LMFAO, that would suck hard. Would be funny as anything though, and you'd have to make sure to NEVER talk to the guy.
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Pokémon Black 2 and White 2 (DS, June in JP, Fall in EU/NA/AU) - Updated May 12th
- Thread starter Firestorm
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Conkeldurr and Mienshao will probably get the elemental punches, making it easier for them to take out Gliscor. Golurk would also probably get at least Fire Punch, which would be useful with Iron Fist. Cofagrigus would love to have Pain Split and it would be interesting on something like Whimsicott as well. There's also plenty of Pokemon that could use Gravity.
I don't think Klinklang would get Superpower, as all of the Pokemon that got it last gen had at least 120 Atk or already learned it by other means.
Edit: I also find it interesting that no Pokemon can learn Shell Smash by breeding. All of the Pokemon that learn Withdraw that don't learn Shell Smash would be able to get it via breeding (Torterra would have to get it from Blastoise).
I was thinking that each form would replace the dominant attack & defense type (eg Black Kyurem gets 150 Attack and 120 Defense), but keep everything else the same (125/130/90/95). This would give it 710 BST which would be the strongest draon + second strongest Pokemon by BST.
Though if there's an even MORE STRONGER-ER FORM I guess it could have both dominant stats from both duders. 125/150/120/150/120/95: 760 BST.
Ice/Fire typing wouldn't hurt as much, then!
On the topic of how we will obtain both formes in either version...I think it'll work kids of like this:
A. Kyurem must be in your party with either Reshiram or Zekrom in the party as well
depending on what form you want Kyu to take, next you go to the God Stone key item and activate it, it'll ask you which Pokemon's genes do you want to give to Kyu.
You'll pick either one and then select Kyurem & BOOM! You'll have either Black or White Kyurem Forme ready for battle. Now the form is permanent until you select the God Stone key item again and ask it to defuse Kyurem back to Incomplete Forme whenever your ready, just so long as you have Kyurem in your party.
B. You will have the Light Stone and the Dark Stone as key items. With Kyurem in your party you will select the stone of with fome you want Kyurem too take and then with a cool graphic, like how they did Giratina and Shaymin, followed by the 1..2..3 BOOM! You'll have either Black or White Kyurem Forme ready for battle.
What do you guys think, A. or B.? OR WILL IT BE DONE A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT WAY!?!?
A. Kyurem must be in your party with either Reshiram or Zekrom in the party as well
depending on what form you want Kyu to take, next you go to the God Stone key item and activate it, it'll ask you which Pokemon's genes do you want to give to Kyu.
You'll pick either one and then select Kyurem & BOOM! You'll have either Black or White Kyurem Forme ready for battle. Now the form is permanent until you select the God Stone key item again and ask it to defuse Kyurem back to Incomplete Forme whenever your ready, just so long as you have Kyurem in your party.
B. You will have the Light Stone and the Dark Stone as key items. With Kyurem in your party you will select the stone of with fome you want Kyurem too take and then with a cool graphic, like how they did Giratina and Shaymin, followed by the 1..2..3 BOOM! You'll have either Black or White Kyurem Forme ready for battle.
What do you guys think, A. or B.? OR WILL IT BE DONE A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT WAY!?!?
I haven't gone through and read every post in this thread, but it could be possible that there's a hold item released for Kyurem to change forms, similar to how Giratina uses a Griseous Orb. This new item would let Kyurem keep its Ice/Dragon typing, but it would also add a damage boost to Fire/Electric moves (depending on which form). Only problem I see with it is that the forms aren't really "version-exclusive", unless that item is obtained pretty much right before the Kyurem capture.
Would be kinda neat if this happens. Their abilities could shift to ones like Regenerator or Natural Cure:[].
Any one else catching the 'gems' in the new logo?
Check it out... The colors seem extra... crystal like.
AND Sapphire box art features vertical blue lines and Ruby box art features horizontal lines... and guess what numbers have what!
Sure it could just be an allusion to the Blue/Red games too :/ but one can dream that they'd finish this gen quicker to move on to six and jump start the 3ds!
Check it out... The colors seem extra... crystal like.
AND Sapphire box art features vertical blue lines and Ruby box art features horizontal lines... and guess what numbers have what!
