And then I considered your stances on Asek and Aura and would you not only bus but come out of deepwolf mode to risk getting lynched today or tomorrow and that led to
-
Check out the relaunch of our general collection, with classic designs and new ones by our very own Pissog!
-
Welcome to Smogon! Take a moment to read the Introduction to Smogon for a run-down on everything Smogon, and make sure you take some time to read the global rules.
NOC The Mafia Invitational Redux Game Thread - GAME OVER
- Thread starter Lrr
- Start date
- Status
Asek's first big meaningful post. While finding Proph somewhat suspicious and knowing Proph is a mislynch attempts to chase Knights instead. I don't see scum ever proposing their own scumbuddy day 1 in the first real post catching up as a meaningful counter wagon to a person they know is town(ie Proph). Worth noting while he calls out Former for mason spec, he uses it as another reason to push Knights instead. Post also contains a basic call out to DLE.hawkie is bae
?
i mean the fact that nobody else except prop tries to pick up on this is pretty telling but do you have any development on this read after this? i didnt sense any agency at all in those fh posts and am wondeirng how you come to this conclusion or if ur just looking for someone to bandwagon for the sake of it
wise to know the rules of the game ur playing
what the fuck
dont talk about ur mason theories in the thread. this goes for anyone. anti town post.
mildly concerned that both koc seems willing to continue this discussion in posts afterwards
no
finally a take thats making some sense
+1
wolfy
hawkie is BAE
knights lynch was fine last game, dont misrep the situation lol. this reads like an attempted pocket
dont fully agree with this, theyre about a null atm in my read. they just seem to be floating around making filler content / gas akin to knights? will see if they kick into gear later but i dont see it at this point of le read
-y
lol what a turnaround on ms last post on proph
quoting this to refernece it in a later post ill quote i saw when i popped in last night to say i wouldnt be posting
theres literally no wagon on these people
lol
why? lol most of their posts have been gas and publicly declaring they think they caught a mason slip?
what?
like seriously what? why join any wagon if this is how you want to play? if you think hes scum vote him like lol this some hedgy ass poo poo post
lol that u vote yeti for this but not knights whos posts are all gas. i get ur supposedly tr'ing that slot but i see no reason to do so at this point
what the fuck is going in this game lol. 'im voting x but i would rather vote y' 'im scumreading z but wont vote for them' is happeing so much like wtf. put ur money where ur mouth is pussies
i wish dle elaborated on this or did anything really
why am i always the one getting highlighted fuck off. highlight some of the other idlers for once who are just playing vidya or some shit
stop downplaying ur scum game. people who downplay their scum game are super annoying, especially when theyre getting scumread. 'teehee dont vote me silly town. i cant play scum lelele' miss me with that shit. not just @ this post but the similar ones u + others have made and i assume i will see more by the time im done.
AAAAAAAND literally the same page
lol was this nomination mafia, that game was a lolzfest
(this is in repons eto koc i dont think the quore shows it) and how is koc town
once again, why am i always singled out
what if theyre both scum? prophlyxais contiually chooses to prefer engaging knights over other players itg in my read from my pov, i think it has s/s potential.
holy shit! a good posts
smogon servers are aids
refer to the proph post i said i was gonna refer to lolz
im not reading all this
what?
cbf reading anymore tbh lol
Sets up the ability to vote either Proph or Knights at the end by claiming both could be scum. Praises Former to the highest heavens(calling this day 1 shit compared to last game, which is ridiculous, last game was nothing but a memefest for the majority of it's pages till it was overtaken by Josh v MS). Null on Moody. Calls out all idlers in a single group, not indicative of handling Empoof/AG any differently from the rest.
This is a purely Town list of now deceased town. He did not bother to put a scum in here for the sake of it.
Drops Knights citing he wants to give him time, worth nothing he dropped him for the above list of purely town.
Defends AFK me in favour of damning AFK confirmed scum Empoof/AG. Take what you will from this.
Furthers his FH townread and groups him with Yeti.
Doubles down on his previous read by quoting himself and voting Empoof instead of me. Worth noting that in both cases he ignored DLE(Hitmon had already subbed for Walrein at this point so irrelevant). This also happened AFTER I made my "Oh the game started?" post.
