Metagame Workshop

It's worth noting that Sand Rush already gives you immunity to sandstorm damage, without having to bring Magic Guard on board. Obviously if you're using Blacephalon then you'll want it anyway for that, but that's a sort of two-Pokemon core that can be swapped out without impacting the other four much.
That's pretty interesting, I didn't know that at all - definitely could lead to some pretty good support for sand teams in the future. That being said, I think without Magic Guard the team would have to be reworked a bit more(which isnt necessarily an issue) - Magic Guard supports this team mostly by allowing abuse of Life Orb without recoil damage(and Blacephalon's Mind Blown like you mentioned).

However, Magic Guard helps this team and any team in general in Shared Power by removing damage that normally comes with hazards, or status like Toxic or Toxic Spikes, making it what i'd argue to be a top tier ability. While it seems a bit boring to have Alakazam/Clefable/Sigilyph on every team, it's great for teambuilding because it removes the necessity for the role of hazard control.

For this team there would definitely have to be a bit more to be reworked other than Blacephalon(if Magic Guard was removed), and not needing hazard control also allows Excadrill to abuse setup as opposed to rapid spin.
 
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So I've been trying to think of how to build a stall team in Shared Power that wouldn't be completely invalidated by facing another stall team (because Stall v Stall in this meta is essentially a perpetual stalemate thanks to Magic Guard + Regenerator) and I came up with this. It's far from perfect and doesn't perform as well against offense as most stall teams would, but it's something.



Lapras @ Grip Claw
Ability: Shell Armor
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Whirlpool
- Perish Song
- Protect
- Ice Beam

Lapras' is a weird choice, but absolutely essential to what the team needs to do. While Whirlpool's persistent damage doesn't effect magic guard users, the trapping effect remains, meaning Lapras can effectively trap and destroy pokemon on any stall team that doesn't carry soundproof thanks to perish song. Ice Beam is there to avoid making Lapras complete dead weight against offense, though it does provide it's team with Shell Armor to aid in that as well.




Tangrowth @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpA
Brave Nature
- Infestation
- Knock Off
- Power Whip
- Earthquake

I chose Tangrowth over Toxapex as the team's Regenerator donor for a few reasons. The first being to avoid exacerbating Lapras' electric weakness, but also due to Tangrowth's more notable offensive presence. Allowing it to trap opposing mons with infestation and hopefully dish out more damage than they're capable of healing back with Regenerator. Though it still fails to beat a lot of mons that have dedicated recovery outside of Regenerator, it's capable of significant annoyance thanks to Knock Off.




Dragonite @ Life Orb
Ability: Multiscale
EVs: 252 HP / 156 SpA / 100 SpD
Calm Nature
- Flamethrower
- Hurricane
- Wrap
- Roost

Multiscale + Regenerator is just one of the best combo's I can think of in this meta and I'd be shocked if Dragonite doesn't become a staple on defensive teams. Confusion damage is one of the few forms of status that actually affect Magic Guard mons, meaning trapping + Hurricane is a fairly effective way to break down opposing mons, and thanks to Roost, it's actually capable of going toe to toe with mons that possess their own form of recovery.




Zapdos @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 8 Def / 248 SpAtk / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Discharge
- Whirlwind
- Heat Wave
- Roost

Zapdos is here to provide some offensive presence as well as lending Pressure to the rest of the team, shortening the longevity of anything that attempts to heal up in the face of Tangrowth or Dragonite.




Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Moonblast
- Soft-Boiled
- Stealth Rock
- Knock Off

Standard Clefable, pretty much singlehandedly changes how Stall v Stall matchups work out in this meta, and integral in making sure this team doesn't get worn down against more common stall archetypes. Magic Guard also has the benefit of providing Dragonite with a free Life Orb boost, allowing Hurricane and Flamethrower to deal significantly more damage without the decidedly anti-stall chip damage LO provides.




Quagsire @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Relaxed Nature
- Scald
- Earthquake
- Recover
- Curse

Well... we can't have 2 clefables.
 
