-
Welcome to Smogon! Take a moment to read the Introduction to Smogon for a run-down on everything Smogon, and make sure you take some time to read the global rules.
SPOILERS! Pokemon Sword & Shield Pre-Release SPOILERS - Check Post 2!
- Thread starter DHR-107
- Start date
Bug Buzz users like Vikavolt and Frosmoth and Kommo-O with Clanging Scales should benefit too.
And to add to that, BST increases?
I know the Battle Tower ones are accurate or extremely close to being so but in the case of like Greedent the estimates seem weird to me unless Gamefreak decided this was the gen they'd reward the early game rodent with an extra 50 BST
I think it's a bit unreasonable to expect the leaker to reveal BST changes for old pokemon. We wouldn't even know where to look and even if we checked the right pokemon it's not guaranteed to show anything conclusive due to ivs and evs
I agree that’s why I ended up copying the other guy and using 15 IVs and 60 EVs each. Only 2 of the demo stats matched with the leaked stats, HP and Sp.Atk, which is understandable because those actually didn’t change much. Idk if SwSh has a feature that lets us see numerical EV values for each stat tho.
I know that there’s always some long standing trends such as early rodents having a BST no larger than 425 like you said, but this is the same company that decided to make Mega Rayquaza. I think anything’s possible.
Oh wait can Corviknight be caught in the wild area at lv 60-ish? If so, then it would have almost 0 EV’s. It would literally be impossible for Corvi to have its demo stats. In this case, Smogon’s calculations might actually be spot on
Last edited:
Probably not as crazy as it looks. It has comparable stats to Stoutland who also has a ~500 bst. Think of it less as a trash rodent and more of an early game mammal and it makes a bit more sense. Diggersby and Gumshoos also have high base stats when their abilities are taken into account.
Edit: then again idk why Gamefreak would think a squirrel should be slower than a magma snail so who knows what they're thinking.
I mean you're still taking into account ability Diggersby and Gumshoos both had a BST under 425 and Stoutland wasnt the early game rodent of gen 5, watchog was and he has 420 BST which is about standard.
Corviknight I think was calculated off the battle tower rental, so it's stats are probably exact since those have predictable EVs and perfect IVs
Y'all need to remember that our information comes from the leaker, and thus we have to rely on what he tells us. The Pokémon that have exact stats are from the Battle Tower rentals, which are pretty much on-point, and the rest have been calculated from wild screenshots he's provided. He's explicitly stated that he's caught many Pokémon in the wild fresh for the purposes of stat calculations, and that includes all the Level 60s (because that's the wild encounter level for the wild area in the post-game). Greedent is one of those Pokémon, so the stat estimates should fall within that range. GF breaking patterns isn't exactly new.
I might’ve missed that. Ik the starters, Barraskewda and a few others were rentals so their stats were easily to figure out, but I didn’t see any Corvi rental leaks anywhere. Tho Blitz is probably right about most screenshots being of Pokémon caught in the post game Wild Area so I stand corrected
You could catch Lillipup on route 1. Same concept. Just because it's a rodent doesn't mean they're immediately hard coded to be awful. Point being an early route normal that grows up to have good stats isn't unheard of.
On the topic of mega evolutions and z-crystals in NatDex gen 8 metas:
It is very important to make sure mega evolutions and z-moves work in some form in gen 8. Even if the items are going to be omitted, they can still be selected in formats such as Custom Game. It is worth noting that even the old gen2 items work in the current gen7customgame format. There is no reason now to end this precedent.
In addition, we can deduce the most likely way that these would be implemented thanks to past precedent, in particular Mega Rayquaza. In current gen 7, Mega Rayquaza cannot mega evolve while holding a z-crystal, implying that these mechanics were never intended to mix ("MRay Precedent"). The MRay Precedent explains why one cannot mega evolve while it can take advantage of the "new" z-crystal mechanic. Now if I apply that logic to dynamaxing:
- You can dynamax any pokemon in gen 8.
