BDSP Battle Tower Discussion & Records

Eisenherz

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RILLIANT DIAMOND & SHINING PEARL

BATTLE TOWER DISCUSSION & RECORDS

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With Generation IV's remakes comes a wave of nostalgia for the good old days for many, and hope that these new titles can spark some favourite childhood memories of getting their ass whipped by the trainers of the Battle Tower. While many were hoping for a full-on Battle Frontier, we instead get a revamped Tower, akin to the original one in DP, but with some twists!

This thread is used to discuss your thoughts, adventures and perils through the new & improved Pokémon rosters.

THINGS TO KEEP IN MIND:
▹ Regular Smogon and Orange Islands forum rules apply.​
▹ Feel free to discuss just about anything about the teams and strategies you use, the opposing Pokémon and movesets you encounter, and your streak successes and failures. Theorymonning is encouraged as well.​
▹ Just looking for a team to get the trainer star or farm BP? Check out the leaderboard, including more sample teams at the bottom!​
▹ Don't cheat. Streaks using hacked Pokémon will not be leaderboard eligible. In the interest of clarity, note that this includes "legal" hacks. We've been consistent on this in all the battle facility threads for previous generations. And I shouldn't even have to mention things like using other software to backup or edit savefiles, enough veterans are around to detect foul play, and you will end up blacklisted.​
▹ If you believe a cheated streak has been submitted and has gotten approved, it is ok to voice concerns and ask questions as long as they're properly justified and the discussion remains respectful, honest and within the rules of this forum. If you're not comfortable raising concerns in public, please use this form (be mindful before submitting, this will be taken seriously).​
▹ This is not a court of law. I reserve the right to reject sufficiently dubious streaks even without absolute proof of cheating.​
▹ Remember that in the end, this is all just for fun. So please try to keep a positive and collegial attitude. It really does make the discussion more pleasant for everyone.​

STREAK SUBMISSION:
Master Class Singles and Doubles streaks must have a minimum of 50 wins to be leaderboard eligible. Ongoing streaks will not be added until they reach 200 wins. Ongoing streaks that haven't been updated with any follow-up post after 6 months will be deemed finished and closed.​
Regular Singles and Doubles streaks must have a minimum of 100 wins to be leaderboard eligible. Ongoing streaks will not be added until they reach 500 wins. Ongoing streaks that haven't been updated with any follow-up post after 6 months will be deemed finished and closed.​
▹ If you'd like to submit a streak to the leaderboard, please make a post detailing your team and strategy, and include a short video that shows you going between your streak number and the Switch system screen, where you should hit the System Update button.
Example:
This helps proves you're not using modified hardware.

RELEVANT INFORMATION:
Here is information that every Battle Tower player benefits from knowing:
▹ The AI not only draws from a collection of pre-made sets, but newly with BDSP's Tower, the trainers also use pre-made teams entirely, including the Pokémon order. The "Resources" section below includes a spreadsheet that allows you to look those up as well as a damage calculator. These tools allow you to plan your turns efficiently and plan the best possible teams; not using them is simply giving yourself a handicap!​
▹ The Doubles format in Master Class only is akin to multi battles; there are always 2 opponents, each with their set 2 Pokémon, controlling their own side of the field. They can only switch to their own backline, and clearing a side makes the battle a 2v1 even if that side has a Pokémon left in the back.​
▹ The AI's Pokémon have been PP maxed; keep it in mind if you plan on PP stalling!​
▹ To the best of our knowledge, going up and down in ranks does not affect the difficulty of Master Class, it simply affects the boss battle at the end of the 7 battles and the prize obtained.​
▹ The AI does not counterteam, nor does it have increased rates of "hax". This is a common misconception, which usually sprouts from unlucky sequences; keep in mind that a lot of the sets the AI uses are designed to rely on luck (evasion, paralysis, OHKO moves), and over the course of many battles, you're bound to get unlucky with these. The idea for a high streak is usually to find ways to build teams that nullify the luck factor as much as possible.​
▹ In Normal mode, the pool of trainers loops around after 49 wins, which means you're back at facing unevolved Pokémon without full EVs for a few rounds before things get more difficult again. This makes the mode overall much easier than Master Class.​

RESOURCES:

 
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Eisenherz

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* = ongoing streak. Last updated July 27th, 2022.

