Metagame Workshop

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Scalemons 600
Last gen there was talk of a meta that uses a formula that make every pokemon's stats around a certain number. I don't think the meta was ever programmed and it didn't transfer to 7th gen. I want to bring it back.
Premise: Use a formula that makes every pokemon close to 600.
The formula does not change HP cause it causes programming difficulties and it prevents threats with large attack stats from becoming too bulky.
All ubers are unbanned unless stated other wise cause they usually have bst over 600 and power creep.
Bans: Eviolite, Aegislash, Shuckle?(depends def is over 255 which might make it unable to be programmed.)
Potential Threats:Sweepers/Wallbreakers:
Beedrill-Mega 65/186/49/19/99/179 bst: 597
Shedinja 1/229/114/76/76/102 bst:598
Pheromosa 71/144/39/144/39/159 bst:596
Abra 25/39/29/203/106/174 bst: 576
Carvanha 45/177/39/28/39/128 bst: 556
Solosis 45/62/83/217/103/41 bst: 551
Duosion 65/65/81/203/97/49 bst: 560
Gastly 30/68/58/194/68/155 bst: 573
Xurkitree 83/94/75/182/75/87 bst: 596
Kadabra 40/53/45/180/105/158 bst: 581
Magnemite 25/65/129/175/102/83 bst: 579
Walls/Tanks:
Onix 35/70/249/47/70/109 580
Steelix 75 100 235 65/76/35 586
Cloyster 50 109 206 97/51/80 593
Aggron 70 125 204 68/68/57 592
Nincada 31 102 203 68/68/90 562
Doublade 59 147 201 60/66/47 580
Duskull 20 81 183 61/183/51 579
Mantine 85 52 90/103/181/90 601
 
Scalemons 600
Last gen there was talk of a meta that uses a formula that make every pokemon's stats around a certain number. I don't think the meta was ever programmed and it didn't transfer to 7th gen. I want to bring it back.
Premise: Use a formula that makes every pokemon close to 600.
The formula does not change HP cause it causes programming difficulties and it prevents threats with large attack stats from becoming too bulky.
All ubers are unbanned unless stated other wise cause they usually have bst over 600 and power creep.
Bans: Eviolite, Aegislash, Shuckle?(depends def is over 255 which might make it unable to be programmed.)
Potential Threats:Sweepers/Wallbreakers:
Beedrill-Mega 65/186/49/19/99/179 bst: 597
Shedinja 1/229/114/76/76/102 bst:598
Pheromosa 71/144/39/144/39/159 bst:596
Abra 25/39/29/203/106/174 bst: 576
Carvanha 45/177/39/28/39/128 bst: 556
Solosis 45/62/83/217/103/41 bst: 551
Duosion 65/65/81/203/97/49 bst: 560
Gastly 30/68/58/194/68/155 bst: 573
Xurkitree 83/94/75/182/75/87 bst: 596
Kadabra 40/53/45/180/105/158 bst: 581
Magnemite 25/65/129/175/102/83 bst: 579
Walls/Tanks:
Onix 35/70/249/47/70/109 580
Steelix 75 100 235 65/76/35 586
Cloyster 50 109 206 97/51/80 593
Aggron 70 125 204 68/68/57 592
Nincada 31 102 203 68/68/90 562
Doublade 59 147 201 60/66/47 580
Duskull 20 81 183 61/183/51 579
Mantine 85 52 90/103/181/90 601
What does Smeargle get? 55/55/97/55/125/209 Speed? That looks extremely troublesome.
 

fanyfan

i once put 42 mcdonalds chicken nuggets in my anus
Scalemons 600
Last gen there was talk of a meta that uses a formula that make every pokemon's stats around a certain number. I don't think the meta was ever programmed and it didn't transfer to 7th gen. I want to bring it back.
Premise: Use a formula that makes every pokemon close to 600.
The formula does not change HP cause it causes programming difficulties and it prevents threats with large attack stats from becoming too bulky.
All ubers are unbanned unless stated other wise cause they usually have bst over 600 and power creep.
Bans: Eviolite, Aegislash, Shuckle?(depends def is over 255 which might make it unable to be programmed.)
Potential Threats:Sweepers/Wallbreakers:
Beedrill-Mega 65/186/49/19/99/179 bst: 597
Shedinja 1/229/114/76/76/102 bst:598
Pheromosa 71/144/39/144/39/159 bst:596
Abra 25/39/29/203/106/174 bst: 576
Carvanha 45/177/39/28/39/128 bst: 556
Solosis 45/62/83/217/103/41 bst: 551
Duosion 65/65/81/203/97/49 bst: 560
Gastly 30/68/58/194/68/155 bst: 573
Xurkitree 83/94/75/182/75/87 bst: 596
Kadabra 40/53/45/180/105/158 bst: 581
Magnemite 25/65/129/175/102/83 bst: 579
Walls/Tanks:
Onix 35/70/249/47/70/109 580
Steelix 75 100 235 65/76/35 586
Cloyster 50 109 206 97/51/80 593
Aggron 70 125 204 68/68/57 592
Nincada 31 102 203 68/68/90 562
Doublade 59 147 201 60/66/47 580
Duskull 20 81 183 61/183/51 579
Mantine 85 52 90/103/181/90 601
I really like this idea. However, can you share the formula you used? More curiosity than anything, but it would be nice
 
I really like this idea. However, can you share the formula you used? More curiosity than anything, but it would be nice
I'm no mathematician, but I may have figured out a way to calculate that. To give an example, I will take Dodrio.

1. Subtract the BST (Base Stat Total) from 600.

600 - 470= 130

2. Divide the result by 5. In case the result is a decimal, round it down.

130 : 5 = 26

3. Add the result to all stats not named HP.

Original: 60 / 110 / 70 / 60 / 60 / 110 || BST: 470
Scaled: 60 / 136 / 96 / 86 / 86 / 136 || BST: 600
 
Last edited:

RNGIsFatal

Banned deucer.
Don't know if this was suggested earlier but here it is.

upload_2017-3-17_9-20-22.png


...

upload_2017-3-17_9-20-34.png



SOS mons
For those who did not play Sun & Moon, from Gen 7 there is a chance that a wild pokemon will call another pokemon if it is in a pinch, and this causes a lot of frustrations in terms of catching something (but something beneficial for EV / EXP farm).

What would happen if same thing happen in Showdown? What if you are about to finish someone and an extra opponent appears to the original opponent? I doubt any of you will not find this interesting.

Metagame premise:

* If someone has their 'mon's health below 50%, they can choose to have one of their parties switch in next to their mon. Essentially the battle becomes 1v2.
* If someone used their SOS call, the other person cannot use SOS call until one of the 'mons faint.
* To make the 1v2 'balanced' to some degree, the 'mon that was called from SOS call will have their Attack, Special Attack, and Speed halved, until its ally faints and is left alone in the field.
* Any 'mon that was called from SOS cannot be switched out unless it used switching move or is forcefully switched out. If it was switched out, the battle becomes 1v1.
* Each player has 1 SOS call per game.

Potential bans and threats:

Threats:

* Any assisting 'mon that has Fake Out can cripple opponent for a turn, letting the other ally deal them.
* Perish Song - After successfully baiting SOS, one can simply get rid of one of the opponent's 'mons, since they cannot switch out after being sent out with SOS.
* Multi-target moves: Things like unreleased Mega Gardevoir, Primal Groudon / Kyogre can use a powerful move that can hit both targets effectively, making themselves efficient check to SOS itself.
* Don't know if this will actually work but if...
- Someone uses Belly Drum.
- Calls SOS and the ally with Follow Me enters.
- Boosted 'mon will stop sweeping while its ally will spam Follow Me.
- Opponent can do almost nothing until they get rid of SOS-called 'mon, while having to survive the other mon with Belly Drum boost.

Bans:

* Shuckle: boost drop means nothing to this guy. It can still harass the opponent with Toxic / Infestation / Encore, or set hazards while its ally is dealing with the opponent.
* Shed Shell: Self-explanatory.
* Arena Trap / Shadow Tag: Things like Dugtrio can call their ally, trap important 'mon from the other team, and make 1v2 situation without letting opponent switch out to something else that can handle 2 'mons.