Sure it could just be an allusion to the Blue/Red games too :/ but one can dream that they'd finish this gen quicker to move on to six and jump start the 3ds!
Personally, I don't think that Black and White 2 are necessarily the end of Gen V. There could definitely be a Pokemon Gray coming eventually and Black and White 2, or at least the emergence of two cover legends instead of one, suggests that.
Resh, Zek, and Kyurem most likely all come from one dragon. In BW, we had three dragons: Reshiram, Zekrom, and Kyurem. In BW2, we have two Dragons: Black Kyurem and White Kyurem. In Gray, might we see the original Dragon? That's my take on it.
I think Hoenn will probably make an appearance in BW2, simply because of the things that were included in BW1's engine that really had little purpose. I think I might have mentioned this earlier, but why was Dive included in Black and White? To explore some pointless underwater ruins? Game Freak could have put the ruins in a cave in the sea and spent less time coding in Dive mechanics, but instead they chose to include an unnecessary HM move in the generation that finally moved away from HM moves. I think they included Dive so they could bring in Hoenn later since Hoenn is the only region to use Dive. Then, the BW2 logos have backgrounds that look like a ruby and a sapphire. BW1 ends with the main villain escaping and his son, now reformed, leaving with one of the dragons to a faraway land. If this is a direct sequel, which I bet that it is, then a Hoenn meetup of you, Ghetsis, and N doesn't seem so farfetch'd, now does it?
If the fusion of all three dragons is the strongest Dragon, then I would guess that it will have a BST of 720 like the strongest Pokemon does. For that reason, I suspect Black Kyurem and White Kyurem will have BSTs of 690, midway between regular Kyurem and Arceus. I would guess the type of these two Dragons to be Dragon/Ice (these are Kyurem formes, not Reshiram or Zekrom formes!) and the abilities to be Turboblaze and Teravolt. I would also speculate that the movepool of these two Dragons is the exact same as Kyurem's plus Cold Flare and Freeze Bolt, though Fusion Flare, Blue Flare, Fusion Bolt, and Bolt Strike are all logical additions.
As for the story, I'm thinking that Unova and Hoenn will be involved somehow, but not sure how exactly. It could be a "16 Badges" deal where you conquer the Unova League (with or without Alder, probably without) while fending off Plasma remnants then some cataclysmic event happens and you fly/take a boat to Hoenn and conquer its league for some reason while Ghetsis tracks down N's Dragon. The basic plot is that Ghetsis wants to fuse Kyurem, Reshiram, and Zekrom so you try to stop him. He gets Kyurem and tracks down N in Hoenn while you pick up the third Dragon somehow. Light, Dark, and God Stones are probably important too because you probably need them to fuse the Pokemon or something. Team Magma and Aqua probably try to wreak havoc too and you wreck their shit and catch Groudon/Kyogre (but not both) for the hell of it. Big battle happens and you win and Ghetsis and N escape again. Gray comes out in 2014 and finishes the story and unveils ReshiZekyurem in all its poorly named glory.
tl;dr: BW2 is part of a trilogy ending with Gray version, Ghetsis tries to recreate ReshiZekyurem but instead forms B/W Kyurem, you ally with N to stop him. Maybe 16 Badges too. Magma/Aqua probably come back too if there's Hoenn.
Or maybe this is just a crappy updated third version. Wouldn't that suck.
Resh, Zek, and Kyurem most likely all come from one dragon. In BW, we had three dragons: Reshiram, Zekrom, and Kyurem. In BW2, we have two Dragons: Black Kyurem and White Kyurem. In Gray, might we see the original Dragon? That's my take on it.
I think Hoenn will probably make an appearance in BW2, simply because of the things that were included in BW1's engine that really had little purpose. I think I might have mentioned this earlier, but why was Dive included in Black and White? To explore some pointless underwater ruins? Game Freak could have put the ruins in a cave in the sea and spent less time coding in Dive mechanics, but instead they chose to include an unnecessary HM move in the generation that finally moved away from HM moves. I think they included Dive so they could bring in Hoenn later since Hoenn is the only region to use Dive. Then, the BW2 logos have backgrounds that look like a ruby and a sapphire. BW1 ends with the main villain escaping and his son, now reformed, leaving with one of the dragons to a faraway land. If this is a direct sequel, which I bet that it is, then a Hoenn meetup of you, Ghetsis, and N doesn't seem so farfetch'd, now does it?