While having dropped Knights he still doubles down on his suspicions on him and cites Texas' townread for that.(Yes the irony is not lost on me)
Includes DLE pairing him with me, while again implicating confirmed scum empoof/AG.
Calls out Moody specifically, and makes a point this is the only slot he is actively interested in talking with of those not idling at the time.
Keep Knights on a short leash still, despite again having dropped him for the day much earlier.
Again defends idle me, pushing idle scum empoof hard. This time he suggests that DLE is also more worthy to push than me.
Continued aggression despite dropping him towards Knights.
Active threat that he will push Knights seriously the next day. going through his posts and the person he engaged the most on his suspicions being Knights, I call into question how free of a pass he even gave him till now.
After having started pushing Hitmon, he specifically calls out that Hitmon highlights both me and Empoof and not DLE. Previously he had been pushing empoof over me and dle. Now that a town he is pushing goes for Empoof and Me calling us out for idling, he specifically goes away from the two of us to call out DLE. I find it doubtful he'd go after this if DLE was his scum partner, after he spent a lot of time pushing his other scum partner for this as well. He likely specifically jumped on this to point away from the group of me and Empoof towards DLE instead because it allowed him to do so by framing it as something Hitmon did and Hitmon is suspicious so therefore DLE must be suspicious while Empoof and LightWolf aren't.
Throws shade at Moody for his reply to Proph(who at this point Asek was pocketing).this is the only post you felt was worth a response?
Calls out Hitmonleet for voting me while saying he wants to lynch someone who will reveal more about the game.
From here on out AG joins the mix
Specifically calls out a reason why he is doing me first, then calls for my lynching. Both of his first ISOs end up being specifically worth lynching. MS ISO could have done to shade me without having to vote me.
Calls out Former and Texas as his next ISOs.
Former is next, this time declares no second one he is doing.
Suspect list still only includes town.
Manages to sneak in the name of everyone still alive at the end of his post. He wanted to go after Moody, but is now deciding to pick up DLE, Knights and his Buddy Asek too. He calls out his reason for not voting Former yet because of the MS situation and he wants to check my post.
Only comment on my wall is in defense of Hitmon, which he explains is because he suspects Hitmon is a mason. Uses my post to mason spec and ignores the rest of it.
Attempt at touching base with Knights, seemingly less intense than his last free card post.
Reaction to knights calling Asek out for reiterating his points.
Calls out Former for voting him based on Texas' vote.
Read list, at this point he has ISOd only me and Former from those still alive. Scum Lean on Buddy Asek and promises to ISO next. Town reads iDLE despite calling out mine, appears to be unaware of his idling. Lessens his Former ISO read to Lean scum only. Jumps Knights despite claiming to be basing his read on only a little he read of the early thread and his 4 isos, one of which was on me. Reads me positively despite his only response to me having been calling my Hitmon read into question, who he 100% town reads. Calls out Moody for hammer only.
When called out for positively reading the hand DLE had in the hammer while scum reading Moody, he defends him calling his moody read a gut one.
Instead of the promised read on his scum buddy Asek, he jumps at the chance to read DLE after Yeti called out his positive read on him, which he updates to be more wishy washy. Originally wanted to read DLE as 100% town after this, what with him never putting DLE infront of Asek after promising Asek, but the previous post that prompted this read may have made him feel like he had to update the DLE read. Still unlikely that AG and DLE are scum while Asek also is.
His claim regarding the Former read contradicts the actual Former read where he claimed that he finished the former read only after night was called, yet here he claims it was done after the hammer. Mostly calling this out because it seems like such a pointless lie to make.
Claims DLE and me aren't scum.
Is certain about my read and suggests that he'd have to look at Asek and DLE later in case he might be wrong. Worth noting the promised Asek ISO has yet to happen. also of course pushing Knights still.
Thows shade at moody.
response to my wallpost.
Asek's response to my response to his response to my wallpost. Also him answering his opinion on a me lynch, asked also by me.
After being done with answering my questions he jumps back on hitmon's ass.
He never ISOd Asek in the end, and voted him without doing so. The other persons left alive right now he didn't ISO are Moody and Knights.
Buddies me and jumps on Hitmon
Complete 180 on the DLE slot after positively reading DLE, to still town reading him with maybe a few suspicious patches, to after subbed calling out DLE for not playing like DLE.
Dodges my Mason question, regarding having them claim.