Questions for the community:

* Should the standard format be OU or Ubers? (I think it will be fun either way)
* Should players have 1 or 2 SOS calls per game?
* Should the debuff from SOS (halving stats) be permanent, for first few turns like Slow Start, or not exist at all?
* What should be done with Eject Button and how are we going to make Red Card work?
* Should I add Follow Me to the banlist?
 
Last edited:

Quantum Tesseract

No Longer Dead
is a Community Contributor
I'm no mathematician, but I may have figured out a way to calculate that. To give an example, I will take Dodrio.

1. Subtract the BST (Base Stat Total) from 600.

600 - 470= 130

2. Divide the result by 5. In case the result is a decimal, round it down.

130 : 5 = 26

3. Add the result to all stats not named HP.

Original: 60 / 110 / 70 / 60 / 60 / 110 || BST: 470
Scaled: 60 / 136 / 96 / 86 / 86 / 136 || BST: 600
The problem is, that just adds flat boosts and fails the purpose of keeping the scale; 110/70 =/= 136/96. What you need is [Original Stat]*[600-HP]/[Base Stat Total-HP]

Original: 60 / 110 / 70 / 60 / 60 / 110 || BST: 470
Scaled: 60 / 145 / 92 / 79 / 79 / 145 || BST: 600
 
Scalemons 600
Last gen there was talk of a meta that uses a formula that make every pokemon's stats around a certain number. I don't think the meta was ever programmed and it didn't transfer to 7th gen. I want to bring it back.
Premise: Use a formula that makes every pokemon close to 600.
The formula does not change HP cause it causes programming difficulties and it prevents threats with large attack stats from becoming too bulky.
All ubers are unbanned unless stated other wise cause they usually have bst over 600 and power creep.
Bans: Eviolite, Aegislash, Shuckle?(depends def is over 255 which might make it unable to be programmed.)
Potential Threats:Sweepers/Wallbreakers:
Beedrill-Mega 65/186/49/19/99/179 bst: 597
Shedinja 1/229/114/76/76/102 bst:598
Pheromosa 71/144/39/144/39/159 bst:596
Abra 25/39/29/203/106/174 bst: 576
Carvanha 45/177/39/28/39/128 bst: 556
Solosis 45/62/83/217/103/41 bst: 551
Duosion 65/65/81/203/97/49 bst: 560
Gastly 30/68/58/194/68/155 bst: 573
Xurkitree 83/94/75/182/75/87 bst: 596
Kadabra 40/53/45/180/105/158 bst: 581
Magnemite 25/65/129/175/102/83 bst: 579
Walls/Tanks:
Onix 35/70/249/47/70/109 580
Steelix 75 100 235 65/76/35 586
Cloyster 50 109 206 97/51/80 593
Aggron 70 125 204 68/68/57 592
Nincada 31 102 203 68/68/90 562
Doublade 59 147 201 60/66/47 580
Duskull 20 81 183 61/183/51 579
Mantine 85 52 90/103/181/90 601
I recently submitted something similar and it was rejected. Only difference was that I made the HP change.
 
The problem is, that just adds flat boosts and fails the purpose of keeping the scale; 110/70 =/= 136/96. What you need is [Original Stat]*[600-HP]/[Base Stat Total-HP]

Original: 60 / 110 / 70 / 60 / 60 / 110 || BST: 470
Scaled: 60 / 145 / 92 / 79 / 79 / 145 || BST: 600
…Hence why I'm no mathematician. ^^;

Though, that would make sense.
 
I'm no mathematician, but I may have figured out a way to calculate that. To give an example, I will take Dodrio.

1. Subtract the BST (Base Stat Total) from 600.

600 - 470= 130

2. Divide the result by 5. In case the result is a decimal, round it down.

130 : 5 = 26

3. Add the result to all stats not named HP.

Original: 60 / 110 / 70 / 60 / 60 / 110 || BST: 470
Scaled: 60 / 136 / 96 / 86 / 86 / 136 || BST: 600
I have a document with all the Pokemon calculated but the formula is different. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1U4IlzzkrcOTF5EClBollaWfbG-kksxjghBhhqkRrGmY/edit?usp=sharing
It made Dodrio 60/140/89/77/77/140 BST: 583
 
Don't know if this was suggested earlier but here it is.

View attachment 79495

...

View attachment 79496


SOS mons
For those who did not play Sun & Moon, from Gen 7 there is a chance that a wild pokemon will call another pokemon if it is in a pinch, and this causes a lot of frustrations in terms of catching something (but something beneficial for EV / EXP farm).

What would happen if same thing happen in Showdown? What if you are about to finish someone and an extra opponent appears to the original opponent? I doubt any of you will not find this interesting.
Metagame premise:

* If someone has their 'mon's health below 50%, they can choose to have one of their parties switch in next to their mon. Essentially the battle becomes 1v2.
* If someone used their SOS call, the other person cannot use SOS call until one of the 'mons faint.
* To make the 1v2 'balanced' to some degree, the 'mon that was called from SOS call will have their Attack, Special Attack, and Speed halved, until its ally faints and is left alone in the field.
* Any 'mon that was called from SOS cannot be switched out unless it used switching move or is forcefully switched out. If it was switched out, the battle becomes 1v1.
* Each player has 1 SOS call per game.

Potential bans and threats:

Threats:

* Any assisting 'mon that has Fake Out can cripple opponent for a turn, letting the other ally deal them.
* Perish Song - After successfully baiting SOS, one can simply get rid of one of the opponent's 'mons, since they cannot switch out after being sent out with SOS.
* Multi-target moves: Things like unreleased Mega Gardevoir, Primal Groudon / Kyogre can use a powerful move that can hit both targets effectively, making themselves efficient check to SOS itself.
* Don't know if this will actually work but if...
- Someone uses Belly Drum.
- Calls SOS and the ally with Follow Me enters.
- Boosted 'mon will stop sweeping while its ally will spam Follow Me.
- Opponent can do almost nothing until they get rid of SOS-called 'mon, while having to survive the other mon with Belly Drum boost.

Bans:

* Shuckle: boost drop means nothing to this guy. It can still harass the opponent with Toxic / Infestation / Encore, or set hazards while its ally is dealing with the opponent.
* Shed Shell: Self-explanatory.
* Arena Trap / Shadow Tag: Things like Dugtrio can call their ally, trap important 'mon from the other team, and make 1v2 situation without letting opponent switch out to something else that can handle 2 'mons.


Questions for the community:

* Should the standard format be OU or Ubers? (I think it will be fun either way)
* Should players have 1 or 2 SOS calls per game?
* Should the debuff from SOS (halving stats) be permanent, for first few turns like Slow Start, or not exist at all?
* What should be done with Eject Button and how are we going to make Red Card work?
* Should I add Follow Me to the banlist?
This sounds like a nightmare to code...
 
Guess I'll give it a shot.

Consolation Prize

Metagame premise: Pokemon have their lowest stat doubled. This does not take into account items, setup moves or abilities, it doubles the lowest raw stat. If a pokemon has more than one lowest stat (Say, like a no EV neutral nature mew for example) no boost will be received. HP does not count as a "Lowest Stat".

Potential bans and threats:

OU banlist and clauses

Mew/Celebi/Jirachi/Manaphy/Shaymin/Victini: Take off 1 IV from a stat and get Fur Coat/Huge power or it's special variants, or even a gigantic speed boost. Pretty strong. All the 6 should start off BANNED.

[Edit] Mega Metagross: By tossing a few EVs in SPDef and SPA, Mega Gross can reach over 500 speed without even investing in it, and still being able to deal massive amounts of damage. Should start off as BANNED

[Edit] Mega Blastoise: Wile still walled by special tanks, Mega Blastoise can invest as much as it wants on speed, and that combined with it's great bulk and above average offensive potential makes it questionable. Potential ban.

[Edit2] Huge/Pure Power: Azumarril, Diggersby, Medicham and other abusers of those abilities can easily set ATK as their lowest stat, however they do sacrifice a lot of bulk/speed in order to fulfill that, so they are just a Potential Threat.

