjusted. In Pokemon games you can just face roll the entire game with literally any Pokemon, and yet we should know considering the entire purpose of this site, that there can be Pokemon battles that are very difficult and can only be won with very calculated moves, team composition and movesets. It should be possible to make a Pokemon game where every boss is actually a serious fight where you have to bring a well rounded team of Pokemon, the right moves, and make the right choices. To do this takes a good amount of balancing work to actually achieve this, the opponents have to be perfectly in tune with the amount of EXP, TMs, available Pokemon, available healing items during a gauntlet of battles, and they have to fight smart but fair.

The problem is that that's work and Game Freak and their investors know they'll make huge amounts of money regardless of having a hard mode or not. A hard mode could go almost completely unnoticed compared to how much work would go into it. Every trainer's pokemon, every route, item locations, prices, all this stuff would be revamped. Pokemon is a business not a passion project so we'll never get to see it. That's why we congregate here and play on a fucking "simulator" instead of playing the actual game with each other. It's pretty hilarious how neglected the competitive and challenging side of the game is, considering how massive the e-sports industry is. Oh well.

 

[Johta]

How would they even be able to make these games more challenging without turning the AI hax on full tilt or just overleveling NPCs and turn these games into one long grindfest?
Can we realistically expect GF to make the AI smart enough to be challenging for anyone who has played one of these games before and knows how not to lose?

Rather easily, to be honest. All the devs have to do is somehow impose flat-like rules to key battles of the main story such as gym battles ( r.i.p ), rival battles, final bosses and etc. That means: no free switching whenever you defeat a pokemon and, more importantly, no recovery items. Basically how we play online, and boom: you got youself a mildly decent challenge.

And no, we can't, because Game Freak can't code to save their lives. Don't get me wrong; they get the job done (mostly), however, the most recent confirmation that there's little to no stereoscopic 3d in Sun and Moon only means that they couldn't adjust to their own home console at all, and that speaks a lot for itself. And no, I'm not buying the "but it's because they're pushing the 3ds to its limits!" excuse when we have stuff like Super Smash Bros for the 3DS being perfectly capable of keeping up 60FPS with the 3D on, whilst still retaining stunning visuals for a handheld. That's just a lazy cop-out.

Having said that, I don't really care how easy the games are since I don't play pokemon for its difficulty or plot. I play pokemon for the worldbuilding aspect of it, which is pokemon's absolutely strongest point. Discovering and exploring a whole new world and learning about its culture—its people—that's what I play pokemon for and as long they don't fuck that up, I'll keep on playing regardless of how easy the game actually is.

 

[Codraroll]

Can we get actual good Ghost moves period? I don't get why Dark has all the cool stuff like Taunt, Pursuit, Sucker Punch, Knock Off etc while all Ghost gets is a new animation for Shadow Ball every Gen.

For several generations now, Game Freak has imposed a sort of "attack concept" for every type. Rock moves have generally high power and low accuracy. Many Fire moves have extremely high power but low PP. Ground moves are powerful with high accuracy, but they're offset in that a lot of 'mons are completely immune to them. Grass moves drain HP. Dark moves are rather weak under normal conditions, but if conditions are just right they get scarily powerful (Critical Hits for some, though others are more mundane such as enforcing Defense drops). Poison moves, well, poison you, while Electric moves paralyse.

The Ghost type's schtick is crippling side effects. Stat drops, lingering passive damage, paralysis, and so forth. They're also all perfectly accurate. Straight up, no-nonsense, high-power moves don't seem to fit that archetype.

Of course, over the generations, it has become harder to uphold these conventions. It seems like we're headed for a future where most types have their own variant of the common moves. I wouldn't be surprised if we get a Ghost-type variant of Fire Blast or a Steel-type Psychic, since when new moves have to be introduced every generation, it becomes more and more tempting to "fill the holes" rather than coming up with new (and increasingly contrived) move concepts.

