I am trying to work the set out! And the bear has a surprise factor! Ya, quick feet would be a good idea, but paralysis would already help with speed, so guts may be the superior ability as it can make ursaring hit hard for a few turns, which would help it bring down walls.
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New and "creative" moveset/EV spread thread "Mark 2"
- Thread starter gengod
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I am trying to work the set out! And the bear has a surprise factor! Ya, quick feet would be a good idea, but paralysis would already help with speed, so guts may be the superior ability as it can make ursaring hit hard for a few turns, which would help it bring down walls.
"Suprise factor?"
That gets absolutely murdered in today's metagame, and you just basically showed us all of Ursaring's options. If you can't think of EVs on a set, it's probably no good and you haven't tested it at all. And have you ever tried typing decently?
*Stop pulling shit out of your ass and displaying it in this thread.*
What do you mean by getting murdered in today's metagame? I really don't know. BTW, evs are really hard, I wanted to come up with an efficient ev. Screw this, whoever want to help me, PM me instead of posting in this place. You should actually try some sets in here, they'll really surprise you. I started using the bulk up ape from here as a joke, but it turned out to be one of the greatest things i've ever used. I just really hope Bulk up ursaring can do as good as that.
It can't. Usaring is pathetically slow, weak to Close Comat, lacks Slack Off and Will-O-Wisp. And its not this thread that makes bad Pokemon sets, its your sets.
Oh, anybody have something to say about these sets?
Agility Arcanine
Bulky Sub Gallade
Oh, anybody have something to say about these sets?
Agility Arcanine
Bulky Sub Gallade
Agility Arcanine is pretty decent, though I would recommend going fully Special, as it provides the best possible coverage, with Dragon Pulse and Flamethrower over Flare Blitz and Iron Head. Hidden Power Grass should be the only option, as Arcanine isn't going to be "revenge-killing" Heatran anytime soon, and it needs to hit Swampert. Heatran is going to be switching anyways.
EVs aren't hard if you actually know what they do, or have access to Shoddybattle. Or have actually looked at some defense articles, located in the "articles section" on the site. If you can't think of EVs, you haven't tested it, and if you haven't tested it, you shouldn't post it.
EVs aren't hard if you actually know what they do, or have access to Shoddybattle. Or have actually looked at some defense articles, located in the "articles section" on the site. If you can't think of EVs, you haven't tested it, and if you haven't tested it, you shouldn't post it.
This is a terrible set. It is too "unsure of itself", if you know what I mean.
Edit: I didn't realize that you edited it before I quoted it... but keep working.
Aren't you supposed to refrain from swearing?
I will now post my own 'coughcrappycough' set...
Salamence
Mixed DDMence @ Life Orb
Dragon Dance
Dragon Claw
Fire Blast
Hydro Pump
Rash nature
200atk, 58spa, 252spe
Starts as a standard DD set until Skarmory or a similar wall comes out. Watch the horror on their face as Hippowdon drowns and Skarmory is fried. Fire Blast also 2HKOs Bronzong.
Not quite done, but set on the movepool. Help would be nice...
No...
Lurk a little more.
This just really seems like a worse Mix-Mence, as you aren't running much to help you sweep. If you really want to use this, use this set. (I'm doubting you've tested this set, anyways.)
- Dragon Dance
- Outrage
- Earthquake
- Fire Blast
Hippowdon is rarely seen these days, so Hydro Pump isn't needed. Dragon-Ground-Fire provides great coverage, and you actually have something benefiting from the DDs, Outrage and Earthquake.
Dusknoir
Duskurse
-Curse
-Will o Wisp
-Protect
-Shadow Sneak
Item: Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
Nature: Brave
252 HP/4 Atk/252 SpD
This is a set I came up with a couple weeks ago. The basic idea is to switch in to an obvious fighting or normal move (or something that will be scared away), and use Curse immediately to either hit that mon/switch, or to force a switch. Second turn you WoW, and then Protect the third turn to gain Lefties and let them burn. You can alternate between Protect and Shadow Sneak until you're healthy enough to Curse again.
