Extraterrestrial Life

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/36769422/?GT1=43001

Not sure if I spelled that right.... anyways, here's the article that started my thoughts. Now, I've always been interested in the possibility of extraterrestrial life. What are your beliefs on it? Personally, I think that the possibility of life beyond our planet is very possible. However, it might differ so much from what we view as life that we may not realize what exactly it is. We know that a rock is not alive, because it doesnt fit our definition of life. Either way, feel free to put out your beliefs.

Oh, and try and keep God, Religion, Creationism V.S. evolution, and etc. out of this. That would defeat the point of this thread.
 
Extraterrestrial life is I think highly probable. It's decently possible in the solar system. Unfortunately, one planet we increasingly believe WAS a pleasant place for life to arise - Mars - is now dry and almost airless.

Europa is a possibility, but the chemistry of its suspected ocean could turn out to be all wrong. Titan's an outside bet, it's probably too cold. Io might seem outlandish, but it's got plenty of heat and sulphur, though I'm not sure there's a viable solvent for life.

Beyond the Solar System, it may be decades or centuries before we become able to carry out the kind of exploration that would be needed to definitively confirm the presence of life. However, detecting reactive chemicals in planetary atmospheres (most obviously oxygen, but any reactive chemical would do) would be a very strong indicator of life - though it would be hard to categorically rule out physical processes.

Of course there's SETI, but we've been listening for decades and heard nothing definite. Extraterrestrial intelligence is almost certainly much less likely that life, since judging from life on Earth intelligence requires massive costs and is thus usually not evolutionary advantageous. It's also suspected intelligent species are liable to self-destruct through war, and a species usually only gets one chance at developing civilisation, since the developmental route will use up the easily-obtained resources, leaving only those which require a functioning advanced civilisation to obtain them. If humanity lost all its modern machinery, we'd have trouble obtaining decent amounts of iron ore for example. Once advanced civilisation falls, whether through war or natural disaster, it is unlikely to recover and the species will go extinct.

If intelligent aliens do exist, I think it is rather likely they would be somewhat hostile. It seems reasonably plausible an intelligent species would seek to wipe out other species for no gain, or for territory, since the same behaviour has been exhibited by humans against other humans numerous times in history. It's also very likely we would be unable to oppose another species seeking to exploit our resources in manners detrimental to us. We can probably take consolation from the fact that it's not clear what Earth has over other planets and moons that would make it particularly useful to extraterrestrial life; biological differences would likely make us useless as alien food (and vice versa), most metals and minerals are probably easier to get from a body with lower gravity, and even water can be had in ample abundance in the moons of the gas giants. Coal and oil are probably found in the Solar System only on Earth, but unless the aliens own planets have similar materials why would they want them?
Of course, we do know where to find stuff on Earth. It's unlikely any species can just remotely scan a planet and know the resources it has. Commandeering our own mines and quarries would be much quicker.

One should not assume that for aliens to reach us they must be vastly more intelligent than us. Technological progress is a very different thing to intelligence - the former is cultural and advances rapidly, the latter strongly biological and likely advances more slowly. Technological development could be driven by a "long tail" of genius individuals in a species generally much less intelligent than those individuals. So while it would be no surprise to meet aliens with IQs of 200, it would also be no surprise if they turned out to have IQs of 70.
 
The real question is not if there is extraterrestrial life, but when we find it. There are studies indicating as many galaxies are in space as there are specks of sand on the earth. How can't there be something else out there?
 
I think the end of the movie Contact explained it pretty well.

"I'll tell you one thing about the universe. The universe is a pretty big place, it's bigger than anything, anyone has ever dreamed of. If it's just us, it seems like an awful waste of space."
 
Well if aliens were to visit us, they'd be the aliens. If we visited their homeplanet we would be the aliens.

I think if we visited their home planet, they'd still be aliens in our heads. And I'm sure they'd no doubt think the same of us.

But yes, I believe there is most definitely life elsewhere in this universe, and that most likely, some of it is intelligent. Perhaps more intelligent than us. And of course, some of those beings may be interested in adding Earth to their empire. Who knows? The problem is, there's no certainties. Just probabilities.
 
With our universe expanding exponentially, it seems improbably that life would not exist elseware. To think differently seems almost cocky to me.

edit: lati0s pwns

edit 2: Yes, I understand now that I am incorrect. Anyone else want to comment on this?
 
@oddish- the expansion of the universe applies only to the matter in it becoming farther apart, not new matter being added so it does not really increase the probability of life in other parts of the universe.

I think it is likely that there is some form of life somewhere else in the universe, intelligent life is much more of a mystery. We really lack the amount of information needed to make a good prediction.
 
The real question is not if there is extraterrestrial life, but when we find it. There are studies indicating as many galaxies are in space as there are specks of sand on the earth. How can't there be something else out there?

This. If you think that there's no other life in the universe, you're just being silly. There chances of there being a planet in the universe that can harber life are extremely high due to the high number of planets in the universe. IIRC, there have been experiments where life was created under certain conditions and they lead me to believe that anywhere life can exist, it does.

I think if we visited their home planet, they'd still be aliens in our heads. And I'm sure they'd no doubt think the same of us.

This reminds me of a Professor Laton puzzle where an astronaut goes to another planet with life on it and they tell you how many male aliens, female aliens, and aliens that have characteristics of both males and females and asks you how many aliens there are. Your first instinct is to add up all the numbers but you have to realize that the astronaut is the only one who's not from that planet and thus the only alien. Who the aliens are just depends on your perspective.
 
