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Double Battle Metagame.

1059860 said:
Wormadam-G @ Leftovers
EVed defensively
- Skill Swap
- Fissure
- Substitute
- Protect

Machamp @ Whatever
NO GUARD
- 4 Moves of Any

The point is having a defensive Wormadam that is capable of Skill Swap and then abusing No Guard Fissure. This only applies if OHKO Clause is not in play.
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No offense, but I really hate these sets. These sets are really tough to set up and let alone use. Here are the major flaws...

1. Wormadam can't really take a hit. If we're talking about maybe using this in Platinum, Heat Wave is a major downfall in this. Zapdos, and Togekiss (Which is very common), can eliminate 2HKO which is the time it needs to sKill Swap and attack.

2. What happens after the strategy? Do you bring in Trick Room or do you try to sweep with Wormadam? Wormadam has WAY to many weaknesses and does not have the speed to back it up.

I know it sounds like I'm putting you down and I'm really not. But other people post Machamp sets, trying to get Skill Swap off, more times than not... it won't work.

I think if people are going to use Skill Swap, here's what I use in my main team... (in next post).
 
dude edit your posts don't keep posting in a row ._.

sorry to minimod but I also wanted to contribute my own little bit of info into this topic.

Trick Room is apparently very effective in doubles, as are pokemon that can get a 1-for-one kill, especially since in the case you get ahead you can probably double up on the opposing pokemon. So I was thinking something along the lines of Bronzong/Togekiss/ Tyranitar(or abomasnow)/ Endeavor Clefs, which all have protect to help them from Fake Out or any other abuse of the sort. Rain Dance abuse is very in common in doubles, but when TR is out and Tyranitar(or abomasnow) hit the field afterwards, it's ery troublesome to gain back the momentum. Tyranitar with STAB Crunch+Rock Slide with EQ for overall coverage and 61 base speed makes him a very potent threat underneath Trick Room, and as noted his endurance is second-to-none. With Tyranitar and one of the Clefs out, Ghosts have a problem blocking the strategy(unless they run multiples) as then they get owned by super-effective Crunch. Maybe not the best strategy, but I think it could work =D
 
Random question, has anybody here actually played 6v6 Doubles with all the standard clauses as well as a ban on Dark Void? The VGS's format is very... Contrary to what a competitive battle should be. ._.
 
I started to play double recently. I tried this combo with some success in double battle tower, though it certainly isn't flawless.

Breloom @ Choice Scarf
Nature: Jolly
EVs: 252 Speed (the rest in Attack / HP / Defenses)
Ability: Poison Heal
- Spore
- 3 other moves (For my Breloom it was Substitute, Leech Seed, Facade)
--> Jolly and max speed is needed to outspeed all +130s.

Lopunny @ Toxic Orb
Nature: Jolly / Timid
EVs: a lot of speed, rest in HP/Defenses
Ability: Klutz
- Fake Out
- Switcheroo
- 2 other moves (Mine had Charm and Thunderwave, but can be anything).

So basically,

Turn 1:
Lopunny uses Fake Out on one opponent.
Breloom spores the other opponent.

Turn 2:
Breloom spores the opponent that's still awake.
Lopunny uses Switcheroo on Breloom.

- So at the end of Turn 2 I'd have a poisoned Breloom and a Lopunny that is ready to trick its scarf to something, facing 2 sleeping opponents.
- Insomnia Banette screws this up totally, among other things.
- When I tried this on double battle tower, I find that opponents often wake up earlier than I'd like.
 
Chinese Dood said:
I started to play double recently. I tried this combo with some success in double battle tower, though it certainly isn't flawless.

Breloom @ Choice Scarf
Nature: Jolly
EVs: 252 Speed (the rest in Attack / HP / Defenses)
Ability: Poison Heal
- Spore
- 3 other moves (For my Breloom it was Substitute, Leech Seed, Facade)
--> Jolly and max speed is needed to outspeed all +130s.

Lopunny @ Toxic Orb
Nature: Jolly / Timid
EVs: a lot of speed, rest in HP/Defenses
Ability: Klutz
- Fake Out
- Switcheroo
- 2 other moves (Mine had Charm and Thunderwave, but can be anything).

