Metagame Shared Power [Under Re-Construction!]

[The Justwin]

As has been pointed out a few times, Gale Wings gets checked before Aerilate so it doesn’t recognize Normal moves as Flying. This is intentional/accurate to the cart.

Sorry, I didn’t see anything as I didn’t want ti look at every single post. Not quite sure why this would be on purpose though. I don’t understand the phrase “accurate to the cart” maybe thats why.

 

[Chillllllow]

A cool Kyurem-B team I want to share. Dragon Breath + Icy Wind. Why? Because technician, sheer force and life orb = massive dmg. Beast boost for more speed, soul heart for more damage and tera volt to break through everything.

team

Porygon-Z @ Normalium Z
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 SpA
- Thunderbolt
- Ice Beam
- Recover
- Conversion

Kyurem-Black @ Life Orb
Ability: Teravolt
EVs: 108 HP / 152 SpA / 248 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dragon Breath
- Icy Wind
- Roost
- Substitute

Magearna @ Life Orb
Ability: Soul-Heart
EVs: 248 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Flash Cannon
- Thunderbolt
- Ice Beam
- Trick Room

Blacephalon @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 240 HP / 16 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Flamethrower
- Shadow Ball
- Psychic
- Dark Pulse

Roserade @ Life Orb
Ability: Technician
EVs: 184 HP / 72 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Energy Ball
- Sludge Bomb
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Shadow Ball

Nidoking @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 12 HP / 248 SpA / 248 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sludge Wave
- Earth Power
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt

Edit: I changed Roserade Technician for Bruxish Dazzling and gave Dragon Pulse / Ice Beam to Kyurem.

 

[Ryolain]

Sorry, I didn’t see anything as I didn’t want ti look at every single post. Not quite sure why this would be on purpose though. I don’t understand the phrase “accurate to the cart” maybe thats why.

As in, this is how it works on the cartridge. Even in OMs we don’t override cartridge mechanics (aside from the specific mechanic overridden for the OM, obviously).

 

[hiei-q]

Hi, i am new in the forums, i started playing last week. Before starting, sorry for my bad english.

First of all, i wanted to talk about the Cheek Pouch + Harvest + Gluttony + Prankster strategy. In the unburden era, i used a unnawere cleffable with aguav berry to heal 50% against skill link teams when they were about to kill him. Then clef 2HKO or OHKO those pokemon (with moonblast and Tbolt) and pass a healing wish before fainting. After the unawere ban, i wanted to continue using that strat, but i needed more reliable recovery so gluttomy came to my mind. Then cheek Pouch and finally harvest. after a bit of practice i mixed the strat with endure+salac to beat skill link with my own skill link cinccino (in order to brak sash). I didnt even knew that starf berry was something legal (because of the randomness), neither i knew about the substitute+prankster abuse.

My point is that berrie spam can be healthy for the metagame. Many people asked how to counter Skill link + techingam + unawere + sturdy + adaptability + etc and i can respond that a single aguav berry or salac berry (with endure) can help A LOT, not a definitive solution but close. Abilities like gluttomy, stamina and unawere can help to make the strategy more consistent. Few examples i can give are a Blacephalon beating a sturdy beedril with salac+cheek Pouch or a cinccino outspeeding a +2 cloyster with endure+salac and beating him with anti priority support (you dont abuse any ability here but living with 1 hp sucks if you are running magic bounce instead of magic guard and also you can harvest another salac for a future switch in).

I suggest to ban starf berry and, probably, substitute or prankster. Substitute is an anoying move that apports few to the metagame due to the prelevance of skill link, and i dont know if there is any healthy strat that relies on substitutes, sure it eases prediction, can be useful vs non skill link and some mons like klefky or doublade can use it reliably but then again i dont see that we will miss the substitute ban. I saw some sableyes ,klefky and thundurus teams using useful priority moves like haze or taunt, so i see that this ban can have negative effects, but i think that haze can be used without priority as well, while difficult, prepared teams with toxapex should be able to pull it off. The main reason of using haze is too cut power trip and stored power stacked power, and to stop mold breakers. The teams that can have issues against that are
1) Stall teams
2) Skill link team vs stamina
3) teams not prepared well enough for victini or contrary kuyrem

(I think unawere as a mandatory ability in 90% of the teams lol)

Skill link is a very solid playstale and a little drawback will not harm. And stall can run sash toxapex to a guaranteed haze vs kyurem, making stall a bit easier to play around can help the metagame to evolve (especially against regenerator). Again, i know that prankster may have good things so this is only a possible solution to the berrie spam problem. Also, murkow knows haze and has prankster lol.

