Metagame SS OU Metagame Discussion v2 [Usage Stats in post #581]

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You're forgetting to take into account Gorrila Tactics, which is currently bugged on the calc.

+1 252 Atk Darmanitan-Galar Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg: 192-226 (48.7 - 57.3%) -- 94.1% chance to 2HKO

+1 252 Atk Choice Band Darmanitan-Galar Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg: 286-338 (72.5 - 85.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

(+1 represents GT)

As you can see, Avalugg is definitely not a check to Darm-Galar, since it gets easily 2HKOd by both of its most popular sets as of now. Sure the opponent has to get some predictions right in order to really take advantage of this, and Avalugg can OHKO back with Body Press, but Avalugg not only can't switch in without fear of getting Flare Blitzed, it also has to find time to recover against something else on the opponent's team unless you want your Avalugg to be potential death fodder.
I used Strength Sap Jellicent a lot to check G-Darm and I feel like it's probably the best check for this broken mon. Jellicent resists both Icicle Crash and Flare Blitz and do not take much from Earthquake, it still get 2HKOed by CB Earthquake but I never saw them lock into it much.

Edit : I forgot, Marvel Scale Flame Orb boosted Milotic is a dumb check to G-Darm, but accessing Strength Sap and Water Absorb makes Jellicent way more reliable than Milotic imo.
 
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I used Strength Sap Jellicent a lot to check G-Darm and I feel like it's probably the best check for this broken mon. Jellicent resists both Icicle Crash and Flare Blitz and do not take much from Earthquake, it still get 2HKOed by CB Earthquake but I never saw them lock into it much.
Same, Jellicent has been one of my favorite mons to use in Gen 8 because of its ability to check both Garm and Dracovish in the same match and somehow not get overwhelmed.
I personally like Sitrus Berry Jellicent, because it can live 2 Earthquakes from Banded Jolly Garm(unless it gets two extremely high rolls), and gives Dracovish a harder time killing it with Crunch, and the lack of lefties doesn't hurt it that much because Strength Sap is dummy broken.
 
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Same, Jellicent has been one of my favorite mons to use in Gen 8 because of its ability to check both Garm and Dracovish in the same match and somehow not get overwhelmed.
I personally like Sitrus Berry Jellicent, because it can live 2 Earthquakes from Banded Jolly Garm(unless it gets two extremely high rolls), and gives Dracovish a harder time killing it with Crunch.
Never thought about the sitrus berry but that's a good option indeed, even if you're losing some staying power throughout the game once it has been used, I'm gonna try this out !
And yeah Strength Sap is definitely broken at moment in my opinion...
 

Yung Dramps

awesome gaming
I personally prefer Colbur Berry on Jellicent as it makes it less vulnerable to Knock Off and still does Sitrus' job of letting it wall Dracovish better.

Fully agree with this discussion, Jellicent is amazing in the current meta. An underrated option for it is Taunt, which can check non-Power Whip Ferrothorn, and along with Scald + Hex can do a number to fat stuff in general while still retaining Strength Sap for those sweet walling capabilities.
 
I wonder though what will happen to the viability of mons like Seismitoad if Dracovish gets the boot? It's good to see Dynamax gone but Draco and G.Darm didn't rely on it. There were a terror before and I feel they'll be even more of a terror now that you can't dynamax to soak up damage with the extra HP.
 
I personally prefer Colbur Berry on Jellicent as it makes it less vulnerable to Knock Off and still does Sitrus' job of letting it wall Dracovish better.

Fully agree with this discussion, Jellicent is amazing in the current meta. An underrated option for it is Taunt, which can check non-Power Whip Ferrothorn, and along with Scald + Hex can do a number to fat stuff in general while still retaining Strength Sap for those sweet walling capabilities.
Fully agreed, Taunt is an amazing option, I personnaly play Jellicent with one and only attack and went for Will-O-Wisp instead the second one.
 
