If the Hawks don't win game 7, I am going to be devastated.
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The Everything NHL Thread
- Thread starter Jackal
- Start date
Just watched Barry Trotz's press conference. Really happy for the guy finally winning a series, but with the way he's talking about the franchise needing this series win you'd think they won the cup. Expecting them to fold in round 2 to whichever division winner they end up having to play; think they're a little too high for where they got. That's kind of okay, though. Big step for them. As a division rival we get stuck seeing a lot of them in Detroit and unlike Columbus I think it's a franchise most of us in Detroit(and Chicago, from what I've read) respect a lot. Easy to feel good about.
If Los Angeles loses and Vancouver wins, I would suggest that Nashville has a pretty good chance against them. From what I know about Nashville, they play a rather tight checking more defensive style and have a few notable trolls on their team to piss people off. This is the exact formula I'd expect to give Vancouver issues. Kinda like Chicago except that Chicago is more of a "run and gun" style IIRC. Correct me if I'm wrong on that stuff, I don't get as many chances to observe central division directly as I would like.
soft euros
Which translates to fuck all. You didn't even watch most of the game most likely if that's your response.
In Game 4 and 5, the Canucks were inexcusable. They were just fucking disgustingly horrible, playing like the Flames in most instances. I never made excuses for them there (and if I did, I apologize). Their defense was disgusting, and Luongo looked pretty weak and shaky out there. Game 6 was the game that they turned it around, and if you had actually watched the game (Bickell's elbow, Edler getting slewfooted by Brouwer, countless slashes by Toews, countless trips), then you would've have thought that the officiating was around NHL standards (aka, fucking horrible). The Canucks were on ice, and were out on full force. Game 6 was a great game except for those officiating gaffs, and both teams looked sharp out there today. If you had actually watched the game, you would see why Canucks fans should be feeling optimistic for Game 7 and that the Canucks, if they played like they did in Game 6, will match well with the Hawks.
And Synre, the thought of that made me cringe.
Erm ok I'm assuming you haven't seen any of the games. Game 1, Luongo was great, Game 2, he was mediocre but ended up hanging on barely for a win. Game 3 was close because Luongo was very good. But if you want to win FOUR games, you can't play like he did in the last 2 and the OT of Game 6. They played well in Game 6 except Luongo imo, who made a couple of decent saves but was shaky on many of them, coughing up rebounds, looking nervous, etc. Hence why I don't have any faith in him. Vezina finalist gives up 11 goals on 53 shots in the last 3 games? No matter how spectacular he was in the beginning of this series/season, that is unacceptable.
Also as someone who did "watch the game" it's not like the Canucks didn't get away with any calls either. It's the playoffs; if penalties were seriously dangerous to players or influenced scoring chances they normally got called and that was pretty much it. Didn't have any issues with Game 6's officiating. Only thing I think are countless are excuses, though. Shouldn't you guys wait till AFTER you lose game 7 to blame everyone but the Canucks?
I woke today to have it reaffirmed for me that everyone related to the NHL is incompetent. No Visnovsky nomination for the Norris? Really? I realize he's not much of a PKer but he's defensively responsible at even strength and won the defenseman points race by a landslide -- he's a hell of a lot better candidate than Mike Green was the years he was nominated. He'd have been my frontrunner for winner, even, so this snub is... something else. Perhaps the voters really are biased against the West Coast after all, with those mean teams playing games after the voters' bed times. I guess without him there I'd vote for Lidstrom just because he plays against dramatically better competition than Chara or Weber does(which I guess is what we're going on if offensive production doesn't matter...). see link: http://www.behindthenet.ca/nhl_stat...0+1+3+5+4+6+7+8+11+12+13+14+15+16+17+18+19+20. I don't think Chara deserves the Norris with the obvious Vezina winner behind him because I think that was more a product of Thomas than of Chara, and hockey media hates it some Nashville... though Weber would be a good pick too, I think, in spite of the fact he had a weak offensive season until the halfway point. Really should be Vishnovsky/Weber/Lidstrom, though.