Finally, i think starf berrie needs to be banned, its just a lottery and a power trip + sword danc+sub+protect pangoro can use that to destroy teams with some luck. I dont find Cheek Pouch + Harvest + Gluttony too much RNG dependent with berries like salac and aguav compared to how RNG dependent serene grace teams are, especially without prankster or substitute to power the strategy. Sure, harvest depends on luck, but a lot of things depends on luck too, and i dont find it unhealthy without starf berrie, with the exception of PP stall teams, but are them good at all?.

I wanted to talk about regenerator a bit, but i dont have time and the post is alredy too long. A simple question, did you fix trace? i find it a very interesting ability and i want to discuss how would it work.

 

[JakeyChan]

Is unburden restricted?

Can you please update the ability banlist because it's getting confusing

 

[elleapple]

Gonna Post my Basic AF team here

Skill link (BAN ME PLEASE)ry

Cloyster @ Focus Sash
Ability: Skill Link
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Shell Smash
- Icicle Spear
- Liquidation
- Rock Blast

Beedrill-Mega @ Beedrillite
Ability: Sniper
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Pin Missile
- U-turn
- Drill Run
- Poison Jab

Bruxish @ Choice Band
Ability: Dazzling
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Psychic Fangs
- Liquidation
- Crunch
- Ice Fang

Cinccino @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Technician
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Tail Slap
- Bullet Seed
- Rock Blast
- U-turn

Swoobat @ Life Orb
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Defog
- Psychic
- Heat Wave
- Air Slash

Alakazam @ Focus Sash
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Counter
- Psychic
- Shadow Ball
- Hidden Power [Fire]

This team focuses on the tried and true adaptability, skill link, technician core. which I doubt is a surprise to anyone. Though there are a few things the change it up.

The most noticeable would be Swoobat, which is my fairly arbitrary choice for a mon with unaware. I chose it over say, Quaqsire in order to hit Doublade, which is a problem for this team in skill link vs. skill link machups. it also leaves zam to save its sash for later threats. Defog is there to remove webs, which really hurt this team

Scarf Cinccino also stands out, but giving this already fast mon a scarf allows it outspeed both mega beedrill and a boosted cloyster, along with slower scarf mons. This stops the game being largely decided by who wins the mega bee speed tie at the beginning, giving a reliable way to revenge kill mega bee and Cloyster

Mega Beedrill is running drill run just to get some extra chip on bulky steels, though fell stingy would probably work better for matchups not against stall.

Cloyster's set is pretty standard, not running ice shard for the obvious reason, dazzling and queenly majesty's nearly universal use.

Alakazam's set is the standard counter set, with hp fire to hurt steels. Counter is able to very nicely deal with what I consider this team's biggest weakness, Mega Aggron. Although nowhere near the most reliable method of dealing with it, it's the best way without sacrificing the rest of the team's strength.

Banded Bruxish is a fairly strong wallbreaker, and can get more done against stall than a sd set, although if not against slow teams it's most helpful use is as a mon to sack in order to safely bring in Cinccino, Beedrill, or Cloyster.

Overall I'd say this team has a pretty good matchup against both other skill link teams and stall, with Unaware stopping stamina and Dazzling stopping any prankster moves other than regen. Matchups versus less common contrary and berry spam teams are also quite favorable.

Some bug dangers to this team are: Steels, specifically scarf durant and mega aggron, Marvel scale stall, although less common this stall variant stops any chance of breaking through even with unaware.

Edit: Forgot the mention that stakataka pretty much destroys this team

 

[elleapple]

Is unburden restricted?

