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Reuniclus

The amount of people that paralyse TR Ranculus is mystifying - I suppose if you don't have sleep it's the only Status of any use, and that 1/4 chance of missing a move is good, but it only makes it faster in Trick Room.

I'm still pretty confident in saying HP Fire is a must on any offensive Ranculus, so there's that to consider too.
 
Considering every other non-TR team isn't going to be outspeeding Reuncilus in TR anyway, that's a moot point. I'd certainly paralyze any Reuniclus, TR or no, for that chance of parahax.
 
It's better than nothing though. Still, as fast as it is, I doubt a paralysis is changing anything other than "outspeeding" what under TR, Shubarugo?
 
If your running Regeneration that simply means you're trolling the opponent and any statues will be pointless, since your team is already filled with Weedles and Geodudes.

Point is, Regeneration is situational and Magic Guard is basically the better ability.
 
EpicTurtle said:
If your running Regeneration that simply means you're trolling the opponent and any statues will be pointless, since your team is already filled with Weedles and Geodudes.

Point is, Regeneration is situational and Magic Guard is basically the better ability.
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Exactly.
 
RaikouLover said:
For two, stall seems to have shit like Choice Scarf Tyranitar on it lately, which also hurts this thing pretty bad.
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Good luck with that. CB Adamant Tyranitar doesn't OHKO with Crunch, so Ranky will be laughing on ScarfTar's ugly face.

@ using paralysis against Ranky: In 4th gen, Magic Guard prevented full paralysis (i.e: unable to attack due to paralysis) too, even though Shoddy never implemented that. If that's the case for BW too, that's another status that's completely useless against Rankurusu, or even benefical to it (!) if it's a Trick Room variant.
 
Confirmed Magic Guard no longer prevents the Pokemon from becoming fully paralyzed.

Paralysis is a hindrance to Reuniclus since it already outspeeds almost everything in TR, and wasting a turn of TR due to full paralysis would suck for it.
 
Deaga said:
Good luck with that. CB Adamant Tyranitar doesn't OHKO with Crunch, so Ranky will be laughing on ScarfTar's ugly face.

@ using paralysis against Ranky: In 4th gen, Magic Guard prevented full paralysis (i.e: unable to attack due to paralysis) too, even though Shoddy never implemented that. If that's the case for BW too, that's another status that's completely useless against Rankurusu, or even benefical to it (!) if it's a Trick Room variant.
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Not absolutely everything has to OHKO Rank, since he's prone to prior damage from switch-ins, U-turn and whatnot. You might end up losing Ttar if you switch him in right away or try to KO at full, but you trade for Rankurusu in the latter instance, since a Rank at ~10% is a useless Rank. If I put CBTar in for CM Rank, I can safely say I have him "covered".

The problem is, I'm scared to death that it might be Trick Room. >_>
 
Demo-Kun said:
It's better than nothing though. Still, as fast as it is, I doubt a paralysis is changing anything other than "outspeeding" what under TR, Shubarugo?
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Actually now that I think about it, there are plenty of minimum speed Ferrothorns that run Gyro Ball on non TR teams so that technically would outspeed a Reuniclus in TR. Only move it can really hit it with though is Power Whip and it's going to get its ass Focus Blasted anyway.

Yeah, if you managed to do at least 75% damage in one hit to a Reuniclus, the thing is easily revenged by something assuming you have something else with decent immediate power. Ttar doesn't have to one shot a pokemon as slow as Reunclius to have effectively delt with it... depending on your team of course.
 
Deaga said:
Good luck with that. CB Adamant Tyranitar doesn't OHKO with Crunch, so Ranky will be laughing on ScarfTar's ugly face.
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According to my calculations, 252 Atk Adamant CB Tyranitar using Crunch against max HP / max Def Bold Reuniclus does 90-106%. So CB Tyranitar can OHKO, but ScarfTar is screwed.
 
I'm not sure if I would consider it a good counter or not, but with all the bulky boosters in this gen, would Life Gamble (or whatever the name is now) be a last resort type move against Reuniclus?

For those unfamiliar,Life Gamble makes the user faints.Then the opposing Pokemon takes damage equal to the HP lost.So simply Explosion+Seismic Toss.The 2 I have been looking at are Ninjask and Victini.Some pros and cons:

NINJASK
Ninjask has a very poor HP as even maxed out it only hits 326.As a reminder, Reuniclus has 424.Add to that problem SR would cut his HP even further and its not going to be the most reliable.However, not all is lost.An Adamant 252 Ninjask does 45.8%-54.2% with unboosted X-Scissor.While Reun will kill with an attack, you have weakened it for another poke to finish it.