The bigger complaint: why the FUCK is Richards not suspended? I would be OK with this if he had actually gotten the major+misconduct like he should have LAST game, but instead he got a joke minor and came back and had primary assists on the tying and winning goals. There was clearly basically no punishment there. So to me it seemed like an obvious decision to suspend for at least one game... (and I'd have given him more than that with carry over to Round 2 or the regular season next year) but I'm not surprised the NHL did nothing, either. Worthless as always, especially when it comes to the Flyers. Sometimes I really don't understand why anyone would want to play in the NHL with player safety being as irrelevant to the brass as it is.
I woke today to have it reaffirmed for me that everyone related to the NHL is incompetent. No Visnovsky nomination for the Norris? Really? I realize he's not much of a PKer but he's defensively responsible at even strength and won the defenseman points race by a landslide -- he's a hell of a lot better candidate than Mike Green was the years he was nominated. He'd have been my frontrunner for winner, even, so this snub is... something else. Perhaps the voters really are biased against the West Coast after all, with those mean teams playing games after the voters' bed times. I guess without him there I'd vote for Lidstrom just because he plays against dramatically better competition than Chara or Weber does(which I guess is what we're going on if offensive production doesn't matter...). see link: http://www.behindthenet.ca/nhl_stat...0+1+3+5+4+6+7+8+11+12+13+14+15+16+17+18+19+20. I don't think Chara deserves the Norris with the obvious Vezina winner behind him because I think that was more a product of Thomas than of Chara, and hockey media hates it some Nashville... though Weber would be a good pick too, I think, in spite of the fact he had a weak offensive season until the halfway point. Really should be Vishnovsky/Weber/Lidstrom, though.
The bigger complaint: why the FUCK is Richards not suspended? I would be OK with this if he had actually gotten the major+misconduct like he should have LAST game, but instead he got a joke minor and came back and had primary assists on the tying and winning goals. There was clearly basically no punishment there. So to me it seemed like an obvious decision to suspend for at least one game... (and I'd have given him more than that with carry over to Round 2 or the regular season next year) but I'm not surprised the NHL did nothing, either. Worthless as always, especially when it comes to the Flyers. Sometimes I really don't understand why anyone would want to play in the NHL with player safety being as irrelevant to the brass as it is.
"Erm ok"
I didn't watch many of those games (I saw two however, which is more than what you obnoxiously assumed) but I know Luongo is a great goalie and yes, as mentionned, a Vezina finalist. The least people should do is give him the benefit of the doubt. Moreover, the Canucks wouldn't have won game 4 and 5 with any goalie ; they also need to score a few goals.
The only one that dared mentionning Schneider's awful play leading to the 2nd goal of the last game is Synre. I can only picture the comments had Luongo done that.
You don't want to be the Flyers and switch goalies on a whim, ruining everybody's confidence.
Luongo is overrated and the fact that he was nominated for the Vezina is a joke. Price has similar numbers playing for the Habs who have a lot less talent than Vancouver sure does. Remember when Luongo played for those bad Florida teams and everyone called him the "best player never to play in the playoffs". Now he has all this talent in front of him and look at what he's done in the playoffs. Nothing.
What has Price done in the playoffs?
Luongo won a gold medal at the Olympics and he isn't eliminated yet. There is still a game 7 to be played and if the Canucks win, they remain a favorite to continue on.
If Luongo is overrated, that yet still doesn't make him a bad goalie and there are many that could have been nominated for the Vezina this year. Regardless, Thomas will win that trophy and he sure struggled in the series against the Canadiens, in the first few games.
Does anybody else in this Canucks team ever get any heat?
Luongo won a gold medal at the Olympics and he isn't eliminated yet. There is still a game 7 to be played and if the Canucks win, they remain a favorite to continue on.
