Metagame Metagame Discussion Thread

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SJCrew

Believer, going on a journey...
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Use Tapu Bulu. It hits like three trucks, can outpace Zygarde's boosts with SD, and has plenty of longevity due to its natural bulk and ability. Zygarde is complete fodder unless it starts running Sludge Wave. It also counters Tapu Koko for good measure, so that's two things you no longer have to worry about in one veritable offensive threat.
 
What are people using to check this monstrosity anyway? Mostly talking about the max SpDef investment Coil variants. I'm not really sure what the opposing team's plan is for beating this most of the time since it wins me so many games I don't deserve to win. I'm seeing a lot of Hippowdons and stuff using Whirlwind to remove the Coil boosts, but it really just delays the inevitable: a last man standing Zygarde sweep. No physical attacker is going to work unless you get a lucky crit off a Dragon Claw/Ice Punch. Some people have resorted to putting Unaware Clefable or Unaware Quagsire on every team. Most teams are using a powerful special attacker with a super effective STAB like Latios, Magaerna, Lele or a strong Ice Beam off say, a Genesect. But even these typically deal ~70% damage while the defender of the ecosystem smacks them hard in return with Thousand Arrows. Honestly it feels like the only real way to not get ran over by thing is to wear the 50% form down to ~60% and prevent it from transforming, though that can easily get played around.
I'm using Tapu Fini + Weavile to check this monster. It kinda works but if the opponent plays perfectly with Zygarde, it's still gg.
 
I don't think Blaziken or Greninja are a precedent for this, as other pokemon get both Speed Boost and Protean, whereas no other pokemon gets Power Construct. There is absolutely nothing that's negatively effected by banning Power Construct.
I really, really don't think anyone would care about that. The ban isn't complex. Just don't use power construct in OU. Only one pokemon can have power construct in the first place, which is broken on it, so yes, I would say it is a broken ability. Banning power construct but not Zygarde would make more people happy in the long run, because Aura Break Zygarde could still be used in OU.

EDIT: Besides, you can't even say power construct would be broken on another pokemon. It's one of those "change to another forme when a certain condition happens" ability, so it literally wouldn't work on any pokemon that wasn't Zygarde.
It's much less about who cares about it or who's affected by it, and much more about the philosophy behind bans. Abilities (and Moves) have been banned when the actual Ability itself is overpowered or uncompetitive, not in how it interacts with certain Pokemon. Moody and Shadow Tag (and Mimimize) fit these bills perfectly. Power Construct by itself is neither of these. Bans on Pokemon have occurred when they have access to a combination of moves, stats, and abilities that are deemed overpowered - we haven't banned just specific moves or specific abilities on specific Pokemon.

As well, a Power Construct Ban opens up the floodgates to a number of different Ability Bans. And there are precedents set already, even if we exclude Blaziken and Greninja.

Gen 4: Can we test Yanmega in UU if we ban Speed Boost?
Gen 5: Are Gothitelle and Wobbuffet allowed into UU if we banned Shadow Tag?
Gen 6: Is Medatite allowed into LC if we ban Pure Power?

There's a ton of hypotheticals we can throw around in the current gen too.

Taking a look at all the Tapu's, if any of them are ever banished to Ubers (or BL in Fini's case), can they be used if we just ban the appropriate Surge ability instead?
If Talonflame ends up in BL, do we allow him in UU if we ban Gale Wings?
If Bruxish ends up in BL2, do we allow him in RU if we ban Dazzling?
If Drampa ends up in BL3, do we allow him in NU if we ban Berserk?
If Zangoose ends up in BL4, do we allow him in PU if we ban Toxic Boost?

If Power Construct instead of Zyguard is banned from OU because it's too broken, then all of these and more become fair game.
 

boxofkangaroos

this is the day of the expanding man
It's much less about who cares about it or who's affected by it, and much more about the philosophy behind bans. Abilities (and Moves) have been banned when the actual Ability itself is overpowered or uncompetitive, not in how it interacts with certain Pokemon. Moody and Shadow Tag (and Mimimize) fit these bills perfectly. Power Construct by itself is neither of these. Bans on Pokemon have occurred when they have access to a combination of moves, stats, and abilities that are deemed overpowered - we haven't banned just specific moves or specific abilities on specific Pokemon.

As well, a Power Construct Ban opens up the floodgates to a number of different Ability Bans. And there are precedents set already, even if we exclude Blaziken and Greninja.

