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NP: UU - Silent Night

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Even Sluge Bomb doesn't do much against Arcanine (i'm considering the combo here).
Also, considering i'm using this combo, i'll probably have a third poke to receive the BP as well (i love Nodoking here).

You have a point though: not considering the combo, Sludge Bomb is maybe a better option overall. Can't say, since i only used Weezing once, with a troll LO Explosion moveset...
 
Alexa888 said:
Quick Feet Jolly Ursaring does the same thing, but better IMO. Its slightly faster, you get the jump on Mismagius, Scyther and Dugtrio, and it gets Close Combat, so you aren't hopelessly walled by Steel Types.
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Raticate, however, gets Super Fang and Thunder Wave, and can run Guts without being outsped at the worst moments. It also gets Flame Wheel, although FW is pretty weak.

On another note, I just got completely raped by a BP team.
 
@Conflict: Yeah Conflict, I told franky that... =/

@PK Gaming: Something along these lines, though I dislike Rest unless you have Heal Bell, so using Pursuit or a slashed move is possible. Spiritomb's job is usually just getting rid of a problem mons like Missy or Zam, so I'm not all that bothered if it dies afterwards.

@M Blade: As mentioned before, not only Sludge Bomb does a decent amount (37% is enough to make its life harder when added to SR, not to mention the possible poison if it doesn't carry Lum Berry), but Arcanine needs to eat a huge amount of recoil, can be checked by the Arcanine that has been mentioned through intimidate and Extremespeed, by Milotic if it doesn't switch in and so on. Same for Nidoking, he needs a Lum Berry to break through Weezing, so that means Milotic can take a +2 EQ and Surf it. Finally, Arcanine works again.

For the first time I'm happy with a topic that popped up in this thread...
 
Okay, the UU ladder is an absolute shitfest at the moment. I mean, I don't mind people testing gimmicks, but the stuff I'm seeing aren't even gimmick testers any more. The ladder is now just full of noobs, spamming stuff like Giga Impact Delcatty (I'm like "WTF").
 
shrang said:
Okay, the UU ladder is an absolute shitfest at the moment. I mean, I don't mind people testing gimmicks, but the stuff I'm seeing aren't even gimmick testers any more. The ladder is now just full of noobs, spamming stuff like Giga Impact Delcatty (I'm like "WTF").
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lol. I ran an old NFE team i made a while back for NU. The saddest part is, it did well.
Also, I faced a BP team today and I outstalled the whole team with jumpluff. They kept passing around until I was eventually facing a +6+6+6+6+6+6 bibarel, and jumpluff just sub/protect/sub/protect/sub/protect. lol. Also, he had a leofeon on their, so apperently, grass types just can't be seeded but they are affected by leech seed?

on an unrelated note, our good friend moltres can make a return to show its pretty little face again should this core ever be prominent in the ladder. it can shred apart milotic who decide to run 252/252 bold instead of going calm. with qwilfish support + rapid spin, it could be seeing more usage again. but then again, this would shift the metagame to weezlotic + chansey + tomb.
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I run that combo of qwilfish + spinner + moltres, and it's awesome. With a set of spikes, aqua jet, explosion, and taunt, qwilish can either set up a spike and then aqua jet to sashbreak against offensive team, or be saved for later to make weapon against stall, coming in on something like milotic, taunting them, setting up some spikes, then exploding.
And it's too bad natural gift isn't proggramed on shoddy, otherwise moltres could blast that defensive core to peices with a base 80 power physical fighting move for chansey and fire blasting everything else. Natural gift is definatly something I could see having potential when SB2 comes out.
 
MegaKick said:
And it's too bad natural gift isn't proggramed on shoddy, otherwise moltres could blast that defensive core to peices with a base 80 power physical fighting move for chansey and fire blasting everything else. Natural gift is definatly something I could see having potential when SB2 comes out.
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Well, if Moltres used the berry that makes him have a 80 base power fighting move, it would lose its Life Orb, making his overall destructive power go way down. Plus, a Neutral Fire Blast does more than a super effective Natural Gift (120 * 1.5 = 180 > 80 * 2 =160).
 