If Luongo is overrated, that yet still doesn't make him a bad goalie and there are many that could have been nominated for the Vezina this year. Regardless, Thomas will win that trophy and he sure struggled in the series against the Canadiens, in the first few games.
Does anybody else in this Canucks team ever get any heat?
Danny Sedin has 5 goals which is quite good for 6 games. Why should anyone give Luongo the benefit of the doubt? I gave it to him in game 5 after the blowout in game 4 thinking that he had changed, nope, another terrible loss. If anything, he needs to PROVE he can quell his demons by winning game 7. I agree that the canucks would have lost game 4 and 5 anyway, but the numbers do not lie: 11 goals on 53 shots. That number is ridiculous and no goalie should ever put up stats like that, let alone a Vezina finalist.
Scheider did indeed make 2 costly mistakes in game 6, but his saves were unreal. Luongo's saves were shaky and nerve racking. Don't think that I hate Luongo or something though. He is a great goalie but Hawks just seem to read him completely.
Scheider did indeed make 2 costly mistakes in game 6, but his saves were unreal. Luongo's saves were shaky and nerve racking. Don't think that I hate Luongo or something though. He is a great goalie but Hawks just seem to read him completely.
Daniel Sedin is 4th in playoff scoring, Roberto Luongo is 18th in GAA 14th in S% (technically one less in each but I removed Lindback's one period performance).
EDIT: Related: Price is 4th in playoff gaa while Thomas is 7th. Price is 5th in playoff S% while Thomas is again 7th. Neither have been perfect, but they've both been dramatically better than Luongo.
For comparison:
Price s% .938
Thomas s% .927
Luongo s% .879
EDIT: Related: Price is 4th in playoff gaa while Thomas is 7th. Price is 5th in playoff S% while Thomas is again 7th. Neither have been perfect, but they've both been dramatically better than Luongo.
For comparison:
Price s% .938
Thomas s% .927
Luongo s% .879
Price plays for a fringe playoff team so of course he isnt going to have much playoff success. Luongo won a gold medal mostly because he had 18 All-star skaters in front of him.
So did the other top teams in the Olympics, thanks for not relativizing properly.
I think it's pretty fair; I don't think you'd find too many people out there who aren't hopelessly blinded by loyalty to their own countries who wouldn't have said Canada had the best roster of skaters, and it wasn't even close. I'd say our roster in the US was maybe the 4th best so it's not the best comparison, but look at the two teams in the finals, for example.
Which blue line would you rather have: Doughty Keith Pronger Seabrook Niedermayer Weber and Boyle or Gleason E.Johnson J.Johnson Orpik Rafalski Suter and Whitney? Can't help but notice everyone on the left side but Seabrook has at least been nominated for a Norris and after this year likely 4 of the 6 will have one. Half of the american blueline is so valuable they switched teams over the past three years. Several of the rest of the members of the American blueline are sidekicks to vastly superior defenseman... see J.Johnson to Canadian Doughty and Suter to Canadian Weber.
Or how about the forwards: Crosby Getzlaf Heatley Bergeron Iginla Marleau Morrow Nash MRichards Perry Staal Thornton Toews or Backes Brown Callahan Drury Kane Kesler Kessel Langenrbunner Malone Parise Pavelski Ryan Stastny? A few scoring champs in the Canadian side, cup finals experience for half the group, most of them are top 20 scorers this year or last year. Perhaps the best comparison is that everyone on the Canadian team is on the first line of their NHL roster bar Bergeron and Morrow who were there for checking/penalty killing roles, whereas the entire US roster only has Kessel, Parise, Stastny, Kesler, and Kane who fulfill that requirement and Stastny will get replaced by Duchene as soon as he's ready. Also Kessel and Stastny's teams are the Toronto Maple Leafs and the Colorado Avalanche. Just saying.
Point being, much like in the Hawks/Canucks series, the team in front of Luongo was much better than the team against him, and much like in the Olympic finals it is still right down to the wire in the first round of the playoffs this year.
