Research Scarlet & Violet Battle Mechanics Research

About Wind Rider, Brambleghast ability...

Since Sandstorm is classified as Wind move now, shouldn't the Bramble be immune to Sandstorm damage? And also, instead of suffering damage from it, shouldn't it activate it's ability?

Or is Sandstorm itself a Wind Move, while it's effects aren't?
 
fratelli bc said:
About Wind Rider, Brambleghast ability...

Since Sandstorm is classified as Wind move now, shouldn't the Bramble be immune to Sandstorm damage? And also, instead of suffering damage from it, shouldn't it activate it's ability?

Or is Sandstorm itself a Wind Move, while it's effects aren't?
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I think that refers to the move Sandstorm, rather than the weather condition we call "sandstorm". The effects aren't a move, so I doubt it would activate Brambleghast's ability; it would just be activated by the setting of manual Sandstorm, since that requires the move Sandstorm to be used.
 
Lectrys said:
Chien-Pao's base Attack got dropped from 130 to 120. Similar drops were applied to the rest of the Ruinous mons.
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The full nerfs being:
Ting-Lu lost 5 Def & Sp. Atk
Chien-Pao lost 10 Attack
Wo-Chien lost 5 Attack & Sp. Atk
Chi-Yu lost 10 Sp. Atk

Honestly it reads way more as a "man we need to nerf the 2 attacking ones but we need all 4 of them to have equivalent BST" so the defensive pair basically just got a small tap on the wrist.
 
R_N said:
The full nerfs being:
Ting-Lu lost 5 Def & Sp. Atk
Chien-Pao lost 10 Attack
Wo-Chien lost 5 Attack & Sp. Atk
Chi-Yu lost 10 Sp. Atk

Honestly it reads way more as a "man we need to nerf the 2 attacking ones but we need all 4 of them to have equivalent BST" so the defensive pair basically just got a small tap on the wrist.
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Ting-Lu actually lost 10 HP and 5 Defense, but gained 5 Special Attack.
 
razorsharp3000 said:
https://www.reddit.com/r/stunfisk/comments/za45pe

Can someone explain or verify this? Is there any way in which the stats are calculated differently in this gen?
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I don't think OP hypertrained speed like they thought they did.
 
Does anyone know if the evolution of Bisharp can be triggered by tricking Leader's Crests onto wild Bisharp? I know it's a bit of a roundabout way to do it, but I'm just curious. Also is it the Leaders Crest or the combination of both the Leader's Crest and it being on a Bisharp that matters?
 
UnholyKidd said:
They did post proof of it tho
Proof
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Feels bad for OP. Maybe it's just a visual bug or something.

Went ahead and tested some stuff, some of which seems obvious but went unanswered in the thread.
  • Using the move Sandstorm can't trigger Wind Rider (Bramblin line doesn't get Sandstorm so can't test it on self bar some shenaniganery)
  • Switching in while Tailwind is active does trigger Wind Rider
  • Sheer Force prevents Anger Shell from activating
  • Ice Face does not reactivate in snow
  • Terastallize to Fire stops Burn
  • Terastallize to Fire after Burn does not heal Burn
  • Fire type terastillizing to non-Fire Tera type gets burnt by Flame Orb
  • Burn halves physical Tera Blast damage
 
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R_N said:
Wait what? Has Sheer Force ever interacted with other abilities like this before? That seems extremely strange.
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Sheer Force has some weird interactions; I know it stops the opponent's Red Card, for one. Not an ability, but you get the idea.

Edit: Bulbapedia says Sheer Force also doesn't proc some abilities like Color Change so this isn't new.
 
UnholyKidd said:
They did post proof of it tho
Proof
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hmm, someone pointed out it could be just due to titans not going above their set-IVs, as the OP is using the Great Tusk caught as a titan and not a regular from Area-Zero. We've seen in-game that the stats aren't calculated differently, so it is either a weird bug for that person, or titans, even with being hyper-trained, are set at 30 regardless. I'm betting on the latter.
 
Yeah Sheer Force having a weird interaction with on-hit abilities is a known thing. It doesn't activate Emergency Exit for example. As for the Snow / Ice Face, I imagine the test was specifically if just being out in snow would restore it, but it's just on activation like it was with Hail which makes sense.
 
mattgcn said:
Yeah Sheer Force having a weird interaction with on-hit abilities is a known thing. It doesn't activate Emergency Exit for example. As for the Snow / Ice Face, I imagine the test was specifically if just being out in snow would restore it, but it's just on activation like it was with Hail which makes sense.
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Yeah, that's what I meant regarding Ice Face. The Korone clip could be confusing since it looked like snow started before she attacked.
 
4 hours of tests! With special thanks to Karthik and pyuk for helping.