I maxed the SpD because most Noir sets I've seen call for max Def, so most opponents will expect that. Burn support means Noir won't take that much damage from the Def side anyway.
Screen and Stealth Rock support helps immensely, as does a Curse/Wish passing team member such as Umbreon. Additionally, a strong Fire-counter is almost obligatory, since this set is not at all effective against Fires, especially Heatran.
any comments?
There was a Curse-Dusknoir set a while back (I'm trying to find the specific post), and it was said to be too gimmicky an option back then. I think that is the case for this set too. The problem is that Curse does so much damage to yourself, and your opponent can just rid themselves of the curse by switching. The old set tried to remedy this by using Mean Look, but I still don't think it's a very viable strategy.
LR.
EDIT: Here's the set, on page 13.
LR.
EDIT: Here's the set, on page 13.
Wouldn't Pain Split be a must on a set like that, since while your opponent switches after having been cursed or Burned you can hopefully Pain Split on a full HP Pokemon which would deal quite a bit of damage.
I have finished my set!!
Some calcs will be done if I have some time.
Grizzly Bear
Ursaring@leftovers
16atk/132spe/200def/164hp
Adamant
or for a reckless evs: 188hp/252def/70sp.def, Impish
this is full bulk, pure recklessness, if you use this, drop Roar for rest.
Ability: Guts is preferred, however Quick Feet is an option.
-Bulk Up
-Roar/Rest
-Body Slam/Return
-Fire Punch/Sleep Talk
*Sleep Talk go with Rest.
This set is meant to be a bulky sweeper. Better used when T-tar and Hetran are gone, especially Hetran since he hits from the special side.
Body Slam for paralysis, so it's preferred, or return for just raw power. Fire Punch is chosen over Earthquake for it's ability to hit most Steel types hard. Earthquake is still a choice.
Bulk Up is what makes this set. No need of explaination. It's used to make it take phsical hits while hitting hard.
Roar is to keep spiker taking the chance to set up, most importantly, Skarm and Hippo, they are capable of Whirlwind/Roar and takes away your boosts. Rest is to keep you away from status and damage, however it's not concerned much, because Ursaring can take advantage of status with it's abilities.
The evs gives you enough speed to outspeed standard Skarm, therefore stopping it from whirlwinding you. The attack stat is enough to 3HKO standard Hippo with Return with one boost, and enough for an over 50% chance to 2HKO a Skarm with Fire Punch with SR. The defense evs was done with X-act's application. I think it's pretty good.
Here are some calcs (quickly updated) all with +1 stat unless specified.
Fire Punch against Skarm:138 - 164 (41.32% - 49.10%) Big Chance to 2HKO with SR and no lefties (shed shell) +2 is 100% 2HKO
Return vs Standard Hippowdon: 160 - 189 (38.10% - 45.00%) 99.9% to 3HKO hippo with lefties.
+2 Return against hippo: 211 - 250 (50.24% - 59.52%), a 100% 2HKO with SR.
Return vs Defensive (252/220) Celebi: 187 - 222 (46.29% - 54.95%) 2HKO with SR.
This means it can 2HKO defensive Zapdos too.
Return vs Wish Bliss:420 - 495 (64.52% - 76.04%) 2HKO.
no boost Fire Punch vs Forry (252/92):200 - 236 (56.50% - 66.67%) 100% 2HKO with SR. But you shouldn't kill him because he is your set up fodder.
+1 -1 boost = 0 boost return on DD Mence: 186 - 220 (51.52% - 60.94%) 2HKO, he might pose a threat, so try to get a bulk up when it DD, and kill it quick.
Fire Punch vs 252/80 Zong: 170 - 202 (50.30% - 59.76%) 2HKO, also set up fodder if it has no Hypnosis.
Fire punch can 2HKO steel killer magnezone.
Defensive Damage all with +1 defense unless specified:
LO no boost mence outrage: 195 - 229 (53.57% - 62.91%) 2HKO, it's just too hard facing this guy if you don't resist dragon. Tsk,Tsk. But there are so few steels that are not very common, or they suck a lot.
