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Returning to Our Roots NOC Mafia - GAME OVER: The Mafia Wins

Alright.

To answer auramaster's comments on my posts:
Mithril - See my last sentence in the second post. What I meant was that the mere fact that he doesn't really post unless pressured to is strange.
Maxim/Hydrattler - I never really paid much attention to his posts tbh. Add on the fact that they were sparse, and you don't really have an impression about him. Hence the "clean slate" part. He's been posting even less than I have, though, which certainly makes him much more suspicious.

Anyway, since the only thing that khz posted Day 3 was that he wouldn't be online for the next day, I want to see him talk more.
 
Not overly surprised about ditto tbh in retrospect, it seemed odd that it was the strongest players being night-killed, and yet ditto, arguable the strongest player, was still around.

Anyway, lynch hydrattler until he starts talking and gives his 3 scummiest players.
 
The good news is, we likely have a vigilante in the village, and managed to kill off the wolf. However, we did lose 2 more inspect roles. The most suspicious individual atm, is still Hydrattler. Therefore lynch Hydrattler
 
MB killed by sending in "Night X - Stabbing USER"

And what's not to like?

EDIT: To clarify, Paperblade gained alliance check powers when the detective died.
 
Orcinus Duo said:
Lol. Where the heck is scum getting this information?

Lynch AG

Thanks MB and vig...Who has the time to go through ditto's posts?
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I've got some free time.

EDIT: Actually I don't, something just came. However I just read his posts and making some observations:

-In hindsight Ditto prodding non active players was probably a way for him to "progress" discussion whilst not actually committing to vote anyone. I suppose that it meant he could either start an easy wagon on an inactive townie or bus an inactive team mate. In the first instance he gained a free kill, in the second one their death was probably inevitable.
-Pretty sure OD is clean based on a post where he attacks him for being "offensive" (as in attacking people). That kind of play sounds like scums worst nightmare since they can't hide.
-Based on his bussing of kok I wouldn't rule out him trying that again. Actually given he bussed kok I think that him prodding inactive players is something we should look at.

Sorry it's not as in depth as I would have liked, I'll try and add more later.
 
Happy thanksgiving, I won't be active tonight :/ there's a first time for everything i suppose.

How would one prove that AG is in fact the village hooker and not the mafia hooker?

i kindof like the Hydrattler lynch for activity but I'm going to wait until tomorrow to be more active in my scumhunting.

GLHF I would also like to note that there is only 12 of us left... we really don't wanna pop majority early so using FoS instead of lynching right now could be used as a way to ensure mafia don't steal this lynch from us.
 
 
Looking through Ditto's posts right now, first major thing I noticed was that he was the first one to put the lynch on NWO, so that helps NWO's case (mafia wouldn't likely bus someone *that* early). Then again we were already fairly certain he was clean anyway so it's not that helpful.

Next he calls out theangryscientist and Maxim for not posting. tas subs out soon after for Paperblade, who we just learned is clean. This slightly helps Hydrattler's case for being clean, but it's certainly possible that Ditto brought him to attention even though he was his teammate because he knew that it wouldn't cost Maxim anything and would help him look clean. We should also look to see if there were any notable inactives around that time that weren't called out. After that he makes a post with a few general reads, nothing too interesting there as it's mostly stuff that other people have echoed since.

This post could be important, as again, he calls out an inactive, this time pokemaniac. Like with Hydrattler above, one wonders if he'd be willing to risk putting a mafia teammate in the spotlight in order to make himself look cleaner. The last post where he calls out a user or makes a read on a user not already dead is here, where he calls out Hydrattler yet again. Interesting that he brought Hydra to the spotlight again; though he's still a suspicious target, if he was mafia would Ditto bring attention to him like that? I guess it's not much of a loss when he's already the center of attention, but still worth noting.

One last thing I noticed while going through and found funny:
Orcinus Duo said:
MB may be a 1 shot bulletproof baiting scum

(lol MB may be. K I'm funny)
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OD called it lol
 
Orcinus Duo said:
Walrein can we get flavor for MB? Want to see if it fits ditto's death.

NWO, ditto was mafia. -.-

Lol I misclicked and liked this thread by accident. :(
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Oh... trololololol, I can't believe I was actually right day 1. In any case, we should look into the thread to see if there's anyone else that's been promoting discussion but not actively trying to lynch anyone like Ditto.
 