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I wonder though what will happen to the viability of mons like Seismitoad if Dracovish gets the boot? It's good to see Dynamax gone but Draco and G.Darm didn't rely on it. There were a terror before and I feel they'll be even more of a terror now that you can't dynamax to soak up damage with the extra HP.
Seismitoad will most likely still be pretty good, since it hard checks both OU Rotoms, and since a water and eletric immunity is always nice on your team. But surely banning Dracovish will hurt not only Toad's viability, but all water absorbers that are now being used because of the threat that is The Fish.
 
Seismitoad will most likely still be pretty good, since it hard checks both OU Rotoms, and since a water and eletric immunity is always nice on your team. But surely banning Dracovish will hurt not only Toad's viability, but all water absorbers that are now being used because of the threat that is The Fish.
Seismitoad is also a pretty solid answer to Dracozolt on the ladder, and now that Swampert's gone it's probably the best Water/Ground type of the game because it still has Toxic and Stealth Rock. I don't know about Seismitoad then, but you're probably right about the other Water Absorbers, since Toxapex will perform better than them if their talent is not needed anymore.
 

Jordy

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I've been playing around with various team structures that avoid using Seismitoad, as I got bored of how easy it was to fit on teams, and have found Jellicent to be a great addition to such teams.

Something that I don't think people are talking about enough is running Night Shade on Jellicent, though. I absolutely believe that this is the best attacking move you can run on Jellicent; it reliably breaks Corviknight's Substitute and is just good consistent damage output in general. In comparison, Scald doesn't really provide useful coverage right now and is honestly a bit redundant alongside Will-O-Wisp in my opinion, and while a boosted Hex from Jellicent is incredibly strong, I don't think that that quite outweighs the consistency of Night Shade.

For whatever it's worth, I also think Jellicent should always run Taunt right now; being able to shut down Toxapex reliably, while also handling Corviknight a little better is incredibly valuable.
 
I've been playing around with various team structures that avoid using Seismitoad, as I got bored of how easy it was to fit on teams, and have found Jellicent to be a great addition to such teams.

Something that I don't think people are talking about enough is running Night Shade on Jellicent, though. I absolutely believe that this is the best attacking move you can run on Jellicent; it reliably breaks Corviknight's Substitute and is just good consistent damage output in general. In comparison, Scald doesn't really provide useful coverage right now and is honestly a bit redundant alongside Will-O-Wisp in my opinion, and while a boosted Hex from Jellicent is incredibly strong, I don't think that that quite outweighs the consistency of Night Shade.

For whatever it's worth, I also think Jellicent should always run Taunt right now; being able to shut down Toxapex reliably, while also handling Corviknight a little better is incredibly valuable.
I've been having fun with Jellicent too running Night Shade, Taunt, WoW and Strength Sap. Breaking those subs are vital since things will snowball quick otherwise. It's pretty hilarious against Ferrothorn when not packing Power Whip and also annoys the hell out of Gyarados. Taunt also helps stop Gyarados from trying to Dragon Dance. Pretty good check to Cinderace as well resisting most of it's usual moves and even the Sucker Punch versions can just be stalled out.
 
I didn't even know it could learn it, and this is, indeed, a great option. If I remember right, neither unboosted Hex, neither Scald breaks the Substitute from Gyarados too, which won't be the case anymore once running Night Shade.
 
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I don't think that whether Ferrothorn's running Power Whip or not actually matters. Jellicent will be able to burn Ferrothorn regardless, after which Power Whip does no very significant damage anyways.
True I've just had bad luck with crit Whips. Bonus it's also shut down some opposing Excadrills while I was playing during the dynamax meta.
 

Yung Dramps

awesome gaming
Ok, so now that we've thoroughly discussed Jellicent, let's move on to something a little bit more memey. Introducing: RainZard.


Charizard @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hurricane
- Fire Blast
- Weather Ball
- Will-O-Wisp

With the additions of Hurricane and Weather Ball this gen, Charizard can serve a role on rain teams similar to what Moltres has been able to do in certain generations. It's a cool mon for the playstyle to have against stuff like Corviknight and Ferrothorn, and Hurricane + Weather Ball can do big huge damage, especially for blindsiding Excadrill. 100 speed is actually really good in this meta, in particular outspeeding Band Darm and Mold Breaker Excadrill. Again, it's kinda memey and probably better on paper than in practice, but idk it's worth a try I guess.
 

