Past Gen RNG Research

I was doing some research on Eggs. I found something that seems to make RNG abusing Eggs in HGSS very hard to impossible. I double checked to compare it to platinum to see if it was the same before coming to this conclusion. In Platinum you can put both parents in the day-care and the RNG is never called once, untill you leave to house. This makes me think that as soon as 2 compatible parents are in the day-care, an egg is made based on the current seed, but held from the player until they take the right amount of steps. Now, in HGSS as soon as you give the Day-care lady one parent, the RNG gets calls of about once persecond. This is why I think it will very hard to impossible to RNG abuse Eggs in HGSS, because by the time you can get the other parent in the daycare so the game can make the egg, the RNG has advanced quite a few times.
It isn't hard at all. I already abused an egg once on my flashcart.

I believe what you were looking at was the Breeding IVs, not the PID.
 
It isn't hard at all. I already abused an egg once on my flashcart.

I believe what you were looking at was the Breeding IVs, not the PID.
Well, I guess it wont be impossible, but it might be the same as trying to hit a delay. Giving the first parent on a frame a few frames before the frame you need, then trying to time it so you give them the 2nd parent on the frame you need.

But, it wasn't IVs those are determined when you pick up the egg, I was giving the day-care couple the parents.
 
Well, I guess it wont be impossible, but it might be the same as trying to hit a delay. Giving the first parent on a frame a few frames before the frame you need, then trying to time it so you give them the 2nd parent on the frame you need.

But, it wasn't IVs those are determined when you pick up the egg, I was giving the day-care couple the parents.
Does it stop calling when you put the second parent in?

If you go outside and save with 2 parents in the daycare and reset, the first egg you get is frame 1, so the RNG calls you see eventually stop/don't affect you if you restart the game.
 
Does it stop calling when you put the second parent in?

If you go outside and save with 2 parents in the daycare and reset, the first egg you get is frame 1, so the RNG calls you see eventually stop/don't affect you if you restart the game.
No, I think it has to do with the NPCs, I think I read somewhere when a NPC move/turns it advances the RNG. When you put pokemon in the daycare it makes npc of it and they turn around, and there is one NPC on the route the daycare is on that turns around in place. It might not remember preplanned eggs on a SR, so it could do a check on start, and if there are breed able parents in the daycare, it makes an egg based on the first frame.

Also, here is some Egg IV research.

Code:
Male Dratini: 18/28/2/29/9/29
Ditto: 28/2/25/11/31/7

Egg: 1
Initial Seed: 9D1101F8
Frame: 3
Real IVs: 1/28/25/28/10/29
RNG Reporter IVs: 1/24/B/28/10/A

Egg: 2
Initial Seed: 35120202
Frame: 11
Real IVs: 18/2/25/15/18/30
RNG Reporter IVs: 5/A/23/15/18/30

Egg: 3
Initial Seed: 72120204
Frame: 5
Real IVs: 1/28/2/3/9/15
RNG Reporter IVs: 1/13/B/3/B/15

Egg: 4
Initial Seed: 47120200
Frame: 15
Real IVs: 18/28/25/1/25/29
RNG Reporter IVs: 19/A/18/1/25/29

Egg: 5
Initial Seed: 421201F8
Frame: 3
Real IVs: 28/5/25/29/7/13
RNG Reporter IVs: A/5/A/B/7/13

Egg: 6
Initial Seed: 3F120216
Frame: 3
Real IVs: 18/3/25/11/20/29
RNG Reporter IVs: 18/3/10/A/20/B

Egg: 7
Initial Seed: 681204AC
Frame: 17
Real IVs: 8/2/4/29/31/23
RNG Reporter IVs: 8/21/4/B/A/A

Egg: 8
Initial Seed: 6A1206DC
Frame: 91
Real IVs: 28/9/25/11/26/8
RNG Reporter IVs: 2/A/18/A/26/A

Egg: 9
Initial Seed: 7B120220
Frame: 3
Real IVs: 18/10/6/13/9/29
RNG Reporter IVs: 28/B/6/13/B/B

Egg: 10
Initial Seed: 651205C8
Frame: 11
Real IVs: 15/2/6/29/31/6
RNG Reporter IVs: 15/A/6/B/A/6
 
No, I think it has to do with the NPCs, I think I read somewhere when a NPC move/turns it advances the RNG. When you put pokemon in the daycare it makes npc of it and they turn around, and there is one NPC on the route the daycare is on that turns around in place. It might not remember preplanned eggs on a SR, so it could do a check on start, and if there are breed able parents in the daycare, it makes an egg based on the first frame.
Yes, like I said from before, that is the breeding RNG. Yes the pokemon become a NPC, and that is why it advances. The pokemon turns based on the RNG. The pid creation is no way affected, and once you leave the building, they don't affect you, or if they do, it is equal to the same amount of NPCs in dppt, 3.
 