The main draw of Ninjask is obviously not in its killing Reun directly (as it needs a Life Orb and +2 to get a guaranteed kill as a +2 by itself is 91%-107.5%) but how it can be used to support the team regardless or Reun.It can still pass speed to certain pokemon to help them sweep.I think everybody has seen what a little speed can do for certain pokemon.Also because of Ninjask's incredible natural speed (357 with only 4 evs) you can outrun alot and act kind of like a suicidal revenge killer by using Life Gamble.


VICTINI
Victini does a little better in the HP department than Ninjask as his top is 404.Victini is also a little more threatening by itself as it has access to several good moves (U-Turn/Fire Blast/Thunder/Focus Blast/etc) that can be useful in certain situations.However, the typing gives many problems with keeping health up (SR weak,U-Turn weak,Pursuit/Sucker Punch weak,Aqua Jet weak,etc).

If you are low on health, a U-Turn from a no investment Victini (like a Hasty Scarf LGamble/UTurn/Fire Blast/Filler) does 41%-48.6%.While again not a huge amount,it can finish a weakened Reun or set it up for a second Pokemon to finish.If you wanted a Victini not so invested in HP (a weaker Life Gamble but stronger normal attacks) and went with only 6 HP, you would have 342 HP.


The main problems are many.The chief among them is that Life Gamble needs most of the HP intact when Reun usually shows up in the mid to late game.The other is most users are SR weak so just switching in can cut of a hundred or more points just by switching in.You also lose a pokemon so that bites.Also if they predict Life Gamble, they could switch ruining it completely.

I don't suggest this as a great alternative but something I found interesting and could have some use as bulky set up is becoming very popular.I also recently saw this in use as I watched a stall team that used Life Gamble to finish off certain threats.So yeah.Just some food for thought.
 
Nearly all Reuniclus run max HP which is a higher base total than Victini's. Not to mention Victini will take heavy SR damage coming in. It can never KO Reuniclus at full health, so it isn't a counter in the slightest.
 
Jaroda said:
Nearly all Reuniclus run max HP which is a higher base total than Victini's. Not to mention Victini will take heavy SR damage coming in. It can never KO Reuniclus at full health, so it isn't a counter in the slightest.
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I never said counter.I said it could be a last resort and I even said it had problems.However, considering Reun's bulk and some other bulky tanks/sweepers, I figured any move that could do a set amount of damage might have some use.Night Shade and Seismic Toss are out since Recover heals to fast.This was more of a finish off a weakened Reun or weaken it to the point it can be finished off type move than a 100% Reun killer move.
 
RaikouLover said:
Wow, im appalled at the bullshit in this thread. Reuniclus for Uber? Are you SHITTING me????

This thing has 100% paper counters, doesn't overcentralize the metagame, and does not make stall unviable since a few common stall members are 100% paper counters to this thing (Spiritomb, Perish Song Celebi, Calm Mind Roar Latias). And these aren't even overspecialized counters!!! For two, stall seems to have shit like Choice Scarf Tyranitar on it lately, which also hurts this thing pretty bad. I'm not buying it for shit. Also, this thing as slow as ass, so revenge killing it is cake.
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Before claiming that my posts contain 'Bullshit' you may consider to read your own posts first. Like i've said before Spiritomb's defenses combined with it's lack of reliable recovery make it an undesirable choice for Generation V stall. Also good luck at running a CM/Recover/Dragon Pulse/Roar Latias in this metagame, with Tyranitar and Scizor being everywhere.

About Perish Song, someone else already brought this up and this was my response:

With beating one on one what are you exactly refering too? Unless you mean 'forcing out' through the use of Perish Song. Unfortunatly Perish Song only has 8PP max which means that your opponent can stall it out off PP over time. Considering as a user of Stall you usually have only way to defeat Rankurusu a skilled opponent will always attempt to achieve this at any cost.
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To be honest i'm quite surprised that i'm responding to a senior member here, one would think they would hold a higher standard
 
elchupo said:
I completely fail to see how this thing is ubers. Completely.
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Reuniclus' bulk is very good. That combined with Magic Guard, Calm Mind and Recover makes it very difficult to take down. There are more reasons, but they were mentioned earlier on. Someone might have to re-explain that.
 
well everyone was actualy cant make their mind which make him sound unstoppable.
They say with 252 252 bold he can take bug bite from CB zor and Does massive with 252 SpA FOcus blast which make him sound unstoppable. But in true term, hes good but not broken. Many say he make stall unviable but thats a biased way to say this guys uber. TR doesnt really destroy Offensive team(only stupid HO team that is unviable in gen 5 in the first place) when played correctly but those two is the main reason why most say hes uber.
 
