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Move Knock Off
- Thread starter youngjake93
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lucario is also pretty good at enjoying its justified boost, while keeping its mega stone when getting smacked around by knock off. The unSTABed users of the move or the weaker ones wont leave a huge dent.
That's apparently a glitch in the simulator, as it activates it first in game.
As such, here is the ultimate Knock Off abuser.
Drifblim@Weakness Policy
Unburden
Impish 252 At / 252 Df / 4 SpD
~ Stockpile
~ Acrobatics
~ Substitute/Phantom Force/Magic Coat
~ Baton Pass
Never have there been so many ways to benefit from having your item taken from you. I hope the simulator gets updated to compensate for that glitch because this is pretty boss. Stockpile with your amazing HP makes you pretty bulky and he has a fair amount of common weaknesses that can activate Weakness Policy outside of Knock Off including Rock, Ghost, Electric and Ice. Once your item is gone Unburden activates and powers up STAB Acrobatics to 110 BP with +2 in attack. Even with your subpar attack stat, that's not bad at all. And the coud de grace is that you can BP every boost outside speed to a crazy mixed tank and just clean house. MegaPinsir/MegaHeracross/RP Tyrantrum, you name it. Even if this catches on to the point that your enemy doesn't attack you with SE moves, you're going to be really hard to kill with all those Stockpiles which can still benefit something with a pass. Substitute protects from status and excessive damage, Phantom Force will become a really strong and fast unblockable Ghost move, and Magic Coat is helpful if you're a lead to reflect hazards and Taunt.
Deoxys-D (Deoxys-Defense) @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 108 Def / 148 Spd
Calm Nature
- Knock Off
- Recover
- Stealth Rock
- Seismic Toss
It's pretty cool for Deoxys-D that move!! Have the bulk to take a hit and Knock off the item
and hits hard to psychic pokes like Espeon (specially when they think that gonna throw the
Stealth Rock/Spikes).
Hope Deoxys-D stay in OU.
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 108 Def / 148 Spd
Calm Nature
- Knock Off
- Recover
- Stealth Rock
- Seismic Toss
It's pretty cool for Deoxys-D that move!! Have the bulk to take a hit and Knock off the item
and hits hard to psychic pokes like Espeon (specially when they think that gonna throw the
Stealth Rock/Spikes).
Hope Deoxys-D stay in OU.
Zoroark @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Illusion
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 SDef
Jolly Nature
- Sucker Punch/Pursuit/Detect/Toxic
- Taunt/Sword Dance
- Knock Off
- Trick
This lead set is is bes zoroak set i have used.
Zoroark lead
and espeon last slot
Zoroark and espeon work so well together 2 shut down set ups.I cant remember the last time someone did stealth rock on me.(espeon illusion )90% sure noone does any harzards vs That opening.
Scarf knock off + espeon illusion baits out ghost types and swap ins and get otk or cripple by losing their items.
replay soon
Ability: Illusion
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 SDef
Jolly Nature
- Sucker Punch/Pursuit/Detect/Toxic
- Taunt/Sword Dance
- Knock Off
- Trick
This lead set is is bes zoroak set i have used.
Zoroark lead
and espeon last slot
Zoroark and espeon work so well together 2 shut down set ups.I cant remember the last time someone did stealth rock on me.(espeon illusion )90% sure noone does any harzards vs That opening.
Scarf knock off + espeon illusion baits out ghost types and swap ins and get otk or cripple by losing their items.
replay soon
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Knock off can also be used as for a decent STAB alternative to crunch with a SUPERB secondary effect! I mean 65 BP(97 if the opponent holds an item)is not bad at all..I have seen a lot of Drapions lately using it as their STAB moves and I run it also on my Crawdaunt and I have to admit it's really good.. (imo)
I'm planning on using it with my Mandibuzz.
Mandibuzz @ ??? (Overcoat) Impish or Careful
Foul Play
Knock Off
Roost
Rock Tomb/Tailwind/Defog/Taunt
252 HP, rest in both defenses.
Knockoff for that glorious effect, FOul Play for some massive damage. Roost to get all the health back. Last move depends on what I think my team needs most. ROck Tomb for a speed decrese of certain threats. Tail wind for speed boost, Defog for spike removal, and Taunt to stop set ups. My team though uses a Duel screen Espeon with magic bounce and a Baton passing Scolipede, so would those make Tailwind and defog not as important? I can see tailwind still being important even with speed boosts.
Mandibuzz @ ??? (Overcoat) Impish or Careful
Foul Play
Knock Off
Roost
Rock Tomb/Tailwind/Defog/Taunt
252 HP, rest in both defenses.
Knockoff for that glorious effect, FOul Play for some massive damage. Roost to get all the health back. Last move depends on what I think my team needs most. ROck Tomb for a speed decrese of certain threats. Tail wind for speed boost, Defog for spike removal, and Taunt to stop set ups. My team though uses a Duel screen Espeon with magic bounce and a Baton passing Scolipede, so would those make Tailwind and defog not as important? I can see tailwind still being important even with speed boosts.
