Little things you like about Pokémon

Pikachu315111

Ranting & Raving!
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Eevee Heroes alt arts(and the not eevees);
Flareon: I wonder how many people in the Pokemon world own a Fire-type for this or similar purposes (lighting a chimney, boiling a pot of water).
Jolteon: So are they implying Jolteon is able to run fast enough it can stick to building windows like Spider-Man?
Espeon: Is Espeon just tidying up or is it actually reading the books (which would be impressive as it means it can read a human language).
Umbreon: "TONIGHT this city BELONGS to US! It'll be the ones who LOOKED DOWN at us who will be the LEFT in the DARK!"
Leafeon: Leafeon couldn't figure out why around Autumn it was always the first to be found in hide-and-seek.
Sylveon: No, Sylveon's "magic cupcakes" aren't made with weed, gosh... it's made with fairy dust which is a WAY stronger hallucinogenic.
VMAX-Espeon: Alright, it's official, the Eevee family are felines: only a cat would find that sleeping position comfortable.
VMAX-Umbreon: It's cute now, but it's not going to be cute when it falls and crushes the buildings and people underneath it. And after it does it's going to act like it planned on doing that.
VMAX-Leafeon: The farmers would like to stop it from playing around with the hay bales... but then they'd become the plaything.
VMAX-Glaceon: Fun & games on the surface, freezing to death for all the trapped marine Pokemon below.
VMAX-Sylveon: If it stands still long enough people will think its just a slide and want to climb on it... and that's when it'll start flinging around its ribbons.
VMAX-Gengar: "Okay, fun's over, time for everyone to go to HELL"
VMAX-Inteleon: Stay Low, Move Fast, Kill First, Die Last, One Shot, One Kill, No Luck, Pure Skill.
 
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Deleted User 465389

Banned deucer.
The fabled garbodor appreciation post
By Xaviere;​
1622586522986.png


When Guardians Rising was released, everyone was hoping to pull a tapu lele.(which’ll be the focus of another essay, this never ends grumble) However, players noticed a garbordor card that punished reckless items, and this would be a game changer.

Part 1; The Stats: 120 hp was good for a basic, and it would hit weakness on the eventual buzzwole gx, and necrozma gx(and also espeon gx). Being a basic it was also worth only one prize, which was good with how good it’s first attack was. 3 retreat cost was annoying, but you had switching cards to deal with that.


Part 2; Acid Spray: this attack sucks don’t use it (sorry temple of ferro cult in the battle facility threads)

Part 3; The Actually Good Attack: At the time before garbodor, most decks relied on lots of items. This punished your opponent if they used a lot of items, and it only cost a single energy for this attack. Decks had to change how they used items, and not be as turbo as they were before. Assuming your opponent had 8 items in the discard, which was likely at the time, you would already be doing 160 damage for a single energy, which was crazy efficient.

(ok essays over standing ovation time~)
 
Haven't posted in a while, so I thought I'd share on one thing I like: The Eternamax Eternatus fight and cutscenes. I have played through all gens, but that stands out to me as one of the coolest moments in Pokémon.

It's a max raid battle in which you team up with the main rival and both box legends to take on an uncatchable form of the third legend. I absolutely loved it, despite the game not being as good in other parts.
 
So one of the things I really liked about Platinum was this optional conversation you can find with Cynthia, I believe in the post-game, in front of the mural if you go back to it. She talks about how Dialga & Palkia were very clearly strong Pokemon, with some power of time/space, but were not literal gods, but instead Pokemon of such Power that they were worshipped as gods. The space/time myth is just that: a creation myth fostered by the sinnoh ancestors.

And to that extent you could probably apply it to certain other "godly" legends and turns out...

Explicitly yes. This even applied to the original RS's Kyogre & Groudon. This is from a Q&A from the RS OST (more translations earlier in the thread), by the way.