  • Commander's boosts can be copied by both Opportunist and Mirror Herb.
    • When they do so, they copy in the "standard" order, i.e. Atk->Def-SpA-SpD->Spe.
  • Order Up still gets a boost when failing the move due to Fairy-type, side target of Tatsugiri, attacking an empty partner slot, or vs Protect (not captured here, but you can find it in any VGC video).
    • Order Up does not boost vs Armor Tail (via called Sleep Talk Prankster).
    • Steel Beam, a move with similar timing in the checks done before move success, will still not lose HP if using it into an empty partner slot.
  • Opportunist and Mirror Herb can stack copying the same boost.
  • Opportunist and Mirror Herb copy a single +2 boost from Howl if both opponents receive an Attack boost.
  • A Tatsugiri inside Dondozo's mouth can still take sand damage / recover from Leftovers.
  • If the first hit of Dragon Darts KOs a Dondozo with a Tatsugiri in its mouth, the second one won't attack the Tatsugiri (similar to Dragon Darts vs Follow Me).
  • Commander does not activate at the standard time of other entrance Abilities. Its timing is consistent with White Herb (after Terrain seeds, before Eject Pack).
  • Mirror Herb also does not activate at the same time as entrance Abilities; it activates after White Herb, but before Eject Pack.
  • Costar can copy Focus Energy.
  • When attacking an ally with Toxic Debris, Toxic Spikes are always set up on the opponent's side.
  • Charge will lose its 2x effect if a non-damaging Electric-type move is used (e.g. Thunder Wave).
  • Jet Punch is boosted by Sheer Force (but Jet Punch does not lose its priority).
  • Armor Tail blocks Prankster Perish Song, but not Prankster Haze.
  • Mirror Herb can copy Anger Point, but will only boost the user by the actual boost the opponent received.
    • +0 Anger Point vs +0 Mirror Herb - both end up at +6 Atk.
    • -6 Anger Point vs -6 Mirror Herb - both end up at +6 Atk.
    • +0 Anger Point vs -1 Mirror Herb - Anger Point ends at +6 Atk, Mirror Herb ends at +5 Atk.
  • Rage Fist is not boosted by an ally's Pollen Puff healing HP, or failing to heal HP due to full HP.
  • Transform only copies 1 PP on Revival Blessing (similar to previous games with Sketch)
  • Using Revival Blessing on a fainted "active" ally (currently in an active slot) will cause the Pokemon to immediately be sent out again.
  • Booster Energy has Mega Stone-like behavior on Paradox Pokemon. It cannot be removed or given via Trick, and it cannot be removed via Knock Off (and uses 65 BP).
  • Illusion is leaked badly by Terastallizing. In the [+] info screen, Terastallization is tied to the Pokemon that is in fact Terastallized, not the Pokemon that is being Illusioned.
  • Toxic's sure-hit accuracy depends on its current type. Terastallizing to or away from Poison-type will impact whether or not Toxic is sure-hit accurate.
  • Revival Blessing can boost Last Respects' base power beyond the initial 5 KOs.
  • Last Respects does not appear to have a BP cap. I got to 850 BP on it after 16 KOs with many Revival Blessings.
In addition, using the same logic for Sheer Force as past games and the SV move data dumps, here's a complete list of all Sheer Force-boosted moves: https://pastebin.com/3CUAf7AQ. Notably, Sparkling Aria and Genesis Supernova are no longer on this list.

Mountain Gale
Triple Arrows
Dire Claw
Barb Barrage
Infernal Parade
Wildbolt Storm
Sandsear Storm
Axe Kick
Salt Cure
Mortal Spin
Blazing Torque
Wicked Torque
Noxious Torque
Combat Torque
Magical Torque
Springtide Storm
Bitter Malice
Triple Arrows
Bleakwind Storm
Lumina Crash
Order Up
Jet Punch
Pounce
Chilling Water
Psyshield Bash
Mystical Power
Esper Wing
Torch Song
Aqua Step
Trailblaze
Stone Axe
Ceaseless Edge
 
Perriechu said:
hmm, someone pointed out it could be just due to titans not going above their set-IVs, as the OP is using the Great Tusk caught as a titan and not a regular from Area-Zero. We've seen in-game that the stats aren't calculated differently, so it is either a weird bug for that person, or titans, even with being hyper-trained, are set at 30 regardless. I'm betting on the latter.
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The titan Great Tusk question is easily testable though?
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2022120308154400-1A552196CBAEC7F073BF13D42EA6C787.jpg

I tried and it goes to 300 speed, with HT, Jolly Nature, and 252 Speed EVs.
 
Can Last Respects BP overflow after a certain point? If yes, at what point?

Fragmented said:
Dark typing only prevents Prankster status moves from opposing Pokemon, it still allows Prankster status moves from allies. So yes, they should be revived.
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Thank you, but I asked it aware of that fact.
I was hoping for a quick test since mechanics behave weirdly at times.

12/4 EDIT: Actually, there was another, more important reason. It's currently relevant to many metagames including namely STABmons, AAA, MnM, and BH, where Revival Blessing is seen as seen as potentially meta defining, and Prankster works well with it. I recognize you make a good point, but this one might impact multiple metagames, isn't that "high priority"? (to Jgerg)
 
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