BATTLE TOWER MASTER CLASS SINGLES RECORDS:

#01. Jumpman16 (345) - Smeargle / Clefable / Drapion
#02. ChubbyPuppy (210*) - Garchomp / Suicune / Raikou & more details
#03. GG Unit (203*) - Arbok / Entei / Glalie
#04. TheReflexWonder (150*) - Shuckle / Breloom / Suicune (3rd run - see details in previous runs)
#05. i want a lamp (144) - Garchomp / Azumarill / Raikou & the loss
#06. hmsa2012 (100*) - Cloyster / Scizor / Latios & 100 update
#07. tjptchr9 (94) - Garchomp / Suicune / Raikou
#08. Stormorbiter (69) - Uxie / Blastoise / Dodrio
#09. Burning Justice (66) - Magneton / Dragonite / Clefable

BATTLE TOWER MASTER CLASS DOUBLES RECORDS:

#01. Eisenherz (1045) - Pelipper / Kingdra / Raikou / Scizor, the progress to 504 & the loss
#02. JustinTR (809) - Latios / Kangaskhan / Blaziken / Magnezone & the loss
#03. Pano (303) - Dusknoir / Aron / Snorlax / Hariyama & the loss
#04. Tersx (203*) - Dusknoir / Aron / Hariyama / Tyranitar
#05. Q8altaria (200) - Dusknoir / Aron / Snorlax / Hariyama
#05. Willow Mango (200) - Dusclops / Aron / Machamp / Tyranitar
#07. Legend of Kage (175) - Venusaur / Torkoal / Cresselia / Garchomp & the loss
#08. PerishVGC (170) - Ludicolo / Scizor / Politoed / Latios
#09. Eppie (159) - Dusknoir / Aron / Torkoal / Machamp
#10. DaWoblefet (154) - Dusknoir / Smeargle / Machamp / Tyranitar
#11. Adamant Zoroark (146) - Dusknoir / Smeargle / Tyranitar / Machamp
#12. tacobelljesus (138) - Dusknoir / Aron / Machamp / Tyranitar
#13. alderrye (130) - Pelipper / Ludicolo / Rotom-W / Empoleon
#14. 4BiddeN (123) - Dusknoir / Aron / Snorlax / Hariyama (Q8altaria's team)
#14. WMello (123) - Aron / Dusknoir / Crawdaunt / Weavile
#16. benben591 (119) - Aron / Dusknoir / Machamp / Tyranitar
#17. sb879 (114) - Regigigas / Weezing / Togekiss / Starmie

___________________________________________________________

BATTLE TOWER REGULAR SINGLES RECORDS:

[Empty for now!]

BATTLE TOWER REGULAR DOUBLES RECORDS:

[Empty for now!]

___________________________________________________________

SAMPLE TEAMS:

Since many are just getting started, here is an (arbitrary) list of teams that have been reported to have the most success and aren't listed on the leaderboard:

Singles

Magnezone / Dragonite / Azumarill by EZaboo
Dragonite / Suicune / Scizor by Jinrou
Garchomp / Scizor / Suicune by Theorymon
Garchomp / Suicune / Latios by Q8altaria
Garchomp / Clefable / Heatran by elf_01
Cloyster / Dragonite / Magnezone by TheMantyke
Yanmega / Latios / Scizor by hmsa2012
Garchomp / Heatran / Rotom-W by Tcut
Magnezone / Staraptor / Gardevoir by TheReflexWonder

Doubles

Venusaur / Torkoal / Cresselia / Garchomp by Legend of Kage
Azumarill / Togekiss / Raichu / Garchomp by gback911
Zapdos / Garchomp / Togekiss / Heatran by hassofalisco

 
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Eisenherz

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RE: Streaks under review

Streaks get listed as "under review" when it is concluded that more information is needed before the streak is fit to be listed on the leaderboard. Streaks remain there indefinitely until a conclusion I'm comfortable with has been reached.
  • The ideal way of obtaining enough information about a streak and team to reach a conclusion is by having a third party try out the team and share their experience. A recorded / streamed streak using the team is best, but writing about it also helps. Anyone is free and encouraged to help out with these, but the opinion of people with extensive and proven facility experience is obviously highly valued.
  • Discussing the different matchups the teams has and the claims made on the original streak can also be useful.
  • If discussions of streaks under review derail, mod action will be taken.
  • Once a conclusion for a streak under review is reached, it will be mentioned in my next update post.
 