Why not put Knock off on a Scout like Meinshao? Seems like a great idea, plus it puts a great deal of fear around your scout.
"This is why you can't have nice things!"
Meinshao @ Left Overs
Jolly, Regenerator
EVs: 252 Spe / 252 HP / 4 Att
- Knock Off
- Fake Out
- U-Turn
- Drain Punch / High Jump Kick / Toxic / Acrobatics*
Knock Off seems great as part of a hit and run strategy, plus it gives it a bit of coverage (not GREAT coverage, but it can hit Ghosts). Fake Out is sort of one of Meinshao's things that it does, and it does a bit of hurt at no cost in 1v1. U-Turn for momentum, to help trigger that regenerator, and because it's always a fun move.
That last slot can go to Drain Punch or High Jump Kick if you want to keep him out for damage or as a safe fall back if he outlives your team (Knock off and Fake out don't really finish battles...), and I thought toxic on a scout might not be a bad idea because you really can't go wrong poisoning everything you can.
The idea behind this guy is to outspeed just about everything it can, Fake Out, Knock Off, and U-Turn into something else, heal w/ Regenerator, and do it again later. Nothing is Immune to Knock Off and U-Turn, so there's no easy way out, and Ghosts are Immune to Fake Out but weak to Knock Off, so if they try a "smart" switch, you can troll them pretty well.
Also, if you want to put Left Overs on something else, you could try Assault Vest for some more bulk (Take Drain Punch or maybe HJKick), or a consumable item like a Berry or a Red Card (For multiple Knock Offs in a row) and grab Acrobatics*, or maybe even put some safety goggles on him (For anti-weather/spore).
This would go well on a team that has some good defensive pivot switches, and would like a Rapid Spin. Plus, the only true threat to this guy would be Megas (don't drop items) and Paralysis, as it would make him very difficult/impossible to use. The only downside, is after the first Knock Off combo, they know what to look for, and will be ready for it the next time, but any good player could use this to their advantage.
"This is why you can't have nice things!"
Meinshao @ Left Overs
Jolly, Regenerator
EVs: 252 Spe / 252 HP / 4 Att
- Knock Off
- Fake Out
- U-Turn
- Drain Punch / High Jump Kick / Toxic / Acrobatics*
Knock Off seems great as part of a hit and run strategy, plus it gives it a bit of coverage (not GREAT coverage, but it can hit Ghosts). Fake Out is sort of one of Meinshao's things that it does, and it does a bit of hurt at no cost in 1v1. U-Turn for momentum, to help trigger that regenerator, and because it's always a fun move.
That last slot can go to Drain Punch or High Jump Kick if you want to keep him out for damage or as a safe fall back if he outlives your team (Knock off and Fake out don't really finish battles...), and I thought toxic on a scout might not be a bad idea because you really can't go wrong poisoning everything you can.
The idea behind this guy is to outspeed just about everything it can, Fake Out, Knock Off, and U-Turn into something else, heal w/ Regenerator, and do it again later. Nothing is Immune to Knock Off and U-Turn, so there's no easy way out, and Ghosts are Immune to Fake Out but weak to Knock Off, so if they try a "smart" switch, you can troll them pretty well.
Also, if you want to put Left Overs on something else, you could try Assault Vest for some more bulk (Take Drain Punch or maybe HJKick), or a consumable item like a Berry or a Red Card (For multiple Knock Offs in a row) and grab Acrobatics*, or maybe even put some safety goggles on him (For anti-weather/spore).
This would go well on a team that has some good defensive pivot switches, and would like a Rapid Spin. Plus, the only true threat to this guy would be Megas (don't drop items) and Paralysis, as it would make him very difficult/impossible to use. The only downside, is after the first Knock Off combo, they know what to look for, and will be ready for it the next time, but any good player could use this to their advantage.
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I find this is a great filler move for almost anything that gets it. Its especially great for assault vest users who want to provide some utility to the team. As a for instance, I really really like assault vest donphan with rapid spin and knock off. You can punish ghost switchins (never gets old removing Trevenant's sitrus berry) or whatever is coming in to avoid Earthquake. With wish support, you have an all around bulky mon with some decent offense for whatever you pair with earthquake.
Yeah, Donphan can pull off Knock Off pretty well.
I used my Donphans with Seed Bomb in the past generation. In order to replace it for the time being, I taught them Knock Off, and I need to say it's awesome. Donphan was a good spinner as of 5th gen, but this move makes him a lot better (I expect a lot of spinners using it).
Donphy's Attack can't be overlooked, it can do a lot of damage to any spinblocker that comes, if not 1HKOs it. The item removal it's awesome against any bulky water types relying of leftovers that usually comes at Don and pretty much any pokemon that enjoy Trick (which are usually Psychic or Ghost types) also dislikes it.
Ttar not only gains a move that has the first hit stronger than Crunch, but also screw with any wall relying on lefties to nullify the sandstorm damage.