I dunno I just find stuff like this really fun. It's just a fun spin on these ridiculous Pokemon and nice flavor to the world.
 
So one of the things I really liked about Platinum was this optional conversation you can find with Cynthia, I believe in the post-game, in front of the mural if you go back to it. She talks about how Dialga & Palkia were very clearly strong Pokemon, with some power of time/space, but were not literal gods, but instead Pokemon of such Power that they were worshipped as gods. The space/time myth is just that: a creation myth fostered by the sinnoh ancestors.

And to that extent you could probably apply it to certain other "godly" legends and turns out...

Explicitly yes. This even applied to the original RS's Kyogre & Groudon. This is from a Q&A from the RS OST (more translations earlier in the thread), by the way.


I dunno I just find stuff like this really fun. It's just a fun spin on these ridiculous Pokemon and nice flavor to the world.
Eh, they might as well be actual gods. This is a JRPG. Gods exist to take "is your character the strongest?" to its full conclusion.
 
The concept of "God" is very loose in Pokemon universe.

In the end it started with Mew who apparently was the progenitor of all pokemon, and then we know how messy the Pokemon timeline is.

Arceus is "meant" to be the creator of the universe, until in a future generation they decide that they wanted something else.
(Or maybe in Arceus Legends we actually get the lore that states whatever the heck he is)
 
I mean to me it seems way easier to just go: Arceus is a genuinely all mighty pokemon (we literally have explicit demonstration of its ability to create life from seemingly nothing, that's pretty big) but also, at the end of the day, is "just" a pokemon. It was seen and revered for its power and made the basis of the Sinnoh creation myth.

Mew being the ancestor of Pokemon is an in-universe scientific theory based on its ability to learn any move (& transform, i presume).

But I assume that in-universe they'll never just out & out say that no they really ARE these things and also no they really AREN'T (even Cynthia hedges her talk in "they might have" or "they could have..." and "seeing these powers, they...." conditionals). Legends Arceus will likely play up its mythological aspect, and show it doing some crazy things, but will probably not literally show it canonically create the universe you know?
 

Pikachu315111

Ranting & Raving!
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Also, "Trashalance" is a top-tier move name. Man, TCG can get creative with those.
Yeah, you can spend a whole day reading through them and imagining what they'd be like if they were in the games.

And to that extent you could probably apply it to certain other "godly" legends and turns out...
Explicitly yes. This even applied to the original RS's Kyogre & Groudon. This is from a Q&A from the RS OST (more translations earlier in the thread), by the way.
WAIT! This makes no sense.

"The truth is, they had never fought. The real star of the show was continental drift, and people made the two creatures to explain why it happened and the story was passed down."

So... what are Groudon and Kyogre then? Just some random Legendary Pokemon that was found which just so happened to have powers matching that of "Groudon" & "Kyogre"? And it also just so happens that the Orbs which were used to "Groudon" and "Kyogre" work in a similar way to these two Legendary Pokemon? And that, despite never having fought each other, once they break loose of the villain team's control they for some reason both went to the same place and started fighting with one another like "Groudon" and "Kyogre" did? AND then there's this third Legendary which just so happens to fit the description of "Rayquaza" which can also be summoned like it to also go to the same spot and just so happen to have the same ability to cause these two Pokemon from fighting?

NO. TAUROS MULCH! Like, if you want to say the Hoenn region actually formed on its own and THAT's the part of the legend the ancient Hoenn people made up, fine, makes sense. They saw these two powerful Pokemon of land and sea and assumed a creation myth. But, as I said, they probably made-up that part because they actually saw Groudon & Kyogre fighting and Rayquaza coming down to stop them. That's not myth, that's the true event which became basis to the myth.