Which blue line would you rather have: Doughty Keith Pronger Seabrook Niedermayer Weber and Boyle or Gleason E.Johnson J.Johnson Orpik Rafalski Suter and Whitney? Can't help but notice everyone on the left side but Seabrook has at least been nominated for a Norris and after this year likely 4 of the 6 will have one. Half of the american blueline is so valuable they switched teams over the past three years. Several of the rest of the members of the American blueline are sidekicks to vastly superior defenseman... see J.Johnson to Canadian Doughty and Suter to Canadian Weber.
Or how about the forwards: Crosby Getzlaf Heatley Bergeron Iginla Marleau Morrow Nash MRichards Perry Staal Thornton Toews or Backes Brown Callahan Drury Kane Kesler Kessel Langenrbunner Malone Parise Pavelski Ryan Stastny? A few scoring champs in the Canadian side, cup finals experience for half the group, most of them are top 20 scorers this year or last year. Perhaps the best comparison is that everyone on the Canadian team is on the first line of their NHL roster bar Bergeron and Morrow who were there for checking/penalty killing roles, whereas the entire US roster only has Kessel, Parise, Stastny, Kesler, and Kane who fulfill that requirement and Stastny will get replaced by Duchene as soon as he's ready. Also Kessel and Stastny's teams are the Toronto Maple Leafs and the Colorado Avalanche. Just saying.
Point being, much like in the Hawks/Canucks series, the team in front of Luongo was much better than the team against him, and much like in the Olympic finals it is still right down to the wire in the first round of the playoffs this year.
Dear fanboy Eraddd:
Shut the fuck up, Eraddd. I am gonna rub shit all over your face if the canucks are knocked out. Good times.
That's is SUCH a non sequitur. Just because a guy plays on the best team in the world and wins a medal does not entitle him to a cup. You wanna talk about relativism? Try using relevant comparisons first. The reason he is given more shit than anyone on the canucks is because he's a little crybaby who lets EVERYTHING get to him. I love how you are ripping on price, yet the stats are clearly in his favor. Price is consistently a fantastic goaltender, Luongo is great too but isn't as emotionally disciplined as he could be.
Shut the fuck up, Eraddd. I am gonna rub shit all over your face if the canucks are knocked out. Good times.
Vineon said:
That's is SUCH a non sequitur. Just because a guy plays on the best team in the world and wins a medal does not entitle him to a cup. You wanna talk about relativism? Try using relevant comparisons first. The reason he is given more shit than anyone on the canucks is because he's a little crybaby who lets EVERYTHING get to him. I love how you are ripping on price, yet the stats are clearly in his favor. Price is consistently a fantastic goaltender, Luongo is great too but isn't as emotionally disciplined as he could be.
Sedins are a combined -13 or something like that ever since Bolland has come back. They have been next to useless since game 4. Actually, a whole bunch of Canuck forwards have put up weak numbers, like Kesler and Burrows. You definitely can't blame Luongo for the really soft play of a lot of the Vancouver team, although it is fun to blame him.
+/- is such a shitty statistic. Hypothetically you could be good half your games and absolutely shit the other half and still get a 0. It tells you nothing about how good a player is. Of bloody course Mary-Kate and Ashley would put up negative numbers when they aren't scoring. They are defensively a huge liability that's usually more than offset by massive offensive flare. Kesler is a defensive forward anyways, so against a team of tight checkers I don't expect him to light it up as much as usual. Burrows I'm a bit surprised by though.
Luongo was the make belief captain last year, was he not? He's apparently a key leader on that team. A goalie shitting the bed becomes a major chink in the armor for any teams confidence (just look at how prices solidness helps raise his team above its means sometimes) but when that goalie is also a leader, it can really jar the troops. You're absolutely right though, Vancouver sucks as a whole, there is no denying it.