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Level 51

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HELLO everyone i'm her etoday to talk about my new battle tower streak with streak 2001, the extra 1 is becasue it is a mutiple of seven 7.

the team I used was: garchomp and draogonite and salamence. as you can see this is a strong team with no shared weakness. i used the item choic

i lost to a trainer at batle 2002 beucase they used fissure quicjk calw, and i had no chance. because the dragonite was KO and salamence had ironball.. sucks to lose to hax..
 
HELLO everyone i'm her etoday to talk about my new battle tower streak with streak 2001, the extra 1 is becasue it is a mutiple of seven 7.

the team I used was: garchomp and draogonite and salamence. as you can see this is a strong team with no shared weakness. i used the item choic

i lost to a trainer at batle 2002 beucase they used fissure quicjk calw, and i had no chance. because the dragonite was KO and salamence had ironball.. sucks to lose to hax..
I like the team, very innovative! Congrats on the streak! I can't help but notice that you're a bit weak to Capybara with Mandarin Orange4 though.

252+ SpA Capybara with Mandarin Orange Mud Slap vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Dragonite: (375.9 - 443.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
-1 0- Atk Capybara with Mandarin Orange Gyro Ball vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Iron Ball Salamence: (3042.2 - 3295.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
0- Atk Capybara with Mandarin Orange Present vs. 0- HP / 0 Def Garchomp: (death - unalive) -- it's a one-hit KO!

Granted, every possible team in the game loses to CwMO4, so I can't really blame you there. Your team is masterfully crafted besides this one hole as well. Perhaps one day we'll be free from this unbeatable set.
 

TailGlowVM

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I won't be getting BDSP and so won't be making any streaks, but for those interested, here's a quick look at what we have got for Singles that was successful in the last few gens:
  • Dragonite should be better than in the Tree with less Fairies to block Outrage and a lower power level, though with all those hax items a lead without Substitute doesn't seem too promising.
  • Scizor - though until Home comes out its movepool is very limited, you have Swords Dance, Roost, Bullet Punch and maybe Brick Break works for coverage?
  • Garchomp is pretty much available as usual.
  • No Eviolite for Chansey, but we have Blissey which probably works alright in the same role.
  • Suicune - but I don't think it has Icy Wind at the moment? Correct me if I'm wrong.
  • Gliscor - but no Toxic until Home comes back, so until then you're going to have to be creative.
  • Cloyster has several issues with the changes to the Tower, but is another potential option.
We're missing Megas, Durant, Tapu Fini, Aegislash, and it seems like the majority of crippling strategies have been killed off for one reason or another.

My prediction is that the best team is going to be Dragonite or Garchomp, Scizor, and something like Suicune or Blissey, though maybe the reduced pool will allow some more exploration into previously outclassed Singles Pokemon.
 
I wonder if we're just going to see the old reliable "Twave Flash lead + Acupressure Drapion" cheese. Has anything in the game changed to prevent this?
 

Eisenherz

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I wonder if we're just going to see the old reliable "Twave Flash lead + Acupressure Drapion" cheese. Has anything in the game changed to prevent this?
I think Thunder Wave's 90% accuracy is a big problem for that plan now, but some type of crippler + Sub Acupressure Drapion is probably going to be one of the first things people try, the potential is undeniable.
 

Eisenherz

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EDIT: The race is over, congratulations to Sirya and Q8altaria for winning the race in singles and in doubles respectively!

Announcing
: The Race to 200!
Prize: "First to BDSP 200" Discord role + custom role colour of your choice on the Battle Facilities Discord server for 1 year.
Rules:
- Be the first to get a streak of 200 wins in a row in the BDSP Battle Tower, and post a picture proof along with details of your team.
- Singles and Doubles are separate categories, one winner for each will be accepted!
- For now, the challenge can be done in either Classic or Master Class; after we figure out more details about the modes, there may be a winner for Classic and another for Master. Update: Now that we know Classic resets sets after 49 wins, 200 doesn't seem like much of an achievement in that mode, and thus only Master Class streaks are eligible.
- Good luck! :D
 
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Level 51

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EDIT: This sheet uses 1.0 data. It will be updated once we've processed the 1.1 data satisfactorily.

Hello! I assembled a list of numbered Tower sets for your reference. These sets use the same set numbers as in Eisenherz's BDSP Tower Damage Calculator for consistency.