Anyone think this might be useful?

http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3969543&postcount=462

Remember that by this stage Paperblade would have had alliance check power.

EDIT: Sorry for my hyperactivity but this was kok's first post, a known mafia:

Alright, I'm finally back, will read through the read more closely later. As of right now, all that i've seen is that Orcinus Duo linked us to mafia terms like we didn't know what they were. Not only do I want to lynch him, I want to punch him in the face. So for now Vote: Orcinus Duo. Will be looking at people to determine scum levels in a sec
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The next post was Ditto calling out TAS and Maxim for inactivity because they both were "yet to post outside "Good luck"." Given that kok's above post added next to nothing to the discussion, I find it odd that Ditto didn't call him out as well. Based on that it seems he didn't want to put team mates out in the spotlight.
 
So basically, kHz is saying that hydrattler is clean?

Voting AG is tradition. Now that I have a better target, thanks kHz for bringing that to my attention:
Unvote Lynch Engineer[/] for trying to frame kHz.
 
Orcinus Duo said:
So basically, kHz is saying that hydrattler is clean?
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I'm honestly not sure. Ditto may have assumed that Maxim was going to post later since he had said so just before hand. Actually I think it's more suspicious that Maxim said he was going to post later but then never does. It's like he says he will post to get himself off the hook then disappeared once the pressure was off.

Anyway, I think EP is very suspicious for a few reasons:

Engineer Pikachu said:
Considering the fact that there are 20 players in this game, there are probably five to six mafia members. This mafia had 17 players and five mafia. By lynching, we have approximately a 31-37% chance of catching a mafia; not exactly favorable odds.
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Here EP pretty much advocates not lynching until we get a majority. Bad idea, I think not?

Engineer Pikachu said:
Again, I didn't post because I didn't really have an opinion. If I'm going to get called out for not posting, and then get called out again for posting something "useless" because I don't have an opinion, it's kind of a catch-22, isn't it?

If you're going to force me to vote for someone, though, I guess lynch TalkingLion? His D1 vote change was quite suspicious and no villager would see a need to change his vote.
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This was the 299th post in the thread. So after all that time, EP never had a read on anyone. Seems to me like he wants to blend in. And when he does vote someone, he just hops on the nearest bandwagon and regurgitates the reasoning given here,here,here and here. IIoA I believe it's called.

Engineer Pikachu said:
Actually, this is a pretty good point. His posts don't make much sense logically. See here, second paragraph and here.
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More IIoA.

And then we have his read list:

Engineer Pikachu said:
Paperblade - Generally helpful?
Mithril - Kind of confusing; I don't really know what to think of him.
Ditto - Was extremely helpful in D1; hasn't been as helpful since, but is still present and a discussion sparker.
auramaster - Haven't really seen him post.
Flamestrike - Posting more lately; seems to be being helpful.
empoof - Great posts.
Metal Bagon - Complex role that seems unlikely to be faked.
Orcinus Duo - Starting a bandwagon on mafia D1 would make it seem like he's not mafia.
nEsp - No clue.
khz - See above.
Hydrattler - Maxim didn't really post much, so I guess Hydrattler gets a clean slate.
Aura Guardian - His posts are kind of confusing, but since he claimed and there's been no counterclaim so far, I guess he's village?
pokémaniac 212 - See nEsp.
New World Order - See AG.
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Which is virtually a copypasta of everyone else's read list.

Then there's when he posts false evidence against me. OD deals with that above, no need for me to repeat it.

All in all, EP sounds like scum trying to fly under the radar. Lynch Engineer Pikachu
 
Orcinus Duo said:
kHz did you only post that because of my vote for engineer, or would you have done that anyways?
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I was going to do it anywhere. I became suspicious of EP after he targeted me twice (he voted me once before because he couldn't get a read on me, and now) and after rereading his posts I though I had enough info to consider him one of my top suspects. Ideally however I would get hydrattler and other inactives to post but they don't seem to be responding to everyone else prodding them.
 
Woops. I thought that those posts had been in Day 2. That's also my reasoning for lynching you Day 3, as I thought you'd been inactive the entire day.

Also, quoting my Day 1 posts don't really do anything...?