So basically,

Turn 1:
Lopunny uses Fake Out on one opponent.
Breloom spores the other opponent.

Turn 2:
Breloom spores the opponent that's still awake.
Lopunny uses Switcheroo on Breloom.

- So at the end of Turn 2 I'd have a poisoned Breloom and a Lopunny that is ready to trick its scarf to something, facing 2 sleeping opponents.
- Insomnia Banette screws this up totally, among other things.
- When I tried this on double battle tower, I find that opponents often wake up earlier than I'd like.
Click to expand...
Sorry for that double post earlier, I had thought I edited it, I must've replied by mistake... I apologize.

On Chinese Doods post...

That strategy is really good! It's unoriginal so your opponent will not expect it. For example, in Doubles, I do not understand why, but everyone expects a Themed team. By themed I mean Rain Dance, Trick Room, etc. So, they bring counters for it. If I were to go up against this team and not know the strategy of it, I would probably attack with both my Pokémon and maybe get luck and KO one of them. But, you really do not have to worry about Banette, Hypno is probably used more than Banette in doubles. As for the two other moves for Lopunny, I would definitely go with T-Wave, and perhaps even Ice Punch if you go with a Jolly nature? It could do a little bit to the annoying Lati@s. That's really all I can think of as a last remaining move. I like the strategy though, it's good!
 
Quantum said:
Yes, but what am I asking is if anybody plays Doubles here outside of the Video Game Showdown?
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A few of us play Doubles competitively, although most of us tend to play PBR-style (meaning you see your opponent's team of 6 and then choose 4). The doubles players on this site tend to come and go, though.

And yeah, the VGS rules are a complete joke.
 
I was scanning through Toxicroak's movepool the other day and I saw that it learned Embargo. I read up on it and realized that it could be a pretty annoying move if combined with a Spore user.

Weavile is the fastest Pokemon with Embargo and Breloom, with a Choice Scarf, is the fastest Spore user. The idea is that Weavile uses Embargo so that Breloom can Spore whatever it wants without fearing Lum, Chesto, or Safeguard. You are essntially free to put all of their Pokemon to Sleep. Of course, there's always Magic Coat, if that's the move that bounces back non-damaging attacks, but that's rarely used.

Yeah, extremely lame but it's really just a gimmick strategy.

A practical use for this, though, could be in tandem with a Dark Void Smeargle at the Video Game Showdown. Just about everyone uses Lum Berry, Chesto Berry, and/or Safeguard on their openers to counter that single strategy alone (as well as sleep in general). But with Emabrgo, there's nothing stopping Dark Void from putting both of their Pokemon to sleep. Like everything, it played around but who will honestly anticipate Embargo?

Heh, Dusknoir learns Embargo.
 
Weavile and Toxicroak can also both learn Knock Off via Platinum move tutor, which is a slightly more permanent solution to your Lum Berry woes. Dusknoir can't learn Knock Off, so Embargo is a handy substitute, I guess.

The best use I can come up with for Embargo is to use it on your partner, eliminating the effect of a Choice Scarf after you've already gotten the desired benefit. I think I like the Lopunny/Klutz/Switcheroo idea better, though.
 
BattleBeastEXP said:
I'm really glad that people are starting to post double strategies! Anyway, this one could work in doubles...

463-m.png

Lickilicky @ Life Orb / Focus Sash / Choice Band
Ability : Own Tempo
252 HP/ 200 Atk/ 56 SpD
- Explosion
- Fire Punch / Return
- Earthquake
- ThunderPunch / Ice Punch / Return / Protect

477-m.png

Dusknoir @ Leftovers
252 HP / 156 SpD / 100 Def
- Trick Room
- Swagger
- Protect
- Night Shade / Will-O-Wisp

Well, the combo of this is pretty easy to set up and use, if your opponent can't Taunt you. Lickilicky can Protect on the first turn and allow you to set up Trick Room which puts the pieces in the puzzle on your strategy. If both have 0 speed IV's Dusknoir will go first which sets up Swagger and boosts Lickilicky's Attack without being confused. Then, you can pretty much just sweep.

It's a good combo to use, so I thought I'd just spit it out so people can use it. But it is hard to pull off if your opponent is expecting it, or if they have Taunt, it will really hurt the strategy and it will become much harder to win.
Click to expand...