It's now a very good move that can disrupt a lot of sets (Trickers, Choice users, Leftovers/Black Sludge, Assault Vest, Weakness Policy).
I love it.
It's pretty annoying to switch out knowing whatever you switch into will have their item removed. It's especially annoying when I'm not expecting it and I go to Porygon2. I usually head out to my Florges when I'm expecting it, though.
Ferrothorn could run this in order to act as poisonous bait for Espeon and Xatu or to weaken powerful attackers that may switch in.
Ferrothorn could run this in order to act as poisonous bait for Espeon and Xatu or to weaken powerful attackers that may switch in.
The problem with the move is that it gets weaker after the first hit, but at the same time, your foe is weaker without their item. I can almost see Acrobatics and consumeable items making a bit of a rise because of this buff. It's almost too bad they removed all the [Type] Gems.
The only REAL downside is Mega Stones.
The only REAL downside is Mega Stones.
I'm planning on running a Scarf shiny Krookodile I RNG'd but as it isn't bred it does not have pursuit. Therefore I'm looking for a slightly varied moveset but I'm apprehensive about this move; it's absolutely amazing utility and Krookodile encourages switches but the weakened second hit makes me wonder if it can be considered reliable.
Currently I'm thinking:
Earthquake
Knock Off
Stone Edge
But I don't know for the last slot. Is Crunch a waste with Knock Off available or will it still see good use? The other options I'm considering are Foul Play (for +2 Mega Kang mainly but also useful against boosted Mega Chomp and other SD users) or Superpower, as Hydreigon has a field day with the current set.
Just wanted to get some thoughts from other experienced competitive players.
Currently I'm thinking:
Earthquake
Knock Off
Stone Edge
But I don't know for the last slot. Is Crunch a waste with Knock Off available or will it still see good use? The other options I'm considering are Foul Play (for +2 Mega Kang mainly but also useful against boosted Mega Chomp and other SD users) or Superpower, as Hydreigon has a field day with the current set.
Just wanted to get some thoughts from other experienced competitive players.
I think you should run crunch since you don't have anything better to run in this slot.
There is no reason to run Knock Off and Crunch.
One of the main appeals of Knock Off is that it does more damage than 2 Crunches factoring the BP drop after the item has been removed.
97+65 BP = 162 BP, which is better than 80*2.
With frail pokemon such as Krookodile you'll probably never get to use Crunch 3 times in a row, so Knock Off is better in most realistic scenarios, unless you get a lucky def drop.
One of the main appeals of Knock Off is that it does more damage than 2 Crunches factoring the BP drop after the item has been removed.
97+65 BP = 162 BP, which is better than 80*2.
With frail pokemon such as Krookodile you'll probably never get to use Crunch 3 times in a row, so Knock Off is better in most realistic scenarios, unless you get a lucky def drop.
I agree with this. With the power increase giving it offensive presence, it's now basically a free "Make your opponent rethink their strategy very carefully" button. The amount of strategic pressure this puts on the opponent cannot be understated, Assault Vest users suddenly find themselves in KO range, scarfers get a taste of their own medicine when they find themselves outsped by would-be prey, and lovers of the Life Orb and Specs/Band suddenly can't push through and get the job done.
Also mega absol, who not only has justified but also can megaevolve to gain magic bounce and bounce back support moves from users like tentacruel or either deoxys.
A note: If you use knock off vs Ferrothorn and Iron Barbs kills you, Ferrothorn keeps its Leftovers (tested In-Game)
Same as when you get killed by Iron Barbs/Rough Skin or Rocky Helmet when trying to Rapid Spin on Ferro/Chomp: the move hits, but the spin effect only happens if you survive.
Knocking Off a Ferro/Chomp with a Rocky Helmet will do 28% to yourself, so it's worth bearing that in mind.
I've been running this on Landorus-T lately who I feel is a great user, considering Intimidate forces switches and with naturally high attack, he pressures a lot of Pokemon.
I threw Knock Off on my Gliscor since I can never figure out what to do with its 4th moveslot and I'm really digging it. It pairs really well with ToxiStalling since it removes Lefties that can slow the process, it completely neuters Choice users and it screws with Rocky Helmet Ferro/Chomp/Skarm that would otherwise cripple my MKang.
It's definitely worth it over Night Slash on Bisharp. In fact, pretty much anything that relied on Night Slash for its primary Dark-type STAB/coverage (Bisharp, Weavile, Absol, etc.) will love using Knock Off if it can learn the move. As long as the opponent still has an item, Knock Off gets a 50% power boost, which essentially gives it 97.5 BP on the first hit. After than first hit, Knock Off is still only 5 BP less than Night Slash, and the ability to remove your opponent's item is priceless. Even if the user in question has the more powerful Crunch (Drapion and Krookodile, for example), Knock Off might still deserve that spot instead. Two Knock Offs is actually a little more powerful than two Crunches (162.5 BP vs 160 BP), and removing the opponent's item is just too good to pass up.
i am a huge fan of knock off bisharp. its sheer power.
252+ Atk Life Orb Bisharp Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Aegislash-Shield -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
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