was user im boon in fact a boon in that game?
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League of Legends: Let's Talk About uhhh??
- Thread starter Thorns
- Start date
Sums up ranked queue pretty nicely.
As support: I really like the Flask start into rush Sightstone (or pick up Ruby or something else if you need stats -- I like going double gp10, but it just makes you so damn squishy I don't think you can do it unless you're quite ahead, even though you can easily pick them both up + Sightstone before lane ends). Flask is fantastic sustain and can probably actually keep you in lane until you go back to buy Sightstone. If I don't have enough when I go back I pick up something else. I don't like Faerie + Bead because it doesn't give you much ward space, so if I didn't want to do that or thought I'd be backing early, Faerie + wards is still fine (I like Faerie + 3 wards + 3 pots and Faerie + 4 wards + 1 pot, depending on the situation). I really like having Flask as support though and I love being able to outsustain the enemy support early with more mana and HP available than them. After all, in the early levels I just want to set the tone for the lane if I can't get kills, and being able to harass more safely than them is a good way to create an initial advantage. Harassing in a way where you don't take damage is important too, but having the extra mana + the ability to trade with them then get rid of the damage while they're stuck with it + them knowing you can outsustain them are all huge bonuses.
I've been too busy doing other things to play much since the start of S3, but I did try all those starts and greatly preferred Flask. I see Krepo always starting Faerie Charm (and usually then into Ruby Crystal) though. I haven't been watching any of the other supports streaming.
ETA:
{ 02:53:40 AM } <LonelyNess> Jirachi
{ 02:53:48 AM } <LonelyNess> flask / sightstone / philo
{ 02:53:49 AM } <LonelyNess> isl ike
{ 02:53:51 AM } <LonelyNess> 3 gp10's
{ 02:53:52 AM } <LonelyNess> lol
{ 03:00:08 AM } <&Jirachi> yea you don't suffer for it LN
{ 03:00:14 AM } <&Jirachi> it was more just a comment in general
i start flask toplane with a ward, sometimes mid when the early pressure is high on both sides
ive watched aphro support, nhat support, and krepo support, and they go mastery items + faerie (maybe rejuv sometimes) wards/pots, very consistently the same. its a strong start for sure, flask isnt bad but you delay your build slightly and as support not always fantastic to throw gold away that isnt guaranteed
ive watched aphro support, nhat support, and krepo support, and they go mastery items + faerie (maybe rejuv sometimes) wards/pots, very consistently the same. its a strong start for sure, flask isnt bad but you delay your build slightly and as support not always fantastic to throw gold away that isnt guaranteed
Flask is pretty universally considered one of the best new items. Great item to start with in top and mid lane (assuming your champion uses mana) and supports can also start with it. If you get it on support you don't even need to get philo stone as you will have plenty of regen and you get absurd amounts of gold from your sightstone anyway (virtual 8 gp/10 assuming your wards are not destroyed, plus you can move them aaaaaaaa its so broken). Speaking of which pretty much every jungler should be getting sightstone along with the support.
i go flask into sightstone pretty much every time. and i feel like theres just no better start than flask four wards. four wards is enough to hold you until you can get sightstone since with ghost ward you no longer have to expend a green ward to push someone out of the side bushes. even though some pros have been saying dont get philo + flask because its too much regen and you need other stats, i still do it in quite a bit of my games and never really felt it was a bad move. a lot of it probably has to do with the level i am play at compared to them though, simply, if my trades are not as efficient ill need more regen. but in the end i always seem to end up selling my philo later and it makes me feel like its a waste becuase i probably didnt get that much of a return on gold, whereas if i had bought kages i would be much better off mid-late since i almost always get shard. boots, ruby sight, pink wards, mikaels, shard, locket/aegis just seems to be the best overall build on almost any support and i just dont care to get revelry anymore.
as for flask in other lanes you can go like 0/16/14 cloth + flask top lane if you're in a losing match up or against like purple side riven who might try to double golems level 2 kill you. people have been going flask + hella potions ryze and just farming until tear + boots. i think the biggest draw to that start is it lets you farm with q and shrug off all harass with your regen and you'll still always have mana for a snare. some ad players have been starting flask against really strong lane champs like cait or mf.
as for flask in other lanes you can go like 0/16/14 cloth + flask top lane if you're in a losing match up or against like purple side riven who might try to double golems level 2 kill you. people have been going flask + hella potions ryze and just farming until tear + boots. i think the biggest draw to that start is it lets you farm with q and shrug off all harass with your regen and you'll still always have mana for a snare. some ad players have been starting flask against really strong lane champs like cait or mf.