- Pokemon in regular gen 8 cannot mega evolve or use z-moves. You could also chalk this up to the items being omitted, actual coding notwithstanding (I'm well aware that the mechanics are very likely to be completely absent from SwSh code).
- The MRay Precedent says that mechanics cannot be combined, meaning one must choose betweeen them.
- Thus, in accordance with the MRay Precedent, Pokemon that have the option to use mega evolution or z-moves (or are primals themselves) cannot dynamax.
- My suggestion: In order to ensure dynamax is used identically to gen 8, gen 8 conditions must be met (no option to mega evolve, no option to use z-move, not mega evolved or in primal reversion due to usage of said options) before a given Pokemon can dynamax.
- The above suggestion would enable all mechanics to be included while avoiding any weird potential interactions of dynamaxing and the otherwise-unavailable mechanics AND maintaining proper functions of items in CG-based metas.
It is very easy to say that only the Pokemon should be brought over (a simple nullification of Dexit). However, omitting items has the following side effects, with varying severity:
- All mega evolutions apart from Mega Rayquaza will be unavailable, and an arbitrary decision will need to be made regarding Rayquaza's ability to mega evolve despite there being exactly 0 mega stones available. In addition, I think Mega Evolutions are considered Pokemon by their own right by many people who are advocating for NatDex metas, myself included.
- Important items relating to the use of abilities or moves would be missing:
- Lack of plates prevent use of Multitype, forcing Arceus to be normal type
- Lack of Ultranecrozium Z prevent Necrozma from Ultra Bursting
- Other various signature items of affected Pokemon will be omitted including but not limited to:
- Soul Dew (Lati@s)
- Lustrous Orb (Palkia)
- Adamant Orb (Dialga)
- Signature Z-Crystals (obviously)
- Also, "in-game" implications mean that these Pokemon would be directly unable to be included:
- Kyurem-B
- Kyurem-W
- Necrozma-Dusk-Mane
- Necrozma-Dawn-Wings
- Shaymin-Sky
- Giratina-O (no Grisious Orb)
It should also be noted that in the last "port", all related items were independently made available in the next game. The entire concept of NatDex is what if Dexit hadn't happened. If Dexit hadn't happened, Game Freak would have done the same thing they did when releasing SM: make all previous items available to be obtained in-game. The only reason that they aren't in SwSh is because of Dexit; I don't see why it would make sense for them to not do that again here for any other reason, given existing precedent set in SM.
Obviously if there are items that were cut that cannot be tied directly to Dexit (like if Normal Gem was unobtainable in SwSh), those specific omitted items should not be included.
Thanks for reading my manifesto.
edit: silvally is in SwSh
Last edited:
Force out moves do not work on Dynamax Pokemon if I remember correctly
Not sure for protect though
I'm here trying to figure out exactly how do you throat spray if you are an insect like Volcaronia or the ice moth
That's only a meager 10 USD increase though - which is nothing for a huge brand like Pokemon and the company to either sell it just as is or straight up stomach the costs. Storage is cheap nowadays unlike the era of GBs, and as incompetent as GF they would have to try really really hard to actually screw up and not fit all their stuff in a 32 or 64GB card even if in full HD.
If the idea is to remain competitive in pricing and avoid scaring people off with the price tag then this is doing things backwards.
Ok we're back for another round.
Indeedee
Emotion Pokemon
2'11"
61.7 lbs
Female
They diligently serve people and Pokemon so they can gather feelings of gratitude. The females are particularly good at babysitting.
Emotion Pokemon
2'11"
61.7 lbs
Female
They diligently serve people and Pokemon so they can gather feelings of gratitude. The females are particularly good at babysitting.
Mr. Mime
Dancing Pokemon
4'7"
125.2 lbs
Galarian Form
It can radiate chiliness from the bottoms of its feet. It'll spend the whole day tap-dancing on a frozen floor.
Mr. Rime
Comedian Pokemon
4'11"
128.3 lbs
Its amusing movements make it very popular. It releases its psychic power from the pattern on its belly.
Dancing Pokemon
4'7"
125.2 lbs
Galarian Form
It can radiate chiliness from the bottoms of its feet. It'll spend the whole day tap-dancing on a frozen floor.