Gen 4: Can we test Yanmega in UU if we ban Speed Boost?
Gen 5: Are Gothitelle and Wobbuffet allowed into UU if we banned Shadow Tag?
Gen 6: Is Medatite allowed into LC if we ban Pure Power?

There's a ton of hypotheticals we can throw around in the current gen too.

Taking a look at all the Tapu's, if any of them are ever banished to Ubers (or BL in Fini's case), can they be used if we just ban the appropriate Surge ability instead?
If Talonflame ends up in BL, do we allow him in UU if we ban Gale Wings?
If Bruxish ends up in BL2, do we allow him in RU if we ban Dazzling?
If Drampa ends up in BL3, do we allow him in NU if we ban Berserk?
If Zangoose ends up in BL4, do we allow him in PU if we ban Toxic Boost?

If Power Construct instead of Zyguard is banned from OU because it's too broken, then all of these and more become fair game.
The thing is, Power Construct is a whole different ball game because it activates an entire new form. Because of this, it functions wildly differently from Aura Break Zygarde.
 
Power Construct Zygarde is actually coded as a completely separate form of Zygarde that has Power Construct in all three ability slots. So banning Power Construct Zygarde 10/50% and not Aura Break Zygarde 10/50% is more like banning Landorus-I but not Landorus-T last gen.

Battle Bond Greninja and Torrent / Protean Greninja are a similar case.

Anyway none of this really matters lol, Smogon Tiering philosophy has been become less defined and more arbitrary as the years have gone on. After stuff like Aldaron's proposal, the Shell Smash + Baton Pass ban in BW RU, the Chatter ban in XY PU, the Mega / base form separation in XY, etc it's hard to take any of it too seriously anymore.
 
I've recently been using Poison-Silvally as an all around check to the Tapu Pokemon, and I've found some good success with it.

Ok, here's my set:

Silvally @ Poison Memory
Ability: RKS System
EVs: 180 Atk / 72 SpA / 200 SpD / 56 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Multi-Attack
- Parting Shot
- Flamethrower / Crunch
- Ice Beam / Crunch

Multi Attack OHKO's all of the Tapu pokemon bar Fini, and he has enough special defense to live a specs thunder bolt from koko. However you split the Speed and Special Attack is up to you. Even with the lowered Special attack, Silvally can still 2HKO pokemon like Lando-T, Gliscor, and Garchomp with Ice Beam, and kill Scizor, Ferro, and Skarm with Flamethrower. Certain pokemon like Rotom-W, Excadrill, and Hippodown still wall him out, but he can always choose to Parting Shot out of the match and cripple the pokemon switching in on him, which is the great part. Parting Shot is what really makes this set work.

Silvally has certain weakpoints. He doesn't have access to recovery, can be crippled pretty badly by status such as burns, and he really misses out on not being able to hold items like life orb or leftovers. However, his ability to change typing and his above average movepool makes him a good glue pokemon.

Relevant Calcs:

252+ SpA Choice Specs Tapu Koko Thunderbolt vs. 0 HP / 200 SpD Silvally in Electric Terrain: 252-297 (76.1 - 89.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
148+ SpA Tapu Lele Psyshock vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Silvally: 278-330 (83.9 - 99.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

180+ Atk Silvally Multi-Attack vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Tapu Koko: 282-332 (100 - 117.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
180+ Atk Silvally Multi-Attack vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Tapu Bulu: 324-384 (94.1 - 111.6%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO
180+ Atk Silvally Multi-Attack vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Tapu Fini: 218-258 (63.3 - 75%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
180+ Atk Silvally Multi-Attack vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Tapu Lele: 312-368 (90.6 - 106.9%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO
 
I thought Aldaron's Proposal and the other things you mentioned were perfectly fine TBH. It's only natural that as Pokemon itself gets bigger and more sprawling over the years, the bans and rule sets would increase in complexity to follow it.
 

SJCrew

Believer, going on a journey...
is a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
It's much less about who cares about it or who's affected by it, and much more about the philosophy behind bans. Abilities (and Moves) have been banned when the actual Ability itself is overpowered or uncompetitive, not in how it interacts with certain Pokemon. Moody and Shadow Tag (and Mimimize) fit these bills perfectly. Power Construct by itself is neither of these. Bans on Pokemon have occurred when they have access to a combination of moves, stats, and abilities that are deemed overpowered - we haven't banned just specific moves or specific abilities on specific Pokemon.