Looks cool your strategy looks better than the one I posted with Helping Hand.
 
Regarding the Dusknoir's EV Spread, while special attacks are very prominent in doubles, Heatwave and Surf being the Top Two most used now, People seem to be carrying Physical Counters for Dusknoir for that same purpose (at least from the competitive JP teams I have found on Wi-Fi) carry in one form or another. So carrying a slightly more Physicaly Oriented EV Spread or maybe a better answer.

The Showdown Rules may not be the best but they are the rules ran at the offical tournaments, so might as well master the metagame that they emphasise than to create one that we will only see used online.
 
Bologo suggested a Pairing like this, so i made it on paper :D

Mewtwo @ Leftovers
Timid - Pressure
Evs: 42 HP / 252 SpA / 216 Spe
- Guard Swap
- Recover
- Shadow Ball
- Aura Sphere

Shuckle @ Leftovers
Impish - Gluttony
Evs: 42 HP / 252 SpA / 216 Spe
- Gastro Acid
- Safeguard
- Swagger / Helping Hand
- Encore / Rest
 
Spiritman said:
Bologo suggested a Pairing like this, so i tested it out and it pwns :D

Mewtwo @ Leftovers
Timid - Pressure
Evs: 42 HP / 252 SpA / 216 Spe
- Guard Swap
- Recover
- Shadow Ball
- Aura Sphere

Shuckle @ Leftovers
Impish - Gluttony
Evs: 42 HP / 252 SpA / 216 Spe
- Gastro Acid
- Safeguard
- Swagger / Helping Hand
- Encore / Rest
Click to expand...

I don't get it. Why does Shuckle have the same EV spread as Mewtwo, why does it have Gluttony, and what is the strategy behind this pairing?
 
Spiritman said:
Bologo suggested a Pairing like this, so i tested it out and it pwns :D

Mewtwo @ Leftovers
Timid - Pressure
Evs: 42 HP / 252 SpA / 216 Spe
- Guard Swap
- Recover
- Shadow Ball
- Aura Sphere

Shuckle @ Leftovers
Impish - Gluttony
Evs: 42 HP / 252 SpA / 216 Spe
- Gastro Acid
- Safeguard
- Swagger / Helping Hand
- Encore / Rest
Click to expand...
guard swap only switches defenses boosts not defense stats, so this would not work out like you want it too

also WTF speed ev's on a shuckle

Edit: oh it looks like you just accidentally put mewtwo's EV spread on shuckle
 
A thought occurred to me just now.

For all these Skill Swap teams, would Follow Me still focus single-target moves onto the Follow-Me user if the attacks were targeted toward the attacker's partner? I think it depends on the attack; Skill Swap CAN be used on enemies, so it'd work; Acupressure can only be used on yourself or or your partner, so it wouldn't. Can anyone confirm this?
 
Sorry i had the wrong ability and evs on shuckle :k!
@latios 315 - guard swap does not only trade stats up according to Serebii.net
i will try it now to see how it works D:
( im aware that in the smogon move thingy it says its only stat boost or drops)
 
Spiritman said:
Sorry i had the wrong ability and evs on shuckle :k!
@latios 315 - guard swap does not only trade stats up according to Serebii.net
i will try it now to see how it works D:
( im aware that in the smogon move thingy it says its only stat boost or drops)
Click to expand...

As a general rule, whenever Smogon and Serebii disagree on a game mechanic, Smogon is right. We actually have a team of researchers here to make sure our strategy Pokédex is accurate. Serebii is a good site for news, but they still have glaring inaccuracies even in their Advance-gen content.
 
I'll slit my throat if that guy does not get infracted for double posting -_-(not really directed at you hhjj but i got infracted for double posting In my trade thread so if you read this delete before they see because orginization does not count for a reason to double post), anyway the team looks good but broken as hell I had 2 people quit on me yesterday jsut because I had a Darkrai on my team I'm guessing before the match even started with the moveset

Spacial Rend/Roar of Time/Hypnosis/Nightmare i just wanted to see what Darkrai looked like on Wi-Fi lols, I'd probably quit after the first turn, facing that team.

Talking about PBR, which IMO is the best place to play doubles at the moment.
 
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