What's the point in tanking a Draco Meteor ? I mean, if it's on the switch, you're dead next turn or after SR anyway, and if you were already facing Dragapult, what's the point in tanking it ? Is that to WoW or Wish ? I'm wondering.
The Special Defense is for living Modest Specs Pult's Draco Meteor after rocks (if running Leftovers).
Assuming that you switch in to rocks the previous turn and then Drag comes out and drops Draco, you can Wish and heal back up. That calc is quite strange to express. I should probably move the attack EVs into SpDef. Thank you for the complement!What's the point in tanking a Draco Meteor ? I mean, if it's on the switch, you're dead next turn or after SR anyway, and if you were already facing Dragapult, what's the point in tanking it ? Is that to WoW or Wish ? I'm wondering.
Still a really great job for all the theorycrafting man !
Flareon is currently quite niche. In fact, you would be better off using Rotom-H over it most of the time. Scarf Rotom-H can revenge-kill +1 Gyarados and bulkier variants can switch into G-Darm. Stall teams can run mons like G-Corsola to handle them. Flareon is a better answer to LO Clefable because it has recovery outside of Rest. That is really the only niche I see and it also has to compete with Centiskorch, which is also more viable than Flareon for it can set-up against defensive teams, though at the cost of solid recovery. Rotom-H is much easier to wear down than Flareon. You are correct that Flareon would be reserved to bulkier playstyles, but it would not be primarily used for Wish-passing as it has low HP compared to Vaporeon or Sylveon. I may have missed some stuff in this response.I reeeeally like the idea of using Flareon as a viable mon this gen, but what niches does it have to be preferred over Rotom-Heat? Wish passing comes to mind, but is it worth dropping Rotom for that? Flareon also has better special bulk, but Rotom gets a ground immunity and much better defenses. Maybe it could have a niche on stall??? I don't actually understand anything about Stall but Wish pass and Stall being able to use more niche mons than other less extreme playstyles makes me think it might be the only place Flareon can thrive.
I reeeeally like the idea of using Flareon as a viable mon this gen, but what niches does it have to be preferred over Rotom-Heat? Wish passing comes to mind, but is it worth dropping Rotom for that? Flareon also has better special bulk, but Rotom gets a ground immunity and much better defenses. Maybe it could have a niche on stall??? I don't actually understand anything about Stall but Wish pass and Stall being able to use more niche mons than other less extreme playstyles makes me think it might be the only place Flareon can thrive.
Also nice spreads TheDraugr!
Basically it's what you have said. A LO Fable check, but with the Wish-passing bonus. Also, with 130 base Attack, Flare Blitz does good damage, even without investiment. Centiskorch only differs from it with the access to Knock Off and the lack of Wish, but both do almost the same job afaik
Flareon, Sylveon, and Centiskorch
These 3 mons are able to act as specially defensive pivots/tanks. They are reliable when it comes to checking Fairy-type attackers such as Life Orb Clefable, and Hatterene. They can also handle Choice Specs Dragapult and Choice Specs Aegislash. Flareon and Sylveon both rely on Wish + Protect for recovery, while Centiskorch utilizes a Rest + Sleep Talk set. Flareon and Centiskorch rely on physical Fire-type moves to threaten Clefable, using Flare Blitz and Fire Lash respectively. Flare Blitz packs respectable power and Fire Lash has a 100% Defense drop rate to allow Centiskorch to avoid remaining passive. Centiskorch has further utility with Knock Off, which in this generation can be very nice as nothing is immune to Knock Off anymore. Sylveon relies on Mystical Fire to lower the special attack of opposing threats, and can also threaten Substitute users, such as Hydreigon, with Hyper Voice.
I got you, and I guess Flareon won't be your primary check to spec's Dragapult. But even if, indeed, in some particular cases it can work to heal back an ally up to full (since the damages will be hardly diminushed by the Sp.Attack drop), it also sacks Flareon almost all the time. It's so situationnal that I'm pretty skeptical, but it might be worth the try. Thanks anyways mate !Assuming that you switch in to rocks the previous turn and then Drag comes out and drops Draco, you can Wish and heal back up. That calc is quite strange to express. I should probably move the attack EVs into SpDef. Thank you for the complement!
I'd just use Solar Power Zard. Once someone sets sun:Following the Charizard discussion, the only thing I have to say is that if I ever try it on Rain, I wouldn,t use gay items like Boots or Umbrella and would just run Specs to do actual damage, protecting him from hazards with some other defoguer/spinner. Moltres was a good Specs user in Rain for 3 gens, Charizard is weaker than Moltres, but the Meta is also weaker in general. In any case, I don,t see the point of running offensive Heavy Duty Boots Mons, unless they have some really good set-up move ( like Frosmoth or Volcarona if it existed in Galar) or use some suport roler ( like Cinderace with Court Change). Leave that item for Mandibuzz and hazard-weak removers.
Copperajah hits significantly harder than Steelix. I'd lean towards Copperajah if I was going to use one of the two.So I wanted to talk a bit about Trick Room.
