SPOILERS! Mysteries and Conspiracies of Pokemon

This is more on the "development curiosity" side of conspiracy but...

I think Hop was one of the first character models they made & they didn't go back towards the end of development to touch him up as much as they should've (or, perhaps, could have. time constraints and so on).

It's been noted by like...everyone that the DLC characters are on the whole much more expressive than their base game counterparts. More expressions, cleaner transitions, more animations, smoother stuff, etc. And I definitely agree, but on my replay you can definitely see some good animationa nd expression even on random trainers, and it seems to get better as the game goes on. Milo, Nessa & Kabu have their moments but compared with Piers & Raihan generally they're a little stiffer. So by the time they reach the DLC, they're just far more experienced and willing to experiment more with the characters and cameras.

Except....Hop. Hop miiight have the worst of the bunch? Have you seen early game Hop? I suggest you go look up a battle because it's really eerie just how stiff he is compared to just about any other later character. He has a permanent : ) face in battle and it was really jarring just how little he actually emoted after coming off the DLC.
iirc Hop also just has several reused animations from Hau, which you don't really see on any other character in the game. (Incidentally I think SWSH uses far less canned animation than gen 7 did.) And also you might remember as people raising a stink over during the big heyday of SWSH pre-release.

And the thing that cinches this theory for me is....H-hop?? His League battle is far more expressive in both animation and actual facial expression than Hop usually ever is, and those were probably made at the tail end of development. It became really obvious to me when we fight him in the post game because he actualy uses his League animations but with his normal clothes rather than the really stiff animations he'd been using the entire rest of the game.

------------
Related to this, the Peony/Oleana event in Crown Tundra feels like them actively experimenting more. It's basically a comedy skit focusing on an existing model, probably the most expressive (certainly, the most memorable) character from the base game with:
-new facial expressions
-more camera angles than the usual conversation
-rapid movement between expressions

The skit otherwise kind of standouts for how it doesn't give you anything. SWSH doesn't have a lot of those (or...any?), unlike prior gens, so it stood out, as did all of Oleana's new expressions.

--------

I dunno I find thinking about this stuff and how it might reflect on the game's development like this interesting, and think it's probably not too far off the mark. On the whole the DLC felt like really getting their feet wet with various concepts and I think emotive trainers was at the top of their list.
 

Pikachu315111

Ranting & Raving!
is a Community Contributoris a Smogon Media Contributor
This is more on the "development curiosity" side of conspiracy but...

I think Hop was one of the first character models they made & they didn't go back towards the end of development to touch him up as much as they should've (or, perhaps, could have. time constraints and so on).
Not directly connected to what you're say... or maybe it is. But I learned some interesting trivia about a certain scene you may have thought was re-used, but it's not re-used... and it's more baffling for it.

Youtuber RadicalSoda for the past months has been slowly but surely been going through & reviewing Pokemon Sword & Shield. If you haven't checked his stuff out I suggest it, he's funny but also makes a lot of good criticisms (some which we have echoes plenty of times, but he may point out things we may not have realized or shows an example of what issue he's having with the game. Here's the links to make it easy: Part 1, Part 2, Part 3, Part 4, and...).

In the most recent one, Part 5, he gets to the scene where the player & Hop are riding the train to Wyndon. Now most of us just assumed they re-used the first scene of the player & Hop on the train going to the Wild Area. Turns out, this isn't true... and somehow made the scene look worst if you really paid attention to it. I'll let RadicalSoda explain it cause he's the one with the video.

(If I were to suggest other Youtuber's playthroughs & reviews of Sword & Shield I'd suggest Alpharad and Desbug)
 
Replying to R_N's above post first: I actually think that you could be onto something here. During my first (and hopefully only, I hate these games compared to the others) playthrough of Sword I couldn't help but notice inconsistencies in the quality of Hop's charact aow there's a problem going on...

Now, onto my other point for coming back here again. There was a huge mystery from November 2016 that I don't know how so many people just glossed over it, but it's perfect for this thread, and I've been wondering ever since why this happened.