Yeah, Sightstone's move ward thing is so ridiculous. I don't like Philo as much anymore, mostly just because of what it builds into and because it gives 1 more gp/10 than Kage's, but you're hardly starved for gold anymore. I do like Shurelya's active a lot though and value it very highly, and more sustain isn't necessarily a bad thing and I don't think it's overkill, since you get HP from Sightstone. There are only a few situations in which I'd want to rush Twin Shadows and never Shard of True Ice, whereas that Philosopher's Stone is gonna sit around into an almost definite Shurelya's. (Aegis, Mikael's, and Shurelya's are my favourite current support items. I underestimated Twin Shadows because I hadn't seen just how damn fast the wraiths go. It's pretty cool in a lot of situations now, not universal like Aegis/Shurelya's/Mikael's though. New Locket is good too.)
I like how support items are a lot more situational now (and in general, but as a support player), although I think there is still a definite best start. Sightstone is absolutely nuts, PLS DONT NERF THO.
Depending on the support I play I've started Flask/Wards or Wards + 1 or 2 pots (I go 3 and pots if I know the enemy botlane is a heavy af poke lane and I'm not Sona), Fae + Rejuv/Ward(s) and Fae + Wards.
Sometimes I finish my Philo first if I'm someone who spams mana and I have wards left over from first buy, recently I've rushed Sightstone if I back with 700.
If we got some kills before I backed, and I know a key chokepoint where I have seen them ward, I'll pick up Sightstone and a Pink and Pink that area (or if they just pinked and I saw it go down) for more vision.
I go Sightstone/Philo/Kage's on anyone Kage's is good on (Janna, Zyra, Lux, even Nami and Lulu) because I like all of their upgrades. My build is still S/P/K into Aegis then either get my Kage's upgrade, Ruby, or if I know we need Shur because they have a lot of chase/catch potential I get Shur to speed everyone away.
Only thing I rush ever is Aegis after my Sightstone and gold items.
I've started picking up boots 2 on the slower supports earlier than I did before if laning ends kinda early and I know I'll just get run down if I didn't hit boots 2 MS - I had to go Alacrity upgrade on Lulu straight up one time because the enemy team had like all gap closers and slows so if their bruisers outran me I was dead. They had Lee Sin and some other dick move permaslowers.
Also Max W Janna never needs to buy Boots 1 she has 409 MS and good poke in lane - if they don't have Sona/Soraka her poke is painful h4h4h4 s0 f4st.
Sometimes I finish my Philo first if I'm someone who spams mana and I have wards left over from first buy, recently I've rushed Sightstone if I back with 700.
If we got some kills before I backed, and I know a key chokepoint where I have seen them ward, I'll pick up Sightstone and a Pink and Pink that area (or if they just pinked and I saw it go down) for more vision.
I go Sightstone/Philo/Kage's on anyone Kage's is good on (Janna, Zyra, Lux, even Nami and Lulu) because I like all of their upgrades. My build is still S/P/K into Aegis then either get my Kage's upgrade, Ruby, or if I know we need Shur because they have a lot of chase/catch potential I get Shur to speed everyone away.
Only thing I rush ever is Aegis after my Sightstone and gold items.
I've started picking up boots 2 on the slower supports earlier than I did before if laning ends kinda early and I know I'll just get run down if I didn't hit boots 2 MS - I had to go Alacrity upgrade on Lulu straight up one time because the enemy team had like all gap closers and slows so if their bruisers outran me I was dead. They had Lee Sin and some other dick move permaslowers.
Also Max W Janna never needs to buy Boots 1 she has 409 MS and good poke in lane - if they don't have Sona/Soraka her poke is painful h4h4h4 s0 f4st.
Is that sarcasm Minwu?
Diana
Crescent Strike
Base damage reduced to 60/95/130/165/200 from 70/110/150/190/230
Pale Cascade
Orb detonation damage radius reduced
Adjusted orb hit box to better match the visual effect
Moonfall
Maximum pull distance reduced
Lunar Rush
Cast range reduced to 750 from 900
(Max range on Q is 825)
She got Eve'd
Diana
Crescent Strike
Base damage reduced to 60/95/130/165/200 from 70/110/150/190/230
Pale Cascade
Orb detonation damage radius reduced
Adjusted orb hit box to better match the visual effect
Moonfall
Maximum pull distance reduced
Lunar Rush
Cast range reduced to 750 from 900
(Max range on Q is 825)
She got Eve'd
No she didn't. You're overreacting.
i c no problem
next two major events are going to be IEM Cologne (starts tomorrow) and IEM Katowice (NA qualifiers begin on the 18th)
cologne is going to see some really interesting stuff. Eclypsia and Curse eu both disbanded really recently and mMillenium basically mixed and matched their rosters and has a new team that looks REALLY scary, despite their lack of practice. they got angush and creaton from crs eu and tabzz/imsofresh/haydal from eclypsia.
