SPOILERS! Scarlet & Violet Leaks Thread - Data/Mechanics

I feel like if it worked such that you'd be able to bring over "exclusive" moves this would be something they'd, ideally, either say directly or show directly. Show any of those Pikachus with...anything notable, at all. Even Volt Tackle would be interesting.

Especially since this would factor into how you'd be able to use Pokemon in official events. The entire point of the mark system, and presumably streamlining with the move reset for BDSP & LA + the Battle Ready reset in SWSH, was presumably to help get rid of this clutter and "level the playing field".
But now anyone with SWSH or LA has an assortment of Paldea Dex Pokemon (the Paldea Mark I don't think will even matter, I think the rules for competition specifically words around it which would actually be relevant for Gholdengo and Go) they can now bring back, teach something, then bring forward. Or just bring forward in general.

I mean GameFreak's fickle, so I guess it's never off the table (see also: being able to swap around Pokemon between gens) that they've just fully changed their mind on how they want these things to work, but I dunno. It just seems off. Why even have the moves reset for SV at all at that point?
 
I feel like I’m living the “open the gate a little” meme looking through all this spotty information on relearning moves. Looking forward to it all dropping on the 24th to see how exactly it works I guess?
 
I just hope the dataminers get to find some fun secrets about DLC stuff once the update drops. C'mon, new mon placeholder slots/codenames...!

(More likely prelim movesets for mons to be added, if anything, like ahead of swsh dlc, but that may not come until a home update closer to dlc)
 
From my recollection HOME compatibility dates have never been officially announced in advance so this happening for SV at all was an anomaly. Usually HOME compatibility is just stealth dropped on a whim with no prior announcement in advance, using all of SwSh, PLA, and that side remake we call BDSP as precedent. SwSh DLCs as well.

The Japanese tweets announcing the features of HOME version 3.0.0 did not specify a date for when it would release at all, which means all of this is on TPCi specifically. It is very possible that there was some NDA business going on and specifying a date for HOME compatibility was in violation of non-disclosure agreements made behind the scenes between the different branches of TPC, and TPCi had to retract the statement so as to not catch shit from TPC Japan, if they haven't already gotten in trouble that is. NDAs in business matters are taken very seriously and breaking NDAs gets the people who do so in significant amounts of trouble so TPCi was definitely on thin ice after that tweet from a business standpoint.

I do expect it will come sometime next week or at least the week after anyway, but it'll just be stealth dropped on a whim with no prior announcement and it will be on the folks at Serebii and Bulbagarden to keep an eye out for when it happens.
 
One thing that is kind of disappointing is there have been so few mythical Pokemon over the last few years. In all of Gen 8, we only had one new mythical Pokemon.

I know for now they are focusing on DLC but it looks like if there will be a new Mythical Pokemon for Gen 9 it will probably be in 2024.
 
pkmfan said:
One thing that is kind of disappointing is there have been so few mythical Pokemon over the last few years. In all of Gen 8, we only had one new mythical Pokemon.

I know for now they are focusing on DLC but it looks like if there will be a new Mythical Pokemon for Gen 9 it will probably be in 2024.
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Considering that there was a placeholder for a potential second Gen VIII Mythical in Sword and Shield, It was likely Covid that stopped it from being a thing, since in Japan(aka the country the games are made in) the Mythicals have mostly be released as downloads/codes only available by physically going to a movie theater(or at the very least getting a physical ticket) to watch the Pokemon movie starring that mythical. There hasn't been a single animated theater release for Pokemon since the Zarude movie, which probably didn't do very well in terms of getting people to theaters due to it being at the peak of the covid lockdowns worldwide
 
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Honestly between Covid and adding new Pokemon every release it wouldn't surprise me if the way Zarude shaked out lead them to fully reevaluated the function of Mythics entirely.

Covid likely put a damper on not just wanting a new movie in general, but location scouting and stuff. And once you see that the franchise didn't really suffer from not having a movie every year, maybe you just...realize you don't need to do a movie ever year. Who knows, maybe that helps with staffing concerns or whatever too.

Meanwhile the other big thing with Mythics (aside from just big cross media marketing) was it was a "new Pokemon" to keep the generation being "fresh" aside from just forms. But when every year is seeing ~5+ new Pokemon anyway, does that really matter as much anymore?

I'm sure we'll see another movie eventually, and it will likely have a new Mythic, but they probably don't feel the need to have one every year forever.
 
The other thing is that the anime has gone through a substantial transition point over the course of the past few years. Obviously there's a bit of hindsight here but Journeys wound up being the end of an era as it turned out to be the final series with Ash Ketchum as the main character and was focusing on his "grand rise to stardom" before sending him off and concluding his story, which was a big change to what was once considered a universal constant of Pokemon.

The movies for the first six generations were mainly just things with Ash and his friends interacting with a mythical, and then the recent moves involved an alternate universe Ash with the Zarude movie being the most recent, and frankly final one.