LO no boost outrage from mence while you have +2: 145 - 172 (39.84% - 47.25%)
So if you return this dude on the switch in, you can safely kill him.
Magnezone t-bolt (well this has no defensive boost) :( :217 - 256 (59.94% - 70.72%) Not that bad, you can kill it.
CB duggy eq: 130 - 154 (35.91% - 42.54%) Awesome!
Defensive Zapdos t-bolt: 157 - 186 (43.37% - 51.38%) Less than Zone, but he outspeeds you.
Hippowdon eq: 120 - 142 (33.15% - 39.23%) Set up fodder, but SS negates lefies, so Forry is easier to set with.
Forry explosion: 130 - 154 (35.91% - 42.54%) LOL, pathetic, you don't want him to do this, because it's just so easy setting up on him.
The bad CC compartment: With +2
LO no boost Luke:: Dead.
Gallade CC: 314 - 372 (86.74% - 102.76%) a chance to live!
Jolly Hera CC: 288 - 338 (79.56% - 93.37%) You live and smash it with return.
Scizor super power: with nLO: 282 - 332 (77.90% - 91.71%) you live and burn it with fire punch!
Update tomorrow.
*Changes: 132 spe evs to out speed most Magnezone. Doing this by taking 4 evs off hp.
Some calcs will be done if I have some time.
Grizzly Bear
Ursaring@leftovers
16atk/132spe/200def/164hp
Adamant
or for a reckless evs: 188hp/252def/70sp.def, Impish
this is full bulk, pure recklessness, if you use this, drop Roar for rest.
Ability: Guts is preferred, however Quick Feet is an option.
-Bulk Up
-Roar/Rest
-Body Slam/Return
-Fire Punch/Sleep Talk
*Sleep Talk go with Rest.
This set is meant to be a bulky sweeper. Better used when T-tar and Hetran are gone, especially Hetran since he hits from the special side.
Body Slam for paralysis, so it's preferred, or return for just raw power. Fire Punch is chosen over Earthquake for it's ability to hit most Steel types hard. Earthquake is still a choice.
Bulk Up is what makes this set. No need of explaination. It's used to make it take phsical hits while hitting hard.
Roar is to keep spiker taking the chance to set up, most importantly, Skarm and Hippo, they are capable of Whirlwind/Roar and takes away your boosts. Rest is to keep you away from status and damage, however it's not concerned much, because Ursaring can take advantage of status with it's abilities.
The evs gives you enough speed to outspeed standard Skarm, therefore stopping it from whirlwinding you. The attack stat is enough to 3HKO standard Hippo with Return with one boost, and enough for an over 50% chance to 2HKO a Skarm with Fire Punch with SR. The defense evs was done with X-act's application. I think it's pretty good.
Here are some calcs (quickly updated) all with +1 stat unless specified.
Fire Punch against Skarm:138 - 164 (41.32% - 49.10%) Big Chance to 2HKO with SR and no lefties (shed shell) +2 is 100% 2HKO
Return vs Standard Hippowdon: 160 - 189 (38.10% - 45.00%) 99.9% to 3HKO hippo with lefties.
+2 Return against hippo: 211 - 250 (50.24% - 59.52%), a 100% 2HKO with SR.
Return vs Defensive (252/220) Celebi: 187 - 222 (46.29% - 54.95%) 2HKO with SR.
This means it can 2HKO defensive Zapdos too.
Return vs Wish Bliss:420 - 495 (64.52% - 76.04%) 2HKO.
no boost Fire Punch vs Forry (252/92):200 - 236 (56.50% - 66.67%) 100% 2HKO with SR. But you shouldn't kill him because he is your set up fodder.
+1 -1 boost = 0 boost return on DD Mence: 186 - 220 (51.52% - 60.94%) 2HKO, he might pose a threat, so try to get a bulk up when it DD, and kill it quick.