I have decided to work on a Shared Power ability compendium for when the metagame is released. Keep in mind that this list isn’t even close to finished and that the abilties themselves are in no particular order. The purpose of this resource is to illustrate the most useful abilities, it’s best users, and its best receivers. These will be grouped into different categories for different playstyles. Notice how Magic Guard falls under “all-around” and not “balanced” since it, and several other abilities are usable in a wide variety of archetypes. While I understand basically everything benefits from everything, this makes it easier to see the most viable team options (I intend for the order of the supporters/receivers to be based on viability). This is missing a very important platystyle in the metagame which is weather. Before I add other abilities, let me know what you think!

Magic Guard
Supporters:

Receivers:
Regenerator
Supporters:

Receivers:



Unaware
Supporters:

Receivers:
Adaptability
Supporters:

Receivers:



Sheer Force
Supporters:

Receivers:
Levitate
Supporters:

Receivers:



Water Immunity
Supporters:

Receivers:



Fire Immunity
Supporters:

Receivers:



Electric Immunity
Supporters:

Receivers:
This is a great guideline and the way the abilities are classified makes sense, though it's really hard to say what's going to actually work without testing, due to the sheer level of variation possible in this meta. This is still nice as sort of a proto-viability ranking sorta thing

Personally, I don't think Kingdra really belongs on the list of Adaptability mons. Water mons in general typically appreciate Water Bubble more and Kingdra isn't that useful outside of Rain Teams, even then, Swampert-Mega may end up outshining it.

Excadrill could probably sit on the list of Receivers for Levitate as well, given that one of it's most common sets back in the day was an Air Balloon set.
-----------------

A couple suggestions, but don't consider the mons I used to be concrete. Remove/add whatever you want, I just wanted to put some stuff forward

Add Multiscale to all-around.

Supporters:

Receivers:


While abilities like Regenerator also benefit offense, there aren't really any regenerator mons that fit well on an offense team. Dragonite however has great offensive and defensive presence, and can fit reasonably well into either playstyle. Giving offensive leads a huge advantage over their opponent, and providing opportunities for set-up mons as long as the offensive player has a way of dealing with hazards, which given Dragonite's access to defog, isn't too hard to accomplish. Bulky offense benefits from this more than HO, but it's a great ability in almost any situation. Ideal receivers would be your typical leads like Lando-T, Tapu-koko or Greninja, who are given a guaranteed advantage over their opposing leads when facing other offensive teams. Defensive mons love multiscale for obvious reasons, but the ones listed here are listed due to their great synergy with Dragonite. Serene Grace providing Hurricane with a 60% confusion chance, Regenerator + Multiscale providing nearly free switches to any team without a ridiculous amount of fire power etc.


Add Crawdaunt and Beedrill-mega to the list of Adaptability users.

While they aren't as good as GonZ, and Beedrill takes up a mega-slot, they both benefit more from the other offensive abilities in the game such as Tough Claws/Technician, and Crawdaunt fits onto rain teams much more easily.

Add Prankster to all around

Supporters:

Receivers:


It leans slightly more defensive but giving offensive mons the ability to use priority taunt/defog/sub/TWave or boosts is pretty nifty. Klefki, Thundurus and Whimsicott are pretty much the only viable donors. I guess Sableye is okay in case you wanna go mega at some point. Honestly, the mons I put here are probably not even the best receivers of it but the list is fairly endless.


Add Serene Grace to offensive

Supporters:

Receivers:


Serene Grace users are already annoying, but the mons that can receive it are even worse. Pidgeot-mega is probably the most threatening, as with Serene Grace, it has a 60% chance of confusing or flinching you with either Hurricane or Air Slash, while neither can miss thanks to No Guard. Aerodactyl and Weavile's main draw is their huge speed stats. While the accuracy on their flinching moves hurts these sets considerably due to flinchhax reliance on consistency. It doesn't all have to be flinchhax though, pretty much every water type in the game appreciates the boosted Scald burn rate, and PorygonZ's tri attack is semi-reliable for inflicting status now.