 

[MrTharne]

That means: no free switching whenever you defeat a pokemon and, more importantly, no recovery items. Basically how we play online, and boom: you got youself a mildly decent challenge.

Nothing is stopping you to play like that. That's not where the problem with Pokemon difficulty lies.
The problem is : enemies rarely switch 'mons and use stupid moves because their 'mons have stupid moves, and this is not an easy thing to do. Well, the stupid moves part is but by adding switching and using the best moves they could easily go over the top and make it (too ?) difficult for the average player.

 

[Pikachu315111]

Type: Null's Evolution: Well, it's face SORTA looks like Arceus... if it was more canine-like... and made of metal... okay, it doesn't look like Arceus. But I was right it was pretty much it with its helmet off (though I had hope it body might have changed a little, maybe to show it has adapted and mastered its various body parts). What I'm more surprised is that the helmet was covering the top of its head and that wasn't a natural horn. I mean it makes sense now seeing what its actual head ornament, though I wasn't expecting it or its face to be robotic.
As for the information given about Type: Null, much what TruthfulCake had said is what I'm wondering. Mainly with how it'll evolve, it needs trust (you know, like the Starters and Rockruff, I have a feeling a major theme of the game is Trust) that it can control its power and until now no one has given it trust since it was too powerful. I don't think we'll be able to catch wild Type: Null, instead we'll probably be given it. I can see two ways this can occur:

• Gladion failing: Sticking with my theory, Gladion will use Type: Null to fight the Ultra Beasts but, due to not trusting it to control its power (thus keeping it in its Type: Null form), it loses and later Gladion realizes that he is unable to unlock the true potential within Type: Null but thinks the player can, giving them Type: Null. But doing this means we won't battle its evo so I'm skeptical of this one though it makes the most sense why we'll be getting Type: Null unevolved.
• Gladion reward: Gladion will successfully evolve Type: Null and use it. The story resolves and Gladion does a heel face turn and either gives a player a Type: Null or the Aether Foundation does. This would at first make more sense storywise concerning Gladion using the evo... but not the player getting a Type: Null. Where would Gladion get a second one (can it breed, and if it does were does the helmet come from?) or why would the Aether Foundation make a second one?

As for how it'll evolve, it could do a combination of certain level + high friendship (which oddly hasn't been done yet). Thus they can set when it should evolve (and since it's likely to be a gift Pokemon you need to have progressed through the game enough for it to listen to you) and also require you to at least have it with you.
So it has an item called "Memory" which is what changes its type. Well sad they aren't using previous existing items, though since it seems like Memory is one item I'm not annoyed. If they make it so that you can set what type the "Memory" will change Type: Null's evo into I think that would work. Though nice bonus is its eyes, mane, and tail will glow in the color of its type (I wonder if that also goes for Normal-type?). Multi Attack is sort of required, like Arceus with Judgement.

Jangmo-o Evolutions: Well, wasn't what I was expecting, though then again neither was Dragon/Fighting-type.
"It looks like a Mesoamerican serpent!"
"It looks like an armored Samurai like in the riddler leak!"
It looks like... Jangmo-o's evolutions. I don't get Mesoamerican serpent. I barely get samurai. It just looks like a bipedal dinosaur with layers of plate hanging off it. The mid stage I have nothing to compare it too, it just is. However for some reason when I look at the final stage I sort of see those dragon puppets they use in Chinese parades. Just me? Just me, alright. Can't really say I like where the evolutions went (was hoping for more of an ankylosaur design... and Dragon/Steel).
Don't want to get into competitive but, yeah, it's looking slow which stinks for the first Dragon/Fighting. Maybe it'll be slow enough it can take advantage of Trick Room but I'm afraid they may make it fall into the "dead zone" of high 60s to low 90s.

I'll get to the other stuff later, but overall I'm actually coming off lukewarm from this CoroCoro. Maybe tomorrow's official news will be more exciting.

