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Pet Mod RBY CAP (CAP 3 - Competitive Learnset)

Feedback: I really like the ideas behind paralysis immunity and another Ghost, but they do feel somewhat redundant with each other. Ghost does have potential as a defensive typing. While we cannot make use of it on Gengar because Poison is the weakest typing here, it would be great paired with something with less common weaknesses, such as Fire, which is another story.

In regards to the RBY Break the Mold, I wanted to make sure if we are trying to make a viable typing do something else. Psychic and Normal already have multiple mons that do different things with fast or bulky stats. However, Electric only has mons that are fast, and they are not exactly bulky. Meanwhile, both Rock and Ground (they're on the same mons) have bulky but slow mons as the top doges. We could make a fast Rock or Ground without both somewhat like Stratagem (or Aerodactyl but better), or we could even make a bulky Electric. It doesn't have to be any of these things per se.
 
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Mova said:
In regards to the RBY Break the Mold, I wanted to make sure if we are trying to make a viable typing do something else. Psychic and Normal already have multiple mons that do different things with fast or bulky stats. However, Electric only has mons that are fast, and they are not exactly bulky. Meanwhile, both Rock and Ground (they're on the same mons) have bulky but slow mons as the top doges. We could make a fast Rock or Ground without both somewhat like Stratagem (or Aerodactyl but better), or we could even make a bulky Electric. It doesn't have to be any of these things per se.
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There's even some design space for super viable types like Psychic or Normal too. For example, imagine a Galarian Rapidash put in RBY (without egg moves). All Psychic-types in RBY are Special attackers that threaten some kind of status, and in OU all viable Psychic-types viably run recovery moves. A Galarian Rapidash however would break that mold by being a physical setup sweeper that doesn't directly threaten status and lacks instant recovery or the bulk to pull off Rest, making it a unique check to its fellow Psychic-types.
 
Voting has begun! Vote for your favorites, as many as you'd like, as long as they're in order from most to least preferred.

Thank you Paulluxx for the explanation!

You can vote for however many subs you want, in a ranked choice system, meaning your first choice will be first, second choice second, etc. Until you either don't want to vote for more, or you've voted for all subs.

Each vote contributes one point to its first-place choice. The candidates are ordered based on both the number of first-place votes and the number of total votes, and eliminated from the bottom. Any vote whose first choice has been eliminated instead gives its point to its second choice, or whatever its next ranking is. The elimination and re-ranking process continues until there are two remaining, upon which the one with more points is the winner.
 
Submission Compendium
  • Limber But Not Really: Pokemon that is difficult to Paralyze
  • Non-Poison Ghost: Self Explanatory
  • Status Stripper: A Pokemon that utilizes the ability to remove the opponent's pre-existing status conditions (aka access to Haze).
  • Rock Paper Scissors: A Pokemon that completes a Rock Paper Scissors triangle, with CAP countering Pokemon A which counters Pokemon B which counters CAP
  • New Friends!: A pokemon designed to look at a currently ranked on the viability rankings pokemon in OU, and build it a pokemon that can cover its weaknesses.
  • Break the Mold: An OU viable pokemon that goes completely against the stereotypes of its typing.
  • Un-niche: Taking a niche a lower tier mon has, and making it work on the CAP
  • It's a critical hit!: A Pokemon that can take advantage of Slash/Razor Leaf, or similar as its sweeping move
  • Nice Typing You Got There...: Viable conversion user!

    I'll have my own votes in tomorrow, but I thought this would make it a lot easier for people to vote. Really excited for this project so far.
 
Break The Mold
Limber but not really
New Friends!
Un-Niche
Status Stripper
Rock Paper Scissors
Nice Typing you Got There...
Non-Poison Ghost
It's a critical hit!