Can you please update the ability banlist because it's getting confusing

Any ability that strictly boosts speed is banned from sharing, this includes speed boost, unburden, quick feet, weak armour, ect

 

[Stone evil]

I laddered to number 9 on the ladder with this strategy and beat many unaware cloysters. Physdef Klefki can eat several hits through berry recovery and 2hko cloyster. Kyub lives one rock blast from full and can kill back through sturdy. Prankster Thunder Wave or Destiny Bond can cripple or remove it.
+1 252+ Atk Cloyster Icicle Spear (5 hits) vs. 244 HP / 252+ Def Klefki: 105-125 (33.2 - 39.5%) -- approx. 10.5% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

I don't see a klefki in your team at first tho

 

[Lcass4919]

Gonna Post my Basic AF team here

Skill link (BAN ME PLEASE)ry

Cloyster @ Focus Sash
Ability: Skill Link
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Shell Smash
- Icicle Spear
- Liquidation
- Rock Blast

Beedrill-Mega @ Beedrillite
Ability: Sniper
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Pin Missile
- U-turn
- Drill Run
- Poison Jab

Bruxish @ Choice Band
Ability: Dazzling
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Psychic Fangs
- Liquidation
- Crunch
- Ice Fang

Cinccino @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Technician
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Tail Slap
- Bullet Seed
- Rock Blast
- U-turn

Swoobat @ Life Orb
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Defog
- Psychic
- Heat Wave
- Air Slash

Alakazam @ Focus Sash
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Counter
- Psychic
- Shadow Ball
- Hidden Power [Fire]

This team focuses on the tried and true adaptability, skill link, technician core. which I doubt is a surprise to anyone. Though there are a few things the change it up.

The most noticeable would be Swoobat, which is my fairly arbitrary choice for a mon with unaware. I chose it over say, Quaqsire in order to hit Doublade, which is a problem for this team in skill link vs. skill link machups. it also leaves zam to save its sash for later threats. Defog is there to remove webs, which really hurt this team

Scarf Cinccino also stands out, but giving this already fast mon a scarf allows it outspeed both mega beedrill and a boosted cloyster, along with slower scarf mons. This stops the game being largely decided by who wins the mega bee speed tie at the beginning, giving a reliable way to revenge kill mega bee and Cloyster

Mega Beedrill is running drill run just to get some extra chip on bulky steels, though fell stingy would probably work better for matchups not against stall.

Cloyster's set is pretty standard, not running ice shard for the obvious reason, dazzling and queenly majesty's nearly universal use.

Alakazam's set is the standard counter set, with hp fire to hurt steels. Counter is able to very nicely deal with what I consider this team's biggest weakness, Mega Aggron. Although nowhere near the most reliable method of dealing with it, it's the best way without sacrificing the rest of the team's strength.

Banded Bruxish is a fairly strong wallbreaker, and can get more done against stall than a sd set, although if not against slow teams it's most helpful use is as a mon to sack in order to safely bring in Cinccino, Beedrill, or Cloyster.

Overall I'd say this team has a pretty good matchup against both other skill link teams and stall, with Unaware stopping stamina and Dazzling stopping any prankster moves other than regen. Matchups versus less common contrary and berry spam teams are also quite favorable.

Some bug dangers to this team are: Steels, specifically scarf durant and mega aggron, Marvel scale stall, although less common this stall variant stops any chance of breaking through even with unaware.

Edit: Forgot the mention that stakataka pretty much destroys this team

a really really small detail, but if you dont mind losing the flinch chance swoobats air slash has, hidden power flying hits considerably harder then air slash due to techhy.

another thing is cloyster might appreciate hydro pump more then liquidation, since doublade is forced to run no guard meaning doub no longer counters cloyster. otherwise liquidations power is actually lacking compared to rock blast/icicle spear, rock blast hitting 185 base power, while liquidation only hitting 168 with both adapt and STAB factored. most steels are physically defensive, so hydro pump is prob worth the risk moreso then liquid..if you dont like the accuracy, you can run water pulse, which is a 90 base power alternative. but you JUST miss out on koing doublade, so id take the risky accuracy on other steels just to nab doublades who think they wall. +2 4 SpA Adaptability Cloyster Surf(water pulse) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Doublade: 266-314 (82.6 - 97.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO.

also im pretty sure scarf cincinno has been a thing for a long time as its main set. i started running it back when quick feet was banned, and it seems like everyone and their mother are running it now.