Why is it exactly that literally EVERY SINGLE PERSON I've seen on the Internet who purchased and first played the original Sun and Moon on launch day ended up getting a Shiny Pokémon sometime before entering the Hall of Fame in their playthrough?

I'm being completely serious here. Go on YouTube when you can and look up "Pokemon Sun and Moon Let's Play Shiny". As of typing this you should be met with a bunch of aDrive videos about some ShinyLocke runs, but I'm telling you, it's all there if you search the Internet hard enough. It even happened to me, having found a random Shiny Gumshoos in Sun outside of the Tapu Village around the time I first arrived there. I don't deny that out of the millions of people who got the game on launch day, there probably were a significant amount who didn't end up finding a random main story Shiny during their first playthrough. Something about this, though... it's always bothered me, and the amount of reports of this I heard at the time peaked my interest. I'd love to get your feedback, and if possible, if this happened to any of you.
 

Pikachu315111

Ranting & Raving!
is a Community Contributoris a Smogon Media Contributor
Now, onto my other point for coming back here again. There was a huge mystery from November 2016 that I don't know how so many people just glossed over it, but it's perfect for this thread, and I've been wondering ever since why this happened.

Why is it exactly that literally EVERY SINGLE PERSON I've seen on the Internet who purchased and first played the original Sun and Moon on launch day ended up getting a Shiny Pokémon sometime before entering the Hall of Fame in their playthrough?
... I didn't find a Shiny when I played Moon. :blobsad:

... BUT I did find a Shiny Snorunt when playing through Shield! :blobwizard:
 
Not so much a deep and compelling mystery as me not having played Lets Go, but where is this meant to be? It's been bugging me since I saw it, I can't work out what area of the game this is.
 

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ScraftyIsTheBest

Unlimited Blade Works
is a Top Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
This is something that's more a bit of a theory in terms of lore. But I wonder if Calyrex has some sort of relationship or history with Eternatus.

The first thing that strikes as interesting is that Calyrex and Eternatus have entirely parallel level-up learnsets. They learn moves at the exact same levels as each other, which is usually reserved for dedicated legendary duos and trios (and a quintet like the Regis). Generally groups that have relationships with each other.

But more importantly, some of Calyrex's lore on the Crown Tundra pedestals and its Pokedex entries really strike as standout. The first is that the pedestals describe it as having shown up to the Crown Tundra wounded and weak, and how it was deeply afraid of being approached with open palms.

This points to two possible events with Calyrex's past: it likely had a confrontation with Eternatus long ago which would suggest why it came to the CT in such a weak state, but right after it recovered it was scared of open palms. And this would be in line with Eternatus's Eternamax form, which literally has a projection that looks like an open hand. Perhaps Calyrex feared open palms because it was constantly reminded of the monstrosity that is E-Max Eternatus's hand. It's not outright stated, but it seems to be some sort of suggestion of a history.

Calyrex's Pokedex entries also mention how it used its powers to move an entire forest overnight, and/or it saved the forest creatures from a meteorite strike. It is well established that Eternatus descended from a meteorite long ago.

Calyrex's Dynamax appearance is also interesting. Dynamax in Galar is intrinsically tied to Eternatus, with it releasing particles of energy that cause Pokemon to Dynamax: this energy is distinctly red, and most Dynamax Pokemon are surrounded with this red energy emanated from Eternatus. But Calyrex is different. Its Dynamax energy is notably blue, and it's described in the pedestals that it emanated a blue light of energy that gave rise to bountiful plant life in the Crown Tundra and turned it into the Crown Plains. This would suggest that Calyrex uses its own special power and energy to be able to Dynamax. Perhaps Calyrex has its own form of Dynamax phenomenon that doesn't involve Eternatus.

I dunno, it's interesting to think about. Maybe there is some sort of connection between those two that happened long ago, even if it wasn't outright stated in-game.
 