Finchinator

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I do not know that rain teams can afford to fit another Pokemon with virtually no defensive potential that does not at least get the swift swim boost or have high natural base speed in order to function as a revenge killer/sweeper itself. I feel like you may be best off sticking within the confines of conventionality for rain teams atm. Charizard offers a lot of unique things, but I feel like it may be best off in lower tiers.
 
As a good amount of you know, I was posting a lot of sets in the first metagame thread of unconventional Pokemon who had genuine niches in OU (bar Avalugg, that ended up being a meme). So in this post-dynamax metagame I wanted to revisit some of these Pokemon that I posted in the first thread, and see how they did in the Post-Dynamax metagame along with giving a brief summary as to why they're better or why they're worse. I will also be linking all of the original posts from the older thread if you want to look at the more detailed analysis of these Pokemon.

So, let's begin! (I won't be analyzing any of the Trick Room Pokemon that I mentioned, those sets still stand on their own without much if any change, but if you want to read the Trick Room sets, here's the link - https://www.smogon.com/forums/threa...tats-in-post-944.3656245/page-35#post-8299735).

Shedinja

Shedinja @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Wonder Guard
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- X-Scissor
- Protect
- Will-O-Wisp
- Shadow Sneak​

Original Shedinja Post: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threa...tats-in-post-944.3656245/page-32#post-8298467

Dynamax Gone, Better, Worse, or Unaffected?: Better

Post-Dynamax Verdict Explanation:

This Pokemon got even better with Dynamax leaving. Pokemon such as Fishious Rend Dracovish and Icicle Crash Darmanitan can no longer use Dynamax to break their choice locks and defeat Shedinja, making it a more solid switch in for those Pokemon. A lack of Pursuit being in the game and the far lowered distribution of Knock Off along with Heavy-Duty Boots being added were an absolutely godsend to this Pokemon. To this day, Shedinja remains the only Pokemon that can reliably without fail switch in on both Fishious Rend and Icicle Crash without worry, it also handles a good amount of other Pokemon who don't have the necessary coverage moves to beat Shedinja. Using it simple, bring it in on a predicted move (especially a Pokemon that is most likely Choiced), spread status and then whittle your opponent's team down. Heavy-Duty Boots means that Shedinja doesn't have to worry about hazards, and it functions the best on rain teams that can cancel out Sandstorm and Hail weather that would put an end to Shedinja's tomfoolery. STAB Shadow Sneak is for dealing with weakened Dragapult, and the various other Ghost and Psychic types currently infesting the metagame. Also, Shedinja is a great answer to certain dittos and set up sweepers who don't have the proper coverage. All in all? A unique late game cleaner / wincon that can decimate unprepared teams.

Silvally-Steel

Silvally-Steel @ Steel Memory
Ability: RKS System
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe or 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe (Depending on whether or not I'm running Thunder Wave or Flamethrower)
Jolly / Naive Nature (Depending on whether or not I'm running Thunder Wave or Flamethrower)
- Multi-Attack
- Parting Shot
- Crunch
- Thunder Wave / Flamethrower​

Original Silvally-Steel Post: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threa...tats-in-post-944.3656245/page-50#post-8314853

Dynamax Gone, Better, Worse, or Unaffected?: Unaffected (Very slightly better)

Post-Dynamax Verdict Explanation:

Silvally-Steel's main usage in OU is being a great answer to the multitude of Fairies like Clefable, Togekiss and Grimmsnarl running around due to its access to a newly buffed base 120 + STAB boosted Steel Multi-Attack, along with very solid base 95 stats all across the board (made more impressive thanks to Dexit nuking a lot of its answers), and one of the fastest (and only Steel type) to gain access to the coveted Parting Shot move in conjunction with a massive movepool and specific advantages over Steel types such as Corviknight, Excadrill, and Bisharp. Dynamax leaving really didn't change this niche. The only things that changed for Silvally-Steel are that Faeries can no longer dynamax making it easier to damage them, and there's no more Max Airstream for Togekiss to abuse to get a speed up over Silvally-Steel. It still functions just as it did with Dynamax there, only its life is slightly easier now.