Now, whether they have the power to actually flood or dry out the world... I'm at two thoughts on that:

  • Of course not. Flood/Dry out Hoenn or any other region they come neat? Sure, they're pretty much a walking apocalypse at full power. But the whole world, at the same time, from a single point where they stand? Only way I can see that is if the reason they're fighting it because one wants to kill the other so it can absorb their power, resulting it to change into a bigger eldritch horror, and slowly start spreading their weather condition across the planet; would take years for them to accomplish their goal.
  • But, at least in-game, they're as powerful as Dialga and Palkia. We'll get to why Cynthia said in a second, but there's no denying that in Gen IV the Timespace Duo were indeed warping spacetime and probably cosmic reset the world. How could we say "oh yeah those two are legit" but not Groudon and Palkia?

Now, addressing what Cynthia said. You know what, she's right. They're not gods... but that doesn't mean they don't have a power of a god. What is a god but an embodiment of a natural force? We say the Legendaries, mainly the mascots, are embodiment of a natural force but they're more like avatars than the actual force incarnate. That's my personal theory. They were created by their natural force, use the power of their force, and act on behalf of their force, BUT they are not their force (for DC fans think of Swamp Thing's relation to The Green). Hence why a normal human can contain and control them, they're capturing & controlling the creature and not necessarily the natural force. In fact, once the Legendary has been captured in a Poke Ball, it seems like most of their connection to their force is (temporarily) severed as not to give the human control of it.

Arceus is the only one who I would say is the closest we have to a "god". Arceus isn't an avatar to a natural force, Arceus is an avatar to what Arceus actually is, a celestial being who's mere existence we cannot comprehend so creates an avatar to puppet to comminicate with us 3-dimensional mortals. And, going back to the start, it likely didn't specifically create the Pokemon World and the landforms throughout it and the life on it. All that formed on its own, Actual Arceus only taking an interest when the formation has been done and the early lifeforms started emerging; a playground for it to create.
 
Honestly assuming it wasn't just a miswording on helix chamber's part (which is possible, you know how translation can be even in the best of times), i kind of wonder if the intent might be one of those "belief made real" type things. You know,that thing you see in pop culture (I feel like this topic's come up here before and it's not really a thing in any relgion, but hey! it's a fun concept in stories) time to time: gods are made real because the shared belief of people made them.
Just some off the top of my head: Gunnerkrigg Court, Shin Megami Tensei (& its spin offs), Touhou, etc. Plenty more stuff relating to that out there.

Well that's probably better suited for the conspiracy thread, especially since they never actually touch on that subject anywhere.
 

Pikachu315111

Ranting & Raving!
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Honestly assuming it wasn't just a miswording on helix chamber's part (which is possible, you know how translation can be even in the best of times), i kind of wonder if the intent might be one of those "belief made real" type things. You know,that thing you see in pop culture (I feel like this topic's come up here before and it's not really a thing in any relgion, but hey! it's a fun concept in stories) time to time: gods are made real because the shared belief of people made them.
Just some off the top of my head: Gunnerkrigg Court, Shin Megami Tensei (& its spin offs), Touhou, etc. Plenty more stuff relating to that out there.

Well that's probably better suited for the conspiracy thread, especially since they never actually touch on that subject anywhere.
In English the closest word we have is "materialization". However some other cultures have closer words. In Buddhism there is the "tulpa" which has been translated as "thoughtform" in English. The occult concept of "egregore" is a semi-close match; it involves a group of people believing something into existence though it's specifically says it's non-physical (like a spirit or an angel).

BTW, my suggestion of ancient people basing mythology of a real life event also has a word: "euhemerism".
 
I always preferred the idea of the cover legendaries and Arceus just being individuals of a powerful & rare (endangered?) species around which some local legends and myths arose. Seems simpler than invoking a multiverse just to explain there being more than one of each. :p

(same goes for sublegends and mythicals in general, but those seem slightly less likely to spark debates about uniqueness)
 

Bull Of Heaven

99 Pounders / 4'3" Feet
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Yeah, I don't really know how I feel about it, but it seems the idea here is that they do have some power over sea/land/time/space/whatever, but the ancient stories about them are exaggerated. Which isn't a terribly ridiculous idea. I knew the Dialga/Palkia thing already, but the Kyogre/Groudon one is new to me, so that's kind of neat.