Yes, like I said from before, that is the breeding RNG. Yes the pokemon become a NPC, and that is why it advances. The pokemon turns based on the RNG. The pid creation is no way affected, and once you leave the building, they don't affect you, or if they do, it is equal to the same amount of NPCs in dppt, 3.
Wait there is more than one RNG?
 
I'm abusing right now for Lugia but I wanted to ask something.
So the 128 steps are the only thing to advance the RNG there?
Getting a shiny must be a bitch then:(
 
I'm abusing right now for Lugia but I wanted to ask something.
So the 128 steps are the only thing to advance the RNG there?
Getting a shiny must be a bitch then:(
You can save outside his room and advance the RNG with Radio/Talking to your poke. Just make sure you count how many steps you take to talk to Lugia, and his initial frame after that.
 
I guess I found a reliable way of advancing the frame for Lugia(or any legendary in HG/SS after all):
When you're out of the cave and you're pokemon is jumping out of it's pokeball....
Everytime you turn to your pokemon or from your pokemon away (this seems to be important that it's TO your pokemon and not only simply to your left or right, no need to talk to it all)
this advances the frame by exactly 2.
Every time, always...^^
So like doing this 10 times advances the frame by 20, and 100 times by 200...
btw probably already known but with two roaming pokemon Lugias Starting Frame is 3.
 
I guess I found a reliable way of advancing the frame for Lugia(or any legendary in HG/SS after all):
When you're out of the cave and you're pokemon is jumping out of it's pokeball....
Everytime you turn to your pokemon or from your pokemon away (this seems to be important that it's TO your pokemon and not only simply to your left or right, no need to talk to it all)
this advances the frame by exactly 2.
Every time, always...^^
So like doing this 10 times advances the frame by 20, and 100 times by 200...
btw probably already known but with two roaming pokemon Lugias Starting Frame is 3.
That's very insteresting. I'll make some tests on this when I get home :)
 
Well it worked at least for me:)
Got me a Calm Lugia with 26/27/27/25/28/30
I think that's good enough. could be higher IVs and shiny but for first testing of this it worked out pretty well.
But it still needs some sort of testing because sometimes (on rare occasions) it advances the frame only 1 and not 2. Also maybe you would have to take the 128 steps thing into account (does turning around counts as a step)not sure yet.
But well you can play along and see how it works out.
The fact that the pokemon follows you (the steps the pokemon makes maybe) seems to advance the RNG btw to an unfixed rate (not quite sure though)
 

ΩDonut

don't glaze me bro
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PIDs for Pokewalker-generated Pokemon (at least Pikachu from the Yellow Forest) are always in the form D5FFFF??. I don't know if IVs are linked to them yet, but if so, it means there are only 256 possible IV combinations for them.

This kind of dampens hope of RNG-manip on the Pokewalker, because it means PID generation is handled on it (it probably can't handle more than 16 bits, so only the last two hex digits vary), so IV generation is probably handled there, too. I originally thought PID\IV generation would be handled once the Pokemon are transferred to the game, but maybe not.
 
This may be sort of a dumb and probably answered question already but not good enough for me to understand so maybe someone could actually explain me:
So if I'm going for abusing Raikou and Entei this has to be done when I encounter them first in the Ruins and they're running away? That's when the IVs, Shinyness and Nature is set?
If so, since I recall that they've been people who succesfully abused a shiny: how did you advance the RNG there? which method are they. a short explanation of the abusing process there would be damn nice.

Sry double post. Succesfully abused for a Shiny Lugia now but with crappy IVs.
Guys do your Shiny spreads also suck?
I can abuse for good nature and good IVs, or for good nature and shinyness but not for good nature, shinyness and good IVs. RNG Reporters TimeFinder isn't finding anything useful.
I set the Max Frame to 1000. I mean is there any point in trying to abuse in higher ranges? For Shiny Lugia I had to hit 589 which was not that easy....
 
This may be sort of a dumb and probably answered question already but not good enough for me to understand so maybe someone could actually explain me:
So if I'm going for abusing Raikou and Entei this has to be done when I encounter them first in the Ruins and they're running away? That's when the IVs, Shinyness and Nature is set?
If so, since I recall that they've been people who succesfully abused a shiny: how did you advance the RNG there? which method are they. a short explanation of the abusing process there would be damn nice.