Tapu Bulu: Can have 410 speed with the right EV spread, and it still allows you to fully invest in ATK and invest quite a lot on bulk, all that wile still receiving the Grassy Terrain bonus to it's Grass STAB. Potential ban.

Magearna: Same problem as Bulu, can have insane speed stats wile still holding massive offensive capabilities. Potential ban.

Questions for the community: How should items like Eviolite be handled? Should Abilities and Stat-Enchanting items (Like Thick Club) actually factor in determining a mon's lowest stat?
I really like this idea and I have been theorymonning a lot about it. I think this meta works best if EVs and IVs are considered, but not items. There are many possibilities:

Amazing wallbreaker.
Kyurem-Black @ Choice Specs
Ability: Teravolt
EVs: 4 Atk / 76 Def / 24 SpA / 152 SpD / 252 Spe (506 SpA)
Jolly Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Draco Meteor
- Ice Beam
- Earth Power
- Focus Blast

Fast and powerful.
Tapu Koko
Ability: Electric Surge
EVs: 8 HP / 84 Def / 164 SpD / 252 Spe (452 SpA)
Timid Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Dazzling Gleam
- Hidden Power Ice
- U-turn

Celesteela @ Flyinium Z
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 152 HP / 16 Atk / 72 SpA / 16 SpD / 252 Spe (442 SpA)
Jolly Nature
- Autotomize
- Air Slash
- Flash Cannon
- Fire Blast

Another amazing wallbreaker!
Zygarde @ Choice Band
Ability: Aura Break
EVs: 16 Atk / 176 SpA / 64 SpD / 252 Spe (480 Atk)
Hasty Nature
- Thousand Arrows
- Extreme Speed
- Outrage
- Iron Tail

Mawile-Mega @ Mawilite
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 52 Atk / 240 SpA / 216 Spe (820 Atk w/ Huge Power)
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Swords Dance
- Play Rough
- Thunder Punch
- Sucker Punch

Azumarill @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 192 Atk / 116 SpA / 200 Spe (736 Atk w/ Huge Power)
Serious Nature
- Belly Drum
- Aqua Jet
- Play Rough
- Knock Off

Viable Shell Smash Users!
Gorebyss @ White Herb
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 36 Atk / 252 SpA / 20 SpD / 200 Spe (380 Spe)
Modest Nature
- Shell Smash
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam
- Hidden Power [Electric]

Serperior @ Leftovers
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 108 Atk / 44 Def / 104 SpA / 252 Spe (424 SpA)
Hasty Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Leaf Storm
- Giga Drain
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Taunt

Xurkitree @ Expert Belt
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 44 Atk / 188 Def / 188 SpD / 88 Spe (448 Spe)
Serious Nature
- Tail Glow
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Energy Ball

Marowak-Alola @ Thick Club
Ability: Rock Head
EVs: 4 HP / 152 Atk / 188 SpA / 164 Spe (728 Atk)
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Swords Dance
- Shadow Bone
- Flare Blitz
- Earthquake

Lol - 252 Atk Tough Claws Metagross-Mega Zen Headbutt vs. +2 4 HP / 252 Def Pheromosa: 254-300 (89.4 - 105.6%)
Pheromosa @ Leftovers
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD (346 Def)
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Quiver Dance
- Focus Blast
- Ice Beam
- Roost

Unreleased monster!
Diancie-Mega @ Diancite
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 SpA / 4 Spe (462 Spe + max Atk and SpA)
Quiet Nature
- Moonblast
- Diamond Storm
- Earth Power
- Hidden Power [Fire]

Scolipede @ Waterium Z
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 44 Atk / 128 SpA / 84 SpD / 252 Spe (388 Atk)
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Swords Dance
- Poison Jab
- Aqua Tail
- Megahorn


Pseudo-Fur Coat Chansey, although it really feels the lacking SpD EVs in this meta.
Chansey @ Eviolite
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 248 Atk / 248 Def / 8 SpA / 4 SpD (321 Def w/ Eviolite)
Sassy Nature
IVs: 30 Def
- Soft-Boiled
- Stealth Rock
- Seismic Toss
- Toxic

Tangrowth @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD (369 SpD w/ AV) you could get more, I chose max Def
Lax Nature
- Giga Drain
- Knock Off
- Earthquake
- Hidden Power Fire

This is a potential spread for BP teams.
252+ Atk Choice Band Tyranitar Crunch vs. +2 40 HP / 252 Def Espeon: 236-282 (83.9 - 100.3%)
252+ Atk Tough Claws Metagross-Mega Meteor Mash vs. +2 40 HP / 252 Def Espeon: 123-145 (43.7 - 51.6%)
Espeon @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 216 Atk / 252 Def / 40 Spe (438 Def)
Serious Nature
- Calm Mind
- Stored Power
- Dazzling Gleam
- Morning Sun

Good mixed bulk + Unaware
Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD (max HP, max SpD and 310 Def)
Gentle Nature
IVs: 11 Atk / 22 Def
- Wish
- Protect
- Moonblast
- Heal Bell

Latias (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 20 Atk / 60 Def / 176 SpD (400 Def and pretty good SpD)
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Def
- Recover
- Psyshock
- Dragon Pulse
- Defog

or

252 Atk Tough Claws Metagross-Mega Meteor Mash vs. +2 252 HP / 180- Def Latias: 105-124 (28.8 - 34%)
252+ Atk Choice Band Tyranitar Crunch vs. +2 252 HP / 180- Def Latias: 222-264 (60.9 - 72.5%)
Latias (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 76 Atk / 180 Def (468 Def)
Lonely Nature
IVs: 0 Def
- Recover
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt
- Calm Mind

Alomomola @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Def / 88 SpA / 164 SpD (472/259/300)
Rash Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Wish
- Protect
- Toxic
- Scald


Does Beast Boost consider the boost given by the meta? And, if this meta was approved, would it be able to be an OMotM? Also, I think bans should be very carefully done, because the meta is so fast and powerful, like I think Manaphy is most probably broken, but Mew or Celebi not so much.
 

Tuthur

海贼王波波
is a Pre-Contributor
Completed
Metagame premise
: Pokemon no longer have their stats drops when they evolved or when they change forms during battle. Alternative evolutions have the best stats of both. Pokemon are also able to use there pre-evolutions, mega-evolutions and other forms abilities.

Potential bans and threats: OU clause, Wonder guard, Serene Grace+Shaymin, Parental Bond+Seismic Toss(Kangaskhan), Shadow Tag, Eeveelutions
Questions for the community: Should pre-evolutions get the same stats as final forms with the removal of eviolite? Should Nidoran-F and Nidoran-M be counted as one pokemon?
I think you can unban Landorus-I since it's same as Landorus-T or ban both of them. Shadow Tag has to be ban since it's as uncompetitive as before. I think you can aply the stats changement to pre-evolution as some can be more interessant than their evolution (eg: Numel and Staryu).
 

charizard8888

Thank you everyone!
is a Forum Moderator Alumnus
Guess I'll give it a shot.

Consolation Prize

Metagame premise: Pokemon have their lowest stat doubled. This does not take into account items, setup moves or abilities, it doubles the lowest raw stat. If a pokemon has more than one lowest stat (Say, like a no EV neutral nature mew for example) no boost will be received. HP does not count as a "Lowest Stat".

Potential bans and threats:

OU banlist and clauses

Mew/Celebi/Jirachi/Manaphy/Shaymin/Victini: Take off 1 IV from a stat and get Fur Coat/Huge power or it's special variants, or even a gigantic speed boost. Pretty strong. All the 6 should start off BANNED.

[Edit] Mega Metagross: By tossing a few EVs in SPDef and SPA, Mega Gross can reach over 500 speed without even investing in it, and still being able to deal massive amounts of damage. Should start off as BANNED

[Edit] Mega Blastoise: Wile still walled by special tanks, Mega Blastoise can invest as much as it wants on speed, and that combined with it's great bulk and above average offensive potential makes it questionable. Potential ban.