Vaporeon

Vaporeon @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Wish
- Scald
- Haze / Yawn
- Protect​

Original Vaporeon Post: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threa...tats-in-post-944.3656245/page-49#post-8313286

Dynamax Gone, Better, Worse, or Unaffected?: Better

Post-Dynamax Verdict Explanation:

Vaporeon has a unique niche over Pokemon like Toxapex due to having the highest Wish HP pass in regional OU (Base 130 HP), it is immune to Dracovish's Fishious Rend, Neutral to Excadrill's Earthquake, and it also has access to both Haze AND Yawn (the latter being a move Toxapex would kill for). Vaporeon got better because (like with Shedinja), Choice locked Pokemon can no longer break their Choice locks with Dynamax. Meaning Pokemon like Dracovish have to switch out, giving you the upper hand. Otherwise it functions the same as before. Spread burns, whittle your opponent down. heal up your team, etc etc.

There are a few other Pokemon I posted, but I need more time to test to conclude whether or not the metagame was beneficial to them. I'm also testing out some other Pokemon that have been mostly ignored as well. I really am enjoying the Post-Dynamax Regional OU metagame quite a bit. While I am going to miss the massive ubiquity of saying (Stall fucking sucks, Dynamax says fuck your Stall mons) every five minutes, I know it's best for the metagame.
 
The fact so many mons that have rarely seen competitive use like flareon is mind boggling. The new meta with dynamax gone is going to be so creative. Personally I can't wait to use mons like Froslass, gallade, flygon, gardevoir, milotic and gourgeist. As time passes we'll see many niche or tech based teams, and that's pretty exciting
 
Alright you know what, I'm too hyped about this. It's time to make another post focusing on my absolute favorite playstyle in Generation 8 regional OU.

R A I N


From the threatening amount of new sweepers introduced to the absolute utility and in some cases safety that rain brings, it's not hard to see why so many people are using this playstyle (*cough* Dracovish *cough*), but I wanted to take a moment to focus on Pokemon who benefit from rain that received very specialized buffs in this new generation that have a chance at life under this playstyle. These Pokemon could have benefitted either in the form of access to new moves, dexit removing a lot of options to handle it, or just having the metagame be kind to it. I will also be mentioning other options for the Pokemon to use that aren't on the primary sets. Let's dive on in!

Dhelmise

Dhelmise @ Choice Band
Ability: Steelworker
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Anchor Shot
- Liquidation
- Power Whip
- Switcheroo / Earthquake / Shadow Claw / Phantom Force / Rock Slide​

Dhelmise (A Grass / Ghost type Pokemon) somehow got access to the coveted Water type Physical move - Liquidation. With a base Attack stat of 131, a Choice Band, and under rain, this hits like an absolute truck. Steelworker essentially gives Anchor Shot (a base 80 power trapping move) STAB, while also preventing double switching tactics and allowing you to regain momentum from an opponent's switch-in. STAB Power Whip also handles numerous would-be switch ins. The last moveslot is mostly filler depending on the specific coverage needs of your team, tailor it to how you need it. Unless you feel like running Switcheroo to get rid of your Choice Band.

Dhelmise also has access to a few new tools not mentioned in this set, and also buffed tools as well. Dhelmise has access to the newly buffed Rapid Spin to take care of hazards and speed creep certain bulky mons with the +1 boost. Along with this, Dhelmise has access to both Swords Dance (for a boosting set under Trick Room), and Switcheroo for tricking an item onto a specific Pokemon. So why would you use Dhelmise right now? Here's the tl;dr simplified version.

  • Access to new tools such as Liquidation, Switcheroo, and a buffed Rapid Spin
  • Pursuit is no longer in the game, and Knock Off has vastly lowered distribution
  • 70 / 100 / 90 Bulk along with 131 Base Attack is much more impressive in this regional metagame, many of the options used to handle it were nuked with Dexit
  • Access to a third STAB with a high powered trapping move is absolutely critical in this fast paced metagame.