 

[Johta]

Nothing is stopping you to play like that. That's not where the problem with Pokemon difficulty lies.
The problem is : enemies rarely switch 'mons and use stupid moves because their 'mons have stupid moves, and this is not an easy thing to do. Well, the stupid moves part is but by adding switching and using the best moves they could easily go over the top and make it (too ?) difficult for the average player.

I'm not saying I can't play like that, but I shouldn't have to impose it onto myself. Even if the AI gets smarter and whatnot, they're still at incredible disavantage when you're allowed to use items such as Revive. It is much easier to limit what the player can do than it is to instruct the AI. But of course, doing both would be ideal.

 

[TruthfulCake]

Is it confirmed that the DexNav feature won't be coming back? It is said that you can't sneak anymore using the Circle Pad, but I am holding onto the hope that it might still function like PokeRadar, in that you can simply walk straight to the rustling grass and encounter hidden Pokemon. But if the Rotom Pokedex turns out to be a mere marketing ploy that has no useful functions, it would be greatly disappointing.

DexNav is, IMO, Gamefreak's crowning achievement when it comes to Pokedex features. It incorporates the habitat feature that was present in Gen V, and is a massive improvement over the boring and nonsensical PokeRadar from Gen IV. It really makes me feel like I am hunting for Pokemon, and I am working for it in a way that makes sense: looking for signs of a particular Pokemon in its environment, observing its special qualities while approaching, etc. None of this "walk 50 steps, hold your gadget over your head and watch grass shake with a Pokemon you absolutely can't see/know". Yes, I detest the PokeRadar; its only redeeming point is the lack of sneaking.

Knowing Gamefreak though, they may just discard this useful feature to make it an ORAS exclusive, or it may take a generation skip before it finds its way back into the main games like some other features. Shame, really.

Speaking of which, if they are replacing DexNav, I wonder how they are going to do it. I mean, we are sitting at about 800 Pokemon now, and surely if they are going to make us obtain them within S/M alone, they have to have a "hidden Pokemon" system, otherwise the encounter table will explode with too many different species in each area. There are three possibilities that make sense, I think:
1. A hidden Pokemon system will return after all, which if it's true should be similar or better than DexNav pretty please.
2. The map is just so large with so many different areas that you can fit in most of the Pokemon so far in the encounter table.
3. There will be exclusive Pokemon obtainable only using the "wild Pokemon visiting your PC Box" feature introduced a while back. Man this would be tedious if we can't control the frequency.

 

[Karxrida]

Is it confirmed that the DexNav feature won't be coming back? It is said that you can't sneak anymore using the Circle Pad, but I am holding onto the hope that it might still function like PokeRadar, in that you can simply walk straight to the rustling grass and encounter hidden Pokemon. But if the Rotom Pokedex turns out to be a mere marketing ploy that has no useful functions, it would be greatly disappointing.

DexNav is, IMO, Gamefreak's crowning achievement when it comes to Pokedex features. It incorporates the habitat feature that was present in Gen V, and is a massive improvement over the boring and nonsensical PokeRadar from Gen IV. It really makes me feel like I am hunting for Pokemon, and I am working for it in a way that makes sense: looking for signs of a particular Pokemon in its environment, observing its special qualities while approaching, etc. None of this "walk 50 steps, hold your gadget over your head and watch grass shake with a Pokemon you absolutely can't see/know". Yes, I detest the PokeRadar; its only redeeming point is the lack of sneaking.

Knowing Gamefreak though, they may just discard this useful feature to make it an ORAS exclusive, or it may take a generation skip before it finds its way back into the main games like some other features. Shame, really.