This sheet technically loses information off the original reference, courtesy of sb879, but I think you'd probably use the damage calculator when it comes to non-Speed stats anyway.

I'm planning to construct a similar Informant tool for the BDSP Tower, contingent on me finding nicely-formatted trainer pools. Let me know if anyone would like any other tools!

edit: added weather ability Pokemon to the speed tiers
 
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Eisenherz

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So I'm working on updating our data, since it's been discovered that 1.1.1 actually added a lot and modified a few things for the Battle Tower, and as I was going through the Ambipom sets, I noticed this really weird EV spread, which is very unconventional in battle facilities:

Ambipom-3 @ Muscle Band
Jolly Nature
Ability: Technician
EVs: 20 HP / 244 Atk / 84 Def / 4 SpD / 156 Spe
- Double Hit
- Thief
- Dual Chop
- Fake Out

That looks like a competitive level 50 spread... on a facility Pokémon. Why?

I dug deeper... the speed stands out as the most deliberate element. Does it speed creep something major? Base 100s maybe?
156 speed EVs allow Ambipom to speed creep max speed Garchomp, by 1 point.

Of course, this can't be a coincidence... now look at these convenient calcs:
244 Atk Muscle Band Technician Ambipom Fake Out vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Garchomp: 51-60 (27.7 - 32.6%)
244 Atk Muscle Band Technician Ambipom Dual Chop (2 hits) vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Garchomp: 136-160 (73.9 - 86.9%)

This is perfectly calculated so Fake Out into Dual Chop always KOs.

And then the rest is dumped in physical bulk...
252 Atk Garchomp Outrage vs. 20 HP / 84 Def Ambipom: 127-151 (83 - 98.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

We have entered a new era of facilities.
 
Managed to unlock Masters Singles without breeding yet. Caught Gible in the underground and used Nursery for egg moves. Suicune and Heatran were SR'd.

Garchomp @ Lum Berry
Jolly, Sand Veil (Rough Skin would be preferred but...)
EVs: 8 HP/250 Atk/252 Speed
IVs: 18-19/30/26-27/X/25-26/31
-Outrage
-Earthquake
-Iron Head
-Swords Dance

Suicune @ Leftovers
Bold, Inner Focus (Pressure would be preferred but...)
EVs: 252 HP/252 Def/4 Speed
IVs: 31/9/29/31/29/31 (Got this in like an hour of SRing WTF?)
-Scald
-Ice Beam
-Calm Mind
-Rest

Heatran @ Choice Scarf (this item change was what let me finally make it to 49 wins)
Modest, Flash Fire
EVs: 4 HP/252 SpAtk/252 Speed
IVs: 27-28/31/28-29/31/31/31 (If only Explosion wasn't nerfed, RIP the attack IV)
-Flamethrower
-Flash Cannon
-Dragon Pulse (Too lazy to get Dark Pulse lmao)
-Earth Power

I would say this team is solid but it's more suited for farming BP fast without having to find good Dittos and the like than for getting a good streak. Would need adjustments for that. Also in the Palmer 2 fight he did a weird switch. He led Heatran so I used SD and then OHKO'd it with EQ. He sent in Regigigas, and then... immediately switched out????????? Even though he has Ice Punch???????????????????? Yeah I know Cresselia has Levitate but I had only used EQ once.

EDIT: Classic streaks can go on infinitely. However, the groups of Pokemon you fight reset so getting to 100 probably isn't too difficult if you have a team that can handle the, like, 5 or so actual threats there.
 
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Level 51

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EDIT: This sheet uses 1.0 data. It will be updated once we've processed the 1.1 data satisfactorily.

Hello! I assembled a list of numbered Tower sets for your reference. These sets use the same set numbers as in Eisenherz's BDSP Tower Damage Calculator for consistency.

This sheet technically loses information off the original reference, courtesy of sb879, but I think you'd probably use the damage calculator when it comes to non-Speed stats anyway.

I'm planning to construct a similar Informant tool for the BDSP Tower, contingent on me finding nicely-formatted trainer pools. Let me know if anyone would like any other tools!

edit: added weather ability Pokemon to the speed tiers
Updated for 1.1 here. Thanks for the data Eisenherz!