(Also, Serene Grace + Tough Claws + Adaptability + Strong Jaw + Technician = 60% Flinch Chance on Weavile's bite and 359 BP after STAB, yikes)


Add No Guard for Offensive

Supporters:

Receivers:


There are so many high BP moves in the game that go unused due to their poor accuracy. Mons like Nidoking can now afford to run Blizzard/Fire Blast over Ice Beam and Flamethrower, while MLop's High Jump Kick no longer risks 50% recoil. Kyurem now has a better Ice STAB in Blizzard. Xurkitree and Magnezone can afford to run Zap Cannon (which is actually more powerful than Thunder, on top of the 100% para chance). Also, Gengar and Xurkitree get a perfectly accurate Hypnosis, which benefits both of them tremendously.


Also, for Grass immunities, Goodra is pretty much the only viable mon, but it's there, and given that Water/Ground has 0 weaknesses with Grass off the table, it might be pretty desirable on a rain team w/ MegaPert
 
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^I don't think plus/minus really needs to be added to the mix, especially if it means changing mechanics. Also it sounds potentially busted lol. The name Shared Power is good, and I don't think the name of the meta really needs to have some variation of the word "ability" in it.

anyways um

Shiny Swap

A similar idea has been presented in this thread a while back, and seem to have gained traction but never went anywhere as far as I'm aware. I'll still present the idea since it's a simple one.

Metagame premise: A pokemon's shiny form will swap its base Atk with Def, SpA with SpD, HP with Spe (and maybe resistances with weaknesses).


Snorlax(N): 160 HP / 110 Atk / 65 Def / 65 SpA / 110 SpD / 30 Spe
Snorlax(S): 30 HP / 65 Atk / 110 Def / 110 SpA / 65 SpD / 160 Spe


Crobat(N): 85 HP / 90 Atk / 80 Def / 70 SpA / 80 SpD / 130 Spe
Crobat(S): 130 HP / 80 Atk / 90 Def / 80 SpA / 70 SpD / 85 Spe

Potential bans and threats:
-I can't think of anything obviously broken with this mechanic, but some speedy attackers would make really solid walls and some fat mons would be really dangerous offensively. Huge power mons like Azumarill and Mega Mawile get a significant buff, but they also take a hit to their bulk that may keep them balanced.
-I can see shiny Araquanid being insane with its base 132 SpA + Water Bubble. It's still weighed down somewhat by its mediocre base 68 speed and 42/70/50 defenses.
-Shiny Steelix is terrifying

Questions for the community:
-Is a simple stat swap too basic? Should something else change with the shiny form? If so, what aspect of a pokemon's abilities/movepool/etc can be "swapped" in a way that the shiny forms won't completely outshine their counterparts?
-Are shiny-based metagame ideas dumb?
-Would teams be comprised of mostly shiny counterparts or would normal forms still see a lot of use?
I love this idea its perfect !! Especially since its not as complicated as the other one (as shiny shift that was posted a while ago) and still retains the same inverse stat-like mechanic

To answer some of the questions:
-no i think its fine as it is, remember simple isnt always bad, they are sometimes the best oms (like stabmons, simple but very fun)

-idk tbh, would it be better to make all the mons have swapped stats without relying on shiny? Or is it better to give variety in giving people the option to use normal stat spread koko for example? For me i think variety is better

-i think we would see more shiny forms than regular, due to the many new wack options we got (shiny snorlax, steelix, blissey, azumarill, lando)

Also i dont think u should add the inverse type resistances and weaknesses, it just makes it way more confusing and more similar to inverse battle

Heres link to the original post if anyones interested: http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/metagame-workshop-check-post-1293.3598275/page-32#post-7435731
 
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I think we ought to look at something else in this metagame. Granted this will not be happening during day 1, I have a question for the community. Should we regulate weather as a whole? Every single Pokemon doubling its speed and being able to set the weather that permits that at the same time sounds like it’s even worse than the banned Speed Boost. Sand teams (the best weather archetype) effectively have every Pokemon double its speed at almost all times, and this is worrysome. I’d like to receive input on the community on this proposal: should ALL weather-inducing abilities become banned in Shared Power?