Fire Punch vs 252/80 Zong: 170 - 202 (50.30% - 59.76%) 2HKO, also set up fodder if it has no Hypnosis.
Fire punch can 2HKO steel killer magnezone.
Defensive Damage all with +1 defense unless specified:
LO no boost mence outrage: 195 - 229 (53.57% - 62.91%) 2HKO, it's just too hard facing this guy if you don't resist dragon. Tsk,Tsk. But there are so few steels that are not very common, or they suck a lot.
LO no boost outrage from mence while you have +2: 145 - 172 (39.84% - 47.25%)
So if you return this dude on the switch in, you can safely kill him.
Magnezone t-bolt (well this has no defensive boost) :( :217 - 256 (59.94% - 70.72%) Not that bad, you can kill it.
CB duggy eq: 130 - 154 (35.91% - 42.54%) Awesome!
Defensive Zapdos t-bolt: 157 - 186 (43.37% - 51.38%) Less than Zone, but he outspeeds you.
Hippowdon eq: 120 - 142 (33.15% - 39.23%) Set up fodder, but SS negates lefies, so Forry is easier to set with.
Forry explosion: 130 - 154 (35.91% - 42.54%) LOL, pathetic, you don't want him to do this, because it's just so easy setting up on him.
The bad CC compartment: With +2
LO no boost Luke:: Dead.
Gallade CC: 314 - 372 (86.74% - 102.76%) a chance to live!
Jolly Hera CC: 288 - 338 (79.56% - 93.37%) You live and smash it with return.
Scizor super power: with nLO: 282 - 332 (77.90% - 91.71%) you live and burn it with fire punch!
Update tomorrow.
*Changes: 132 spe evs to out speed most Magnezone. Doing this by taking 4 evs off hp.
I disagree. Explain to me why I should use this over CurseLax.
Brave Cacturne @ Life orb
Sand veil
Ev's: 180 atk / 246 sp.atk / 80 hp
Moveset:
- Focus Punch
- Hp fire
- Energy ball (grass knot)
- sucker punch
mix-turne, damn right!
Hp fire is for nice coverage, F- punch for prodiction, Sucker punch for the special wall psychics of UU and Energy ball for STAB.
heres a few calcs.
all done with Life orb added in
Sucker punch Vs Standard slowking
Damage: 395 - 465
Percent: 102.86% - 121.09%
Ko, with a guarented OHKO
Energy ball Vs Standard claydol
Damage: 272 - 320
Percent: 83.95% - 98.77%
Not that Claydol switches in...
Hp fire Vs Standard Pinsir
Damage: 247 - 291
Percent: 90.81% - 106.99%
death TBH.
Focus punch Vs Bulkiest Clefable
Damage: 398 - 468
Percent: 101.02% - 118.78%
OHKO BITCH!!!....
SO yeah, this cacnea is sex.
could use TR support i guess..
Just re-putting this out there.
So basically you say Roar is for Skarmory so it doesn't whirlwind you out, but you're using Fire Punch against it here. So there it will Whirlwind you out?
Okay, I haven't... but I'm breeding Bagon with Hydro Pump and Dragon Dance currently, so I wanted to know if this would be a good set for Wi-Fi use. And Outrage doesn't exactly appeal to me, either.
What about the EV's and nature? Do they work out?
Okay, Fire Punch is for Skarm if it decides to switch in after being roared out, and when it wants to set up spikes and hazards.
Well, this dude has more power and speed over curelax, even if curse lax does paralize something with body slam, it's curse will reduce it's speed and so paralize won't help much. Ursaring can body slam and paralizes, and having some speed to work with. The speed I am using is right now at 178, but I am thinking of 179 speed to outspeed some magnezones. So 179 times 4 = 716, so if anything get paralized, it's ought to be slower than Ursaring. Ursaring also have guts or quick feet to work with. Snorlax have to worry about getting burned, so it has to carry rest most of the time, whereas Ursaring takes advantage of the status, it gets a big attack boost that will bring down walls. Most importantly, if lax goes to sleep, anything with Roar/Whirlwind can easily get rid of you. While Ursaring can Roar them out instead, causing entry hazard damage and possibly putting them in a bad face-off. Lax does have a lot more bulkiness to work with, and it doesn't have to worry about the special side. If BL metagame ever appears, this dude can be replacing curse lax.