Now we are in the Gen 9 anime and this is the beginning of a new age for the anime because this is no longer the "Ash Ketchum is travelling the flagship region" loop, but a completely new story starring a new protagonist (Liko), and right now the focus is getting her story started and having her and Roy establish their place in the Pokemon world along with their stories.

Which is to say, at earliest the next movie, and by proxy the next mythical, I imagine will be at earliest next year once Horizons has had a substantial number of episodes and Liko has had enough time to establish herself as a big name in Pokemon (as she has some big shoes to fill right now following in the footsteps of a character who was once considered a universal constant of Pokemon for 25+ years). I think for now in addition to that they are also trying to figure out how to handle the movies in that front in the new era of Anipoke, especially with respect to this era being one without Ash Ketchum. This would include what kinds of stories they wanna tell with the movies, and in what way and how they can use Liko and Roy in movies if that's the route they want to go for in future movies, or even whatever future protagonists we get.

A bit of a rant but the point is that right now we are in a big transitional era for the anime itself, and movies will likely be differently handled moving forward in this new era, and by extension mythicals may come at a different pace as well.
 
ScraftyIsTheBest said:
A bit of a rant but the point is that right now we are in a big transitional era for the anime itself, and movies will likely be differently handled moving forward in this new era, and by extension mythicals may come at a different pace as well.
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One thing I would add is that the first Pokemon movie for the Ash era came out about 14 months after the first anime episode debuted, and presumably would have been in the works before they had a full scope or longer term plan for that iteration of the anime (I recall prior to a hiatus induced by the ESP incident that they were considering Ash winning the League like traditional anime, which may have entailed a new protag per region).

What I'm trying to get at here is that besides the old movie schedule being from a different time for both Anime and the Franchise, there was a sizeable wait for a film that was much more of an "event" at its inception, on top of any complications of COVID. Between that and stuff like the side animations like Hisuian Snow, I wonder if they might simply be stepping away from the movie concept long term.

DLC stories and episodic anime appearance structure already allow them to debut Pokemon in the same roles Mythicals would serve: bringing eyes back onto the games after their initial wave of hype with new content. I kind of already regarded stuff like Urshifu or Calyrex as filling the same niche as Mythicals (and arguably better than they have since Gen 4-5 since they have actual world context and story attached again), and it's probably preferable for GF and Players alike since instead of criticism for FOMO, it future proofs the content while monetizing what were previously free promotional events (i.e. GF paying for locations to host it or ship codes, or needing a middle man to sell them to and have them packaged with like Gamestop for example) that might only make their money back indirectly through the renewed engagement
 
Things in regards to the HOME stuff I wanna know:

1. Since they can't get the move due to no other Pokemon getting the move by level-up or w/e, but are coded to learn it in the game, is Heal Bell Chansey/Blissey freed when HOME comes out?

2. I'm guessing for movepools it looks for overlap. IE: Two Pokemon learn Tackle at level 5 in both BDSP and SV, so Tackle stays. But in BDSP this Pokemon can learn this other move it can't learn in SV, so no go. Is there any evidence pointing towards this?
 
Melons-N-Soda said:
Things in regards to the HOME stuff I wanna know:

1. Since they can't get the move due to no other Pokemon getting the move by level-up or w/e, but are coded to learn it in the game, is Heal Bell Chansey/Blissey freed when HOME comes out?
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If the move sets are fully reset, then no. As you say, Chansey only gets the move by Breeding and all the natural Heal Bell learners are unfortunately not in Paldea. So there's no one to pass it down via Egg Move/Mirror Herb.
In this scenario it won't be legal (barring some surprise event, I guess) until the DLC hits where at the very least it seems Chimecho comes back

2. I'm guessing for movepools it looks for overlap. IE: Two Pokemon learn Tackle at level 5 in both BDSP and SV, so Tackle stays. But in BDSP this Pokemon can learn this other move it can't learn in SV, so no go. Is there any evidence pointing towards this?
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We don't know, sadly. Personally I think the safe answer is "it is only looking at the level up list of the specific game, so overlap doesn't matter", but strictly speaking they've not laid out the specifics.
 
One thing I think that’s important to clarify about Pokémon home and the move relearner, is that nowhere on the Japanese (presumably, the original) website about moves needing to be useable in some generations. The only limitations it lists are the Pokémon having learnt the move, and that “some moves excluded” (ie cut moves and hidden power for BDSP).
 
MaskedFeraligatr said:
One thing I think that’s important to clarify about Pokémon home and the move relearner, is that nowhere on the Japanese (presumably, the original) website about moves needing to be useable in some generations. The only limitations it lists are the Pokémon having learnt the move, and that “some moves excluded” (ie cut moves and hidden power for BDSP).
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I don't really understand what you are clarifying about moves needing to be usable in some generations, since you mention cut moves later as a separate exclusion which is basically the same thing. If a move is not usable in a game then it is cut from that game, and if a move becomes usable in another game then you can just learn it within that game, assuming it is learnable which leads to my next point.