Before we answer this, let’s look at what these abilities are:
  • Sand Stream is the worst offender here, as Tyranitar (main weather setter) is already a terrific Pokemon, and Excadrill is absolutely no slouch. With supporters like Latios and Water-immune Pokemon (which all receive the Sand Rush boost) this playstyle seems borderline unbeatable. It can hold its own against all of the other weather archetypes. I propose banning Sand Stream from being shared in order for weather to remain viable yet a little more balanced. However, if we do this, I believe we will have to ban the other ones as well. Moving on:
  • Drizzle is another big threat in the metagame as this one not only provides the team with a speed-doubling ability in Swift Swim, but it boosts the power of Water STAB as well. While Pelipper and Kingdra are not nearly as good as Tyranitar and Excadrill, they still provide a scary amount of support to the rest of their teammates, as they can all simply switch in and trigger the weather and Speed boost as well.
  • Drought has the monster known as Mega Charizard Y providing Drought support once it Mega Evolves. While the selection of Chlorophyll users isn’t the most elite, they still provide the rest of the team (and Charizard Y itself, which is terrifying) with the doubled Speed. Water immunities also help Drought team win the weather war with Drizzle teams. Lastly:
  • Snow Warning may seem a little dumb compared to all the other ones I mentioned because of how underwhelming Hail is as a whole, but Hail has something over all the other weathers out there that’s pretty broken, and that is Aurora Veil. Alolan Ninetales blesses the entire team with Aurora Veil support, and Alolan Sandslash provides the Speed boost. Aurora Veil is a very dangerous move in this meta as it’s centralized on offense, so I believe Snow Warning is on the same level as the previous abilities are mentioned.
So again, my question is whether we should ban/suspect test weather abilities as a whole so that the entire team does not have access to them. This would mean that every team could still have the ability that boosts the speed stat in weather, but they will have to depend on the sole setter being conserved, making it a much less apparent threat in the metagame. I do not want this to turn into a metagame where weather is the only viable playstyle or a centralizing one. Let me know what you think!
 
I think we ought to look at something else in this metagame. Granted this will not be happening during day 1, I have a question for the community. Should we regulate weather as a whole? Every single Pokemon doubling its speed and being able to set the weather that permits that at the same time sounds like it’s even worse than the banned Speed Boost. Sand teams (the best weather archetype) effectively have every Pokemon double its speed at almost all times, and this is worrysome. I’d like to receive input on the community on this proposal: should ALL weather-inducing abilities become banned in Shared Power?

Before we answer this, let’s look at what these abilities are:
  • Sand Stream is the worst offender here, as Tyranitar (main weather setter) is already a terrific Pokemon, and Excadrill is absolutely no slouch. With supporters like Latios and Water-immune Pokemon (which all receive the Sand Rush boost) this playstyle seems borderline unbeatable. It can hold its own against all of the other weather archetypes. I propose banning Sand Stream from being shared in order for weather to remain viable yet a little more balanced. However, if we do this, I believe we will have to ban the other ones as well. Moving on:
  • Drizzle is another big threat in the metagame as this one not only provides the team with a speed-doubling ability in Swift Swim, but it boosts the power of Water STAB as well. While Pelipper and Kingdra are not nearly as good as Tyranitar and Excadrill, they still provide a scary amount of support to the rest of their teammates, as they can all simply switch in and trigger the weather and Speed boost as well.
  • Drought has the monster known as Mega Charizard Y providing Drought support once it Mega Evolves. While the selection of Chlorophyll users isn’t the most elite, they still provide the rest of the team (and Charizard Y itself, which is terrifying) with the doubled Speed. Water immunities also help Drought team win the weather war with Drizzle teams. Lastly:
  • Snow Warning may seem a little dumb compared to all the other ones I mentioned because of how underwhelming Hail is as a whole, but Hail has something over all the other weathers out there that’s pretty broken, and that is Aurora Veil. Alolan Ninetales blesses the entire team with Aurora Veil support, and Alolan Sandslash provides the Speed boost. Aurora Veil is a very dangerous move in this meta as it’s centralized on offense, so I believe Snow Warning is on the same level as the previous abilities are mentioned.
So again, my question is whether we should ban/suspect test weather abilities as a whole so that the entire team does not have access to them. This would mean that every team could still have the ability that boosts the speed stat in weather, but they will have to depend on the sole setter being conserved, making it a much less apparent threat in the metagame. I do not want this to turn into a metagame where weather is the only viable playstyle or a centralizing one. Let me know what you think!
I personally think that they should be banned or suspect tested. Swampert-M is downright terrifying. Rain Dish Drizzle and Swift Swim is a deadly combination.if we regulated them, you would actually need to run a fast setter in order to run a weather after it stops, even then, it could get killed easily.
 