 

[Deleted User 229847]

To those who want to ban Unaware: Unaware is currently necessary to check setup, Beast Boost/Moxie, and Stamina. While you could use Prankster+Haze, it's a lot easier just to slap an Unaware mon on the team. So don't ban that. Bruxish and Tsareena check Espeed, Gale Wings, and Triage spam. As has been stated earlier, I don't want to see this turn into Espeed spam. People have been boasting about the laureates of Aerilate Espeed Dragonite, so imagine that without anti priority checks. Talonflame would allow teams to use a 120 power move as priority, usually without recoil due to Mguard. And Pangoro is already annoying with Triage, so imagine a Buzzwole or Conkeldurr smashing your team.

I don't agree with you on unaware. I pretty much think, as an avid stall user, that it's kind of a lame ability not only in stall but also in offensive. Also, we can abuse haze with 48 PP if needed. I honestly think offensive teams with unaware+skill link are way too good in the current meta.

Also, I might suggest banning Regenerator. We all agree stall vs stall is a horrible matchup. Now, the abilities that make that matchup disastrous are Magic Guard, Magic Bounce, and Regenerator. While Magic Guard is necessary to allow physical offense to exist (imagine taking 42% damage every time you attack from Iron Barbs + Rough Skin + Rocky Helmet, and Magic Bounce is basically the same as Magic Guard in this metagame, Regenerator is only really used on Stall teams, and allows players to just switch constantly without any skill. It creates endless PP stall games and makes the game awful. So by banning Regenerator from sharing you would not destroy stall but instead help stop the mindless switching that stall can create.

Agree on the regenerator ban. I'm actually not using it in my stall team because technically with poison heal+protect and magic guard you get a shitload of healing, and even though the endless battle problem is not gonna go away it's definitely the most uncompetitive ability in stall by far. I'd love to see it restricted.

Starf berry+cheek pouch+prankster etc. it's kinda lamey RNG but as far as I am concerned stall can pp stall his way through victory. I do not play other playstyles so it might be a huge problem for them though. Shouldn't skill link+unaware just destroy them pretty much instantly?

 

[Chimera404]

I don't agree with you on unaware. I pretty much think, as an avid stall user, that it's kind of a lame ability not only in stall but also in offensive. Also, we can abuse haze with 48 PP if needed. I honestly think offensive teams with unaware+skill link are way too good in the current meta.


Agree on the regenerator ban. I'm actually not using it in my stall team because technically with poison heal+protect and magic guard you get a shitload of healing, and even though the endless battle problem is not gonna go away it's definitely the most uncompetitive ability in stall by far. I'd love to see it restricted.

Starf berry+cheek pouch+prankster etc. it's kinda lamey RNG but as far as I am concerned stall can pp stall his way through victory. I do not play other playstyles so it might be a huge problem for them though. Shouldn't skill link+unaware just destroy them pretty much instantly

Agreed on both points. Unaware is a problem on both defensive and offensive fronts, and it's strong enough to be worth bringing even if it isn't shared with the rest of the team. Haze and Phasing with Dragon Tail/Roar/Red Card also exists, so it's not like Unaware is the only option to stop a setup sweep.

Regenerator is just silly when combined with Multiscale and Unaware. It's breakable for sure, but archetypes that can't 2hko Stall staples pretty much instantly lose. Not to mention the stupidity of Stall vs Stall matchups in this meta.

Physically defensive Klefki beats Unaware Skill Link, as does physdef Pangoro and Kyurem B who can live any multi-hit move for the +5 defense IIRC.

 

[Lelouch94]

Isn't this broken? Harvest+leppa berry +prankester +substitute +unaware +magic bounce + recovery +regenerator = pp stall?

Team

Exeggutor-Alola @ Leppa Berry
Ability: Harvest
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Synthesis
- Leech Seed
- Protect

Whimsicott @ Leppa Berry
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Leech Seed
- Cotton Guard
- Encore

Blissey (F) @ Leppa Berry
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Soft-Boiled
- Toxic
- Defense Curl

Espeon @ Leppa Berry
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Toxic
- Morning Sun
- Protect

Clefable @ Leppa Berry
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Moonlight
- Cosmic Power
- Protect

Toxapex @ Leppa Berry
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 140 Def / 116 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Protect
- Toxic Spikes
- Recover

 

[M3ggo]

Isn't this broken? Harvest+leppa berry +prankester +substitute +unaware +magic bounce + recovery +regenerator = pp stall?