[Edit2] Huge/Pure Power: Azumarril, Diggersby, Medicham and other abusers of those abilities can easily set ATK as their lowest stat, however they do sacrifice a lot of bulk/speed in order to fulfill that, so they are just a Potential Threat.

Tapu Bulu: Can have 410 speed with the right EV spread, and it still allows you to fully invest in ATK and invest quite a lot on bulk, all that wile still receiving the Grassy Terrain bonus to it's Grass STAB. Potential ban.

Magearna: Same problem as Bulu, can have insane speed stats wile still holding massive offensive capabilities. Potential ban.

Questions for the community: How should items like Eviolite be handled? Should Abilities and Stat-Enchanting items (Like Thick Club) actually factor in determining a mon's lowest stat?
This sounds cool! EVs IVs investment will be required to keep in mind while team building. Slow and average speed mons like Dragonite will benefit the most.
Eviolite can be good with Type:Null and Chansey


Type: Null @ Eviolite
Ability: Battle Armor
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Spe
Serious Nature
IVs: 21 Def
This gives it 394 HP and 648 Defense (after the boost)
Still it lacks recovery moves, the only which it gets is Rest and there will be others getting huge attack boosts so this looks beatable and moreover its high defense might help in balancing the meta? That can only be known after some battles though.


Chansey (F)
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 112 Atk / 140 Def
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 Def
Chansey gets a respectable 240 Defense with 704 HP, earlier the highest Defense it could reach was 117. The boost makes it really bulky but there are others too getting boosts which can defeat this.


Marowak-Alola
Ability: Cursed Body
EVs: 80 Atk / 228 SpA / 200 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 29 Atk
Marowak reaches 768 Attack if Thick Club doesn't affect the Lowest Raw Stat, otherwise its highest is 564.
The question is can this thing be stopped? Pretty much yeah. Its quite slow, doesn't have priority, has average defenses and is weak to Ghost, Ground, Water, Dark, and Rock. Most this thing can get is 2 KOs in a match and 3 against unprepared sides.

Vikavolt can reach 370 Speed which is good.
Also how does the stat boost interact with Mega Evolution? Does the mega form carry the same boost as the base or it gets a boost in a different stat if it changes after Mega Evolution?
Either way Garchomp and Mega Garchomp look great in this.
Garchomp can go physical or special and if Mega changes the boost then the EVs IVs can be tweaked to make it fast (Yay Mega Chomp at its best)
Last and the least (yeah the least important thing of the discussion part :P) another name for the meta could be Fragility Boost but Consolation Price sounds nice as well.
I don't know if it already exists, but hey, i have an idea.

Ability sharing
Metagame premise: Ability sharing is an OU-based meta where you basically share your ability with your opponent, with a reset every switch. (your ability isn't replaced by the ability of the opponent, but you still can profit of it)

If you need a deeper explanation, let's just say : You have a Scolipede with Speed Boost and your opponent a Throh with Guts.
Turn 1 - At the end of the turn, both Pokemon's speeds are boosted by Speed Boost. The opponent's Flame Orb triggers.
Turn 2 - Scolipede use Return, which isn't boosted by Guts since unlike your Throh, Scolipede doesn't have a Flame Orb.
Turn 3 - The opponent switch for a Drifblim. At the end of the turn, Drifblim's speed is also boosted by Speed Boost.
Also, note that, even if abilities are "shared", they don't share the same rhythm, for example : if you have a Regigigas that isn't weakened by Slow Start anymore, and your opponent switches, your opponent's new mon will be weakened by Slow Start for 5 turns.

Potential bans and threats:
Serperior @ Life Orb
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Leaf Storm
- Dragon Pulse
- Hidden Power Fire
- Glare

Explanation: As always, Serperior is great. And now, it can reverse setups.

Liepard @ Black Glasses
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Nasty Plot
- Dark Pulse
- Copycat
- Encore

Explanation: Sharing Prankster make it now immune to status moves that targets it.

Questions for the community: Is the name bad ?
Do you think abilities' rhythm should be also shared ?
Now your opponent will feel what you feel when facing a Huge Power mon :D

The concept is great. I checked out the index and don't think there's a meta like this in it.
On to Serperior (Correct me if I missed something in this one) I think that it should not be banned because the one who is using Serperior should be aware and ready to handle the ability just like how it happens in BH. In the same way weather speed boost users like Excadrill would have to take care as the opponent will also get the same boost. And Liepard, looks solid with status immunity, not sure whether it should be banned or not.

Arena Trap, Intimidate, Emergency Exit, Magic Bounce, Levitate, Protean would be fun. The user of these abilities should make sure that their own team is able to handle any other mon with that ability. Volt Switch and U-turn will be good for getting the right ability to the right mon of your team. Hazard removal would help in getting abilities like Sturdy get activated. Abilities like Truant and Slow Start would affect the foe to so we might see Slaking banned again :/
This meta seems to have a lot of possibilities and would be fun to play!

Some Questions
How would weather summoning abilities work? Like what if Tyranitar and Torkoal switch in the same turn. I assume the slower Pokemon's weather would be summoned.
Would Mummy change all the abilities to Mummy?
Can mon specific abilities like Disguise and Shield down be copied?
Would Mega Evolutions carry two abilities or just the one which they get on mega evolving?
Name ideas: Quantumbility [Quantum + Ability], Ability Claim, Congruent Abilities, Ability Congruency, Congruentbilities, Ability Quadrant, Ability Copy, Copybility, Ability Combo, Combinationbility, Ability Congregation.
Feel free to mix/edit the words so that it sounds good :p
 
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Monotype 2.0
Metagame Premise:
All Pokemon must have one type in common - however, they can use the ability of anything that has that type as its primary type
Potential Bans and Threats: Contrary, Huge Power, Pure Power, Slaking, Regigigas, Fur Coat, Parental Bond, Protean, maybe Aerilate & Psychic Surge
Questions for the OM community: Good name?
 
I've had a number of ideas over time but, lemme just toss this one out.

Totem Showdown
  • Metagame premise: You know Totem Pokemon Battles? Basically, it's that. Doubles format with Slot 1 is a Totem Pokemon that always leads, cannot ever switch out, and has boosted stats across the board. The rest of the team reinforce the Totem Pokemon one at a time as they get knocked out, so long as the Totem is not KOed. First side to KO the Totem and any helpers on the field at the time wins.
  • Potential bans and threats. Obviously, ban Perish Song and probably Curse. Hard to say beyond that.
  • Questions for the community. How buffed should Totem Pokemon be? +1 across the board? Higher defenses than offenses, like +2 both defenses +1 both offenses? Should they get extra HP or other base stat increases? Some resistance or immunity to certain statuses, ala Wonder Skin?
  • Frequency of reinforcements? Should they lead with one and it function like normal battles? Reinforcements can only come in at the end of, say, even numbered turns to better simulate real Totem battles?
  • Allow Ubers as the totem?
I tried implementing this on Dragon Heaven.
Here's a replay
I also made it so that Totem Pokémon can't switch out even with U-Turn.

Guess I'll give it a shot.

Consolation Prize

Metagame premise: Pokemon have their lowest stat doubled. This does not take into account items, setup moves or abilities, it doubles the lowest raw stat. If a pokemon has more than one lowest stat (Say, like a no EV neutral nature mew for example) no boost will be received. HP does not count as a "Lowest Stat".

Potential bans and threats:

OU banlist and clauses

Mew/Celebi/Jirachi/Manaphy/Shaymin/Victini: Take off 1 IV from a stat and get Fur Coat/Huge power or it's special variants, or even a gigantic speed boost. Pretty strong. All the 6 should start off BANNED.

[Edit] Mega Metagross: By tossing a few EVs in SPDef and SPA, Mega Gross can reach over 500 speed without even investing in it, and still being able to deal massive amounts of damage. Should start off as BANNED

[Edit] Mega Blastoise: Wile still walled by special tanks, Mega Blastoise can invest as much as it wants on speed, and that combined with it's great bulk and above average offensive potential makes it questionable. Potential ban.