Like I've said, if they can pull their shit together and stop Chicago at this point it will really show what kind of character they have as a team.
Sorry I missed this before:
You mean playing like the flames for the last 10 games of the year and the first half of the year? The flames were something like 2nd best in the league through the last half of the year and were absolute juggernauts. You are such a fanboy it's sickening, taking jabs at a team that Vancouver fans cultivated a rivalry with by acting like cunts. Get over it already.
You did make excuses:
I'm sure there were some bad calls by refs, there always are, but fanboys tend to really be biased like this. I know the Hawks are a dirty team, I've said it, but they can't call every single cheapshot. The canucks also have their share of players who aren't afraid to throw an elbow, every team has them (it's just that the hawks have more of them). Sometimes the puck just doesn't bounce your way, all that means is your team has to get its thumb out of its ass and pepper the net with quality shots at an even higher frequency.
Luongo was the make belief captain last year, was he not? He's apparently a key leader on that team. A goalie shitting the bed becomes a major chink in the armor for any teams confidence (just look at how prices solidness helps raise his team above its means sometimes) but when that goalie is also a leader, it can really jar the troops. You're absolutely right though, Vancouver sucks as a whole, there is no denying it.
Like I've said, if they can pull their shit together and stop Chicago at this point it will really show what kind of character they have as a team.
Sorry I missed this before:
You mean playing like the flames for the last 10 games of the year and the first half of the year? The flames were something like 2nd best in the league through the last half of the year and were absolute juggernauts. You are such a fanboy it's sickening, taking jabs at a team that Vancouver fans cultivated a rivalry with by acting like cunts. Get over it already.
You did make excuses:
I'm sure there were some bad calls by refs, there always are, but fanboys tend to really be biased like this. I know the Hawks are a dirty team, I've said it, but they can't call every single cheapshot. The canucks also have their share of players who aren't afraid to throw an elbow, every team has them (it's just that the hawks have more of them). Sometimes the puck just doesn't bounce your way, all that means is your team has to get its thumb out of its ass and pepper the net with quality shots at an even higher frequency.
A -13 in 3 games is bad no matter how you look at it, especially from 2 potential Hart finalists
This is coming from Synre, the guy I watched the Olympics with who shouted to whoever wanted to hear it before the tournament started that both the Swedish and Russians had a better hockey team than Canada.
I suppose now that Canada has won gold on home soil, it may be a little bit easier to claim they had the better team. Whatthefuckever seriously.
Regardless, winning this gold medal is an accomplishement and Luongo is the goalie that won it ; he can claim he's won something important, on home soil to boot.. hell it was in Vancouver. Please also keep in mind that Olympics come once every four years.
Man do you not know Price at all if you believe emotions don't get the best of him at times. Have you missed last year when he cracked under pressure after having been given every chance possible to carry the team? He's been way more consistent this year, thank god, largely because there isn't another goalie putting pressure on him.
The only thing I've said is that Price hasn't won yet because someone used him first in comparisons. If you wish to compare Luongo with a goalie that wins, actually pick one that did.
My expectations that those two teams would outperform Canada had nothing to do with the strength of their rosters(which were inferior) and everything to do with expecting Canada to choke at home(which they didn't, obviously).
I'm not really sure what your point is with some of these posts. People have posted pretty decent evidence to contradict your unwaivering faith in Luongo and you retort with stuff that is about as substantial as "nuh-uh!"
I'm not really sure what your point is with some of these posts. People have posted pretty decent evidence to contradict your unwaivering faith in Luongo and you retort with stuff that is about as substantial as "nuh-uh!"
Thats pretty much it. He was the goalie who won it. Nothing more.
Yeah that 2 week grind is so tough.
I don't recall saying that Price was a fortress of emotional solidity, I just commented that Luongo isn't as disciplined, which he isn't. What is the second paragraph even going on about? Why do you have such a hard on for Luongo? He's a great goalie and all, but seriously you need to be more objective.