A few brief words of explanation: some sets have (Name)s next to them. We hypothesize that these sets will only appear in fights against those trainers. For example, Abomasnow-8 (Candice) only shows up in the Singles Master Class fight against Candice, while Abomasnow-7 (Candice/Maylene) only shows up in the Doubles Master Class fight against Candice and Maylene. Sometimes these sets are the same as non-(Name)d sets, but they've been duplicated for clarity. For example, Abomasnow-7 is the exact same set as Abomasnow-5.

One implication of this hypothesis is that we should be able to narrow down sets better in battles against regular trainers. For example, if you're fighting an Absol and it's not the Doubles Master Class battle against Saturn and Jupiter, it can't have Play Rough. If you encounter a counterexample to this, please let us know!
 
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We have entered a new era of facilities.
Well if you followed the datamine, several of the gym rematches and E4 rematches have sets that really feel taken straight out of smogon or VGC.

There is hope for whatever gen 9 facility to bring stuff like this forward to a new era of pain.

And honestly I'd take optimized competitive PvP sets over evasion spam and full inaccurate move sets any time any day :psysly:
 

Eisenherz

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And honestly I'd take optimized competitive PvP sets over evasion spam and full inaccurate move sets any time any day :psysly:
It seems like you may not have checked the full list of sets... it looks like ILCA thought "why not BOTH" :P Do a quick search for Double Team in the sheet :eyes:
 
It seems like you may not have checked the full list of sets... it looks like ILCA thought "why not BOTH" :P Do a quick search for Double Team in the sheet :eyes:
I have, but my hope is that the evasion ones will be gone some day and we get to be destroyed by banded Dracovish or Boots Libero Cinderace instead

*insert heavy copium dose*
 
Out of curiosity, has anyone gotten ribbons for getting a 50 streak, defeating Palmer or ranking up? There's strings that reference a ribbon reward for these achievements, but they didn't appear to be used as of 1.0.0.
 
I think Thunder Wave's 90% accuracy is a big problem for that plan now, but some type of crippler + Sub Acupressure Drapion is probably going to be one of the first things people try, the potential is undeniable.
Fair point. Perhaps Glare instead? That leaves us Dunsparce, Seviper, and Arbok

Dunsparce gets pretty much nothing other than Glare in terms of accuracy / attack reduction.

Seviper also gets nothing lol.

Arbok has the best speed of the three and has Intimidate. It gets Torment which could I guess be slightly useful. Also Scary Face. It's the fastest of the three as well.

Sub + Accupressure Drapion sounds good but now we have Moody. Maybe something like Arbok + Moody Glalie + a backup Charm / Memento / Flash mon?

I'm gonna ladder with a meme squad of Dunsparce / Bibarel / Pachirisu.
 
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Ranking down is, if you fail to clear a room a certain number of times you go down a rank. I didn't keep track of how many times I failed in Rank 2 but it feels so bad lmao. But yeah it's not "consecutive losses" per se, it's 7 consecutive fails to clear.
Out of curiosity, has anyone gotten ribbons for getting a 50 streak, defeating Palmer or ranking up? There's strings that reference a ribbon reward for these achievements, but they didn't appear to be used as of 1.0.0.
I did all 3 of these things. The Pokemon I used did not get any ribbons now that I'm checking.
 

Level 51

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Serebii's posted Battle Tower information, which appears to indicate two potentially concerning things:

Firstly, it looks like trainers use pre-constructed teams, rather than random Pokemon. For example, Cameraman Barrett picks from four teams instead of selecting three Pokemon from a pool of 12. This aligns with what Jinrou has been describing in the Discord server. The teams appear to be doing pretty well against general goodstuffs so far, but I wonder if they will become stale much more quickly than the random selection we're used to.

Secondly, Double Battles in Master Class appear to be against two trainers at once, for example this listing for "Pokémon Breeder Emilee & Scientist Carlo". We haven't been able to corroborate this yet with ingame experience, but if it's true, and if opponents that come in pairs are locked to Multi Battle style switching, Double Battles could be significantly easier (or at least significantly different).

How do we feel about these changes? To me it's looking like the Singles crippler + Drapion strategy might be even more effective in this game than in the originals, since we have much more foresight into what's in the back of an opposing lineup. On the Doubles front, I'm a bit sad about potentially being able to reduce games to 2v1s with this structural advantage over the AI.
 
Just from a casual perspective, someone who only occasionally does the battle tower and likes to read record posts, it seems like even with the advantage, which can help you know what to expect in that battle, you still have the randomness of running into xyz trainer and dealing with that. You're just better equipped at....uh....dealing with that.
 

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