[Edit2] Huge/Pure Power: Azumarril, Diggersby, Medicham and other abusers of those abilities can easily set ATK as their lowest stat, however they do sacrifice a lot of bulk/speed in order to fulfill that, so they are just a Potential Threat.

Tapu Bulu: Can have 410 speed with the right EV spread, and it still allows you to fully invest in ATK and invest quite a lot on bulk, all that wile still receiving the Grassy Terrain bonus to it's Grass STAB. Potential ban.

Magearna: Same problem as Bulu, can have insane speed stats wile still holding massive offensive capabilities. Potential ban.

Questions for the community: How should items like Eviolite be handled? Should Abilities and Stat-Enchanting items (Like Thick Club) actually factor in determining a mon's lowest stat?
I don't know if it already exists, but hey, i have an idea.

Ability sharing
Metagame premise: Ability sharing is an OU-based meta where you basically share your ability with your opponent, with a reset every switch. (your ability isn't replaced by the ability of the opponent, but you still can profit of it)

If you need a deeper explanation, let's just say : You have a Scolipede with Speed Boost and your opponent a Throh with Guts.
Turn 1 - At the end of the turn, both Pokemon's speeds are boosted by Speed Boost. The opponent's Flame Orb triggers.
Turn 2 - Scolipede use Return, which isn't boosted by Guts since unlike your Throh, Scolipede doesn't have a Flame Orb.
Turn 3 - The opponent switch for a Drifblim. At the end of the turn, Drifblim's speed is also boosted by Speed Boost.
Also, note that, even if abilities are "shared", they don't share the same rhythm, for example : if you have a Regigigas that isn't weakened by Slow Start anymore, and your opponent switches, your opponent's new mon will be weakened by Slow Start for 5 turns.

Potential bans and threats:
Serperior @ Life Orb
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Leaf Storm
- Dragon Pulse
- Hidden Power Fire
- Glare

Explanation: As always, Serperior is great. And now, it can reverse setups.

Liepard @ Black Glasses
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Nasty Plot
- Dark Pulse
- Copycat
- Encore

Explanation: Sharing Prankster make it now immune to status moves that targets it.

Questions for the community: Is the name bad ?
Do you think abilities' rhythm should be also shared ?
Completed
Metagame premise
: Pokemon no longer have their stats drops when they evolved or when they change forms during battle. Alternative evolutions have the best stats of both. Pokemon are also able to use there pre-evolutions, mega-evolutions and other forms abilities.
Examples:
Glalie
Type: Ice Abilities: Refrigerate, Inner Focus, Ice Body, Moody, Snow Cloak, Cursed Body Stats: 80/80/80/80/80/110
Glalie-Mega
Stats: 80/120/80/120/80/110
Froslass
Type: Ice/Ghost Abilities: Refrigerate, Inner Focus, Ice Body, Moody, Snow Cloak, Cursed Body Stats: 80/80/80/80/80/110

Darmanitan
Type: Fire Abilities: Zen Mode, Sheer Force Stats: 105/140/55/35/55/95
Darmanitan-Zen
Type: Fire Abilities: Zen Mode Stats: 105/140/105/140/105/95

Nincada
Type: Bug/Ground Abilities: Compound Eyes, Run Away Stats: 31/45/90/30/30/40
Ninjask
Type: Bug/Flying Abilities: Compound Eyes, Run Away, Speed Boost, Infiltrator Stats: 61/90/90/50/50/160
Shedninja
Type: Bug/Ghost Abilities: Compound Eyes, Run Away, Speed Boost, Infiltrator Stats: 61/90/90/50/50/160

Potential bans and threats
: OU clause, Wonder guard, Serene Grace+Shaymin, Parental Bond+Seismic Toss(Kangaskhan), Shadow Tag, Eeveelutions
Questions for the community: Should pre-evolutions get the same stats as final forms with the removal of eviolite? Should Nidoran-F and Nidoran-M be counted as one pokemon?
These too. Use /reportbug if you come across any bugs
 
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RNGIsFatal

Banned deucer.
Don't know if this was suggested earlier but here it is.

SOS mons
For those who did not play Sun & Moon, from Gen 7 there is a chance that a wild pokemon will call another pokemon if it is in a pinch, and this causes a lot of frustrations in terms of catching something (but something beneficial for EV / EXP farm).

What would happen if same thing happen in Showdown? What if you are about to finish someone and an extra opponent appears to the original opponent? I doubt any of you will not find this interesting.
This sounds like a nightmare to code...
It is going to be tough one. But this meta will force players to make careful decisions about calling SoS or teambuilding in general.
 
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yeah, I know I owned 2 OMs already, but well, since this is a thread for sharing OM ideas, why not? Anyone interested in this idea can submit this.

This is the meta that got approved on the VERY end of Gen 6. Because of that, it never get much plays due to not even having a chance to even be voted for OMotM.

Nature's Fear

Metagame Premise:
1. All pokes have a special " Intimidate" on top on their ability, which means it still have their original Ability.
2. This Intimidate lowers opposing stats by 1 stage based on negative (may be changed to positive if it's better) side of the Nature. For example, if you send out a Timid natured pokemon, your opponent's Attack is lowered.

To summarize:

Bold, Modest, Calm and Timid Nature will lower opponent's Attack
Lonely, Mild, Gentle and Hasty Nature will lower opponent's Defense
Adamant, Impish, Careful and Jolly will lower opponent's Special Attack
Naughty, Lax, Rash and Naive will lower opponent's Special Defense
Brave, Relaxed, Quiet and Sassy will lower opponent's Speed

Bans and Clauses:
OU banlist

Threat list:

Defiant users
Contrary users
Walls in general has better time switching in
Clear Body/Hyper Cutter mons
Mixed attacker in general

Question for the community:
Should the stat drop follows positive or negative side of nature?

Also 1001st Post, because 1000th is boring and unoriginal :^)
 
I really like this idea and I have been theorymonning a lot about it. I think this meta works best if EVs and IVs are considered, but not items. There are many possibilities:

Amazing wallbreaker.
Kyurem-Black @ Choice Specs
Ability: Teravolt
EVs: 4 Atk / 76 Def / 24 SpA / 152 SpD / 252 Spe (506 SpA)
Jolly Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Draco Meteor
- Ice Beam
- Earth Power
- Focus Blast

Fast and powerful.
Tapu Koko
Ability: Electric Surge
EVs: 8 HP / 84 Def / 164 SpD / 252 Spe (452 SpA)
Timid Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Dazzling Gleam
- Hidden Power Ice
- U-turn

Celesteela @ Flyinium Z
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 152 HP / 16 Atk / 72 SpA / 16 SpD / 252 Spe (442 SpA)
Jolly Nature
- Autotomize
- Air Slash
- Flash Cannon
- Fire Blast

Another amazing wallbreaker!
Zygarde @ Choice Band
Ability: Aura Break
EVs: 16 Atk / 176 SpA / 64 SpD / 252 Spe (480 Atk)
Hasty Nature
- Thousand Arrows
- Extreme Speed
- Outrage
- Iron Tail

Mawile-Mega @ Mawilite
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 52 Atk / 240 SpA / 216 Spe (820 Atk w/ Huge Power)
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Swords Dance
- Play Rough
- Thunder Punch
- Sucker Punch

Azumarill @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 192 Atk / 116 SpA / 200 Spe (736 Atk w/ Huge Power)
Serious Nature
- Belly Drum
- Aqua Jet
- Play Rough
- Knock Off

Viable Shell Smash Users!
Gorebyss @ White Herb
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 36 Atk / 252 SpA / 20 SpD / 200 Spe (380 Spe)
Modest Nature
- Shell Smash
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam
- Hidden Power [Electric]

Serperior @ Leftovers
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 108 Atk / 44 Def / 104 SpA / 252 Spe (424 SpA)
Hasty Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Leaf Storm
- Giga Drain
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Taunt

Xurkitree @ Expert Belt
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 44 Atk / 188 Def / 188 SpD / 88 Spe (448 Spe)
Serious Nature
- Tail Glow
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Energy Ball