If the fusion of all three dragons is the strongest Dragon, then I would guess that it will have a BST of 720 like the strongest Pokemon does. For that reason, I suspect Black Kyurem and White Kyurem will have BSTs of 690, midway between regular Kyurem and Arceus. I would guess the type of these two Dragons to be Dragon/Ice (these are Kyurem formes, not Reshiram or Zekrom formes!) and the abilities to be Turboblaze and Teravolt. I would also speculate that the movepool of these two Dragons is the exact same as Kyurem's plus Cold Flare and Freeze Bolt, though Fusion Flare, Blue Flare, Fusion Bolt, and Bolt Strike are all logical additions.
As for the story, I'm thinking that Unova and Hoenn will be involved somehow, but not sure how exactly. It could be a "16 Badges" deal where you conquer the Unova League (with or without Alder, probably without) while fending off Plasma remnants then some cataclysmic event happens and you fly/take a boat to Hoenn and conquer its league for some reason while Ghetsis tracks down N's Dragon. The basic plot is that Ghetsis wants to fuse Kyurem, Reshiram, and Zekrom so you try to stop him. He gets Kyurem and tracks down N in Hoenn while you pick up the third Dragon somehow. Light, Dark, and God Stones are probably important too because you probably need them to fuse the Pokemon or something. Team Magma and Aqua probably try to wreak havoc too and you wreck their shit and catch Groudon/Kyogre (but not both) for the hell of it. Big battle happens and you win and Ghetsis and N escape again. Gray comes out in 2014 and finishes the story and unveils ReshiZekyurem in all its poorly named glory.
tl;dr: BW2 is part of a trilogy ending with Gray version, Ghetsis tries to recreate ReshiZekyurem but instead forms B/W Kyurem, you ally with N to stop him. Maybe 16 Badges too. Magma/Aqua probably come back too if there's Hoenn.
Or maybe this is just a crappy updated third version. Wouldn't that suck.
So like meloetta? interesting, definently seems likely to me
That's what I think as well. Those moves haven't been released yet, it's unlikely they have no extra component aside from damage to them.
There is also mention that in the trailer to the new movie, Kyruem changes formes at will during battle, so it seems like an item that is held to dictate form (sort of like Giratina) is out of the question. The attacking moves also goes with Mellotta as said above, so that's what my money is on.
I think the "Original dragon", provided it exists, could be reserved for Gen. VI. Regigigas is the prime example of this, though Lugia and Ho-oh also did it to some extent: They were the trio masters of a trio from the previous generation.
Also, I kinda sit on the fence regarding Hoenn. A possibility could be that you traverse Unova yet again, repopulated with new interesting characters, more customized music (I want a street band in Nimbasa, with new instruments added as the story progresses), more (old) Pokémon, an unforeseen new forme or two, and the Unova Subway could take you to more new places, while the "Battle [Noun]" is moved to a Battle Frontier somewhere.
But I can see the Battle Frontier being accessed by plane from Mistralton. It could be explicitly said to be in another region, but the only part of that region you can access is the Frontier. This, of course, would be the Hoenn Battle Frontier. In an eventual R/S remake, you could visit the exact same place again, just like the Frontiers in Platinum and HG/SS are identical. Only in this case, it wouldn't be two Frontiers, but the same one.
Also, I kinda sit on the fence regarding Hoenn. A possibility could be that you traverse Unova yet again, repopulated with new interesting characters, more customized music (I want a street band in Nimbasa, with new instruments added as the story progresses), more (old) Pokémon, an unforeseen new forme or two, and the Unova Subway could take you to more new places, while the "Battle [Noun]" is moved to a Battle Frontier somewhere.
But I can see the Battle Frontier being accessed by plane from Mistralton. It could be explicitly said to be in another region, but the only part of that region you can access is the Frontier. This, of course, would be the Hoenn Battle Frontier. In an eventual R/S remake, you could visit the exact same place again, just like the Frontiers in Platinum and HG/SS are identical. Only in this case, it wouldn't be two Frontiers, but the same one.