Defends himself for Moody calling out his lynch of Asek.
Suggests there is no mason in regards to my mason claim request.
Gets very heated with Knights while discussing the existance of the final mason.
Prompted by Moody, AG claims that he changed his mind on his hard Knights read. Has yet to ISO Knights.
Continues arguing with me against having mason claim.
Ignores Former's actual point of AG being overly defensive in the post quoted to talk more about mason claim asking should stop.
The two parts of his read list. First part he yet again pushes Hitmon, reads me as clear and town leans Moody who he still hasn't ISOd yet. In the second part he picks up with now purely town reading KoC who he still hasn't ISOd, is back to leaning scum on Former(Only scum read he didn't change to town from yesterday, despite in the KoC one calling out him being in general wrong yesterday as a reason for changing his read on KoC) and continuing his 180 on DLE despite town reading DLE day 3.
Reaction to Knights questioning his lynch order.
Aura exclaims that his Former and DLE reads stand even if Hitmon flips town.
Suggests a DLE flip first as an option before the hitmon flip. No mention of a Former flip.
Reply to former suggesting if DLE is scum then so am I. Defends me saying I can be still town if DLE is scum, but implies if I am scum then so is DLE. Suggests that if I flipped scum DLE is scum with me, and should be lynched instead of me. Can be read as trying to paint the DLE slot as scum if I flipped scum.
Defense against moody calling out his previous misreading of what if Asek flips post.
Defends me and himself implicating that hitmon would lose if we both flip town.
Jumps on Former, despite being okay with a DLE slot lynch previously, after his main vote claims mason, who btw had been gunning to get him lynched. The choice of voting former over DLE when Former has no chance of being lynched at this point is of note here, in light of his later suicide.
Defends his former vote to be just based on his poe order, despite previously stating why DLE was last in it and how he was willing to start with DLE, specifically in response to Former.
Last pre hammer post, response to epik over his vote.
Verdicts:
Knights: The deck is completely stacked in his favour. His whole interaction with Asek, and Asek's seeming willingness to put him aside till later yet keeping up engaging him the most(maybe a tie with Texas) and consistently calling him out. Of note is that he drops the Knights push to literally pick up pushing Empoof his partner. Everything here screams Knights isn't scum with Asek. Then we jump to AG, who never ISOd Knights, picked him up as his main wagon day 3 after suspecting but not voting Former in his ISO of former. Then unceremoniously he flips around most of his town reads day 3 to 4 under the pretense that he was wrong about everything because he was wrong about Asek, and drops KoC. KoC ends up being the person he engages with the most day 4, and KoC is a fairly big proponent in pushing him both days.
DLE: Most note worthy interactions are three cases I'd say. After Asek had been pushing Empoof consistently why defending me and DLE from time to time, he calls out Hitmon and points out how Hitmon only highlighted me and Empoof for idling but not DLE. I can't see him using this to push his iDLE buddy while directing away from Empoof who he had been pushing for most of the middle part of the day. Then there is the case of the delayed ISO, when AG promised to ISO Asek(which he never did) Yeti called out AG's DLE read, which eventually led to AG dropping the Asek read and doing DLE first. I find it highly unlikely, that even with prompting from Yeti, he specifically delays the ISO of his scum buddy to read his other scum buddy worse than previously. Third event is how AG completely flipped his read on DLE, and called his playstyle not matching his expectations of DLE, despite in his previous ISO of him while being wishy washy, still town leaning him as a whole, yet he now thinks DLE is scummy, not even for what his sub had done during the day. All those considered I find DLE being third scum extremely unlikely.
The other two didn't have big jumps out at me interactions so uh they will mostly be summaries so I can get a better overview of both to decide at the end of the verdict how it all reads together.