Mew being the ancestor of Pokemon is an in-universe scientific theory based on its ability to learn any move (& transform, i presume).
Between the "common genetic ancestor" thing, Mewtwo being made from a fossil, "ancient Mew" depictions in early franchise media, and the rumours that Mew was an extremely late addition to the gen 1 games, my personal speculation is that Game Freak originally intended Mew to be extinct.
 

ScraftyIsTheBest

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So... what are Groudon and Kyogre then? Just some random Legendary Pokemon that was found which just so happened to have powers matching that of "Groudon" & "Kyogre"? And it also just so happens that the Orbs which were used to "Groudon" and "Kyogre" work in a similar way to these two Legendary Pokemon? And that, despite never having fought each other, once they break loose of the villain team's control they for some reason both went to the same place and started fighting with one another like "Groudon" and "Kyogre" did? AND then there's this third Legendary which just so happens to fit the description of "Rayquaza" which can also be summoned like it to also go to the same spot and just so happen to have the same ability to cause these two Pokemon from fighting?
I think you might have it a bit reversed. Groudon and Kyogre were likely discovered first, and so were the orbs associated with them, before any myths were created about them. The likely situation is that the people of ancient Hoenn discovered these two super powerful, extraordinary Pokemon who have the power to cause droughts or heavy downpours as well as two powerful orbs that are used to awaken or control their power, and the ancient people of Hoenn were in complete awe of how extraordinarily powerful they truly were, likely having witnessed said power at some point as well. In such awe and admiration of how truly powerful they were, the people created myths and legends about these two powerful Pokemon and attributed it to them in such reverence of their awesome power and essentially began to see them as deities, even naming them as "creators" of the Hoenn region and creating a story about them in doing so. The same likely goes with Rayquaza too: they discovered its existence at one point, and also further attributed some stories to it in reverence at witnessing such extraordinary appearance and power that Rayquaza has. As time passed, the myths and legends the ancient people of Hoenn created about these super powerful Pokemon were passed down over time, possibly being changed somewhat over different retellings of said myths over the eras.

It's not so much that Groudon and Kyogre's myths were created first in other words: it's that the actual Pokemon themselves were at one point discovered, if not outright seen by ancient people and people witnessed these ultra powerful Pokemon and gave them stories and myths because they had so much reverence and awe in beholding just how powerful they were. Power in the eyes of the beholder, and the beholder creates a story to revere and possibly emphasize just how strong these extraordinary Pokemon really are.

It's like how Dialga, Palkia, and Giratina likely do have powers over time, space, and antimatter, but the myths exaggerate them greatly and ancient Sinnohan folk created stories about them (and the Lake Trio+Arceus) after they beheld such awesome power from these Pokemon. Giratina likewise definitely has exaggerated myths, like how some consider it "banished" and "exiled" and attribute it to being an evil being, but its portrayal in Platinum shows that it is, in truth, a chaotic neutral being that simply lives in a world where the laws of matter and physics are reversed, and its existence vital in that it sustains the real Pokemon world, but it's not truly malevolent, and it's very protective of its home.

Many other legendaries such as Lugia/Ho-Oh, Raikou/Entei/Suicune, Reshiram/Zekrom/Kyurem, and Xerneas/Yveltal/Zygarde likely also have this nature: rare, extraordinary Pokemon that have unique and extraordinary power, but any stories associated with them are very much exaggerated or myth. Notably, the latter group with Xerneas, Yveltal, and Zygarde are pretty much the most mysterious group of "major legendaries" and not much is really said about them, really emphasizing that they are elusive and magnificent, and it's likely in that case that those three were the most elusive even to people of ancient times.