That's all I can think of why to use Grizzly ove lax.
Well, this dude has more power and speed over curelax, even if curse lax does paralize something with body slam, it's curse will reduce it's speed and so paralize won't help much. Ursaring can body slam and paralizes, and having some speed to work with. The speed I am using is right now at 178, but I am thinking of 179 speed to outspeed some magnezones. So 179 times 4 = 716, so if anything get paralized, it's ought to be slower than Ursaring. Ursaring also have guts or quick feet to work with. Snorlax have to worry about getting burned, so it has to carry rest most of the time, whereas Ursaring takes advantage of the status, it gets a big attack boost that will bring down walls. Most importantly, if lax goes to sleep, anything with Roar/Whirlwind can easily get rid of you. While Ursaring can Roar them out instead, causing entry hazard damage and possibly putting them in a bad face-off. Lax does have a lot more bulkiness to work with, and it doesn't have to worry about the special side. If BL metagame ever appears, this dude can be replacing curse lax.
That's all I can think of why to use Grizzly ove lax.
Outrage is generally good with Dragon Dance and a small bit of prediction skills. Hydro Pump isn't needed, because you are really only hitting Heatran and Hippo, both of whom are hit hard by Earthquake and Outrage (2HKOs Hippo).
The EVs are okay, but I would run a spread like the one below, as it doesn't tamper with Salamence's Speed, and more SpA allows for 2HKOs on Skarmory with Fire Blast. Rash is fine as a nature.
58 Atk / 200 SpA / 252 Spe
But wouldn't changing Hydro Pump into Earthquake making it the same as the standard DD mix set? Just with different evs? So I don't think that's really new.
BTW, just surveying you guys if you want to answer, do youy think the moves are more important than the evs or the evs are more important than the moves? Evs including nature.
BTW, just surveying you guys if you want to answer, do youy think the moves are more important than the evs or the evs are more important than the moves? Evs including nature.
Ability : Arena Trap
Nature: Modest
EV: 252 Sp Atk / 252 Speed / 6 Def
Earth Power
Ancient Power
Hidden Power Grass
Tri Attack
Tried this out, it actually catches a few suprises. Earth Power/Ancient Power provides a special rock/ground combination. Hidden Power Grass will OHKO Swampert not invested in Sp Def. Modest nature is needed to help it's pathetic special attack stat. Tri Attack is a filler move, to finish off the fragile weak pokemon.
Specs Dugtrio was originally a gimmick to trap and kill Garchomp with HP Ice, invented on the wifi boards when someone bred a Modest Dugtrio with a decent SpA IV and decided to give it a spin. I don't see why you would use Dugtrio's base 50 SpA with weaker moves when you could just use its base 80 Atk with stronger moves (Earthquake has more BP than Earth Power). Specs Dugtrio can't kill half the things that Dugtrio normally can - Infernape, Tyranitar, Blissey, Tentacruel to name a few.
In summary - it is a gimmick, sorry.
LR.
In summary - it is a gimmick, sorry.
LR.
Just tested it, and it fails really bad.
You only have a 30% chance of paralysis with Body Slam, and it's not like you'll be able to pull if off considering Ursaring is as slow as fuck and won't be surviving any Close Combats after a Bulk Up anyways.
@ Choice Specs
Ability : Arena Trap
Nature: Modest
EV: 252 Sp Atk / 252 Speed / 6 Def
Earth Power
Ancient Power
Hidden Power Grass
Tri Attack
Tried this out, it actually catches a few suprises. Earth Power/Ancient Power provides a special rock/ground combination. Hidden Power Grass will OHKO Swampert not invested in Sp Def. Modest nature is needed to help it's pathetic special attack stat. Tri Attack is a filler move, to finish off the fragile weak pokemon.