Yung Dramps

awesome gaming
This is something that's more a bit of a theory in terms of lore. But I wonder if Calyrex has some sort of relationship or history with Eternatus.

The first thing that strikes as interesting is that Calyrex and Eternatus have entirely parallel level-up learnsets. They learn moves at the exact same levels as each other, which is usually reserved for dedicated legendary duos and trios (and a quintet like the Regis). Generally groups that have relationships with each other.

But more importantly, some of Calyrex's lore on the Crown Tundra pedestals and its Pokedex entries really strike as standout. The first is that the pedestals describe it as having shown up to the Crown Tundra wounded and weak, and how it was deeply afraid of being approached with open palms.

This points to two possible events with Calyrex's past: it likely had a confrontation with Eternatus long ago which would suggest why it came to the CT in such a weak state, but right after it recovered it was scared of open palms. And this would be in line with Eternatus's Eternamax form, which literally has a projection that looks like an open hand. Perhaps Calyrex feared open palms because it was constantly reminded of the monstrosity that is E-Max Eternatus's hand. It's not outright stated, but it seems to be some sort of suggestion of a history.

Calyrex's Pokedex entries also mention how it used its powers to move an entire forest overnight, and/or it saved the forest creatures from a meteorite strike. It is well established that Eternatus descended from a meteorite long ago.

Calyrex's Dynamax appearance is also interesting. Dynamax in Galar is intrinsically tied to Eternatus, with it releasing particles of energy that cause Pokemon to Dynamax: this energy is distinctly red, and most Dynamax Pokemon are surrounded with this red energy emanated from Eternatus. But Calyrex is different. Its Dynamax energy is notably blue, and it's described in the pedestals that it emanated a blue light of energy that gave rise to bountiful plant life in the Crown Tundra and turned it into the Crown Plains. This would suggest that Calyrex uses its own special power and energy to be able to Dynamax. Perhaps Calyrex has its own form of Dynamax phenomenon that doesn't involve Eternatus.

I dunno, it's interesting to think about. Maybe there is some sort of connection between those two that happened long ago, even if it wasn't outright stated in-game.
It's a very compelling theory but it makes one wonder what the timeline with the original Darkest Day is. Did Calyrex fight alongside Zacian and Zamazenta, or was there a 3rd appearance of Eternatus at some undisclosed point in time?

Actually, I just had a wild extension to this: What if Calyrex was one of the Heroes, who rode Zacian and/or Zamazenta into battle like we see him do with the 2 horses? Perhaps the specifics of that part were lost to time, which ties in with the plot detail about Calyrex losing power from being forgotten.
 

Pikachu315111

Ranting & Raving!
is a Community Contributoris a Smogon Media Contributor
It's a very compelling theory but it makes one wonder what the timeline with the original Darkest Day is. Did Calyrex fight alongside Zacian and Zamazenta, or was there a 3rd appearance of Eternatus at some undisclosed point in time?
I think that's the main mystery. I completely agree and came to the same conclusion as ScraftyIsTheBest, I even got the "open palm" bit referring to Eternatus Eternamax form. But where are the wolves? Where are the twin heroes who the wolves joined with to defeat Eternatus? And it feels odd all this happened 20k years ago, like sure let's say Legendary Pokemon can live that long (or at least Calyrex, not sure about the horses) but would such a small village in a freezing tundra be able to keep on with traditions and legends that old? In real life, 20k years ago the Eath was just coming out of the Ice Age and human civilization was just getting the knack of making permanent settlements.

Makes me think maybe 20k years ago Eternatus came to Earth on a meteorite, Calyrex confronted it but unable to defeat it so did something that put both of them in temporal timeout (maybe this is the "teleportation" that happened, it didn't teleport but rather removed itself and the surrounding area from time). Thousands of years passed, approximately 17k (Sonia mentions the geoglyph in Turffield is 3k years old), and both somehow get free. Calyrex is severely weakened (likely for having kept Eternatus in check for so long) and stumbles into the Crowned Tundra where its taken care of the people in Freezington. Eternatus meanwhile flees to mainland Galar where it causes the first recorded Darkest Day until defeated by Zacian and Zamazenta. Its driven underground until recent times when its found by Rose who starts absorbing it of energy but it starts to awaken which leads us to Sword & Shield's story.