Team

Exeggutor-Alola @ Leppa Berry
Ability: Harvest
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Synthesis
- Leech Seed
- Protect

Whimsicott @ Leppa Berry
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Leech Seed
- Cotton Guard
- Encore

Blissey (F) @ Leppa Berry
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Soft-Boiled
- Toxic
- Defense Curl

Espeon @ Leppa Berry
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Toxic
- Morning Sun
- Protect

Clefable @ Leppa Berry
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Moonlight
- Cosmic Power
- Protect

Toxapex @ Leppa Berry
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 140 Def / 116 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Protect
- Toxic Spikes
- Recover

Knock Off'd Berries can't get harvested again so that breaks the team easy. And Mold Breaker Taunt renders the whole team useless.

 

[Zyrax]

Knock Off'd Berries can't get harvested again so that breaks the team easy. And Mold Breaker Taunt renders the whole team useless.

Swapping Blissey for something that has Sticky Hold and this team is nearly unbeatable, as long as you don't run Mold Breaker Taunt. I Sincerely think, that these kinds of teams are over centralizing (I HAVE to run Mold Breaker as of now)...

 

[hiei-q]

lamey RNG but as far as I am concerned stall can pp stall his way through victory. I do not play other playstyles so it might be a huge problem for them though. Shouldn't skill link+unaware just destroy them pretty much instantly?

Starf berry pangoru can beat stall with swords dance and power trip. He can carry taunt to shut down haze attemps but at the cost of losing protect. As chimera 404 said, klefki can beat skill link teams. I will also mention physically defensive snorlax, he can recover hp with aguav berry, and with belly drum + recycle/protect he can punch holes in skill link teams.

Though claws teams can destroy berrie spam if they use unnerve aerodactyl as donator

 

[Yung Dramps]

I personally think that we need to decide whether we want a fun meta or a balanced meta. As others have stated, and the way I see it, there is no way to make this format balanced without banning a good 10-20 abilities. And then we gotta ask ourselves: Will the tier even be worth playing at that point? We could get rid of every single problematic element, but at that point, there would be no value left in the format, and creative possibilities would be all squashed.

pp stall is still awful tho, ban regen

 

[Jrsmash9]

Regenerator should not be banned lol. If that was banned then stall has a whole would be invalidated and then Speed Teams would be even better then now. Stall rarely resorts to endless switching unless its a defensive team v defensive team, otherwise it will be throwing out attacks like moonblast and dragon claw. When people say to ban regenerator its not because its broken or uncompetitive, but because they dont think its "fun" or it "ruins the meta". That is very objective and not a good way of constructing the meta.

 

[Haaku.]

The current biggest problem in the metagame is Skill Link in my opinion and the removal of this ability might just be what the metagame needs to get into a stable state.

This is an absolutely ridiculous Pokemon that really shouldn’t have access to Skill Link. Not only does it share Adaptability to the rest of the team, but receiving Skill Link and Technician means that only 4x resists like Celesteela can actually switch into it. Currently, all playstyles are strapped for an answer to this thing. Defensive teams have to run Stamina, but oh wait! Skill Link is the main reason Unaware is so great right now because it completely invalidates that form of counterplay out the window. Pokemon that were previously thought of as metagame-defining like Dragonite are no longer as such, and it’s all because of Skill Link. Beedrill is not broken, but Skill Link probably is. I want to reach a council decision soon, and I’d like to hear discussion on both sides of the community.

I’d also like to dedicate this post to address something I’ve always wanted to, and I want to thank Yung Dramps for bringing it up.

I personally think that we need to decide whether we want a fun meta or a balanced meta.

Ideally, we’d want both. But let’s be honest, with a metagame of this caliber, we’re never going to get a completely balanced metagame. The goal of Shared Power has always been a fun, yet playable metagame. The dependency on matchups will always be there, but it’s up to us, the community, to minimize this. Being a matchup-based metagame is not a bad thing if there are enough interesting and competitive matchups to keep things fun. This very thing is what’s made Monotype such a fun and successful metagame, and with Monotype being my “main” metagame, I want to model my own metagame after this. Please bear with us since the metagame has existed for a little over a month and a half. Usually, it takes metagames quite a while before stabilizing, and the process that Shared Power has made in such a short time is very satisfying, at least to me.