You don't ven need to test it, you can tell it's bad.
Whatever Teabag, use Ursaring if you want to, use Lax if you want to, it's none of my business, I really don't care about you using Lax over this dude, I just wanted to make a Bulk Up Ursaring, I didn't make this set hoping that it will surpass Curse Lax. I just wanted to make the set and post it here and use it myself to have fun with a brand new set. Dude, don't get intense in the posts, BTW, fuck is not slow, it has 120 speed base stat. Lax is also slow as Shuckle (now there's something that's really slow) after like 3 Curses.
Hydro Pump isn't resisted like Earthquake, though, and Gliscor is still out there (24th - not overly common, but 2nd or 3rd highest physical wall on the list). It also hits Rhyperior and Aerodactyl lot harder than EQ does, and Hydro Pump is a OHKO on minHP/noSpD Aerodactyl, while Dragon Claw falls short. Outrage, like I said, is not my favorite move...
Anti Sweeper Ludicolo "Bulky Water"
Ludicolo@Leftovers
Calm/Rain Dish
EVs: 204 HP/88 Def/100 SpA/104 SpD/12 Spe
~Surf
~Grass Knot
~Hidden Power Fire
~Ice Beam
Comments
This Ludicolo is designed to stop your team from getting swept by some top tier threats including Gyarados, Azelf, Starmie, Lucario, Heatran and Scizor. Ludicolo is often seen as setup fodder, so when these Pokemon decide to come in and set up on Ludicolo you've got some good options to KO them. Ludicolo is also an effective Physical wallbreaker and provides great coverage with its 4 different move types. I've been using it to counter some of things that can give my team trouble, namely Mamoswine, Hippo and Weavile.
EVs
The EVs are quite important on this set, much like the old Bulky Gyarados standard. For a 70 BP HP Fire the IVs generated are 31/x/31/30/31/30 (Speed last), which alters the spread slightly, albeit only by one point for a couple of stats. Firstly, 204 HP EVs reach the last Leftovers benchmark for Base 80 HP Pokemon and a stat of 352. 88 Defence EVs hit 198 Defence and garuntee survival from Adamant Life Orb Lucario's Close Combat, as long as it isn't boosted. 100 Special Attack EVs hit 240 Special Attack and also hits three birds with one stone. It garuntees that Surf will do at least 50% to that same Lucario, which means it will switch in and take the damage and can't KO you. It also garuntees that HP Fire will OHKO Scizor and Forry after Stealth Rock has been accounted for. Plus, it passes the 235 mark, the point where Ice Beam is garunteed to OHKO 4 HP/min Salamence. 12 Speed EVs get you to 178 and garuntee that you will outspeed minimum Speed Skarmory and also those Pokemon that rest one point above it, such as a few variants of Metagross. The 108 Special Defence EVs and the Calm nature gets to 288 Special Defence and allow Ludicolo to sponge Special hits well, including stuff like Zapdos' Thunderbolt.
Moveset
The basic moveset listed here allows the best protection from the largest amount of threats, but it can be taylored to fit your team's needs. For instance, if you already have a good Scizor counter you need not bother with HP Fire, and if the Dragons aren't a problem you won't need Ice Beam. I don't, however, reccommend dropping the STAB Water and Grass moves in any case since they will be Ludicolo's prime damage means.
HP Fire and Ice Beam deal with Scizor/Forretress and Salamence respectively. Often they'll come in on Ludicolo to try and set up(since many don't run Ice Beam, and I haven't yet seen one that runs HP Fire). The all-physical variants of Scizor and Mence won't be able to kill Ludicolo without a boost to their Attack. Adamant Life Orb Scizor does a maximum of 75% with Superpower and the standard Adamant Leftovers Salamence does a maximum of 89% with Outrage. Life Orb variants will usually OHKO, but you have a small chance of living. On to Forry. I was surprised at the amount of Forry-containing teams who were eager to switch their Steel bug into Ludicolo to spin away my Stealth Rocks and try and set some up of their own. HP Fire will always OHKO Forry if Stealth Rock is up (and still has a chance of doing so if there's no Stealth Rock).