Sry double post. Succesfully abused for a Shiny Lugia now but with crappy IVs.
Guys do your Shiny spreads also suck?
I can abuse for good nature and good IVs, or for good nature and shinyness but not for good nature, shinyness and good IVs. RNG Reporters TimeFinder isn't finding anything useful.
I set the Max Frame to 1000. I mean is there any point in trying to abuse in higher ranges? For Shiny Lugia I had to hit 589 which was not that easy....
It's when you meet them in Ecrutaek City, so it seems. Red_Phoenix (if I'm not mistaken, it was him) managed to abuse by killing it and advancing the RNG before finishing the champion (Roamers respawn after you win the E4)
 

mattj

blatant Nintendo fanboy
So, I've been following this thread religiously and have been browsing through the RNG help thread gleaing the HG/SS info too. I haven't yet imported HG because I didn't think it was possible to RNG without states yet. However, numerous people have made comments to the effect that it is actually possible, just terribly difficult at the moment when compared to DPPt RNGabuse because A) You currently can't immidiately verify wether or not you hit your seed, B) There is currently no "quick" way to advance your frames, and C) Higher frames tend to "veer off" for unknown reasons.

I am probably one of the most patient people you will ever meet. If A, B, and C are the only "difficulties" when it comes to RNGabusing HG/SS straight off the cart, I can deal with that. I have no problem with attempting to hit my delay, walking 2000 steps, and catching the legendary in order to verify everything and repeating it dozens of times till I get it right. Are there any other "difficulties" with HG/SS RNGabuse straight off the cart that I haven't mentioned/don't know of?

I realize that this is not a "Help Thread" but I thought I'd ask this here because you people here would be the only people who would know, and I'd like to get started, and could possibly provide some detailed info when I do.

Thanks so much. :)
 
Well it worked at least for me:)
I tried it and...Or my frame advanced 1 and 2, or it didn't work. I can't really tell, because I was using a syncher and there's a LOT of possible frames, so I don't know.
But I do recall my frame advancing when I turned left or right to capture Lugia, don't remember now if I was facing my poke or not.

So, I've been following this thread religiously and have been browsing through the RNG help thread gleaing the HG/SS info too. I haven't yet imported HG because I didn't think it was possible to RNG without states yet. However, numerous people have made comments to the effect that it is actually possible, just terribly difficult at the moment when compared to DPPt RNGabuse because A) You currently can't immidiately verify wether or not you hit your seed, B) There is currently no "quick" way to advance your frames, and C) Higher frames tend to "veer off" for unknown reasons.

I am probably one of the most patient people you will ever meet. If A, B, and C are the only "difficulties" when it comes to RNGabusing HG/SS straight off the cart, I can deal with that. I have no problem with attempting to hit my delay, walking 2000 steps, and catching the legendary in order to verify everything and repeating it dozens of times till I get it right. Are there any other "difficulties" with HG/SS RNGabuse straight off the cart that I haven't mentioned/don't know of?

I realize that this is not a "Help Thread" but I thought I'd ask this here because you people here would be the only people who would know, and I'd like to get started, and could possibly provide some detailed info when I do.

Thanks so much. :)
A) Of course you can verify your seed, just capture a poke and go from there. But yes, you don't have 'Coin Flip' method yet.

B) Quick...You have, talking to your poke, but this is kinda random. But you can advance 1 frame tunning and detunning the bottom right button on your radio. It takes longer than journal flips, but at least it's consistent. (Bottom left advance my frame by 4 everytime, but for ClikC, it didn't, so I can't say if it's reliable).

C) Don't go for high frames, it's a waste of time, go for higher delays using emloop. It's much more easier.
 
hmm while abusing for Extremespeed Dratini (Result you can see in the Dicuss my Pokemon Tread) what I got new so far:

The thing I did for Lugia, like turning around your pokemon, didn't advance the frame here AT ALL, which sucks btw.
but I tried to make the thing with talking to your pokemon and how many frames this actually advances the RNG:

1. Pokemon make "..." and followed by "Pokemon's Name は OT のめをじっとみつめてる" advances the frame by 14.
Can't tell if it depends on how many Pokemon you have in your party, I had 3 in mine.

2. Pokemon jumps around makes happy smile advanced the frame by 10 while having 3 pokemon in my party.

Sorry I know this might be not that useful at all but this is what I tried to find out and contribute to the research, well at least I got my desired frame^^

@DarkLynx: You also tried outside the cave of Lugia or somewhere else? And I guess best way to test how it works would be trying to hit a Shiny Spread, it is possible and they're not that common^^
 
hmm while abusing for Extremespeed Dratini (Result you can see in the Dicuss my Pokemon Tread) what I got new so far:

The thing I did for Lugia, like turning around your pokemon, didn't advance the frame here AT ALL, which sucks btw.
but I tried to make the thing with talking to your pokemon and how many frames this actually advances the RNG:

1. Pokemon make "..." and followed by "Pokemon's Name は OT のめをじっとみつめてる" advances the frame by 14.
Can't tell if it depends on how many Pokemon you have in your party, I had 3 in mine.

