New and 'creative' moveset/EV spread thread Mk. 5

[Azure Demon]

that does sound like a good idea only thing that worries me about that set is i think it may give curse t-tars some time to set up a bit. But then again flash cannon serene grace takes care of that

and no speed is not the issue with this jirachi it can be as slow as it wants i have the parahax 60% chance for BS to slow things down for us while still keeping that special bulk

and i run careful with only physical moves because careful is -spatk +spdef

ok

physically base mixed infernape fire blast vs cosmic power rachi +1: 39.2% - 46.8%

specially based mixed infernapen fire blast vs cosmic power rachi +1: 45.7% - 54.8%

adamant max attack flygon earthquake vs cosmic power jirachi +1: 45.7% - 54.8%

adamant lead metagross with 236 atk evs vs cosmic power jirachi +1: 37.6% - 44.6%

 

[Shizzle]

Physicall Based Infernape Overheat to Jirachi After Cosmic Power = 63.44% - 74.73%
Other Special Mixapes [neutral 252 SpA] Fire Blast vs Jirachi after CP = 59.68% - 70.97%

Also we should keep in mind that these are all pretty much OHKOs or extremely close to OHKOs without CP up, and you can't set up CP after CP without some sort of recovery, IMO Wish would be amazing. Allowing it to actually set up and heal itself, because the enemy can merely sacrifice something [getting a STAB like EQ/Fire Blast off] and then finish Jirachi off with just about anything.

 

[Grayheart]

While we're on Jirachi sets I'll post this

Jirachi@Leftovers
Bold - 252 HP / 128 Defense / 128 Sp. Defense
+Serene Grace+
~Wish
~Cosmic Power
~Icy Wind
~Charge Beam
[NOTE: I made this when I first started playing and haven't touched it, I know the EV spread sucks. But I have no idea what to do to change it so..I guess that's where it needs help]
This Jirachi takes a VERY long time to get going (Regigigas would go sooner), but once it does only a critical hit can take it down.

Icy Wind + Charge Beam are certainly a devious duo. Icy Wind and Charge Beam's effects always take place, lowering opponent speed and upping Jirachi's Sp. Atk, respectively. Though they have low power, they have [nearly] perfect coverage.

Wish keeps Jirachi healthy while he sets up Cosmic Powers. Steel typing keeps Toxic from ruining your plan, though Leech Seed and WilloWisp can get very annoying, without a Sub to hide behind.

No STAB and low power moves means that a powerful bulky sweeper like Suicune can come in and probably win, so Toxic Spikes are helpful to wear him and the like down, and almost a necessity because this Jirachi is certainly sweeping no time soon. This is obviously for a stall team.

Just throwing this out there. *hides behind flame shield*

 

[Lucalibur]

you got a point? if its suppose to be used on stall then damage output is not the most important thing. it should be used with toxic spikes to damage bulky pokemons like suicune, ice and eletric hit pretty much all pokemons immune to T-spikes for high damage and are not named or friends of muk, drapion and skuntank. all you dont see often outside of NU and UU.

 

[lulzer]

Hello guys, this is my first post here but I've been playing here quite a time already.
Well, I know that Aggron in OU was discussed a ton of times already.
I know that many people will argue saying that his 4x earth and fighting weaknesses screw his job as a bulky poke. What about ignoring that and using these to your advantage?
I've been running this anti-lead/suicide lead for a while and it works wonders, only having trouble with ape, champ, the rare starmie, celebi and some stat leads.
Well, with no further addo, this is the set:

Lead Aggron:
Nature: Adamant
EV spread: 252 HP / 240 Attack / 16 SpD (still working on the special def, it MUST take at max 199% damage from earth power from timid Heatran)
Item: Shucca Berry
Moveset:
- Ice Punch
- Head Smash
- Metal Burst
- SR

Justification on the moves: Sr is obvious on a suicide lead, Ice Punch and Head Smash are your offensive options. I didn't go for EQ for the sole reason anything that you could hit with EQ (read Metagross,Heatran and Mamo) will attack before and deal more damage to you than you do to them and that's where the third move appears.
I'll give a paragraph on Metal Burst because it's what makes Aggron work, the point here is to profit from Aggron's weakness and low SpD and defeat leads that would otherwise cause trouble. This thing is so magical that it can kill a LO Scizor instantly if he tried to Brick Break you, leave Lead-Perts with 30% hp, OHKO Heatran and much more. It does require some prediction, but it's surprising how the stelly dude attracts EQs...

How to play it:
It's actually simples: stealth rock or attack your opponent but lets see with examples how to do it.