First of all, I find Oranguru is a really interesting setter because it is normal type. The only other normal type Trick Room setter is Indeedee, which I honestly thinks belongs in a lower tier. (I'll save that rant for another time.) From my experiences, Oranguru is just generally better in most cases because of superior defensive stats. I also am discovering that pairing a normal Trick Room setter with a Ghost type setter is much better defensively than most setter cores. There is still the potential dark type weakness just because all the normal type setters are also psychic type. However, there are also some fairy type setters available. My point is that using Oranguru allows you to potentially create a core of Trick Room setters that has less common weaknesses than we typically see.
I'm still experimenting so I'm going to leave most of my bit on Trick Room abusers out for now. I just want to ask, does anyone know if Steelix or Copperajah is better for Trick Room? I can't decide.
Unless Bulbapedia and Serebii are both wrong, Noivern doesn't get Thunder, so IDK why you have it slashed in next to Shadow Ball.Alright you know what, I'm too hyped about this. It's time to make another post focusing on my absolute favorite playstyle in Generation 8 regional OU.
R A I N
From the threatening amount of new sweepers introduced to the absolute utility and in some cases safety that rain brings, it's not hard to see why so many people are using this playstyle (*cough* Dracovish *cough*), but I wanted to take a moment to focus on Pokemon who benefit from rain that received very specialized buffs in this new generation that have a chance at life under this playstyle. These Pokemon could have benefitted either in the form of access to new moves, dexit removing a lot of options to handle it, or just having the metagame be kind to it. I will also be mentioning other options for the Pokemon to use that aren't on the primary sets. Let's dive on in!
Dhelmise @ Choice Band
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
- Anchor Shot
- Power Whip
- Switcheroo / Earthquake / Shadow Claw / Phantom Force / Rock Slide
Dhelmise (A Grass / Ghost type Pokemon) somehow got access to the coveted Water type Physical move - Liquidation. With a base Attack stat of 131, a Choice Band, and under rain, this hits like an absolute truck. Steelworker essentially gives Anchor Shot (a base 80 power trapping move) STAB, while also preventing double switching tactics and allowing you to regain momentum from an opponent's switch-in. STAB Power Whip also handles numerous would-be switch ins. The last moveslot is mostly filler depending on the specific coverage needs of your team, tailor it to how you need it. Unless you feel like running Switcheroo to get rid of your Choice Band.
Dhelmise also has access to a few new tools not mentioned in this set, and also buffed tools as well. Dhelmise has access to the newly buffed Rapid Spin to take care of hazards and speed creep certain bulky mons with the +1 boost. Along with this, Dhelmise has access to both Swords Dance (for a boosting set under Trick Room), and Switcheroo for tricking an item onto a specific Pokemon. So why would you use Dhelmise right now? Here's the tl;dr simplified version.
- Access to new tools such as Liquidation, Switcheroo, and a buffed Rapid Spin
- Pursuit is no longer in the game, and Knock Off has vastly lowered distribution
- 70 / 100 / 90 Bulk along with 131 Base Attack is much more impressive in this regional metagame, many of the options used to handle it were nuked with Dexit
- Access to a third STAB with a high powered trapping move is absolutely critical in this fast paced metagame.
Jolteon @ Life Orb
Ability: Volt Absorb
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
IVs: 0 Atk
- Weather Ball
- Shadow Ball
- Volt Switch
Jolteon started off strong in old generations, but slowly started to lose out to different picks over the years due to being outclassed. With Dexit removing a lot of the things that outclass it, 110 Special Attack and 130 Speed are looking far better this generation. Under Rain, perfect accuracy STAB Thunder hits like an absolute truck, and having a 30% paralysis chance is also a great option. Shadow Ball as coverage is even better right now than previously due to the rampant Ghost types and Psychic types running around the tier, and access to Weather Ball allows Jolteon to nuke options under rain that it normally wouldn't be able to handle such as Excadrill. Life Orb is the best set for Jolteon due to the ubiquity of Ground types looking to get a free switch-in under rain, as the ability to switch from Thunder to Weather Ball is crucial for this niche to work. Volt Switch is great for keeping up momentum as well. Having a Bolt Beak immunity is wonderful too.
- Access to 100 BP Water move in Weather Ball and Shadow Ball coverage is great in the current meta.
- 110 Special Attack and 130 Speed is a lot more impressive in the OU Regional Dex metagame.
- Dexit nuked a lot of the options that outclassed it, and a lot of the options that handled it.
Noivern @ Expert Belt
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
- Draco Meteor
- Thunder / Shadow Ball
- Super Fang / U-Turn (Thanks Zukrad for other set options)
Now you're probably thinking, why use Noivern when Dragapult exists? Both have Infiltrator, and Dragapult has a 3 point SpA edge over Noivern. The answer is simple. Noivern has access to a slew of unique tools that Dragapult doesn't get including STAB Hurricane (never missing under Rain), utility in Super Fang, U-Turn, Taunt, and Defog, and it isn't weak to Ghost type moves (while still being able to nail them super effectively with access to Shadow Ball). Also Noivern isn't affected by Stick Webs (Thanks qways ) Super Fang in particular is great for wearing down Special walls that Dragapult or others wouldn't be able to wear down otherwise (Super Fang removes 50% of a Pokemon's HP). Noivern also has a bevy of other support options and some additional offensive options that will be listed below.