I've always been a bit annoyed when people keep saying hoenn will be in this games, but now that I think about it.. If this really are the last games in gen 5 I think it might be a decent chance we will get to visit Hoenn or any other region. All other generations (except the first for obvious reasons) have let us visit at least two regions, like 2th gen had Jotho + Kanto, and 3th gen and 4th gen had the remakes.
So who knows, maybe they add Hoenn/other region or maybe they don't, we'll just have to see. In one way I want this to be the last 5th gen games because I want a main game pokémon 3DS game, but at the same time I don't feel ready for new pokémon :P
So who knows, maybe they add Hoenn/other region or maybe they don't, we'll just have to see. In one way I want this to be the last 5th gen games because I want a main game pokémon 3DS game, but at the same time I don't feel ready for new pokémon :P
I don't really think BW2 need to have Hoenn in them. Unless GF is stopping their 1 new Gen every 4 years thing, I can't see why they would make this game early just to make us wait 2 and a half years for Gen 6.
The Dive HM was likely programmed into this game so that they don't have to replace an HM for it in the RS remakes, like they had to replace Defog for Whirlpool in HGSS. Since Rock Smash and Flash are currently TMs, all 8 of the RS HMs are present in some form in this game. HMs also currently have no dependence on Badges to be useable outside of battle, meaning that it doesn't matter much whether those two moves are TMs or HMs.
I really hope they don't make us use Freeze Shock/Burn to change Kyurem's forms. The two moves are already pretty much unuseable, due to taking two turns to work, meaning that Kyurem's alternate forms will essentially never be used.
The Dive HM was likely programmed into this game so that they don't have to replace an HM for it in the RS remakes, like they had to replace Defog for Whirlpool in HGSS. Since Rock Smash and Flash are currently TMs, all 8 of the RS HMs are present in some form in this game. HMs also currently have no dependence on Badges to be useable outside of battle, meaning that it doesn't matter much whether those two moves are TMs or HMs.
I really hope they don't make us use Freeze Shock/Burn to change Kyurem's forms. The two moves are already pretty much unuseable, due to taking two turns to work, meaning that Kyurem's alternate forms will essentially never be used.
Actually, that's a good point. They would have to carefully change where/how you obtained the HM's for Ruby and Sapphire if they retained the no badges needed for HM's rule. You can't use HM's (Because unobtainable) before getting the first badge in BW. But having Rock Smash available would be strange for RS because of the cave and moving on to the Volcano wouldn't be able to be stopped (as in moving on before beating Wattson in Mauville). It would also let you get to Fortree WELL ahead of schedule if you traded for Surf near the start of the game.
Imo, the new HM mechanics would have to be scrapped if they make RS again. It's needed way too much to keep the storyline progressing in the correct manner in Hoenn.
^This is a fair point.
Note how extremely linear Unova is. Literally, there are two "crossroads", both leading into ends of the same linear loop. In Hoenn, you get to your first crossroad as early as Oldale. The map can be perceived roughly as a figure eight, with one loop around the main island and another with the sea, but even then there are shortcuts and alternate routes and dead ends. In Unova, each time you got to a new area, there was a physical blockade that had to be dealt with before you could progress. In Hoenn, you had to go back a few times, there were alternate routes and several ways to go from A to B. It makes sense for Unova to allow you to use HMs at will - while Hoenn would be broken with the same mechanics.
Note how extremely linear Unova is. Literally, there are two "crossroads", both leading into ends of the same linear loop. In Hoenn, you get to your first crossroad as early as Oldale. The map can be perceived roughly as a figure eight, with one loop around the main island and another with the sea, but even then there are shortcuts and alternate routes and dead ends. In Unova, each time you got to a new area, there was a physical blockade that had to be dealt with before you could progress. In Hoenn, you had to go back a few times, there were alternate routes and several ways to go from A to B. It makes sense for Unova to allow you to use HMs at will - while Hoenn would be broken with the same mechanics.
Yeah the RS remakes would have to bring back the HM dependence. I never really thought about how much of a problem it could be because HMs like Surf and Fly can only be obtained in the game either after or right before you get the badge to use them. For Flash and Rock Smash, they could simply only have the people give them to you after you have those badges. However, that still means that you could trade in a Pokemon with Rock Smash to go through Rusturf tunnel before you even get your first badge.
