Blissey

[Lee]

Based onn the extremem amount of chatter on something totally irellavent...

Tell me about it...I for one am sick of seeing every thread derailed by Shadow Tag Shanderaa. For all we know it could be years before it hits the metagame. In fact, it might never be released at all just like the Azure Flute in DPPt. So sitting here and changing every discussion into 'how does [pokemon] fare against Shanderaa?' is just an annoying waste of time.

 

[KokoaKiwi]

Tell me about it...I for one am sick of seeing every thread derailed by Shadow Tag Shanderaa. For all we know it could be years before it hits the metagame. In fact, it might never be released at all just like the Azure Flute in DPPt. So sitting here and changing every discussion into 'how does [pokemon] fare against Shanderaa?' is just an annoying waste of time.

As a Shandera fangirl, I agree with you. We should worry about Garchomp roaming free on the metagame once more, I think.

 

[Voltres]

Based onn the extremem amount of chatter on something totally irellavent i'm guessing every trainers tem will have a Chandera on it... I dont know why blissey has to change to match 1 counter for any reason. each pokemon has somethign it cant stand up to thats why there are weaknesses etc.

to limit blissey to one candle is stupid. she is still the best special wall in game and can take almost any beast so I dont understand why some people wanna say it will lose usage.

there is no need to change anythign on blissey just adjust your team as necessary to batte the candle if there is on on the opposing team and i'm guessing it goes uber or even banned with shadow tag anyway

Agreed. I hate the fact that people are only talking about Dream World abilities when we don't even know whether we'll get all of them. I think Blissey we still be great, and I think her ability to spread paralysis around could be invaluable in this apparently hyper-offensive metagame.

 

[SJCrew]

I dont know why blissey has to change to match 1 counter for any reason.

there is no need to change anythign on blissey

This kind of attitude is not going to fly when it comes down to crunch time. I know you don't want to lose your Blissey to Shanderaa every single time, or worse, have it set up in your face and severely weaken your other team members while you do nothing to it with your Toxic/Flamethrower/Seismic Toss. If Shanderaa turns out to be on every team and standard Blissey can't even touch it, then you HAVE to adapt, no questions asked. Either get yourself a Shed Shell or pack some Shadow Ball.

Personally, I'd go with Shadow Ball. There's no reason at all that Blissey should be switching out on something it's supposed to counter, especially when it has 140-something base Special Attack and Will-o-Wisp to fuck up your Tyranitar.

Other Pokemon have had to adapt to this level too. Once Scizor got Bullet Punch, DDtar was practically forced to carry a Babiri Berry. The new EVs for Stall Breaker Gliscor were designed specifically to outrun Lucario once it gained access to Ice Punch. And that's pretty damn important since that's one of the very few concrete Lucario counters there are.

As to everyone claiming Shadow Tag Shanderaa might not exist...yeah, that's going a little overboard on the optimisim. Azure Flute is just one stupid little item that turned out to be irrelevant anyway when they released the Pokemon itself. I highly doubt they're just going to omit an entire ability on a Pokemon just for the fuck of it. Even if they don't do the whole Dream World thing, they could just release an event for it, like they've been doing with other Pokemon for the past...forever?

 

[KokoaKiwi]

As to everyone claiming Shadow Tag Shanderaa might not exist...yeah, that's going a little overboard on the optimisim. Azure Flute is just one stupid little item that turned out to be irrelevant anyway when they released the Pokemon itself
We waited at least 2 years for an actual release of Arceus. And even then, we weren't able to EV train it properly (lol 100 spreads with vitamins).
My point it, it may be years away for us to get a legit chance of catching a Shadow Tag Hitomoshi (Shandy's preevo).

 

[Mazinger]

...

How many times do i need to say it until you finally understand?

The only way to ever beat shanderaa is to run CM. Shadow ball alone wont help you. At all.

thank you.

 

[Tobes]

Jesus. If people are so worried about Shandera then just run Shed Shell and T-tar. It's not that hard.

 

[VOLCANO]

no they gave out different natures, I have a bold one but with crap IVs

edit: and other crap natures like impish and naive

Well, if I saw any WishBlisses on wi-fi that's tanking I'm pretty sure it's hacked though. WishBliss is INCREDIBLY rare, seeing as it was only given out once and that was over 5 years ago.

 

[Aqueos]

Jesus. If people are so worried about Shandera then just run Shed Shell and T-tar. It's not that hard.

Yeah umm people. Blissey just needs to copy chancey and did what it did in uu ages ago. Simple. Another reason why prevo stone chancey is not as good as blissey. Note by the way. You can run you own choice scarf shandera and knock there's away with shadow ball. Enjoy.