2. Pokemon jumps around makes happy smile advanced the frame by 10 while having 3 pokemon in my party.

Sorry I know this might be not that useful at all but this is what I tried to find out and contribute to the research, well at least I got my desired frame^^

@DarkLynx: You also tried outside the cave of Lugia or somewhere else? And I guess best way to test how it works would be trying to hit a Shiny Spread, it is possible and they're not that common^^
Only outside his area, but in his cave. I had to go through the door, though.

@Topic
Figure out something...that probably everyone knows .-. But I never had that problem until yesterday.
On Wednesdays and Thurdays, the program Pokemon March (Bottom Right) is replaced by 'Region' Sound, that don't advance frames at all, in other week days, it always increase by 1 (As ClikC discovered) :)
 

Syberia

[custom user title]
is a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
Wait there is more than one RNG?
Yes. The Egg PID is determined from a second RNG (typically referred to as the IRNG) that is not effected by NPC movement. In HG/SS it seems to randomly skip PIDs that it should generate, which would seem to imply that something else is advancing it as well. In DPPt, this RNG was able to be manually advanced by using the coin flip and happiness checker applications; in HG/SS, it seems that the "only" way to advance it is to pick up every single egg.

This is for Syberia:

I am also getting weird frames for Soul Silver breeding IVs. The only IVs that matched with my egg was frame 14000 and it didn't match with my parent pokemon IVs. I think Soul Silver IV creation may be flawed/different.

On frame 4, the spread is
5/15/B/A/10/16.

My parents are :
18/15/15/15/26/21
22/8/14/30/28/3
Egg:
5/15/14/30/10/21


Tried for a second time, and it did work. I got a frame 2 egg.

So this is weird. Maybe there are split spreads just like emerald.
This is weird. I may open up my save file (still in front of the Daycare man with a shiny egg waiting for me) in HG just for the purpose of IV creation and see what happens.
 
Well, here are some of my researches. I used PRNG Frame Finder for the Frame and am Emulator for Current and Initial Seed.

Code:
Time: 14:00
Initial Seed: A90E033D
Current Seed: F07C12E3 (Frame 39)
Out of Pokecenter:
Current Seed: 8C1795F2 (Frame 64)
Just standing and waiting:
9D5F4CD1 (357)
4AEE4C9D (481)
C0D14BC2 (656)
5E7FA570 (870)
063EB65A (872)
22D30680 (886)
Well, nothing important. Just run and pausing the emulator for checking Frames. But after Frame 885 changed to AE862E2E! Well, I put the Seed back to A90E033D without checking the current Seed. So I started a new one.

RNG Report:
Time: 14:37
Seed: D50E0577
Current Seed: 18CF4892 (Frame 54)
4267D83A (158)
EA8FCDC8 (276)
39798D62 (390)

Then I got a phonecall!

Seed: 67AB46C6
Current Seed: 5F4B7840 (Frame 1954755491)

Well, the frame is strange, so i waited for a few more seeds.

Current Seed: FF7D397D (Frame 1954755502)
D774B231 (Frame 1954755506)

Changing the Initial Seed back to D50E0577
Current Seed: D7376A1D (Frame 439)

So it's back to normal by changing the seed manual. Every phonecall i get changes the initial seed.
 
The problem with that is finding what the phone actually changes the seed for. I hatched a shiny egg with the phone going off multiple times and the seed didn't change. Unless every 2 phone calls changes you off the seed and back onto it, I don't know what to say. I suggest doing another test with getting 2 phone calls this time.
 
I just finished mapping out Egg IV spreads that work in HGSS for various Hidden Powers, also all the inherited IVs are from the B parent. Just need to RNG a female of the Pokemon you want to breed on platinum, then breed it with a random male with the new egg moves you need and you will get flawless HGSS egg move Pokemon.

Code:
| Initial Seed | Frame |     Spread     |                 Best For                 |
|______________|_______|________________|__________________________________________|
|   7A040210   |   7   | B/30/30/31/B/B |                 HP ICE 70                |
|   FF160211   |   15  | B/B/31/B/30/30 |              HP FIGHTING 70              |
|   5916020B   |   13  | B/30/B/30/31/B |          HP GRASS 70; HP FIRE 70         |
|   D2080210   |   7   | B/31/31/B/B/31 | HP ELECTRIC 70; HP GROUND 70; 31 All Ivs |
 

mattj

blatant Nintendo fanboy
I hope this isn't out of place, posting this here, but has anybody seen this on serebii's page? Lots of people here have pointed out that Egg IVs just aren't working quite right. According to Serebii, there's a completely new mechanic involved that lets you use power items to pass down specific IVs. Could this be involved?
 

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