When you are facing:
- Aero: Ice punch him on the face, he wont KO you and the chance of getting taunted is huge. If you have no fear, SR up. He will deal 35% damage to you with EQ;
- Azelf: Same as aero, just with Head Smash, he wont OHKO you anyways;
- Heatran: Metal Burst him to oblivion, lets say you take 80% damage... well... he will take more than that;
- Swampert: SR up or try to metal burst him, he will be left with around 25~30% hp left if he EQs you, also with the SpD EVs you should take only 85% from surf, OHKOing him back;
- Metagross: Been a while, but just SR up, he can't stop you;
- Dragonite: Ice Punch him on the face... he can't OHKO you with superpower, well not even a scarf TTar can if I remember;
- Gyarados: Head Smash him, KO is a given;
- Ape /Celebi/ Starmie/ Machamp/ Stat Leads: Switch to something (Gengar is a nice partner to Aggron since he can kill Ape and severely dent Machamp if carrying explosion);

Also, this Aggron can lure AND kill Flygons and Salamences if his berry is intact: Bring him in, wait for the EQ, Ice Punch, Profit. Same works with gyara, just with Head Smash.

Thanks for reading, and I hope to see some more Aggrons out there in OU.

TL;DR: Metal Burst Aggron Lead is made of awesomesauce.

 

[lulzer]

Hmm.... thats assuming timid? I've been using metalkid calc and it said i'd be safe with 16 EV, also smogon calc said the same. But i think you can even realocate attack EV to something else, since even skarm takes a whooping 50% from smash.

 

[Captain Awesome]

Hmm.... thats assuming timid? I've been using metalkid calc and it said i'd be safe with 16 EV, also smogon calc said the same. But i think you can even realocate attack EV to something else, since even skarm takes a whooping 50% from smash.

252 / 16 is only sufficient if the Heatran isn't holding a Life Orb / Specs. Hell, even if it uses Soft Sand it still gets a guaranteed OHKO.

 

[Delko]

Just use a Focus Sash instead. This way you can pump more EV's into offense.

 

[Lucalibur]

i used to run a aggron set almost like that, but it was somewhat different.

(Aggron) (M) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Rock Head
EVs: 252 HP/252 Atk/6 Spd
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Head Smash
- Thunder Wave
- Stealth Rock
- Metal Burst

with enough prediction it could beat most leads, it only lost to roserade and scarf brelooms who spore insteaf of superpower. the thing is simple, you gotta have perfect prediction here.

against metagross you have to guess if he is going to EQ or SR, if he SR then you SR too, if he EQ you metal busst. against azelf you t-wave if he SR, head smash if he taunt and you can only use SR after paralyzing azelf(you outspeed and dont fear taunt anymore).

the same deal for most leads, metal burst or SR VS swampert and etc, aero is the most tricky one, he often taunt so its better to head smash him but if he dont you can para him and put SR in field, metal burst is useless here because head smash will 2hko(sash) in the same way metal burst would.

 

[Ericcc]

i used to run a aggron set almost like that, but it was somewhat different.

(Aggron) (M) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Rock Head
EVs: 252 HP/252 Atk/6 Spd
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Head Smash
- Thunder Wave
- Stealth Rock
- Metal Burst

with enough prediction it could beat most leads, it only lost to roserade and scarf brelooms who spore insteaf of superpower. the thing is simple, you gotta have perfect prediction here.

against metagross you have to guess if he is going to EQ or SR, if he SR then you SR too, if he EQ you metal busst. against azelf you t-wave if he SR, head smash if he taunt and you can only use SR after paralyzing azelf(you outspeed and dont fear taunt anymore).

the same deal for most leads, metal burst or SR VS swampert and etc, aero is the most tricky one, he often taunt so its better to head smash him but if he dont you can para him and put SR in field, metal burst is useless here because head smash will 2hko(sash) in the same way metal burst would.

Seems like a pretty sold, but extremely risky lead.
What if Head Smash misses? What if you SR and they EQ? I don't think it outspeeds Metagross leads (does it?) so at most you'll just get SR up.
I would shy away from something like this... lol

 

[Lucalibur]

you are suppose to be outspeed by leads like metagross so that you can metal burst the shit out of they asses, different from counter this move dont got negative priority so if you are faster then metal burst(and the only change you got of beating metagross) is useless.

i said you need to have perfect prediction what no one really got. i heard about high risk high reward but i have to agree this is too much.