Edit: after thinking about it, I have decided to change my vote order
 
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Un-Niche
It's a critical hit!
New Friends!
Rock Paper Scissors
Break the Mold
Nice Typing You Got There...
Non-Poison Ghost
Status Stripper

Not sure if I can vote for myself--

I think Status Stripper has a lot of potential to go wrong, not even considering it being our first CAP. Seems very easy to end up making it into something that's self-defeating or "too out there". I'm more interested in utilising already-existing roles that nothing can perform viably in OU like Swords Dance, Light Screen, Fire-types, etc or using something more intuitive. My top 3 would probably go that route.
 
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Status Stripper
Nice Typing You Got There...
Rock Paper Scissors
New Friends!
Un-niche
It's a critical hit!
Limber but not really
Break the Mold
Non-Poison Ghost
 
Limber But Not Really
It's a critical hit! (If it’s not another Slash mon)
Non-Poison Ghost
Break the Mold
New Friends!
Nice Typing You Got There...
Status Stripper

I completely agree with May about status stripper. It sounds cool in theory, but I’m seriously doubtful it’ll work well in practice.

EDIT: Didn’t realize I had to order my votes.
 
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New Friends! - Big fan of this concept to create a new OU core
Rock Paper Scissors - I like this too because it seems like a way to add some counterplay on your teams
Nice Typing You Got There... - New niche is fun
Status Stripper -New niche is fun
Break the Mold - Could flip typing concepts on its head
Limber but Not really - Might create new lead matchups, but might also pigeonhole us in typing discussion
Un-Niche - I feel like this is going to be "x mon, but better"
It's a Critical Hit! - I feel like this is going to be "x mon, but better" except even more constraints
Non-Poison Ghost - Pigeonholes us in typing too much IMO
 
pvk asked me to vote so i guess i'm voting

Break the Mold: i kinda love this! a psychic-type that can resist psychic but without the classic psychic tools (all ou viable psychics have either have tw + recover or a sleep move) and does something else entirely would be very cool and healthy i think, then again you would question whether the tier needs even more psychics. but nonetheless there are many great options for this using other types, i think this is just naturally going to result in interesting things that offer cool alternatives to the usual balances

Limber But Not Really: i like this, the only options to stop enemy twave atm is something that's already statused or rhydon - having a ground that can switch into twave without being 2hkoed by the pokemon that usually carry twave (as rhydon is) can open a few interesting play sequences that don't currently exist. the other approach (unparalyzable by body slam) already kind of exists with porygon (or ghosts i guess) but i think more twave counterplay would be very very interesting to see

Nice Typing You Got There...: conversion is weird because being normal vs normals isn't particularly good (ok bslam immune but the damage is the important part of that equation) and a good few things in rby can hit themselves supereffectively or generally strong enough to make conversion not that good (rhydon, zapdos, starmie if tbolt, chansey doesn't care too much, and so on) - but there are a few mons where this could be interesting if this mon is set up to abuse them in particular (alakazam, cloyster, jolteon, exeggutor), i think this could be excellent if the follow up is good

Un-niche: are we making a good swords dancer? this sure sounds like a good swords dancer. could be interesting, why not

New Friends!: i worry that this just ends up being "something that is good against either normals or psychics" because that's what a vast majority of the vr is weak to, but i don't think that'd be bad at all in general. it would probably result in a good pokemon that doesn't need its friend to be viable though.

Rock Paper Scissors: i think this is less safe than it looks because introducing (1) a rhydon check or (2) a zapdos check that isn't rhydon can both pose an extreme danger to rhydon and make it obsolete altogether; maybe that's not a bad thing but it feels a bit too early to kill off A rank mons on the very fist CAP

Non-Poison Ghost: would almost certainly be metagame changing if this is any good at 1v1ing tauros. like, you'd want to run this in every team until tauros stops having 100% usage and now you're playing a vastly different metagame. a lot of space to accidentally upset balances completely and inadvertedly, i'd recommend against for now (maybe at a later point but as i understand the point of this project currently i would say no)

It's a critical hit!: high crit special moves aren't terribly interesting bc you don't usually find special setup that you need to crit through other than rare stuff like slowbro; high crit physical moves are interesting because they make physical attackers that can break reflect lax, but do we really need persian v2? high crit moves feel more like the side notes on a different design concept than something you actively build around

Status Stripper: this is impossibly hard to realize - a strategy that wastes turns clicking thunder wave, then haze, then sleep is almost certainly going to be worse than a strategy that just clicks sleep. using a turn to heal your opponent's status is too much of a tempo drain, i don't think this can work and i expect that if a mon is made that tries to make this work they would probably before too long drop haze in favor of any other 4th move that does anything.
 