Those are just my thoughts on things as of recent. With that being said, I’ve been having a blast playing this metagame and I want to continue balancing this metagame. If you love playing the meta as much as I do, sign up for the Unity tournament as signups end today. That’s all for now!

 

[hiei-q]

My point of view of this metagame is that you mainly use abilities to counter other abilities. This is because since any pokemon can carry that ability, you cant just rely on a pokemon to counter that. Abilities like sturdy and multiscale would become broken if skill link is banned. So skill link is needed in the metagame as a way to make everything more balanced.
Besides, skill link is a special case to think about: there is no ability that counters skill link, but there are fee mons that can exploit it, so you can find solid answers to skill link with pokemons.

I think that before baning any ability we need to think how it would affect the metagame. An ability not broken like magic guard can be banned and the result will be that more abilities like head rock, magic bounce and sand stream will become viable and make the meta more interesting. But without some critical abilities like unawere or skill link the metagame can snowball to the point that only a few abilities will be available, morphing shared power from a metagame in which you can shared almost any ability to a metagame in which some specific abilities like fire absorb or levitate can be shared

 

[Zyrax]

The current biggest problem in the metagame is Skill Link in my opinion and the removal of this ability might just be what the metagame needs to get into a stable state.

This is an absolutely ridiculous Pokemon that really shouldn’t have access to Skill Link. Not only does it share Adaptability to the rest of the team, but receiving Skill Link and Technician means that only 4x resists like Celesteela can actually switch into it. Currently, all playstyles are strapped for an answer to this thing. Defensive teams have to run Stamina, but oh wait! Skill Link is the main reason Unaware is so great right now because it completely invalidates that form of counterplay out the window. Pokemon that were previously thought of as metagame-defining like Dragonite are no longer as such, and it’s all because of Skill Link. Beedrill is not broken, but Skill Link probably is. I want to reach a council decision soon, and I’d like to hear discussion on both sides of the community.

I’d also like to dedicate this post to address something I’ve always wanted to, and I want to thank Yung Dramps for bringing it up.

Ideally, we’d want both. But let’s be honest, with a metagame of this caliber, we’re never going to get a completely balanced metagame. The goal of Shared Power has always been a fun, yet playable metagame. The dependency on matchups will always be there, but it’s up to us, the community, to minimize this. Being a matchup-based metagame is not a bad thing if there are enough interesting and competitive matchups to keep things fun. This very thing is what’s made Monotype such a fun and successful metagame, and with Monotype being my “main” metagame, I want to model my own metagame after this. Please bear with us since the metagame has existed for a little over a month and a half. Usually, it takes metagames quite a while before stabilizing, and the process that Shared Power has made in such a short time is very satisfying, at least to me.

Those are just my thoughts on things as of recent. With that being said, I’ve been having a blast playing this metagame and I want to continue balancing this metagame. If you love playing the meta as much as I do, sign up for the Unity tournament as signups end today. That’s all for now!

While I agree to this, I want to add the following:

The reason Skill Link rose to power in the first place was due to the sheer amount of Multiscale/ Sturdy Teams. I agree that Skill Link + Unaware is the main problem here and that we should deal with it (ideally Skill Link). But if we do that, you basically only have niche sets for dealing with Sturdy/ Multiscale (as Mold Breaker and - if we proceed with this - Skill Link will not be able to be shared). I honestly think, that if we deal with Skill Link (which we imo should), we should also deal with Multiscale/ Sturdy.

 

[Haaku.]

An alternative option is to just ban Beedrillite. Banning it would keep Skill Link teams relevant (Cloyster is a fantastic Pokemon still) but would rob them of the greatest abuser of the ability. If Mega Beedrill wasn’t banned, teams would rely on the much slower Mega Heracross as a Skill Link abuser. I understand keeping Magic Guard and Multiscale in check is a great thing, but I don’t want their use to be completely invalidated by just one Pokemon. I have compiled a list of calcs that just prove how limited counterplay to it is:

This isn’t ok

252 Atk Adaptability Beedrill-Mega Pin Missile (5 hits) vs. 244 HP / 12 Def Gliscor: 185-220 (52.5 - 62.5%) -- approx. 80.9% chance to 2HKO after Poison Heal