Grass Knot deals great damage to Hippowdon and Tyranitar as well as hitting Gyarados pretty hard as well (Ludicolo walls Gyaras that don't have Stone Edge and will usually win in one on one situations as Grass Knot deals a minimum of 40% to 4 HP/min Gyarados). The fact that it gets STAB makes this a 180 BP move on all these Pokemon. Grass Knot also hits Starmie hard.
Finally, Surf is there mainly for Heatran. Ludicolo counters Scarf Heatran really well, but to do it properly it'll need something to hit it hard which is exactly what Surf does. Hydro Pump can be used in Surf's place to hit Metagross, Lucario and numerous other Steel types harder, in exchange for some accuracy.
Other Options
The set can be changed to fit your team, because you can choose the move you need the least and replace it with something more useful. Like I said though, I do not reccommend dropping the STAB moves (particularly Grass Knot). Rain Dance can be used if your team requires Rain support and it also heals you up a little with Rain Dish. Protect works for scouting and Leech Seed is another good supporting option, although I found it wasn't all that great here since Ludicolo isn't a Seed staller/Subseeder. You might be able to get a little Protect/Leech Seed going though.
Toxic is a fair option to chip away at the opponent's health but again, it's better on Stall Ludicolos. Synthesis is a VERY nice choice for healing, but it's unreliable because of all the Sand Streamers running around. Still, it's definitely worth mentioning as Ludicolo's only healing option. Fake Out is there if you want it, but you'll only be using it if you're really scared of Focus Sash.
Finally, you can change the Hidden Power on Ludicolo if you're scared of a few other threats, although Fire is generally the superior choice in most cases. Hidden Power Ground is an option to hit Magnezone really hard but that's all you do. If the opponent is using one of those Rock/Steels like Aggron it's a nasty surprise for them, but they're not common enough. Ludicolo can make a decent Kingdra counter with Hidden Power Dragon but again, that's all that you'll be countering.
Finally, Energy Ball is worth consideration since it hits Vaporeon a lot harder and if you're using this in BL matches then it's probably the superior choice. However, things are really heavy in OU and you need Grass Knot to effectively counter Gyarados.
This Ludicolo has performed well for me over Shoddy so far, generally surprising and taking out one, two or even three of my opponent's Pokemon as well as making a good late-game bulky attacker. Please offer your comments and suggestions and, if you decide to use it, I wish you well.
Ludicolo@Leftovers
Calm/Rain Dish
EVs: 204 HP/88 Def/100 SpA/104 SpD/12 Spe
~Surf
~Grass Knot
~Hidden Power Fire
~Ice Beam
Comments
This Ludicolo is designed to stop your team from getting swept by some top tier threats including Gyarados, Azelf, Starmie, Lucario, Heatran and Scizor. Ludicolo is often seen as setup fodder, so when these Pokemon decide to come in and set up on Ludicolo you've got some good options to KO them. Ludicolo is also an effective Physical wallbreaker and provides great coverage with its 4 different move types. I've been using it to counter some of things that can give my team trouble, namely Mamoswine, Hippo and Weavile.
EVs
The EVs are quite important on this set, much like the old Bulky Gyarados standard. For a 70 BP HP Fire the IVs generated are 31/x/31/30/31/30 (Speed last), which alters the spread slightly, albeit only by one point for a couple of stats. Firstly, 204 HP EVs reach the last Leftovers benchmark for Base 80 HP Pokemon and a stat of 352. 88 Defence EVs hit 198 Defence and garuntee survival from Adamant Life Orb Lucario's Close Combat, as long as it isn't boosted. 100 Special Attack EVs hit 240 Special Attack and also hits three birds with one stone. It garuntees that Surf will do at least 50% to that same Lucario, which means it will switch in and take the damage and can't KO you. It also garuntees that HP Fire will OHKO Scizor and Forry after Stealth Rock has been accounted for. Plus, it passes the 235 mark, the point where Ice Beam is garunteed to OHKO 4 HP/min Salamence. 12 Speed EVs get you to 178 and garuntee that you will outspeed minimum Speed Skarmory and also those Pokemon that rest one point above it, such as a few variants of Metagross. The 108 Special Defence EVs and the Calm nature gets to 288 Special Defence and allow Ludicolo to sponge Special hits well, including stuff like Zapdos' Thunderbolt.