Haha yeah, the combination of Rock Smash and Surf from the beginning would essentially allow you to get *anywhere* in Hoenn (minus Sootopolis and the Pokemon League, and possibly Lillycove) before acquiring any badges at all. Even if they changed the mechanics to BW's (As in needing at least 1 badge to trade) from then you could reach anywhere in the same manner.
I never realised how reliant on Rock Smash Hoenn was O_o
I never realised how reliant on Rock Smash Hoenn was O_o
Well, after your first badge in BW, you CAN get ~level 34 Herdier and Watchog, so screw-ups *can* happen. They'll probably use NPCs to block some paths, add a few walls here and there to solve that problem, though it is something to be noted.
Why would they use the Black and White brand name to do a Ruby and Sapphire remake? Ruby and Sapphire sold better (particularly in North America) and cramming them into a sequel for Black and White doesn't make a lot of sense to me. I'm as wishful as the rest of you in hoping this isn't another "third" version, but I think they would reserve those games for separate titles, possibly on the 3DS. I wouldn't expect anything more than incremental updates, and if something awesome happens then you can get excited.
^This is, actually, the strongest point against Hoenn inclusion I've heard. If they want to include Hoenn, it's not because they like the region particularly well, it's because it would appeal to the people who got Ruby and Sapphire when they came out.
Said people would usually have some prejudice against the new Pokémon (look at Heatmor, Vanillish, Swoobat, for instance), and would prefer to be able to go to Hoenn "without the stupid Unova crap" first. So far, all (both) the remakes have followed the plot of the original quite rigorously, and added some extra stuff when you're almost done with the storyline. They want to give the impression of the original game with better graphics, adapted to the latest generation, not of a latest-generation game with some nostalgic stuff in it.
Right now, the news about the games spread through word of mouth. Not everybody engage in the speculation, most people simply think that this will be Black & White over again, because that's what GameFreak says. Most people associate this with "those new Pokémon games", and that's probably an association that will stand. If GameFreak decide to redo Ruby & Sapphire, it will be announced as such.
However, I still stand firm with my Battle Frontier hypothesis: That you might be able to go to a Hoenn-based Battle Frontier, but you can't go further into Hoenn than the Frontier in BW2. Then if RS2 come out, you will be able to visit the exact same Frontier (imported from BW2 like HG/SS' was from Platinum), but you won't be able to go to Unova.
Said people would usually have some prejudice against the new Pokémon (look at Heatmor, Vanillish, Swoobat, for instance), and would prefer to be able to go to Hoenn "without the stupid Unova crap" first. So far, all (both) the remakes have followed the plot of the original quite rigorously, and added some extra stuff when you're almost done with the storyline. They want to give the impression of the original game with better graphics, adapted to the latest generation, not of a latest-generation game with some nostalgic stuff in it.
Right now, the news about the games spread through word of mouth. Not everybody engage in the speculation, most people simply think that this will be Black & White over again, because that's what GameFreak says. Most people associate this with "those new Pokémon games", and that's probably an association that will stand. If GameFreak decide to redo Ruby & Sapphire, it will be announced as such.
However, I still stand firm with my Battle Frontier hypothesis: That you might be able to go to a Hoenn-based Battle Frontier, but you can't go further into Hoenn than the Frontier in BW2. Then if RS2 come out, you will be able to visit the exact same Frontier (imported from BW2 like HG/SS' was from Platinum), but you won't be able to go to Unova.
I don't know what started the Hoenn speculation but including two regions in a single game isn't unprecedented. GS included Kanto but that wasn't a remake of RBY. It was integrated into the GS story as part of the game. We got RBY remakes later as FireRed and LeafGreen. So the presence of Hoenn in BW2 would not necessitate remaking RSE down to the story progression. It could simply be an extension of the BW adventure that's set in a comtemporaneous Hoenn.
Anyway, I don't know about Hoenn but new areas are pretty likely. Platinum had the Distortion World and FRLG had Sevii Islands. So there's bound to be some new places to go in BW2.
Anyway, I don't know about Hoenn but new areas are pretty likely. Platinum had the Distortion World and FRLG had Sevii Islands. So there's bound to be some new places to go in BW2.
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