As well, a Power Construct Ban opens up the floodgates to a number of different Ability Bans. And there are precedents set already, even if we exclude Blaziken and Greninja.

Gen 4: Can we test Yanmega in UU if we ban Speed Boost?
Gen 5: Are Gothitelle and Wobbuffet allowed into UU if we banned Shadow Tag?
Gen 6: Is Medatite allowed into LC if we ban Pure Power?

There's a ton of hypotheticals we can throw around in the current gen too.

Taking a look at all the Tapu's, if any of them are ever banished to Ubers (or BL in Fini's case), can they be used if we just ban the appropriate Surge ability instead?
If Talonflame ends up in BL, do we allow him in UU if we ban Gale Wings?
If Bruxish ends up in BL2, do we allow him in RU if we ban Dazzling?
If Drampa ends up in BL3, do we allow him in NU if we ban Berserk?
If Zangoose ends up in BL4, do we allow him in PU if we ban Toxic Boost?

If Power Construct instead of Zyguard is banned from OU because it's too broken, then all of these and more become fair game.
It's actually quizzical how you worked your way through all of these logical loopholes and did not once mention how we ban Mega Stones instead of Mega formes. Do you know why that is? Because Mega Stones serve no other functional purpose than to create an entirely new forme. Said forme cannot exist without the appropriate Mega Stone, and that is exactly how Power Construct works. Consider it Zygardianite, if you will, because for all intents and purposes, that's essentially what it is.
 
Its pretty crazy how Sp.Def Talonflame could have completely walled phero if gale wings wasn't nerfed. Even still Zygarde is easily the most uber thing in the tier right now.
 
How are the Gen 6 OU staples handling this gen? Talonflame is obviously dead. What about mons like Bisharp after the Sucker Punch / Knock Off nerf? Do you guys see any pokes that were UU/BL making a resurgence in this gen?
 
Its pretty crazy how Sp.Def Talonflame could have completely walled phero if gale wings wasn't nerfed. Even still Zygarde is easily the most uber thing in the tier right now.
Yeah, while Phero and Aegi are obviously busted, they aren't WITHOUT checks. Power Construct should be straight up banned, people literally win battles based on when they send that in, and that's just not healthy for the meta. I don't want to be running Abomasnow on my team to even have a chance of 2HKO'ing
 
While Zygarde is allowed, does anyone have thoughts on Coil vs Dragon Dance on the standard specially defensive spread? Which is considered better at the moment?
 
While Zygarde is allowed, does anyone have thoughts on Coil vs Dragon Dance on the standard specially defensive spread? Which is considered better at the moment?
I use Coil personally. Makes it as fat as possible. Also helps I run enough speed EV's to outspeed Tapu Koku after Sticky Web help.
 
It's much less about who cares about it or who's affected by it, and much more about the philosophy behind bans. Abilities (and Moves) have been banned when the actual Ability itself is overpowered or uncompetitive, not in how it interacts with certain Pokemon. Moody and Shadow Tag (and Mimimize) fit these bills perfectly. Power Construct by itself is neither of these. Bans on Pokemon have occurred when they have access to a combination of moves, stats, and abilities that are deemed overpowered - we haven't banned just specific moves or specific abilities on specific Pokemon.

As well, a Power Construct Ban opens up the floodgates to a number of different Ability Bans. And there are precedents set already, even if we exclude Blaziken and Greninja.

Gen 4: Can we test Yanmega in UU if we ban Speed Boost?
Gen 5: Are Gothitelle and Wobbuffet allowed into UU if we banned Shadow Tag?
Gen 6: Is Medatite allowed into LC if we ban Pure Power?

There's a ton of hypotheticals we can throw around in the current gen too.

Taking a look at all the Tapu's, if any of them are ever banished to Ubers (or BL in Fini's case), can they be used if we just ban the appropriate Surge ability instead?
If Talonflame ends up in BL, do we allow him in UU if we ban Gale Wings?
If Bruxish ends up in BL2, do we allow him in RU if we ban Dazzling?
If Drampa ends up in BL3, do we allow him in NU if we ban Berserk?
If Zangoose ends up in BL4, do we allow him in PU if we ban Toxic Boost?