Marowak-Alola @ Thick Club
Ability: Rock Head
EVs: 4 HP / 152 Atk / 188 SpA / 164 Spe (728 Atk)
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Swords Dance
- Shadow Bone
- Flare Blitz
- Earthquake

Lol - 252 Atk Tough Claws Metagross-Mega Zen Headbutt vs. +2 4 HP / 252 Def Pheromosa: 254-300 (89.4 - 105.6%)
Pheromosa @ Leftovers
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD (346 Def)
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Quiver Dance
- Focus Blast
- Ice Beam
- Roost

Unreleased monster!
Diancie-Mega @ Diancite
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 SpA / 4 Spe (462 Spe + max Atk and SpA)
Quiet Nature
- Moonblast
- Diamond Storm
- Earth Power
- Hidden Power [Fire]

Scolipede @ Waterium Z
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 44 Atk / 128 SpA / 84 SpD / 252 Spe (388 Atk)
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Swords Dance
- Poison Jab
- Aqua Tail
- Megahorn


Pseudo-Fur Coat Chansey, although it really feels the lacking SpD EVs in this meta.
Chansey @ Eviolite
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 248 Atk / 248 Def / 8 SpA / 4 SpD (321 Def w/ Eviolite)
Sassy Nature
IVs: 30 Def
- Soft-Boiled
- Stealth Rock
- Seismic Toss
- Toxic

Tangrowth @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD (369 SpD w/ AV) you could get more, I chose max Def
Lax Nature
- Giga Drain
- Knock Off
- Earthquake
- Hidden Power Fire

This is a potential spread for BP teams.
252+ Atk Choice Band Tyranitar Crunch vs. +2 40 HP / 252 Def Espeon: 236-282 (83.9 - 100.3%)
252+ Atk Tough Claws Metagross-Mega Meteor Mash vs. +2 40 HP / 252 Def Espeon: 123-145 (43.7 - 51.6%)
Espeon @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 216 Atk / 252 Def / 40 Spe (438 Def)
Serious Nature
- Calm Mind
- Stored Power
- Dazzling Gleam
- Morning Sun

Good mixed bulk + Unaware
Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD (max HP, max SpD and 310 Def)
Gentle Nature
IVs: 11 Atk / 22 Def
- Wish
- Protect
- Moonblast
- Heal Bell

Latias (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 20 Atk / 60 Def / 176 SpD (400 Def and pretty good SpD)
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Def
- Recover
- Psyshock
- Dragon Pulse
- Defog

or

252 Atk Tough Claws Metagross-Mega Meteor Mash vs. +2 252 HP / 180- Def Latias: 105-124 (28.8 - 34%)
252+ Atk Choice Band Tyranitar Crunch vs. +2 252 HP / 180- Def Latias: 222-264 (60.9 - 72.5%)
Latias (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 76 Atk / 180 Def (468 Def)
Lonely Nature
IVs: 0 Def
- Recover
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt
- Calm Mind

Alomomola @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Def / 88 SpA / 164 SpD (472/259/300)
Rash Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Wish
- Protect
- Toxic
- Scald


Does Beast Boost consider the boost given by the meta? And, if this meta was approved, would it be able to be an OMotM? Also, I think bans should be very carefully done, because the meta is so fast and powerful, like I think Manaphy is most probably broken, but Mew or Celebi not so much.
Good builds, and it's nice to see people like it <3

About Beat Boost though, I intended on having it boost the highest raw stat, but it's not something necessary. However it works on the code should be fine.

Also, I'd love to see it become an OMOTM candidate, but I have no idea on how that works... If it happens it happens I suppose.

This sounds cool! EVs IVs investment will be required to keep in mind while team building. Slow and average speed mons like Dragonite will benefit the most.
Eviolite can be good with Type:Null and Chansey


Type: Null @ Eviolite
Ability: Battle Armor
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Spe
Serious Nature
IVs: 21 Def
This gives it 394 HP and 648 Defense (after the boost)
Still it lacks recovery moves, the only which it gets is Rest and there will be others getting huge attack boosts so this looks beatable and moreover its high defense might help in balancing the meta? That can only be known after some battles though.


Chansey (F)
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 112 Atk / 140 Def
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 Def
Chansey gets a respectable 240 Defense with 704 HP, earlier the highest Defense it could reach was 117. The boost makes it really bulky but there are others too getting boosts which can defeat this.


Marowak-Alola
Ability: Cursed Body
EVs: 80 Atk / 228 SpA / 200 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 29 Atk
Marowak reaches 768 Attack if Thick Club doesn't affect the Lowest Raw Stat, otherwise its highest is 564.
The question is can this thing be stopped? Pretty much yeah. Its quite slow, doesn't have priority, has average defenses and is weak to Ghost, Ground, Water, Dark, and Rock. Most this thing can get is 2 KOs in a match and 3 against unprepared sides.

Vikavolt can reach 370 Speed which is good.
Also how does the stat boost interact with Mega Evolution? Does the mega form carry the same boost as the base or it gets a boost in a different stat if it changes after Mega Evolution?
Either way Garchomp and Mega Garchomp look great in this.
Garchomp can go physical or special and if Mega changes the boost then the EVs IVs can be tweaked to make it fast (Yay Mega Chomp at its best)
Last and the least (yeah the least important thing of the discussion part :P) another name for the meta could be Fragility Boost but Consolation Price sounds nice as well.
I intended to make so that megas get their lowest stat doubled, rather than carrying over the boost from the pre evolution, but similarly to Beast Boost, as long as it doesn't break I'm fine with it.

And regarding the name, i called it Consolation Prize as a reference to an item in The Binding of Isaac: Antibirth. The item Consolation Prize gives you a +1 to your lowest stat upon pickup, which is just fitting.

Here's it's in-game sprite btw
 
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yeah, I know I owned 2 OMs already, but well, since this is a thread for sharing OM ideas, why not? Anyone interested in this idea can submit this.

This is the meta that got approved on the VERY end of Gen 6. Because of that, it never get much plays due to not even having a chance to even be voted for OMotM.

Nature's Fear

Metagame Premise:
1. All pokes have a special " Intimidate" on top on their ability, which means it still have their original Ability.
2. This Intimidate lowers opposing stats by 1 stage based on negative (may be changed to positive if it's better) side of the Nature. For example, if you send out a Timid natured pokemon, your opponent's Attack is lowered.

To summarize:

Bold, Modest, Calm and Timid Nature will lower opponent's Attack
Lonely, Mild, Gentle and Hasty Nature will lower opponent's Defense
Adamant, Impish, Careful and Jolly will lower opponent's Special Attack
Naughty, Lax, Rash and Naive will lower opponent's Special Defense
Brave, Relaxed, Quiet and Sassy will lower opponent's Speed

Bans and Clauses:
OU banlist

Threat list:

Defiant users
Contrary users
Walls in general has better time switching in
Clear Body/Hyper Cutter mons
Mixed attacker in general

Question for the community:
Should the stat drop follows positive or negative side of nature?
Also 1001st Post, because 1000th is boring and unoriginal :^)
I think it should stay negative. That way if you want a speed drop you actually have to use a speed lowering nature, which means more risk.
 
Yeah, spamming Scarfs and Bands/Specs against opposing offense sounds REALLY mindless and I'd love for it to not be a thing out the gate. Do Pokemon with Intimidate get both a guaranteed Attack drop plus their Nature's specified drop?

EDIT: I think Offense is going to completely steamroll this metagame, actually. I don't mean that as an insult, it was just something that occurred to me. You know how mixed attackers usually need to be played with some prediction? Not really anymore, or at least, you don't need mixed attackers. Simply switch Pheromosa in on a Chansey after revealing Quiver Dance (so they try to dance with the Focus Blast) and have a better than even chance of OHKOing after Rocks.

224+ SpA Pheromosa All-Out Pummeling (190 BP) vs. -1 4 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 530-626 (82.5 - 97.5%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

Really, expect Choice items and VoltTurn to reign supreme.
 
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Spandan Nice! Although not functioning quite properly as losing the totem should mean not being able to switch in any other Pokemon under any circumstance. Left side should have won on turn 2.