Jolteon

Jolteon @ Life Orb
Ability: Volt Absorb
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Thunder
- Weather Ball
- Shadow Ball
- Volt Switch​

Jolteon started off strong in old generations, but slowly started to lose out to different picks over the years due to being outclassed. With Dexit removing a lot of the things that outclass it, 110 Special Attack and 130 Speed are looking far better this generation. Under Rain, perfect accuracy STAB Thunder hits like an absolute truck, and having a 30% paralysis chance is also a great option. Shadow Ball as coverage is even better right now than previously due to the rampant Ghost types and Psychic types running around the tier, and access to Weather Ball allows Jolteon to nuke options under rain that it normally wouldn't be able to handle such as Excadrill. Life Orb is the best set for Jolteon due to the ubiquity of Ground types looking to get a free switch-in under rain, as the ability to switch from Thunder to Weather Ball is crucial for this niche to work. Volt Switch is great for keeping up momentum as well. Having a Bolt Beak immunity is wonderful too.

  • Access to 100 BP Water move in Weather Ball and Shadow Ball coverage is great in the current meta.
  • 110 Special Attack and 130 Speed is a lot more impressive in the OU Regional Dex metagame.
  • Dexit nuked a lot of the options that outclassed it, and a lot of the options that handled it.

Noivern

Noivern @ Expert Belt
Ability: Infiltrator
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Hurricane
- Shadow Ball
- Super Fang / U-Turn (Thanks Zukrad for other set options)​

Now you're probably thinking, why use Noivern when Dragapult exists? Both have Infiltrator, and Dragapult has a 3 point SpA edge over Noivern. The answer is simple. Noivern has access to a slew of unique tools that Dragapult doesn't get including STAB Hurricane (never missing under Rain), utility in Super Fang, U-Turn, Taunt, and Defog, and it isn't weak to Ghost type moves (while still being able to nail them super effectively with access to Shadow Ball). Also Noivern isn't affected by Stick Webs (Thanks qways ) Super Fang in particular is great for wearing down Special walls that Dragapult or others wouldn't be able to wear down otherwise (Super Fang removes 50% of a Pokemon's HP). Noivern also has a bevy of other support options and some additional offensive options that will be listed below.

  • Access to STAB Hurricane that never misses under Rain and ignores screens and subs with Infiltrator.
  • Immune to Sticky Webs unlike Dragapult who is slowed down
  • Access to Super Fang to wear down Special walls that other Special attackers can't handle.
  • Access to various other utility options like Taunt, U-Turn, Tailwind, and Defog.
  • Neutral to Ghost type attacks while being able to hit them super effectively.
  • 123 is a fantastic speed tier.

What are you waiting for? Go try out some of these Pokemon! Let the rain wash over you!
 
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Ok, so now that we've thoroughly discussed Jellicent, let's move on to something a little bit more memey. Introducing: RainZard.


Charizard @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hurricane
- Fire Blast
- Weather Ball
- Will-O-Wisp

With the additions of Hurricane and Weather Ball this gen, Charizard can serve a role on rain teams similar to what Moltres has been able to do in certain generations. It's a cool mon for the playstyle to have against stuff like Corviknight and Ferrothorn, and Hurricane + Weather Ball can do big huge damage, especially for blindsiding Excadrill. 100 speed is actually really good in this meta, in particular outspeeding Band Darm and Mold Breaker Excadrill. Again, it's kinda memey and probably better on paper than in practice, but idk it's worth a try I guess.
If you run Utility Umbrella instead of boots, your Fire Blast won't be powered down by Rain. I have been trying this set with FB instead of WB with mild success. Is ok when it can do something, but most of the time is death fodder or doesn't get a chance to attack before Barraskewda 6-0s my opponent

Alright you know what, I'm too hyped about this. It's time to make another post focusing on my absolute favorite playstyle in Generation 8 regional OU.