  • Non-Poison Ghost: Fuck yes give me a non gengar ghost type please.
  • Rock Paper Scissors: Seems like by far the healthiest option for the metagame
  • Break the Mold: Can be pretty interesting depending on the type.
  • Un-niche: Lower tiers have a lot of potential due to uncovering incredible sets not seen in ou.
  • Nice Typing You Got There...:Niche but sounds workable on this gen
  • New Friends!: Something i know is that teammate caps always end in disaster, but it could work.
  • It's a critical hit!: Way too niche for my liking
  • Limber But Not Really: This just sounds like another normal type in the making.
  • Status Stripper: People already gve their two cents on why they don't like this concept and i agree with them
 
Amaranth said:
pvk asked me to vote so i guess i'm voting

Rock Paper Scissors: i think this is less safe than it looks because introducing (1) a rhydon check or (2) a zapdos check that isn't rhydon can both pose an extreme danger to rhydon and make it obsolete altogether; maybe that's not a bad thing but it feels a bit too early to kill off A rank mons on the very fist CAP
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Thanks for voting!

Rhydon would not be 'killed off' though. If RPS goes with a Rhydon > Zapdos > CAP > Rhydon triangle, Rhydon (and Golem) would have a Pokemon that makes it harder to for Rhydon to break through the opposing team, but that CAP would be designed to be Zapdos food. That would encourage Zapdos usage to thrash this new CAP, which in turn would again encourage Rhydon usage because nothing counters Zapdos as hard as Rhydon.
 
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Enigami said:
Thanks for voting, but I wanted to address something here:
Rhydon would not be 'killed off'. If RPS goes with a Rhydon > Zapdos > CAP > Rhydon triangle, Rhydon (and Golem) would have a Pokemon that makes it harder to for Rhydon to break through the opposing team, but that CAP would be designed to be Zapdos food. That would encourage Zapdos usage to thrash this new CAP, which in turn would again encourage Rhydon usage because nothing counters Zapdos as hard as Rhydon.
Click to expand...
in that case i don't think this is a good thing for the tier, as it enhances the impact of match up luck and worsens one of the (imo) biggest problems with ou already which is trying to play match up roulette with your last available slot
i think rhydon is in a very precarious spot already with most of the metagame just naturally being able to casually 2hko it nowadays; its match ups being very binary is already unhealthy (imo) and it needs more soft checks and things to soft beat as opposed to hard counters which make the already extreme zap v don match up even more prevalent (and give it two more equally bad alternatives in zap v cap1 and cap1 v don, even)
i think that would be even worse than killing off rhydon personally so my vote is not changing
 
Amaranth said:
in that case i don't think this is a good thing for the tier, as it enhances the impact of match up luck and worsens one of the (imo) biggest problems with ou already which is trying to play match up roulette with your last available slot
i think rhydon is in a very precarious spot already with most of the metagame just naturally being able to casually 2hko it nowadays; its match ups being very binary is already unhealthy (imo) and it needs more soft checks and things to soft beat as opposed to hard counters which make the already extreme zap v don match up even more prevalent (and give it two more equally bad alternatives in zap v cap1 and cap1 v don, even)
i think that would be even worse than killing off rhydon personally so my vote is not changing
Click to expand...

I guess we'd end up making something very similar to Egg anyways.
 
Limber But Not Really
Nice Typing You Got There...
Break the Mold
Un-niche
Non-Poison Ghost
It's a critical hit!
Rock Paper Scissors
New Friends!
Status Stripper

Don't really like the last two at all tbh. Teammate related concepts have a pretty bad history in CAP and Status Stripper just seems impossible to accomplish
 
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