... Infact, typing all this out, it makes me sorry for Eternatus. Think of things in its point of view. It somehow was travelling around space on a meteor until suddenly crash landing on an unknown planet. It probably starts getting panicky so releases energy which causes things to go haywire, and that causes unknown creatures to attack it. (If we go by my theory it's then gets frozen in time until managing to get freed again, only to then be defeated and not knocked out). It hides underground only to be discovered by another group of creatures who lock it away in a small capsule and starts draining it on its energy. Finally upon coming out it goes on a rampage until defeated by the creatures that knocked it out last time... though in a twist it's then captured in a device that makes it feel calm. And now it's in the care of a small strange creature that feeds it, plays with it (which includes battling), & heals it; it also now has many "friends" with other creatures which are also under the care of its caretaker. For 20k years Eternatus felt it was in danger until the player character finally caught it and actually treated it with kindness (we'll just put aside the whole theory with Poke Balls forcing obedience/calmness).
 

p0ip0le

it's a billion lions
is a Pre-Contributor
So it's already pretty common knowledge that Unova's Elite Four music makes reference to Hoenn's Elite Four music, but I just realized that Alder's music also sounds suspiciously similar to a past track.


don't quite hear it, do you have timestamps for the similar bits?
 
So Mat Block is still in Sword and Shield, exclusive to Throh... as a transfer only move... why. It used to be Greninja's signature move but was added to Throh's moveset in gen 7. In Sword and Shield, Throh can no longer learn it by level up, and it's not even useful for Throh to have! Mat Block protects the user and the partner from any attacking move, but does not have priority. It ended up having some sparse use in VGC on Greninja because, you know, Greninja has this little thing called a "speed stat of 122." Usually you would be better off with a pokemon with Fake Out, but it had a niche.

Now lets turn to Throh, Throh has a speed stat of, uhh, 45???? yeah 45. So could use it under trick room or if you speed swap with another pokemon, but its not what anyone would call viable. There is a lot of set up needed for Throh to pull off a Mat Block, and you are probably better of using Fake Out or Greninja if you are playing a Gen 6/7 game. Well now it's the only Mat Block user in Gen 8, so why not give it a go! Oh, Throh cannot learn Mat Block by level up, it is only a transfer move, so Throh cannot use it in the official Gen 8 formats.

Why?

I'm not trying to hate on Throh so much, but why keep Mat Block when its: 1) Transfer only, 2) a former signature move for a pokemon not in the game, 3) not really useful on the pokemon in question, and 4) not even usable in the official competitive format of the game. Maybe it is just a forgotten relic from development, since we know that Greninja was used in the leaked development versions, but it seems odd to keep this move over everything else.
 
So Mat Block is still in Sword and Shield, exclusive to Throh... as a transfer only move... why. It used to be Greninja's signature move but was added to Throh's moveset in gen 7. In Sword and Shield, Throh can no longer learn it by level up, and it's not even useful for Throh to have! Mat Block protects the user and the partner from any attacking move, but does not have priority. It ended up having some sparse use in VGC on Greninja because, you know, Greninja has this little thing called a "speed stat of 122." Usually you would be better off with a pokemon with Fake Out, but it had a niche.

Now lets turn to Throh, Throh has a speed stat of, uhh, 45???? yeah 45. So could use it under trick room or if you speed swap with another pokemon, but its not what anyone would call viable. There is a lot of set up needed for Throh to pull off a Mat Block, and you are probably better of using Fake Out or Greninja if you are playing a Gen 6/7 game. Well now it's the only Mat Block user in Gen 8, so why not give it a go! Oh, Throh cannot learn Mat Block by level up, it is only a transfer move, so Throh cannot use it in the official Gen 8 formats.