Moody: Asek calls him out shortly after starting his Empoof push, wanting to talk with him exlaiming that he is the person he is most interested in talking with beyond the idlers, with his previous read on him having been a null. After Moody finally posts he instantly throws shade at him for his first post being a reply to the mocking of Moody done by Proph, yet contrary to the previous post Asek does not engage him in any form beyond this. Along with Knights, he is the only unISOd by AG person left alive. AG drops the Moody ISO before even announcing it in favour of checking DLE Knights and Asek first. Never having read moody the first AG read list calls him scummy solely for the hammer. Then calls the hammer read a gut one. Asek then throws shade at Moody again for the hypocrisy of calling Asek no substance while Moody was low substance himself, Asek still hasn't talked to Moody by day 3. Asek when asked about my lynch mentions both AG and Moody, Moody specifically as someone not being discussed he'd wagon, but says he wants to lynch Hitmon for sure above anyone else. After this come day 4, AG mostly just interacts with Moody by replying to his pushes regarding AG's opinions on third parties. In his partial and full read post he town leans Moody with no explanation, neverr ISOd and never really talked about. AG lists Moody in his Moody/Knights/LW don't lynch list, still no explanation. One last interaction is AG's reaction to Moody calling out AG's previous reads on what would happen based on Asek's flips completely going against his current reads and his assurance that even if hitmon flipped town his reads would no change.
In the end he is in a bad position because of his early activity, being below everyone active, but just above chronic idlers lw/empoof/walrein/dle who were called out plenty. This left Moody with very few interactions between Asek and him. Despite calling him out to talk with moody, asek proceeded to only mock him with meaningless quotes for meh moody posts. And once specifically mentions moody together with AG while discussing if he'd lynch me, while turning the discussion towards the two then finally exclaiming he wants to lynch Hitmon first 100%. AG never engages with Moody directly, even his early scum read on moody he never engages on beyond answering one time when yeti questioned him on it, and only replies to really few accusations by moody, then despite Moody pushing him turning his read from scummy to town between the two days still not having ISOd moody. I feel that with Knights never being ISOd, and AG using DLE and sickness to not have to ISO Asek as well as his strange pocketing despite Moody pushing him hard, moody comes out fairly well in the end out of this, especially with the minimalist way Asek interacted with him, and seemingly grouping him together with AG when asked about my lynch with no prompting, a group of somewhat suspicious characters but let's lynch Hitmon first LW, the only other person pushing Hitmon beside me, Asek.
Former: Asek calls him out in his bigpost for mason spec, but uses the mason spec to push KoC more. Asek then hard TRs Former. On request reads the Former wall post and only mentions this makes former a harder TR. Asek has no further interactions with Former beyond #759 and even then previously only mentioned him in his SPECTACULAR post. AG first mentions Former in relation to reading him and Texas next, then reading him after Texas. This never happens on day 2, at first claiming he didn't finish the ISO before night was called, but later during day 4 he claims to have had it done after hammer but didn't want to post it since the lynch was called. AG calls former wishy washy in the ISO, in a wishy washy was himself ending it as a scum lean, but does not vote Former citing having to read my wall and the previous MS lynch as reasons. Asek's next interaction is calling out Former for using Texas' vote on Asek as a reason for voting Asek, this is not discussed further by Asek. AG's day 3 read list claims Former's recent post made him go down to a scum lean, despite his ISO post calling him a scum lean anyways, AG also finally puts a vote down here after refusing to vote Former previously, on Knights who he hasn't ISOd and his problem is with Knight's not being memorable in other ISOs, compared to the scum lean he did ISO. Correct's former's use of the phrase "doth protest to much, methinks" rather than responding to accusations by Former to AG being overly defensive. Day 4 Read post AG still scum leans on Former, which along with his read on Me as town, are the only two reads AG didn't flip to the other end from day 3 to day 4 in his reads list. AG states his Former and DLE suspicions wouldn't drop if Hitmon flipped town. AG jumps in saying he'd be okay with lynching DLE first, no mention of his Former read here. When Former brings up a DLE to Me relation read AG jumps in to suggest the reverse. After Hitmon claims mason, AG jumps onto Former isntead citing his lynch order, despite being willing to previously forgo even Hitmon to lynch DLE instead, and knowing that DLE at least would be a far more viable alternative lynch to stay alive.