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Magikingdra it’s very important to note that banning weather abilities does not mean that you can’t use a Tyranitar with Sand Stream. It just means that the rest of the team won’t have access to it. Weather rocks would be something to look at way in the future, but they don’t seem like a huge issue at this moment.
 
how will banned ability work? will it be they wont transfer to other pokemon but still be legal or will that ability not be able to be used at all? the first is unlike most other metas and the second is quite troubling for certain pokemon as they them selves would become illegal if they don't have any other abilities the only one I can think of is shedinja which I think is already banned cause sturdy + shed + magic guard unbeatable
 
how will banned ability work? will it be they wont transfer to other pokemon but still be legal or will that ability not be able to be used at all? the first is unlike most other metas and the second is quite troubling for certain pokemon as they them selves would become illegal if they don't have any other abilities the only one I can think of is shedinja which I think is already banned cause sturdy + shed + magic guard unbeatable
Like I said, banned abilities means that they cannot be shared among the team. An Azumarill with Huge Power is perfectly legal; however, none of its teammates will receive Huge Power.

Also, check the OP for the metagame. Shedinja has always been banned.
 
Swapmons-
  • Metagame premise. Pokémon have EVs, IVs, Nature, Ability, and items swapped with the opposing mon. These are updated each turn, but boosts will be added to yourself.
  • Potential bans and threats. OU banlist.
  • Questions for the community. What should be banned, and does this look fun?
What does everything get swapped with?
DrPumpkinz the opponents stats.
 
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so basicly lowest evs possible lowest ivs worst nature for what you are worst ability sticky barb?
it seems pointless you will just see crappy mons cause actually having a good mon will actually hinder you so run slacking gigas archeops and then some crappy mons
 
I think we ought to look at something else in this metagame. Granted this will not be happening during day 1, I have a question for the community. Should we regulate weather as a whole? Every single Pokemon doubling its speed and being able to set the weather that permits that at the same time sounds like it’s even worse than the banned Speed Boost. Sand teams (the best weather archetype) effectively have every Pokemon double its speed at almost all times, and this is worrysome. I’d like to receive input on the community on this proposal: should ALL weather-inducing abilities become banned in Shared Power?