EDIT: Oh, and in case you're wondering why I voted you D3 instead of the other host of inactive people, I just rolled the RNG.
 
Engineer Pikachu said:
Woops. I thought that those posts had been in Day 2. That's also my reasoning for lynching you Day 3, as I thought you'd been inactive the entire day.

Also, quoting my Day 1 posts don't really do anything...?

EDIT: Oh, and in case you're wondering why I voted you D3 instead of the other host of inactive people, I just rolled the RNG.
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Actually quoting suspect posts from D1 does do something, because if your scum on day 1, then you're still scum now lol.

Anyway I'm reasonably convinced it's an honest mistake, I doubt anyone would try and pull something like that which is so easily checked. Still, could you please reply to some of my other points? (if you do satisfactorily I may withdraw my vote)
 
Okay then, I guess...
khz said:
<text>
Here EP pretty much advocates not lynching until we get a majority. Bad idea, I think not?
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First NOC game and I had no clue what the theories about RVS were. There was no information to go on at the time of my post, so a pure random lynch would be detrimental from a pure mathematical standpoint. kok showed pretty blatant signs of being mafia so we lynched him but ofc at that point it wasn't random anymore.
This was the 299th post in the thread. So after all that time, EP never had a read on anyone. Seems to me like he wants to blend in. And when he does vote someone, he just hops on the nearest bandwagon and regurgitates the reasoning given here,here,here and here. IIoA I believe it's called.
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I'll be honest here and say that I kind of forgot that I was in the game during those couple days (Walrein had to prod me to send in my action, sorry). With the exception of my D3 lynches to get people talking, I think I only voted once, which was the vote on NJiggly since Orcinus was asking for L-1.
More IIoA.
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Conceded.
And then we have his read list:

Which is virtually a copypasta of everyone else's read list.
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iirc I was asked to post a list of reads, so I posted my list of reads, however shaky and redundant. I posted operating under the assumption that "some post is better than no post" especially since I had been asked to post.
 
Apologies for the double post.

Unvote.

After thinking over my vote for a couple of hours, I concede that I probably overreacted to what appeared at the time to be an irrational and illogical vote on me. In hindsight I'm almost 100% sure it was an honest mistake since EP is a decent player. Yeah I know this seems strange backflipping on my stance, but in my defence I'm only human and probably became a bit emotional at his accusations.

EDIT: Lol ninja'd

EDIT 2: Now to a more pertinent issue, which is the rampant inactivity in this game. Just off the top of my head hydrattler, Mithril and pokemaniac212 are pretty inactive and only seem to post when they're pressured. Obviously this isn't good because these guys get a free ride until someone notices they're inactive, then they make a post and everyone forgets about them. Anyway I think we need to pressure these guys and be willing to lynch them if they don't post more to show we are actually serious about this. Does anyone support me here? Obviously it's not going to work if only 25% of players are willing to put these guys close to majority to make them talk.
 
Walrein had to prod me to send in my action, sorry
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I just saw this post from EP, Thanksgiving and all, and it jumped at me. In a game where I am unsure of how many power roles the village actually has left, I doubt that every player left even has a night action. EP just explicitly stated he has a night action, either making him mafia or having a power role. This is something that needs to be discussed.

Personally, I am leaning towards him being mafia for many of the things khz has said, along with a general lack of either useful posts or activity at all in the main thread. What are other's thoughts on this?

FYI, I won't really be on the 25th, have stuff to do with family / friends for my birthday, apologies ahead of time.
 
Mithril said:
I just saw this post from EP, Thanksgiving and all, and it jumped at me. In a game where I am unsure of how many power roles the village actually has left, I doubt that every player left even has a night action. EP just explicitly stated he has a night action, either making him mafia or having a power role. This is something that needs to be discussed.

Personally, I am leaning towards him being mafia for many of the things khz has said, along with a general lack of either useful posts or activity at all in the main thread. What are other's thoughts on this?

FYI, I won't really be on the 25th, have stuff to do with family / friends for my birthday, apologies ahead of time.
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That is true, though remember we have found only one vanilla townie. So either we have just been unlucky or there are no duplicate roles. There are still some roles unaccounted for, e.g. the announcer, bodyguard, possible back up roles, the vigilante etc.
 
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