 

[lulzer]

The sash idea is interesting, but i still find the berry more useful just in case you need to switch him back, with the sash you probably wont be able to revenge kill later on as anyone can set rocks up against aggron. Besides, Machamp will confuse you, Ape will do his sash breaking combo so the deal is more or less the same...
You don't need any more EV in offense, with the 16 SpD you can still deal 50% to spiker skarm if he's not roosting.
About the risk of missing the Head Smash, it's pretty accurate, people use Fire Blast and Stone Edge, right?
For aero leads, i find it more useful to Ice Punch em right in the face.
And it's not that hard to predict stuff with aggron, he is still somewhat unheard of in OU, so people will just EQ your face... at least that's what been happening with me for a while.

 

[Azure Demon]

Physicall Based Infernape Overheat to Jirachi After Cosmic Power = 63.44% - 74.73%
Other Special Mixapes [neutral 252 SpA] Fire Blast vs Jirachi after CP = 59.68% - 70.97%

Also we should keep in mind that these are all pretty much OHKOs or extremely close to OHKOs without CP up, and you can't set up CP after CP without some sort of recovery, IMO Wish would be amazing. Allowing it to actually set up and heal itself, because the enemy can merely sacrifice something [getting a STAB like EQ/Fire Blast off] and then finish Jirachi off with just about anything.

see but another thing is most of the moves putting jirachi in that 1hit Jo zone are also pretty high risk moves fire blast overheat ect. Only one is stabbed eq the hp is easy gotten back from drain punching because most of the pokemon running ground moves barring 3 are hit for neutral damage or super effective damage by it allowing it to heal up. (on the physical set)

as for the special variant we could drop flash cannon for wish because everything rachi doesn't hit neutral or se damage with t-bolt toxic can hit only pokemon that doesn't apply to in ou is magnezone

 

[Brammi]

I was looking at things that can draw in and destroy or just plain destroy some of todays big threats such as ScarfTar, BandScizor and Machamp. I was taking a look at scizor especially. (Just because of what was on my team at that point.) Now I wanted to bait it an destroy it so I went for Gengar / Zone duo to do it. Now the problem was that Tyranitar was ruining my fun all the time. Adding to that was that Starmie was able to just come in revenge and start sweeping. So I was going to need a faster Gengar. Enter BaitKazam.

BaitKazam

Alakazam @ Life Orb
Ability: Either work
EVs: 28HP / 228Spe / 252SpD
Timid (+Spe, -Att)
Moves
~ Psychic
~ Focus Blast
~ HP Fire
~ Protect

This set works almost exactly the same way that BaitGar works. It baits in Scizor looking for a revenge kill in which case you Protect to look which move it wants to beat you with. Bullet Punch means you can move to the Magnezone in the same way as Gengar. If it is looking to pursuit you, you can retaliate with HP Fire before it hits you. So far no different to the Gengar we know and love. Now to what it can do better.

Gengar due to it's base 110 speed is outsped by Scarftar who loves to revenge it. It doesn't have that pleasure against Alakazam. Scarf tar is outsped by a single point thanks to the Speed EVs and will always be 1HKOed by Focus Blast. Specially defensive variants such as CurseTar are weakened into a range able to be revenged by almost anything Diond a minimum of 85.6% damage and you have around a 2% chance of OHKOing CurseTar. These are impressive quirks. Sure Gengar does better against CurseTar but it doesn't have the pleasure of beating ScarfTar.

Opinions, Comments?

 

[Coldcut]

I was looking at things that can draw in and destroy or just plain destroy some of todays big threats such as ScarfTar, BandScizor and Machamp. I was taking a look at scizor especially. (Just because of what was on my team at that point.) Now I wanted to bait it an destroy it so I went for Gengar / Zone duo to do it. Now the problem was that Tyranitar was ruining my fun all the time. Adding to that was that Starmie was able to just come in revenge and start sweeping. So I was going to need a faster Gengar. Enter BaitKazam.

BaitKazam

Alakazam @ Life Orb
Ability: Either work
EVs: 28HP / 228Spe / 252SpD
Timid (+Spe, -Att)
Moves
~ Psychic
~ Focus Blast
~ HP Fire
~ Protect

This set works almost exactly the same way that BaitGar works. It baits in Scizor looking for a revenge kill in which case you Protect to look which move it wants to beat you with. Bullet Punch means you can move to the Magnezone in the same way as Gengar. If it is looking to pursuit you, you can retaliate with HP Fire before it hits you. So far no different to the Gengar we know and love. Now to what it can do better.