 

[SJCrew]

How many times do i need to say it until you finally understand?

You can say it as many times as you want, but you have to make sure it's actually true before you tote it as fact and type it in bold letters for emphasis.

Serene Grace Shadow Ball has a 40% chance of dropping Sp. Def and when combined with Toxic, you're not winning that stall war. Unless you're imagining some kind of mono-attacking sub/cm/pain split/flamethrower set, which is easily beaten by like, almost anything, Blissey is perfectly capable of beating Shanderaa on its own if it has to.

 

[MapleSandwich]

Well, if I saw any WishBlisses on wi-fi that's tanking I'm pretty sure it's hacked though. WishBliss is INCREDIBLY rare, seeing as it was only given out once and that was over 5 years ago.

Yeah, that's one thing that people don't often take into account when considering competitive Pokemon: Simulators are only a simulation, and therefore do not accurately represent the current metagame situation of a wi-fi setting, where maybe 1 in every 1000 battles has a legitimate Wish Blissey, Leech Seed Vileplume, Level 50 Dragonite, etc.

On the topic of Bliss, I've had no problem using her in my practice so far. You have to make sure you have hard counters to the Pokemon who like to set up on her. My personal set is:

Katy Perry (Blissey) (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 60 HP/252 Def/196 SDef
Bold nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Wish
- Protect
- Counter
- Shadow Ball
---
EV Spread maximizes useful bulk while making sure it has the defense to actually use Counter against opposing physical Pokemon.

You pretty much don't use it if you see a set-up Pokemon coming in, you switch instead and counter it. (ex. Hippowdon coming in on T-Tar and Lucario, Scarfmie coming in on Gyarados, Balloon Ninetales or Skarmory coming in on Doryuuzu, etc.)

Counter is for utility or coverage Pokemon who happen to have Physical
attacks and try to threaten you when you are weakened by using them. Shadow Ball has always been my preference to round out the Fighting/Ghost combo while also having a chance of lowering SpDef to make countering certain Pokemon easier, as well as harassing Celebi and Rotom, and now Victini and Shanderaa. The new Wish mechanics will make Wish/Protect even more ridiculously potent, so I think it's safe to say this Bliss and others in the metagame are here to stay, for now. In fact, stall might be even effective, if not plausible, depending on how the metagame develops...with old staples, such as this, being improved, and new Pokemon such as Bunungeru allowing us to counter things in ways that were not possible in 4th generation, you have to remember that Stall is being boosted just as offense is. Look for me to be rockin' the stall game all through 5th gen just I have through 3rd and 4th.

 

[ShinyAzelf]

Healing Beam + its Dream World ability means its got lots of Double Battle potential. Pair this up with a bulky sweeper and that'd be a good combination.

 

[Mazinger]

Serene Grace Shadow Ball has a 40% chance of dropping Sp. Def and when combined with Toxic, you're not winning that stall war. Unless you're imagining some kind of mono-attacking sub/cm/pain split/flamethrower set, which is easily beaten by like, almost anything, Blissey is perfectly capable of beating Shanderaa on its own if it has to.

i was actually talking about sub/CM/shadow ball/fire attack or hp fighting, whihc will beat blissey 60% (or 80% because natural cure is really helpful and probably wouldnt be worth sacrificing for a 20% chance) of the time as you mentioned, and i wouldnt consider hoping that you get a spdef drop a way to beat shanderaa.

so no, blissey is not perfectly capable of beating shanderaa unless it runs CM.

 

[Forsety]

Am I the only one who cries at the idea of a Red Card/Recycle Bliss? A phazing Bliss would be a bloody nightmare.

Setup your special sweep than Bliss comes in and everytime you hit it you're forced to switch, then it simply heals off the damage and picks up a new Red Card. The issue is that if you're not 1 hitting Bliss or able to Taunt than you'll simply get ejected.

 

[THE ENEMY]

i was actually talking about sub/CM/shadow ball/fire attack or hp fighting, whihc will beat blissey 60% (or 80% because natural cure is really helpful and probably wouldnt be worth sacrificing for a 20% chance) of the time as you mentioned, and i wouldnt consider hoping that you get a spdef drop a way to beat shanderaa.

so no, blissey is not perfectly capable of beating shanderaa unless it runs CM.

I dont think so.

Suppose we give Shandera its best case scenario:

1. Shandera switches in on blissey after a kill or on a blissey wish (as switching in on a toxic or a shadow ball would be disasterous.)

2. Shandera uses CM, Blissey uses Shadow Ball. How much does this do?

3. The point is, can't Blissey do enough damage with Shadow Ball on Shandera to break any of its subs no matter how many CM's it has up?