Plus, a Neutral Fire Blast does more than a super effective Natural Gift (120 * 1.5 = 180 > 80 * 2 =160)
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Chansey's Special Defense is about 3x as high as its Physical Defense, though.
 
Modest LO Moltres Fire Blast 252 SAtk vs. 252/252 Chansey = 29.5% - 34.8%
+Speed Moltres' Natural Gift [Fighting] (no Atk EVs) vs. same Chansey = 38.7% - 45.9%

Remember Natural Gift is physical. You need 172 Atk EVs and +Atk nature to do 50.2% min on 252/252 calm chansey, but this is with a 31 x 6 IV spread, and I don't know if that's a legal combination or not.
 
shrang said:
The ladder is now just full of noobs, spamming stuff like Giga Impact Delcatty (I'm like "WTF").
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Ah, you're still unaware of the sheer power that set has >.<

Anyway, I'm using Anti-lead Houndoom on all my UU teams lately and he is one of the most effective ones these days imo. Although I've seen a lot of Dugtrio leads lately but that could be me.
 
Haha I thought Natural Gift was special... Well, you learn something new everyday lol sorry

Even then, can't you only use Natural Gift once before the berry is gone?
 
Sky attack does more and has a 30% chance to flinch, so you could give it a power herb and solar beam to attack Milotic, but giving it a physical move other than U-turn in the first place just isn't right...

Solar beam does 58.5% - 69.2% to Milotic. That's not bad. It OHKOs with Spikes and SR. The downside is, you lose a lot more power on your special STABs.
 
Hi there :toast:. My name is FlameHeart. I'm new on Smogon, but I've been playing Shoddy for the last week.

I've noticed you guys have been talking about gimmicks. The thing is, I've haven't seen much of these "gimmicks" (Giga Impact Delcaty!?). I know I haven't been here for very long, but I've been seeing a a lot more serious teams rather then gimmicks. In fact, I've seen a large number of rain and hail teams. Luckly, I've used a Sunny Day-Trick Room team, so they haven't been a problem. (Screaming Gimmick Anyone!?)
 
yeah, well, a lot of the higher up players are probably just bored and testing for lulz. You'll get there someday (as will I :/)
Also I didn't mean to start a natural gift discussion I just meant I wish there was some way moltres could surprise chansey with that base 100 attack. If only it had beat up T_T
 
Charizard has Beat Up, if you're looking for a Moltres-lite that can break through Chansey. Who would give up Life Orb just to get a one-time Fighting-type attack on Chansey -.-.
 
The best fire type for me is still definitely magmortar and I'm glad that hes so underused because hes really a hard to handle pokemon. The mix set can devastate any balance / stall team I play. I have had so many milotic switch ins to magmortar that I just tbolt the first turn every time now and set myself up for the 2hko. Thats how easy Milotic has become for me since I started running Magmortar. Point is more people need to be using him.

I'm also wondering if anyone else has been play testing with magmortar to the same outcome as I have?
 
magmortar is pretty good, definitely one of the top five stall breakers. back in the day i ran substitute / focus punch / fire blast / thunderbolt @ expert belt. stall pretty much auto loses against that; put a sub up and watch shit die. life orb would probably be better, however with so many azumarill / houndoom / arcanine sponging fire blast you must be careful with spamming fire blast. with that sr weakness plus the life orb recoil, every hit needs to be a 2hko. that's whats holding him back; he just doesnt have the bulk to switch in, and one wrong move and he's out 35%
 
Yea I generally run rapid spin support with him because I really don't enjoy that 25% he gets when he switches in. Though to my surprise alot of people have been excluding Stealth Rocks from their team which baffles me. I really like that subpunch set though haha, something new to test out, thanks badass.
 
badass that set is pretty awesome. Rock/Grounds are annoying but nobody switches them into mortar anyway. As Yondie said, spin support is much appreciated especially since it'll be using Sub with no recovery. As for Fire Blast spongers, shouldn't you normally be setting up a sub as they switch in? I thought the point of sub on that set was to ease predictions like those and take advantage of their switch and reacting with Tbolt/Focus Punch.
 
I'm curious as to everyone's opinion on the effect of Salamence's upcoming ban on UU. There's been a number of people who've posted recently saying that they'd like some change to the UU metagame to create more interest, and this has the possibility of moving more than a few Pokemon around.