Fnatic is also in group A and still has rekkles on AD carry, so they're definitely one of the favorites for the tournament.
there's also ex-mousesports, which is the former roster of mousesports (they bought The Mighty Midgets' roster recently and the old members left). they have experience and big names like dedrayon and MoMa (who you might remember from season one).
the last team in group A is SK Telecom 1, formerly Eat Sleep Game, which was the team that Reapered from azubu blaze put together. they swept through the korean regionals and are definitely a powerful team.
the four other teams in group B are ALTERNATE, who notably have 3k ELO player forellenlord; MeetYourMakers, who are regarded as one of the top polish teams in the world; CLG.eu, who need no introduction; and CJ Entus, who took second place at the korean regionals behind reapered's team.
in other competitive news, CLG has been using Nhat Nguyen as a sub quite a lot recently in their scrims, and if CLG Nhat Nguyen becomes a thing then i'm going to be extremely happy
cologne is going to see some really interesting stuff. Eclypsia and Curse eu both disbanded really recently and mMillenium basically mixed and matched their rosters and has a new team that looks REALLY scary, despite their lack of practice. they got angush and creaton from crs eu and tabzz/imsofresh/haydal from eclypsia.
Fnatic is also in group A and still has rekkles on AD carry, so they're definitely one of the favorites for the tournament.
there's also ex-mousesports, which is the former roster of mousesports (they bought The Mighty Midgets' roster recently and the old members left). they have experience and big names like dedrayon and MoMa (who you might remember from season one).
the last team in group A is SK Telecom 1, formerly Eat Sleep Game, which was the team that Reapered from azubu blaze put together. they swept through the korean regionals and are definitely a powerful team.
the four other teams in group B are ALTERNATE, who notably have 3k ELO player forellenlord; MeetYourMakers, who are regarded as one of the top polish teams in the world; CLG.eu, who need no introduction; and CJ Entus, who took second place at the korean regionals behind reapered's team.
in other competitive news, CLG has been using Nhat Nguyen as a sub quite a lot recently in their scrims, and if CLG Nhat Nguyen becomes a thing then i'm going to be extremely happy
seeing as someone brought up the biscuiteer tree briefly, i thought it would be interesting to discuss support masteries. Heres what i use for the squishy, ranged support
i wasnt impressed with the biscuit + 60 sec ward at first but after thinking about it, it seems like a decent early game pick if you're laning with a draven or w/e, to complement their strengths. Artificier seems really good though considering 15% is huge and more or less every support item bar aegis has an active. Seems like more of a pick your poison thing rather than a clear best option.
Taric page
in theory, grabbing a ton of ms to get stuns off seems solid but not sure how well the tier1 ms thing will work.
Also this is probably pretty obv but considering getting twin shadows on nami to make sure her shit connects.
i wasnt impressed with the biscuit + 60 sec ward at first but after thinking about it, it seems like a decent early game pick if you're laning with a draven or w/e, to complement their strengths. Artificier seems really good though considering 15% is huge and more or less every support item bar aegis has an active. Seems like more of a pick your poison thing rather than a clear best option.
Taric page
in theory, grabbing a ton of ms to get stuns off seems solid but not sure how well the tier1 ms thing will work.
the defensive tree is super strong in particular and i think a lot of supports are running some kind of 0/13/17 page, which is enough to invest into pickpocket in utility and block in defense. running block/unyielding will stop a ton of damage from enemy poke for very little mastery investment. on the downside you're losing improved exhaust and 3% movespeed from utility but oh well
on a side note i have yet to see an AD carry take barrier
on a side note i have yet to see an AD carry take barrier
Riot is not very good at nerfing. Lower damage on Q, make shield less potent. Bam. Diana is no longer overwhelming but is still quite awesome.
Instead they do stupid stuff like make her R have less range than her Q. Okay? So if I land a full-ranged Q, I can no longer Lunar Rush to my target. Way too big of a nerf.
Instead they do stupid stuff like make her R have less range than her Q. Okay? So if I land a full-ranged Q, I can no longer Lunar Rush to my target. Way too big of a nerf.
i assume this is referring to ranged supports, yes?
yep, my friend who mains support finds that it's not that worthwhile to take pickpocket on melee supports since their poking ability is limited at best early on - i mean maybe if you're playing gangplank, but that's it. for melee supports he's investing more heavily into defense and only putting enough into utility to get the bonus starting gold (so more like a 1/15/14 split)
Scout is trash, don't get it. Biscuiteer is decent on supports because if you damage their AD carry for something that costs you 1 mastery point, you've done your job. Might as well get the ward also and go -1 in the CDR mastery because 4% and 6% CDR isn't much difference.