R A I N



From the threatening amount of new sweepers introduced to the absolute utility and in some cases safety that rain brings, it's not hard to see why so many people are using this playstyle (*cough* Dracovish *cough*), but I wanted to take a moment to focus on Pokemon who benefit from rain that received very specialized buffs in this new generation that have a chance at life under this playstyle. These Pokemon could have benefitted either in the form of access to new moves, dexit removing a lot of options to handle it, or just having the metagame be kind to it. I will also be mentioning other options for the Pokemon to use that aren't on the primary sets. Let's dive on in!

Dhelmise

Dhelmise @ Choice Band
Ability: Steelworker
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Anchor Shot
- Liquidation
- Power Whip
- Switcheroo / Earthquake / Shadow Claw / Phantom Force / Rock Slide

Dhelmise (A Grass / Ghost type Pokemon) somehow got access to the coveted Water type Physical move - Liquidation. With a base Attack stat of 131, a Choice Band, and under rain, this hits like an absolute truck. Steelworker essentially gives Anchor Shot (a base 80 power trapping move) STAB, while also preventing double switching tactics and allowing you to regain momentum from an opponent's switch-in. STAB Power Whip also handles numerous would-be switch ins. The last moveslot is mostly filler depending on the specific coverage needs of your team, tailor it to how you need it. Unless you feel like running Switcheroo to get rid of your Choice Band.

Dhelmise also has access to a few new tools not mentioned in this set, and also buffed tools as well. Dhelmise has access to the newly buffed Rapid Spin to take care of hazards and speed creep certain bulky mons with the +1 boost. Along with this, Dhelmise has access to both Swords Dance (for a boosting set under Trick Room), and Switcheroo for tricking an item onto a specific Pokemon. So why would you use Dhelmise right now? Here's the tl;dr simplified version.

  • Access to new tools such as Liquidation, Switcheroo, and a buffed Rapid Spin
  • Pursuit is no longer in the game, and Knock Off has vastly lowered distribution
  • 70 / 100 / 90 Bulk along with 131 Base Attack is much more impressive in this regional metagame, many of the options used to handle it were nuked with Dexit
  • Access to a third STAB with a high powered trapping move is absolutely critical in this fast paced metagame.

Jolteon

Jolteon @ Life Orb
Ability: Volt Absorb
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Thunder
- Weather Ball
- Shadow Ball
- Volt Switch

Jolteon started off strong in old generations, but slowly started to lose out to different picks over the years due to being outclassed. With Dexit removing a lot of the things that outclass it, 110 Special Attack and 130 Speed are looking far better this generation. Under Rain, perfect accuracy STAB Thunder hits like an absolute truck, and having a 30% paralysis chance is also a great option. Shadow Ball as coverage is even better right now than previously due to the rampant Ghost types and Psychic types running around the tier, and access to Weather Ball allows Jolteon to nuke options under rain that it normally wouldn't be able to handle such as Excadrill. Life Orb is the best set for Jolteon due to the ubiquity of Ground types looking to get a free switch-in under rain, as the ability to switch from Thunder to Weather Ball is crucial for this niche to work. Volt Switch is great for keeping up momentum as well. Having a Bolt Beak immunity is wonderful too.

  • Access to 100 BP Water move in Weather Ball and Shadow Ball coverage is great in the current meta.
  • 110 Special Attack and 130 Speed is a lot more impressive in the OU Regional Dex metagame.
  • Dexit nuked a lot of the options that outclassed it, and a lot of the options that handled it.

Noivern

Noivern @ Expert Belt
Ability: Infiltrator
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Hurricane
- Shadow Ball
- Super Fang

Now you're probably thinking, why use Noivern when Dragapult exists? Both have Infiltrator, and Dragapult has a 3 point SpA edge over Noivern. The answer is simple. Noivern has access to a slew of unique tools that Dragapult doesn't get including STAB Hurricane (never missing under Rain), utility in Super Fang, U-Turn, Taunt, and Defog, and it isn't weak to Ghost type moves (while still being able to nail them super effectively with access to Shadow Ball). Super Fang in particular is great for wearing down Special walls that Dragapult or others wouldn't be able to wear down otherwise (Super Fang removes 50% of a Pokemon's HP). Noivern also has a bevy of other support options and some additional offensive options that will be listed below.