Obviously the Suspect ladder won't directly relate to what we'll see in OU in the future, but it's certainly a good indicator. And the suspected concentration of G/F/W cores in OU may push and pull more than a few Pokemon close to the OU/UU border.

For instance, some Pokemon of interest from June's Suspect Ladder:
44 Lanturn
47 Dugtrio
48 Electivire
50 Sceptile
51 Dusknoir
55 Slowbro
57 Ninjask
60 Umbreon

Now I don't know where the line would be in there precisely, but it would probably be in that area. Any thoughts? Any other Pokemon you think might be pulled up into OU? Others that you feel might be less useful and fall?
 
Salamence got banned huh... this does not bode well for UU

I mean what is this nonsense! Lanturn, Slowbro and Sceptile might go to OU?
Oh and Electivire in UU... (shudders)

I mean Lanturn is an excellent counter Starmie, and Slowbro takes on Machamp no problem, but are those 2 pokemon prominent enough to warrent the high use of said pokemon?

For one, it's the ultimate Electric-Slayer.
Fairy Tail Reference
Not only is it a powerful offensive pokemon force, but it really literally hurt UU's electric attacks. No more can you use Raichu, Manectric and Rotom (well Rotom'll will still stay frosty I guess) with ease. Electivire cripples them, and not only that it's the ultimate partner to Milotic. The worse part? Electivire doesn't even BREAK UU. It has counters, and it lacks the raw power to muscle it's way through the tier.

Sceptile leaving UU would piss me off to no end. It's a very fun pokemon to use with multiple sets. I concede that it's viable in OU (even more so with Mence gone) it'll be a sad day when it leaves.

Dugtrio leaving UU would also piss me off. It's great to take out Chansey/Registeel with ease now that nobody runs Shed Shell. I would not like my tool being taken away from me.

Ninjask in UU is pretty annoying. You'll see a bunch of useless Baton Pass team's on Shoddy. Is Ninjask good in UU? Personally I have no idea, but it's a decent lead nonetheless. The lacking of taunt AGAIN hurts it.

Umbreon coming back to UU is pretty nice I guess.


Edit: I hate to say this but I've got to rely on the scrubs who continually use Electivire excessively. I guess we should consider that they'll excessively use some of the potential drop downs and thus negate it.
 
A lot of the changes in Suspect just reflected the higher skill level of players playing there. Some people seem to be suggesting that Venusaur may be pulled into OU with Salamence gone, which would really shake up UU. However, I don't find that likely.
 
Venusuar is going to stay UU. Roserade pretty much covers it.
Also without Sala in OU, we might not see Heracross in UU anymore (since now it's only Draggy up there, and Dragnite is slower. So is Gyarados).

It would be cool to see something like Weavile in UU, however.
 
PK Gaming said:
Not only is it a powerful offensive pokemon force, but it really literally hurt UU's electric attacks. No more can you use Raichu, Manectric and Rotom (well Rotom'll will still stay frosty I guess) with ease. Electivire cripples them, and not only that it's the ultimate partner to Milotic. The worse part? Electivire doesn't even BREAK UU. It has counters, and it lacks the raw power to muscle it's way through the tier.
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Wait, so you're saying that you would hate to see E-vire come down not because it would be broken (as you said, it probably wouldn't) or centralize the metagame, but because you wouldn't be able to use Raichu anymore. lol.

On another note, I feel that a lot of the stall teams I've been facing on the ladder are relying too much on Milotic against the myriad special Fire attackers. A typical core I've seen goes something like Weezing/Milo/Tomb/Registeel, with Chansey and Venusaur also being popular. With entry hazards and double-switching, Milo can easily get worn down into KO range for, say, +2 Dark Pulse from Houndoom or HP Grass from Moltres. From there, the aforementioned attacker can go on and sweep unperturbed. I would recommend packing another pokemon that can actually hurt fire-types, especially since Milo is being relied on to also wall a whole bunch of other crap. Also, anyone running Subperior should definitely outpace that damn Weezing. Stone Edge 3HKOs, while you can grab a free Sub against something that's supposed to wall you.
 
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