Gengar due to it's base 110 speed is outsped by Scarftar who loves to revenge it. It doesn't have that pleasure against Alakazam. Scarf tar is outsped by a single point thanks to the Speed EVs and will always be 1HKOed by Focus Blast. Specially defensive variants such as CurseTar are weakened into a range able to be revenged by almost anything Diond a minimum of 85.6% damage and you have around a 2% chance of OHKOing CurseTar. These are impressive quirks. Sure Gengar does better against CurseTar but it doesn't have the pleasure of beating ScarfTar.

Opinions, Comments?

I posted a nearly identical Alakazam a while back, except with Expert Belt instead of Life Orb. You really only want to keep him in if he can OHKO and the Expert Belt gets all those KOs (ScarfTar, Scizor, etc.). I had him EVed to survive a Jolly Ttar Pursuit if you stay in to have two chances with Focus Blast and survive a +1 Scizor bullet Punch at full health.

Here it is:

Pokemon name:Alakazam
Moveset Name: BaitZam
-Psychic
-Focus Blast
-Hidden Power Fire
-Protect
Item: Expert Belt
Ability: Synchronize
Nature: Timid
EVs: 236 Defense / 44 Special Attack / 228 Speed

This set acts as bait for Tyranitar and Scizor. The Expert Belt is used to bluff a choice item, giving Scarf Ttar and CB Scizor what they think will be an easy revenge kill. It also guarantees the KO on Scarf Ttar in Sandstorm with Focus Blast. The strategy is simple. Come in on something Alakazam can either pick off or scare away, luring in the opponent's Tyranitar or Scizor, Alakazam's biggest counters.

The given EVs and nature allow you to always outspeed +1 Jolly Tyranitar (factoring in the speed drop from HP Fire) and survive a 40 base power Pursuit after stealth rock and one round of Sandstorm (with 1HP) if Focus Blast misses, giving you two shots at KOing it, with a 91% chance of success (given Focus Blast's shaky accuracy). Protect is listed to scout Scizor's move, but CB Scizor's Bullet Punch does a maximum of 97.2% with the given EVs, so you can opt to attack with HP Fire right away if Alakazam is at full health. If Alakazam is at less than 97.2% (244HP), Protect first and if Scizor uses Pursuit or U-turn, fire away with HP Fire. If it uses Bullet Punch, switch to an appropriate counter, but watch out for Swords Dance varieties.

This set can also be used to revenge kill both of these pokemon, if Scizor is not locked into Bullet Punch. It can also revenge kill various fighting types like Infernape, a guaranteed OHKO with Psychic, and has a good chance of OHKOing most variants of Machamp.

If you are feeling lucky with Focus Blast, you can go with a more standard 4 Def/252 SAtk/252Spd to hit other pokemon harder and outspeed a few extra threats, but you will lose the ability to potentially survive a CB Scizor Bullet Punch.

I eventually ditched the defensive portions of the EVs in favor of more offensive punch because the extra survivability turned out to be too situational.

 

[Brammi]

It is so frail that defence really isn't needed. I do like that though. I might change it to be Expert Belt. I do like how I can 1HKO Mence with Life Orb after SR though. Maybe if it gets banned.

 

[Coldcut]

Salamence is a significant OHKO so it might be worth it. I eventually dropped Protect in favor of another coverage move like Shadow Ball after getting burned by SD Scizor too many times. Even one of Alakazam's many great support moves might work in that last spot too, like Substitute, Reflect, Encore, etc.

 

[3v3rnoob]

On alakazam I like using encore. It's then allowed to come in on something like calm mind Jirachi or cosmic power clefable, encore, then get a free attack on the switch. If they're dumb enough to stay in, Zam can just encore again when the encore ends.

 

[Azure Demon]

well 3v3rnoob those are horrible examples of pokemon to encore because either way your zam is getting the fuck stalled out of it especially rachi after 2 calm minds zam won't be doing jack shit with hp fire to a jirachi so maybe some better examples are in order

posted by Iloveliza

BaitKazam

Alakazam @ Life Orb
Ability: Either work
EVs: 28HP / 228Spe / 252SpD
Timid (+Spe, -Att)
Moves
~ Psychic
~ Focus Blast
~ HP Fire
~ Protect

This set works almost exactly the same way that BaitGar works. It baits in Scizor looking for a revenge kill in which case you Protect to look which move it wants to beat you with. Bullet Punch means you can move to the Magnezone in the same way as Gengar. If it is looking to pursuit you, you can retaliate with HP Fire before it hits you. So far no different to the Gengar we know and love. Now to what it can do better.