Judas DN said:
Before claiming that my posts contain 'Bullshit' you may consider to read your own posts first. Like i've said before Spiritomb's defenses combined with it's lack of reliable recovery make it an undesirable choice for Generation V stall. Also good luck at running a CM/Recover/Dragon Pulse/Roar Latias in this metagame, with Tyranitar and Scizor being everywhere.
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So if Tyranitar and Scizor are everywhere, both pokemon that can deal enough damage to Rankurusu to make it completely useless for the rest of the match, are "everywhere," then why is Rankurusu such a big problem?

Also, have you used Spiritomb? It's not completely useless for stall teams, making an effective staller and spinblocker. It's also an effective user of Will-O-Wisp, and with its typing with no weaknesses, it can provide an effective stop to many physical attackers. It may not stop as many attackers as, say, Burungeru, another bulky ghost, but it does stop Rankurusu, and isn't complete dead weight outside of it. This point has been reiterated many times throughout the thread: Spiritomb is a perfectly viable counter for Rankurusu.

CM Roar Latias is actually very powerful, and just because Tyranitar and Scizor are commonly used, doesn't mean they can't be worked around. Both of them can be lured and KOed relatively easily due to their respective 4x weakness, and when gone, CM Roar Latias is quite powerful.

About Perish Song, someone else already brought this up and this was my response:
With beating one on one what are you exactly refering too? Unless you mean 'forcing out' through the use of Perish Song. Unfortunatly Perish Song only has 8PP max which means that your opponent can stall it out off PP over time. Considering as a user of Stall you usually have only way to defeat Rankurusu a skilled opponent will always attempt to achieve this at any cost.
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To be honest i'm quite surprised that i'm responding to a senior member here, one would think they would hold a higher standard
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By the same logic, one would think that you would hold a higher standard when responding to a senior member. Have you seen Obi's famous stall team? It utilized Perish Song very effectively to stop last-pokemon set-uppers which usually decimate full stall teams. 8 PP is plenty enough to stop bulky CMers like Rankurusu.

PlatinumDude said:
Reuniclus' bulk is very good. That combined with Magic Guard, Calm Mind and Recover makes it very difficult to take down. There are more reasons, but they were mentioned earlier on. Someone might have to re-explain that.
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He knows that. he was saying that with all of the information that he's gained from reading the thread, he still doesn't see how Rankurusu could be Uber.
 
cosmicexplorer said:
So if Tyranitar and Scizor are everywhere, both pokemon that can deal enough damage to Rankurusu to make it completely useless for the rest of the match, are "everywhere," then why is Rankurusu such a big problem?

Also, have you used Spiritomb? It's not completely useless for stall teams, making an effective staller and spinblocker. It's also an effective user of Will-O-Wisp, and with its typing with no weaknesses, it can provide an effective stop to many physical attackers. It may not stop as many attackers as, say, Burungeru, another bulky ghost, but it does stop Rankurusu, and isn't complete dead weight outside of it. This point has been reiterated many times throughout the thread: Spiritomb is a perfectly viable counter for Rankurusu.

CM Roar Latias is actually very powerful, and just because Tyranitar and Scizor are commonly used, doesn't mean they can't be worked around. Both of them can be lured and KOed relatively easily due to their respective 4x weakness, and when gone, CM Roar Latias is quite powerful.


By the same logic, one would think that you would hold a higher standard when responding to a senior member. Have you seen Obi's famous stall team? It utilized Perish Song very effectively to stop last-pokemon set-uppers which usually decimate full stall teams. 8 PP is plenty enough to stop bulky CMers like Rankurusu.