Shandera has thin defenses. A supereffective shadow ball will hurt even if there are a couple CM's up. Shandera is risking it trying to set up on a Shadow Ball Blissey

 

[Lunanight]

Too bad latios Can Easily 2HKO blissey With or Without Soul Dew so switching blissey on psycho shock may make you think twice

Timid 252 SpAtk Choice Spec Latios Psycho Shock VS 252/252 Bold Blissey: 54.3% - 64%
Timid 252 SpAtk Life Orb Latios Psycho Shock VS 252/252 Bold Blissey: 47.2% - 55.6%

Modest 252 SpAtk Life Orb Latios Psycho Shock VS 252/252 Bold Blissey: 51.8% - 61.1%

Modest 252 SpAtk Choice Spec Latios Psycho Shock VS 252/252 Bold Blissey: 59.7% - 70.3%

 

[Tobes]

Too bad latios Can Easily 2HKO blissey With or Without Soul Dew so switching blissey on psycho shock may make you think twice

Timid 252 SpAtk Choice Spec Latios Psycho Shock VS 252/252 Bold Blissey: 54.3% - 64%
Timid 252 SpAtk Life Orb Latios Psycho Shock VS 252/252 Bold Blissey: 47.2% - 55.6%

Modest 252 SpAtk Life Orb Latios Psycho Shock VS 252/252 Bold Blissey: 51.8% - 61.1%

Modest 252 SpAtk Choice Spec Latios Psycho Shock VS 252/252 Bold Blissey: 59.7% - 70.3%

Except that Latios would much rather keep a coverage move than use Psycho Shock >_>. (Also T-tar says hi.)

 

[SupremeDirt]

I tend to like running an offensive set, with Serene Grace and Charge Beam.

 

[Loves_Eo]

Hey, I'm not all that worried about Shandera fucking over Blissey. Cause you know, I have this guy on my team, his name is Doryuuzu, and he'd like to say a big fuck you to Shandera. Also cause Blissey gets Skill Swap, and LO Shandera with max ev's in SpA and modest nature only 3HKO's blissey after 1 Calm mind. Even with 2 Calm Minds he only 2HKO's very rarely on a specially defensive Blissey, which is plenty of time to skill swap and go to someone who resists Shandy and can fuck him up.

 

[SJCrew]

Oh, things are different now. Those CM sets we were all talking about? Didn't happen. Blissey's not as common as it was in 4th gen either, so you're not going to get that picture perfect scenario as much as you'd like even if you're running a CM set.

A much better use of Shandy's capabilities is slapping on a choice item and smoking out key threats your team needs out of the way.

 

[AccidentalGreed]

Those CM sets we were all talking about? Didn't happen.

Not to mention that Shandera will likely hesitate to even go into a war with Blissey either. The most Shandras I've seen on Pokemon online were the Scarf ones, which I easily took care of. I'm not even seeing Blissey on PO.

Blissey's still the best of a Special Wall as it was ever, and apparently, CM Shandera doesn't exist.

I tend to like running an offensive set, with Serene Grace and Charge Beam.

I guess it would be okay in your opinion, but if you're going that route, why not go with Jolteon and friends?

 

[ensoriki]

Gravity Blizzard Blissey does pretty well, granted gravity's up it'll kill it's dragon opposition. Roobpushin gravity dynamic paunch with iron fist is a sight to behold as well.

Don't know how easy stalling is with gravity but I used grass whistle Erufuun to good affect, as the sleep chance was high. Might try combining gravity with weather for greater effect.

 

[min min]

Blissey will keep on doing what she has always done, and will continue to do so for the rest of time. There is no denying that. Shanderaa is PURE and UTTER THEORYMON at the moment barring PO DW tier as IT HAS NOT BEEN RELEASED.

However there are some special sweepers this gen that might give Blissey trouble:
~Psycho Shock Calm Mind Rankurusu.
~NPLuke.
~Psycho Shock Latios, if you want to play it that way. :/

But I'm sure you know that already.

My point is that Blissey has not changed, special attacks are still being used, and there is no other pokemon with Natural Cure and 255/135 special defences. Blissey will still be used, theoretical Shanderaa or not.

 

[rickheg]

Just wondering, would Counter work against Psycho Shock? It seems a few people are willing to run Counter anyway, would it give Bliss a way to still deal with those Psycho Shock users?

 

[Heartgold]

Just wondering, would Counter work against Psycho Shock? It seems a few people are willing to run Counter anyway, would it give Bliss a way to still deal with those Psycho Shock users?

Nope, psycho shock is still a special based move which targets the opponents defence instead of sp.defence.