Mr. Rime
Comedian Pokemon
4'11"
128.3 lbs
Its amusing movements make it very popular. It releases its psychic power from the pattern on its belly.
A game being $70 compared to $60 is pretty much killing the game preemptively. You’re basically exclaiming to the world that your game is better than other switch games, or at least more valuable. Stomaching the costs makes no sense from a business perspective and would likely push back the deadline to get all of the mons in, double hurting profits. People wouldn’t like this either (whether it be higher cost or the game being delayed) . As for the data compression point, I’m pretty sure it’s just one of those “my random internet opinion holds more weight than this individual with actual game development experience” arguments, but I’m sure they could fit it on a 32/64 gb cart, yeah, but that’s not really the point (see above for why it’s not wise for them to sell it for more)
Ok we're back for another round.
Indeedee
Emotion Pokemon
2'11"
61.7 lbs
Female
They diligently serve people and Pokemon so they can gather feelings of gratitude. The females are particularly good at babysitting.
Mr. Mime
Dancing Pokemon
4'7"
125.2 lbs
Galarian Form
It can radiate chiliness from the bottoms of its feet. It'll spend the whole day tap-dancing on a frozen floor.
Mr. Rime
Comedian Pokemon
4'11"
128.3 lbs
Its amusing movements make it very popular. It releases its psychic power from the pattern on its belly.
Seems a bit weird for an Ice type to have screen cleaner when it would ruin efforts like Aurora Veil
Sinistea
Black Tea Pokemon
4"
.4 lbs
It absorbs the life-force of those who drink it. It waits patiently, but opportunities are fleeting-it tastes so bad that it gets spat out immediately.
Polteageist
Black Tea Pokemon
8"
.9 lbs
When angered, it launches tea from its body at the offender's mouth. The tea causes strong chills if swallowed.
Black Tea Pokemon
4"
.4 lbs
It absorbs the life-force of those who drink it. It waits patiently, but opportunities are fleeting-it tastes so bad that it gets spat out immediately.
Polteageist
Black Tea Pokemon
8"
.9 lbs
When angered, it launches tea from its body at the offender's mouth. The tea causes strong chills if swallowed.
Two things:
1. You don't necessarily need to make a game as expensive as being 10 USD more. For instance, huge titles like this and buying cartridges in massive bulk, you have cheaper prices compared to other smaller companies with indie games buying a handful (comparatively). Not to mention the Pokemon Company is the one deciding the official selling price.
2. A game being 10 dollar cheaper wouldn't make it much competitive if people refused to buy it or have second thoughts (though unlikely since it's Pokémon) due to negative controversies. It makes no good if people have to seriously consider if they are buying or not.
And that it's still theory if these HD models do have to take up so much cartridge space which I have serious doubt about that. Ive handled a few models for mods (which admittedly not Pokemon), and with their incredible details and textures involving moving parts animations they still don't have that much of a model size either. 3DS models all have higher definitions than the console can handle and that didn't balloon up into insane sizes either.
Ponyta
Unique Horn Pokemon
2'7"
52.9 lbs
Galarian Form
This Pokemon will look into your eyes and read the contents of your heart. If it finds evil there, it promptly hides away.
Rapidash
Unique Horn Pokemon
5'7"
176.4 lbs
Galarian Form
Brave and prideful, this Pokemon dashes airily through the forest, its steps aided by the psychic power stored in the fur on its fetlocks.
Unique Horn Pokemon
2'7"
52.9 lbs
Galarian Form
This Pokemon will look into your eyes and read the contents of your heart. If it finds evil there, it promptly hides away.
Rapidash
Unique Horn Pokemon
5'7"
176.4 lbs
Galarian Form
Brave and prideful, this Pokemon dashes airily through the forest, its steps aided by the psychic power stored in the fur on its fetlocks.
Teatime + Ripen let's goooooooo.
Also forcing your opponents to eat their pinch berries when they're at near-max health.
Also forcing your opponents to eat their pinch berries when they're at near-max health.