Why?

I'm not trying to hate on Throh so much, but why keep Mat Block when its: 1) Transfer only, 2) a former signature move for a pokemon not in the game, 3) not really useful on the pokemon in question, and 4) not even usable in the official competitive format of the game. Maybe it is just a forgotten relic from development, since we know that Greninja was used in the leaked development versions, but it seems odd to keep this move over everything else.
Strange... are there any other transfer-exclusive moves like this?
 
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Does Matt Block actually work, by the way? Or is it "soft snapped", where in it has a descriptoin it just uhhhh doesnt work.

There's a couple of oddities like that in the game. Ribombee can get Powder in USUM and Powder isn't full-snapped but you can't actually use it. Magearna just had Heart Swap but it doesnt get it now. Likewise Lugia from XD can still bring forward Deoxys' Psycho Boost, but the move still isn't implemented yet.

If I had to guess these moves are all being rerouted back into being exclusive to Greninja, Vivillon, Manaphy and Deoxys respectively (ok well i mean, Psycho Boost XD Lugia is a deep pull regardless but stay with me). So they're not on the docket to be removed permanently but it also means that things like this slip through the cracks. They don't want to force move removals but they don't want to mark these moves as never ever coming back but also they're not coming back at all right now.

I kind of suspect this whole snafoo is why Smeargle was left out

e: To clarify snapped moves are in two categories
Full snapped. They are completely removed and seemingly never coming back. These are the ones that have the special message and flag saying to delete them.
"Half-snapped". These moves aren't implemented at all yet but they're also still retaining their normal description and you can bring them into the game no problem. Most of these are signature moves of various Pokemon not currently in the game, by my recollection.
 
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Does Matt Block actually work, by the way? Or is it "soft snapped", where in it has a descriptoin it just uhhhh doesnt work.

There's a couple of oddities like that in the game. Ribombee can get Powder in USUM and Powder isn't full-snapped but you can't actually use it. Magearna just had Heart Swap but it doesnt get it now. Likewise Lugia from XD can still bring forward Deoxys' Psycho Boost, but the move still isn't implemented yet.

If I had to guess these moves are all being rerouted back into being exclusive to Greninja, Vivillon, Manaphy and Deoxys respectively (ok well i mean, Psycho Boost XD Lugia is a deep pull regardless but stay with me). So they're not on the docket to be removed permanently but it also means that things like this slip through the cracks. They don't want to force move removals but they don't want to mark these moves as never ever coming back but also they're not coming back at all right now.

I kind of suspect this whole snafoo is why Smeargle was left out

e: To clarify snapped moves are in two categories
Full snapped. They are completely removed and seemingly never coming back. These are the ones that have the special message and flag saying to delete them.
"Half-snapped". These moves aren't implemented at all yet but they're also still retaining their normal description and you can bring them into the game no problem. Most of these are signature moves of various Pokemon not currently in the game, by my recollection.
Okay, so I tested whether or not it works. I caught a Throh in Pokemon Y, transferred to Sun through Bank (because it is a TRANSFER ONLY POKEMON IN GEN 7! why.......... more transfer exclusive weirdness for Throh I guess), taught it Mat Block, transferred it back to Bank, moved it to Home and into Sword, fed it xp candies and took it into the nearest double battle I could find, and guess what, Mat Block actually works!

(Personal note: finally an excuse to pay for Bank and Home! (and to transfer some version exclusive legendaries to Sword :blobthumbsup: ).

I clipped a video of Throh using this on the Switch, and I'll update this post with it once I figure out how to post the video.

Edit: here's a link to a video on Twitter showing this, best way I found to show this:

 
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Okay, so I tested whether or not it works. I caught a Throh in Pokemon Y, transferred to Sun through Bank (because it is a TRANSFER ONLY POKEMON IN GEN 7! why.......... more transfer exclusive weirdness for Throh I guess), taught it Mat Block, transferred it back to Bank, moved it to Home and into Sword, fed it xp candies and took it into the nearest double battle I could find, and guess what, Mat Block actually works!