252 Atk Adaptability Beedrill-Mega Pin Missile (5 hits) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Clefable: 200-240 (50.7 - 60.9%) -- approx. 96.5% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

252 Atk Adaptability Beedrill-Mega Pin Missile (5 hits) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Blacephalon: 185-220 (74.8 - 89%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (Blacephalon is very frail but this is a quad resist)

-1 252 Atk Adaptability Beedrill-Mega Pin Missile (5 hits) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Landorus-Therian: 170-200 (53.2 - 62.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

This amazing wallbreaking power combined with an insane speed tier is something I don’t think we want moving forward in the metagame. I think Skill Link teams can still flourish even after a ban because Cloyster, Mega Heracross, and Ambipom will continue to be good options. This isn’t even bringing up the fact that it can donate Adaptability, which is just icing on the cake.

 

[Isa Simple]

I think that we can all be quite happy with the way the meta is looking atm.

Skill Link may seem strong right now, but I do believe that given another few days the meta will have adapted to it and shifted again. I've been quite impressed with how dynamic this meta is and how quickly it can shift with modifications to counter and accomodate for growing trends.

I mean Skill Link rose to fame because of the power of Multiscale and Sturdy. Stamina got more usage because of Skill Link, and then because of that Skill Link + Unaware became a common offensive core.

Now that Skill Link teams are running Unaware, they are actually extremely one dimensional and I'm sure if people put more thought into it they'd find some strong counters pretty quick. I mean your team is obviously gonna be running Skill Link / Adaptability / Technician, now you're throwing in Unaware, next you probably need Dazzling, and most round it out with Magic Guard to run Focus Sashes and protect Mega Bee and Cloyster from SR in particular. So the Skill Link / Technician / Adaptability combo is the only damage boosting on the team and is only fully effective on 3 moves dispersed between 3 pokemon, Mega Bee's Pin Missile, Cloyster's Icicle Spear, and Ambipom/Cinccino's Tail Slap. I'm struggling to see how we can't find counters to that, heard of Steel types?

Already we are starting to see more and more of the Doublade + Durant core. As No Guard + Hustle is a very effective core and the two pose a great threat to Skill Link teams as Doublade counters Mega Bee and co while Durant can often sponge a hit or out speed with Scarf and break through them.

Also note that the bans to speed boosting abilities including Quick Feet, Unburden and Weak Armor were still very recent, and the meta is still discovering new things that have benefitted from the departure of these abilities.

Allow me to point one out to you.

Remember that this thing got unbanned? Being a native user of Speed Boost, this is one of few pokemon left in the meta who can boost its Speed quite comfortably. Would you know it, Blaziken also boasts a 4x Bug resist, and hits Beedrill, Cloyster, and Cinccino/Ambipom super effectively with its STABs.
So hello, Blaziken can come in on either of Mega Beedrill's most spammable moves, Pin Missile and U-Turn, grab a Speed Boost, Protect, grab another to out speed even Scarf Ciccino and Ambipom, then kill everything. Focus Sash you say? Run Blaziken with Technician Double Kick, 90bp STAB that breaks Sturdy and Sashes.

+1 252 Atk Technician Beedrill-Mega Pin Missile (5 hits) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Blaziken: 165-200 (54.8 - 66.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Life Orb Blaziken Flare Blitz vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Beedrill-Mega: 1063-1256 (392.2 - 463.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Life Orb Technician Blaziken Double Kick (2 hits) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Cloyster: 240-286 (99.5 - 118.6%) -- approx. 93.8% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Life Orb Technician Blaziken Double Kick (2 hits) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Ambipom: 562-660 (193.1 - 226.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Not too bad hey?

Here's another, with Weak Armor out of the picture, Intimidate is a lot more viable now as Defiant and Competitive have fallen off without Weak Armor shenanigans, and Contrary has fallen in favour thanks again to Skill Link. A team with Intimidate + Regenerator packing a strong physical wall like Buzzwole as well as any Steel type could easily have its way with common Skill Link builds like no man's business.

One more thing that I think is quite unexplored is Bulletproof.
Immunities to Rock Blast and Bullet Seed put in some solid work against the flavor of the week, but it also offers a lot more than that.
Immunities to Focus Blast and Shadow Ball are an absolute godsend, plus the Gyro Ball immunity is awesome as it allows Chesnaught to completely dumpster on Stakataka, a super powerful threat that has always been good but is getting even better because you guessed it, it's strong against Skill Link.