- Access to STAB Hurricane that never misses under Rain and ignores screens and subs with Infiltrator.
- Immune to Sticky Webs unlike Dragapult who is slowed down
- Access to Super Fang to wear down Special walls that other Special attackers can't handle.
- Access to various other utility options like Taunt, U-Turn, Tailwind, and Defog.
- Neutral to Ghost type attacks while being able to hit them super effectively.
- 123 is a fantastic speed tier.
What are you waiting for? Go try out some of these Pokemon! Let the rain wash over you!
I realize that Copperajah has better attack and an excellent move pool. The thing with Steelix is it gets Body Press at 200 base defense. It also gets Head Smash and Rock Head, which basically makes it more powerful Stone Edge. So with Head Smash and STAB Earthquake, it can use the same ground/rock coverage that you mentioned with Rypherior with better defensive typing. Or it can Sheer Force Psychic Fangs and/or Crunch to open up Body Press more. I'm not saying Steelix is better or worse. I'm just saying that it's an oversimplification to say Copperajah is more powerful. The thing that would make Steelix most relevant here is Body Press.Copperajah hits significantly harder than Steelix. I'd lean towards Copperajah if I was going to use one of the two.
I'd also recommend giving Crawdaunt a look if you're not already using it. Imsosorrylol's Gen 7 Trick Room team proved just how terrifying Crawdaunt can be under Trick Room, and it helps patch up your problems with opposing Dark and Ghost types.
I think Escavalier is an underexplored option for Trick Room teams. Fantastic defensive typing and bulk, high Attack, good coverage, very hard to switch into.
Rhyperior is another obscure Trick Room abuser that I think could be an option worth exploring. EdgeQuake is unresisted in the current metagame and Rhyperior is the only remaining Pokemon to get STAB on it, along with Fire Punch to blow back Ferrothorn. On the other hand, its typing is still just as shit defensively as ever.
Fair point on Steelix but I think you're underselling Escavalier a little. A Pokemon with Base 135 Attack that can afford to run a +Attack nature is hardly defensive-oriented. It's going to leave big dents in just about anything. It's also one of few Pokemon who retained access to Knock Off, and none of the things that can take a Megahorn are going to like switching into Close Combat or Knock Off. I admit I haven't really experimented much with this Pokemon myself, but I intend to. This thing seems like quite the frightening breaker, and a good fit for a Trick Room team.I realize that Copperajah has better attack and an excellent move pool. The thing with Steelix is it gets Body Press at 200 base defense. It also gets Head Smash and Rock Head, which basically makes it more powerful Stone Edge. So with Head Smash and STAB Earthquake, it can use the same ground/rock coverage that you mentioned with Rypherior with better defensive typing. Or it can Sheer Force Psychic Fangs and/or Crunch to open up Body Press more. I'm not saying Steelix is better or worse. I'm just saying that it's an oversimplification to say Copperajah is more powerful. The thing that would make Steelix most relevant here is Body Press.
Crawdaunt is a pokemon I have really liked trying in past gens. I might try it again.
Escavalier seems like a more defensive oriented option to me than other steel type attackers. The biggest thing in its favor as a Trick Room attacker is Megahorn, which has a good deal of types that resist it.
Conkeldurr also has a form of priority in mach punch and more bulk and utility in defog... knock off is a good weapon in Goon instead..I have used obstagoon aswell. And while it certainly is viable, i think conkeldurr is the better guts wallbreaker. I used conkeldurr and obstagoon on the same team and preferred to switch my conk in. conkeldurr having drain punch is extremely useful.
I gotta disagree, Garm, although strong, has some pretty decent checks, that can even fit on offensive teams, such as the very common Rotom-Heat, if you end up getting swept because your Rotom got chipped, than that's a misplay, playing recklessly with your Garm check is one of the easiest ways to lose a game. Banded Garm loses the sweeping/cleaning potential for more damage output and for more wallbreaking potential, but the lost speed really hurts it, since 317 max speed is not that good against offensive teams, and against fatter teams, than there's just a loot of place to add a Garm check, sometimes more than one check can be used. The rocks weakness also doesn't help.I dont know how soon its appropriate to talk about the next ban but darm is just fucking stupid. The scarf set easily sweeps teams after some chip dmg unless you are running a whole bunch of fat mons but if ur using a fat team you get 6-0 by the band set. The instant power it gets is just dumb and it needs to go ASAP.
e: i forgot to mention this stupid ass flinch chance if god forbid you are actually able to take a hit
Just want to point out that Conkeldurr does not have more bulk then obstagoon, even though he LOOKS more beefy. His special defense is much lower, and his defense is BARELY higher.Conkeldurr also has a form of priority in mach punch and more bulk and utility in defog... knock off is a good weapon in Goon instead..