With our universe expanding exponentially, it seems improbably that life would not exist elseware. To think differently seems almost cocky to me.

edit: lati0s pwns

Just because the universe is expanding (if it even is) doesn't mean that more matter is being created.
 
Extraterrestrial life is one thing. We've seen the microscopic remains of bacteria on meteorites and rocks from Mars. There is evidence of flowing water on the surface of the red planet in the past as well, the one basic thing needed to support life as we know it. I've always been interested in the possiblity of life there since, if it were just a bit closer to the sun, it could be full of life.

But there's a big difference between "extraterrestrial" life and "extraterrestrial intelligent" life.

http://prozacville.com/myspace/images/calvin-and-hobbes-intelligent-life.jpg

Intelligent life is much more interesting to think of! That there are other beings out there just like us... but it would take an incredible amount of, well, sheer luck to be honest, to replicate the conditions necessary for intelligent life elsewhere in the universe. But the universe is so huge, and it's still expanding. We know so little about the universe that no one can honestly imagine even the possibilities, but I think there's a good chance life is out there somewhere.
 
I think a lot of people think there is alien life because they fear thinking we're the only species in the entire universe.

to me, it's as possible for ET life as much as it isn't possible. the sheer size and our existence's insignificance to the universe makes it seem like it could be more likely, but the universe constantly surprising me so I'm a fence rider on this.
 
I think a lot of people think there is alien life because they fear thinking we're the only species in the entire universe.

I think most people realize that the universe is so incredibly vast that the likelihood of there being another planet with suitable conditions for life, even intelligent life, is very likely. It has nothing to do with fear.
 
you take my definition of 'fear' a little too literally there. I do not mean, "HOLY SHIT I'M FUCKING SCARED SOMEONE HOLD ME." being the ONLY species in the entire universe is baffling and makes you feel a little more insignificant than we already are in the grand scheme of things. thus, a lot of people believe ET exist. now I'm not saying it's dumb, don't get me wrong, but with how much the universe surprises me (black holes for one) I wouldn't be too surprised that we may be the only intelligent life out there.
 
Think of this:
All of existence, every single great leader, idea, and war, evey single dream that anyone had, all lies on a tiny rock hurtling through space in trillions of miles of darkness.

Makes you feel kinda lonely, doesnt it?
 
Think of this:
All of existence, every single great leader, idea, and war, evey single dream that anyone had, all lies on a tiny rock hurtling through space in trillions of miles of darkness.

Makes you feel kinda lonely, doesnt it?
exactly what I'm saying (whether you agree it's a thing of fear or not). it's not a shit your pants fear. it's an insignificant fear. but I edited my previous post and went into depth on what I mean so.
 
being the ONLY species in the entire universe is baffling and makes you feel a little more insignificant than we already are in the grand scheme of things.

I feel like this would have the exact opposite effect regarding feeling insignificant in the universe if earth was in fact the only planet with life in the universe.
 
Think of this:
All of existence, every single great leader, idea, and war, evey single dream that anyone had, all lies on a tiny rock hurtling through space in trillions of miles of darkness.

Makes you feel kinda lonely, doesnt it?
Heheh, well said, well said. I think the fact that we can contemplate the thought of a huge, unknown universe naturally makes us afraid, in a lonely sense of the word. It's frightening to think of merely being an insignificant "dust speck", and that our entire race could die out and no one would notice. I think that's why we're so eager to think of intelligent life; it would somehow give our existence meaning.
 
I feel like this would have the exact opposite effect regarding feeling insignificant in the universe if earth was in fact the only planet with life in the universe.


I can see how you got to that point. But, if there is life out there, the we can hold the tiniest hope that one day, long after we're gone, theyre gonna find our ruins. Someone will know that we lived. Someone will know that, however insignificant, we were here. And to most people, that would mean something.

If we are alone, then when we die, everything dies. The universe becomes a cold, empty black void of chemical reactions and pretty lights.
 
FattyButt said:
[...]it might differ so much from what we view as life that we may not realize what exactly it is. We know that a rock is not alive, because it doesn't fit our definition of life.
I wondered about the same thing some years ago. Life, developed on a celestial body strange to us, will be strange to us. And I wondered if this strangeness would apply even to what makes it alive. This is the conclusion I came to: whether or not it's actually a duck, we only need to call it a duck if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, etc..

Nonetheless, I think that contact with extraterrestrial life will stretch our thinking to an unprecedented degree. (it will quack like a falcon)
 
I can see how you got to that point. But, if there is life out there, the we can hold the tiniest hope that one day, long after we're gone, theyre gonna find our ruins. Someone will know that we lived. Someone will know that, however insignificant, we were here. And to most people, that would mean something.

If we are alone, then when we die, everything dies. The universe becomes a cold, empty black void of chemical reactions and pretty lights.

This does make more sense. I still don't think that it's enough of a fear for a person to convince themselves that life probably exists elsewhere in the universe, which is what I'm now taking his argument to be (correct me if I'm wrong though). Hoping is one thing but actually believing it solely because of that fear doesn't really seem likely.
 
Funny, I was just discussing this exact same thing with the family only yesterday.

In my opinion, to suggest that in the entire vastness of the universe, our planet is the only one capable of harbouring life is very arrogant. The prospect of extraterrestrial life is, in my opinion, almost certain.

However, as some people have mentioned, this isn't to be confused with "Oh no, there's gonna be flying saucers everywhere!". There could be intelligent life out there, but that can't be accepted or dismissed until we manage to get more information (unfortunately way past our lifetimes :( )
 
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