Also, BDSP Hidden Power wouldn't need to be a particular exclusion based on what we know so far. The consistent part across all translations is that a move has to be "learnable" in one of the Switch games, and based on the Japanese/Chinese translations it is likely this is not intended to mix or add to movepools.

For example, if you bring Hidden Power on a non-Unown bank mon, we know it is not learnable by anything that is not Unown or Smeargle in SWSH/BDSP/PLA/SV, so it is a reasonable assumption to say that Hidden Power Pikachu is not coming to BDSP or PLA.
 
doipy hooves said:
I don't really understand what you are clarifying about moves needing to be usable in some generations, since you mention cut moves later as a separate exclusion which is basically the same thing. If a move is not usable in a game then it is cut from that game, and if a move becomes usable in another game then you can just learn it within that game, assuming it is learnable which leads to my next point.

Also, BDSP Hidden Power wouldn't need to be a particular exclusion based on what we know so far. The consistent part across all translations is that a move has to be "learnable" in one of the Switch games, and based on the Japanese/Chinese translations it is likely this is not intended to mix or add to movepools.

For example, if you bring Hidden Power on a non-Unown bank mon, we know it is not learnable by anything that is not Unown or Smeargle in SWSH/BDSP/PLA/SV, so it is a reasonable assumption to say that Hidden Power Pikachu is not coming to BDSP or PLA.
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Hidden Power WAS specifically excluded in the English site. It put (some moves excluded) next to BDSP.
My clarification was that nowhere on the Japanese does it mention the idea of a Pokémon needing to learn a move the switch games, ie, that transfer moves are limited only to what can be learned in those games specifically. Obviously cut moves will be gone. They aren’t going to update the game to add them back.
 
Hopefully if pre-Switch moves are obtainable on BDSP, I can FINALLY have Zap Cannon + Mind Reader on Hypno(Can't have it on it in SV because Mind Reader was removed, and it can only get Mind Reader in BDSP and not USUM or earlier). I know it's not a GOOD set to have on a Hypno, its more of being able to have it at all.
 
MaskedFeraligatr said:
Hidden Power WAS specifically excluded in the English site. It put (some moves excluded) next to BDSP.
My clarification was that nowhere on the Japanese does it mention the idea of a Pokémon needing to learn a move the switch games, ie, that transfer moves are limited only to what can be learned in those games specifically. Obviously cut moves will be gone. They aren’t going to update the game to add them back.
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It's not a specific exclusion if they don't specifically mention Hidden Power by name and has no equivalent mention on the Japanese site, especially knowing how vague the English site has been.

Also now that your clarification has been changed from "moves needing to be usable in some generation" to "Pokemon don't need to learn a move in the switch games", I can say that this is just false and I'm wondering what your source is, because I've already explained in detail on the Scarlet/Violet thread how the Japanese and Chinese sites specifically mention how the feature says that you can relearn moves learned so far that can be learned in the destination game.

doipy hooves said:
I feel about the same way based on how the Japanese site words the feature with the implication that you get your movepool from the game you're entering into.
https://www.pokemon.co.jp/ex/pokemonhome/ja/features/03/

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There is some debate on if it means the previous or destination game, but google translate and deepL side towards the latter interpretation.
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doipy hooves said:
Speaking of the Chinese side, this is another source that supports the "moves it learns in the game you're entering" interpretation since it uses the term 送去 which means "sent to" compared to the Japanese woridng used which could apparently mean both before or ahead.
https://www.pokemon.co.jp/ex/pokemonhome/sc/features/03/
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Overall I think the English side's wording is pretty unclear especially with how they specify (some moves excluded) only on BDSP, and it's hard to say what will actually happen in practice, but I would rather keep my expectations low and be surprised if it does actually happen that you can mix and match your movesets across games.
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Melons-N-Soda said:
Things in regards to the HOME stuff I wanna know:

1. Since they can't get the move due to no other Pokemon getting the move by level-up or w/e, but are coded to learn it in the game, is Heal Bell Chansey/Blissey freed when HOME comes out?

2. I'm guessing for movepools it looks for overlap. IE: Two Pokemon learn Tackle at level 5 in both BDSP and SV, so Tackle stays. But in BDSP this Pokemon can learn this other move it can't learn in SV, so no go. Is there any evidence pointing towards this?
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Here's a pleasant update to this that I just saw in the Competitve OU thread:
The way move transfers work, if a move on that Pokemon is still valid in Gen 9, and it knew it before transfer, you can still relearn the move. This applies to TMs but also Egg Moves, which is relevant for Chansey because that means it can still get Heal Bell in Gen 9! Just a bit more roundabout.
 
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