If Power Construct instead of Zyguard is banned from OU because it's too broken, then all of these and more become fair game.
In addition to what's already been said about Mega Stones (Salamencite and Gengarite are not broken when held by Simisage -- does that mean Smogon should allow them and ban base form Salamence or Gengar "for consistency"?), bans take place based on what currently gets it, not based on whether it would be broken in every possible world where anything else could hypothetically get it. This is even more true with something that is obviously a signature ability and which can't feasibly work on anything else.

To use the Shadow Tag ban as an example, nobody would seriously argue that we can't ban it in OU because it wouldn't be broken or uncompetitive on Cosmog if it got it as a hidden ability in gen 12 or something.
 
It's actually quizzical how you worked your way through all of these logical loopholes and did not once mention how we ban Mega Stones instead of Mega formes. Do you know why that is? Because Mega Stones serve no other functional purpose than to create an entirely new forme. Said forme cannot exist without the appropriate Mega Stone, and that is exactly how Power Construct works. Consider it Zygardianite, if you will, because for all intents and purposes, that's essentially what it is.
Then I still wonder how that would be different from banning something like Pure Power on Meditite.

In LC, Pure Power effectively acts as a +100-120 BST boost to Meditite, just like Mega Stones and Power Construct. For all real intents and purposes, Pure Power on Meditite acts like an automatically activated Mega Forme - he is completely different from Telepathy Meditite. If Power Construct works as if it was Zygardianite, then shouldn't Pure Power be viewed as Meditianite? In which case Telepathy Meditite could be separate and allowed?

If it's because it's actually coded as a separate form, then (if necessary) can we not just ban King's Shield or Offensive Moves on Aegislash?
 

November Blue

A universe where hot chips don't exist :(
is a Contributor Alumnus
Stuff that can deal with Zygarde:

- Taunt. The specially defensive Coil /Dragon Dance set is Taunt bait, especially to things that have more than 85/95 base Speed and a Ground resistance.
- Alolan Persian. Taunt, Foul Play, Fur Coat, Parting Shot.
- Mandibuzz. Fast Taunt, Foul Play, Whirlwind.
- Tapu Bulu.

+6 252+ Atk Zygarde Thousand Arrows vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Tapu Bulu: 237-280 (68.8 - 81.3%)

Not taking it down easily, and Bulu can retaliate with Wood Hammer, Horn Leech, or maybe Dazzling Gleam.

Anything that resists Ground is tough for Zygarde to break past.

Mamoswine is also a good check. I'm using this ATM:

Mamoswine @ Icicle Plate
Ability: Thick Fat
EVs: 252 Atk / 212 Def / 44 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Knock Off
- Earthquake
- Ice Shard
- Icicle Spear

It has enough Speed to outpace 0 investment Zygarde-C, max Attack, and the rest in Defense to take hits a little better. Icicle Spear tears through Zygarde's Substitutes and Defense boosts:

252+ Atk Icicle Plate Mamoswine Icicle Spear (3 hits) vs. +1 252 HP / 0 Def Zygarde: 372-444 (58.4 - 69.8%)

Icicle Spear 2HKOs on switch-in.

+1 0 Atk Zygarde Thousand Arrows vs. 0 HP / 212 Def Mamoswine: 138-163 (38.2 - 45.1%) -- 9% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock

Zygarde loses the matchup.

252+ Atk Icicle Plate Mamoswine Icicle Spear (2 hits) vs. +3 252 HP / 0 Def Zygarde: 152-192 (23.8 - 30.1%)

It can't boost to avoid Icicle Spear, which will (almost) always break Substitute.

252+ Atk Icicle Plate Mamoswine Icicle Spear (5 hits) vs. +6 252 HP / 0 Def Zygarde: 240-300 (37.7 - 47.1%)
+5 0 Atk Zygarde Thousand Arrows vs. 0 HP / 212 Def Mamoswine: 321-378 (88.9 - 104.7%)

The matchup is quite favourable for Mamoswine.

Other than that, you've got stuff like Haze Toxapex, which can stall it. Whirlwind/Roar from Skarmory, Mega Venusaur, Hippowdon, etc.
 
Then I still wonder how that would be different from banning something like Pure Power on Meditite.

In LC, Pure Power effectively acts as a +100-120 BST boost to Meditite, just like Mega Stones and Power Construct. For all real intents and purposes, Pure Power on Meditite acts like an automatically activated Mega Forme - he is completely different from Telepathy Meditite. If Power Construct works as if it was Zygardianite, then shouldn't Pure Power be viewed as Meditianite? In which case Telepathy Meditite could be separate and allowed?