  • Access to STAB Hurricane that never misses under Rain and ignores screens and subs with Infiltrator.
  • Access to Super Fang to wear down Special walls that other Special attackers can't handle.
  • Access to various other utility options like Taunt, U-Turn, Tailwind, and Defog.
  • Neutral to Ghost type attacks while being able to hit them super effectively.
  • 123 is a fantastic speed tier.

What are you waiting for? Go try out some of these Pokemon! Let the rain wash over you!
Noivern is legit cool in rain, I used it a lot in prebank gen 6, until Tornadus-T replaced it permanently. Now that Tornadus isn't avaliable, maybe it i'll have a justified niche.

Noivern @ Choice Specs
Ability: Infiltrator
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Hurricane
- Focus Blast/Fire Blast
- U-turn

I don't see the value of Super Fang or Shadow Ball on it tho. If you want to run ShadowBall just run Dragapult
 
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Yung Dramps

awesome gaming
If you run Utility Umbrella instead of boots, your Fire Blast won't be powered down by Rain. I have been trying this set with FB instead of WB with mild success. Is ok when it can do something, but most of the time is death fodder or doesn't get a chance to attack before Barraskewda 6-0s my opponent



Noivern is legit cool in rain, I used it a lot in prebank gen 6, until Tornadus-T replaced it permanently. Now that Tornadus isn't avaliable, maybe it i'll have a justified niche.

Noivern @ Choice Specs
Ability: Infiltrator
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Hurricane
- Focus Blast/Fire Blast/Thunder
- U-turn

I don't see the value of Super Fang or Shadow Ball on it tho. If you want to run ShadowBall just run Dragapult
Utility Umbrella sounds cool, but wouldn't that also prevent Charizard from getting the Weather Ball and Hurricane buffs under rain? Or am I misunderstanding how it works
 
Following the Charizard discussion, the only thing I have to say is that if I ever try it on Rain, I wouldn,t use gay items like Boots or Umbrella and would just run Specs to do actual damage, protecting him from hazards with some other defoguer/spinner. Moltres was a good Specs user in Rain for 3 gens, Charizard is weaker than Moltres, but the Meta is also weaker in general. In any case, I don,t see the point of running offensive Heavy Duty Boots Mons, unless they have some really good set-up move ( like Frosmoth or Volcarona if it existed in Galar) or use some suport roler ( like Cinderace with Court Change). Leave that item for Mandibuzz and hazard-weak removers.
 
First off, Gyarados took a hit from losing access to set rain and boost speed by itself.
Appletun resists EQ so there was also no need to include that calc.
252 Atk Darmanitan-Galar Icicle Crash vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Thick Fat Appletun: 244-292 (57.5 - 68.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
GDarm 2hko's even w/ Thicc Fat
252 Atk Choice Band Weavile Icicle Crash vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Thick Fat Appletun: 328-388 (77.3 - 91.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Weavile also 2HKO'S
88 Atk Avalugg Avalanche vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Thick Fat Appletun: 268-316 (63.2 - 74.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Hell, even Avalugg 2hko's it.
Yes, it has a niche w/ access to recover and able to wear down stuff that would normally wall it(which is like 3/4 of the metagame) w/ Apple Acid but its bulk is mediocre at best and it just falls flat with a limited movepool and being prone to PP stalling (which I definitely see Corviknight abusing).
The calc currently doesn't take the boost from Gorilla Tactics into account. A more accurate calc would be:

252 Atk Darmanitan-Galar Icicle Crash vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Thick Fat Appletun: 372-436 (87.7 - 102.8%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO

Until they fix Gorilla Tactics, it's better to remove Darmanitan's ability entirely and then calc it at +1 Attack.
The thing whit Appletun isnt good again stab ice moves, expecialy for g-darm and weavile. but again the others is pretty decent. He is not ferro but if flareon has a niche why not Appletun?
 