Gengar due to it's base 110 speed is outsped by Scarftar who loves to revenge it. It doesn't have that pleasure against Alakazam. Scarf tar is outsped by a single point thanks to the Speed EVs and will always be 1HKOed by Focus Blast. Specially defensive variants such as CurseTar are weakened into a range able to be revenged by almost anything Diond a minimum of 85.6% damage and you have around a 2% chance of OHKOing CurseTar. These are impressive quirks. Sure Gengar does better against CurseTar but it doesn't have the pleasure of beating ScarfTar.

this is a nice set I'll look to give it a try however i still think this set will have a problem with siczor due to the simple fact that siczor can easily bait you into either switching or staying in if you use protect you don't have the knowledge of is it life orbed or choice banded so if you see bullet punch and you assume banded you will be likely to be destroyed on the switch by a pursuit

 

[Efemera]

I wouldn't count on Focus Blast's shaky 70% accuracy to eliminate ScarfTar. There's definitely better Pokemon for the job. Also, Alakazam lacks Gengar's 3 immunities and 2 4x resistances, making it a lot harder to switch in.

 

[Bogmire]

This is more of a creative EV spread than a moveset (the moves themselves are pretty standard) I think its a lot better than the one in the analysis anyway (near max defense EVs when you have WoW and the most common spinner is starmie why?). Just remember Dusknoir is inherently a pretty bad poke in general so don't expect miracles from this set. This utilizes as many advantages over Rotom as possible namely access to EQ, SS, IP, and significantly better special defense.

Not outclassed by Rotom

Dusknoir@Leftovers
Careful
EVs: 252 HP/88 Def/168 SpD
-Pain Split
-Will-O-Wisp
-Earthquake
-Shadow Sneak/Ice Punch

I spent a couple hours running damage calcs trying to figure out what significant things Dusknoir would like to survive to come up with the EV spread. Only 88 defense EVs are needed to guarantee survival from +1 outrage from lum mence (who isn't exactly uncommon) after SR so you can get a second chance to burn it or just kill it with ice punch. 88 defense evs also let you survive 2 jolly outrages from scarfgon after SR+lefties 99.4% of the time so that's kinda handy. The rest of the EVs are thrown in special defense to let Dusknoir counter LO spin starmie better than Rotom could ever hope to. the EVs give 382 special defense which means LO surf never 2HKOs after SR (mixape flamethrower won't either). of course if it has hydro pump then you could die unless you come in at full health (just make sure you don't switch in on hydro pump and you'll probably be able to pressure stall hydro pump with pain split or just shadow sneak it). EQ is pretty standard on Dusknoir so its nothing new. its easily dusknoir's most consistent and reliable attack and it actually hits a lot of special sweepers like heatran, mixape, and jolteon for big damage. Again, being able to stand up to those Pokemon is another advantage Dusknoir has over Rotom. shadow sneak is also standard judging by usage statistics but its not in the analysis for some reason. priority is just GOOD to have on something slow like dusknoir and hitting scarf rotom, gengar, and starmie for respectable damage is never a bad thing. also helps in tight situations where EQ may have left just a sliver of health remaining on something. Ice punch is pretty good too as a secondary attack for near perfect neutral coverage as well as hitting stuff like breloom, gliscor, flygon, and salamence. I feel tpunch and fpunch are better on a purely physically defensive set so I left them out. scizor still hates getting burned and you should have something else to counter bulkygyara so yeah.

 

[Shizzle]

Thunder Punch deserves a slash there, no real comments considering it has the same function as the set Dusknoir, looks nice :P. If you don't have Thundepunch, then TauntDDdos loves to switch in, of course the choice between Shadowsneak/Ice Punch/Thunder Punch would be based on your team

 

[Despotar]

Agility Sweeper

@ Life Orb/Lum Berry
Adamant
Hyper Cutter
4 HP/252 atk/252 spe
-Agility
-Stone Edge
-Earthquake
-Night Slash/Fire Fang

This is a Gliscor meant to kill it's normal counters, and sweep late game.
It gets pretty good coverage with EQ Stone edge, and night slash,
Stone edge can OHKO Gyara after SR it can also OHKO Mence after SR, (Hyper cutter counters intimidate.) Earthquake can OHKO any Heatran set, and it always outspeeds after a agility. Night Slash can 2HKO any rotom set after SR, and can 3HKO Dusknoir.
Fire Fang is optional to counter Scizor, and levitating steels (Bronzoong) who would otherwise wall you.

Hope you like this set! It works well.

 

[beep beep beep]

Gliscor does not learn any of the elemental punches. It has to settle for the fangs.

 

[Despotar]

Sorry it was a typo.