He knows that. he was saying that with all of the information that he's gained from reading the thread, he still doesn't see how Rankurusu could be Uber.
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It has been proved multiple times that Rank can OHKO T-tar, but T-tar cannot do so to Rank. Also, Scizor can't do a bunch of damage with Pursuit or KO with U-turn
 
masterful said:
It has been proved multiple times that Rank can OHKO T-tar, but T-tar cannot do so to Rank. Also, Scizor can't do a bunch of damage with Pursuit or KO with U-turn
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Please read my post.

cosmicexplorer said:
So if Tyranitar and Scizor are everywhere, both pokemon that can deal enough damage to Rankurusu to make it completely useless for the rest of the match...
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A Rankurusu at 10% is a useless Rankurusu, and Rankurusu cannot OHKO Scizor, especially as it's going to be switching out by attacking with U-turn. Also, CBTar's Crunch does 89.6%-106.1% to 252/252 Bold Rankurusu, having a 37.5% chance to KO at 100% health, and OHKOing with any other residual. Both Tyranitar and Scizor can effectively halt Rankurusu's sweep and let any other pokemon come in and KO it, even if they die in the process, and as explained before, if Rankurusu has any prior damage from switching into an attack, it's OHKOed.
 
So if Tyranitar and Scizor are everywhere, both pokemon that can deal enough damage to Rankurusu to make it completely useless for the rest of the match, are "everywhere," then why is Rankurusu such a big problem?
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Because stallteams cannot run Tyranitar and Scizor reliably while the offensive opponent can run both Rankurusu and T-tar/Scizor as they work very well together.

Also, have you used Spiritomb? It's not completely useless for stall teams, making an effective staller and spinblocker. It's also an effective user of Will-O-Wisp, and with its typing with no weaknesses, it can provide an effective stop to many physical attackers
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All these calculations have been made against a maximum Physically invested Spiritomb

CB T-tar Crunch: 49.7% - 58.6%
CB Scizor U-turn: 42.1% - 50%
Yache SD Chomp Outrage: 44.4% - 52.3% after SD: 88.2% - 103.9%
Gliscor can set up with ease thanks to it's immunity to Burn
Life Orb Doryuuzu EQ: 49.3% - 58.2% after SD: 98% - 115.8%
Roobushin can set up with ease as well considering you actually boost it's power after a burn
Gyarados: Most common version nowadays is the taunt version to stop Nattorei, spiritomb can't touch it.
Dragonite: I'll give you this one.
LO Blaziken Flare Blitz: 54.3% - 64.1% after SD 107.9% - 127.3%
Metagross Meteor Smash: 41.8% - 49.3% -> you induce burn than you die i hope for you it doesn't have Lum berry
Lucario: I'll give you this one
LO Randorusu: 61.2% - 72% in Sandstorm
LO Cloyster Icicle Spear: 52.6% - 62.5% after Shell Break: 105.6% - 124.3%
Choice Scarf Jirachi: 25% - 29.6% -> you may win if you're lucky

I wouldn't consider a pokemon who can only reliably stop 2 out of 15 of Generation V's top physicall sweepers with a maximum defensive investment to be an effective physicall wall. Having no weaknesses isn't worth much, to be an effective wall one has to have usefull resistances or immunities like Gliscor and Skarmory do. To make things worse Resttalk is only way Spiritomb can heal itself but with the new sleep mechanics those aren't as reliable as it used to be.

Have you seen Obi's famous stall team? It utilized Perish Song very effectively to stop last-pokemon set-uppers which usually decimate full stall teams. 8 PP is plenty enough to stop bulky CMers like Rankurusu.
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I have read Obi's stall team with much interest and yes, and i admit it was an effective team during Generation IV. However that it was effective back than doesn't necessarly mean it's effective in Generation V

How is 8 PP enough? Take the fellowing scenario: starting with a Heatran-blissey matchup
Turn 1
Heatran switches out to Rankurusu
Blissey does whatever(can't hurt it anyway)

Turn 2
Blissey switches out to Celebi
Rankurusu uses Calm Mind

Turn 3
Celebi uses Perish Song
Rankurusu uses Psycho Shock

Turn 4
Celebi uses recover
Rankurusu switches out to Heatran

Turn 5
Celebi switches out to Blissey
Heatran uses whatever( can't touch blissey regardless)

Repeat this proces 8 times and the Rankurusu user wins, i've done this 3 times succesfully on the ladder. While it doesn't work in a simple proces like that in a real game it usually comes to switching in Rankurusu 8 times which is incredibly easy against a stallteam.
 
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