Noivern
I've actually been playing around with Noivern as well:
:sm/noivern:
Noivern @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Infiltrator
EVs: 252 HP / 80 Def / 120 SpA / 56 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Draco Meteor
- Roost
- Taunt
- Flamethrower/Defog

Noivern is an excellent choice for more defensive builds that struggle with mons such as SubNP Hydreigon and SubBU Corviknight. The Special Attack is meant to 2HKO Ferrothorn with Flamethrower, Speed is for Timid Hydreigon, Health and Def and filler. Taunt shuts down shit like Pex, Toad, G-Corsola, and others. If forgoing FT, keep 92 EVs in Special Attack to guarantee the OHKO on 4 SpDef Hydreigon.

I've also done a shit ton of theorycrafting for the Eeveelutions after seeing the first post.
:sm/Vaporeon:
Vaporeon @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 196 Def / 24 SpA / 16 SpD / 20 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Wish
- Protect
- Yawn/Haze

24 Special Attack always kills 4 SpDef Rotom-H after rocks. 20 Speed is for uninvested Corviknight. 16 SpDef guarantees the 3HKO from Modest Specs Dragapult after rocks. I'm not sure how Vaporeon will fare in the long run. Sure it's bulky af, but it is overly passive. Most likely a niche pick once the new meta settles. It certainly has merits in stopping the circumcised fish and Scarf G-Darm, but faces stiff competition from Seismitoad, which has rocks, and Milotic which has one turn recovery.

252+ SpA Choice Specs Dragapult Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 16 SpD Vaporeon: 184-217 (39.6 - 46.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
24 SpA Vaporeon Scald vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Rotom-H: 182-216 (75.5 - 89.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

:sm/flareon:
Flareon @ Heavy-Duty Boots/Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 24 Def / 212 SpD / 20 Spe
Careful Nature
- Wish
- Protect
- Will-O-Wisp
- Flare Blitz

The Defense is for always living LO Hatterene's Psyshock. The Special Defense is for living Modest Specs Pult's Draco Meteor after rocks (if running Leftovers). The Speed is, again, for uninvested Corviknight. You could invest 56 EVs into attack instead of SpDef if you really wanted to, but the extra bulk seems more important and it doesn't hit any benchmarks that I am aware of. It seems almost chimerical that FLAREON of all mons would be remotely viable after spending the past five years seeing it on the lower ladder and explaining to people irl how it was dogshit; however, it may, just maybe, have a chance at being a viable niche pick. Sure Centiscorch will probably be the better bulky Fire-type Clef answer on more offensive teams, but Flareon might be useful on more defensive builds. Only time will tell.

252+ SpA Choice Specs Dragapult Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 156+ SpD Flareon: 211-250 (63.1 - 74.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock this is only somewhat important if you invest 56 EVs into Attack
252+ SpA Life Orb Hatterene Psyshock vs. 252 HP / 24 Def Flareon: 282-333 (84.4 - 99.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Finally,
:sm/sylveon:
Sylveon @ Leftovers
Ability: Pixilate
EVs: 252 HP / 20 Def / 52 SpA / 140 SpD / 44 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hyper Voice
- Wish
- Protect
- Mystical Fire/Calm Mind/Yawn

Defense is for living Adamant Haxorus' Poison Jab after rocks. The Special Attack is for 2HKOing Duraludon with Hyper Voice after rocks and lefties. The Speed is for Pelipper (I like speedcreeping OK!). Sylveon still has its merits over Unaware Clef even if it were released, mainly the ability to OHKO Hydregion through sub and superior special bulk for Specs Dragapult. It definitely will be the best Eeveelution in the coming meta.

52 SpA Pixilate Sylveon Hyper Voice vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Duraludon: 172-204 (50 - 59.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Mold Breaker Haxorus Poison Jab vs. 252 HP / 20 Def Sylveon: 290-342 (73.6 - 86.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
Thank you all for reading this long ass post! Some of the sets could be further optimized, but this is the best that I can do.

EDIT: Cleared up some Flareon info
 
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