If it's because it's actually coded as a separate form, then (if necessary) can we not just ban King's Shield on Aegislash?
I think it's pretty obvious to everyone that an actual form change with a ban aimed at preventing that form change is different to "it gets stronger with this, so in that respect it's a bit like a mega if you squint really hard, right? It's totally the same". Actual form change bans are not complex bans because, well, they are a lot more intuitively simple to understand than "no Protean on Greninja". They're not complex and there is no slippery slope because there's a clear line drawn when the form change is effectively seen as a separate mon entirely that happens to share a species. The fact that people constantly complained about megas not being tiered separately until the system was changed, but not about, say, a Mewtwo that only knows Metronome not being tiered separately from the standard ubers set, shows this nicely.

As for King's Shield: Smeargle gets it, and it is legitimately useful on Smeargle without making it broken. If that wasn't the case, I don't think there would be any philosophical problem with banning the move other than there not really being any good reason to save non-KS Aegislash sets.
 
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While Zygarde is allowed, does anyone have thoughts on Coil vs Dragon Dance on the standard specially defensive spread? Which is considered better at the moment?
Blunder ran a team with Fat DD Zygarde with DD/RestTalk/Arrows, and it works surprisingly well given how hard it is to actually kill Zygarde. Coil has been standard fare for most ladder players, though.
 
I think it's pretty obvious to everyone that an actual form change with a ban aimed at preventing that form change is different to "it gets stronger with this, so in that respect it's a bit like a mega if you squint really hard, right? It's totally the same.". Actual form change bans are not complex bans because, well, they are a lot more intuitively simple to understand than "no Protean on Greninja". They're not complex and there is no slippery slope because there's a clear line drawn when the form change is effectively seen as a separate mon entirely that happens to share a species. The fact that people constantly complained about megas not being tiered separately until the system was changed, but not about, say, a Mewtwo that only knows Metronome not being tiered separately from the standard ubers set, shows this nicely.

As for King's Shield: Smeargle gets it, and it is legitimately useful on Smeargle without making it broken. If that wasn't the case, I don't think there would be any philosophical problem with banning the move other than there not really being any good reason to save non-KS Aegislash sets.
You're absolutely right, I forgot about Smeargle.

I agree that a ban on the actual form would be perfectly fine and not complex - banning Complete Forme Zygarde itself causes no issues. Though, if that's the case, I don't see why we couldn't also just ban Blade Forme Aegislash as well instead of Aegislash as a whole.

Banning the Ability that causes the forme change instead of the actual forme though - well, we have several abilities that can alter forms in battle already. Outside of Battle Bond and Zen Mode, none of the users actually have a second ability, but if any of those forme changes were overpowered and they had a second ability, or if Battle Bond Greninja or Zen Mode Darmanitan actually turned out overpowered (lol), do we ban the abilities?
 
You're absolutely right, I forgot about Smeargle.

I agree that a ban on the actual form would be perfectly fine and not complex - banning Complete Forme Zygarde itself causes no issues. Though, if that's the case, I don't see why we couldn't also just ban Blade Forme Aegislash as well instead of Aegislash as a whole.

Banning the Ability that causes the forme change instead of the actual forme though - well, we have several abilities that can alter forms in battle already. Outside of Battle Bond and Zen Mode, none of the users actually have a second ability, but if any of those forme changes were overpowered and they had a second ability, or if Battle Bond Greninja or Zen Mode Darmanitan actually turned out overpowered (lol), do we ban the abilities?
There's actually a pretty interesting thread about this in the Policy Review subforum. I'd recommend checking it out.

On topic, here's a Pokémon I haven't seen many people using.


Necrozma @ Darkinium Z
Ability: Prism Armor
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Psyshock
- Dark Pulse
- Flash Cannon
- Calm Mind

This thing is pretty cool! I've been using this bulky calm mind set primarily to beat Toxapex but it does remarkably well against a lot of things!
Darkinium Z is to lure aegislash, but can also do a lot of damage to anything else on a one-time basis.