Essentially, many of these legendaries have extraordinary powers, but the stories about them are "created" by people of ancient times who beheld their power with their own eyes, but created stories because they revered these Pokemon's awesome power so much.

That's sort of the idea, I think.
 
I wouldn't take developer interviews at face value when it comes to lore, Pokémon's worldbuilding has always been inconsistent at best.

My take on Arceus lore is that it actually did create the universe, but it isn't omnipotent and/or invincible. Or maybe it just created the Pokémon planet and not the whole universe? At the very least, the Sinjoh Ruins event shows that Arceus can create reality-warping dragons, so there is evidence that it has great creator powers. It might just be that it triggered the Big Bang and didn't do much afterwards.
 

I think most of us were on the right interpretation before, but a slightly clearer translation that's in line with the cynthia conversation

Also learned about the word "diastrophism" (which is the actual term for plate shifting) and the replies showed a fun big bang diagram in lets go


Related but it's fun when the games have little museums like this. Everyone remembers the cool skeleton kabutops/aerodactyl and the columbia shuttle (retconned to just being a shuttle, in general, in subsequent games) but imo Alola's power plant in particular is my favorite.
 
Related but it's fun when the games have little museums like this. Everyone remembers the cool skeleton kabutops/aerodactyl and the columbia shuttle (retconned to just being a shuttle, in general, in subsequent games) but imo Alola's power plant in particular is my favorite.
Agreed. Museums are just super comfy places in general, so having a little virtual museum to walk around whenever you want in is great.
 

The Mind Electric

Calming if you look at it right.
There is no one that worships or even acknowledges Arceus as far as we know.
That's something that interests me personally. If Arceus is the closest thing Pokémon have to a supreme being (that we know of), why does almost nobody seem to know about it? The closest thing we have to someone acknowledging its existence is Cynthia bringing up the possibility that the cave painting might depict the Spear Pillar trio surrounding something rather than the Lake Pokémon surrounding Dialga/Palkia, and even that is guessing at the intentions of an ancient civilization. My best guess is that it set the world in motion either by causing the Big Bang or by creating the first Pokémon and then went off to chill out away from civilization forever, but if that's the case then what's up with that event at Spear Pillar? Legends will probably answer this, but it's a weird little detail to think about in the meantime.

On the topic of museums, the one in Unova is my personal favorite because it both provides fossil restoration and is actually important to the plot. The Dark/Light Stone being introduced as "just an ordinary stone" is a neat little story element since you'll probably forget about it until it becomes relevant in the last act of the story, just like the characters themselves.
 
if Arceus is a god to end all gods and can create time wrapping dragons, does it choose to stay in your pokéball when you catch it. Does it go "well this kid kinda off the shits this might be fun."
 

The Mind Electric

Calming if you look at it right.
if Arceus is a god to end all gods and can create time wrapping dragons, does it choose to stay in your pokéball when you catch it. Does it go "well this kid kinda off the shits this might be fun."
I think of Pokémon catching as a way of proving to the Pokémon you're trying to catch that you are worthy of their companionship. You make this easier by weakening them because doing that demonstrates your ability as a Pokémon trainer, and legendary Pokémon are harder to catch because they really want to test your worthiness before they're willing to take orders from you. When Arceus gets in the ball, it's basically saying that you're so extraordinary as a trainer that even the supreme being has deemed you worthy.
 
I think of Pokémon catching as a way of proving to the Pokémon you're trying to catch that you are worthy of their companionship. You make this easier by weakening them because doing that demonstrates your ability as a Pokémon trainer, and legendary Pokémon are harder to catch because they really want to test your worthiness before they're willing to take orders from you. When Arceus gets in the ball, it's basically saying that you're so extraordinary as a trainer that even the supreme being has deemed you worthy.
That's a good explanation, though I feel like they should have done the let's go way (faint then catch) to signify the difference between catching a normal pokemon (it's a matter of struggle since its just a wild animal) vs a legendary (having to prove yourself)
 

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