Moveset
The basic moveset listed here allows the best protection from the largest amount of threats, but it can be taylored to fit your team's needs. For instance, if you already have a good Scizor counter you need not bother with HP Fire, and if the Dragons aren't a problem you won't need Ice Beam. I don't, however, reccommend dropping the STAB Water and Grass moves in any case since they will be Ludicolo's prime damage means.
HP Fire and Ice Beam deal with Scizor/Forretress and Salamence respectively. Often they'll come in on Ludicolo to try and set up(since many don't run Ice Beam, and I haven't yet seen one that runs HP Fire). The all-physical variants of Scizor and Mence won't be able to kill Ludicolo without a boost to their Attack. Adamant Life Orb Scizor does a maximum of 75% with Superpower and the standard Adamant Leftovers Salamence does a maximum of 89% with Outrage. Life Orb variants will usually OHKO, but you have a small chance of living. On to Forry. I was surprised at the amount of Forry-containing teams who were eager to switch their Steel bug into Ludicolo to spin away my Stealth Rocks and try and set some up of their own. HP Fire will always OHKO Forry if Stealth Rock is up (and still has a chance of doing so if there's no Stealth Rock).
Grass Knot deals great damage to Hippowdon and Tyranitar as well as hitting Gyarados pretty hard as well (Ludicolo walls Gyaras that don't have Stone Edge and will usually win in one on one situations as Grass Knot deals a minimum of 40% to 4 HP/min Gyarados). The fact that it gets STAB makes this a 180 BP move on all these Pokemon. Grass Knot also hits Starmie hard.
Finally, Surf is there mainly for Heatran. Ludicolo counters Scarf Heatran really well, but to do it properly it'll need something to hit it hard which is exactly what Surf does. Hydro Pump can be used in Surf's place to hit Metagross, Lucario and numerous other Steel types harder, in exchange for some accuracy.
Other Options
The set can be changed to fit your team, because you can choose the move you need the least and replace it with something more useful. Like I said though, I do not reccommend dropping the STAB moves (particularly Grass Knot). Rain Dance can be used if your team requires Rain support and it also heals you up a little with Rain Dish. Protect works for scouting and Leech Seed is another good supporting option, although I found it wasn't all that great here since Ludicolo isn't a Seed staller/Subseeder. You might be able to get a little Protect/Leech Seed going though.
Toxic is a fair option to chip away at the opponent's health but again, it's better on Stall Ludicolos. Synthesis is a VERY nice choice for healing, but it's unreliable because of all the Sand Streamers running around. Still, it's definitely worth mentioning as Ludicolo's only healing option. Fake Out is there if you want it, but you'll only be using it if you're really scared of Focus Sash.
Finally, you can change the Hidden Power on Ludicolo if you're scared of a few other threats, although Fire is generally the superior choice in most cases. Hidden Power Ground is an option to hit Magnezone really hard but that's all you do. If the opponent is using one of those Rock/Steels like Aggron it's a nasty surprise for them, but they're not common enough. Ludicolo can make a decent Kingdra counter with Hidden Power Dragon but again, that's all that you'll be countering.
Finally, Energy Ball is worth consideration since it hits Vaporeon a lot harder and if you're using this in BL matches then it's probably the superior choice. However, things are really heavy in OU and you need Grass Knot to effectively counter Gyarados.
This Ludicolo has performed well for me over Shoddy so far, generally surprising and taking out one, two or even three of my opponent's Pokemon as well as making a good late-game bulky attacker. Please offer your comments and suggestions and, if you decide to use it, I wish you well.
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