(Personal note: finally an excuse to pay for Bank and Home! (and to transfer some version exclusive legendaries to Sword :blobthumbsup: ).

I clipped a video of Throh using this on the Switch, and I'll update this post with it once I figure out how to post the video.
I am legit shocked this works. Thanks for checking, what an odd little thing this is.
 
Likewise Lugia from XD can still bring forward Deoxys' Psycho Boost, but the move still isn't implemented yet.

If I had to guess these moves are all being rerouted back into being exclusive to Greninja, Vivillon, Manaphy and Deoxys respectively (ok well i mean, Psycho Boost XD Lugia is a deep pull regardless but stay with me). So they're not on the docket to be removed permanently but it also means that things like this slip through the cracks. They don't want to force move removals but they don't want to mark these moves as never ever coming back but also they're not coming back at all right now.
Also, Bulbapedia is saying that Psycho Boost is a signature move of Lugia in Gen 8 for some reason. Idk what they are basing this off of though, I can't find any evidence of this claim, especially when it was removed and is not present in Lugia's moveset.

edit: heres a link and a picture of the website for reference:

bulbapedia lugia.png

https://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Psycho_Boost_(move)
 
Also, Bulbapedia is saying that Psycho Boost is a signature move of Lugia in Gen 8 for some reason. Idk what they are basing this off of though, I can't find any evidence of this claim, especially when it was removed and is not present in Lugia's moveset.

edit: heres a link and a picture of the website for reference:

View attachment 292127
https://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Psycho_Boost_(move)
Because it's the only Pokémon that can have it in Gen VIII. Sure, it cannot learn the move outside of XD, but you can transfer it all the way up to Sword and Shield, while you can't do the same with Deoxys.

It's very very very very very taken with a grain of salt.
 
Bulbapedia is very picky about signature moves. Since Lugia is literally the only Pokemon that can get it until Deoxys comes back even though this requires taking one very specific Lugia from gen 3 and porting it up to gen 8, they consider it a signature move.

It was really funny looking at their signature move page (last I looked was before the DLC hit) and just seeing a bunch of moves that are signature by like...technicality.
 
Because it's the only Pokémon that can have it in Gen VIII. Sure, it cannot learn the move outside of XD, but you can transfer it all the way up to Sword and Shield, while you can't do the same with Deoxys.

It's very very very very very taken with a grain of salt.
Bulbapedia is very picky about signature moves. Since Lugia is literally the only Pokemon that can get it until Deoxys comes back even though this requires taking one very specific Lugia from gen 3 and porting it up to gen 8, they consider it a signature move.

It was really funny looking at their signature move page (last I looked was before the DLC hit) and just seeing a bunch of moves that are signature by like...technicality.
Still, it seems weird/funny to call a move a signature move if it can't be used in game. I guess over the holidays i'll have to buy a GBA - GameCube cable and beat XD to bring that Lugia up. Seems like a fun curiosity to have sitting around, at least until they re-implement Psycho Boost
 
Odd that they would count Psycho Boost as Lugia's signature move, but then also count Confide as Impadimp's signature move. Do transfers count or not?
Bulbapedia basically counts a move as a signature move if only one Pokemon can learn it naturally, even if was available to others previously.

To give an example, loads of stuff learned Psywave in Gen I, because it was a TM. But nothing learned it on their own, so it was no-one's signature move. In Gen II, Misdreavus gets it as a starting move, and is the only Pokemon to do so, so they count Psywave as being Misdreavus' signature move in Gen II.

Similarly, Substitute is counted as Mr Mime's signature move, but only in Gen II because it's the only Pokemon that gets it by levelling up. Kecleon gets it by levelling up as well starting in Gen III, so it's no longer considered a signature (even though nothing else learns it by levelling up in Gen RGBY so according to their logic it should be Mr Mime's signature move in Gen I as well...)
 

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