I've also tried him with this set, to some crazy results

Necrozma @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Prism Armor
EVs: 52 HP / 252 SpA / 204 Spe
Timid Nature
- Autotomize
- Stored Power
- Dark Pulse
- Flash Cannon

This set aims to set up an automotize while tanking a super effective hit, then sweep with +2/+2/+2 stored power
Dark pulse for aegislash, flash cannon for tapus.
I think the speed allowed me to outspeed scarf aegislash at +2

Give Necrozma a try! Definitely the coolest looking mon this gen
 
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SJCrew

Believer, going on a journey...
is a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
You're absolutely right, I forgot about Smeargle.

I agree that a ban on the actual form would be perfectly fine and not complex - banning Complete Forme Zygarde itself causes no issues. Though, if that's the case, I don't see why we couldn't also just ban Blade Forme Aegislash as well instead of Aegislash as a whole.
You're missing the point again, dude. Nobody said any of that.

"it gets stronger with this, so in that respect it's a bit like a mega if you squint really hard, right? It's totally the same."
He's basically ridiculing your logic because you believe forme changes and abilities that make Pokemon stronger are the essentially same thing. That's not actually true for a number of reason, but I digress. The bigger picture here is that banning either one of Power Construct or Zygarde-Complete accomplishes the same goal, and choosing which one must be listed in the ban list in lieu of the other is just splitting hairs.

You can think all you like that banning Power Construct means we're going to ban other abilities on other broken Pokemon, but it should say enough that we opted to simply ban Greninja and Blaziken while admonishing all of the fans over the years who've wanted to bring them back with ability restrictions.

In other words, we've been here before and handled it gracefully. Move on already.
 
Toxapex and A-Marowak seems quite strong/useful in this metagame.

The former is good, but without being utterly broken because it is often pressured to rely on Recover + switch-out to be at high health throughout the match. Even with Haze, this thing is quite passive enough to be overwhelmed.


A-Marowak is ...odd to me. Sure, now seems so strong due to the possibility to run Thick Club (basically, a Choice Band without being restricted to use one attack) and Lightning Rod to stop this Electric spam, while rectifying our Spe in the process. On a side note, remember only that A-Raichu runs Surf, so don't expect to check this thing that well.
We have a monsters with Ghost typing useful towards HJK spam (...Pheromosa...), Fire typing to deal with annoying Steel (i.e. Genesect, but there are many others) plus Lighting Rod to check Electric spam into a single body.

Once the meta settles down, I doubt that this thing will be so used in OU (at maximum it will be a low tier monster), but this is only my opinion.
 
Turn 26

Tapu Lele, come back!

Go! Bisharp!
Pointed stones dug into Bisharp!

The opposing Persian used Z-Parting Shot!
Bisharp's Attack fell!
[Bisharp's Defiant!]
Bisharp's Attack rose sharply!
Bisharp's Special Attack fell!
[Bisharp's Defiant!]
Bisharp's Attack rose sharply!

RikRing withdrew Persian (Persian-Alola)!

RikRing sent out Zygarde (Zygarde-Complete)!
The healing wish came true for the opposing Zygarde!
Pointed stones dug into the opposing Zygarde!

The opposing Zygarde restored a little HP using its Leftovers!

Turn 27

Bisharp used Iron Head!
The opposing Zygarde lost 48% of its health!

The opposing Zygarde used Thousand Arrows!
It's super effective! Bisharp lost 63.8% of its health!

Bisharp fainted!

The opposing Zygarde restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
★mahlzeit: that does
★mahlzeit: 0
★mahlzeit: literally

Go! Tapu Lele!
Pointed stones dug into Tapu Lele!
[Tapu Lele's Psychic Surge!]
The battlefield got weird!


Turn 31

Genesect used Ice Beam!
It's super effective! The opposing Zygarde lost 48% of its health!

The opposing Zygarde used Thousand Arrows!
Genesect lost 42.8% of its health!

The opposing Zygarde restored a little HP using its Leftovers!


Why does Zygarde work for all my opponents and not for me ;__; that +3 damage and Genesects IceBeam with 252 spA is hilarious and a big fuck off to all stall users, don't you have a rl to annoy with your bullshit?
 
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and i'm worried about Mgard/Malakazam + Psy Surge Core after aegis ban...

AND i don't think aegis have to be banned. Now people are using new pokemons to deal with it.

Amonguns, Mandibuzz and m-sableye at defensive side
Landorus and earthquake user in general at balanced side
We have Hoopa-u and news UBs to deal with it at the ofensive side.
 
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