Though, if it's already being coded, I suppose I should go make a submission. ...probably tomorrow though when I'm not exhausted.
 
Love this thread! Really nice ideas. I've been toying with this idea for a while now, so here goes:

.:A Berry Useful Immunity:.


Tired of never having a chance to switch in because of spammable moves like Scald? Are you annoyed that some Pokemon's types are less useful because they don't have immunities to help them switch in or are too susceptible to a certain type?

Metagame premise:

An OU-based metagame where type resist berries now grant immunities to a type when held. For example, a Mamoswine with Passho Berry makes it immune to Water-type moves, while giving it Rindo berry makes it immune to Grass moves. They will have this immunity as long as they hold the berry.

Just like the normal berries, the immunities only work if the user is weak to a type (so Mamoswine with Yache berry will not be immune to Ice moves). If a Poison-weak user holds a Kebia berry, they will be immune to Poison damage AND Poison status. If a Fire-weak user holds an Occa berry, they will also be immune to Burn status. Wacan Berry users will be immune to Thunder Wave/Nuzzle, but will still be susceptible to other forms of paralysis like Glare (as they do no turn Electric type, they are just immune to Electric type paraysis moves).

As Stealth Rock calculates damage based on type effectiveness, Charti users may potentially be immune to SR damage...but not sure if this will turn into a Pet Mod (see Questions for Community below for more detail).

As for Chilan berry- since no one is weak to Normal, just like its normal effect, anyone can hold Chilan berry and gain a Normal immunity (mostly to protect you for Fake Out and Extremespeed)

Moldbreaker has no effect on the berry immunities, since it only interacts with abilities.

Tried to balance the immunity advantage by:
  • Using the item slot. Sure Sableye can be immune to Fairy moves now, but it can't Mega evolve or use Leftovers. Sweepers will have to rely on stat ups instead of Life Orb and NFEs like Chansey will have to forgo Eviolite.
  • Like the type resist berries' original effects, immunity only works on the Pokemon's weakness (except for Chilan Berry). This way, the immunity options are limited- you will always know that Normal types will potentially have a Fighting type immunity.
  • Knock Off will remove the immunities when the berries are Knocked Off. However, Colbur berries will make the holder immune to Dark type moves, so Knock Off has no effect.
  • The importance of Taunt/Whirlwind/Roar. Immunity holders will have to rely on boosting moves for offensive potential to replace the lack of Choice items/Life Orb.
  • Unnerve ignores all berry immunities.
Potential bans and threats:
-Moreso on the threats side, but Pokemon with one weakness:
  • Scizor has the potential to be a great Swords Dancer, being immune to the Fire type weakness and Poison/Burn status. Teams will have to rely on passive Rocks/Spikes damage to help inflict damage, which Scizor can just Defog/Roost. Taunt helps against Scizor though. Otherwise, Babiri Berry Unaware Clefable can keep it in check.
  • Normal types in general- they are now immune to both Ghost and Fighting. Snorlax will be formidable once it sets up (although it trades Leftovers for a Ghost/Fighting immunity). Blissey finally has defining niche against Chansey, with more HP + Fighting type immunity it walls a lot more Special sweepers who relied on Focus Blast hitting to dent the pink blob.
  • Pure Electric types turn their Ground weakness into an immunity. Xurkitree has an easier time using Tail Glow while bulky Raikou appreciates easier Calm Minds.
- Colbur + Ghost/Psychic types. Since they are immune to Dark type moves and therefore Knock Off- these types have a better advantage in that their Immunities won't be removed unless its by Trick/Switcheroo. This also protects them from both Sucker Punch and Pursuit- except from Unnerve Pursuit trapping Tyranitar.

- Magic Bounce. Protects from Taunt/pseudo-hazing moves, which protects Colbur Berry Espeon's stat boosts. Good for using Stored Power.

- Bulky Water types- in general are already good with only 2 weaknesses, so removing one is a great asset. Specifically, Electric immunities protect you from Volt Switch momentum breakers. Some notable ones:
  • Gyarados. Being immune to Electricity leaves it with one weakness- and can take advantage of a Electric/Ground moves to provide a well-placed Intimidate, then Substitute/Dragon Dance away. Ironically, now becomes a great Electric type counter.
  • Mantine really appreciates being immune to Electricity. Although it loses Lefties, the lack of a x4 weakness helps it sponge special attacks and Roost damage better.
  • Gastrodon. Rindo Berry removes its only weakness to Ground, and coupled with Storm Drain, allows it to be a great counter against Rain teams, not fearing Hidden Power grass anymore.
- Fairy types. Their weaknesses are not that common, so removing one of them is a great boon. Unaware Clefable doesn't have to worry about Poison status anymore if it has Kebia, while Babiri Berry protects it from Scizor's Bullet punches.
- Tapu Koko with Shuca berry leaves it with only a Poison weaknesses, which gives it great synergy with Steel types (Tapu Koko can protect them from Ground moves). Nice pivoting potential as it has access to both pivot moves.
- Magnezone- now has Ground immunity that lasts for more than one-turn, allowing it to be a safer Steel switch-in. While Skarmory/Celesteela can choose either a Fire/Electric immunity, Magnezon has Sturdy to allow insurance in finding out which immunity they have, and then fire of a Thunderbolt/Hidden Power Fire once you find out their immunity berry.
- Dragonite- extra immunities helps with Multiscale DD sets. Mindgame galore with baiting which move to use- is it immune to Ice? Or maybe the spammable Fairy? Guess wrong and Dragonite has already boosted.
- Yache Garchomp has returned with a vengeance. Or is he baiting you and has a Roseli berry instead?


Misc Metagame thoughts:
- Choice users will be less effective, since these potentially give a free turn/switch-in. Same with Mono-attacking Sleep Talk sets and Self Destruct/Explosion.
- Volturn will not be as spammable, which could lead to more interesting, tactical plays where you have to be more careful.
- Taunt is more important against both stat boosters + pseudohazers.
- Knock Off will be more important but also be a liability against Colbur berry users. Colbur berry users will be important to block Knock Offs and may see a rise.
- Hazards. Switching will be a lot more prevalent because every type potentially will have no effect against another type. Mispredicting potentially means a switch, so damage can add up.
- Defog will be more useful, in relation to the last point.
- Chilan Berry+ Sturdy protects your leads from Fake Out, guaranteeing you at least two turns. Doesn't protect from Taunt though.
- Scald will be less spammable. Grass types with Occa Berry laugh at the face of boiling water (takes resisted damage but is immune to burn). Physical Rock/Ground types appreciate the immunity to Scald's burn chance (although can still be burned by Fire moves).
- Occa berry Grass types finally have a way to protect themselves from the increased Fire damage under Sun. Physical Chlorophyll sweepers in particular don't need to fear burn status anymore. Technician Breloom also appreciates immunity to burn which would've weakened its Mach Punches.
- Similarly, Swift Swimmers love Wacan Berry- protecting them from Electric attacks as well as Thunder Wave paralysis. Ludicolo can use Coba berry to protect itself from accurate Hurricanes.
- Shuca berry Heatran finally removes its x4 Ground weakness for more than one turn. Notably, Specially Defensive versions have nothing to fear against Magnezone as long as it can survive a Thunderbolt, as it will be immune to Hidden Power Ground/Fire.
- Unaware users will be more important for set-up sweepers. Babiri Clefable is great against Scizor, while Quagsire has a niche of having no weaknesses with a Rindo berry (and can Recover off the damage).
- Unnerve will also be a more useful ability now. Unnerve Tyranitar ignores Colbur Berry and makes a great Pursuit trapper for Psychic/Ghost types.
- Trick may see some use again. Although situational, something like Toxic Orb + Magic Guard Alakazam using Trick against a Colbur Berry holder would be a good exchange.
- Noivern/Gothitelle's Frisk ability will have more use? lol


Questions for the community
-STEALTH ROCK-. SR relies type effectiveness to deal damage (50% against Rock/Flying). Would making Rock-weak Charti-berry users immune to SR turn this into a Pet mod? The berry turns the weakness into an immunity, and Stealth Rock weakness IS weakness-reliant. Could make for more interesting metagame potential where things SR-immune Volcarona and co. would gain more viability. Additionally, this 'balances' out by telegraphing what immunity a Pokemon has (so a full health Aerodactyl is confirmed to be Rock immune instead of Water. Saving you one turn of being outpredicted).