Before we answer this, let’s look at what these abilities are:
  • Sand Stream is the worst offender here, as Tyranitar (main weather setter) is already a terrific Pokemon, and Excadrill is absolutely no slouch. With supporters like Latios and Water-immune Pokemon (which all receive the Sand Rush boost) this playstyle seems borderline unbeatable. It can hold its own against all of the other weather archetypes. I propose banning Sand Stream from being shared in order for weather to remain viable yet a little more balanced. However, if we do this, I believe we will have to ban the other ones as well. Moving on:
  • Drizzle is another big threat in the metagame as this one not only provides the team with a speed-doubling ability in Swift Swim, but it boosts the power of Water STAB as well. While Pelipper and Kingdra are not nearly as good as Tyranitar and Excadrill, they still provide a scary amount of support to the rest of their teammates, as they can all simply switch in and trigger the weather and Speed boost as well.
  • Drought has the monster known as Mega Charizard Y providing Drought support once it Mega Evolves. While the selection of Chlorophyll users isn’t the most elite, they still provide the rest of the team (and Charizard Y itself, which is terrifying) with the doubled Speed. Water immunities also help Drought team win the weather war with Drizzle teams. Lastly:
  • Snow Warning may seem a little dumb compared to all the other ones I mentioned because of how underwhelming Hail is as a whole, but Hail has something over all the other weathers out there that’s pretty broken, and that is Aurora Veil. Alolan Ninetales blesses the entire team with Aurora Veil support, and Alolan Sandslash provides the Speed boost. Aurora Veil is a very dangerous move in this meta as it’s centralized on offense, so I believe Snow Warning is on the same level as the previous abilities are mentioned.
So again, my question is whether we should ban/suspect test weather abilities as a whole so that the entire team does not have access to them. This would mean that every team could still have the ability that boosts the speed stat in weather, but they will have to depend on the sole setter being conserved, making it a much less apparent threat in the metagame. I do not want this to turn into a metagame where weather is the only viable playstyle or a centralizing one. Let me know what you think!
I vote no ban until actual playtesting can take place. Rain's main buffs are stopped almost entirely by water absorb/storm drain, sand force doesn't buff to the extent that rain/sun do and requires running a dedicated mon just for that, and hail... isn't bad, but is nowhere near as good as the other 3 even with Aurora Veil. Also, in order for teams to maintain the speed buff, switching is required fairly often. Cloud nine is another option for invalidating weather teams flat out, and while the donors aren't great, Altaria can be held in standard form until a point in the match where pixilate would be more beneficial, or just left as is while other mons put in the work. There's also Drampa, who's not great in standard but has a solid enough movepool and stat spread to be made useful with the right team support in this meta. While the offensive merits of these teams would absolutely make them unstoppable in OU, pretty much everything in this meta is broken on paper, and I'm not confident that weather will be the biggest issue. On the topic of being more OP than Speed Boost, weather teams have exploitable weaknesses and require a specific set of mons to work properly, which differentiates weather setting abilities from ones like Huge Power/Speed Boost, which are honestly no brainers for practically any offensive team. It's definitely something to be aware of, but I'd give it some time before making any calls.
 
Another thing with weather, is that its easy to unset as soon as the setter is down for the count, or you can use a Dry Skin pokemon to counter rain.

another thing id like to say:

Add Rain Dish for Defensive
Supporters:

Receivers:


Rain Dish would be helpful on most rain teams, with Rain Dish + Leftovers + Dry Skin giving it an amazing rain recovery. Blastoise donating Rain Dish before it Mega Evolves gives it support being in the back, until it Megas and gives Mega Launcher instead. Shiinotic's other abilities are Illuminate(Does Nothing) and Effect Spore(Kinda usefull i guess?) plus it getting Spore + Strength Sap is a big plus. Tentacruel has Clear Body, which is very useful, but it can also run Rain Dish for stall teams. as for the receivers? Mostly stall mons that would benefit from recovery, but also Hydreigon/Koko/Skarmory also get Recoil moves, which are useful when you have recovery aside from leftovers.
 
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From what I understand, Hakuunite's intention for Shared Power was that abilities would remain in effect regardless of whether or not the donor has fainted, so stopping weather isn't quite that easy, but I maintain my stance that it honestly doesn't seem (at least in context) to be any more overwhelming than the rest of the meta inherently is.
 
From what I understand, Hakuunite's intention for Shared Power was that abilities would remain in effect regardless of whether or not the donor has fainted, so stopping weather isn't quite that easy, but I maintain my stance that it honestly doesn't seem (at least in context) to be any more overwhelming than the rest of the meta inherently is.
what i meant was if we banned abilities for sharing.
 
what i meant was if we banned abilities for sharing.
Oh, gotcha. Honestly I don't think weather itself will be a problem, rather it's Swift Swim/Sand Rush/Chlorophyll that take it over the edge. We could always try implementing Gen 5's Swift Swim + Drizzle kinda ban. But again, I'm personally in favour of leaving things as open ended as possible during the early days of any meta so...

Plus, weather teams strength's are all double edged swords here. You're running rain? Cool. But your opponent has a Swift Swim mon in the bank just for this occasion, and didn't need to dedicate all of the other team slots to rain support, meaning their Swift Swim mon is capable of overpowering yours. Or, oh no, this Stakataka has Water Absorb and has successfully set up TR, meaning Swift Swim dooms your entire team to eating 100+ BP STAB moves. Just, lots of room for exploitation tbh.
 
Oh, gotcha. Honestly I don't think weather itself will be a problem, rather it's Swift Swim/Sand Rush/Chlorophyll that take it over the edge. We could always try implementing Gen 5's Swift Swim + Drizzle kinda ban. But again, I'm personally in favour of leaving things as open ended as possible during the early days of any meta so...