Speaking of which, if they are replacing DexNav, I wonder how they are going to do it. I mean, we are sitting at about 800 Pokemon now, and surely if they are going to make us obtain them within S/M alone, they have to have a "hidden Pokemon" system, otherwise the encounter table will explode with too many different species in each area. There are three possibilities that make sense, I think:
1. A hidden Pokemon system will return after all, which if it's true should be similar or better than DexNav pretty please.
2. The map is just so large with so many different areas that you can fit in most of the Pokemon so far in the encounter table.
3. There will be exclusive Pokemon obtainable only using the "wild Pokemon visiting your PC Box" feature introduced a while back. Man this would be tedious if we can't control the frequency.

GameXplain said there was stuff about Dextom that they weren't allowed to tell us, so presumably there are going to be some new functions that we haven't seen before.

 

[porneon]

. But if the Rotom Pokedex turns out to be a mere marketing ploy that has no useful functions, it would be greatly disappointing.

Yeah, I miss the DexNav interface showing Abilities, rare moves and uncommon attributes. Too bad it's gone.

But let's not forget about the QR function that shows the exact location of the Pokémon, the Eurogamer crew did not mentioned that. It seems it's just not available from the start. Let's just wait and see wich upgrades the rotom dex can get.

 

[viol and bass]

For several generations now, Game Freak has imposed a sort of "attack concept" for every type. Rock moves have generally high power and low accuracy. Many Fire moves have extremely high power but low PP. Ground moves are powerful with high accuracy, but they're offset in that a lot of 'mons are completely immune to them. Grass moves drain HP. Dark moves are rather weak under normal conditions, but if conditions are just right they get scarily powerful (Critical Hits for some, though others are more mundane such as enforcing Defense drops). Poison moves, well, poison you, while Electric moves paralyse.

The Ghost type's schtick is crippling side effects. Stat drops, lingering passive damage, paralysis, and so forth. They're also all perfectly accurate. Straight up, no-nonsense, high-power moves don't seem to fit that archetype.

Of course, over the generations, it has become harder to uphold these conventions. It seems like we're headed for a future where most types have their own variant of the common moves. I wouldn't be surprised if we get a Ghost-type variant of Fire Blast or a Steel-type Psychic, since when new moves have to be introduced every generation, it becomes more and more tempting to "fill the holes" rather than coming up with new (and increasingly contrived) move concepts.

This is a really solid and interesting analysis! Part of the "consistency" aspect of ghost moves is maybe that they've got only a single resistence and an immunity. So since it's such a solid offensive type, maybe the lack of high-power moves is to avoid brokenness.

 

[Darvin]

Then; what makes these differences not enough for them to be "new" pokemon? If all pokemon are supposed to be related, a-la Mew, then is a small difference not enough to classify them as new species?

As with many things, the pokemon series doesn't use the actual biological definition of species (what pokemon calls an "egg group" is what a biologist would call a "species". You can see how that would get confusing fast) so there's really no point looking too deeply into the matter. A distinct species is what Gamefreak says it is.

 

[TruthfulCake]

GameXplain said there was stuff about Dextom that they weren't allowed to tell us, so presumably there are going to be some new functions that we haven't seen before.

I suppose this means that the feature will be revealed in the next official announcement, but before the demo, since we can probably see what Dextom does in-game in the demo.

BTW, I did not get the ORAS demo, so I'm not sure, but how "complete" was the Pokedex functionality in the demo? Since DexNav was a part of Pokenav Plus, I understand if it didn't make it to the demo, but if Dextom is inherently a Pokedex, can we expect to experience the complete version in the demo?

Yeah, I miss the DexNav interface showing Abilities, rare moves and uncommon attributes. Too bad it's gone.

But let's not forget about the QR function that shows the exact location of the Pokémon, the Eurogamer crew did not mentioned that. It seems it's just not available from the start. Let's just wait and see wich upgrades the rotom dex can get.

I forgot about that. It might or might not be the confidential information in question. Whatever the new feature is, we can use it within 2 hours of gameplay, so it should be something reasonable for early game. Then again, the DexNav was available within the first 20 minutes of playing. Getting slightly optimistic again!