If immunity is allowed, this opens up a couple of options, for example:
  • Another thing that helps Multiscale Dragonite (but also saves you trying to predict if he will be immune to Ice/Fairy).
  • Eases switch-ins for rock-weather setters like Pelipper, Alola-Ninetales or the Drought setters. (Although weather has less turns per switch-in, in exchange for more opportunities to safely set weather again in the longer term)
  • Quiver Dance + Roost Volcarona being more viable again.
  • Talonflame/Moltres switches in safer. Rock immunity highlights defensive benefits of Fire/Flying, allowing the mto become bulky defoggers that are immune to all hazards. Good synergy with a Water-immune Ground type to absorb Water/Electric attacks.

-Other hazards. Poison-weak Kebia-berry holders will be immune to Toxic Spikes because they are immune to Poison, but they won't absorb the Toxic Spikes like Poison types.

Should Ground-weak Shuca users (grants Ground immunity) be immune to Spikes? Spikes don't rely on Ground weaknesses, and I think they just deal typeless damage? I feel like Spikes should be left as is...if they they will be immune to Spikes, then I feel this mechanics change makes it a Pet Mod?

Or should hazards just stay the same then (Charti having no effect on SR)? Or just have Stealth Rock immunities because that's the only one that relies on type effectiveness (leaning to this because more interesting, but again don't want this to be a Pet Mod)?

-Type Changes (Conversion/Camouflage)- How do the normal type-resist berries handle this (my guess is they don't, they just reduce damage)? If Colbur Berry Starmie uses Camouflage, should it just retain its Dark immunity until its item gets removed? If it switches out and switches in again, it will go back to its original typing anyway.

This is more an issue for Camouflage/Reflect Type rather than Conversion, since Porygon-Z would rather use Normalium-Z (Normal type means it can only use Chople Berry anyway, so if it uses Conversion, it would gain weaknesses).

As for Imposter- I'm thinking Ditto will keep the Fighting type immunity when Transformed (again, it will most likely gain a weakness when it transforms unless it transforms to Normal type).

-Scrappy & Ignoring Fighting/Normal type immunities. Scrappy's description states how it only affects Ghost types, but is that how it is coded in the game? Or is it coded that Normal/Fighting has no immunities at all?

If it's the latter, then the scenario will be like this: Pangoro's Dark type moves will still have no effect on Colbur Berry holders, but Normal/Fighting moves can damage Chople/Chilan berry holders.

Otherwise if it the coding needs to be changed as well (if the ability originally only works on specifically Ghost types), does that push this to Pet Mod territory again?


In hide tags because of length..

Maybe someone likes this idea enough to pick it up?
 
Last edited:

AWailOfATail

viva la darmz
-STEALTH ROCK-. SR relies type effectiveness to deal damage (50% against Rock/Flying). Would making Rock-weak Charti-berry users immune to SR turn this into a Pet mod? The berry turns the weakness into an immunity, and Stealth Rock weakness IS weakness-reliant. Could make for more interesting metagame potential where things SR-immune Volcarona and co. would gain more viability. Additionally, this 'balances' out by telegraphing what immunity a Pokemon has (so a full health Aerodactyl is confirmed to be Rock immune instead of Water. Saving you one turn of being outpredicted).

If immunity is allowed, this opens up a couple of options, for example:
  • Another thing that helps Multiscale Dragonite (but also saves you trying to predict if he will be immune to Ice/Fairy).
  • Eases switch-ins for rock-weather setters like Pelipper, Alola-Ninetales or the Drought setters. (Although weather has less turns per switch-in, in exchange for more opportunities to safely set weather again in the longer term)
  • Quiver Dance + Roost Volcarona being more viable again.
  • Talonflame/Moltres switches in safer. Rock immunity highlights defensive benefits of Fire/Flying, allowing the mto become bulky defoggers that are immune to all hazards. Good synergy with a Water-immune Ground type to absorb Water/Electric attacks.

-Other hazards. Poison-weak Kebia-berry holders will be immune to Toxic Spikes because they are immune to Poison, but they won't absorb the Toxic Spikes like Poison types.

Should Ground-weak Shuca users (grants Ground immunity) be immune to Spikes? Spikes don't rely on Ground weaknesses, and I think they just deal typeless damage? I feel like Spikes should be left as is...if they they will be immune to Spikes, then I feel this mechanics change makes it a Pet Mod?

Or should hazards just stay the same then (Charti having no effect on SR)? Or just have Stealth Rock immunities because that's the only one that relies on type effectiveness (leaning to this because more interesting, but again don't want this to be a Pet Mod)?

-Type Changes (Conversion/Camouflage)- How do the normal type-resist berries handle this (my guess is they don't, they just reduce damage)? If Colbur Berry Starmie uses Camouflage, should it just retain its Dark immunity until its item gets removed? If it switches out and switches in again, it will go back to its original typing anyway.

This is more an issue for Camouflage/Reflect Type rather than Conversion, since Porygon-Z would rather use Normalium-Z (Normal type means it can only use Chople Berry anyway, so if it uses Conversion, it would gain weaknesses).

As for Imposter- I'm thinking Ditto will keep the Fighting type immunity when Transformed (again, it will most likely gain a weakness when it transforms unless it transforms to Normal type).

-Scrappy & Ignoring Fighting/Normal type immunities. Scrappy's description states how it only affects Ghost types, but is that how it is coded in the game? Or is it coded that Normal/Fighting has no immunities at all?

If it's the latter, then the scenario will be like this: Pangoro's Dark type moves will still have no effect on Colbur Berry holders, but Normal/Fighting moves can damage Chople/Chilan berry holders.

Otherwise if it the coding needs to be changed as well (if the ability originally only works on specifically Ghost types), does that push this to Pet Mod territory again?
[/hide]

In hide tags because of length..

Maybe someone likes this idea enough to pick it up?
For Stealth Rock, it is weakness-reliant, but it is not immunity-reliant. The way it is currently handled is:
Code:
onSwitchIn: function (pokemon) {
     let typeMod = this.clampIntRange(pokemon.runEffectiveness('Rock'), -6, 6);
     this.damage(pokemon.maxhp * Math.pow(2, typeMod) / 8);
},
runEffectiveness doesn't account for immunities, and the formula used could never be 0. So, as of now, the Rock immunity would not affect Stealth Rock damage.

Spikes checks for isGrounded, but being immune to Ground is not the same as not being grounded. There's a lot of overlap, so I may actually be wrong on this one, but I'm fairly sure they're different.

The berry immunity would check for the typeMod on the current Pokemon, which to my understanding, factors in forme changes. As of normal mechanics, a Starmie with a Tanga Berry (halves SE Bug attacks) after using Camouflage does not use the berry when hit by a Bug-type move. So, in this metagame, since it is no longer being hit super-effectively by it, it would lose that immunity.

Scrappy ignores all immunities of Fighting and Normal, so it should be able to hit a Chople/Chilan holder.

This is currently how everything would act, but it could be worked around (if, for example, Rock immunity should bypass Stealth Rock).
 
Spikes checks for isGrounded, but being immune to Ground is not the same as not being grounded. There's a lot of overlap, so I may actually be wrong on this one, but I'm fairly sure they're different.
The obvious test here is that Shedinja is immune to Ground, but gets KO'd by Spikes anyway. Likewise, it's the only thing to maintain an immunity to Thousand Arrows.
 
The obvious test here is that Shedinja is immune to Ground, but gets KO'd by Spikes anyway. Likewise, it's the only thing to maintain an immunity to Thousand Arrows.
Not sure that's the obvious test. Shedinja is immune to Grass, but is KOed by Leech Seed. Immune to Ice, KOed by Hail. Immune to Poison, KOed by Poison status. Wonder Guard doesn't really function as a proper immunity.
 
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