I mean I'm thinking that Bulletproof Jellicent being immune to Bullet Seed could just about 6-0 a Skill Link team, plus it froths that Shadow Ball immunity. It also gives a nice Water Immunity to the whole team to help with a bunch of other all sorts.

Just imagining that all of Doublade, Intimidate, Bulletproof and Jellicent could be becoming more viable almost gives me hope that Balance can even finally be viable in this meta.

Let's just give it a bit more time. I don't see Skill Link ruling the meta forever.

 

[Legendary]

^Isa said it in longer form. Yes, Mega Beedrill is definitely a force to be reckon with. It necessitates a scarfer or a hardy pursuiter like Doublade to check it (or else it can just uturn and come back in to likely destroy you with pin missile after that uturn damage. BUT please don't restrict Skill Link, it would make any team with multiscale/magic guard/sturdy (offensive or stall) indestructible, requiring one of those abilities to be restricted. I don't even like banning Bedrillite because I love the raw power of this mon, but it is definitely the lesser of two evils. Although I can see why some would want to ban Mega Beedrill, I don't think is broken.

An alternative option is to just ban Beedrillite. Banning it would keep Skill Link teams relevant (Cloyster is a fantastic Pokemon still) but would rob them of the greatest abuser of the ability. If Mega Beedrill wasn’t banned, teams would rely on the much slower Mega Heracross as a Skill Link abuser. I understand keeping Magic Guard and Multiscale in check is a great thing, but I don’t want their use to be completely invalidated by just one Pokemon. I have compiled a list of calcs that just prove how limited counterplay to it is:

This isn’t ok

252 Atk Adaptability Beedrill-Mega Pin Missile (5 hits) vs. 244 HP / 12 Def Gliscor: 185-220 (52.5 - 62.5%) -- approx. 80.9% chance to 2HKO after Poison Heal

252 Atk Adaptability Beedrill-Mega Pin Missile (5 hits) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Clefable: 200-240 (50.7 - 60.9%) -- approx. 96.5% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

252 Atk Adaptability Beedrill-Mega Pin Missile (5 hits) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Blacephalon: 185-220 (74.8 - 89%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (Blacephalon is very frail but this is a quad resist)

-1 252 Atk Adaptability Beedrill-Mega Pin Missile (5 hits) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Landorus-Therian: 170-200 (53.2 - 62.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

This amazing wallbreaking power combined with an insane speed tier is something I don’t think we want moving forward in the metagame. I think Skill Link teams can still flourish even after a ban because Cloyster, Mega Heracross, and Ambipom will continue to be good options. This isn’t even bringing up the fact that it can donate Adaptability, which is just icing on the cake.

 

[Ryolain]

I wonder if rather than banning abilities from sharing (which has a genuine risk of whittling the meta down until barely anything relevant can be shared), we might better reduce the matchup-based issye by re-examining the mechanics of the meta. For instance, maybe change it so only the abilities of the first 3 Pokemon on your team are shared, limiting just how insane the ability combos can get. Or maybe rather than banning abilities from sharing, ban Pokémon with those abilities from being recipients of shared abilities. This would potentially dramatically increase the opportunity cost of running niche abilities like Dazzling/Queenly Majesty; Bruxish/Tsareena can still be workable now when they have 5 other offensive abilities stacked on them, but having to use them in their vanilla form in order to share their abilities does a lot more towards making them essentially dead weight on your team.

Just a thought to consider as I fear it’s going to be reeeeeally hard to balance the meta via ability bans. Some of the bans are already proving semi-effective at best, eg Pangoro being a big threat with its natural Mold Breaker.

 

[Champion Leon]

How about:

King’s Rock-

Poison Touch (Tail Slap makes contact), Merciless, Skill Link, Technician, Serene Grace, Filler

No need for Unaware if you Critical Hit, Poison hurts them further for damage without Magic Guard, while Serene Grace stacks without Poison Touch and King’s Rock to have more likelihood to stall with Flinches while accumulating Poison damage, breaking Sash, Sturdy, Substitute and Marvel Scale.

Poison Touch can also be useful for Hex, Venoshock and can work with the poison Status to deal double damage