Day 1 Asek just dropped Former a TR, and wouldn't even have interacted with Former on his big post if Yeti hadn't asked his opinion on it, which he didn't go into just said it strenghtened the TR. Neither scum even mentions Former till day 3, beyond AG promising to read Former twice during day 2, which when dropped early day 3 claims it was done only after night was called, this claim AG goes back on day 4 claiming it was actually done by hammer but didn't want to post it after hammer was called. Asek never interacted with Former till his demise besides calling out that Texas sucked in lynching scum so Former shouldn't follow his asek lynch. Meanwhile Former is the only consistent scum read of AG(with me staying consistent town between days 3 and 4) while everyone else flipped to the other alignment in AG's reads. Despite claiming AG was lowering the Former read to scum lean during his read post day 3, that was the exact wording he described his read on Former after the ISO in the first place, seemingly trying to fake progression on a read that didn't really progress between the ISO and day 3 reads. Strangely AG is never seen pushing Former in any way beyond stating it, nor if former ever called him out did he respond, beyond the "doth protest to much, methinks" post in which AG completely ignored the actual argument. Instead AG was far more willing to discuss the DLE to LW relation read by Former, implying that he thinks that one works better if I'd flip first, this is contrary to the fact he'd not change his mind about Former and DLE if hitmon flipped town. Then after the mason claim that drove him to suicide he decides to strictly follow the lynch order he was previously willing to deal with DLE first, despite it killing any of his chances at survival if he pushes Former who was literally only supported by me previously when I called former a dark horse. Former in the end has the weakest relationship and comments coming from the dead scum than anyone, even DLE who was mostly idle. Asek hard TRs and drops FH extremely quickly, only commenting on him when promted one time, then never again till former votes him, even then not doubting Former, just texas' read Former was following, and even this exchange was never picked up by Asek. Ignoring the discrepancy between AG's claims why he didn't post the FH read day 2, AG not voting the read via an excuse he knew was false as scum and then voting KoC without having ISOd him ignoring his previous fears of voting nor really engaging with my wallpost. Moving on his progression, specifically lack of by AG despite pretending there was on this read, and despite being his only unchanging scum read, AG never actively or even passively engaged Former, only reacting to one of Former's accusations, and even then completely ignoring it. AG did far more in relation to his KoC push, as well as his MS push, both on town(well I assume KoC is town at this point, bite me), same with the Hitmon push. He had more to say about his suspcions on DLE/Epik than Former, including discussing an LW+Epik scum team with Former.
So yes at the end my lynch order would be Former->Moody. But realistically speaking, the lynch order is LightWolf -> Former. I feel good enough about Moody now, in addition to his AG push, that I don't really need to prepare a flip for him. Not voting Former to reserve my own hammer. It's just easier than convincing moody.
Except me being town and suspecting Hitmon apparently.
That's what I did with Asek and AG. It was fun! Thank you smogon for at least supporting multi ISO.
Anyone wants to discuss this ?
when AG makes this post he is kidding himself if he thinks he lives to get those mislynches
scum reads posts made after the tipping point shouldn't be taken at face value
That was before the tipping point, you yourself have consistently brought up that Hitmonleet could have easily been mislynched. There was no guarantee for his survival until Hitmon claimed mason, which was the tipping point where AG was doomed.
Also really I literally say I can only actively discuss shit for a hour and 3/4 into the hour no one has talked to me.
Not done reading your wall of quotes sooo yeah
Unimpressed with these isos so far
Maybe you should try doing yours instead of screaming omg LightWolf is scum because he doesn't conform to the same thinking I have and pushed a guy I town read.
Bout to say. It's all well and good that I'm trying to come to a conclusion on my own, but if you think I'm gonna do the work for you when I'm already burning out of these walls...
Ah I was worried we'd go a whole page without you misrepresenting the case made against you
Moddy, do it anyway. ObviTown are at a premium rn, so sell me on how obvi you are.
We can compare notes and maybe I'll stop wishing I died in N3.
Are you going to lay out an iso case on Light?
I think if you want to see my case on Lw you can read up the last 10 pages or so
You said you needed to iso me before engaging with what was going on in these pages
Your iso tells me nothing about your thought processes
And now you're asking me to iso Lw ? get real
Your iso tells me nothing about your thought processes
And now you're asking me to iso Lw ? get real
Dude, man up and show your work on this case. Nobody else is going to show your work for you.
Don't use me as your john.
Read the fucking thread
Okay. I'll go interrupt myself from the reread I'm trying to do despite burning out. While I go do that, maybe you can think about how much more effective your case could be if you didn't fight with and frustrate someone you're trying to convince.
Ok that wallpost gets better with the Verdicts part
Well yeah, the rest are low oppinion stuff for the sake of other people being able to use it to form their own opinions on the posts.
- Status