Plus, weather teams strength's are all double edged swords here. You're running rain? Cool. But your opponent has a Swift Swim mon in the bank just for this occasion, and didn't need to dedicate all of the other team slots to rain support, meaning their Swift Swim mon is capable of overpowering yours. Or, oh no, this Stakataka has Water Absorb and has successfully set up TR, meaning Swift Swim dooms your entire team to eating 100+ BP STAB moves. Just, lots of room for exploitation tbh.
True, plus, its also possible to be a whole battle with each team setting up one weather after another, each switching out just so they can get a Swift Swim/Chloro/Slush Rush/Sand Rush boost.
 
Yeah I think the meta will balance itself with regards to weather just based on the fact that weather v weather sounds really goofy. I imagine weather being extremely effective against a lot of teams but sand has a rough time against any team with levitate, sun can't deal with flash fire very well and water gets shut down pretty hard by water absorb/storm drain, or even dry skin. Those might be sort of niche abilities compared to the other options in the meta, but weather teams built without those abilities in mind are basically just rolling the dice any time they enter a match, meaning I doubt people will want to use them consistently. I think I mentioned this already, but chlorophyll mons are also exacerbating one of their primary weaknesses by being included in sun teams as well, while they may have the advantage of dealing with fire's water weakness, they get nailed by ice type coverage and the nature of weather v weather means the switches are likely to be fairly predictable. (I guess you could run water absorb + thick fat on a sun team? Maybe?)

Also, I think it's a more worthwhile effort to focus on specific weather abusers instead of weather itself. As far as Sand Rush/Swift Swim donors go, nothing in the game comes close to Excadrill/MegaPert levels of efficiency. In fact, nearly every other Swift Swim mon is currently PU with a few exceptions, while literally every other Sand Rush user is. Using the same argument that was made earlier where someone justified the hypothetical plus buff by saying that all of it's donors were so bad that it meant you were basically playing with 5 mons, if those abilities end up being a problem, banning Excadrill/MegaPert would be a good way to keep weather balanced without having to ban weather setters.

Similarly, if hail is somehow broken due to Aurora Veil, I think the best option would just be to ban Aurora Veil, especially considering that since it has 0 use outside of hail, there's not really any collateral damage. (Not that I can see this happening because hail is... the least threatening weather even with Aurora Veil but still)

One last thing, weather teams face a dilemma wherein they have to choose between having maximum speed in order to capitalize on rush/swim, and running lower speed in order to get weather up turn 1 against other weather teams. Choose the former and you're better off against non weather teams, but you've basically given your opponents lead in weather v weather matchups a free turn. Whereas if you choose the latter, you get the jump turn 1 on other weather teams, but risk being outrun by scarfers depending on your swift swim mons natural speed stat.

Tyranitar may be the only weather setter worth suspecting, as it maintains a fairly unique speed tier among weather setters (and among usable mons in general) which leaves it slow enough to get weather up against stuff like Pelipper, ZardY or Ninetales, yet fast enough to outrun most common mons after the Sand Rush boost. While opposing weather setters have a choice of either staying in and probably dying, or eating an adaptability pursuit on the way out and... probably dying. Even then though, I'm not sure if TTar would end up being overpowered in the overall context of the meta or if it just has the advantage in weather matchups.

Anyway I really just wanna play this meta already and stop theorymon'ing.
 
Anyway I really just wanna play this meta already and stop theorymon'ing.
i am trying to get this thing up as soon as possible, but as i think ive said before im not very good with coding metagames, but your weather statement brings up some good points. hell, id use hail teams just to disrupt other weather teams
 
Has anyone brought up Mold Breaker yet? Because there goes your Unaware, immunity Abilities, Filter/Rock Head/Prism Armor, etc...

Call it the kid who's still burned from the Weather Wars, but weather Abilities should absolutely not pass to the entire team. Passing the Speed-boosting Abilities will be bad enough (and should definitely be looked at upon the metagame becoming playable), but as it stands the metagame will be weather spam and anything else will be far far inferior.
 

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